Misdaad
Een forum voor onopgeloste misdaden en macabere zaken uit het verleden.
Topic for facts, speculations and general chat with our foreign friends, preferably in English.
Part one:
Natalee Holloway (in the rebound).
Part two:
Natalee Holloway (in the rebound) II
Part three:
Natalee Holloway (in the rebound) III
Andere topics die interessant zijn:
Shango's raadsel
De man in de schaduw: Steve Gregory Croes
Peter's reactie op kritische reacties na uitzending
Buitenland:
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.
http://arubadirtypolice.blogspot.com/
En uiteraard op de FP:
Peter's reactie op kritische reacties na uitzending
Holloway-zaak kost Aruba miljoenen
Joran praat morgen met politie
I never said it had to do with this case,although it is possible but I have no idea. They asked me more about it,so I told them part of what I know. I think theres a good chance they were both murdered after speaking to her family and hearing and seeing what happened,BTW that lady is dutch! I am assuming you read what I posted yesterday at SM? I don't know what the one hand in the pocket means,I would be guessing since they posted in the front page of the newspaper for everyone to see,Maybe a warning? What did you think about it?
[ Bericht 18% gewijzigd door NorthernStar op 09-02-2008 01:13:46 ]
Part one:
Natalee Holloway (in the rebound).
Part two:
Natalee Holloway (in the rebound) II
Part three:
Natalee Holloway (in the rebound) III
Andere topics die interessant zijn:
Shango's raadsel
De man in de schaduw: Steve Gregory Croes
Peter's reactie op kritische reacties na uitzending
Buitenland:
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.
http://arubadirtypolice.blogspot.com/
En uiteraard op de FP:
Peter's reactie op kritische reacties na uitzending
Holloway-zaak kost Aruba miljoenen
Joran praat morgen met politie
Hi,quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 10:26 schreef BwennieBren het volgende:
[..]
Morning
I would like to read the statement in your post I put in bold?
Also, I'm curious, last night I've read about the suicide hangings in Aruba in 2006 on SM, some TV-woman called Bridgitte and some cameraman? What does this had to do with this case and do you maybe know what it means: hanging with the hand(s) in their pockets?
I never said it had to do with this case,although it is possible but I have no idea. They asked me more about it,so I told them part of what I know. I think theres a good chance they were both murdered after speaking to her family and hearing and seeing what happened,BTW that lady is dutch! I am assuming you read what I posted yesterday at SM? I don't know what the one hand in the pocket means,I would be guessing since they posted in the front page of the newspaper for everyone to see,Maybe a warning? What did you think about it?
[ Bericht 18% gewijzigd door NorthernStar op 09-02-2008 01:13:46 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
I never heard she had a relationship at the time NH dissapeared! They had a relationship last year,but Beth says they are just friends now.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 10:33 schreef Ryan3 het volgende:
[..]
One other thing though; couple a months ago I read (I'am not certain where anymore), that the mother of Natalee had a relationship with the father of JoBenet Ramsey at the time of Natalee's disappearance. Is that also false?
[ Bericht 36% gewijzigd door NorthernStar op 09-02-2008 01:15:06 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
[NS: added to the OP, thanks]
[ Bericht 97% gewijzigd door NorthernStar op 09-02-2008 01:14:50 ]
[ Bericht 97% gewijzigd door NorthernStar op 09-02-2008 01:14:50 ]
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
When reading those police transcripts I get the feeling that especially Deepak (and possibly Satish) knows more about this case than we expect. They also give me the feeling that Joran made up everything we saw on the De Vries tapes.
Btw that Aruba Dirty Police web site is quite slenderous, isn't it. Paul van der Sloot is depicted as 'scum of the earth; the man who can't zip his fly (photo included), a rapist and murderer'. That's rich. 
.
.
I´m back.
Ah all right, they did have a relationship but not at the time and not anymore.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 10:51 schreef observer777 het volgende:
[..]
I never heard she had a relationship at the time NH dissapeared! They had a relationship last year,but Beth says they are just friends now.
I´m back.
I know the lady is Dutchquote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 10:49 schreef observer777 het volgende:
[..]
Hi,
I never said it had to do with this case,although it is possible but I have no idea. They asked me more about it,so I told them part of what I know. I think theres a good chance they were both murdered after speaking to her family and hearing and seeing what happened,BTW that lady is dutch! I am assuming you read what I posted yesterday at SM? I don't know what the one hand in the pocket means,I would be guessing since they posted in the front page of the newspaper for everyone to see,Maybe a warning? What did you think about it?
But what do you mean by "her family"? Natalee's family? Yes I gave read your post on SM yesterday, but I stopped halfway cause it was too late. I haven't made a bookmark from where I stopped reading so that's why I asking you now.. 
I'm trying to find out what it means, can't find much though and yes I find it very strange, although I really don't think it has much to do with the Holloway- case but more has to do with some drugscartel in ABC islands maybe? I haven't got a clue..
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
Well, don't worry I'm not confusedquote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 10:29 schreef Ticker het volgende:
[..]
Don't get confused, those statements are wrongly quoted and defenitely not in that order.
Check the PDF here to see what really was said:
http://judicial-inc.biz/arubaTranscript3.pdf
, I'm just trying to catch up with the case. I haven't did that the last 1 1/2 year due to sickness.... And yes, I would like to base my opinion on legal documents and statements in this case as well.BTW wat is FOK toch weer retetraag vandaag
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
To understand what they are talking about, you really really have to read http://hollowaycase.com/archive/ all of the police statements.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 10:56 schreef Nielsch het volgende:
When reading those police transcripts I get the feeling that especially Deepak (and possibly Satish) knows more about this case than we expect. They also give me the feeling that Joran made up everything we saw on the De Vries tapes.
First time I read the things they said to eichother it sounded all weird, but actualy the brothers are just saying they helped Joran lying because he asked them to do, and they did not meant to frame his father they just brought up that his father told them if there was no body then the case wouldn't really be that strong against them.
- Maybe O.D.B My Long Distance Family -
"Computer says: no.."
"Laat hen gaan, blinden zijn zij, die blinden leiden. Indien een blinde een blinde leidt, zullen zij beiden in een put vallen". (Matteüs 15:14)
"Computer says: no.."
"Laat hen gaan, blinden zijn zij, die blinden leiden. Indien een blinde een blinde leidt, zullen zij beiden in een put vallen". (Matteüs 15:14)
Now your twisting words around and I showed you the source. You are picking and choosing what you want to believe and what you want to argue about..LOL! I never said the hair on the duct tape was anything and yes Joran blaming Deepak was BS!! That has nothing to do with his confession,something bad happened and leading them to the Body that was all over every major News Station in America. I told you there is two witnesses that saw Deepak franticly cleaning his car(Hosing it down) with two others at 3AM after Natalee dissapeared,in a very odd part of the house witnessed by a neghbor. We have known about this for two years! Greta reported it just a few months ago on Fox. We knew about it through another source long ago,it has been talked about quite often even by Natalee's Dad. Search for it at SM or BFN! Or watch it on Fox maybee youtube when Beth went there with Greta on there last trip. He also looked into long term storage for his car. It also appears by the pics I showed you that the car was changed.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 10:36 schreef Ticker het volgende:
[..]
Well I don't know about that. The thing is alot of stuff has been blown up in the media. Like the tape with hare, that did not even belong to natalee. The fishing net that was a fishing net but somehow, someone made the story up that it was Natalee's clothing.
Also the story about the brothers washing their car.
I havent read anything in the police statements where the officer denies that Deepak and Satish only vacumed the car the friday before this happend.
The boys didn't even wash it after Natalee was disapeared. At least I haven;t seen any statement anywhere, only vague posts on different forums with no source.
Joran probably even brought that up more by claiming there was blood. He was smart enough to know S&D where questioned again if he said that. Even tough it wasn't true.
[..]
See, you say it yourself he misinfo'd the police by claiming false information.
[..]
Again all kinds of accusations about PVDS without any source. Not that I care, but since Í'm tracking all the info I want it all to be correct.
I already showed you the source about PVDS,It was in the Diario newspaper from a Court Ruling in Aruba. I dont make this crap up,All I want is the truth and to put the pieces together and have this solved. This is Aruba we are talking about and a massive cover up! We dont have the dossier and it's a pain in the butt tracking down this stuff that was on TV,In the Newspapers,Private Investigators,In Statements,On The Radio and direct quotes from these people. Believe what you like but don't accuse me of making shit up,thats a flat out lie! No one has this stuff on video tape nor do I know anyone with the Dossier from Natalee's case. Also many of these youtubes dissapear and the News Stations pull the articles.
Superior Court - Diario - 02-14-2007
The whole case of the disappearance of Natalee Holloway gets a different twist now that the information has come out from no less than the Superior Court, and in which mention is made of the declarations of witnesses and a phone tap that show or give an indication that Paul van der Sloot had on two occasions personal contact with Natalee during the night that she disappeared. Mention is made that, according to one or more official reports of the phone tap and also the declaration of Paul van der Sloot himself, that Paul fetched Joran and Natalee at McDonald and took them to the Holiday Inn. Based on this information, the judicial authorities and the police had at that time a justified basis to arrest Paul van der Sloot based on different suspicions. (Translation Credit: Diario)
http://www.diario-aruba.com/2007/2/14/
http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/
Superior Court
January, 2007
The possible involvement of Paulus with that could then be deducted from the file with the official reports of witnesses, amongst which two people suggested a contact existed between Paulus and Natalee Holloway the night of her disappearance, and a taped report (that was given by the Prosecutor in her final note 1 to the Court). The taped information and his declaration that he picked up Joran and Natalee by the McDonalds Palm Beach and brought them to the Holiday Inn, are clearly understood by the Dept. of Justice, and could in the judgement of this Superior Court, be considered as an indication of the involvement of Paulus in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway.”
---------------------------------------------
Beth Holloway Twitty
'Rita Cosby Live & Direct'
September 19, 2005
HOLLOWAY TWITTY: ... I don‘t think there was ever a question that Joran and Paulus Van Der Sloot had been in that Excelsior Casino, and, particularly, on the night of the 29th where he and his father met Natalee.
-------------------------------------------------------
Beth Twitty
NANCY GRACE
August 12, 2005
BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY: Oh -- oh, it`s a very critical detail. And the night that we arrived on the island -- you know, Jug does not misinterpret a 4:00 AM time pickup to 11:00 PM. I mean, Paulus Van Der Sloot stated that he picked them up up at 4:00 AM on May the 30th. Then -- we don`t know who they were, but then even as far as June 16 and June 17, Mr. Van Der Sloot was still stating this 4:00 AM pickup. Only until around -- maybe it was when he was picked up or arrested did he change it to 11:00 PM that I had knowledge of.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Roy Tromp - lead Investigator
Paulus van der Sloot's Interrogator
CBS NEWS
August 5, 2005
Tromp said investigators believe van der Sloot, who turns 18 on Saturday, is the prime suspect and that he had some assistance from his father, Paul, an apprentice judge on the island. "We believe something went wrong with the girl, and the first person you are going to call is your daddy," said Tromp. "In this case, daddy would know exactly what to do." Tromp, who declined to provide details about exactly what investigators believe happened to Holloway, said that Paul van der Sloot has also changed his account the night Holloway vanished. "Why should you do that if you are telling the truth?" he said.
[ Bericht 1% gewijzigd door observer777 op 08-02-2008 11:15:11 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Freddie is a good friend of Joran.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 10:59 schreef Nielsch het volgende:
And who is Freddie?
Freddy was the only one who knew Joran and the brothers did not drop off Natalee at the hotel. neo f the brothers assumes that he even knows more than that because freddy always knows Joran's secrets since they where kids.
By the way, freddy also told Joran's father that Joran lied about the hotel drop off, and since then Paulus also knew it was a lie.
As far as I know he didn't knew that untill that point.
- Maybe O.D.B My Long Distance Family -
"Computer says: no.."
"Laat hen gaan, blinden zijn zij, die blinden leiden. Indien een blinde een blinde leidt, zullen zij beiden in een put vallen". (Matteüs 15:14)
"Computer says: no.."
"Laat hen gaan, blinden zijn zij, die blinden leiden. Indien een blinde een blinde leidt, zullen zij beiden in een put vallen". (Matteüs 15:14)
Ik denk meer dat je als nieuwsposter een geile egocentrische narcist moet zijn, die een flinke stijve krijgt van alle berichten die ie van zijn eigen hand ziet op de FP, zo! ©yvonne
Beste nieuwsbericht ooit op de FOK!frontpage!
Beste nieuwsbericht ooit op de FOK!frontpage!
quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 10:59 schreef Nielsch het volgende:
And who is Freddie?
quote:ARAMBATZIS, Freddy Alexander Zedan – age 21, AKA Freddy Arambatzis-Zedan. Best friend of and neighbor of JVDS and reported guest at the VDS house the night of Natalee’s disappearance. Arrested 8-26-06 under suspicion of intentionally distributing and showing sexual images of a minor, intercourse with someone he knows is unconscious, and sexual acts with a girl younger than 16 years. (a.k.a. Locoman Pimp,” a.k.a. “badboy_956,” a.k.a. “Freddy Zedan” nickname “Fefi”). Listed as a character witness for Joran in NY civil trial filing by Tacopina. Freddy has worked at Champions Bar at the Marriott Hotel. According to several declarations, Joran told Freddy the truth of the evening and the story told to police on 5-31-05. Joran met Freddy when Freddy was 19 during a tournament at the Racquetball Club, according to Joran’s book.
Bron
Of die bron betrouwbaar is week nie...
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
And ofcourse everything is rigged and so you don't believe in rule by our law?quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 05:34 schreef NorthernStar het volgende:
[..]
I think we are talking on different levels here.
Sure, I believe in rule by law. When its not a rigged game that is..
Personally, I find a sense of justice in hearing that Joran is in hiding eversince the broadcast.
Deze verklaring geeft precies aan hoe de complotdenker redeneert natuurlijk. Er is een wereld, achter de zichtbare wereld, waarin alles wat onverklaarbaar blijft in de zichtbare wereld een puzzle-stukje is in een groter wereldomvattend plan.
I´m back.
quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 11:07 schreef observer777 het volgende:
..
Source: http://hollowaycase.com/archive/police_documents/pvds618.htmquote:On May 29th 2005, at approximately 16.00 hours, I went with Joran to the “Free Carribean Stud Tournament” in the Holiday Inn. During the break, at approximately 18.30 hours, I went back home. My youngest son Sebastian, who was playing at a friends house, was due to be dropped off at home around that time. Joran, with my permission, took over my seat because he had been eliminated earlier. We had agreed that he would call me after the tournament, in order for me to come and pick him up. He did indeed call me and at approximately 23.00 hour I picked him up near the McDonalds on Palm Beach with my red Suzuki. We drove home and I went to bed. I presumed he also had gone to bed. Afterwards we found out that he had gone out to Carlos & Charlies without my permission.
On May 30th 2005, in the nightly hours, I did not pick up Joran from anywhere. I slept solidly through the night without waking up.
That's all I can find of Paulus about his statement that night.
Nothing that says he met Natalee.
Eventough I've seen the camera images and i'm positive that he is sitting there at the table, I still have no clue about the other statement where he sayd he did met Natalee.
- Maybe O.D.B My Long Distance Family -
"Computer says: no.."
"Laat hen gaan, blinden zijn zij, die blinden leiden. Indien een blinde een blinde leidt, zullen zij beiden in een put vallen". (Matteüs 15:14)
"Computer says: no.."
"Laat hen gaan, blinden zijn zij, die blinden leiden. Indien een blinde een blinde leidt, zullen zij beiden in een put vallen". (Matteüs 15:14)
quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 11:10 schreef Surveillance-Fiets het volgende:
Natalee Holloway topic for our English speaking users
Not smart to suddenly move over to a different chain of topics.
- Maybe O.D.B My Long Distance Family -
"Computer says: no.."
"Laat hen gaan, blinden zijn zij, die blinden leiden. Indien een blinde een blinde leidt, zullen zij beiden in een put vallen". (Matteüs 15:14)
"Computer says: no.."
"Laat hen gaan, blinden zijn zij, die blinden leiden. Indien een blinde een blinde leidt, zullen zij beiden in een put vallen". (Matteüs 15:14)
No, we don't have to movequote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 11:19 schreef Ticker het volgende:
[..]
Not smart to suddenly move over to a different chain of topics.
Please continue here!
Ik denk meer dat je als nieuwsposter een geile egocentrische narcist moet zijn, die een flinke stijve krijgt van alle berichten die ie van zijn eigen hand ziet op de FP, zo! ©yvonne
Beste nieuwsbericht ooit op de FOK!frontpage!
Beste nieuwsbericht ooit op de FOK!frontpage!
I learned what happened from Brigittes Family,and I feel terrible for them! There are more suspicious deaths and more about this story,but I will leave it at that. I really hope someone in Holland can help them,because I don't think anyone from Aruba will do anything. They are a simple Family and don't have the means to look into her suicide. You can see what I wrote here..quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 11:00 schreef BwennieBren het volgende:
[..]
I know the lady is Dutch
I'm trying to find out what it means, can't find much though and yes I find it very strange, although I really don't think it has much to do with the Holloway- case but more has to do with some drugscartel in ABC islands maybe? I haven't got a clue..
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2578.msg343951#msg343951
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
That case of the suicide of the producer and the camera man is very distrubing. I gather there was a police investigation?
I´m back.
You are positive thats him at the table huh? I am not positive but I think its him! You realize he said he went home two hours earlier right? Joran at that time in his statements says he was still in the tourney. He also said Joran took his place in that tournament and said he won money and placed 4th? Well that never happened!! Joran lost his seat and his dads! It's very important in the timeline,because PVDS says he went to the bank twice the next day to deposit Joran's winnings. We have a lot of unnacounted time. Also Joran was 17 and it was illegal to be gambling and it is illegal to takes someones place in a tourney,well at least all the casino's I have been to and heard about.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 11:17 schreef Ticker het volgende:
[..]
[..]
Source: http://hollowaycase.com/archive/police_documents/pvds618.htm
That's all I can find of Paulus about his statement that night.
Nothing that says he met Natalee.
Eventough I've seen the camera images and i'm positive that he is sitting there at the table, I still have no clue about the other statement where he sayd he did met Natalee.
You have to understand that Jan VDS and Dennis Jacobs were really dirty,statements were changed,destroyed or witnesses never gave statements. PVDS himself was allowed to change his son's statements and they had the case files what others were saying. We heard how mad Rudy Croes was that PVDS was caught in wiretaps,probably with JAN VDS,we know in Joran's book they talked frequently on the phone,no denying they were close friends. Plus that PV I dont think is the full Interrogation but just a part of it. It sure pays to have a best friend as a police commissioner,friends in the ALE,know all the prosecuters and even the judges and Govt officials.
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
No there wasnt! When they arrived in Aruba from Holland the cop in charge of her case called in sick everyday! They went home with nothing,except a old poem. When I researched this all,I saw what a reporter in Aruba was saying about her and they were all stinking lies. What can they do about it? I gave them Peter R'S Email,But I think they should wait a while until he is not so busy. Also they need to research more. I wouldn't be as suspicious if the same thing didn't happen to her camera man two weeks later with one hand in his pocket.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 11:38 schreef Ryan3 het volgende:
That case of the suicide of the producer and the camera man is very distrubing. I gather there was a police investigation?
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 11:39 schreef observer777 het volgende:
[..]
You are positive thats him at the table huh? I am not positive but I think its him! You realize he said he went home two hours earlier right? Joran at that time in his statements says he was still in the tourney. He also said Joran took his place in that tournament and said he won money and placed 4th? Well that never happened!! Joran lost his seat and his dads! It's very important in the timeline,because PVDS says he went to the bank twice the next day to deposit Joran's winnings. We have a lot of unnacounted time. Also Joran was 17 and it was illegal to be gambling and it is illegal to takes someones place in a tourney,well at least all the casino's I have been to and heard about.
You have to understand that Jan VDS and Dennis Jacobs were really dirty,statements were changed,destroyed or witnesses never gave statements. PVDS himself was allowed to change his son's statements and they had the case files what others were saying. We heard how mad Rudy Croes was that PVDS was caught in wiretaps,probably with JAN VDS,we know in Joran's book they talked frequently on the phone,no denying they were close friends. Plus that PV I dont think is the full Interrogation but just a part of it. It sure pays to have a best friend as a police commissioner,friends in the ALE,know all the prosecuters and even the judges and Govt officials.
Still these are at the moment just accusations.
These accusations make the story turn into a big cover-up where in the end Paulus did it.
And that's something I really do not see at this point. I mean he sure did help Joran on his way but not dump the body and stuff.
Again, there is no statement made by paulus that he picked up Natalee and Joran, at this point I can say, that clame is bullshit.
I even searched SM for it completely with the words:
Natalee Paulus Car
Natalee PVDS picked- (picked up)
Natalee Paulus picked
etc
The only thing I came up with is this:
http://scaredmonkeys.net/(...)3;topicseen#msg61873
Still don't see anything shocking. Except a fucked up timeframe and maybe a 17 year old who won money (bigtime) where he wasn't allowed to? Possibility.quote:In that interview where Paulus corrects himself about the phone calls after the official end of the interview, he and the guy for Dutch TV were talking about Joran having called Paulus allegedly at 11 and that is the big deal to have Paulus on record denying having told Beth and the others it was not 11 but 4 when he picked "them" up at McDonald's
- Maybe O.D.B My Long Distance Family -
"Computer says: no.."
"Laat hen gaan, blinden zijn zij, die blinden leiden. Indien een blinde een blinde leidt, zullen zij beiden in een put vallen". (Matteüs 15:14)
"Computer says: no.."
"Laat hen gaan, blinden zijn zij, die blinden leiden. Indien een blinde een blinde leidt, zullen zij beiden in een put vallen". (Matteüs 15:14)
yeah I saw that picture of the girl who framed that sex network or something.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 11:45 schreef observer777 het volgende:
[..]
No there wasnt! When they arrived in Aruba from Holland the cop in charge of her case called in sick everyday! They went home with nothing,except a old poem. When I researched this all,I saw what a reporter in Aruba was saying about her and they were all stinking lies. What can they do about it? I gave them Peter R'S Email,But I think they should wait a while until he is not so busy. Also they need to research more. I wouldn't be as suspicious if the same thing didn't happen to her camera man two weeks later with one hand in his pocket.
People do not hang themself out in the open that way.
- Maybe O.D.B My Long Distance Family -
"Computer says: no.."
"Laat hen gaan, blinden zijn zij, die blinden leiden. Indien een blinde een blinde leidt, zullen zij beiden in een put vallen". (Matteüs 15:14)
"Computer says: no.."
"Laat hen gaan, blinden zijn zij, die blinden leiden. Indien een blinde een blinde leidt, zullen zij beiden in een put vallen". (Matteüs 15:14)
Yes,No statement from his PV's that I have seen either. Bullshit? How can you argue with the Supreme Court of Aruba? It's right in front of you! The Mother of Natalee,ALE and others heard this also..Are they liars as well? They are the ones saying it,It was Nico Jorg and the Prosecuters that had this info..Not me! It was printed in the Newspaper,I am amazed you call that BS! Why do you think PVDS lost his case on appeal? Where do you think that came from? You think I am making this shit up?quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 11:48 schreef Ticker het volgende:
[..]
Again, there is no statement made by paulus that he picked up Natalee and Joran, at this point I can say, that clame is bullshit.
[ Bericht 4% gewijzigd door observer777 op 08-02-2008 12:03:52 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
If you've read the article then you can give the link here.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 11:54 schreef observer777 het volgende:
[..]
Yes,No statement from his PV's that I have seen either. Bullshit? How can you argue with the Supreme Court of Aruba? It's right in front of you! They are the ones saying it,It was Nico Jorg and the Prosecuters that had this info..Not me! It was printed in the Newspaper,I am amazed you call that BS! Why do you think PVDS lost his case on appeal? Where do you think that came from? You think I am making this shit up?
The link you gave before was an site from Aruba.. i'm from Holland, and using bablefish spanish-english doesn't translate it.
It's not that I don't believe you but you're not backing it up!
- Maybe O.D.B My Long Distance Family -
"Computer says: no.."
"Laat hen gaan, blinden zijn zij, die blinden leiden. Indien een blinde een blinde leidt, zullen zij beiden in een put vallen". (Matteüs 15:14)
"Computer says: no.."
"Laat hen gaan, blinden zijn zij, die blinden leiden. Indien een blinde een blinde leidt, zullen zij beiden in een put vallen". (Matteüs 15:14)
Well thats where this all took place was Aruba!! Of course it was in Papi!! You are really missing the point here,PVDS and Joran have been protected since the beginning and the last thing that Aruban Govt wants is the truth to come out. Sure I backed it up and I am done with this subject! I gave you several sources even the courts of Aruba! Natalee's Mother,ALE,NIco Jorg,The Prosecuters and others all said this! Are they lying also? Nico Jorg spoke out about PVDS,but I forget all what he said. PVDS then said the cops were idiots and he said 11PM,but other times he said others heard wrong because he was directing his words to those same cops and not the others that were there that night. But as you read there was also wiretaps and other sourcesquote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 12:03 schreef Ticker het volgende:
[..]
If you've read the article then you can give the link here.
The link you gave before was an site from Aruba.. i'm from Holland, and using bablefish spanish-english doesn't translate it.
It's not that I don't believe you but you're not backing it up!
Papiamento transltor
http://www.donamaro.nl/papiamentu/
http://getagripmonkey.blogspot.com/ (Maybee it's here also)
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
A source is not a person where you heard it from.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 12:20 schreef observer777 het volgende:
[..]
Well thats where this all took place was Aruba!! Of course it was in Papi!! You are really missing the point here,PVDS and Joran have been protected since the beginning and the last thing that Aruban Govt wants is the truth to come out. Sure I backed it up and I am done with this subject! I gave you several sources even the courts of Aruba! Natalee's Mother,ALE,NIco Jorg,The Prosecuters and others all said this! Are they lying also? Nico Jorg spoke out about PVDS,but I forget all what he said. PVDS then said the cops were idiots and he said 11PM,but other times he said others heard wrong because he was directing his words to those same cops and not the others that were there that night. But as you read there was also wiretaps and other sources
Papiamento transltor
http://www.donamaro.nl/papiamentu/
http://getagripmonkey.blogspot.com/ (Maybee it's here also)
With a source is meant hard-evidence like an article or some real documents.
Don't act like i'm blaming you anything, I just like to see your quotes backed-up instaid of sending me on the internet to look for it myself.
By the way.. you still are doing it cause you are giving me a link and saying maybe it's on there, look for it yourself.
- Maybe O.D.B My Long Distance Family -
"Computer says: no.."
"Laat hen gaan, blinden zijn zij, die blinden leiden. Indien een blinde een blinde leidt, zullen zij beiden in een put vallen". (Matteüs 15:14)
"Computer says: no.."
"Laat hen gaan, blinden zijn zij, die blinden leiden. Indien een blinde een blinde leidt, zullen zij beiden in een put vallen". (Matteüs 15:14)
I don't like the way you are posting this.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 04:00 schreef observer777 het volgende:
Forensic Investigators at the VDS home in 2007. Is this a clue what he was measuring? Did Natalee pass away or was injured at the VDS home?
[ afbeelding ]
Why are you stating (posting) this or asking yourself or asking us? This questions.
My opinion is, that if you are posting this you must at least give some facts that support your questions.
Now it looks like you are trying to push us in a direction.
I think you saw this interview from the paul&witteman show on 11-01-2008. The wine incident was right after the show.
If you do not understand dutch its very difficult to judge the interview, and of course it is different watching this after the 'confession'. But maybe it reveals some 'things' about the case. I am not going to speculate about it here because I am searching for facts.
I am busy reading the 'proces verbaal' of the suspects. 2 questions for you:
- Where is the 'proces verbaal of 'Freddy Zedan'?
- Why is it that there are dutch words in some of the english text on the images with text on S.monkey?
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door ZoneKill op 08-02-2008 12:55:28 ]
I think some of those where off the record or the public did not get their hands on it.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 12:38 schreef ZoneKill het volgende:
I am busy reading the 'proces verbaal' of the suspects. 2 questions for you:
- Where is the 'proces verbaal of 'Freddy Zedan'?
- Why is it that there are dutch words in some of the english text on the images with text on S.monkey?
- Maybe O.D.B My Long Distance Family -
"Computer says: no.."
"Laat hen gaan, blinden zijn zij, die blinden leiden. Indien een blinde een blinde leidt, zullen zij beiden in een put vallen". (Matteüs 15:14)
"Computer says: no.."
"Laat hen gaan, blinden zijn zij, die blinden leiden. Indien een blinde een blinde leidt, zullen zij beiden in een put vallen". (Matteüs 15:14)
Another Mystery..Joran's Shoes size and Missing Shoes..We know it was reported early in the case Investigators were looking for one shoe. Then they were looking for two shoes,rumors were that there was blood on one of the shoes.
Then his shoes shrunk,We were told he had size 14 shoes then the KLPD told us he wore size 10.5!! Why is everything in this case filled with bogus information and not one clear cut answer?
Case of Natalee: report shows formal deceit
Joran van der Sloot’s feet grow and shrink almost 4 sizes from one day to the other
DIARIO Aruba
05/08/2006
ORANJESTAD (AAN) --- Those of a little advanced or respectable age can still remember the time where there was an alcoholic beverage that was called ‘foot sweller’.
This alcoholic beverage, it was said, that those who drank too much of it, their feet swelled and because of this they called the drink ‘foot sweller’, but who can believe that in the year 2005 there are people in Aruba whose feet really swell or grow almost 4 sizes from one day to the other?
This was the case of the suspect Joran van der Sloot, who is currently peacefully studying in Holland and Aruba itself is stuck with the case of Natalee, and in the US they are trying in every way to organize and implement all sorts of boycotts and acts that could harm Aruba in the wide sense of the word.
This is not an attempt to cast guilt on Joran van der Sloot in the case of Natalee, but the fact is that the majority of people in the community is very angry in regards to the case of Natalee causing a negative impact on the economic situation, the image of the people of Aruba and surely, for the island’s tourism.
Too many changing declarations, formal deceit by the suspects and the very strange way in which the authorities, who have to be competent, have proceeded have today stuck Aruba in a very bad situation in regards to Natalee’s case and those who know the truth remain quiet believing that in this way, they can evade guilt of any involvement or any violation of the law.
From the copies of different police reports, today readers themselves can read how Joran van der Sloot, who until today for inexplicable reasons ‘supposedly’ left his expensive brand name running shoes at the beach on the night he was with Natalee, according to the version he gave police.
Police came up with the matter of the running shoes or it was Joran himself who started talking about the running shoes of an expensive brand name, size 14? From the police report of June 14, 2005, readers can read how Joran himself declared that he took off his size 14 running shoes and left them on the beach.
On June 29, 2005, he again repeated to police that he left his size 14 running shoes on the beach. The strange thing is that on August 2, 2005, after so many interrogations had already taken place, Joran van der Sloot in a car heading back to KIA, told a Dutch police officer who came to Aruba especially to interrogate the suspects, that Joran had on some K-Swiss running shoes that he borrowed from a fellow prisoner.
At no moment did the Dutch police officer ask Joran something, it was Joran himself who started talking with the police officer, as can been seen from the police report.
Now, the question is: was Joran brought from the first day to KIA shoeless and had no shoes to wear that it was a fellow prisoner who had to lend Joran a pair of running shoes?
Van der Sloot’s parents couldn’t bring shoes for Joran to wear, and someone from the prison had to lend him some shoes, and to top it all off they were K-Swiss brand?
By the way, at KIA they have to register, as in the majority of prisons around the world, what shoes and other belongings each person comes in with, yes or no? On August 8, 2005, the same Dutch police officer asked Joran to take off his shoe, which was a K-Swiss brand running shoe.
Joran asked to see his lawyer and wanted to find his lawyer’s support, but his lawyer didn’t even look at Joran and started to write (in local dialect, you deal with your problems!) After the Dutch police officer insisted, Joran took off the running shoe and handed it over across the table.
The police officer asked Joran how in the supposed day that he was with Natalee on the beach, he had size 14 K-Swiss running shoes, then how was the one that Joran put on the table size 10.5?
After Joran put his running shoe back on, the police pressed on the tip of the running shoes, and observed that the shoes were a good fit on Joran, and Joran didn’t react!
The matter of the size 14 K-Swiss running shoes is ‘too good to be true’. Was it the shark that Natalee supposedly wanted to see at the North shore that left with Joran van der Sloot’s size 14 running shoes?
http://tinyurl.com/3csjnm
Are you kidding me?
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door observer777 op 08-02-2008 12:49:32 ]
Then his shoes shrunk,We were told he had size 14 shoes then the KLPD told us he wore size 10.5!! Why is everything in this case filled with bogus information and not one clear cut answer?
Case of Natalee: report shows formal deceit
Joran van der Sloot’s feet grow and shrink almost 4 sizes from one day to the other
DIARIO Aruba
05/08/2006
ORANJESTAD (AAN) --- Those of a little advanced or respectable age can still remember the time where there was an alcoholic beverage that was called ‘foot sweller’.
This alcoholic beverage, it was said, that those who drank too much of it, their feet swelled and because of this they called the drink ‘foot sweller’, but who can believe that in the year 2005 there are people in Aruba whose feet really swell or grow almost 4 sizes from one day to the other?
This was the case of the suspect Joran van der Sloot, who is currently peacefully studying in Holland and Aruba itself is stuck with the case of Natalee, and in the US they are trying in every way to organize and implement all sorts of boycotts and acts that could harm Aruba in the wide sense of the word.
This is not an attempt to cast guilt on Joran van der Sloot in the case of Natalee, but the fact is that the majority of people in the community is very angry in regards to the case of Natalee causing a negative impact on the economic situation, the image of the people of Aruba and surely, for the island’s tourism.
Too many changing declarations, formal deceit by the suspects and the very strange way in which the authorities, who have to be competent, have proceeded have today stuck Aruba in a very bad situation in regards to Natalee’s case and those who know the truth remain quiet believing that in this way, they can evade guilt of any involvement or any violation of the law.
From the copies of different police reports, today readers themselves can read how Joran van der Sloot, who until today for inexplicable reasons ‘supposedly’ left his expensive brand name running shoes at the beach on the night he was with Natalee, according to the version he gave police.
Police came up with the matter of the running shoes or it was Joran himself who started talking about the running shoes of an expensive brand name, size 14? From the police report of June 14, 2005, readers can read how Joran himself declared that he took off his size 14 running shoes and left them on the beach.
On June 29, 2005, he again repeated to police that he left his size 14 running shoes on the beach. The strange thing is that on August 2, 2005, after so many interrogations had already taken place, Joran van der Sloot in a car heading back to KIA, told a Dutch police officer who came to Aruba especially to interrogate the suspects, that Joran had on some K-Swiss running shoes that he borrowed from a fellow prisoner.
At no moment did the Dutch police officer ask Joran something, it was Joran himself who started talking with the police officer, as can been seen from the police report.
Now, the question is: was Joran brought from the first day to KIA shoeless and had no shoes to wear that it was a fellow prisoner who had to lend Joran a pair of running shoes?
Van der Sloot’s parents couldn’t bring shoes for Joran to wear, and someone from the prison had to lend him some shoes, and to top it all off they were K-Swiss brand?
By the way, at KIA they have to register, as in the majority of prisons around the world, what shoes and other belongings each person comes in with, yes or no? On August 8, 2005, the same Dutch police officer asked Joran to take off his shoe, which was a K-Swiss brand running shoe.
Joran asked to see his lawyer and wanted to find his lawyer’s support, but his lawyer didn’t even look at Joran and started to write (in local dialect, you deal with your problems!) After the Dutch police officer insisted, Joran took off the running shoe and handed it over across the table.
The police officer asked Joran how in the supposed day that he was with Natalee on the beach, he had size 14 K-Swiss running shoes, then how was the one that Joran put on the table size 10.5?
After Joran put his running shoe back on, the police pressed on the tip of the running shoes, and observed that the shoes were a good fit on Joran, and Joran didn’t react!
The matter of the size 14 K-Swiss running shoes is ‘too good to be true’. Was it the shark that Natalee supposedly wanted to see at the North shore that left with Joran van der Sloot’s size 14 running shoes?
http://tinyurl.com/3csjnm
Are you kidding me?
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door observer777 op 08-02-2008 12:49:32 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
And suddenly it's getting a bit of a twisted again...
Maybe this site does have some nice stuff.
http://getagripmonkey.blogspot.com/search?updated-max=2007-12-04T13%3A53%3A00-05%3A00&max-results=20
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door Ticker op 08-02-2008 12:57:36 ]
- Maybe O.D.B My Long Distance Family -
"Computer says: no.."
"Laat hen gaan, blinden zijn zij, die blinden leiden. Indien een blinde een blinde leidt, zullen zij beiden in een put vallen". (Matteüs 15:14)
"Computer says: no.."
"Laat hen gaan, blinden zijn zij, die blinden leiden. Indien een blinde een blinde leidt, zullen zij beiden in een put vallen". (Matteüs 15:14)
Hallo,Simply asking the question is all. We know in Peter R first broadcast he told us that the ALE thought perhaps they never went to the beach and it all happened at the VDS home and that is where something bad happened. Perhaps she died in the garden. That is exactly where the KLPD was searching and taking samples when they searched the VDS home in 2007. I noticed that KLPD officer was measuring by that tree and wall..Why?Some people have speculated a witness saw them from there or perhaps Natalee tried to escape from that area and fell. I don't know,but there must be a reason why he was measuring and why they were digging up the garden and other areas in that back yard!quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 12:38 schreef ZoneKill het volgende:
[..]
I don't like the way you are posting this.
Why are you stating (posting) this or asking yourself or asking us? This questions.
My opinion is, that if you are posting this you must at least give some facts that support your questions.
Now it looks like you are trying to push us in a direction.
I think you saw this interview from the paul&witteman show on 11-01-2008. The wine incident was right after the show.
If you do not understand dutch its very difficult to judge the interview, and of course it is different watching this after the 'confession'. But maybe it reveals some 'things' about the case. I am not going to speculate about it here because
I am searching for facts.
I am busy reading the 'proces verbaal' of the suspects. 2 questions for you:
- Where is the 'proces verbaal of 'Freddy Zedan'?
- Why is it that there are dutch words in some of the english text on the images with text on S.monkey?
I haven't slept yet so I am tired. Some of Freddys PV'S may be at SM I am not sure at the moment because I cant think straight
I don't think we have seen more than one or two of his PV'S..I think Diario Newspaper released one of them. Perhaps the reason some dutch words are in english text because it was translated with a online translator?[ Bericht 1% gewijzigd door observer777 op 08-02-2008 13:13:34 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
What I can find on the internet is a curiuos conversation on an Aruban bullitin board. A user called Lako wants to know who her landlord is, on 12/30/06 18:46. Vew days after the suicide.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 11:45 schreef observer777 het volgende:
[..]
No there wasnt! When they arrived in Aruba from Holland the cop in charge of her case called in sick everyday! They went home with nothing,except a old poem. When I researched this all,I saw what a reporter in Aruba was saying about her and they were all stinking lies. What can they do about it? I gave them Peter R'S Email,But I think they should wait a while until he is not so busy. Also they need to research more. I wouldn't be as suspicious if the same thing didn't happen to her camera man two weeks later with one hand in his pocket.
http://aruba.prikpagina.nl/read.php?f=2308&i=10671&t=10671
User Jiskefet finds that 'raar', which can be translated in: 'odd'.
And later in the same thread the daughter of Brigit Katelaan, called Kimberley, wants to know whether someone knew her mother.
Furthermore I learn that she made some documentaries about a ring of prostitution in some villages of Aruba.
And she made some reports about illegal drag races, on Curacao.
Nothing that's directly linked to the Holloway case.
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door Ryan3 op 08-02-2008 13:26:47 ]
I´m back.
I saw that also. They told her daughter the house was haunted which is BS. I haven't seen a direct link to Natalee's case either. The Landlord was terrible to this family,he already had someone living in the house,made the family pay money to get her things and only gave them 3 hours to do it and would not let them in the house. But you should know that one if not more very high ranking ministers in the Aruban Govt is tied into Prostitution in Aruba and Venezuela. Rudy Croes the Minister of Justice was caught holding three women from the D.R. against there will and pimping them in Aruba. When he was questioned about it and got into trouble he said he gave them visas so they could work in San Nicolas and paint. In San Nicolas it is a legal area for prostitution in Aruba. The Drag racing is interesting because of the connection with someone that was called in for questioning in Natalee's case a friend of LVR. It simply could have been drug related,because the day her story was in the paper someone else died and they ruled it a suicide also I think. He had a ear missing,was dragged to the beach and something about 20 lbs of cocaine. If you saw the camera mans pic with one hand in the pocket I posted another at SM on the next page with someone hung the same way. Whatever happened to them,I tend to believe she uncovered something that got her and her camera man killed IMOquote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 13:21 schreef Ryan3 het volgende:
[..]
What I can find on the internet is a curiuos conversation on an Aruban bullitin board. A user called Lako wants to know who her landlord is, on 12/30/06 18:46. Vew days after the suicide.
http://aruba.prikpagina.nl/read.php?f=2308&i=10671&t=10671
User Jiskefet finds that 'raar', which can be translated in: 'odd'.
And later in the same thread the daughter of Brigit Katelaan, called Kimberley, wants to know whether someone knew her mother.
Furthermore I learn that she made some documentaries about a ring of prostitution in some villages of Aruba.
And she made some reports about illegal drag races, on Curacao.
Nothing that's directly linked to the Holloway case.
[ Bericht 3% gewijzigd door observer777 op 08-02-2008 13:52:26 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Very well made video from a person from Holland 
Natalee Holloway - Have You Seen Her
http://youtube.com/watch?v=z5T9oUoQBbk
Natalee Holloway - Have You Seen Her
http://youtube.com/watch?v=z5T9oUoQBbk
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Jeeez, you're not asleepquote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 14:14 schreef observer777 het volgende:
Very well made video from a person from Holland
Natalee Holloway - Have You Seen Her
http://youtube.com/watch?v=z5T9oUoQBbk
Sleep is also important you know...
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
Look at this:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=YA3NKpGHnqc
It shows Natalee and Joran both entering the casino, alone.
The funny thing is, the casino camera above the table says it's about 20:25.
The camera aimed at the door, shows Joran entering at 19:51.
This same camera shows on 20:58 that Natalee enters the casino.
What's up with the time differents.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=YA3NKpGHnqc
It shows Natalee and Joran both entering the casino, alone.
The funny thing is, the casino camera above the table says it's about 20:25.
The camera aimed at the door, shows Joran entering at 19:51.
This same camera shows on 20:58 that Natalee enters the casino.
What's up with the time differents.
- Maybe O.D.B My Long Distance Family -
"Computer says: no.."
"Laat hen gaan, blinden zijn zij, die blinden leiden. Indien een blinde een blinde leidt, zullen zij beiden in een put vallen". (Matteüs 15:14)
"Computer says: no.."
"Laat hen gaan, blinden zijn zij, die blinden leiden. Indien een blinde een blinde leidt, zullen zij beiden in een put vallen". (Matteüs 15:14)
08 Februari 2008
OM wil debat na uitzending De Vries
Voorzitter Brouwer van het college van procureurs-generaal wil een debat over de rol van burgers bij opsporing van strafbare feiten. Brouwer vindt de kritiek op Peter R. de Vries hypocriet. Hij zegt dat in een gesprek met Trouw.
De hoogste baas van het Openbaar Ministerie wil bijvoorbeeld weten hoe ver burgers daarbij mogen gaan. Hij zegt dit naar aanleiding van de uitzending van De Vries over de zaak-Holloway.
Brouwer vindt dat De Vries vakwerk heeft geleverd, maar vraagt zich af waar de grenzen liggen. Het OM gaat onderzoek doen naar de betrokkenheid van burgers bij het opsporen van verdachten.
bron NOS
OM wil debat na uitzending De Vries
Voorzitter Brouwer van het college van procureurs-generaal wil een debat over de rol van burgers bij opsporing van strafbare feiten. Brouwer vindt de kritiek op Peter R. de Vries hypocriet. Hij zegt dat in een gesprek met Trouw.
De hoogste baas van het Openbaar Ministerie wil bijvoorbeeld weten hoe ver burgers daarbij mogen gaan. Hij zegt dit naar aanleiding van de uitzending van De Vries over de zaak-Holloway.
Brouwer vindt dat De Vries vakwerk heeft geleverd, maar vraagt zich af waar de grenzen liggen. Het OM gaat onderzoek doen naar de betrokkenheid van burgers bij het opsporen van verdachten.
bron NOS
Wanneer domme mensen domme dingen beweren, dan moet je ze niet corrigeren, maar glimlachend gelijk geven.
Natalee went in and out the casino maybe? Also strange, according to one of Natalee's friends, Ruth McVey:quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 15:07 schreef Ticker het volgende:
Look at this:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=YA3NKpGHnqc
It shows Natalee and Joran both entering the casino, alone.
The funny thing is, the casino camera above the table says it's about 20:25.
The camera aimed at the door, shows Joran entering at 19:51.
This same camera shows on 20:58 that Natalee enters the casino.
What's up with the time differents.
quote from http://scrux.com/natalee/mbinterview.htm
Video says not so...quote:Greta Van Susteren: Do you remember about what time on Sunday May 29th that you went to the casino?
Ruth McVey: It was around ten, nine-thirty, ten..
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
Another American Girl Missing with Aruba Connection just seven years ago
While Aruba does damage control over fears that their tourism industry may suffer, reports have surfaced that Natalee Holloway is not the only young American girl to disappear there.
Another family said they know exactly what the parents of Natalee Holloway, the Alabama teenager who has been missing in Aruba since last week, are going through.
They've been dealing with the same nightmare for seven years.
The Bradleys, of Virginia, went on a cruise in 1998 and Aruba was one of the stops. That's where their daughter disappeared.
Iva Bradley said her 23-year-old daughter, Amy, befriended three men who worked on the cruise ship and they wanted to take her to a bar in Aruba.
"They said they wanted to take her to a bar on Aruba that was called Carlos and Charlie's," said Bradley.
this is amy
Natalee Holloway spent her last night ALSO eating and dancing at Carlos 'n Charlie's bar
While Aruba does damage control over fears that their tourism industry may suffer, reports have surfaced that Natalee Holloway is not the only young American girl to disappear there.
Another family said they know exactly what the parents of Natalee Holloway, the Alabama teenager who has been missing in Aruba since last week, are going through.
They've been dealing with the same nightmare for seven years.
The Bradleys, of Virginia, went on a cruise in 1998 and Aruba was one of the stops. That's where their daughter disappeared.
Iva Bradley said her 23-year-old daughter, Amy, befriended three men who worked on the cruise ship and they wanted to take her to a bar in Aruba.
"They said they wanted to take her to a bar on Aruba that was called Carlos and Charlie's," said Bradley.
this is amy
Natalee Holloway spent her last night ALSO eating and dancing at Carlos 'n Charlie's bar
Wanneer domme mensen domme dingen beweren, dan moet je ze niet corrigeren, maar glimlachend gelijk geven.
Moeder Van der Sloot: geen halfbroer Joran
ORANJESTAD — De moeder van Joran van der Sloot, Anita, wil de geruchten uit de wereld helpen dat er een halfbroer van Joran bestaat. Dat heeft ze gisteren aan de Amigoemeegedeeld.
In de editie van gisteren werd melding van gemaakt van het feit dat dat de Nederlandse actualiteitenrubriek Netwerk en de lokale radiozender Cool FM vermoedden dat ene Lorenzo van R. degene was die moordverdachte Joran had geholpen het lichaam van Natalee Holloway met een boot weg te werken. Eerder werd Daury Rodriguez als de ‘bootman’ genoemd, maar die heeft ontkend. In de spraakmakende reportage van Peter R. de Vries zei Joran van der Sloot dat hij geholpen werd door ‘Daury’.
De familie Van der Sloot heeft het gerucht ook in de beginfase van het onderzoek ontzenuwd. Anita van der Sloot: “Dat is toen helemaal uitgezocht door justitie die heeft kunnen constateren dat er niets van klopt. Maar nu wordt het weer opgegraven door de media. Hoe moeten de broers van Joran dit nu begrijpen? Ze vroegen mij of het klopte wat er in de Amigoe stond, dat ze dus een halfbroer hebben. Dit komt nog bovenop wat er al allemaal gebeurd is.”
Ook de familie van Lorenzo van R. zou in het verleden al aan een krant hebben verteld dat er niets van het verhaal waar is. De twee families gingen slechts korte tijd met elkaar om, vlak nadat de familie Van der Sloot in 1990 op Aruba kwam wonen. “Omdat zij een garage hadden gingen we toen een paar keer naar hun toe voor de auto. Lorenzo was toen vijf of zes jaar en Joran tweeënhalf.”
ORANJESTAD — De moeder van Joran van der Sloot, Anita, wil de geruchten uit de wereld helpen dat er een halfbroer van Joran bestaat. Dat heeft ze gisteren aan de Amigoemeegedeeld.
In de editie van gisteren werd melding van gemaakt van het feit dat dat de Nederlandse actualiteitenrubriek Netwerk en de lokale radiozender Cool FM vermoedden dat ene Lorenzo van R. degene was die moordverdachte Joran had geholpen het lichaam van Natalee Holloway met een boot weg te werken. Eerder werd Daury Rodriguez als de ‘bootman’ genoemd, maar die heeft ontkend. In de spraakmakende reportage van Peter R. de Vries zei Joran van der Sloot dat hij geholpen werd door ‘Daury’.
De familie Van der Sloot heeft het gerucht ook in de beginfase van het onderzoek ontzenuwd. Anita van der Sloot: “Dat is toen helemaal uitgezocht door justitie die heeft kunnen constateren dat er niets van klopt. Maar nu wordt het weer opgegraven door de media. Hoe moeten de broers van Joran dit nu begrijpen? Ze vroegen mij of het klopte wat er in de Amigoe stond, dat ze dus een halfbroer hebben. Dit komt nog bovenop wat er al allemaal gebeurd is.”
Ook de familie van Lorenzo van R. zou in het verleden al aan een krant hebben verteld dat er niets van het verhaal waar is. De twee families gingen slechts korte tijd met elkaar om, vlak nadat de familie Van der Sloot in 1990 op Aruba kwam wonen. “Omdat zij een garage hadden gingen we toen een paar keer naar hun toe voor de auto. Lorenzo was toen vijf of zes jaar en Joran tweeënhalf.”
Wanneer domme mensen domme dingen beweren, dan moet je ze niet corrigeren, maar glimlachend gelijk geven.
Friends of Natalee statements
According FBI documents, see: http://scrux.com/discuss/viewtopic.php?p=6838
Nancy Laraine Watson:
Katharine Madison Whatley:
According FBI documents, see: http://scrux.com/discuss/viewtopic.php?p=6838
Nancy Laraine Watson:
Elisabeth Lewis Cain:quote:Watson's last conversation with HOLLOWAY took place earlier on Sunday evening sometime between 9:00 and 10:00 pm. WATSON saw HOLLOWAY coming out of the bathroom in de Holiday Inn lobby area. WATSON talked to her and complemented her on the shirt she was wearing. She appeared to be getting prepared to leave the hotel. She did not mention to WATSON what she was doing or of she met anyone. Although WATSON knew that HOLLOWAY had been drinking that day, HOLLOWAY did not seem to be intoxicated.
Also strange, is this ever looked into?quote:On Sunday 5/29/2005, HOLLOWAY had been drinking and appeared to be a little intoxicated but still had her xxxxx about her. CAIN saw HOLLOWAY during the day and night, on 5/29/2005 at the follwing times and locations:
4.30 pm - Pool at Holiday Inn
5.00 pm - Hot tub at the Holiday Inn
5.15 pm - HOLLOWAY showered in her room
9.00 p.m. Pavilion at Holiday Inn, HOLLOWAY stated that she was going to the casino in hotel.
11.00 pm - CARLOS 'N CHARLIES night club and bar
12.15 a.m. (5/30/2005) - Sitting at the bar inside of CARLOS 'N CHARLIES with VIVIAN YIELDING and CALLIE PERKINS.
Katharine Madison Whatley:
quote:WHATLEY advised the security guard at the hotel were suspicious during their stau n Aruba. While WHATLEY, LEE ASHFORD, MCVEIGH, and HOLLOWAY were taking a nap one afternoon, someone tried to open the sliding glass door to the hotel room. The curtain was half drawn on the door when they saw an arm pulling on the door, she told he others ahe saw a "dark uniform go around a corner". WHATLEY advised the security guards at the hotel wore dark uniforms.
WHATLEY advised their was a weird message on the phone of their horel room. A woman voice left a message and called twice for "ROSEMARY", one of the girls on the trip. The message said ROSEMARY was scheduled for a massage of the hotel property.
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
Was Natalee Holloway Set Up?
One thing that investigators do when they reach an impasse in a case is they go back to the beginning and retrace the facts as they know them. In the case of missing Natalee Holloway let's do that one more time from the FACTS we know to be true.
Fact: Joran Van der Sloot was a frequent gambler in the casinos in Aruba. He was a playboy and well-connected to several of the people in those casinos. We know this because he was underage and was allowed to drink and gamble.
Fact: Joran Van der Sloot was hanging around the students from Mountain Brook all week long.
Fact: Joran Van der Sloot intially approached Natalee at a black jack table, not the other way around.
Fact: He was polite and when told she had lost a good deal of money gambling during the week, he played for her and won some of it back, earning her approval.
Fact: Natalee left him at the casino and went to Carlos and Charlie's for the final part of the evening showing little interest in him romantically.
Fact: Joran Van der Sloot showed up at Carlos and Charlie's and reconnected with Natalee there. They were seen dancing and leaving the club together.
Fact: Natalee got into a car driven by one of the Kalpoe brothers just a few feet away from her friends who were finding their way back to the hotel.
Fact: Natalee was never seen again.
These are all facts that have been documented by interviews with the friends of both Joran Van der Sloot and Natalee Holloway. Beyond these facts, we know nothing else to be true. It is conjecture. But, these facts, if taken logically, could lead to a very strong conjecture....
Was Natalee Holloway set up from the beginning to be taken off the island against her will?
Here is the conjecture part based on some reasonable assumptions of the facts.
Joran Van der Sloot likes to gamble. If you know anything about gambling, you know that most gamblers lose. If a gambler borrows a significant amount of money that he or she cannot pay back legally then they have to come up with a way to resolve it illegally. Owing someone money makes us do things we would not normally do. Owing someone who is dangerous a great deal of money would make us seriously consider doing something we would NEVER do. If Joran Van der Sloot owed a debt to someone and could not pay them back with his own money, he could have been told to pay with something or someone else. If this was the case, he would have to find a marker. Someone who fit the requirements of repayment. He would have to figure out a way to get that marker into the hands of the people he owed. Go back over the facts we know to be true. Remember, this is conjecture based on the facts. But, this scenario is one of the few that fits all the details including the amazing way that Natalee Holloway is nowhere to be found...
Joran spends time with the Mountain Brook kids and sizes up Natalee Holloway as the perfect mark. He waits until the last night and finds her playing cards. He makes friends with her by helping her out, thus winning her trust. He then calls the Kalpoe brothers and arranges for them to be his transportation for the rest of the evening. He finds her again at Carlos and Charlie's. He knows she will be there because she told him at the black jack table she would be. He dances with her and puts something in her drink shortly before she leaves the bar. We are not certain WHY she got into the car with him. She is either not in control of her faculties or is inebriated enough to be responding to him at this point. He tells her that he wants to, "show her the island" and she is either out of it or is thinking, "This guy is fun! I am having a good time. No harm in that!" She walks out with him and instead of telling her friends anything, she allows him to guide her into the car which has just pulled up. She jumps into the back seat and off they go. They wheel around the lighthouse and head to a deserted part of the island away from all the lights and people.. At that point, Joran Van der Sloot gets Natalee out of the car (or they carry her unconsciously) and takes her to the shoreline where several individuals are waiting. They force her into a boat and the debt is paid. Joran has done his part. He gets back into the car, tells the Kalpoe brothers to take him home or to the Marriott Hotel beach area. At some point, he either tells his dad or calls him from the beach. He tells his dad about Natalee "overdosing" on drugs or alcohol and that he asked some friends of his to get rid of her. He doesn't tell him about the debt. But, he is really scared that he might get into trouble. His father assures him, "No body, no CASE! and is upset that Natalee has died but it was not the fault of his son." (He may not know anymore than that since it is also documented that Joran lies to his parents constantly) The Kalpoe brothers are not going to talk because they are afraid for their own lives and five weeks later...No Natalee. Why not? She is not on the island. Who knows what the others did to her after she was dropped off. The debt was paid in full.
Conjecture is all we have. It may be all that we ever have. Joran is the only person being interrogated so all he has to do is keep quiet. There is no one else that really knows any of the other details except for him. The Kalpoe brothers may know that Natalee was put into a boat, but they could never prove it and if they talk they could die. The father doesn't want to know anything because he wants to be a judge and protect his son. The mother is clueless.
It is one of the few ways that Natalee Holloway could have disappeared so effectively. Like Caren Janssen, the Attorney General says, "There is NO evidence that a murder or even a crime has been committed." Of course not.
The actions of Joran Van der Sloot stalking Natalee in advance make me lean towards this grisly ending. This appears to have been planned earlier in the week. If he was desperate for money or feared for his own life, he would do just about anything to settle it in his favor. He may not be a murderer. He may be an accomplice to a kidnapping, instead. Either way, he is a sleaze bag who is clamming up because he doesn't want his own future compromised. That is why he will never talk. Never.
A lot of things fit with this scenario:
---no real evidence of cell phone activity, email or text messaging went on which would have indicated a panic once the murder was committed. Instead, Joran kept everything to himself. The advance plan kept any communication after the fact to a minimum
---the father is nervous about what happened to Natalee but really doesn't know much more beyond that.
---it explains why a responsible girl like Natalee did not respond initially to Joran and may have only left with him out of gratitude and a chance for some harmless fun or she was drugged.
---it explains why the Kalpoe brothers didn't break down under interrogation and why now they may leave the country out of fear. Otherwise, why leave?
---it fits Joran hanging around the group and not really engaging any of the girls all week until deciding on Natalee the last night she was there.
---it fits Joran's gambling habit.
---it explains why the body was never found and how the strategy to dispose of her was not done in a few hours but well-planned over several days.
---it explains why a calculating, intelligent girl like Natalee did not make an impulsive and irresponsible decision to get into a car with three virtual strangers while her friends were standing all around her.
---it explains the comment, "Don't worry boys, no body, no CASE!"
---it allows for the possibility that Joran Van der Sloot is not a psychopathic killer, but a coward who uses other people when it suits him. The greater the problem, the more desperate his solution.
The prevailing thinking is that he killed her alone on the beach and called his dad to help him dispose of her body. I understand that view. Either way, since the FBI was not allowed to have any control here, the absence of a lie detector, no crime scene and no physical evidence or apparent motive...Joran Van der Sloot is looking pretty safe from a legal standpoint right now.
By Pat Hurley
July 5, 2005
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door johan555 op 08-02-2008 19:20:10 ]
One thing that investigators do when they reach an impasse in a case is they go back to the beginning and retrace the facts as they know them. In the case of missing Natalee Holloway let's do that one more time from the FACTS we know to be true.
Fact: Joran Van der Sloot was a frequent gambler in the casinos in Aruba. He was a playboy and well-connected to several of the people in those casinos. We know this because he was underage and was allowed to drink and gamble.
Fact: Joran Van der Sloot was hanging around the students from Mountain Brook all week long.
Fact: Joran Van der Sloot intially approached Natalee at a black jack table, not the other way around.
Fact: He was polite and when told she had lost a good deal of money gambling during the week, he played for her and won some of it back, earning her approval.
Fact: Natalee left him at the casino and went to Carlos and Charlie's for the final part of the evening showing little interest in him romantically.
Fact: Joran Van der Sloot showed up at Carlos and Charlie's and reconnected with Natalee there. They were seen dancing and leaving the club together.
Fact: Natalee got into a car driven by one of the Kalpoe brothers just a few feet away from her friends who were finding their way back to the hotel.
Fact: Natalee was never seen again.
These are all facts that have been documented by interviews with the friends of both Joran Van der Sloot and Natalee Holloway. Beyond these facts, we know nothing else to be true. It is conjecture. But, these facts, if taken logically, could lead to a very strong conjecture....
Was Natalee Holloway set up from the beginning to be taken off the island against her will?
Here is the conjecture part based on some reasonable assumptions of the facts.
Joran Van der Sloot likes to gamble. If you know anything about gambling, you know that most gamblers lose. If a gambler borrows a significant amount of money that he or she cannot pay back legally then they have to come up with a way to resolve it illegally. Owing someone money makes us do things we would not normally do. Owing someone who is dangerous a great deal of money would make us seriously consider doing something we would NEVER do. If Joran Van der Sloot owed a debt to someone and could not pay them back with his own money, he could have been told to pay with something or someone else. If this was the case, he would have to find a marker. Someone who fit the requirements of repayment. He would have to figure out a way to get that marker into the hands of the people he owed. Go back over the facts we know to be true. Remember, this is conjecture based on the facts. But, this scenario is one of the few that fits all the details including the amazing way that Natalee Holloway is nowhere to be found...
Joran spends time with the Mountain Brook kids and sizes up Natalee Holloway as the perfect mark. He waits until the last night and finds her playing cards. He makes friends with her by helping her out, thus winning her trust. He then calls the Kalpoe brothers and arranges for them to be his transportation for the rest of the evening. He finds her again at Carlos and Charlie's. He knows she will be there because she told him at the black jack table she would be. He dances with her and puts something in her drink shortly before she leaves the bar. We are not certain WHY she got into the car with him. She is either not in control of her faculties or is inebriated enough to be responding to him at this point. He tells her that he wants to, "show her the island" and she is either out of it or is thinking, "This guy is fun! I am having a good time. No harm in that!" She walks out with him and instead of telling her friends anything, she allows him to guide her into the car which has just pulled up. She jumps into the back seat and off they go. They wheel around the lighthouse and head to a deserted part of the island away from all the lights and people.. At that point, Joran Van der Sloot gets Natalee out of the car (or they carry her unconsciously) and takes her to the shoreline where several individuals are waiting. They force her into a boat and the debt is paid. Joran has done his part. He gets back into the car, tells the Kalpoe brothers to take him home or to the Marriott Hotel beach area. At some point, he either tells his dad or calls him from the beach. He tells his dad about Natalee "overdosing" on drugs or alcohol and that he asked some friends of his to get rid of her. He doesn't tell him about the debt. But, he is really scared that he might get into trouble. His father assures him, "No body, no CASE! and is upset that Natalee has died but it was not the fault of his son." (He may not know anymore than that since it is also documented that Joran lies to his parents constantly) The Kalpoe brothers are not going to talk because they are afraid for their own lives and five weeks later...No Natalee. Why not? She is not on the island. Who knows what the others did to her after she was dropped off. The debt was paid in full.
Conjecture is all we have. It may be all that we ever have. Joran is the only person being interrogated so all he has to do is keep quiet. There is no one else that really knows any of the other details except for him. The Kalpoe brothers may know that Natalee was put into a boat, but they could never prove it and if they talk they could die. The father doesn't want to know anything because he wants to be a judge and protect his son. The mother is clueless.
It is one of the few ways that Natalee Holloway could have disappeared so effectively. Like Caren Janssen, the Attorney General says, "There is NO evidence that a murder or even a crime has been committed." Of course not.
The actions of Joran Van der Sloot stalking Natalee in advance make me lean towards this grisly ending. This appears to have been planned earlier in the week. If he was desperate for money or feared for his own life, he would do just about anything to settle it in his favor. He may not be a murderer. He may be an accomplice to a kidnapping, instead. Either way, he is a sleaze bag who is clamming up because he doesn't want his own future compromised. That is why he will never talk. Never.
A lot of things fit with this scenario:
---no real evidence of cell phone activity, email or text messaging went on which would have indicated a panic once the murder was committed. Instead, Joran kept everything to himself. The advance plan kept any communication after the fact to a minimum
---the father is nervous about what happened to Natalee but really doesn't know much more beyond that.
---it explains why a responsible girl like Natalee did not respond initially to Joran and may have only left with him out of gratitude and a chance for some harmless fun or she was drugged.
---it explains why the Kalpoe brothers didn't break down under interrogation and why now they may leave the country out of fear. Otherwise, why leave?
---it fits Joran hanging around the group and not really engaging any of the girls all week until deciding on Natalee the last night she was there.
---it fits Joran's gambling habit.
---it explains why the body was never found and how the strategy to dispose of her was not done in a few hours but well-planned over several days.
---it explains why a calculating, intelligent girl like Natalee did not make an impulsive and irresponsible decision to get into a car with three virtual strangers while her friends were standing all around her.
---it explains the comment, "Don't worry boys, no body, no CASE!"
---it allows for the possibility that Joran Van der Sloot is not a psychopathic killer, but a coward who uses other people when it suits him. The greater the problem, the more desperate his solution.
The prevailing thinking is that he killed her alone on the beach and called his dad to help him dispose of her body. I understand that view. Either way, since the FBI was not allowed to have any control here, the absence of a lie detector, no crime scene and no physical evidence or apparent motive...Joran Van der Sloot is looking pretty safe from a legal standpoint right now.
By Pat Hurley
July 5, 2005
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door johan555 op 08-02-2008 19:20:10 ]
Wanneer domme mensen domme dingen beweren, dan moet je ze niet corrigeren, maar glimlachend gelijk geven.
She supposedly ate in restaurant next to the Holiday Inn with 3/4 other MB students. Also she is with MB students when travelling to CnC's, so I can not imagine that PVDS has something to do it with it before 3 suspects go on a ride with Natalee.
There is however a difference in the PV's regarding stopping at Joran's house before going to the beach. What proof is there actually that they indeed have been dropped off at the beach.
There is however a difference in the PV's regarding stopping at Joran's house before going to the beach. What proof is there actually that they indeed have been dropped off at the beach.
www.hollowaycase.com (timeline)quote:4:00 pm: Joran and his father Paul attend a free poker tournament at the HI's Excelsior casino. Halfway through Paul leaves to look after Joran's youngest brother, and Joran takes his place (J 6/9).
Joran plays poker with Jug Twitty's nephew, Thomas (VF).
4:30 pm: Liz sees Natalee at the HI pool (Cain 302)
5:00 pm: Liz sees Natalee at the hot tub in the HI (Cain 302)
6:46 pm: Sunset. Natalee and her roommates are photographed together on the beach. .
7:00 pm: Natalee, Lee, Madison and others go to dinner at a restaurant next to the HI (Broughton 302, Whatley 302)
7:00 or 8:30 pm: Keycard that Dave Holloway later believes Natalee was using, is used for the last time ("Aruba" p. 72, MSNBC 4/5/06)
During dinner Natalee has a couple drinks, and talks with other girls about who she will "hook up" with. Madison thinks that Natalee will hook up with Kevin Broday because she had been flirting with him Natalee had also shown an interest in Jack Noble, the roommate of Madison's boyfriend, but he already has a girlfriend (Whatley 302, DZNH)
7:51 pm: Joran on tape entering HI casino (PTL)
After dinner, Natalee Holloway, Lee Broughton, Madison Whatley, and others go to the Holiday Inn casino, where Joran van der Sloot is already present (Whatley 302).
8:15 pm: Joran and group of MB girls including Natalee are captured on security video together at the same blackjack table in the HI casino. The girl sitting next to Joran on his left is Ruth, Natalee is to Ruth's left. Natalee does not interact with Joran on the video, and at one point is talking on a cell phone (PTL)
Natalee watches her classmates gamble but does not gamble herself. Joran helps Ruth win back money she'd lost. Ruth and Madison tell Joran they are going to CnCs, Joran tells them CnCs sucks on a Sunday night. They tell Joran it is the MB students' last night in Aruba (Whatley 302, J 6/9).
Note: In the days after Natalee's disappearance, Joran allegedly makes the false statement to at least two witnesses, that the girl whose money he helped win back was Natalee (OTR 5/30/05, Sander Gottenbos 6/16, Deepak e-mail)
Natalee briefly introduces herself to Joran and then walks off (OTR 6/21/05)
8:58 pm: Natalee captured on video re-entering casino (PTL)
9:00 pm: Liz Cain sees Natalee at HI Pavilion, Natalee says she is going to the casino in the hotel (Cain 302)
9:00-10:00 pm: Nancy Watson sees Natalee coming out of the bathroom in HI lobby area. Nancy compliments Natalee on her shirt and has a conversation with her. Natalee appears to be getting ready to leave the hotel, she does not appear intoxicated (Watson 302)
After blackjack, Ruth and Natalee eat nachos, before going to the Soul Beach Music Festival on Surfside Beach (DZNH)
9:45 pm: MB girls and Joran go to hotel bar by the pool (Broughton 302)
At the sports bar Joran meets his friends Luis and Joshua (DZNH).
9:50 pm: As Joran is leaving, Natalee askes if Joran is going meet them later at CnCs, Joran says no one really goes out on Sunday nights (Broughton 302).
After MB girls suggest it again, Joran decides he will go to CnCs, hoping to meet up with Ruth, whose name he later recalls as 'Kathleen" (J 6/9, OTR)
Ruth tells Joran she will take a shower and meet him later at CnCs (J 6/9)
Joran asks his friend Andre, who is at the casino, if he will accompany him to CnCs. Andre says he cannot because he has an exam the next day (Dos Santos 6/20)
Joran walks outside, calls his father and asks for a ride home. Paul says he will pick him up at McDonalds. Joran then calls his friend Jaimie and asks if he will accompany him to CnCs, but Jaime says he cannot because he has to work the next day. On the way to McDonalds Joran calls Deepak (OTR, J 6/9)
9:50 pm: Joran tells Deepak he met girls in the casino who would be going to CnCs, and asks Deepak if he wants to accompany him. Deepak says yes, he will go home for a short while and then pick Joran up at his place (D 6/11)
10:00-10:30 pm: Natalee, Ruth, Tracy Lazarus, and John Henderson take a taxi to CnCs (Broughton 302, DZNH)
Where facts are few, experts are many.
If i remember correctly from reading the reports/documents, he was chatting to Ruth at the blackjack table about the fact that she lost some money and joran would help her to win it back.quote:Fact: Joran Van der Sloot intially approached Natalee at a black jack table, not the other way around.
Fact: He was polite and when told she had lost a good deal of money gambling during the week, he played for her and won some of it back, earning her approval.
quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 18:43 schreef Mistify het volgende:
[..]
If i remember correctly from reading the reports/documents, he was chatting to Ruth at the blackjack table about the fact that she lost some money and joran would help her to win it back.
, see my post above, the FBI statement of Katharine Madison Whatley, 3rd subparagraph from above:"According to WHATLEY, Van der Sloot was helping RUTH MCVEIGH trying to win $100 at the card table."
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
ja maar de vriendinnen hebben later een verklaring afgelegd dat Joran nooit iet s voor wie dan ook gewonnen zou hebben op die avond
Wanneer domme mensen domme dingen beweren, dan moet je ze niet corrigeren, maar glimlachend gelijk geven.
Zou kunnen, hij heeft zelf wel geld verloren, ongeveer $ 250 staat ook in die FBI verklaring van Katharine Madison Whatleyquote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 19:31 schreef johan555 het volgende:
ja maar de vriendinnen hebben later een verklaring afgelegd dat Joran nooit iet s voor wie dan ook gewonnen zou hebben op die avond
Computer data Joran (May 30, 2005)
chat with Deepak:
3:25.04 am Deepak to Joran ben je der
3:25.04 am Deepak to Joran ?
3:25.38 am Deepak to Joran anyways fijn te horen dat je thuis bent ik spreek je morgen ik ga slapen
3:25.42 am Deepak to Joran take care
7 minutes and 26 seconds later
3:33.08 am Joran to Deepak hey swa (hey buddy)
3:35.32 am Joran to Deepak topa/lopa pimp hheehehe
Websites visited:
I'm off drinking
, and yes responsible 
[ Bericht 8% gewijzigd door BwennieBren op 08-02-2008 19:55:17 ]
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
The whole money part is a bit puzzling indeed, but I can realise that at one point these class mates wanted to tell a different story then Joran.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 19:31 schreef johan555 het volgende:
ja maar de vriendinnen hebben later een verklaring afgelegd dat Joran nooit iet s voor wie dan ook gewonnen zou hebben op die avond
Might not be relevant anyway.
- Maybe O.D.B My Long Distance Family -
"Computer says: no.."
"Laat hen gaan, blinden zijn zij, die blinden leiden. Indien een blinde een blinde leidt, zullen zij beiden in een put vallen". (Matteüs 15:14)
"Computer says: no.."
"Laat hen gaan, blinden zijn zij, die blinden leiden. Indien een blinde een blinde leidt, zullen zij beiden in een put vallen". (Matteüs 15:14)
This is a simulation showing vortex formation and downstream shedding from a circular “island”. Note carefully the rotating vorticies that form and alternately sweep the downstream face of the “island”. This is our “Marriot Beach/Huts” side.
Wanneer domme mensen domme dingen beweren, dan moet je ze niet corrigeren, maar glimlachend gelijk geven.
To me the weird thing is that she apparently got there at 20:58 and was sitting at the table around 20:25. Either thats strange or I need glasses.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 15:07 schreef Ticker het volgende:
Look at this:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=YA3NKpGHnqc
It shows Natalee and Joran both entering the casino, alone.
The funny thing is, the casino camera above the table says it's about 20:25.
The camera aimed at the door, shows Joran entering at 19:51.
This same camera shows on 20:58 that Natalee enters the casino.
What's up with the time differents.
I liked it. I was good at it. It made me feel alive.
A few minutes stroll back along the beach from the Fisherman's Huts to the HI hotel.
The bushes, left, make the huts beach area slightly secluded.
Wanneer domme mensen domme dingen beweren, dan moet je ze niet corrigeren, maar glimlachend gelijk geven.
Lees die timetable nog eens... Het was een re-enter, ze ging even weg en kwam terug. Hoe ze naar buiten is gegaan is niet duidelijk.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 20:56 schreef Harajuku. het volgende:
To me the weird thing is that she apparently got there at 20:58 and was sitting at the table around 20:25. Either thats strange or I need glasses.
Where facts are few, experts are many.
That's odd; the ring of prostitution comes to mind.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 17:23 schreef johan555 het volgende:
Another American Girl Missing with Aruba Connection just seven years ago
While Aruba does damage control over fears that their tourism industry may suffer, reports have surfaced that Natalee Holloway is not the only young American girl to disappear there.
Another family said they know exactly what the parents of Natalee Holloway, the Alabama teenager who has been missing in Aruba since last week, are going through.
They've been dealing with the same nightmare for seven years.
The Bradleys, of Virginia, went on a cruise in 1998 and Aruba was one of the stops. That's where their daughter disappeared.
Iva Bradley said her 23-year-old daughter, Amy, befriended three men who worked on the cruise ship and they wanted to take her to a bar in Aruba.
"They said they wanted to take her to a bar on Aruba that was called Carlos and Charlie's," said Bradley.
this is amy [ afbeelding ]
Natalee Holloway spent her last night ALSO eating and dancing at Carlos 'n Charlie's bar
Which was investigated by Brigit Katelaan.
.
I´m back.
Joran van der Sloot verhoord in Rotterdam
(Novum) - Joran van der Sloot is vrijdag verhoord door rechercheurs van de Arubaanse politie. Dat heeft het Openbaar Ministerie van Aruba laten weten. Het verhoor over de verdwijning van Natalee Holloway vond plaats op een politiebureau in Rotterdam.
In het twee uur durende verhoor heeft Van der Sloot verklaard dat hij tijdens de gesprekken in de auto van Patrick van der Eem, die was ingeschakeld door misdaadverslaggever Peter R. de Vries, onder invloed van marihuana was.
Ook wil Van der Sloot bij zijn eerdere verklaringen tegenover de politie blijven en ontkent hij dus iedere betrokkenheid bij Holloways verdwijning. Al voor de geruchtmakende uitzending van De Vries zei Joran van der Sloot dat zijn veronderstelde bekentenissen in de zaak niet de waarheid zijn.
De gesprekken met Van der Eem zijn met een verborgen camera opgenomen en hierop verklaart Van der Sloot dat hij precies weet hoe Natalee op zee werd gedumpt. Hij stelde dat de 18-jarige Amerikaanse onwel was geworden tijdens seks op het strand.
Of Van der Sloot verder wordt verhoord hangt af van de uitspraak in het beroep dat het Arubaanse OM heeft aangespannen tegen de beslissing van de rechter-commissaris. Die wees het verzoek om Van der Sloot opnieuw te arresteren af. Een uitspraak hierover wordt na het weekeinde verwacht.
Het Arubaanse OM roept de media op om terughoudend te zijn met eigen naspeuringen in de zaak. Het OM is bang dat 'bepaalde personen op intimiderende wijze worden belaagd'. "Het tot een verdachte bestempelen van willekeurige personen kan de zaak schaden", legt een woordvoerder van het OM uit. Het OM benadrukt dat met de oproep de vrije nieuwsgaring niet in gevaar hoeft komen maar dat van de pers terughoudendheid mag worden verwacht. Vorige week ontstond een volksoploop in Drachten toen ten onrechte werd gedacht dat Joran zich daar in een flat bevond.
[ Bericht 4% gewijzigd door johan555 op 08-02-2008 21:22:33 ]
(Novum) - Joran van der Sloot is vrijdag verhoord door rechercheurs van de Arubaanse politie. Dat heeft het Openbaar Ministerie van Aruba laten weten. Het verhoor over de verdwijning van Natalee Holloway vond plaats op een politiebureau in Rotterdam.
In het twee uur durende verhoor heeft Van der Sloot verklaard dat hij tijdens de gesprekken in de auto van Patrick van der Eem, die was ingeschakeld door misdaadverslaggever Peter R. de Vries, onder invloed van marihuana was.
Ook wil Van der Sloot bij zijn eerdere verklaringen tegenover de politie blijven en ontkent hij dus iedere betrokkenheid bij Holloways verdwijning. Al voor de geruchtmakende uitzending van De Vries zei Joran van der Sloot dat zijn veronderstelde bekentenissen in de zaak niet de waarheid zijn.
De gesprekken met Van der Eem zijn met een verborgen camera opgenomen en hierop verklaart Van der Sloot dat hij precies weet hoe Natalee op zee werd gedumpt. Hij stelde dat de 18-jarige Amerikaanse onwel was geworden tijdens seks op het strand.
Of Van der Sloot verder wordt verhoord hangt af van de uitspraak in het beroep dat het Arubaanse OM heeft aangespannen tegen de beslissing van de rechter-commissaris. Die wees het verzoek om Van der Sloot opnieuw te arresteren af. Een uitspraak hierover wordt na het weekeinde verwacht.
Het Arubaanse OM roept de media op om terughoudend te zijn met eigen naspeuringen in de zaak. Het OM is bang dat 'bepaalde personen op intimiderende wijze worden belaagd'. "Het tot een verdachte bestempelen van willekeurige personen kan de zaak schaden", legt een woordvoerder van het OM uit. Het OM benadrukt dat met de oproep de vrije nieuwsgaring niet in gevaar hoeft komen maar dat van de pers terughoudendheid mag worden verwacht. Vorige week ontstond een volksoploop in Drachten toen ten onrechte werd gedacht dat Joran zich daar in een flat bevond.
[ Bericht 4% gewijzigd door johan555 op 08-02-2008 21:22:33 ]
Wanneer domme mensen domme dingen beweren, dan moet je ze niet corrigeren, maar glimlachend gelijk geven.
Oh, right. Hoezo is dat niet op de tape dan?quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 21:01 schreef Atreidez het volgende:
[..]
Lees die timetable nog eens... Het was een re-enter, ze ging even weg en kwam terug. Hoe ze naar buiten is gegaan is niet duidelijk.
I still find it very hard to believe that his dad knows and was like "Oh you threw her into the ocean? Well, Ill protect you!" My parents would call the cops
Oh, and the story about him taking Natalee to pay debts.. Wouldnt that be fucking stupid? Those people know he did that and would be like "I need you to do this and this or we'll tell this and that to the cops"
I liked it. I was good at it. It made me feel alive.
There is still no concrete and compelling evidence to suggest that Paul van der Sloot was a corrupt magistrate (-trainee). That it was his (Paul's) plan te dispose of the body of Natalee in the ocean and that the Aruban govt and its officials helped with, what some SM users called, a humongus cover-up.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 21:21 schreef Harajuku. het volgende:
[..]
Oh, right. Hoezo is dat niet op de tape dan?
I still find it very hard to believe that his dad knows and was like "Oh you threw her into the ocean? Well, Ill protect you!" My parents would call the cops [ afbeelding ]
Oh, and the story about him taking Natalee to pay debts.. Wouldnt that be fucking stupid? Those people know he did that and would be like "I need you to do this and this or we'll tell this and that to the cops"
Sure there might be corruption on Aruba, in connection with drug trafficing, as observer all ready lined out, but does this mean that they go so far as to smother a ring of serial rapist? Don't think so. Maffia kind of people are as conservative on these things as the mother of Natalee is.
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door Ryan3 op 08-02-2008 21:54:30 ]
I´m back.
I gave you proof. The article I sent you was a newspaper article from Aruba's largest newspaper,I sent you the translations and also gave you the translator to do that yourself. Also a direct quote from Natalee's Mom who heard this herself from his own mouth and has spoken about it many times.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 12:29 schreef Ticker het volgende:
[..]
A source is not a person where you heard it from.
With a source is meant hard-evidence like an article or some real documents.
Don't act like i'm blaming you anything, I just like to see your quotes backed-up instaid of sending me on the internet to look for it myself.
By the way.. you still are doing it cause you are giving me a link and saying maybe it's on there, look for it yourself.
Read the latest work of the freebirds. It is well done
http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/
[ Bericht 3% gewijzigd door observer777 op 08-02-2008 22:09:09 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Oohh, Im with you on this one. That's what I've been saying. They say things like "Aruba is corrupted and THEREFOR Holloway is a cover up" And that is not how we do these things.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 21:39 schreef Ryan3 het volgende:
[..]
There is still no concrete and compelling evidence to suggest that Paul van der Sloot was a corrupt magistrate (-trainee). That it was his (Paul's) plan te dispose of the body of Natalee in the ocean and that the Aruban govt and its officials helped with, what some SM users called, a humongus cover-up.
Sure there might be corruption on Aruba, in connection with drug trafficing, as observer all ready lined out, but does this mean that they go so far as to smother a ring of serial rapist? Don't think so. Maffia kind of people are as conservative on these things as the mother of Natalee is.
And Im not gonna believe that his father knows everything and helped him just like that, untill they prove it. I just won't.
I liked it. I was good at it. It made me feel alive.
het OM op aruba een lachertje !!
de website bestaat sinds 2004 en er staat NIKS op
ha ha niet te geloven !
http://www.omaruba.aw/
Welkom op de website van het Openbaar Ministerie Aruba (OM). Op deze website willen wij u meer vertellen over het OM. Bij het OM werken zo’n 50 mensen. Deze mensen zijn dag in dag uit bezig met de uitvoering van de kerntaak van het OM: de strafrechtelijke handhaving van de rechtsorde in Aruba.
Lees meer over het OM Aruba
Copyright © 2004 Afdeling Voorlichting en Communicatie OM Aruba
Adres : Havenstraat 2 | Oranjestad | Aruba
Postadres : Postbus 1163 | Oranjestad | Aruba
Tel : +297 582 1415
Fax : +297 583 8891
Email : om.aruba@setarnet.aw
Ontwikkeling en Beheer : Grip MultiMedia
Wanneer domme mensen domme dingen beweren, dan moet je ze niet corrigeren, maar glimlachend gelijk geven.
quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 22:22 schreef johan555 het volgende:
[ afbeelding ]
het OM op aruba een lachertje !!
de website bestaat sinds 2004 en er staat NIKS op
niet te geloven !
http://www.omaruba.aw/
Welkom op de website van het Openbaar Ministerie Aruba (OM). Op deze website willen wij u meer vertellen over het OM. Bij het OM werken zo’n 50 mensen. Deze mensen zijn dag in dag uit bezig met de uitvoering van de kerntaak van het OM: de strafrechtelijke handhaving van de rechtsorde in Aruba.
Lees meer over het OM Aruba
Copyright © 2004 Afdeling Voorlichting en Communicatie OM Aruba
Adres : Havenstraat 2 | Oranjestad | Aruba
Postadres : Postbus 1163 | Oranjestad | Aruba
Tel : +297 582 1415
Fax : +297 583 8891
Email : om.aruba@setarnet.aw
Ontwikkeling en Beheer : Grip MultiMedia
they moved their site to a different address:
http://www.chiquitabananen.nl/nlnl/
Dostojewski: "Je kunt je niet van je eigen gezond verstand overtuigen door je buurman op te sluiten."
Caesu, perhaps I'am wrong, but aren't you an user who has sympathy for Wilders?quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 22:32 schreef Caesu het volgende:
[..]
they moved their site to a different address:
http://www.chiquitabananen.nl/nlnl/
I´m back.
What doya mean?quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 22:51 schreef lipboutje het volgende:
niet? oh
I´m back.
interesting point.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 22:38 schreef Ryan3 het volgende:
[..]
Caesu, perhaps I'am wrong, but aren't you an user who has sympathy for Wilders?
but no i have no sympathy for Wilders. i disagree with him on almost every subject strongly.
i do however agree with Hero Brinkman (PVV) that Aruba en the Antilles are full with corruption and drugs smugling and maybe worse. i don't support putting those islands on e-bay, but i do however support i big cleaning up operation on those islands.
i suspect the entire dutch parliament knows Hero Brinkman has a point.
but they are afraid to side with the PVV because they are afraid to be affailiated with this party because of other more extreme views on muslims for example.
what do you think?
Dostojewski: "Je kunt je niet van je eigen gezond verstand overtuigen door je buurman op te sluiten."
Perhaps these ilses need some cleansing; but I don't think you shoud walk away from it. So I' m not siding with the PVV. They want to part with it, amongst other things because of the corruption.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 22:58 schreef Caesu het volgende:
[..]
interesting point.
but now i have no sympathy for Wilders. i disagree with him on almost every subject strongly.
i do however agree with Hero Brinkman (PVV) that Aruba en the Antilles are full with corruption and drugs smugling and maybe worse. i don't support putting those islands on e-bay, but i do however support i big cleaning up operation on those islands.
i suspect the entire dutch parliament knows Hero Brinkman has a point.
but they are afraid to side with the PVV because they are afraid to be affailiated with this party because of other more extreme views on muslims for example.
what do you think?
I´m back.
yes, that's what i mean. not abandon those islands, that goes too far.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 23:10 schreef Ryan3 het volgende:
[..]
Perhaps these ilses need some cleansing; but I don't think you shoud walk away from it. So I' m not siding with the PVV. They want to part with it, amongst other things because of the corruption.
so much drugs comes via the ABC islands to Europa.
yesterday we saw how easy it is to smuggle on airplanes on Schiphol Airport (no adequate security).
but i find the PVV is the only party to bring this up. (the problems on the ABC and in lesser extent SSS islands)
the coalition party's disagrees per definition with the PVV.
so if the PVV has one idea which may have some valid aspects - other party's (especially the government coalition party's) struck it down by default.
i think this is the bigger picture.
maybe seemingly unrelated to Natalee.
but i reallly think a culture of drugs and corruption enables persons like Joran to exploit the situation and cause havoc.
Dostojewski: "Je kunt je niet van je eigen gezond verstand overtuigen door je buurman op te sluiten."
Judge Bob Witt Judicial associate of Paulus van der Sloot changed the search warrant on the spot from the entire VDS residence to a small part of the property,Joran's little apt and the two cars. High Ranking official Ben Vocking(King)laid low for two weeks purportedly staying at the Van der Sloot residence. He surfaced on June 15, 2005 at the door of the Van der Sloot home with Dutch Judge Bob Wit to block the search of the Van der Sloot property when the police and prosecution authorities arrived with a full search warrant. It wasn't until two years later that the VDS house was fully searched.
Judge Bob Wit intervened again eight days later when Joran’s father Paulus Van Der Sloot was arrested for reasonable suspicion in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway, once again blocking a search of the Van Der Sloot home. Without question Bob Wit knew Paulus van der Sloot - they worked on cases together and appear to be very good friends judging from such an outrageous ruling. Since when do arrested murder suspects get immunity from having their houses searched? Judge Bob Wit needs to answer this question in the open forum of the Caribbean Court of Justice, rather than hide behind the opaque wall of Dutch law
Judge Rick Smid– Reportedly a friend of PVDS who stayed at VDS home. It was Judge Rick Smid who released the three suspects and gave them an unconditional release granting them immunity from further questioning in the case. On August 30, 2005 Judge Smid issued a ruling that Joran should be held another 30 days, flew back to Curacao and immediately faxed in a reversal of his ruling. Police statements and secret recordings of the three suspects suggest intimate knowledge of "something bad" happening to Holloway. He was also aware that Joran van der Sloot had lied repeatedly in his police statements and conflicting statements from all the suspects. Judge Rick Smid chose to ignore this and grant immunity instead. Upon his release, Joran van der Sloot fled the island of Aruba to Holland where he currently resides. As we know none of the suspects have ever been questioned again. Including Paul Van Der Sloot where it was ruled by Aruba's highest court that he had two contacts with Natalee Holloway including at 4am two hours after his son said he left her at the beach.
Jan van der Straaten-Police Chief for the Aruba Police Department and close friend of Paulus van der Sloot . Jan van der Straten's role as lead investigator in the first two months of the Natalee Holloway case demonstrates the obvious conflicts of interest found in the Aruba investigation. Van der Straaten was, by Paulus van der Sloot's own public admission, a "close friend" of Van der Sloot and worked for PVDS years earlier. We know PVDS and JVDS were in constant contact during the Investigation and we know the bogus evidence that got the security guards arrested was by Gerald Dompig's brother-in law who also states he saw Natalee Holloway with cocaine. Both are definite flat out lies. Van der Straten would have been very instrumental in the decision not to arrest the three main suspects in Natalee's disappearance until 10 days after she vanished, even though he knew immediately that they lied about dropping the Alabama teen off at the Holiday Inn.Van der Straten would have also been involved in the decision to arrest two black security guards on June 5, 2005 which in effect prolonged the time given to the three suspects to cover their tracks and eliminate any evidence that should have been collected immediately upon the discovery of the Holiday Inn lie.Van der Straten stated to Dutch media on June 12, 2005 that he believed Natalee was no longer alive and when asked by the reporter why he would make such a comment he responded, "Because I know the evidence and you don't. Interestingly, two years later the lead investigator has never explained what that evidence is.He also made comment months after we were told he was retiring and moved to the neighboring island of Bonaire as he took the same title as Police Commissioner. He stated that the case should have been solved early on but that there were "people who didn't want to cooperate." Since suspects rarely cooperate, Van der Straten had to have been talking about a corrupt Aruban government and Dutch judiciary. Any high-ranking official with such a close relationship to a suspect's parent should have recused himself or alternately been forced off the case, but this is Aruba, a country in the grip of Mafia control who never saw a conflict of interest they didn't like.
From Joran's Book
Van der Straaten arrives and tells Joran that he "has known your father for years. I only want to help you. I am going to see to it that you can go to Holland, that you will not have to go to jail, but that you will be committed to a mental institution. You only have to tell the truth."
posted on 06/12/2005
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
UPDATE 24: Tuesday night during the broadcast of the most popular entertainment news program in The Netherlands, RTL-Boulevard, crime reporter John van den Heuvel announced that he talked to police commissioner Jan van der Straten, who is heading the investigation. The commissioner told van den Heuvel that they expect the case of Natalee Holloway to be solved within the next 24 hours.
Aruban Who's Who
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=203.0
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
is this december or june 2005?quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 23:21 schreef observer777 het volgende:
posted on 06/12/2005
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
UPDATE 24: Tuesday night during the broadcast of the most popular entertainment news program in The Netherlands, RTL-Boulevard, crime reporter John van den Heuvel announced that he talked to police commissioner Jan van der Straten, who is heading the investigation. The commissioner told van den Heuvel that they expect the case of Natalee Holloway to be solved within the next 24 hours.
if it is june 2005 i find this very remarkable... (nonetheless if it is december it is remarkable too)
this was right around the time they kept Beth and Jug asking questions wether Natalee had a history with epilepsy / seizures. to which they repeatedly said NO!
why did van Straten think he was going to solve it 24 hours??????
because he thought he would be able to make a natural death out of it???
Dostojewski: "Je kunt je niet van je eigen gezond verstand overtuigen door je buurman op te sluiten."
It was June 2005! I think just a day or two later in Joran's book is where he told Joran all you have to do is tell the truth and I will see you never go to prison but instead to a mental institution. Remember it was announces all over American media Joran confessed on June 10th,something bad happened and they were retreaving her body. Some newspapers reported her as confirmed dead. Then the next day it was said it was mis-information by Rudy Croes,even though his office is the one who announced the confession. We know on the 13th Joran was saying he was being framed and then gave the statement accusing Deepak of coming back with two dogs and possibly raping and killing Natalee.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 23:31 schreef Caesu het volgende:
[..]
is this december or june 2005?
if it is june 2005 i find this very remarkable... (nonetheless if it is december it is remarkable too)
this was right around the time they kept Beth and Jug asking questions wether Natalee had a history with epilepsy / seizures. to which they repeatedly said NO!
why did van Straten think he was going to solve it 24 hours??????
because he thought he would be able to make a natural death out of it???
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
omg.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 23:45 schreef observer777 het volgende:
[..]
It was June 2005! I think just a day or two later in Joran's book is where he told Joran all you have to do is tell the truth and I will see you never go to prison but instead to a mental institution. Remember it was announces all over American media Joran confessed on June 10th,something bad happened and they were retreaving her body. Some newspapers reported her as confirmed dead. Then the next day it was said it was mis-information by Rudy Croes,even though his office is the one who announced the confession. We know on the 13th Joran was saying he was being framed and then gave the statement accusing Deepak of coming back with two dogs and possibly raping and killing Natalee.
speechless
Dostojewski: "Je kunt je niet van je eigen gezond verstand overtuigen door je buurman op te sluiten."
It could have been meant that he confessed the story of being dropped off with her alone at the beach, instead of the HI story. I do however think that JvS knows more about this case then he was willing to pursue. Weren't all interrogations filmed and taped btw, I think I red this somewhere.
Where facts are few, experts are many.
Joran van der Sloot continues to deny
during new police interrogations
This morning Joran van der Sloot was interrogated at a police station in Rotterdam by detectives of the Aruba Police Corps and the Corps Federal Police. This was announced by the Aruba Public Prosecutor tonight.
Joran declares that he conducted the talks in the car while being under the influence of marihuana. He makes no further deviations from his statements as made earlier during the investigation. He denies having had anything to do with the disappearance of Natalee Holloway.
The interrogation lasted approximately two hours. Joran’s lawyer was present at the time.
during new police interrogations
This morning Joran van der Sloot was interrogated at a police station in Rotterdam by detectives of the Aruba Police Corps and the Corps Federal Police. This was announced by the Aruba Public Prosecutor tonight.
Joran declares that he conducted the talks in the car while being under the influence of marihuana. He makes no further deviations from his statements as made earlier during the investigation. He denies having had anything to do with the disappearance of Natalee Holloway.
The interrogation lasted approximately two hours. Joran’s lawyer was present at the time.
Wanneer domme mensen domme dingen beweren, dan moet je ze niet corrigeren, maar glimlachend gelijk geven.
Peter R. de Vries reageert op nieuwe verklaring Joran
Joran heeft vandaag tegenover de recherche verklaard dat hij tijdens de urenlange bekentenissen tegenover onze undercover Patrick onder invloed verkeerde van wiet en daardoor onzin heeft uitgekraamd. Het lijkt een laatste, verwoede poging van hem om te redden wat er te redden valt. Immers, wat kan hij anders nog verzinnen om onder een celstraf uit te komen. Als hij zou toegeven dat hij bij zijn volle verstand was, dan was zijn spel meteen uit.
- ONGELOOFWAARDIG -
Jorans nieuwe verklaring is in mijn ogen een zeer ongeloofwaardige, niet reële uitleg. Belangrijk om vast te stellen is dat Joran zijn verhaal deed op verschillende tijdstippen van de dag, op verschillende dagen en soms met een tussenpoos van wel een week. Niet één keer kwam Joran terug op zijn eerdere verklaring en niet één keer wekte hij ook maar een beetje de indruk dat hij de volgende dag schrok van wat hij eerder - volgens hem nu dus in kennelijke staat - had verteld tegen Patrick. Nee, steeds ging hij er juist op door en vulde hij zijn verhaal aan met nieuwe feiten en omstandigheden over wat er de fatale nacht in mei 2005 op het strand op Aruba was gebeurd.
- NIET CONSTANT STONED -
Bovendien was Joran helemaal niet constant stoned, als hij dat überhaupt al is geweest in de auto met Patrick. Hij is immers gewend aan blowen. Hij rookte in de auto slechts een aantal malen een joint, en stak heus niet de ene met de andere aan. Steevast haalde Patrick hem fris en nuchter op bij het huis van zijn oma in Arnhem, waarna hij, voor hij een joint opstak, overtuigend inging op zijn aandeel in Natalee’s verdwijning. Of wil Joran nu beweren dat hij alle dagen volkomen stoned bij zijn oma op de bank zat te wachten tot Patrick hem rond het middaguur kwam oppikken?
- BIJ VOLLE VERSTAND -
Nee, wat Joran van der Sloot in de auto tegenover Patrick verklaarde, gebeurde bij zijn volle verstand. En iedereen heeft dat kunnen vaststellen. Het lijkt erop dat hij deze laatste escape verzint omdat de Amerikaanse opinie over drugsgebruik nogal puriteins is en hij erop hoopt dat men een dergelijke uitleg misschien eerder slikt. Maar het snijdt op geen enkele manier hout.
bron : peterrdevries.nl
Joran heeft vandaag tegenover de recherche verklaard dat hij tijdens de urenlange bekentenissen tegenover onze undercover Patrick onder invloed verkeerde van wiet en daardoor onzin heeft uitgekraamd. Het lijkt een laatste, verwoede poging van hem om te redden wat er te redden valt. Immers, wat kan hij anders nog verzinnen om onder een celstraf uit te komen. Als hij zou toegeven dat hij bij zijn volle verstand was, dan was zijn spel meteen uit.
- ONGELOOFWAARDIG -
Jorans nieuwe verklaring is in mijn ogen een zeer ongeloofwaardige, niet reële uitleg. Belangrijk om vast te stellen is dat Joran zijn verhaal deed op verschillende tijdstippen van de dag, op verschillende dagen en soms met een tussenpoos van wel een week. Niet één keer kwam Joran terug op zijn eerdere verklaring en niet één keer wekte hij ook maar een beetje de indruk dat hij de volgende dag schrok van wat hij eerder - volgens hem nu dus in kennelijke staat - had verteld tegen Patrick. Nee, steeds ging hij er juist op door en vulde hij zijn verhaal aan met nieuwe feiten en omstandigheden over wat er de fatale nacht in mei 2005 op het strand op Aruba was gebeurd.
- NIET CONSTANT STONED -
Bovendien was Joran helemaal niet constant stoned, als hij dat überhaupt al is geweest in de auto met Patrick. Hij is immers gewend aan blowen. Hij rookte in de auto slechts een aantal malen een joint, en stak heus niet de ene met de andere aan. Steevast haalde Patrick hem fris en nuchter op bij het huis van zijn oma in Arnhem, waarna hij, voor hij een joint opstak, overtuigend inging op zijn aandeel in Natalee’s verdwijning. Of wil Joran nu beweren dat hij alle dagen volkomen stoned bij zijn oma op de bank zat te wachten tot Patrick hem rond het middaguur kwam oppikken?
- BIJ VOLLE VERSTAND -
Nee, wat Joran van der Sloot in de auto tegenover Patrick verklaarde, gebeurde bij zijn volle verstand. En iedereen heeft dat kunnen vaststellen. Het lijkt erop dat hij deze laatste escape verzint omdat de Amerikaanse opinie over drugsgebruik nogal puriteins is en hij erop hoopt dat men een dergelijke uitleg misschien eerder slikt. Maar het snijdt op geen enkele manier hout.
bron : peterrdevries.nl
Wanneer domme mensen domme dingen beweren, dan moet je ze niet corrigeren, maar glimlachend gelijk geven.
tvp.
Yvonne riep ergens: Static is gewoon Static, je leeft met hem of niet.
Geen verborgen agenda's, trouw, grote muil, lief hartje, bang voor bloed, scheld FA's graag uit voor lul.
Op dinsdag 26 oktober 2021 16:46 schreef Elan het volgende:
Hier sta ik dan weer niet van te kijken Zelfs het virus is bang voor jou.
Geen verborgen agenda's, trouw, grote muil, lief hartje, bang voor bloed, scheld FA's graag uit voor lul.
Op dinsdag 26 oktober 2021 16:46 schreef Elan het volgende:
Hier sta ik dan weer niet van te kijken Zelfs het virus is bang voor jou.
meet Me at Hot or Not
Wanneer domme mensen domme dingen beweren, dan moet je ze niet corrigeren, maar glimlachend gelijk geven.
face book !
JORAN ADVERTISES ON FACEBOOK THAT HE ATTENDS MICHIGAN UNIVERSITY, BUT THE TRUTH IS JORAN LIVED IN ARUBA AND WAS IN HIGH SCHOOL
JORAN ADVERTISES ON FACEBOOK THAT HE ATTENDS MICHIGAN UNIVERSITY, BUT THE TRUTH IS JORAN LIVED IN ARUBA AND WAS IN HIGH SCHOOL
Wanneer domme mensen domme dingen beweren, dan moet je ze niet corrigeren, maar glimlachend gelijk geven.
keep in mind of course that it is possible to make such a page for someone else.quote:Op zaterdag 9 februari 2008 00:16 schreef johan555 het volgende:
face book !
JORAN ADVERTISES ON FACEBOOK THAT HE ATTENDS MICHIGAN UNIVERSITY, BUT THE TRUTH IS JORAN LIVED IN ARUBA AND WAS IN HIGH SCHOOL
[ afbeelding ]
but it can be checked by looking at IP-addresses of course.
Dostojewski: "Je kunt je niet van je eigen gezond verstand overtuigen door je buurman op te sluiten."
tja
Wanneer domme mensen domme dingen beweren, dan moet je ze niet corrigeren, maar glimlachend gelijk geven.
The confession was real and all over the American media on most every major news station,I could provide like 30 links for the 10th and 11th. And even more links the next day when they were retrieving her body. Natalee's family was already grieving and was told by the FBI she was not alive. Mass confusion,mis-information..etc..But Deputy Chief Dompig andThe Minister of Defense Office(David Croes)said there was a confession and they were leading them to the body. As you can see the next day that all changed. Many of the video/text links no longer work or were updated. But it was a AP story,CNN,FOX and other MSM and of course all over the blogs. Yes,I do believe interrogations were filmed,at least that is what we were told.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 23:55 schreef Atreidez het volgende:
It could have been meant that he confessed the story of being dropped off with her alone at the beach, instead of the HI story. I do however think that JvS knows more about this case then he was willing to pursue. Weren't all interrogations filmed and taped btw, I think I red this somewhere.
Witnessed by Diario Reporter
“They Buried Natalee in the neighborhood of Fishermen huts"
http://www.scaredmonkeys.com/?p=1260
According to information that DIARIO is receiving, when Joran van der Sloot was detained he started crying during interrogation and he even told officers that they buried Natalee in the neighborhood of Fishermen hutsIt could be deduced that he doesn’t remember precisely where, but in the neighborhood of Fishermen huts, the elder Kalpoe brother buried Natalee. He told police that he would cooperate but that didn’t last long.
As for the Kalpoe Brothers, they also made fun of our authority because they simply told the cops: “No Body means No Case”.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Natalee Holloway Is Dead
A reliable source from Aruba throughout my reporting has informed me that Natalee Holloway has now been confirmed as deceased, her Father is traveling to the location of the body. My thoughts and prayers go out to the family.
http://www.riehlworldview(...)rvative/2005/week23/
AP is correcting that they did not confess , just said something bad has happenned to her.
One of the teenage suspects confessed to killing Natalee Holloway and they are looking for the body now. One of the suspects is taking them to the body now.
From CNN
Karl Penhaul is reporting
STORY ON CNN
One of three young suspects arrested Thursday in the investigation into the disappearance of an Alabama teenager has confessed to her murder, a senior police official said late Friday.
The suspect has agreed to lead police to the body of 18-year-old Natalee Holloway, the police official said.
Police did not say which of the three teenagers confessed.
The three have been identified as brothers Satish Kalpoe, 18, and Depak Kalpoe, 21, and their friend, 17-year-old Joran Van Der Sloot, the son of a judge
AP: ORANJESTAD, Aruba - One of three young men who took an Alabama high school student to the beach during her class trip to Aruba confessed he killed her, police say. Deputy Police Commissioner Gerold Dompig told The Associated Press that the man was leading police late Friday to the scene of the crime.
WBRC
Local Birmingham TV is reporting that the family is going to the lighthouse area to look for the body. Mai Martinez reporting live says that they were at the lighthouse but now are heading to police station nord.
MSNBC
ORANJESTAD, Aruba - One of three young men who took a missing Alabama honors student to the beach confessed that “something bad” happened to the 18-year-old American, police say.
1 AM : Aruba Girl in the comments is reporting that they are going to Canashito, a rock quarry. During the massive search (the one where the civil servants got off), they spotted suspcious activity by a white van in the area. The cops went to check it out, but found nothing.
Yahoo
An unidentified friend of Natalee Holloway signs a ‘wall of hope’ erected for the missing Alabama teen in Mountain Brook, Ala., on Friday, June 10, 2005. Holloway disappeared in Aruba on May 30 during a senior graduation trip to the Dutch Caribbean island. (AP Photo/Jay Reeves)
http://scaredmonkeys.com/2005/06/11/breaking/
http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/06/10/missing.teen/index.html
--------------------------------------------
- One of three young men who took an Alabama teenager to the beach during a high school graduation trip to Aruba said "something bad happened" to her, police said Friday.
Deputy Police Commissioner Gerold Dompig told The Associated Press that the man was leading police late Friday to the scene. He refused to identify which young man had made the statement.
Fox news is reporting that one of the men arrested in the Natalee Holloway disappearance arrested yesterday has confessed to killing her and said he will lead police to her body.
------------------------------------------------
Confusion Reigns in Natalee Holloway Case
A barrage of conflicting reports from Aruban officials over the weekend concerning the fate of Alabama honor student Natalee Holloway sent news reporters scrambling to determine whether or not the teenager's death has been confirmed and her body located. Her family denies that the body has been found.
Saturday afternoon Fox News quoted Aruban Minister of Justice Edward Croes confirming Holloway's death and saying authorities know the location of her body. Reportedly, Natalee's father was with investigators looking for her body. However, a few hours later Fox News reported that same official denied making that statement.
Croes said that he was the victim of a "misinformation campaign."
It was Croes who called late Friday reports 'lies" that one of the three men who took Alabama teen Natalee Holloway to the beach the night she disappeared confessed that "something bad" happened to the teen and would lead authorities to her body.
The Associated Press reported late Friday night that Deputy Police Commissioner Gerold Dompig said that the man was leading police to the scene of the crime. The report did not say which of the three students confessed. CNN "confirmed" this report and continued to report the confession throughout the day.
Dompig said one of the three admitted that "something bad" had happened to the honor student who was in Aruba with her senior class. She disappeared May 30 when she failed to show up for a return flight home.
Conflicting Reports
Then Justice Minister Rudy Croes told reporters early Saturday morning that the rumor that one of the students had confessed was a lie, throwing the media on the island into confusion and prompting conflicting news alerts from the Caribbean. Croes emphatically denied that any confession had been made.
Three men who admitted they were with Holloway on the night she disappeared in Aruba were arrested Thursday in connection with the case. The three are Satish Kalpoe, 18, and his brother, Deepak, 21, and Joran Andreas Petrus Van Der Sloot, 17.
The three men appeared in court Saturday and a judge determined that there was enough evidence to continue to hold them in custody.
Meanwhile, another report said a sixth man had been arrested in connection with the case, but later reports said that arrest had nothing to do with the Holloway disappearance.
http://crime.about.com/b/(...)ee-holloway-case.htm
http://en.wikinews.org/wiki/US_teen_missing_in_Aruba_feared_dead
-----------------------------------------------
ORANJESTAD, Aruba (CNN) -- A judge ruled Saturday to keep in custody three youths arrested earlier this week in connection with the disappearance of an Alabama teenager, a government official said.
The decision allows police and prosecutors eight days to continue their investigation into 18-year-old Natalee Holloway's disappearance, the official said.
The judge was flown in from the neighboring island of Curacao, a step not considered unusual in high-profile cases, said Aruba government spokesman Rueben Trappenberg. He explained that government officials want to ensure everything is done properly.
Defense attorneys have come to the defense of the young men, saying they have maintained their innocence.
"My client keeps on saying he is not guilty," said attorney David Kock, who represents 18-year-old Satish Kalpoe. He added that as far as he knew, none of the three have admitted guilt.
Kock said, "There's a girl missing, so everybody assumes that a crime has been committed."
Antonio Carlo represents Joran Van Der Sloot, the son of an Aruban judge. Carlo said the teen "has admitted to no crime whatsoever. My client has maintained that he is innocent."
Asked how Van Der Sloot was faring, Carlo said, "He is a 17-year-old boy. His detention is, of course, having an effect on him emotionally, but he is holding strong."
He said Van Der Sloot had been in contact with his mother and was assisting in the investigation. Both attorneys refused to comment on details of the investigation.
Van der Sloot, Kalpoe and Kalpoe's 21-year-old brother Depak were the last to be seen with Holloway. They were spotted leaving the popular Carlos'N Charlie's nightclub in the early hours of May 30.
A senior police official told CNN there had been "a breakthrough amounting to a confession, or some sort of confession" in relation to the case, but did not say who made it.
Prosecutors refused to confirm or deny reports of a confession.
Law enforcement sources close to the investigation said there has not been a confession, but that cracks are appearing in the three suspects' stories.
Spokeswoman Vivian Van Der Biezen said only that the investigation was at a "very crucial" point.
Aruba Prime Minister Nelson Oduber said no one had informed him of a confession, but noted that type of information is not something he would learn of during this stage of investigation.
He said early Saturday that there was no search for a body or remains.
"Investigators will continue early in the morning doing their job," Oduber said.
Late Friday, a senior police official told CNN that one of the three youths police took into custody Thursday had confessed to killing Holloway.
The Mountain Brook, Alabama, resident was in Aruba with more than 100 classmates and seven chaperones celebrating high school graduation.
[ Bericht 1% gewijzigd door observer777 op 09-02-2008 01:06:33 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
So?quote:Op zaterdag 9 februari 2008 00:16 schreef johan555 het volgende:
face book !
JORAN ADVERTISES ON FACEBOOK THAT HE ATTENDS MICHIGAN UNIVERSITY, BUT THE TRUTH IS JORAN LIVED IN ARUBA AND WAS IN HIGH SCHOOL
[ afbeelding ]
Most people lie on the internet.
Yvonne riep ergens: Static is gewoon Static, je leeft met hem of niet.
Geen verborgen agenda's, trouw, grote muil, lief hartje, bang voor bloed, scheld FA's graag uit voor lul.
Op dinsdag 26 oktober 2021 16:46 schreef Elan het volgende:
Hier sta ik dan weer niet van te kijken Zelfs het virus is bang voor jou.
Geen verborgen agenda's, trouw, grote muil, lief hartje, bang voor bloed, scheld FA's graag uit voor lul.
Op dinsdag 26 oktober 2021 16:46 schreef Elan het volgende:
Hier sta ik dan weer niet van te kijken Zelfs het virus is bang voor jou.
Shocking, so the case was solved in June 2005 but somehow the confession and the body of Natalee was 'lost'... how strange...
WEB / [HaxBall #64] Jos is God
Arguing on the Internet is like running in the Special Olympics.
Arguing on the Internet is like running in the Special Olympics.
Mede-Fokkers:
Ik moet toch wat zeggen over de ScaredMonkeys.
Deze mensen zitten vanaf begin bovenop de zaak.
Dag en nacht zijn ze Nederlandse en Arubaanse kranten / journaals / talkshows / OM documenten aan het naspitten.
Ze verstaan er niets van maar ze gooien het in de automatische vertalers en gaan analyseren.
Er moet iemand zijn die Nederlands kan want uiteindelijk komen ze met een vrijwel correcte vertaling.
Dus ook vanuit Papiamento, nou dat is geen wereldtaaltje natuurlijk - ook dat gaat in de automatische vertaler. Gescande documenten, tikken ze dus uit in in het Papiamento.
Het is werkelijk ongelovelijk waar deze mensen mee bezig zijn.
Bijvoorbeeld: die uitzending Pauw & Witteman met het wijnincident.
Die uitzending wordt bekeken, volledig geanalyseerd op body language, alles wordt er bij gehaald.
Zelfs de comments die wij Nederlanders plaatsen op de site van Pauw&Witteman worden geanalyseerd en besproken.
Deze mensen weten denk ik 100x zoveel over het eiland Aruba alleen al dan de gemiddelde Nederlander en misschien wel de gemiddelde Arubaan ook.
Er zijn vast monkeys bij die de landkaart van Aruba kunnen dromen.
Ondertussen hebben ze ook nog een radiostation.
Paar dagen geleden was Jug Twitty (stiefvader) daar zelfs te gast.
Ze hebben overigens ook contact met Beth.
Terwijl dit allemaal aan de gang is moeten ze zich ook nog verdedigen tegen grofste beschuldigingen die hier en daar tegen Natalee en de Holloway / Twitty familie worden gemaakt.
Bijvoorbeeld dat de familie lekker financieel zit binnen te lopen dankzij het verlies van hun dochter...
Volgens mij is het Joran die overal een slaatje uit probeert te slaan.
Vanaf begin af aan vertrouwden ze de boel niet.
En pas nu blijkt dat ze er mogelijk helemaal niet ver naast hebben gezeten want reguliere media begint het ook langzaam te begrijpen.
Natuurlijk zijn er de wildste speculaties, maar ook die worden door en door geanalyseerd en onder de loep gehouden.
Op Fok! geven we Fok!awards.
Nou mensen als deze lui geen award verdienen weet ik het niet meer.
Ik kom overigens pas sinds een week op die site maar werkelijk dit is indrukwekkend hoor.
Ik hoop dat ze contact kunnnen leggen met Peter R. de Vries want ze hebben werkelijk waardevole informatie.
Natuurlijk zullen ze er ook naast zitten hoor, maar ze zijn tenminste enorm fanatiek bezig de waarheid boven tafel te krijgen.
Ze zijn zeer teleurgesteld in het OM op Aruba en ze verdienen echt alle kudo's voor waar ze mee bezig zijn.
Een heleboel Amerikanen daar in hun studeerkamers, zolders en weet ik waar ze allemaal zitten zijn mogelijk een enorme blunder die zich afspeelt binnen het Koninkrijk der Nederlanden aan het oplossen, of ik moet zeggen natuurlijk een poging daartoe.
Ik ga geen linkjes plaatsen naar voorbeelden maar ik plaats alleen dit linkje naar een topic ten tijde van het wijnincident:
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2512.msg327217#msg327217 (dit is tijdens de Pauw & Witteman uitzending - het wijnincident moet nog komen).
gooi voor de grap eens Peter R. de Vries in de automatische translator:
Godfather R. the Freeze
zo noemen sommigen hem op SM.
< einde reclame >
Observer: i just had to give me opinion about SM, you know i am very impressed about all the information you guys are gathering and analyzing.
[ Bericht 1% gewijzigd door Caesu op 09-02-2008 01:28:05 ]
Ik moet toch wat zeggen over de ScaredMonkeys.
Deze mensen zitten vanaf begin bovenop de zaak.
Dag en nacht zijn ze Nederlandse en Arubaanse kranten / journaals / talkshows / OM documenten aan het naspitten.
Ze verstaan er niets van maar ze gooien het in de automatische vertalers en gaan analyseren.
Er moet iemand zijn die Nederlands kan want uiteindelijk komen ze met een vrijwel correcte vertaling.
Dus ook vanuit Papiamento, nou dat is geen wereldtaaltje natuurlijk - ook dat gaat in de automatische vertaler. Gescande documenten, tikken ze dus uit in in het Papiamento.
Het is werkelijk ongelovelijk waar deze mensen mee bezig zijn.
Bijvoorbeeld: die uitzending Pauw & Witteman met het wijnincident.
Die uitzending wordt bekeken, volledig geanalyseerd op body language, alles wordt er bij gehaald.
Zelfs de comments die wij Nederlanders plaatsen op de site van Pauw&Witteman worden geanalyseerd en besproken.
Deze mensen weten denk ik 100x zoveel over het eiland Aruba alleen al dan de gemiddelde Nederlander en misschien wel de gemiddelde Arubaan ook.
Er zijn vast monkeys bij die de landkaart van Aruba kunnen dromen.
Ondertussen hebben ze ook nog een radiostation.
Paar dagen geleden was Jug Twitty (stiefvader) daar zelfs te gast.
Ze hebben overigens ook contact met Beth.
Terwijl dit allemaal aan de gang is moeten ze zich ook nog verdedigen tegen grofste beschuldigingen die hier en daar tegen Natalee en de Holloway / Twitty familie worden gemaakt.
Bijvoorbeeld dat de familie lekker financieel zit binnen te lopen dankzij het verlies van hun dochter...
Volgens mij is het Joran die overal een slaatje uit probeert te slaan.
Vanaf begin af aan vertrouwden ze de boel niet.
En pas nu blijkt dat ze er mogelijk helemaal niet ver naast hebben gezeten want reguliere media begint het ook langzaam te begrijpen.
Natuurlijk zijn er de wildste speculaties, maar ook die worden door en door geanalyseerd en onder de loep gehouden.
Op Fok! geven we Fok!awards.
Nou mensen als deze lui geen award verdienen weet ik het niet meer.
Ik kom overigens pas sinds een week op die site maar werkelijk dit is indrukwekkend hoor.
Ik hoop dat ze contact kunnnen leggen met Peter R. de Vries want ze hebben werkelijk waardevole informatie.
Natuurlijk zullen ze er ook naast zitten hoor, maar ze zijn tenminste enorm fanatiek bezig de waarheid boven tafel te krijgen.
Ze zijn zeer teleurgesteld in het OM op Aruba en ze verdienen echt alle kudo's voor waar ze mee bezig zijn.
Een heleboel Amerikanen daar in hun studeerkamers, zolders en weet ik waar ze allemaal zitten zijn mogelijk een enorme blunder die zich afspeelt binnen het Koninkrijk der Nederlanden aan het oplossen, of ik moet zeggen natuurlijk een poging daartoe.
Ik ga geen linkjes plaatsen naar voorbeelden maar ik plaats alleen dit linkje naar een topic ten tijde van het wijnincident:
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2512.msg327217#msg327217 (dit is tijdens de Pauw & Witteman uitzending - het wijnincident moet nog komen).
gooi voor de grap eens Peter R. de Vries in de automatische translator:
Godfather R. the Freeze
zo noemen sommigen hem op SM.
< einde reclame >
Observer: i just had to give me opinion about SM, you know i am very impressed about all the information you guys are gathering and analyzing.
[ Bericht 1% gewijzigd door Caesu op 09-02-2008 01:28:05 ]
Dostojewski: "Je kunt je niet van je eigen gezond verstand overtuigen door je buurman op te sluiten."
Ex-commissioner Stanley Zaandam in his new book KPA-Quo Vadis 2,3
To exculpate the son of Paul vd Sloot, the commissioner and fiscal falsely arrested two ex security guards
Bon Dia Aruba
9/19/2005
ORANJESTAD – The police corps committed a blunder in the case of the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. According to ex-commissioner Stanley Zaandam, who dedicates attention to the case here and also in his upcoming publication.
According to Zaandam, the nominations - of among others Commissioners Bernardina, Dompig, Hassel and Richardson, along with 34 high-rank 1st class inspectors - which are against the law and hierarchy of the KPA [police corps], have serious consequences for the quality and integrity of work in KPA.
Accoding to Zaandam, none of the high-ranked commissioners has the qualifications nor experience to conduct a judicial investigation.
Police at the top of political list
According to Zaandam, Commissioner Dompig is under the instruction of Minister Rudy Croes, of MEP.
He also states that 20 other policemen were ranked high on a political list. Five others (…) among them Commissioner Hassell, according to Zaandam.
He also claims this is how Commissioner vd Straten was appointed to this case. However, according to Zaandam, this should not be work for a commissioner.
BLUNDER
Zaandam continues talking about the blunder under which the 3 youngsters were questioned, which should have been a simple case, but one that resulted in KPA’s biggest blunder, due to the deceiptfulness of JvdS, Satish and Deepak Kalpoe, they remained free another 12 days.
FALSE ARREST
Zaandam keeps on saying in his book, two days after 5/29, the body of Natalee H. may have already been found and Cvp [police commissioner] looked the other way to do a favour for Paul vd Sloot (ex of chief staff of Cabinet PG [prosecutor general] J. Zwinkels). To exculpate the son of Paul, the CvP and fiscal chief prosecutor Karen Jansen made the false arrest of two ex-security guards, Jones and John , called this a ‘tactical maneuver’ , and denied them their freedom for another 10 days.
This, continues Zaandam in his book, is the issue here. However, he has much more to tell regarding the case of Natalee Holloway.
[translated by Getagrip]
// posted by Getagrip @ 9/19/2005 12:18:00 PM
http://getagripmonkey.blo(...)pmonkey_archive.html
To exculpate the son of Paul vd Sloot, the commissioner and fiscal falsely arrested two ex security guards
Bon Dia Aruba
9/19/2005
ORANJESTAD – The police corps committed a blunder in the case of the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. According to ex-commissioner Stanley Zaandam, who dedicates attention to the case here and also in his upcoming publication.
According to Zaandam, the nominations - of among others Commissioners Bernardina, Dompig, Hassel and Richardson, along with 34 high-rank 1st class inspectors - which are against the law and hierarchy of the KPA [police corps], have serious consequences for the quality and integrity of work in KPA.
Accoding to Zaandam, none of the high-ranked commissioners has the qualifications nor experience to conduct a judicial investigation.
Police at the top of political list
According to Zaandam, Commissioner Dompig is under the instruction of Minister Rudy Croes, of MEP.
He also states that 20 other policemen were ranked high on a political list. Five others (…) among them Commissioner Hassell, according to Zaandam.
He also claims this is how Commissioner vd Straten was appointed to this case. However, according to Zaandam, this should not be work for a commissioner.
BLUNDER
Zaandam continues talking about the blunder under which the 3 youngsters were questioned, which should have been a simple case, but one that resulted in KPA’s biggest blunder, due to the deceiptfulness of JvdS, Satish and Deepak Kalpoe, they remained free another 12 days.
FALSE ARREST
Zaandam keeps on saying in his book, two days after 5/29, the body of Natalee H. may have already been found and Cvp [police commissioner] looked the other way to do a favour for Paul vd Sloot (ex of chief staff of Cabinet PG [prosecutor general] J. Zwinkels). To exculpate the son of Paul, the CvP and fiscal chief prosecutor Karen Jansen made the false arrest of two ex-security guards, Jones and John , called this a ‘tactical maneuver’ , and denied them their freedom for another 10 days.
This, continues Zaandam in his book, is the issue here. However, he has much more to tell regarding the case of Natalee Holloway.
[translated by Getagrip]
// posted by Getagrip @ 9/19/2005 12:18:00 PM
http://getagripmonkey.blo(...)pmonkey_archive.html
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Paulus van der Sloot
Pauw & Witteman Show
January 11, 2008
Paulus: Well look uhhhh… Mister De Vries can’t hear that good… If he would have listened carefully he would have heard that Joran said that he didn’t have any confidence in the OM (public pros.)! That’s what Joran has said. Joran didn’t talk about the judicial authorities. What you see now.., what has happened is that luckely we have judicial authorities… And we sit here again! So in the end it’s because of the judicial authorities that all has ended well.
Translation: EURobert - SM FP Poster/Monkey
http://scaredmonkeys.net/(...);topicseen#msg328035
Jossy Mansur
NANCY GRACE
October 4, 2005
GRACE: … Jossy, regarding the connection, what I perceived to be a close connection between the judge, Paulus Van Der Sloot and the retired chief of police who initially handled Natalee`s case, Van Der Stratten, were they friends?
MANSUR: Of course, they were friends. It stands to reason they were friends because Paul Van Der Sloot had many friends within the police department; he had many friends within the Department of Justice. And he had many friends with -- and he was friendly with all the judges in Aruba. He worked out of the same office as they did and did the same work.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0510/04/ng.01.html
Paulus van der Sloot
NOVA - TWAN HUYS
June 28, 2005
VAN DER SLOOT: That gives a feeling of absurdity. It is indeed almost unimaginable that by someone you actually know very well, where you worked together with for a long time, that that one comes to tell you that you are suspected of complicity to murder.
HUYS: Who was that in your case?
VAN DER SLOOT: That was, in this case, that was the leader of the team of police commissioners.
HUYS: Jan van der Straaten.
VAN DER SLOOT: That was Jan van der Straaten, yes.
HUYS: And you know each other very well?
VAN DER SLOOT: Yes
Paulus van der Sloot
NOVA
June 28, 2005
JUDICIARY
Reporter (Twan Huys): Which function do you have here at the island? Because many stories go around about that. What is your function?
Paulus van der Sloot: I am a replacing member of the joint court of justice of the Netherlands Antilles and Aruba [1] and I am appointed for a period of three years, from January the first, 2003, until January the first, 2006.
Reporter (Twan Huys): So, you are replacement judge?
Paulus van der Sloot: Yes.
PROSECUTOR'S OFFICE
Reporter (Twan Huys): Do you know the people very well, for example, the people here from the public prosecutors' office that ordered your detention?
Paulus van der Sloot: Yes, for sure, because, before that, I have worked for eight years as chief of the cabinet of the prosecutor general [2].
Reporter (Twan Huys): So, you also know the current prosecutor general?
Paulus van der Sloot: Yes.
Reporter (Twan Huys): Mrs. Croes.
Paulus van der Sloot: Yes.
ARUBAN LAW ENFORCEMENT
Reporter (Twan Huys): Yes, and what does that mean when your colleagues stop by to arrest you?
Paulus van der Sloot: That gives a feeling of absurdity. It is indeed almost unimaginable that by someone you actually know very well, where you worked together with for a long time, that that one comes to tell you that you are suspected of complicity to murder.
Reporter (Twan Huys): Who was that in your case?
Paulus van der Sloot: That was, in this case, that was the leader of the team of police commissioners.
Reporter (Twan Huys): Jan van der Straaten.
Paulus van der Sloot: That was Jan van der Straaten, yes.
Reporter (Twan Huys): And you know each other very well?
Paulus van der Sloot: Yes.
Translation Credit: Dugo - Riehl Worldview
Pauw & Witteman Show
January 11, 2008
Paulus: Well look uhhhh… Mister De Vries can’t hear that good… If he would have listened carefully he would have heard that Joran said that he didn’t have any confidence in the OM (public pros.)! That’s what Joran has said. Joran didn’t talk about the judicial authorities. What you see now.., what has happened is that luckely we have judicial authorities… And we sit here again! So in the end it’s because of the judicial authorities that all has ended well.
Translation: EURobert - SM FP Poster/Monkey
http://scaredmonkeys.net/(...);topicseen#msg328035
Jossy Mansur
NANCY GRACE
October 4, 2005
GRACE: … Jossy, regarding the connection, what I perceived to be a close connection between the judge, Paulus Van Der Sloot and the retired chief of police who initially handled Natalee`s case, Van Der Stratten, were they friends?
MANSUR: Of course, they were friends. It stands to reason they were friends because Paul Van Der Sloot had many friends within the police department; he had many friends within the Department of Justice. And he had many friends with -- and he was friendly with all the judges in Aruba. He worked out of the same office as they did and did the same work.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0510/04/ng.01.html
Paulus van der Sloot
NOVA - TWAN HUYS
June 28, 2005
VAN DER SLOOT: That gives a feeling of absurdity. It is indeed almost unimaginable that by someone you actually know very well, where you worked together with for a long time, that that one comes to tell you that you are suspected of complicity to murder.
HUYS: Who was that in your case?
VAN DER SLOOT: That was, in this case, that was the leader of the team of police commissioners.
HUYS: Jan van der Straaten.
VAN DER SLOOT: That was Jan van der Straaten, yes.
HUYS: And you know each other very well?
VAN DER SLOOT: Yes
Paulus van der Sloot
NOVA
June 28, 2005
JUDICIARY
Reporter (Twan Huys): Which function do you have here at the island? Because many stories go around about that. What is your function?
Paulus van der Sloot: I am a replacing member of the joint court of justice of the Netherlands Antilles and Aruba [1] and I am appointed for a period of three years, from January the first, 2003, until January the first, 2006.
Reporter (Twan Huys): So, you are replacement judge?
Paulus van der Sloot: Yes.
PROSECUTOR'S OFFICE
Reporter (Twan Huys): Do you know the people very well, for example, the people here from the public prosecutors' office that ordered your detention?
Paulus van der Sloot: Yes, for sure, because, before that, I have worked for eight years as chief of the cabinet of the prosecutor general [2].
Reporter (Twan Huys): So, you also know the current prosecutor general?
Paulus van der Sloot: Yes.
Reporter (Twan Huys): Mrs. Croes.
Paulus van der Sloot: Yes.
ARUBAN LAW ENFORCEMENT
Reporter (Twan Huys): Yes, and what does that mean when your colleagues stop by to arrest you?
Paulus van der Sloot: That gives a feeling of absurdity. It is indeed almost unimaginable that by someone you actually know very well, where you worked together with for a long time, that that one comes to tell you that you are suspected of complicity to murder.
Reporter (Twan Huys): Who was that in your case?
Paulus van der Sloot: That was, in this case, that was the leader of the team of police commissioners.
Reporter (Twan Huys): Jan van der Straaten.
Paulus van der Sloot: That was Jan van der Straaten, yes.
Reporter (Twan Huys): And you know each other very well?
Paulus van der Sloot: Yes.
Translation Credit: Dugo - Riehl Worldview
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Geef maar kudos aan een paar gekken met te veel tijd en een eigen radiostation. De twin tower maniakken hebben dat ook ... een obsessie is nooit goed.quote:Op zaterdag 9 februari 2008 01:14 schreef Caesu het volgende:
Observer: i just had to give me opinion about SM, you know i am very impressed about all the information you guys are gathering and analyzing.
“I'm in trouble because I'm normal and slightly arrogant. A lot of people don't like themselves and I happen to be totally in love with myself.”
Thankyou Caesu! If we had given up then it would of all been forgotten,Natalee would never be found and there would be no justice. We are up against a Govt spending millions in a misinformation/slander campaign against this victim and her family. If we don't try and help who will?quote:Op zaterdag 9 februari 2008 02:00 schreef -MyLove- het volgende:
[..]
Geef maar kudos aan een paar gekken met te veel tijd en een eigen radiostation. De twin tower maniakken hebben dat ook ... een obsessie is nooit goed.
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
wat vind je van de obsessie van Natalee's moeder Beth om te weten te komen wat met haar dochter is gebeurd?quote:Op zaterdag 9 februari 2008 02:00 schreef -MyLove- het volgende:
[..]
Geef maar kudos aan een paar gekken met te veel tijd en een eigen radiostation. De twin tower maniakken hebben dat ook ... een obsessie is nooit goed.
als zij geen enorme mediacampagne was begonnen, was Natalee waarschijnlijk maar heel kort in het nieuws geweest, had Peter R. de zaak niet opgepikt, was Patrick al helemaal niet op Joran afgestapt en was de zaak nooit opgelost - of misschien wel: de officieele verklaring was dat ze gewoon op strand plotseling overleden was...
en Joran kon op jacht naar nieuwe prooien.
ik heb groot respect voor de scaredmonkeys, lees mijn bericht hierboven nog maar eens.
maak een topic erover en geef aan waar je het precies niet mee eens bent.
Dostojewski: "Je kunt je niet van je eigen gezond verstand overtuigen door je buurman op te sluiten."
It was actually Joran who said that.quote:Op vrijdag 8 februari 2008 09:35 schreef observer777 het volgende:
Deepak Quotes from the police car tapes
If they find the girl they will see the shit!
[/b]
He is threatening Deepak and Satish that he's going to incriminate them. He is frustrated because they didnt stick to the story. He is then bluffing, saying he can get them into trouble also, so they better comply and do as he says.
Deepak and Satish are laughing at him, they basically say 'We have nothing to fear, we just tell the truth, simple as that'. They call his bluff more or less.
This makes Joran even more angry and he then makes a mistake:
Joran knows that if the police finds the body then "they will see that shit". We dont know what "that shit" is exactly but stands to reason that the body will have obvious signs of foul play.quote:Joran: I know very well that you are afraid. That is if you two have done something bad with that girl. En if they find the girl, then we shall see
Satish: I'm not afraid. Why must I be afraid?
[...]
Joran: That's your problem. If they find that girl, then they will see that shit.
Police car conversation
The way Joran tries to use this to threaten the two brothers shows that they have no knowledge of this.
This correlates with what Joran said to Patrick in the De Vries tapes:
"Ik heb mazzel gehad. Als ze haar vinden, ben ik de lul."
(I have been lucky'. If they find her, I'm fucked.)
And why Joran in one of his early statements claimed that Natalee hit her head on the street pavement when she tripped getting out of their car. (to account for a head wound)
And there are more refrences to this:
"she accidentally hit her head" "Then she fell and hit her head on something." [source]
Did Joran bash her head in? Brain injury would certainly explain the convulsions.
[ Bericht 1% gewijzigd door NorthernStar op 09-02-2008 02:39:41 ]
Your exacly right NS! There was one of the parents and friend of the family who was in Aruba the first few days and a teacher told them that Joran hit Natalee in the head with a baseball bat..No idea if true or not..But Interesting..We also learned those first few days Joran was sleeping at his school and not his home. As I posted there is several references from PJK2 about her hitting her head,It very well could be what Joran means if they find the girl,they will see the shit. We know Deepak says to him if they find the girl you will get 15 years! Why 15 years? In Satish's PV he does not go to school and sleeps until 1pm and the first thing he asked his brother Deepak is hows the girl? I tend to believe Satish went home and Deepak was there and saw everything. PVDS was on the computer researching drugs and alcohol that first night also. Not suprising the computer had a virus and most everything was erased and damaged. We did see that someone logged in as Val at 3am on x-plane,so he could have been the alibi on the computer or perhaps someone else. All of this on a school night on a sunday?
Yes,The brain injury could cause convulsions. Add in the reports of blood in the car and the missing shoes and that very well may be a piece of the puzzle. If she died of a natural death or OD why did they lie,cover up and hide the body forever. Why didn't they call a ambulance?
Yes,The brain injury could cause convulsions. Add in the reports of blood in the car and the missing shoes and that very well may be a piece of the puzzle. If she died of a natural death or OD why did they lie,cover up and hide the body forever. Why didn't they call a ambulance?
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
i think, val= valentine, the younger brother of joran, but i cannot imagine he is awake in the middle of the night, someone just used his account.
Blood in Deepak's car was announced by the Minsiter of Justice Rudy Croes,Prime Minsiter Oduber,FBI and ALE..We know later they said it turned out to be chocolate. How could so many people mistake blood for chocolate,how could the neat freak Deepak allow chocolate all over his car? The FBI says there was blood in the trunk of the vehicle as well,we were told later that it turned out to be rust. A PI for the family found out Deepak was looking into long term storage for this vehicle and there is eye witnesses that saw Deepak and two others franticly washing and cleaning the car at 3AM in a very strange part of the house shortly after NH vanished.
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2016.0
We know they cut squares out of one of those cars on the seat and headliner. We also saw the Aruban Newspaper article that blood was found in one of the sloot vehicles. Not sure if the article was a typo or not.
The "Diario," a local daily newspaper, is reporting that a human blood sample found in a car at the residence of one of the teens in custody — the 17-year-old son of a high-ranking island judicuary official — is now being sent to the U.S. and will be tested for a possible match to Natalee, whose mother gave a blood sample to investigators.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159252,00.html
http://edition.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0510/04/ng.01.html
Back to Beth Twitty, Natalee`s mom. I want to talk to you about the prime minister`s statement, the Aruban prime minister, who went public and stated there was blood found in the car. Remember?
BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY: Yes, absolutely.
GRACE: What happened?
BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY: Absolutely. That`s what I would love to know. On June 11, he states on international media in front of me -- I had no idea what he was about to disclose -- that there was blood in the Kalpoes` vehicle, there was DNA, there was blood. Where is that? Even (INAUDIBLE) went so far to cut interior portions from the car -- the back seat, the ceiling. You know, what happened with that?
Somebody -- you know, that`s the reason there`s no evidence. Had they gone to the -- and impounded that car that day -- the FBI told us there was blood all in the car. The prosecutor said the FBI said there was blood in the car. But for some reason or another, when they sent it off, they say now it`s all cleaning fluid. Well, who knows. I know they had nine days to clean the car.
Natalee Holloway: ... BLOOD WAS FOUND IN THE TRUNK OF THE CAR. ... of the suspect's cars to see if it was Holloway's blood. ...ABC NEWS
Authorities were overheard on a police frequency Sunday evening issuing a bulletin to stop a rented white Toyota in connection with the disappearance of the 5-foot-4-inch blonde. Dompig declined to confirm it.
Art Wood, a retired Secret Service agent helping the Holloway family investigate the case, said: "That blood was sent to Holland and it came back as being cleaning fluid and chocolate. That's what the test results show. But an Aruban police officer who worked on the investigation told me there was definitely blood in that car. I think the wrong sample was deliberately sent to Holland.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159711,00.html
Aruban officials did ask the FBI, however, to analyze a DNA sample from the backseat of one of the suspect's cars to see if it was Holloway's blood. The blood was flown to the FBI crime lab in Quantico, Va., but tests came back negative for blood.
An FBI spokeswoman also confirmed that Aruban officials have not requested more evidence processing at the Quantico lab. However, FBI agents are being included in police briefings, and one agent is being allowed to observe interviews with the suspects through a live video feed or through glass.
------------------------------------------------
Search for blood in Deepak Kalpoe's carJune 9, 2005
3 page report
Divisie Centrale Recherche, Aruba
Laboratory Report (blood sample)
June 9, 2005
Blood Samples
COMPARISON FBI – Quantico
The "Diario," a local daily newspaper, is reporting that a human blood sample found in a car at the residence of one of the teens in custody — the 17-year-old son of a high-ranking island judicuary official — is now being sent to the U.S. and will be tested for a possible match to Natalee, whose mother gave a blood sample to investigators.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159252,00.html
The next day, June 10, 2005, DNA samples were taken from Beth Twitty and Dave Holloway in Aruba. June 10, 2005 brought us another important occurrence in this case – a confession was made by one of the suspects arrested the previous day.
Chief of Police, Gerold Dompig
CBS NEWS
June 10, 2005
http://www.cbsnews.com/st(...)nal/main700829.shtml
Holloway's family rushed late Friday to an old stone lighthouse beside Arisha beach after Deputy Police Commissioner Gerold Dompig told The Associated Press that one of three young men in custody admitted that "something bad happened" to Holloway and was leading police to the scene of the alleged crime.
Paul Reynolds - Natalee Holloway's Uncle
'Scarborough Country'
July 12, 2005
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8551822
PAUL REYNOLDS, UNCLE OF NATALEE HOLLOWAY: I know that my sister had a meeting with the FBI June 10, Friday. And from that meeting, she became convinced that Natalee was no longer alive. She called her mother and told her that. And our family was—was—began the grieving process. However, if Aruban spokespeople were to be believed, there was not blood, but rather cleaning fluid found inside Deepak’s car – and the confession was merely a “misinformation campaign.”
FOX NEWS
June 11, 2005
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159252,00.html
David Cruz, a spokesman for the Aruban Minister of Justice (search) told FOX News Natalee Holloway (search), who was on vacation with friends with a graduation trip when she disappeared, was confirmed dead and that authorities knew the location of her body. However, Cruz later retracted the statement, saying he was a victim of a "misinformation campaign."
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2016.0
We know they cut squares out of one of those cars on the seat and headliner. We also saw the Aruban Newspaper article that blood was found in one of the sloot vehicles. Not sure if the article was a typo or not.
The "Diario," a local daily newspaper, is reporting that a human blood sample found in a car at the residence of one of the teens in custody — the 17-year-old son of a high-ranking island judicuary official — is now being sent to the U.S. and will be tested for a possible match to Natalee, whose mother gave a blood sample to investigators.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159252,00.html
http://edition.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0510/04/ng.01.html
Back to Beth Twitty, Natalee`s mom. I want to talk to you about the prime minister`s statement, the Aruban prime minister, who went public and stated there was blood found in the car. Remember?
BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY: Yes, absolutely.
GRACE: What happened?
BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY: Absolutely. That`s what I would love to know. On June 11, he states on international media in front of me -- I had no idea what he was about to disclose -- that there was blood in the Kalpoes` vehicle, there was DNA, there was blood. Where is that? Even (INAUDIBLE) went so far to cut interior portions from the car -- the back seat, the ceiling. You know, what happened with that?
Somebody -- you know, that`s the reason there`s no evidence. Had they gone to the -- and impounded that car that day -- the FBI told us there was blood all in the car. The prosecutor said the FBI said there was blood in the car. But for some reason or another, when they sent it off, they say now it`s all cleaning fluid. Well, who knows. I know they had nine days to clean the car.
Natalee Holloway: ... BLOOD WAS FOUND IN THE TRUNK OF THE CAR. ... of the suspect's cars to see if it was Holloway's blood. ...ABC NEWS
Authorities were overheard on a police frequency Sunday evening issuing a bulletin to stop a rented white Toyota in connection with the disappearance of the 5-foot-4-inch blonde. Dompig declined to confirm it.
Art Wood, a retired Secret Service agent helping the Holloway family investigate the case, said: "That blood was sent to Holland and it came back as being cleaning fluid and chocolate. That's what the test results show. But an Aruban police officer who worked on the investigation told me there was definitely blood in that car. I think the wrong sample was deliberately sent to Holland.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159711,00.html
Aruban officials did ask the FBI, however, to analyze a DNA sample from the backseat of one of the suspect's cars to see if it was Holloway's blood. The blood was flown to the FBI crime lab in Quantico, Va., but tests came back negative for blood.
An FBI spokeswoman also confirmed that Aruban officials have not requested more evidence processing at the Quantico lab. However, FBI agents are being included in police briefings, and one agent is being allowed to observe interviews with the suspects through a live video feed or through glass.
------------------------------------------------
Search for blood in Deepak Kalpoe's carJune 9, 2005
3 page report
Divisie Centrale Recherche, Aruba
Laboratory Report (blood sample)
June 9, 2005
Blood Samples
COMPARISON FBI – Quantico
The "Diario," a local daily newspaper, is reporting that a human blood sample found in a car at the residence of one of the teens in custody — the 17-year-old son of a high-ranking island judicuary official — is now being sent to the U.S. and will be tested for a possible match to Natalee, whose mother gave a blood sample to investigators.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159252,00.html
The next day, June 10, 2005, DNA samples were taken from Beth Twitty and Dave Holloway in Aruba. June 10, 2005 brought us another important occurrence in this case – a confession was made by one of the suspects arrested the previous day.
Chief of Police, Gerold Dompig
CBS NEWS
June 10, 2005
http://www.cbsnews.com/st(...)nal/main700829.shtml
Holloway's family rushed late Friday to an old stone lighthouse beside Arisha beach after Deputy Police Commissioner Gerold Dompig told The Associated Press that one of three young men in custody admitted that "something bad happened" to Holloway and was leading police to the scene of the alleged crime.
Paul Reynolds - Natalee Holloway's Uncle
'Scarborough Country'
July 12, 2005
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8551822
PAUL REYNOLDS, UNCLE OF NATALEE HOLLOWAY: I know that my sister had a meeting with the FBI June 10, Friday. And from that meeting, she became convinced that Natalee was no longer alive. She called her mother and told her that. And our family was—was—began the grieving process. However, if Aruban spokespeople were to be believed, there was not blood, but rather cleaning fluid found inside Deepak’s car – and the confession was merely a “misinformation campaign.”
FOX NEWS
June 11, 2005
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159252,00.html
David Cruz, a spokesman for the Aruban Minister of Justice (search) told FOX News Natalee Holloway (search), who was on vacation with friends with a graduation trip when she disappeared, was confirmed dead and that authorities knew the location of her body. However, Cruz later retracted the statement, saying he was a victim of a "misinformation campaign."
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Yes,could be..We don't even know for sure that he wasn't in holland with the mom and younger brother. There were rumors that Freddy stayed the night at the sloot house also. I do not know if that is true or not. Somewhere in all of this is Guido. He is also involved. His arrest for suspicion of heavy battery and murder in 2006 is very interesting.MOquote:Op zaterdag 9 februari 2008 02:58 schreef THEFXR het volgende:
i think, val= valentine, the younger brother of joran, but i cannot imagine he is awake in the middle of the night, someone just used his account.
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
No, and even if her head injury was an accident there would be absolutely no need to dispose of the body. The fact that Joran and his accomplices made that choice is an admission of foul play.quote:Op zaterdag 9 februari 2008 02:47 schreef observer777 het volgende:
Your exacly right NS! There was one of the parents and friend of the family who was in Aruba the first few days and a teacher told them that Joran hit Natalee in the head with a baseball bat..No idea if true or not..But Interesting..We also learned those first few days Joran was sleeping at his school and not his home. As I posted there is several references from PJK2 about her hitting her head,It very well could be what Joran means if they find the girl,they will see the shit. We know Deepak says to him if they find the girl you will get 15 years! Why 15 years? In Satish's PV he does not go to school and sleeps until 1pm and the first thing he asked his brother Deepak is hows the girl? I tend to believe Satish went home and Deepak was there and saw everything. PVDS was on the computer researching drugs and alcohol that first night also. Not suprising the computer had a virus and most everything was erased and damaged. We did see that someone logged in as Val at 3am on x-plane,so he could have been the alibi on the computer or perhaps someone else. All of this on a school night on a sunday?
Yes,The brain injury could cause convulsions. Add in the reports of blood in the car and the missing shoes and that very well may be a piece of the puzzle. If she died of a natural death or OD why did they lie,cover up and hide the body forever. Why didn't they call a ambulance?
The exact role of the two brothers remains obscure. There are indications that Deepaks car was used to transport the girl. That could have been from where Natalee suffered a head injury to Jorans house. From there Paulus takes charge. Deepak was send home, with instructions to clean his car, work on an alibi and such. etc. Could be.
It indeed seems Deepak knows what happened to the girl but doesnt consider himself responsible. For that he clearly points to Joran.
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door NorthernStar op 09-02-2008 03:18:03 ]
Of course there is a reason to dispose of the body! AFAI can see Natalee died at the van der Sloot's house, and that would fuck up the position of the new judge in training... Most of the statements Joran and the the Kalpoe brothers have made so far seem to try to get the attention distracted from the house (to the beach), but there was a mention of the four of them (including Natalee alive) driving to the van der Sloot house in one of the earlier statements given to the police. That statement was later changed. I'd have to look up which was the original statement though...quote:Op zaterdag 9 februari 2008 03:12 schreef NorthernStar het volgende:
[..]
No, and even if her head injury was an accident there would be absolutely no need to dispose of the body. The fact that Joran and his accomplices made that choice is an admission of foul play.
The exact role of the two brothers remains obscure. There are indications that Deepaks car was used to transport the girl. That could have been from where Natalee suffered a head injury to Jorans house. From there Paulus takes charge. Deepak was send home, with instructions to clean his car, work on an alibi and such. etc. Could be.
It indeed seems Deepak knows what happened to the girl but doesnt consider himself responsible. For that he clearly points to Joran.
Die statement van 14 juni 2005 heb ik hier. Ik ken de verklaringen van Joran ook inmiddels uit mijn hoofd. Word ik nu ook vereerd?quote:Op zaterdag 9 februari 2008 04:02 schreef kabouterjong het volgende:
[..]
Of course there is a reason to dispose of the body! AFAI can see Natalee died at the van der Sloot's house, and that would fuck up the position of the new judge in training... Most of the statements Joran and the the Kalpoe brothers have made so far seem to try to get the attention distracted from the house (to the beach), but there was a mention of the four of them (including Natalee alive) driving to the van der Sloot house in one of the earlier statements given to the police. That statement was later changed. I'd have to look up which was the original statement though...
AUB, laatste alinea...
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
I'm not sure what you mean?quote:Op zaterdag 9 februari 2008 04:02 schreef kabouterjong het volgende:
[..]
Of course there is a reason to dispose of the body! AFAI can see Natalee died at the van der Sloot's house, and that would fuck up the position of the new judge in training...
Do you mean if there was an accident at VDS's house, that would be enough to decide to cover it up?
Because I was talking about an accident > if it where an accident, then there's no reason to dispose of the body.
I dont see why there ever would be a need to cover up an accident.
An interesting observation.quote:Most of the statements Joran and the the Kalpoe brothers have made so far seem to try to get the attention distracted from the house (to the beach),
I had to search a while for that statement:
http://www.hollowaycase.c(...)oranandsatish618.htm
It's been bothering me since i read it. There were these pictures with PVDS (possibly) being in the casino with Natalee, there's the statement from the gardener seeing the the Honda Civic between 2:30 and 3:00 a clock or so near the lighthouse (another statement i have to look up); a lot later than the three guys say they were at that place. And there's no proof of Joran and Natalee ever being at the beach (a report of some fishers near the Mariott around the time Joran supposedly left Natalee on the beach, but the fishermen don't recall seeing anyone). All of this made me think that the whole thing was a cover up to hide the death of Natalee at the VDS house to avoid problems for PVDS. He'd never become a judge if they found out a young girl died at his place...
Or am i simply imagening things here?
http://www.hollowaycase.c(...)oranandsatish618.htm
It's been bothering me since i read it. There were these pictures with PVDS (possibly) being in the casino with Natalee, there's the statement from the gardener seeing the the Honda Civic between 2:30 and 3:00 a clock or so near the lighthouse (another statement i have to look up); a lot later than the three guys say they were at that place. And there's no proof of Joran and Natalee ever being at the beach (a report of some fishers near the Mariott around the time Joran supposedly left Natalee on the beach, but the fishermen don't recall seeing anyone). All of this made me think that the whole thing was a cover up to hide the death of Natalee at the VDS house to avoid problems for PVDS. He'd never become a judge if they found out a young girl died at his place...
Or am i simply imagening things here?
kabouterjong,
You are 100% on the ball and totally correct!! They were never at the beach and I am quite sure they were at the VDS house! But,PVDS I believe already knew he failed the tests to become a judge. He gave interviews about this and said he wasn't ready. We know he was asking Rudy Croes for a job in the Justice Dept.
You are 100% on the ball and totally correct!! They were never at the beach and I am quite sure they were at the VDS house! But,PVDS I believe already knew he failed the tests to become a judge. He gave interviews about this and said he wasn't ready. We know he was asking Rudy Croes for a job in the Justice Dept.
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
New cement being placed on their swimming pool (where did i read that?), a truck/van of a furniture company parked behind their house (where was that picture?), the 'judge' or whoever restricting the search to Joran's little cottage when they had authority to search all of the premisses... The Honda Civic too clean to be true afterwards. Joran's shoes. It's just to wild to believe.
Thats just part of the story and is all correct. I don't think anyone could ever think up a story like this in a million years. Originally they said they had one shoe and were looking for the other..Then it was a pair of shoes. Does he have size 14 or 10.5?quote:Op zaterdag 9 februari 2008 04:54 schreef kabouterjong het volgende:
New cement being placed on their swimming pool (where did i read that?), a truck/van of a furniture company parked behind their house (where was that picture?), the 'judge' or whoever restricting the search to Joran's little cottage when they had authority to search all of the premisses... The Honda Civic too clean to be true afterwards. Joran's shoes. It's just to wild to believe.
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Maybe if she were drunk and/or took drugs aaand had his sperm on/in her.. I can see how someone might panicquote:Op zaterdag 9 februari 2008 04:18 schreef NorthernStar het volgende:
[..]
I'm not sure what you mean?
Do you mean if there was an accident at VDS's house, that would be enough to decide to cover it up?
Because I was talking about an accident > if it where an accident, then there's no reason to dispose of the body.
I dont see why there ever would be a need to cover up an accident.
I liked it. I was good at it. It made me feel alive.
Yeah i know. It keeps haunting my brain this thing. I also know the Aruban police made a mojor fuck up in this case. Sorry to say that. They should have acted when they had the chance. Now it's years later and most of the evidence is probably gone. I can only hope the truth will still emerge some day. That day, it will most probably be proven that Peter de Vries was to quick with his assumptions. Joran is still lying to save someone's ass. For now i have to save my own though, and get some sleep if i can. I'll be with you (and the rest of the posse) tomorrow...
Natalee's case on Nancy Grace Feb 8th,2008
(Beth and Dave H)
Part1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ctfsE7DrqIM
Part2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oE5RyKbO154
Part3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MmlWJrAE3kI
Part4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=faCbxqKHEIo
[ Bericht 1% gewijzigd door observer777 op 09-02-2008 07:24:50 ]
(Beth and Dave H)
Part1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ctfsE7DrqIM
Part2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oE5RyKbO154
Part3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MmlWJrAE3kI
Part4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=faCbxqKHEIo
[ Bericht 1% gewijzigd door observer777 op 09-02-2008 07:24:50 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Yes well I had a short exchange about this subject earlier. I think disposing of a body is an admission of guild. People just dont do something like that to avoid an inconvenience or like Jorans explanation out of fear of punishment for being out at night.quote:Op zaterdag 9 februari 2008 05:09 schreef Harajuku. het volgende:
[..]
Maybe if she were drunk and/or took drugs aaand had his sperm on/in her.. I can see how someone might panic
Also combined with the numerous times when Joran says he's done for if they find the body.. its self evident imo.
Kijk het is vrijwel onmogelijk om zo'n zaak via de computer op te lossen .
Een rechtbank zal altijd kijken naar de harde bewijzen
Als de georganiseerde gokwereld ook achter de verdwijing zit zal ze echt nooit gevonden worden
alleen forensische bewijzen kunnen hem dan de nek om doen .
inmiddels zet z'n eigen advocaat hem ook neer als een serie LEUGENAAR.
Dat ie dat is komt ze blijkbaar goed uit .
Z'n vader heeft middelen genoeg om hem goed te laten verdedigen .
ik denk zelf dat ze dus niet in zee gedumpt is
later meer hierover .
ik blijf bij het riolerings scenario ,daarin wordt ik gesterkt door het aantal
zenuwachtige reacties die ik krijg op m'n schrijven hier en elders van allerlei mensen dat ik bezig ben het volledige plan van het riolerings stelsel te gaan ontvangen ( beerputten ,septictanks etc )
hier een visie over hoe de gokwereld werkt
zie verhaal van 8 februari 2008 @ 18:31 Was Natalee Holloway Set Up?
Was Natalee Holloway Set Up?
One thing that investigators do when they reach an impasse in a case is they go back to the beginning and retrace the facts as they know them. In the case of missing Natalee Holloway let's do that one more time from the FACTS we know to be true.
Fact: Joran Van der Sloot was a frequent gambler in the casinos in Aruba. He was a playboy and well-connected to several of the people in those casinos. We know this because he was underage and was allowed to drink and gamble.
Fact: Joran Van der Sloot was hanging around the students from Mountain Brook all week long.
Fact: Joran Van der Sloot intially approached Natalee at a black jack table, not the other way around.
Fact: He was polite and when told she had lost a good deal of money gambling during the week, he played for her and won some of it back, earning her approval.
Fact: Natalee left him at the casino and went to Carlos and Charlie's for the final part of the evening showing little interest in him romantically.
Fact: Joran Van der Sloot showed up at Carlos and Charlie's and reconnected with Natalee there. They were seen dancing and leaving the club together.
Fact: Natalee got into a car driven by one of the Kalpoe brothers just a few feet away from her friends who were finding their way back to the hotel.
Fact: Natalee was never seen again.
These are all facts that have been documented by interviews with the friends of both Joran Van der Sloot and Natalee Holloway. Beyond these facts, we know nothing else to be true. It is conjecture. But, these facts, if taken logically, could lead to a very strong conjecture....
Was Natalee Holloway set up from the beginning to be taken off the island against her will?
Here is the conjecture part based on some reasonable assumptions of the facts.
>>>
Joran Van der Sloot likes to gamble. If you know anything about gambling, you know that most gamblers lose. If a gambler borrows a significant amount of money that he or she cannot pay back legally then they have to come up with a way to resolve it illegally. Owing someone money makes us do things we would not normally do. Owing someone who is dangerous a great deal of money would make us seriously consider doing something we would NEVER do. If Joran Van der Sloot owed a debt to someone and could not pay them back with his own money, he could have been told to pay with something or someone else. If this was the case, he would have to find a marker. Someone who fit the requirements of repayment. He would have to figure out a way to get that marker into the hands of the people he owed. Go back over the facts we know to be true. Remember, this is conjecture based on the facts. But, this scenario is one of the few that fits all the details including the amazing way that Natalee Holloway is nowhere to be found...
Joran spends time with the Mountain Brook kids and sizes up Natalee Holloway as the perfect mark. He waits until the last night and finds her playing cards. He makes friends with her by helping her out, thus winning her trust. He then calls the Kalpoe brothers and arranges for them to be his transportation for the rest of the evening. He finds her again at Carlos and Charlie's. He knows she will be there because she told him at the black jack table she would be. He dances with her and puts something in her drink shortly before she leaves the bar. We are not certain WHY she got into the car with him. She is either not in control of her faculties or is inebriated enough to be responding to him at this point. He tells her that he wants to, "show her the island" and she is either out of it or is thinking, "This guy is fun! I am having a good time. No harm in that!" She walks out with him and instead of telling her friends anything, she allows him to guide her into the car which has just pulled up. She jumps into the back seat and off they go. They wheel around the lighthouse and head to a deserted part of the island away from all the lights and people.. At that point, Joran Van der Sloot gets Natalee out of the car (or they carry her unconsciously) and takes her to the shoreline where several individuals are waiting. They force her into a boat and the debt is paid. Joran has done his part. He gets back into the car, tells the Kalpoe brothers to take him home or to the Marriott Hotel beach area. At some point, he either tells his dad or calls him from the beach. He tells his dad about Natalee "overdosing" on drugs or alcohol and that he asked some friends of his to get rid of her. He doesn't tell him about the debt. But, he is really scared that he might get into trouble. His father assures him, "No body, no CASE! and is upset that Natalee has died but it was not the fault of his son." (He may not know anymore than that since it is also documented that Joran lies to his parents constantly) The Kalpoe brothers are not going to talk because they are afraid for their own lives and five weeks later...No Natalee. Why not? She is not on the island. Who knows what the others did to her after she was dropped off. The debt was paid in full.
Conjecture is all we have. It may be all that we ever have. Joran is the only person being interrogated so all he has to do is keep quiet. There is no one else that really knows any of the other details except for him. The Kalpoe brothers may know that Natalee was put into a boat, but they could never prove it and if they talk they could die. The father doesn't want to know anything because he wants to be a judge and protect his son. The mother is clueless.
It is one of the few ways that Natalee Holloway could have disappeared so effectively. Like Caren Janssen, the Attorney General says, "There is NO evidence that a murder or even a crime has been committed." Of course not.
The actions of Joran Van der Sloot stalking Natalee in advance make me lean towards this grisly ending. This appears to have been planned earlier in the week. If he was desperate for money or feared for his own life, he would do just about anything to settle it in his favor. He may not be a murderer. He may be an accomplice to a kidnapping, instead. Either way, he is a sleaze bag who is clamming up because he doesn't want his own future compromised. That is why he will never talk. Never.
A lot of things fit with this scenario:
---no real evidence of cell phone activity, email or text messaging went on which would have indicated a panic once the murder was committed. Instead, Joran kept everything to himself. The advance plan kept any communication after the fact to a minimum
---the father is nervous about what happened to Natalee but really doesn't know much more beyond that.
---it explains why a responsible girl like Natalee did not respond initially to Joran and may have only left with him out of gratitude and a chance for some harmless fun or she was drugged.
---it explains why the Kalpoe brothers didn't break down under interrogation and why now they may leave the country out of fear. Otherwise, why leave?
---it fits Joran hanging around the group and not really engaging any of the girls all week until deciding on Natalee the last night she was there.
---it fits Joran's gambling habit.
---it explains why the body was never found and how the strategy to dispose of her was not done in a few hours but well-planned over several days.
---it explains why a calculating, intelligent girl like Natalee did not make an impulsive and irresponsible decision to get into a car with three virtual strangers while her friends were standing all around her.
---it explains the comment, "Don't worry boys, no body, no CASE!"
---it allows for the possibility that Joran Van der Sloot is not a psychopathic killer, but a coward who uses other people when it suits him. The greater the problem, the more desperate his solution.
The prevailing thinking is that he killed her alone on the beach and called his dad to help him dispose of her body. I understand that view. Either way, since the FBI was not allowed to have any control here, the absence of a lie detector, no crime scene and no physical evidence or apparent motive...Joran Van der Sloot is looking pretty safe from a legal standpoint right now.
By Pat Hurley
July 5, 2005
Een rechtbank zal altijd kijken naar de harde bewijzen
Als de georganiseerde gokwereld ook achter de verdwijing zit zal ze echt nooit gevonden worden
alleen forensische bewijzen kunnen hem dan de nek om doen .
inmiddels zet z'n eigen advocaat hem ook neer als een serie LEUGENAAR.
Dat ie dat is komt ze blijkbaar goed uit .
Z'n vader heeft middelen genoeg om hem goed te laten verdedigen .
ik denk zelf dat ze dus niet in zee gedumpt is
later meer hierover .
ik blijf bij het riolerings scenario ,daarin wordt ik gesterkt door het aantal
zenuwachtige reacties die ik krijg op m'n schrijven hier en elders van allerlei mensen dat ik bezig ben het volledige plan van het riolerings stelsel te gaan ontvangen ( beerputten ,septictanks etc )
hier een visie over hoe de gokwereld werkt
zie verhaal van 8 februari 2008 @ 18:31 Was Natalee Holloway Set Up?
Was Natalee Holloway Set Up?
One thing that investigators do when they reach an impasse in a case is they go back to the beginning and retrace the facts as they know them. In the case of missing Natalee Holloway let's do that one more time from the FACTS we know to be true.
Fact: Joran Van der Sloot was a frequent gambler in the casinos in Aruba. He was a playboy and well-connected to several of the people in those casinos. We know this because he was underage and was allowed to drink and gamble.
Fact: Joran Van der Sloot was hanging around the students from Mountain Brook all week long.
Fact: Joran Van der Sloot intially approached Natalee at a black jack table, not the other way around.
Fact: He was polite and when told she had lost a good deal of money gambling during the week, he played for her and won some of it back, earning her approval.
Fact: Natalee left him at the casino and went to Carlos and Charlie's for the final part of the evening showing little interest in him romantically.
Fact: Joran Van der Sloot showed up at Carlos and Charlie's and reconnected with Natalee there. They were seen dancing and leaving the club together.
Fact: Natalee got into a car driven by one of the Kalpoe brothers just a few feet away from her friends who were finding their way back to the hotel.
Fact: Natalee was never seen again.
These are all facts that have been documented by interviews with the friends of both Joran Van der Sloot and Natalee Holloway. Beyond these facts, we know nothing else to be true. It is conjecture. But, these facts, if taken logically, could lead to a very strong conjecture....
Was Natalee Holloway set up from the beginning to be taken off the island against her will?
Here is the conjecture part based on some reasonable assumptions of the facts.
>>>
Joran Van der Sloot likes to gamble. If you know anything about gambling, you know that most gamblers lose. If a gambler borrows a significant amount of money that he or she cannot pay back legally then they have to come up with a way to resolve it illegally. Owing someone money makes us do things we would not normally do. Owing someone who is dangerous a great deal of money would make us seriously consider doing something we would NEVER do. If Joran Van der Sloot owed a debt to someone and could not pay them back with his own money, he could have been told to pay with something or someone else. If this was the case, he would have to find a marker. Someone who fit the requirements of repayment. He would have to figure out a way to get that marker into the hands of the people he owed. Go back over the facts we know to be true. Remember, this is conjecture based on the facts. But, this scenario is one of the few that fits all the details including the amazing way that Natalee Holloway is nowhere to be found...
Joran spends time with the Mountain Brook kids and sizes up Natalee Holloway as the perfect mark. He waits until the last night and finds her playing cards. He makes friends with her by helping her out, thus winning her trust. He then calls the Kalpoe brothers and arranges for them to be his transportation for the rest of the evening. He finds her again at Carlos and Charlie's. He knows she will be there because she told him at the black jack table she would be. He dances with her and puts something in her drink shortly before she leaves the bar. We are not certain WHY she got into the car with him. She is either not in control of her faculties or is inebriated enough to be responding to him at this point. He tells her that he wants to, "show her the island" and she is either out of it or is thinking, "This guy is fun! I am having a good time. No harm in that!" She walks out with him and instead of telling her friends anything, she allows him to guide her into the car which has just pulled up. She jumps into the back seat and off they go. They wheel around the lighthouse and head to a deserted part of the island away from all the lights and people.. At that point, Joran Van der Sloot gets Natalee out of the car (or they carry her unconsciously) and takes her to the shoreline where several individuals are waiting. They force her into a boat and the debt is paid. Joran has done his part. He gets back into the car, tells the Kalpoe brothers to take him home or to the Marriott Hotel beach area. At some point, he either tells his dad or calls him from the beach. He tells his dad about Natalee "overdosing" on drugs or alcohol and that he asked some friends of his to get rid of her. He doesn't tell him about the debt. But, he is really scared that he might get into trouble. His father assures him, "No body, no CASE! and is upset that Natalee has died but it was not the fault of his son." (He may not know anymore than that since it is also documented that Joran lies to his parents constantly) The Kalpoe brothers are not going to talk because they are afraid for their own lives and five weeks later...No Natalee. Why not? She is not on the island. Who knows what the others did to her after she was dropped off. The debt was paid in full.
Conjecture is all we have. It may be all that we ever have. Joran is the only person being interrogated so all he has to do is keep quiet. There is no one else that really knows any of the other details except for him. The Kalpoe brothers may know that Natalee was put into a boat, but they could never prove it and if they talk they could die. The father doesn't want to know anything because he wants to be a judge and protect his son. The mother is clueless.
It is one of the few ways that Natalee Holloway could have disappeared so effectively. Like Caren Janssen, the Attorney General says, "There is NO evidence that a murder or even a crime has been committed." Of course not.
The actions of Joran Van der Sloot stalking Natalee in advance make me lean towards this grisly ending. This appears to have been planned earlier in the week. If he was desperate for money or feared for his own life, he would do just about anything to settle it in his favor. He may not be a murderer. He may be an accomplice to a kidnapping, instead. Either way, he is a sleaze bag who is clamming up because he doesn't want his own future compromised. That is why he will never talk. Never.
A lot of things fit with this scenario:
---no real evidence of cell phone activity, email or text messaging went on which would have indicated a panic once the murder was committed. Instead, Joran kept everything to himself. The advance plan kept any communication after the fact to a minimum
---the father is nervous about what happened to Natalee but really doesn't know much more beyond that.
---it explains why a responsible girl like Natalee did not respond initially to Joran and may have only left with him out of gratitude and a chance for some harmless fun or she was drugged.
---it explains why the Kalpoe brothers didn't break down under interrogation and why now they may leave the country out of fear. Otherwise, why leave?
---it fits Joran hanging around the group and not really engaging any of the girls all week until deciding on Natalee the last night she was there.
---it fits Joran's gambling habit.
---it explains why the body was never found and how the strategy to dispose of her was not done in a few hours but well-planned over several days.
---it explains why a calculating, intelligent girl like Natalee did not make an impulsive and irresponsible decision to get into a car with three virtual strangers while her friends were standing all around her.
---it explains the comment, "Don't worry boys, no body, no CASE!"
---it allows for the possibility that Joran Van der Sloot is not a psychopathic killer, but a coward who uses other people when it suits him. The greater the problem, the more desperate his solution.
The prevailing thinking is that he killed her alone on the beach and called his dad to help him dispose of her body. I understand that view. Either way, since the FBI was not allowed to have any control here, the absence of a lie detector, no crime scene and no physical evidence or apparent motive...Joran Van der Sloot is looking pretty safe from a legal standpoint right now.
By Pat Hurley
July 5, 2005
Wanneer domme mensen domme dingen beweren, dan moet je ze niet corrigeren, maar glimlachend gelijk geven.
highly recommend this.quote:Op zaterdag 9 februari 2008 06:24 schreef observer777 het volgende:
Natalee's case on Nancy Grace Feb 8th,2008
(Beth and Dave H)
Part1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ctfsE7DrqIM
Part2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oE5RyKbO154
Part3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MmlWJrAE3kI
Part4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=faCbxqKHEIo
part 2 explains about how Peter prepared Beth for whah she was about to see on the tapes.
Dostojewski: "Je kunt je niet van je eigen gezond verstand overtuigen door je buurman op te sluiten."
Friday, February 8, 2008
XVII. Support the Effort
Special Notice:
The dedicated ocean search for Natalee Holloway has been underway since mid-November, 2007. What began in Louisiana during mobilization now culminating in Aruba, the search has utilized some of the best search equipment and personnel in the world. To date, approximately 900 miles of sonar data has been collected covering a geographic area 80% the size of Aruba. The search has required a painstakingly slow approach which in the end leaves no stone unturned.
Although slow, this approach is extremely effective in marine search and recovery. Since the beginning, the search has been privately funded by Louis Schaefer Jr. of Underwater Expeditions who remarkably and gracefully accepted the financial burden when requested by Texas Equusearch and Natalee's parents. John Silvetti of Marine Surveys, Greg Landry of Offshore Innovative Solutions, Erik McGuire of Seatronics, along with Agiosat and Wilkens Weather Service came beside Louis to conduct this humanitarian effort. To put this search effort in financial perspective, an equivalent search conducted for industry would involve costs well exceeding several million dollars. This project has been conducted for about 35 cents on the dollar, with costs still exceeding a million dollars.
Although we have searched and ruled out an extensive portion of the original planned search area, a substantial portion of the high-probability area yet remains to be explored. Now, following a publicly confirmed admission that Natalee Holloway was disposed at sea, we are confident that completing the focused search area will bring closure. We therefore formally invite and request anyone who this humanitarian effort has touched to get involved and to help support the remaining search efforts. Donations are being handled by Texas Equusearch, a 501 (c) (3) nonprofit organization. Please come beside those who have already given so much to help ensure a proper funeral in Alabama for Natalee Holloway. Please make all donations marked as: "Holloway search".
To learn more about Texas Equusearch and to help support the search for Natalee Holloway, check out: http://www.texasequusearch.org/donate.html
Texas EquuSearch Office:
4013 FM 517, Suite B
Dickinson, Texas 77539
P. O. Box 395, Dickinson, Texas 77539
Office: (281) 309-9500
Fax: (281) 534-6719
Toll Free: (877) 270-9500
Email: donate@texasequusearch.org
http://www.nholloway.blogspot.com/
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Die zenuwachtige reacties (ook op de komst van Observer 777) op dit forum en de negatieve kletspraatjes over Nathalee en haar familie zijn minstens opmerkelijk te noemen. Je zou het als wanhopige pogingen de berichtgeving een andere kant op te sturen, kunnen opvatten.quote:Op zaterdag 9 februari 2008 08:45 schreef johan555 het volgende:
ik blijf bij het riolerings scenario ,daarin wordt ik gesterkt door het aantal
zenuwachtige reacties die ik krijg op m'n schrijven hier en elders van allerlei mensen dat ik bezig ben het volledige plan van het riolerings stelsel te gaan ontvangen ( beerputten ,septictanks etc )
Het vele zoekwerk van Observer 777 en het Canadese Forum "Scared Monkeys" is overigens een compliment waard.
Greta van Susteren update plus some interesting reactions:
http://gretawire.foxnews.com/2008/02/08/update-from-aruba/4397/
http://gretawire.foxnews.com/2008/02/08/update-from-aruba/4397/
Wer lesen kann, ist klar im Vorteil.
Yesterday the newsitem came up that the Kalpoe brother sued Dr Phil. I red a lot of them, and allthough it could be just some detail being left out, I found it weird that the lawyer stated everywhere "They only dropped off Joran somewhere". Nowhere did it say the beach..quote:Op zaterdag 9 februari 2008 04:40 schreef kabouterjong het volgende:
I had to search a while for that statement:
http://www.hollowaycase.c(...)oranandsatish618.htm
It's been bothering me since i read it. There were these pictures with PVDS (possibly) being in the casino with Natalee, there's the statement from the gardener seeing the the Honda Civic between 2:30 and 3:00 a clock or so near the lighthouse (another statement i have to look up); a lot later than the three guys say they were at that place. And there's no proof of Joran and Natalee ever being at the beach (a report of some fishers near the Mariott around the time Joran supposedly left Natalee on the beach, but the fishermen don't recall seeing anyone). All of this made me think that the whole thing was a cover up to hide the death of Natalee at the VDS house to avoid problems for PVDS. He'd never become a judge if they found out a young girl died at his place...
Or am i simply imagening things here?
Where facts are few, experts are many.
This is what I believe is the true story how Natalee left Carlos and Charlies.
I had spoken with Dan Riehl in 2005 and I know for sure he had a valid eye witnesses that saw this and it is confirmed by Jossy Mansur just a few weeks ago. Natalee's parents also believe this story,although it is foggy with the witnesses and details. Dan Riehl was very angry at me for questioning his source in 2005 and wanted to show me his phone bills from all his research. She was drugged and did not leave in a drunken stupor with 3 strangers. Until I see otherwise,I am quite sure she initially left with the melee and confusion of everyone leaving about the same time near 1AM. For whatever reasons she went back into C and C a few minutes later and Deepak and probably Joran went back in and retrieved her 10 minutes later. She probably sensed it was a bad idea to leave with those three but could not think straight and went back to where it was safe to look for her friends. JK2 knew was incapacitated and went back in to get her before she was knocked out cold on the floor.She was in a drugged out stupor and was escorted out of the bar after most everyone had already left. Deepak probably told her he was taking her back to her hotel where Joran said he was staying,not that it really mattered because she was probably already in a zombie state of mind and could barely walk. MO
More info is available through the research@ http://members.aol.com/worldJOURNIER/NATALEE/NATALEEtimeline.html
Jossy Mansur Editor of Diario Newspaper
“A bartender at the club where she was that fatal night has confirmed that two of the three suspects had to practically drag her to the car because she was uncertain on her feet”
http://scaredmonkeys.com/page/7/
--------------------------------------------------------
Natalee Holloway Left Carlos And Charlies With Deepak
In what was a controversial story at the time, I reported that Natalee Holloway left Carlos and Charlies with Deepak Kalpoe and not Joran Va der Sloot. In addition to sources used for that first report, I have now confirmed through another independent witness that the report was in fact accurate.
In attempts to re-construct the time-line for the night of Natalee Holloway's disappearance, it now seems that she did leave first with Joran Van der Sloot - but the two did not walk off together immediately.
At some point after most of Natalee's friends drifted away, Joran v d Sloot and Satish Kalpoe are thought to have left the front of the club, perhaps to return to Deepak's car.
Natalee then went back inside the club very briefly before emerging with the elder Kalpoe brother, who, as previously reported, was said to have been holding her by the arm. That has been described as non-romantic in nature and more consistent with an effort to assist one as they walk. At some point during that time period an unidentified Mountain Brook student is reported to have asked her if she was "Okay." It's believed she responded that she was.
The two are said to have been observed walking up the street from C and C some 80 to 100 yards, passing by the other nightclubs on the street until at or through a nearby intersection. At some point time after they disappeared from view, the three boys and Natalee Holloway are reported to have come back through the area, all seated in the car of Deepak Kalpoe. The car containing Natalee Holloway is said to have been observed by another Mountain Brook student who was located upon the porch of another nightclub.
http://tinyurl.com/39k757
-------------------------------------------------------
Previous Info
http://tinyurl.com/3a8877
[ Bericht 2% gewijzigd door observer777 op 09-02-2008 20:39:09 ]
I had spoken with Dan Riehl in 2005 and I know for sure he had a valid eye witnesses that saw this and it is confirmed by Jossy Mansur just a few weeks ago. Natalee's parents also believe this story,although it is foggy with the witnesses and details. Dan Riehl was very angry at me for questioning his source in 2005 and wanted to show me his phone bills from all his research. She was drugged and did not leave in a drunken stupor with 3 strangers. Until I see otherwise,I am quite sure she initially left with the melee and confusion of everyone leaving about the same time near 1AM. For whatever reasons she went back into C and C a few minutes later and Deepak and probably Joran went back in and retrieved her 10 minutes later. She probably sensed it was a bad idea to leave with those three but could not think straight and went back to where it was safe to look for her friends. JK2 knew was incapacitated and went back in to get her before she was knocked out cold on the floor.She was in a drugged out stupor and was escorted out of the bar after most everyone had already left. Deepak probably told her he was taking her back to her hotel where Joran said he was staying,not that it really mattered because she was probably already in a zombie state of mind and could barely walk. MO
More info is available through the research@ http://members.aol.com/worldJOURNIER/NATALEE/NATALEEtimeline.html
Jossy Mansur Editor of Diario Newspaper
“A bartender at the club where she was that fatal night has confirmed that two of the three suspects had to practically drag her to the car because she was uncertain on her feet”
http://scaredmonkeys.com/page/7/
--------------------------------------------------------
Natalee Holloway Left Carlos And Charlies With Deepak
In what was a controversial story at the time, I reported that Natalee Holloway left Carlos and Charlies with Deepak Kalpoe and not Joran Va der Sloot. In addition to sources used for that first report, I have now confirmed through another independent witness that the report was in fact accurate.
In attempts to re-construct the time-line for the night of Natalee Holloway's disappearance, it now seems that she did leave first with Joran Van der Sloot - but the two did not walk off together immediately.
At some point after most of Natalee's friends drifted away, Joran v d Sloot and Satish Kalpoe are thought to have left the front of the club, perhaps to return to Deepak's car.
Natalee then went back inside the club very briefly before emerging with the elder Kalpoe brother, who, as previously reported, was said to have been holding her by the arm. That has been described as non-romantic in nature and more consistent with an effort to assist one as they walk. At some point during that time period an unidentified Mountain Brook student is reported to have asked her if she was "Okay." It's believed she responded that she was.
The two are said to have been observed walking up the street from C and C some 80 to 100 yards, passing by the other nightclubs on the street until at or through a nearby intersection. At some point time after they disappeared from view, the three boys and Natalee Holloway are reported to have come back through the area, all seated in the car of Deepak Kalpoe. The car containing Natalee Holloway is said to have been observed by another Mountain Brook student who was located upon the porch of another nightclub.
http://tinyurl.com/39k757
-------------------------------------------------------
Previous Info
http://tinyurl.com/3a8877
[ Bericht 2% gewijzigd door observer777 op 09-02-2008 20:39:09 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
On Google Earth i saw that there are buildings being constructed very near the vd Sloot place. The (satellite) picture appears to be from 2008. Does anyone happen to know what the situation was like around June 2005??? It would be the ideal place to hide a body...
And I think someone might do something like that when in panicquote:Op zaterdag 9 februari 2008 07:19 schreef NorthernStar het volgende:
[..]
Yes well I had a short exchange about this subject earlier. I think disposing of a body is an admission of guild. People just dont do something like that to avoid an inconvenience or like Jorans explanation out of fear of punishment for being out at night.
Also combined with the numerous times when Joran says he's done for if they find the body.. its self evident imo.
However, I dont know what Joran did and Im not saying that he did this.
I liked it. I was good at it. It made me feel alive.
Hi guys,
Since the "confession" I've been following several forums and other media, but never felt the need to actively participate in the discussions. But now I do have some questions/points.
Regarding Natalees past
What is true about the claims that she has been in rehab (just prior to Aruba) and that she went missing before (2 weeks in Puerto Rico (?)). I've never seen any proof for these claims, accept that I've read a quote from, I believe, a MB student that claims she went missing before. It said somehing like: This (disappearance in Aruba) is nothing like when she went missing in Puerto Rico for two weeks.
I don't remember where I read this and can't find it anymore (or too lazy) I also have heard Jamaica before, and not entirely sure the quote said Puerto Rico.
Correction: I found this story here
WTF is up with Jossy Mansur?
Mansur has appeared in several TV shows and is mentioned alot on forums like SM
This guy is well known to be a large criminal, acquisations include money-laundring, (cigarette)smuggling, ties with mafia and drugcartels, bribing, etc. Mansur is head of a large rich family. Two guys of his family were extradicted to the US a couple of years ago (DEA), but not sure if they were convicted.
Someone else involved is Michael Posner, also a known mafia affiliate and owner of the HI casino.
Although I really admire the dedication of the Scared Monkeys, I do think they aren't neutral (to say it mildly). They are very biased and pro-Holloway. They are convinced Holloway/US are GOOD and Aruba/VDS are EVIL. They are convinced that Aruba is corrupt and VDS guilty. They don't hesitate to call Jorans mother a Whore and things like that (where's the proof of that, does she work in San Nicolas??). They often pull qutoes out of context. For instance yesterday they were talking about his confession in the car. One quote that kept popping up is "Even if they find her with my semen in her they can't do anything" (Al vinden ze dat meisje met m'n sperma er in, dan kunnen ze niks meer doen). Joran said this to explain to Patrick that if they had tried to make a murdercase and Joran is acquitted, that he can't be trialed for the same murder again. (Ne bis in idem / Double Jeopardy). He did say some bad thing about Natalee (calling her a slet/hoer =whore) but that's more or less a normal way to speak of a girl in the 'streetlanguage' Joran talks. Translation from dutch to english or papiamentoe (to dutch) to english is also dangerous. In the confession he said something like: She started shaking, and I shook her and then I take her. English speaking persons could see this as that he took her (had sex with her) but he just picked her up o.s.
So, I do admire SM's work and dedication for facts and objective discussions I prefer sites as refugeesunleashed.net or Scrux.com. Another good source with only hard evidence is this e-ssay
The many anti-Holloway sites started, IMO, as a response to sites like SM where they keep calling for a boycott of Aruba. Beth Holloway spoke very bad of Aruba in the first few months and that drew a lot of angry blood on Aruba. This was in june 05 o.s. A lot of Arubans helped in the search (they could get a day off for it) hotels and restaurants did not charge anything to the family/searchparty. Buit at the same time Beth spoke very badly over Aruba in the states. This started the uproar against the family. The linked article from Amigoe talks about the first few days of Beth on the island. Dutch article The Story told in this
Vanity Fair article is more or less the same.
As mentioned in the last article Julia Renfro was a friend of Beth in the beginning and she helped with the search in the first few days. After she made a comment about Joran on a TVshow she was considered the enemy by the Twitty's. She has been called a prostitute as well on the SMforum, just as Anita Holloway (What did she do wrong other than defend her flesh and blood). I believe Renfro is part of the pro-aruba lobby currently in the USA.
Some things I found strange are:
- the first poster the Twitty's put up in Aruba
.
If you read this poster you would think the family thought Natalee ran away from home.
-Tthe discrepancies between landingtimes of the unauthorized medplane the family arrived with, are very suspicious. (don't know if there is official proof of this)
-The fact that all students were sent to the US on monday, instead of being questioned.
-The reluctance of the FBI to give permission for an investigation in the US by Aruban police. (like question the students and family)
Those two psychics claiming a totally different story (childabuse/impregnation by Twitty) are working for the vdSloot family according to SM (so they must be evil)
I do think Joran knows more about it
[ Bericht 2% gewijzigd door wwwever op 10-02-2008 04:44:21 ]
Since the "confession" I've been following several forums and other media, but never felt the need to actively participate in the discussions. But now I do have some questions/points.
Regarding Natalees past
What is true about the claims that she has been in rehab (just prior to Aruba) and that she went missing before (2 weeks in Puerto Rico (?)). I've never seen any proof for these claims, accept that I've read a quote from, I believe, a MB student that claims she went missing before. It said somehing like: This (disappearance in Aruba) is nothing like when she went missing in Puerto Rico for two weeks.
I don't remember where I read this and can't find it anymore (or too lazy) I also have heard Jamaica before, and not entirely sure the quote said Puerto Rico.
Correction: I found this story here
No reliable source to say the least (all heresayquote:I have a print out of a comment posted on Joran's website that says:
(exact wording)”natalee changed her hair color to black.cut her hair short. Still hiding @ rock formation ner big industrial company. I guess in puerto rico when she tried to do this ‘missing thing’ they found her verrrrrrrry fast. but this times I think she succeded. aruba is such smaller than puerto rico. they haven’t found her yet. maybe she’s happy this way. her friends knew about this but I had the guts to tell the truth. weird..”
Published by lindsey. - June 09 11:25 PM.
WTF is up with Jossy Mansur?
Mansur has appeared in several TV shows and is mentioned alot on forums like SM
This guy is well known to be a large criminal, acquisations include money-laundring, (cigarette)smuggling, ties with mafia and drugcartels, bribing, etc. Mansur is head of a large rich family. Two guys of his family were extradicted to the US a couple of years ago (DEA), but not sure if they were convicted.
I don't think any of the Mansurs has ever been convicted of a crime, but that to me just proofs that 'money makes the world go round'. If you have enough money you can buy your innocence. This is true in Aruba, but also everywhere else in the world, especially the US. (OJ/MJ)quote:The Interbank is owned by the Mansur Family. If anybody owns 60 per cent of the island, it is this powerful family. The Mansurs made their fortune as cigarette manufacturers and in the import-export business. With a licence of Philip Morris, they are the major suppliers of Marlboros in the Caribbean basin. The Mansurs sponsor the best baseball team – Aruba's national sport – the Marlboro Red Tigers as well as the AVP party of Prime Minister Henny Eman. They own the biggest hotel and time-sharing complex, La Cabana, with its inevitable casino. And they have a couple of import-export businesses in the Free Trade Zone.
Jossy Mansur is the owner and chief editor of the biggest newspaper on the island, "Diario". "When I read an article in Diario, I know what will be the next action of the government,"says Hendrik Croes, adding that the Mansurs create a climate of fear and intimidation on Aruba. Their newspapers force others off the market. Furthermore, "their annual income is bigger than the yearly budget of the government. And you may guess how they make that kind of money”."Jossy Mansur is not impressed claiming that accusing people of drug trafficking and money laundering "has become a political tool to discredit them”."
source
Someone else involved is Michael Posner, also a known mafia affiliate and owner of the HI casino.
Although I really admire the dedication of the Scared Monkeys, I do think they aren't neutral (to say it mildly). They are very biased and pro-Holloway. They are convinced Holloway/US are GOOD and Aruba/VDS are EVIL. They are convinced that Aruba is corrupt and VDS guilty. They don't hesitate to call Jorans mother a Whore and things like that (where's the proof of that, does she work in San Nicolas??). They often pull qutoes out of context. For instance yesterday they were talking about his confession in the car. One quote that kept popping up is "Even if they find her with my semen in her they can't do anything" (Al vinden ze dat meisje met m'n sperma er in, dan kunnen ze niks meer doen). Joran said this to explain to Patrick that if they had tried to make a murdercase and Joran is acquitted, that he can't be trialed for the same murder again. (Ne bis in idem / Double Jeopardy). He did say some bad thing about Natalee (calling her a slet/hoer =whore) but that's more or less a normal way to speak of a girl in the 'streetlanguage' Joran talks. Translation from dutch to english or papiamentoe (to dutch) to english is also dangerous. In the confession he said something like: She started shaking, and I shook her and then I take her. English speaking persons could see this as that he took her (had sex with her) but he just picked her up o.s.
So, I do admire SM's work and dedication for facts and objective discussions I prefer sites as refugeesunleashed.net or Scrux.com. Another good source with only hard evidence is this e-ssay
The many anti-Holloway sites started, IMO, as a response to sites like SM where they keep calling for a boycott of Aruba. Beth Holloway spoke very bad of Aruba in the first few months and that drew a lot of angry blood on Aruba. This was in june 05 o.s. A lot of Arubans helped in the search (they could get a day off for it) hotels and restaurants did not charge anything to the family/searchparty. Buit at the same time Beth spoke very badly over Aruba in the states. This started the uproar against the family. The linked article from Amigoe talks about the first few days of Beth on the island. Dutch article The Story told in this
Vanity Fair article is more or less the same.
As mentioned in the last article Julia Renfro was a friend of Beth in the beginning and she helped with the search in the first few days. After she made a comment about Joran on a TVshow she was considered the enemy by the Twitty's. She has been called a prostitute as well on the SMforum, just as Anita Holloway (What did she do wrong other than defend her flesh and blood). I believe Renfro is part of the pro-aruba lobby currently in the USA.
Some things I found strange are:
- the first poster the Twitty's put up in Aruba
.
.If you read this poster you would think the family thought Natalee ran away from home.
-Tthe discrepancies between landingtimes of the unauthorized medplane the family arrived with, are very suspicious. (don't know if there is official proof of this)
-The fact that all students were sent to the US on monday, instead of being questioned.
-The reluctance of the FBI to give permission for an investigation in the US by Aruban police. (like question the students and family)
Those two psychics claiming a totally different story (childabuse/impregnation by Twitty) are working for the vdSloot family according to SM (so they must be evil)
I do think Joran knows more about it
[ Bericht 2% gewijzigd door wwwever op 10-02-2008 04:44:21 ]
Intentionally left blank.
One other thing I just thought of.
The police stated that no other calls were made from the beach area, accept those to Deepak. What if Joran had 2 cellphones? Not very unusual especially not IF he is the date-raping drug dealer some people claim...
Did the police check all calls made in that area or only his phone and the payphones? At that time probably only a few calls were made in that region (or entire island by the way)
The police stated that no other calls were made from the beach area, accept those to Deepak. What if Joran had 2 cellphones? Not very unusual especially not IF he is the date-raping drug dealer some people claim...
Did the police check all calls made in that area or only his phone and the payphones? At that time probably only a few calls were made in that region (or entire island by the way)
Intentionally left blank.
wwwever,
Unfortunately you are terribly misinformed and you need to stop reading at RU if you want to learn the truth and not lies and wrong information.
Unfortunately you are terribly misinformed and you need to stop reading at RU if you want to learn the truth and not lies and wrong information.
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Observer,
Ok I might be misinformed, but do you mind adressing some of the points I made.
the rehab/missing in PR is not true, I believe that
Mansur is BAD I do know that (everybody that rich must be bad LOL)
Renfro and AVDS are being called a prostitute by posters on SM. Where's the proof in that? Do they work in SN?
The (med)plane did arrive, Beth claimed she arrived at 2300 others that she arrived at like 1945.
That first poster could be a fake, but surely someone must have an original.
What is your explanation why the other students were all send home (why not let a couple of them stay to help the investigation or at least ask around themselves.
Did the FBI give permission for an investigation by the ALE in the US? Why would they not give this?
What's your opinion on the Vanity Fair article?
Don't get me wrong, I know Aruba (and the Dutch Antiles for that matter) are corrupt as hell. And I know Joran is guilty of something.
My apologies for claiming RU is alot more objective, I read that on some other site (probably the forensic essay) I've just read some more posts on RU and alot of them are just SM bashing.
What happened to make you guys so hateful of forums like RU. I did see the monKKKey cage post. There must be a reason a lot of sites talk bad about SM.
Ok I might be misinformed, but do you mind adressing some of the points I made.
the rehab/missing in PR is not true, I believe that
Mansur is BAD I do know that (everybody that rich must be bad LOL)
Renfro and AVDS are being called a prostitute by posters on SM. Where's the proof in that? Do they work in SN?
The (med)plane did arrive, Beth claimed she arrived at 2300 others that she arrived at like 1945.
That first poster could be a fake, but surely someone must have an original.
What is your explanation why the other students were all send home (why not let a couple of them stay to help the investigation or at least ask around themselves.
Did the FBI give permission for an investigation by the ALE in the US? Why would they not give this?
What's your opinion on the Vanity Fair article?
Don't get me wrong, I know Aruba (and the Dutch Antiles for that matter) are corrupt as hell. And I know Joran is guilty of something.
My apologies for claiming RU is alot more objective, I read that on some other site (probably the forensic essay) I've just read some more posts on RU and alot of them are just SM bashing.
What happened to make you guys so hateful of forums like RU. I did see the monKKKey cage post. There must be a reason a lot of sites talk bad about SM.
Intentionally left blank.
This is just Trias Politica, one of the basic principles of democracy.quote:
Or am I totally wrong, it's kind of late here....
Intentionally left blank.
wwwever,
I figured sooner or later people from that website would come here and post that crap. Please read back in my earlier posts as I answered some of those very same questions from someone else(Natalee Rebound section 1-4). You are really really far off from reality of what happened to Natalee and are posting flat out lies and mis-information. RU is one of the most hateful sites on the internet and post's lies,wrong info and continiously attacks and slanders a victim and her her family. Not all the posters but a majority of them. Alot of sites talk bad about SM? Care to name them besides the Hate site RU? Julia Renfro has done some of the most vile acts I have ever seen in my life,what she has done to Natalee and her Family is something I will never forget. She is a proven liar and lost all credibility long ago.
How would you like it if your daughter was murdered and you had someone like Julia Renfro telling people she ran away with a Blue eyed Dutch Boy,Ran away to another island,was impregnated by her stepfather,Accused you of lying and hiding Natalee..etc etc etc.. Way too many things to list as she is being payed for her dastardly acts and is friends of the Van Der Sloots.
------------------------------------------
Snip of two articles that tell the story way too nice of two things things Julia has done to Natalee's family
The reason Renfro suddenly found the Twittys disinterested in her help was the fact that she also orchestrated, or at least contributed to, one of the cruelest hoaxes of the investigation. Twelve days after Natalee’s disappearance, Renfro suddenly appeared in downtown Oranjestad where Jug Twitty had made an unplanned stop to buy some clothes (the circumstances surrounding how she found him remain mysterious). Renfro was hysterical over news that Natalee had been found dead and her body had been moved to the island’s courthouse. When asked where she had learned these details, she claimed it had come from one of her regular sources, a deputy information officer in the justice department.
What followed was a frantic, ten-block car race to the courthouse made more uncomfortable by the fact that Renfro had pushed herself into the family’s already full minivan (she took a spot on the console), conspicuously inserting herself, perhaps now as a newspaper reporter, into the unfolding story. Upon arriving at the courthouse, a throng of television cameras met the family. What happened next was a long, uncomfortable walk to the courthouse where Jug and his friends found a locked door and an apparently empty building. It was later learned that no justice department official had ever leaked the information. The incident was yet another nightmarish spectacle that the family endured during weeks of searching for their daughter. Renfro’s contribution to the occasion was the beginning of the end of her association with the family (another fact not found in the Vanity Fair story). It should be considered that while the search for Natalee Holloway continues, it took weeks for the family to figure out which personalities on the island were credible or not, which has led to some hurt feelings along the way.
http://tinyurl.com/349mmk
-------------------------------------------------------------
Snip from Beths Book
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/Books/story?id=3675252&page=1
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door observer777 op 10-02-2008 08:48:17 ]
I figured sooner or later people from that website would come here and post that crap. Please read back in my earlier posts as I answered some of those very same questions from someone else(Natalee Rebound section 1-4). You are really really far off from reality of what happened to Natalee and are posting flat out lies and mis-information. RU is one of the most hateful sites on the internet and post's lies,wrong info and continiously attacks and slanders a victim and her her family. Not all the posters but a majority of them. Alot of sites talk bad about SM? Care to name them besides the Hate site RU? Julia Renfro has done some of the most vile acts I have ever seen in my life,what she has done to Natalee and her Family is something I will never forget. She is a proven liar and lost all credibility long ago.
How would you like it if your daughter was murdered and you had someone like Julia Renfro telling people she ran away with a Blue eyed Dutch Boy,Ran away to another island,was impregnated by her stepfather,Accused you of lying and hiding Natalee..etc etc etc.. Way too many things to list as she is being payed for her dastardly acts and is friends of the Van Der Sloots.
------------------------------------------
Snip of two articles that tell the story way too nice of two things things Julia has done to Natalee's family
The reason Renfro suddenly found the Twittys disinterested in her help was the fact that she also orchestrated, or at least contributed to, one of the cruelest hoaxes of the investigation. Twelve days after Natalee’s disappearance, Renfro suddenly appeared in downtown Oranjestad where Jug Twitty had made an unplanned stop to buy some clothes (the circumstances surrounding how she found him remain mysterious). Renfro was hysterical over news that Natalee had been found dead and her body had been moved to the island’s courthouse. When asked where she had learned these details, she claimed it had come from one of her regular sources, a deputy information officer in the justice department.
What followed was a frantic, ten-block car race to the courthouse made more uncomfortable by the fact that Renfro had pushed herself into the family’s already full minivan (she took a spot on the console), conspicuously inserting herself, perhaps now as a newspaper reporter, into the unfolding story. Upon arriving at the courthouse, a throng of television cameras met the family. What happened next was a long, uncomfortable walk to the courthouse where Jug and his friends found a locked door and an apparently empty building. It was later learned that no justice department official had ever leaked the information. The incident was yet another nightmarish spectacle that the family endured during weeks of searching for their daughter. Renfro’s contribution to the occasion was the beginning of the end of her association with the family (another fact not found in the Vanity Fair story). It should be considered that while the search for Natalee Holloway continues, it took weeks for the family to figure out which personalities on the island were credible or not, which has led to some hurt feelings along the way.
http://tinyurl.com/349mmk
-------------------------------------------------------------
Snip from Beths Book
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/Books/story?id=3675252&page=1
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door observer777 op 10-02-2008 08:48:17 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
He was using two phones.His and Anita's..Speaking of phones there is a new development in the case today.quote:Op zondag 10 februari 2008 04:57 schreef wwwever het volgende:
One other thing I just thought of.
The police stated that no other calls were made from the beach area, accept those to Deepak. What if Joran had 2 cellphones? Not very unusual especially not IF he is the date-raping drug dealer some people claim...
Did the police check all calls made in that area or only his phone and the payphones? At that time probably only a few calls were made in that region (or entire island by the way)
-------------------------------
Natalee Holloway: Comments Form Jossy Mansur Regarding New Developments in Aruba and Joran Van [b]der Sloot
2-9-08[/b]
The following are comments that I received today from Jossy Mansur, Managing Editor of Diario. It would seem that Aruba has grown sick and tired of Joran Van der Sloot and his actions. Although they are late to the game, they now do not believe Joran Van der Sloot’s story or his excuses. Joran is no longer welcome in Aruba. It’s about time that Aruba stopped running cover for Joran. Then there is the following confirmation regarding a man who claims he found a telephone behind the lighthouse in 2005. The walls are caving in around Joran Van der Sloot and his family.
Everything is happening in Holland. The Dutch government is now interested in the case and plans to do something about it, we were informed from Holland. Joran was interrogated for more than two hours by the dutch national police and three policemen from Aruba. We still have to hear what came out of that.
The Minister of Justice declared Joran ‘persona non grata’ (unwelcome) in Aruba. He also said he is kicking Paulus off every government committee in which he has a seat (hospital, prison, etc.). Late, but proof of the change of attitude noticeable everywhere on the island. Most people here are convinced Joran is responsible for Natalee’s death.
The people here are really fed-up with that character. The worst that could have happened to him is the video recording made by De Vries. No one believes his story about being under the influence of marijuana because he never stuttered, never hesitated, his eyes didn’t become vague or unfocused, he was in complete command of himself all the time. He could have used it as an excuse had it not been shown in its entirety (in Dutch) and was seen and heard in Aruba by practically everyone.
Voices are now being raised to kick him and his family off the island. Others want the U.S. to extradite him. Things are moving fast on that level, but on the official level we find the prosecution still pussy-footing with it.
A man claims he found a telephone behind the lighthouse in 2005; it was broken; he fixed it and dialed a person with the phone, so his story goes. The person apparently answered and said that that number belonged to Paulus Van der Sloot. The man is now giving testimony to the police. Late, but still important enough to be taken into consideration.
(Scaredmonkeys.com)
http://tinyurl.com/3ygm6r
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door observer777 op 10-02-2008 08:07:56 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Cracking the Holloway Case?
Meet the crime writer who believes he's solved the mystery
Snip
What happened after you aired your first show on the case?
We were getting information from everywhere and hearing very strange things. For example, when the police came to search Joran's house, they tried knocking on the door and are greeted by a justice official. We uncovered a lot of new stuff, but we didn't solve the case. But we knew there was something rotten.
http://www.newsweek.com/id/109260
Meet the crime writer who believes he's solved the mystery
Snip
What happened after you aired your first show on the case?
We were getting information from everywhere and hearing very strange things. For example, when the police came to search Joran's house, they tried knocking on the door and are greeted by a justice official. We uncovered a lot of new stuff, but we didn't solve the case. But we knew there was something rotten.
http://www.newsweek.com/id/109260
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
One of the bones found in 2005 that we never heard anything about. We were told this was a monkey bone or a prop. This was found in the closest part of the Venezuelan coast to Aruba.
[ Bericht 52% gewijzigd door observer777 op 10-02-2008 08:07:00 ]
[ Bericht 52% gewijzigd door observer777 op 10-02-2008 08:07:00 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
@ WWWever,
It is rather obvious that people come up with stories about Nathalee to get the attention away from what really happened.
An American girl went with some school friends to Aruba. On her last night she disappeared and her girlfriends seen her leaving with Joran and his friends.
It only makes sence for people who know more about Nathalee's disappearance to blame the girl herself and her family. Blaming the other is very popular by people who want to get the attention away from were they do not want it. People who want not to be found out the truth, make up stories about total innocent people.
The stories about Nathalee and her family are totally fake and not interesting at all.
For example: Nathalee's mother was the next day in Aruba and that's supposed to be found strange.
My parents would have done exactly the same: jump in the plane and go over there immediately.
It is rather obvious that people come up with stories about Nathalee to get the attention away from what really happened.
An American girl went with some school friends to Aruba. On her last night she disappeared and her girlfriends seen her leaving with Joran and his friends.
It only makes sence for people who know more about Nathalee's disappearance to blame the girl herself and her family. Blaming the other is very popular by people who want to get the attention away from were they do not want it. People who want not to be found out the truth, make up stories about total innocent people.
The stories about Nathalee and her family are totally fake and not interesting at all.
For example: Nathalee's mother was the next day in Aruba and that's supposed to be found strange.
My parents would have done exactly the same: jump in the plane and go over there immediately.
Ok thx for the reply
@ Observer
At least one site I found a rather negative comment on was NH Forensic
You say Joran used his mothers phone on the beach aswell? Surely there must be records of that, I've never heard this. The idea that Joran had 2 phones never came up?
I'll read up on Renfro and will read your previous posts.
But what about Mansur, surely his criminal past must've been mentioned before in the media.
I believe your monkey bone should be a donkey bone. And no way that something can drift from Aruba to Punto Fijo.
I kinda regret not really following the case even though I'm lviing 1 island to the east...
Gonna get some sleep GN
@ Observer
At least one site I found a rather negative comment on was NH Forensic
What's SM's opinion on that site or rather on the essay?quote:If you are one of the apparently 70% of Americans who are certain Joran killed Natalee you will find ample space to abuse me at Scared Monkeys.
You say Joran used his mothers phone on the beach aswell? Surely there must be records of that, I've never heard this. The idea that Joran had 2 phones never came up?
I'll read up on Renfro and will read your previous posts.
But what about Mansur, surely his criminal past must've been mentioned before in the media.
I believe your monkey bone should be a donkey bone. And no way that something can drift from Aruba to Punto Fijo.
I kinda regret not really following the case even though I'm lviing 1 island to the east...
Gonna get some sleep GN
Intentionally left blank.
Never heard of that site before and I have been following this since the very beginning. You found one negative comment from a troll? Are you kidding me? I never said Joran had two phones at the beach..There is no evidence that says they were ever at the beach! He had access to his mom's phone as well,as we know from the PV'S when his Father called him the next day when the Family arrived,they went on that wild goose chase and Joran was using Anita's phone when he was out gambling. Of course the boys were dirty and sweaty and not the kind of clothes you wear in a casino,so it's unlikely thats what they were doing. That makes two nights in a row on school nights that he said he snuck out and was up all night without his fathers permission..Yeh right!!!quote:Op zondag 10 februari 2008 08:55 schreef wwwever het volgende:
Ok thx for the reply
@ Observer
At least one site I found a rather negative comment on was NH Forensic
[..]
What's SM's opinion on that site or rather on the essay?
You say Joran used his mothers phone on the beach aswell? Surely there must be records of that, I've never heard this. The idea that Joran had 2 phones never came up?
I'll read up on Renfro and will read your previous posts.
But what about Mansur, surely his criminal past must've been mentioned before in the media.
I believe your monkey bone should be a donkey bone. And no way that something can drift from Aruba to Punto Fijo.
I kinda regret not really following the case even though I'm lviing 1 island to the east...
Gonna get some sleep GN
You should also know that Deepak's car was spotted inside of the VDS compound that very first night,when the Family finally arrived a little later at the VDS house the car was gone!!!!!!!! PVDS came out of the house after 10 minutes of honking and sirens with a cell phone already in his hand. We have strong reason to believe the Van Der Sloots were tipped off that Natalee's Family was on the island and on there way to the house. Also Natalee's Mom noticed her account of that night was serious altered in her testimony by Lead Investigator Dennis Jacobs. At least 6 months later they promised her she could give her witness account again if she came back to Aruba,Instead they grilled her about Insurance Money,Being related to hitler and dealings with people in Colombia.
The next day on June 31st when she met him (Dennis Jacobs)early in the AM he said he needed to eat his frosted flakes first and shave. As she waited 3 hours for him she noticed that Deepak's car was parked on the side of the police station and this was June 31st in the AM. When he was done eating his Frosted Flakes he told her she was not needed and sent her home. That day or the following day when she finally gave her witness account she noticed that there was a PV from Joran torn and on the ground. This was a narcotics officer,what business did he have being the lead investigator in the biggest murder case in Aruban history? This dirty cop handled all the evidence!!!! So much to say about this guy and he was on the case for almost two years!
Speaking of Donkey bones,there were other bones found with flesh and meat still on them that were decaying that were found early in the case in June,one or two of them looked like Human Bones. One of them they said was a Donkey bone. There is more to this I will tell another time. I am not saying that Arm bone is Natalee,but we were told it was a monkey bone and then a human prop. How can you say for sure that was not Natalee? That happened after the hurricane and was found at the closest part of Venezuela to Aruba. Where is that arm bone?
As far as Jossy Mansur goes,he is the only person in Aruba that has gone out of his way to try and help this Family and he continues to do so. I think he cares and has done a enormous amount to help and on his own time and used his own money. He may have other political motives but it is irrelevant for trying to get the truth to this Family about what happened to there daughter. You being in Curacao should know this.
[ Bericht 2% gewijzigd door observer777 op 10-02-2008 10:38:04 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
On the hollowaycase.com there is a phone trace of the May 30/31 (the night after the missing), where the trace shows he walks in opposit directions of what he declared doing that night ( http://hollowaycase.com/archive/police_documents/phone.htm ).
Also I red somewhere that there is not much broadcast points on Aruba, and it wouldn't be a difference if Joran was home or at the HI beach to use the same GSM contact point? Can't find it anymore, though it is strange no phone traces are available for May 29/30, allthough it is knows there was an 8 minute call to Deepak from around 2.30.
Also I red somewhere that there is not much broadcast points on Aruba, and it wouldn't be a difference if Joran was home or at the HI beach to use the same GSM contact point? Can't find it anymore, though it is strange no phone traces are available for May 29/30, allthough it is knows there was an 8 minute call to Deepak from around 2.30.
Where facts are few, experts are many.
@ Observer
that quote I put up from NH Forencic regarding SM was made by the author of the essay not a troll. I did see his name somewhere but can't remember. In my original post I should have said: talk bad about the family instead of talk bad about SM.
Regarding the monkeybone in Venezuela. The text below the picture is not entirely clear. The peninsula Paraguana is indeed only like 16 nm from Aruba (closest point), but Punto Fijo is in the southwestern part of the peninsula. According to google earth 51 nm south-southwest of Aruba. The prevailing current is like 290 with 1-2 kts (west-northwest). Hurricanes won't change the current that much, and I remember the passing of the last 2 hurricanes and the only thing I noticed was a temporary change of winddirection/speed. We were warned by the media to prepare for the passing but absolutely nothing out of the ordinary happened.
The leeward islands are way below the hurricanebelt. The hurricane that passed last year (still tropical storm at that time), passed at 90 nm or something. And that was the closest hurricane ever I believe.
Aruba did have some flooding problems during a hurricane passage in 03 (or 02)
BTW regarding the 2 phones story. I was just thinking about the confession particularly the payphone. There aren't any records of calls being made from a payphone in that timeframe (or the payphone doesn't make local calls or whatever). So Joran might have called the helper with a secondary phone he owns, a phone he normally only uses for drugs or other things that he wanted to keep secret. Overhere you buy a prepaid phone with credit for like 50$. And you buy those anonymously.
But then again it probably happened all at the VDS residence, like you said before. That sounds a lot more logical. Especially when you read things like the pooring of cement in the garden and things like that.
What exactly do you think was the reason for the cover-up?? Surely not to protect the VDS'es, they really aren't that powerful. But then again a lot of the officials involved were close to VDS... And a lot of dubious things happened, like the search at their home and missing/altered statements.
Maybe it was to protect the precious tourism-sector, but that backfired almost immediately. Even if it was soon discovered that she was murdered/gangraped in the most gruesome way, that would have had a lesser impact on the economy than this gigantic cover-up.
I do know the mentality a bit of the Antilleans. One big thing: They don't like to be told how to do something and they don't like to being pushed around and if you do it probably will have the opposite effect.
And I do think an island like Aruba, where almost everybody is related, is too small to handle an investigation like this themselves. When everybody knows eachother you can't be impartial in your investigation. Especially scary on a judge level, because the judge alone decides the outcome, there's no jury or anything.
Regarding Mansur. He might just be so nice to help the family. But has his credibility never been questioned in the US media??
that quote I put up from NH Forencic regarding SM was made by the author of the essay not a troll. I did see his name somewhere but can't remember. In my original post I should have said: talk bad about the family instead of talk bad about SM.
Regarding the monkeybone in Venezuela. The text below the picture is not entirely clear. The peninsula Paraguana is indeed only like 16 nm from Aruba (closest point), but Punto Fijo is in the southwestern part of the peninsula. According to google earth 51 nm south-southwest of Aruba. The prevailing current is like 290 with 1-2 kts (west-northwest). Hurricanes won't change the current that much, and I remember the passing of the last 2 hurricanes and the only thing I noticed was a temporary change of winddirection/speed. We were warned by the media to prepare for the passing but absolutely nothing out of the ordinary happened.
The leeward islands are way below the hurricanebelt. The hurricane that passed last year (still tropical storm at that time), passed at 90 nm or something. And that was the closest hurricane ever I believe.
Aruba did have some flooding problems during a hurricane passage in 03 (or 02)
BTW regarding the 2 phones story. I was just thinking about the confession particularly the payphone. There aren't any records of calls being made from a payphone in that timeframe (or the payphone doesn't make local calls or whatever). So Joran might have called the helper with a secondary phone he owns, a phone he normally only uses for drugs or other things that he wanted to keep secret. Overhere you buy a prepaid phone with credit for like 50$. And you buy those anonymously.
But then again it probably happened all at the VDS residence, like you said before. That sounds a lot more logical. Especially when you read things like the pooring of cement in the garden and things like that.
What exactly do you think was the reason for the cover-up?? Surely not to protect the VDS'es, they really aren't that powerful. But then again a lot of the officials involved were close to VDS... And a lot of dubious things happened, like the search at their home and missing/altered statements.
Maybe it was to protect the precious tourism-sector, but that backfired almost immediately. Even if it was soon discovered that she was murdered/gangraped in the most gruesome way, that would have had a lesser impact on the economy than this gigantic cover-up.
I do know the mentality a bit of the Antilleans. One big thing: They don't like to be told how to do something and they don't like to being pushed around and if you do it probably will have the opposite effect.
And I do think an island like Aruba, where almost everybody is related, is too small to handle an investigation like this themselves. When everybody knows eachother you can't be impartial in your investigation. Especially scary on a judge level, because the judge alone decides the outcome, there's no jury or anything.
Regarding Mansur. He might just be so nice to help the family. But has his credibility never been questioned in the US media??
Intentionally left blank.
Read this comparision between Joran and Deepak's confessions:
http://forensicthoughtprints.com/default.aspx?200827
This story fits very well and could be true I think
http://forensicthoughtprints.com/default.aspx?200827
This story fits very well and could be true I think
WEB / [HaxBall #64] Jos is God
Arguing on the Internet is like running in the Special Olympics.
Arguing on the Internet is like running in the Special Olympics.
PeterR de Vries heeft een stukje op zijn website geschreven:
"Hoe zit het toch met Jorans ouders?"
http://www.peterrdevries.nl/
"Hoe zit het toch met Jorans ouders?"
http://www.peterrdevries.nl/
super!quote:Op zondag 10 februari 2008 17:56 schreef kinkajoe het volgende:
PeterR de Vries heeft een stukje op zijn website geschreven:
"Hoe zit het toch met Jorans ouders?"
http://www.peterrdevries.nl/
ik denk dat het nog een druk weekje gaat worden volgende week wat betreft dit.
Balkenende op de Antillen (vrijdag Aruba)
Peter R. in Nederland verslag doen van z'n bezoek aan Amerika en telkens de beerput wat verder open trekken.
Amerka houdt ook al het nieuws van Peter in de gaten, want hij heeft ook een Engelse site.
Dostojewski: "Je kunt je niet van je eigen gezond verstand overtuigen door je buurman op te sluiten."
ik hou niet van nancy grace, ze is pro natalee, ze zet haar neer, als de heilige maagd maria, als er negatieve dingen over natalee worden gezegd door haar gasten, dan kapt ze die gewoon af!
verder worden de woorden van Joran erger/zwaarder vertaald naar het engels
verder worden de woorden van Joran erger/zwaarder vertaald naar het engels
Kan me wel voorstellen dat mensen geen vervelende verhalen over Nathalee willen horen.quote:"ik hou niet van nancy grace, ze is pro natalee, ze zet haar neer, als de heilige maagd maria, als er negatieve dingen over natalee worden gezegd door haar gasten, dan kapt ze die gewoon af!
verder worden de woorden van Joran erger/zwaarder vertaald naar het engels"
Het meisje was 18 jaar oud en op vakantie. Of ze de heilige maagd Maria was of niet, is totaal niet interessant en heeft verder niets met haar verdwijning te maken. Het is erg kinderachtig (zelfs een beetje minderwaardig imo) te gaan hakken op zo'n verdwenen meisje van 18 jaar dat met haar vriendinnen op Aruba was. Verdedigen kan ze zich niet.
wat vinden we hiervan:
http://video.google.nl/videoplay?docid=6192575384273936337&q=natalee+holloway&total=391&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=7
zeer interessant. vraag me af waarom dit onopgemerkt is gebleven in de media.
http://video.google.nl/videoplay?docid=6192575384273936337&q=natalee+holloway&total=391&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=7
zeer interessant. vraag me af waarom dit onopgemerkt is gebleven in de media.
Very interesting.. So many stories so many lies... very difficult.. But this may well be what happened.. Dont know. But i have a question.. Does someone here has that Deepak E-mail transcript? Or has somebody a link to that text from the book: into the deep?quote:Op zondag 10 februari 2008 17:25 schreef -jos- het volgende:
Read this comparision between Joran and Deepak's confessions:
http://forensicthoughtprints.com/default.aspx?200827
This story fits very well and could be true I think
oh... ze was zwanger van haar stiefvader...?quote:Op zondag 10 februari 2008 19:03 schreef Drexciyan het volgende:
wat vinden we hiervan:
http://video.google.nl/videoplay?docid=6192575384273936337&q=natalee+holloway&total=391&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=7
zeer interessant. vraag me af waarom dit onopgemerkt is gebleven in de media.
[ Bericht 2% gewijzigd door cptmarco op 10-02-2008 19:31:40 ]
Waarom zou de moeder van Nathalee de moeite nemen naar Aruba te gaan als ze wist dat Nathalee van huis wilde weglopen?
Als Nathalee alleen maar van huis wilde weglopen, waarom is ze dan nu nog steeds verdwenen?
Does not make sence to me.
Misschien zijn dit een paar mensen die er geld aan willen verdienen met die grote zonnebrillen op. Er zijn wel meer moord c.q. verdwijningszaken waar mensen een slaatje uit willen slaan. Het zal de eerste keer niet zijn!
Wellicht weet Observer 777 hoe dit zit. Mocht hier een kern van waarheid inzitten, dan is Nathalee natuurlijk een beter slachtoffer dan een van de andere meisjes.
Als Nathalee alleen maar van huis wilde weglopen, waarom is ze dan nu nog steeds verdwenen?
Does not make sence to me.
Misschien zijn dit een paar mensen die er geld aan willen verdienen met die grote zonnebrillen op. Er zijn wel meer moord c.q. verdwijningszaken waar mensen een slaatje uit willen slaan. Het zal de eerste keer niet zijn!
Wellicht weet Observer 777 hoe dit zit. Mocht hier een kern van waarheid inzitten, dan is Nathalee natuurlijk een beter slachtoffer dan een van de andere meisjes.
Those psychics have no proof whatsoever and are being paid by the vdSloots/Aruba
at least according to SM
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door wwwever op 10-02-2008 19:40:56 (sp) ]
at least according to SM
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door wwwever op 10-02-2008 19:40:56 (sp) ]
Intentionally left blank.
I expected something like that. But still, it does not change anything about the disappearance of Nathalee.quote:Op zondag 10 februari 2008 19:39 schreef wwwever het volgende:
Those psychics have no proof whatsoever and are being paid by the vdSloots/Aruba
at least according to SM
steken die neppers nog steeds de kop opquote:Op zondag 10 februari 2008 19:03 schreef Drexciyan het volgende:
wat vinden we hiervan:
http://video.google.nl/videoplay?docid=6192575384273936337&q=natalee+holloway&total=391&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=7
zeer interessant. vraag me af waarom dit onopgemerkt is gebleven in de media.
eigenlijk schandalig dat je zulke kwetsende misinformatie nog durft te posten
Dostojewski: "Je kunt je niet van je eigen gezond verstand overtuigen door je buurman op te sluiten."
Zorgen voor verwarring en desinformatie. Bekend verschijnsel.quote:Op zondag 10 februari 2008 19:56 schreef Caesu het volgende:
[..]
steken die neppers nog steeds de kop op
eigenlijk schandalig dat je zulke kwetsende misinformatie nog durft te posten
Zenuwachtigheid misschien zoals Johan 555 schreef?
These two frauds were brought to Aruba by Minister of Tourism Briesen and Minister of Justice Rudy Croes. This is a perfect example of the wide spread cover up by the Aruban Govt. This was in every newspaper,tv station and on the radio in Aruba. Everything they said was 100% lies,they showed no proof of anything and then left the island. Obviously they did it for the money. Rudy Croes said they should be taken seriously,but the Arubans themselves proved they were lying about everything like the time the Family arrived in Aruba,Drug abuse by Natalee and being pregnant..etc etc etc Pure evil!!quote:Op zondag 10 februari 2008 19:03 schreef Drexciyan het volgende:
wat vinden we hiervan:
http://video.google.nl/videoplay?docid=6192575384273936337&q=natalee+holloway&total=391&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=7
zeer interessant. vraag me af waarom dit onopgemerkt is gebleven in de media.
What is interesting is back in 2006 they claimed there were murders because of Natalee,specificly Pitbull who had his head bashed in,legs cut off and set on fire..But Aruba called it a suicide. He worked as a bouncer for a local bar called choose-a-name that was burned down after his death. He is also the x brother in law of Gerlad Dompig as is Boeti the star witness who got two innocent men arrsted and sent the investigation away from the real perps. The fraud psychic said a guy named edward croes of top 95 witnessed the murder last month during that BS press conference. He also claimed that Lorenzo VR was the murderer. Strange he can make these claims on TV and Radio but no one ever looks into it?
One of the reporters in that video is Rene'e Gielen,friends of the Van Der Sloots and reporter from Curacao she put out that other BS story(The other side) brought up here in this thread with Julia Renfro. These are disgusting low life humans making money off of a murdered girl and her parents!! This is all a huge waste of time and disgusting to the core,but I am glad you brought it up as it shows a bit of the lying,slandering,wrong information put out by the Aruban Govt. Everyone knows it it BS,It was put out for public consumption for there precious tourism and to combat the real truth because that week Beth was on Oprah.
Two frauds leading the way in the media for the Dis-Information and lies coming out of Aruba
Rene'e Gielen
Julia Renfro
[ Bericht 4% gewijzigd door observer777 op 10-02-2008 23:54:01 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Search at the VDS home. Since when do Murder Rape and Kidnapping suspects get Immunity from having there property searched? Since when do they allow a Deputy Commissioners to obstruct justice in a murder Investigation? Since when do the Judges,ALE and Prosecuters all tell a different story and point fingers at each other but never resolve what happened? [color=blue]After this story was printed and Dompig was accused of Obstructing a murder Investigation I see he is running for a high ranking position in the ALE..Are you kidding me?[/color]
Ok,One last time I want to make sure this is all on record. I am convinced they are caught in a huge lie here. If something is wrong here please correct me!!!!!! It just doesnt make sense that Murder,Rape and Kidnapping suspects never had there house searched for 2 years!! We all saw they went in like lightening arrested 2 innocent men,did body searches,forensics in home and cars but for some reason the real perps were granted immunity. What did the Dutch first do when they arrived in Aruba? Did they question Beth what she did with Natalee? No they searched the VDS home and did forensics tests at the Kalpoes.
----------------------------------
Dompig: Said they were dissapointed that the judge did not allow them to search more than just Jorans Apt and they were turned down for a full search of the entire property. They were denied again when PVDS was arrested 8 days later for Premediated Murder and Kidnapping.
Peter De Vries: Told us that when they(ALE)arrived to search the the entire Van Der Sloot property but they were shocked when High Ranking official Ben King answered the door and they found out Judge Wit restricted the search of the VDS home to just Jorans little Apt and the two cars.
Judge Wit: Tells us that Dompig obstructed the search to give the Van Der Sloots privacy. Says the OM(Prosecutions Office)Never asked to search more than just Jorans Apt and the two cars. Said he had to make a decision on the spot? That if something was found it would not be allowed?
Karen Janssen:?
-------------------------------------------------
Translation - posted by Lazlo at RU
Bob Wit defends himself in Bon Dia.
(For sure translation faults, but on or about what it says is the following)
Ex Head Commissar Bob Wit defends his actions in the Holloway case.
-Willemstad- "I have acted correct procedure wise in the case of Natalee Holloway, The ex Head Commissaris in the affair, Bob Wit tells about the procedures that took place fast in the first days of the investigation. During one week, Mr Wit who's avenue is affiliated with the Court of Justice of the Caribbean, has functioned as a Head Commissar in the case here.
On Aruba the Chief of investigation in the time when Gerald Dompig was the Head Commissar, did not approve of the search of the house of the parents of Van Der Sloot as part of the investigation and had obstructed the investigation (?). The investigation of the Dutch crime investigator Peter R. de Vries, has came to the same conclusion. It was remarkable in the case that after the Dutch group of investigators had joined the case they were allowed to search the territory of the family. The impression was given also because it was the deal of a functionnaire who was learning to become Head, felt he had to protect the privacy of the family. Paul van der Sloot, father of Joran van der Sloot after having become a suspect in the case. ....... (no idea)
Mr Wit, had to decide in an instant about the search of where Joran's father lived, and made the decision to allow the search of the apartment of Joran van der Sloot and also in the two cars of the family.
At no moment they had (asked?) to search more then that. A Head Commisar cannot do otherwise, because the petition has to be substantial. Another word is by having allowed to search at other places that were not covered by the petition of the OM all evidence eventually obtained would be illegal. This is very significant since dealing with the case ourselves we had to work in a correct manner, Mr Wit says.
The ex Head Commissar also says by having dealt with the case himself the suspicions against Van Der Sloot and the Kalpoe brothers is strong.
I had concluded from the dossier there had been various contradictions in their declarations. But that is not enough to succeed in a conviction. In a case where no the remains are found in order to treat it as a crime you have to have additional material such as a witness who has seen it happen or traces of blood that for example can be tested for DNA, so the Magistrate tells.
For one thing is, the case itself, Mr Wit says that even after time has passed one can still prosecute the suspects. I have seen often in my work the instant good new information comes up that can throw a new light on a case that was unsolved, so Mr Witt is commenting. The Ministry Public in Aruba has announced this the week that the case here ....of a "crime" is 7 years for murder and 10 years for premeditated murder.
--------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------
OCTOBER, 2005
http://scaredmonkeys.com/(...)lity-1-nay-sayers-0/
Reporter: And the police only searched his apartment, deputy chief?
Dompig: That is correct. The fact is that we as a law enforcement agency always try to get the maximum. Meaning that we want to search as much places as possible. We were not granted by the judge a search warrant for the complete house, we only received the warrant for the apartment.
NOVEMBER, 2006
Peter De Vries
On the Record w/ Greta
November 27, 2006
VAN SUSTEREN: What about the search of the van der Sloot property? Was that ever done, and was, you know--including, sort of, the cabana area where Joran lives?
DE VRIES: Well, the search in the home address of the family van der Sloot was very strange because the search warrant was made by head prosecutor Karin Janssen, and contained an allowance to search the whole address, “Montanja nineteen.” So, the gardens, the buildings--everything. But, when the police was on the spot, another high-ranking employee of the Justice office--it was Mr. Bob Wit--reduced the search warrant to only the room of Joran--and that was very strange.
Beth Twitty
MARTHA MCCALLUM
November 28, 2006
TWITTY: Well I think they will always have to look at there were two personnel involved from the Aruban Justice Department and that is why we do not have any evidence and that is what Joran’s attorney will have to be reminded of. It is because of Bob Witt and Ben King stopped the search warrants. It was made to initially search the entire area of Mon. 19 - the garden, the buildings and everything but on the spot a high ranking employee of the Justice Office, Bob Witt, reduced the search warrant to only the room of Joran so that’s why we do not have any evidence because of involvement of the obstruction from the Aruban Justice Department personnel.
-------------------------------------------------
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door observer777 op 11-02-2008 07:49:57 ]
Ok,One last time I want to make sure this is all on record. I am convinced they are caught in a huge lie here. If something is wrong here please correct me!!!!!! It just doesnt make sense that Murder,Rape and Kidnapping suspects never had there house searched for 2 years!! We all saw they went in like lightening arrested 2 innocent men,did body searches,forensics in home and cars but for some reason the real perps were granted immunity. What did the Dutch first do when they arrived in Aruba? Did they question Beth what she did with Natalee? No they searched the VDS home and did forensics tests at the Kalpoes.
----------------------------------
Dompig: Said they were dissapointed that the judge did not allow them to search more than just Jorans Apt and they were turned down for a full search of the entire property. They were denied again when PVDS was arrested 8 days later for Premediated Murder and Kidnapping.
Peter De Vries: Told us that when they(ALE)arrived to search the the entire Van Der Sloot property but they were shocked when High Ranking official Ben King answered the door and they found out Judge Wit restricted the search of the VDS home to just Jorans little Apt and the two cars.
Judge Wit: Tells us that Dompig obstructed the search to give the Van Der Sloots privacy. Says the OM(Prosecutions Office)Never asked to search more than just Jorans Apt and the two cars. Said he had to make a decision on the spot? That if something was found it would not be allowed?
Karen Janssen:?
-------------------------------------------------
Translation - posted by Lazlo at RU
Bob Wit defends himself in Bon Dia.
(For sure translation faults, but on or about what it says is the following)
Ex Head Commissar Bob Wit defends his actions in the Holloway case.
-Willemstad- "I have acted correct procedure wise in the case of Natalee Holloway, The ex Head Commissaris in the affair, Bob Wit tells about the procedures that took place fast in the first days of the investigation. During one week, Mr Wit who's avenue is affiliated with the Court of Justice of the Caribbean, has functioned as a Head Commissar in the case here.
On Aruba the Chief of investigation in the time when Gerald Dompig was the Head Commissar, did not approve of the search of the house of the parents of Van Der Sloot as part of the investigation and had obstructed the investigation (?). The investigation of the Dutch crime investigator Peter R. de Vries, has came to the same conclusion. It was remarkable in the case that after the Dutch group of investigators had joined the case they were allowed to search the territory of the family. The impression was given also because it was the deal of a functionnaire who was learning to become Head, felt he had to protect the privacy of the family. Paul van der Sloot, father of Joran van der Sloot after having become a suspect in the case. ....... (no idea)
Mr Wit, had to decide in an instant about the search of where Joran's father lived, and made the decision to allow the search of the apartment of Joran van der Sloot and also in the two cars of the family.
At no moment they had (asked?) to search more then that. A Head Commisar cannot do otherwise, because the petition has to be substantial. Another word is by having allowed to search at other places that were not covered by the petition of the OM all evidence eventually obtained would be illegal. This is very significant since dealing with the case ourselves we had to work in a correct manner, Mr Wit says.
The ex Head Commissar also says by having dealt with the case himself the suspicions against Van Der Sloot and the Kalpoe brothers is strong.
I had concluded from the dossier there had been various contradictions in their declarations. But that is not enough to succeed in a conviction. In a case where no the remains are found in order to treat it as a crime you have to have additional material such as a witness who has seen it happen or traces of blood that for example can be tested for DNA, so the Magistrate tells.
For one thing is, the case itself, Mr Wit says that even after time has passed one can still prosecute the suspects. I have seen often in my work the instant good new information comes up that can throw a new light on a case that was unsolved, so Mr Witt is commenting. The Ministry Public in Aruba has announced this the week that the case here ....of a "crime" is 7 years for murder and 10 years for premeditated murder.
--------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------
OCTOBER, 2005
http://scaredmonkeys.com/(...)lity-1-nay-sayers-0/
Reporter: And the police only searched his apartment, deputy chief?
Dompig: That is correct. The fact is that we as a law enforcement agency always try to get the maximum. Meaning that we want to search as much places as possible. We were not granted by the judge a search warrant for the complete house, we only received the warrant for the apartment.
NOVEMBER, 2006
Peter De Vries
On the Record w/ Greta
November 27, 2006
VAN SUSTEREN: What about the search of the van der Sloot property? Was that ever done, and was, you know--including, sort of, the cabana area where Joran lives?
DE VRIES: Well, the search in the home address of the family van der Sloot was very strange because the search warrant was made by head prosecutor Karin Janssen, and contained an allowance to search the whole address, “Montanja nineteen.” So, the gardens, the buildings--everything. But, when the police was on the spot, another high-ranking employee of the Justice office--it was Mr. Bob Wit--reduced the search warrant to only the room of Joran--and that was very strange.
Beth Twitty
MARTHA MCCALLUM
November 28, 2006
TWITTY: Well I think they will always have to look at there were two personnel involved from the Aruban Justice Department and that is why we do not have any evidence and that is what Joran’s attorney will have to be reminded of. It is because of Bob Witt and Ben King stopped the search warrants. It was made to initially search the entire area of Mon. 19 - the garden, the buildings and everything but on the spot a high ranking employee of the Justice Office, Bob Witt, reduced the search warrant to only the room of Joran so that’s why we do not have any evidence because of involvement of the obstruction from the Aruban Justice Department personnel.
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[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door observer777 op 11-02-2008 07:49:57 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
I can't read Dutch or Papi but I see some interesting things written here at this person's site. One is a letter to The Boss of Karen Janssen,here is her response back. His initial letter was interesting and worth the read if it is still on his site. Basicly she was saying they were waiting for video from holland before they arrest JK2 and that she saw no evidence that led to the arrest of the two innocent men that were detained for 10 days. Obvious attempted frame of two innocent men while they led the Investigation away from the real killers.MO
http://www.renevannie.com/inhoud/kritisch/_kritisch2005.html
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ZATERDAG
Hij heet Freddy Arambatzis, bijgenaamd "Locoman Pimp" en is 18 jaar oud. Freddy is opgepakt in relatie tot de Natalee zaak en 'Gang Rape' en maakt deel uit van de 'Gang', Joran en de Kalpoe broeders. Ik wist niet dat we een Gang Rape ploeg hadden maar 1 van de drie meisjes die verkracht zou zijn heeft een aanklacht ingediend. De twee andere meisjes durven -nog- niet. Waarom niet? Hebben we op Aruba dan toch een duistere macht die alles onder controle houdt of wordt Pappa van der Sloot geholpen 'op hoog niveau'? Zeker is dat de rol van Pappa van der Sloot zeer discutabel is en meer weet dan hij wil zeggen. De -bijna - rechter zit niet goed in elkaar. En stel je toch voor dat deze man op de rechterstoel zou komen te zitten. Ik bedoel, zijn collega's zijn veelal geitewollensokken tipoos en volgens mij krijgen we vanuit Nederland alleen maar kneusje toegestuurd die hier recht moeten komen spreken.
http://www.renevannie.com/inhoud/kritisch/_kritisch2005.html
http://www.renevannie.com/inhoud/kritisch/_kritisch2005.html
----------------------------------------------------------
ZATERDAG
Hij heet Freddy Arambatzis, bijgenaamd "Locoman Pimp" en is 18 jaar oud. Freddy is opgepakt in relatie tot de Natalee zaak en 'Gang Rape' en maakt deel uit van de 'Gang', Joran en de Kalpoe broeders. Ik wist niet dat we een Gang Rape ploeg hadden maar 1 van de drie meisjes die verkracht zou zijn heeft een aanklacht ingediend. De twee andere meisjes durven -nog- niet. Waarom niet? Hebben we op Aruba dan toch een duistere macht die alles onder controle houdt of wordt Pappa van der Sloot geholpen 'op hoog niveau'? Zeker is dat de rol van Pappa van der Sloot zeer discutabel is en meer weet dan hij wil zeggen. De -bijna - rechter zit niet goed in elkaar. En stel je toch voor dat deze man op de rechterstoel zou komen te zitten. Ik bedoel, zijn collega's zijn veelal geitewollensokken tipoos en volgens mij krijgen we vanuit Nederland alleen maar kneusje toegestuurd die hier recht moeten komen spreken.
http://www.renevannie.com/inhoud/kritisch/_kritisch2005.html
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
We all noticed that someone was using Joran's phone and signing into his myspace when he was in prison. Because he mentions his father smuggled in a cell phone while he was in prison I believe these screens are true. We also know Paul Van Der Sloot is on the Committee of the Prisons and Hospitals and probably other boards as well.
[quote author=OBSERVER link=topic=7955.msg296425#msg296425 date=1196887923]
I see someone logged into his Myspace account yesterday and changed his profile on Nov 25th.
http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendID=88422124
[/quote]
------------------------------------------------------
Another website that talks about the corruption in Aruba.
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door observer777 op 11-02-2008 02:22:24 ]
[quote author=OBSERVER link=topic=7955.msg296425#msg296425 date=1196887923]
I see someone logged into his Myspace account yesterday and changed his profile on Nov 25th.
http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendID=88422124
[/quote]
------------------------------------------------------
Another website that talks about the corruption in Aruba.
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door observer777 op 11-02-2008 02:22:24 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
very good! i didn't know Peter R. de Vries had been on Greta van Susteren before!
omg... is that the Karin Janssen from the corruption case in Limburg, Netherlands.
(the illegaly build house - and the next day it was suddenly legal)
omg... is that the Karin Janssen from the corruption case in Limburg, Netherlands.
(the illegaly build house - and the next day it was suddenly legal)
Dostojewski: "Je kunt je niet van je eigen gezond verstand overtuigen door je buurman op te sluiten."
they should have put the entire island in a plastic evidence bag years ago and let some independent United Nations team investigate the whole island.
Dostojewski: "Je kunt je niet van je eigen gezond verstand overtuigen door je buurman op te sluiten."
Just another example of the huge conflict of interest in Aruba.
Michael Dompig: (Dompigs Son)Told Dave Holloway that PVDS borrowed Koen Gottenbo's boat to dispose of Natalee on 5-31-05. It was reported in the Media he overheard 3 people saying they used a boat to dispose of Natalee. When he was questioned by the ALE his father resigned from the Natalee case as Commissioner.
Buuti Naar: Dompigs Brother In law who implicated the two innocent security guards in the case saying they were in Natalee's room and stealing from the MB kids. Also said he saw Natalee with cocaine. Two flat out lies.
Dinesh ‘Pitbull’ Djoegan: X Brother In law of Gerald Dompig. He was found on/in Guadirikiri cave on 04/05/2006 -His head was bashed in,legs cut off and set on fire. It was ruled a suicide and many many suspicious events surround his death. He worked for choose-a-name bar as a bouncer that burned down shortly after his death. David Kock slipped in a interview that JK2 stopped at another bar after C&C and it is rumored that it was this bar
K2 Brothers: Are rumored to be Dompigs cousins
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Why can’t we find Natalee Holloway?
May 04, 2006
Recently the Dutch and Aruban press have turned very critical of the Aruban police investigation into the disappearance of Holloway, the first public signal that corruption might be the major obstacle to solving the case. Several Dutch criminal law experts have gone on the record calling the investigation methods “strange and unprofessional” and the investigation itself “total madness.”
At the center of controversy is Gerald Dompig, Aruba's Chief of Police. According to reports, an anonynous man in tears called Dompig with information about where the body of Holloway was buried. A month passed before authorities began the search, yet ealier Dompig spoke openly with the press about new clues. “This is very strange,” said legal psychologist Peter van Koppen. “Normally the area is closed off immediately, to dig and search for clues, but not in Aruba.”
Menno Dolman, a criminal law expert at the University of Amsterdam, was also baffled by Dompig’s slow response. “It is incomprehensible that police, after an important tip about the location of Natalee Holloway’s body, would not go search immediately.”
Regarding Dompig’s leaks about the investigation, University of Leiden’s criminal law expert Hans Nijboer comments: “Total madness. It is against all principles and illogical to bring forth information about the tips before starting the search. [First] competent investigators investigate the case.”
Dompig, who recently resigned his post as Aruba’s Police Chief under mysterious circumstances, is becoming the center of controversy over many odd details related to the case. For example, Joran Van der Sloot and Deepak and Satish Kalpoe were quickly identified as the last people to see Natalee Holloway alive the evening of May 30. However, Dompig waited over a week to gather evidence from the Van der Sloot home, as well as a variety of other sites on the island that might have harbored clues about Holloway’s disappearance. It is widely known that Dompig and Joran Van der Sloot’s father are friends.
There are dozens of other details about Holloway’s disappearance that remain a mystery. Why did Stephen Crooes (a DJ and local operator of a party boat) come forward early in the investigation to corroborate the first tale about the three boys having dropped Holloway off at the Holiday Inn, a story the three boys later admitted was a lie? Crooes now says “he was trying to help,” but what was his motivation to stick his nose into such a high profile investigation if he knew the details weren’t the truth? Was he a plant intended to throw the investigation off course, or was he just stupid?
Authorities remain tight-lipped about the fishing huts on the northwest corner of the island near the hotel where Holloway was staying. Shortly after Holloway disappeared, the fishing huts were vandalized and missing items included fishing cages and knives—equipment that could have been used to dispose of a body.
Forensic evidence taken from the Kalpoe’s vehicle that was later determined unusable was never recollected. Why?
There is a series of videotapes, now labeled “the Chicago tapes” (I have no idea why they are named that) that show island authorities in rental cars searching the northern dunes and painting rocks in areas where Holloway might have disappeared—activities that would obviously corrupt a crime scene. There is information about four boys seen carrying a shovel near the dump in the early morning hours of May 31, reports of suspicious automobiles near the Racquet Club, the fishing huts, and the dump during that evening, and information about a woman being attacked near the fishing huts eight days before Holloway disappeared. All those leads remain loose ends.
Following Dompig’s resignation, Geoffrey Van Cromvoirt was arrested on April 16. News soon surfaced that Cromvoirt was friends with Michael Dompig, the son of Gerald Dompig. Both worked on the Aruban Visibility Team, a security group that patrolled the beaches at the hotels where Holloway was staying. Recent accounts in the Aruban newspaper Diario reported that the boys often boasted that they “had fun with female tourists, even impersonating or representing themselves as island police.” It is coincidental, to say the least, that Cromvoirt’s father owned an island security firm that, among other things, was in charge of video surveillance at the Holiday Inn where Holloway was staying. Cromvoirt was released on April 24, but authorities say that he remains a suspect in the investigation.
Weeks ago, Gerald Dompig appeared in the American media to proclaim that “Holloway died of a drug or alcohol overdose,” but one day later told Dutch newspapers that “Holloway was raped and killed.” Amid this most recent controversy, Aruban newspapers are now reporting that islanders have become resigned to the fact that Dompig and his team have botched the investigation. From all accounts, Aruba is a small island and like many small communities, everyone knows everyone else’s business, a fact that was very apparent during my interviews on the island 11 months ago. After almost one year of an investigation riddled with unresolved questions, incompetent police work, and lies, it is becoming easier to believe that this crime remains unsolved because of the efforts of a few people who actually don’t want to see justice served.
Someone knows what happened to Natalee Holloway, they just aren’t talking.
http://tinyurl.com/luwel
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
In October, 2005 Aruban authorities approached Dave Holloway and informed him that Koen Gottenbos could possibly be the key to solving the case. Nevertheless, Koen was never interrogated again in spite of the promises of Gerold Dompig. The assistant prosecutor, Amalin Flanegin, quit because she believed that Koen lied when he was interrogated in the initial stages of the investigation, and Dompig refused to bring him in again. A meeting that took place between Koen's father and the investigators could possibly reveal an explanation.
[ Bericht 2% gewijzigd door observer777 op 11-02-2008 06:38:00 ]
Michael Dompig: (Dompigs Son)Told Dave Holloway that PVDS borrowed Koen Gottenbo's boat to dispose of Natalee on 5-31-05. It was reported in the Media he overheard 3 people saying they used a boat to dispose of Natalee. When he was questioned by the ALE his father resigned from the Natalee case as Commissioner.
Buuti Naar: Dompigs Brother In law who implicated the two innocent security guards in the case saying they were in Natalee's room and stealing from the MB kids. Also said he saw Natalee with cocaine. Two flat out lies.
Dinesh ‘Pitbull’ Djoegan: X Brother In law of Gerald Dompig. He was found on/in Guadirikiri cave on 04/05/2006 -His head was bashed in,legs cut off and set on fire. It was ruled a suicide and many many suspicious events surround his death. He worked for choose-a-name bar as a bouncer that burned down shortly after his death. David Kock slipped in a interview that JK2 stopped at another bar after C&C and it is rumored that it was this bar
K2 Brothers: Are rumored to be Dompigs cousins
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Why can’t we find Natalee Holloway?
May 04, 2006
Recently the Dutch and Aruban press have turned very critical of the Aruban police investigation into the disappearance of Holloway, the first public signal that corruption might be the major obstacle to solving the case. Several Dutch criminal law experts have gone on the record calling the investigation methods “strange and unprofessional” and the investigation itself “total madness.”
At the center of controversy is Gerald Dompig, Aruba's Chief of Police. According to reports, an anonynous man in tears called Dompig with information about where the body of Holloway was buried. A month passed before authorities began the search, yet ealier Dompig spoke openly with the press about new clues. “This is very strange,” said legal psychologist Peter van Koppen. “Normally the area is closed off immediately, to dig and search for clues, but not in Aruba.”
Menno Dolman, a criminal law expert at the University of Amsterdam, was also baffled by Dompig’s slow response. “It is incomprehensible that police, after an important tip about the location of Natalee Holloway’s body, would not go search immediately.”
Regarding Dompig’s leaks about the investigation, University of Leiden’s criminal law expert Hans Nijboer comments: “Total madness. It is against all principles and illogical to bring forth information about the tips before starting the search. [First] competent investigators investigate the case.”
Dompig, who recently resigned his post as Aruba’s Police Chief under mysterious circumstances, is becoming the center of controversy over many odd details related to the case. For example, Joran Van der Sloot and Deepak and Satish Kalpoe were quickly identified as the last people to see Natalee Holloway alive the evening of May 30. However, Dompig waited over a week to gather evidence from the Van der Sloot home, as well as a variety of other sites on the island that might have harbored clues about Holloway’s disappearance. It is widely known that Dompig and Joran Van der Sloot’s father are friends.
There are dozens of other details about Holloway’s disappearance that remain a mystery. Why did Stephen Crooes (a DJ and local operator of a party boat) come forward early in the investigation to corroborate the first tale about the three boys having dropped Holloway off at the Holiday Inn, a story the three boys later admitted was a lie? Crooes now says “he was trying to help,” but what was his motivation to stick his nose into such a high profile investigation if he knew the details weren’t the truth? Was he a plant intended to throw the investigation off course, or was he just stupid?
Authorities remain tight-lipped about the fishing huts on the northwest corner of the island near the hotel where Holloway was staying. Shortly after Holloway disappeared, the fishing huts were vandalized and missing items included fishing cages and knives—equipment that could have been used to dispose of a body.
Forensic evidence taken from the Kalpoe’s vehicle that was later determined unusable was never recollected. Why?
There is a series of videotapes, now labeled “the Chicago tapes” (I have no idea why they are named that) that show island authorities in rental cars searching the northern dunes and painting rocks in areas where Holloway might have disappeared—activities that would obviously corrupt a crime scene. There is information about four boys seen carrying a shovel near the dump in the early morning hours of May 31, reports of suspicious automobiles near the Racquet Club, the fishing huts, and the dump during that evening, and information about a woman being attacked near the fishing huts eight days before Holloway disappeared. All those leads remain loose ends.
Following Dompig’s resignation, Geoffrey Van Cromvoirt was arrested on April 16. News soon surfaced that Cromvoirt was friends with Michael Dompig, the son of Gerald Dompig. Both worked on the Aruban Visibility Team, a security group that patrolled the beaches at the hotels where Holloway was staying. Recent accounts in the Aruban newspaper Diario reported that the boys often boasted that they “had fun with female tourists, even impersonating or representing themselves as island police.” It is coincidental, to say the least, that Cromvoirt’s father owned an island security firm that, among other things, was in charge of video surveillance at the Holiday Inn where Holloway was staying. Cromvoirt was released on April 24, but authorities say that he remains a suspect in the investigation.
Weeks ago, Gerald Dompig appeared in the American media to proclaim that “Holloway died of a drug or alcohol overdose,” but one day later told Dutch newspapers that “Holloway was raped and killed.” Amid this most recent controversy, Aruban newspapers are now reporting that islanders have become resigned to the fact that Dompig and his team have botched the investigation. From all accounts, Aruba is a small island and like many small communities, everyone knows everyone else’s business, a fact that was very apparent during my interviews on the island 11 months ago. After almost one year of an investigation riddled with unresolved questions, incompetent police work, and lies, it is becoming easier to believe that this crime remains unsolved because of the efforts of a few people who actually don’t want to see justice served.
Someone knows what happened to Natalee Holloway, they just aren’t talking.
http://tinyurl.com/luwel
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
In October, 2005 Aruban authorities approached Dave Holloway and informed him that Koen Gottenbos could possibly be the key to solving the case. Nevertheless, Koen was never interrogated again in spite of the promises of Gerold Dompig. The assistant prosecutor, Amalin Flanegin, quit because she believed that Koen lied when he was interrogated in the initial stages of the investigation, and Dompig refused to bring him in again. A meeting that took place between Koen's father and the investigators could possibly reveal an explanation.
[ Bericht 2% gewijzigd door observer777 op 11-02-2008 06:38:00 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
This just made me laugh out loud
I mean, c'mon. How can anyone maintain that everything is just fine inside the ALE?
quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 01:07 schreef observer777 het volgende:
[...]
His head was bashed in,legs cut off and set on fire. It was ruled a suicide [...]
I mean, c'mon. How can anyone maintain that everything is just fine inside the ALE?
April 17, 2006
"The former lead investigater in the case(DOMPIG) said his son worked for a watersports company and overheard a group of people tell a story about someone using a boat to get rid of Natalee's body"
http://youtube.com/watch?v=UKeEDXG3K7w
----------------------------
From Dave's book, pgs. 118-119...
He (Michael Dompig) then started talking about the case, and during this conversation he mentioned that he had heard that Paulus van der Sloot had borrowed a friend's boat on either the night of Natalee's disappearance or the next day and that he was allegedly involved with Natalee's murder. That brought to mind one of Joran's statements. Apparently, this friend's father owned a boat. The message was that this boat was used to take Natalee out to sea. Another boat that was also mentioned by him was the Pair A Dice, which is a local boat from Aruba.
"The former lead investigater in the case(DOMPIG) said his son worked for a watersports company and overheard a group of people tell a story about someone using a boat to get rid of Natalee's body"
http://youtube.com/watch?v=UKeEDXG3K7w
----------------------------
From Dave's book, pgs. 118-119...
He (Michael Dompig) then started talking about the case, and during this conversation he mentioned that he had heard that Paulus van der Sloot had borrowed a friend's boat on either the night of Natalee's disappearance or the next day and that he was allegedly involved with Natalee's murder. That brought to mind one of Joran's statements. Apparently, this friend's father owned a boat. The message was that this boat was used to take Natalee out to sea. Another boat that was also mentioned by him was the Pair A Dice, which is a local boat from Aruba.
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Yes. You know how this works, you have seen it happen.quote:Op zondag 10 februari 2008 08:25 schreef kinkajoe het volgende:
@ WWWever,
It is rather obvious that people come up with stories about Nathalee to get the attention away from what really happened.
[...]
It only makes sence for people who know more about Nathalee's disappearance to blame the girl herself and her family. Blaming the other is very popular by people who want to get the attention away from were they do not want it. People who want not to be found out the truth, make up stories about total innocent people.
Trying to shift the blame away from the suspect onto others, sow doubts and confusion, trying to influence public opinion, and when public opinion has sufficiently been molded, try to use public opinion as their own tool in exerting pressure unto the authorities.
Thats why even if the 'De Vries tapes' cant be used directly in court, which remains to be seen at this point, Peter has giving a tremendous blow to those playing this PR game. I would say its a KO. They wont recover from this no matter how many psychics or wild theories they put out there. Peter has in one big swoop undone this whole carefully crafted disinfo campaign.
NorthernStar, what do you think about my theory that Peter R. planned the timeline.quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 01:43 schreef NorthernStar het volgende:
[..]
Yes. You know how this works, you have seen it happen.
Trying to shift the blame away from the suspect onto others, sow doubts and confusion, trying to influence public opinion, and when public opinion has sufficiently been molded, try to use public opinion as their own tool in exerting pressure unto the authorities.
Thats why even if the 'De Vries tapes' cant be used directly in court, which remains to be seen at this point, Peter has giving a tremendous blow to those playing this PR game. I would say its a KO. They wont recover from this no matter how many psychics or wild theories they put out there. Peter has in one big swoop undone this whole carefully crafted disinfo campaign.
i mean, coming friday balkenende is visiting Aruba. it is an important visit, he doesn't go there often.
do you think Peter R. will issue a statement about the Van der Sloots thursday or wednesday to grab the media attention (also in the USA live on let's say Greta or Nancy Grace) again and embarras Balkenende so much that shit starts hitting the fan?
this is just a theory, but my gut tells me Peter R. plays better poker than Paul vdS and everybody.
Dostojewski: "Je kunt je niet van je eigen gezond verstand overtuigen door je buurman op te sluiten."
[ afbeelding ]quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 00:50 schreef observer777 het volgende:
We all noticed that someone was using Joran's phone and signing into his myspace when he was in prison. Because he mentions his father smuggled in a cell phone while he was in prison I believe these screens are true. We also know Paul Van Der Sloot is on the Committee of the Prisons and Hospitals and probably other boards as well.
[quote author=OBSERVER link=topic=7955.msg296425#msg296425 date=1196887923]
I see someone logged into his Myspace account yesterday and changed his profile on Nov 25th.
http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendID=88422124
[ afbeelding ]
[ afbeelding ]
------------------------------------------------------
Another website that talks about the corruption in Aruba.
[ afbeelding ]
[ afbeelding ]
[/quote]this website stil exists!!! last login 10-2-2008!!!!
xx 236-kl-78yu-MMklo-ccdfth21
Peter R. obviously chose the moment. I remember he said something about it along the lines that he could have gone on with the operation, well almost indefinitely. So yes the decision to end it and to bring it out in the open with the broadcast was deliberately chosen. Balkenende's visit could very well have been a factor in that discussion decision. But to what extent, I dont know.quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 01:53 schreef Caesu het volgende:
[..]
NorthernStar, what do you think about my theory that Peter R. planned the timeline.
i mean, coming friday balkenende is visiting Aruba. it is an important visit, he doesn't go there often.
do you think Peter R. will issue a statement about the Van der Sloots thursday or wednesday to grab the media attention (also in the USA live on let's say Greta or Nancy Grace) again and embarras Balkenende so much that shit starts hitting the fan?
this is just a theory, but my gut tells me Peter R. plays better poker than Paul vdS and everybody.
My feeling is, and there are some indications that point in that direction, that Peter R. has done this in coordination with elements within the law enforcement and judiciary. He is well connected anyway so there would be contacts but it seems to me that there's a little more to it. The official story is that Patrick came out of the blue and offered his services to Peter, but is that what really happened? Or was this initiated and organized by elements within the law enforcement? It has also been suggested that Patrick's appearance was arranged by the organized crime. The boundaries between law enforcement and organized crime are probably a bit more murkier anyway on places like Aruba.
If Peter R. is working in coordination with "others" then who knows what will be taken into consideration in their decision making. What interests are in play.
Thats the problem imo, we know nothing about whats going on behind the scenes.
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door NorthernStar op 11-02-2008 03:56:21 ]
Another thought on this.quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 01:53 schreef Caesu het volgende:
[..]
do you think Peter R. will issue a statement about the Van der Sloots thursday or wednesday to grab the media attention (also in the USA live on let's say Greta or Nancy Grace) again and embarras Balkenende so much that shit starts hitting the fan?
Peter's aim is not to bring the whole thing down like a house of cards. If the crime is solved till a satisfactory degree and Peter gets a big chunk of the credit, well thats major success. He is not out to get everyone who might have made their hands dirty since may 2005. On the contrary. Those are potentional favors he can call in at a later time, in another case. You never know when those might come in handy. You scratch my back and I'll scratch yours.. He wouldnt have been a "crime reporter" very long if he would have gone out and exposed everything he came across. At least not a very successful one. Within notime every door would be closed for him.
He said in one interview he's certain that Joran will stand trial. If think he already has gotten assurance that this is going to happen. No need to embarrass certain people.
[ afbeelding ]quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 00:50 schreef observer777 het volgende:
We all noticed that someone was using Joran's phone and signing into his myspace when he was in prison. Because he mentions his father smuggled in a cell phone while he was in prison I believe these screens are true. We also know Paul Van Der Sloot is on the Committee of the Prisons and Hospitals and probably other boards as well.
[quote author=OBSERVER link=topic=7955.msg296425#msg296425 date=1196887923]
I see someone logged into his Myspace account yesterday and changed his profile on Nov 25th.
http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendID=88422124
[ afbeelding ]
[ afbeelding ]
------------------------------------------------------
Another website that talks about the corruption in Aruba.
[ afbeelding ]
[ afbeelding ]
[/quote]
What kind of evidence does this provide......as I see it nothing, the FBI can get this info from the servers of myspace and verify wich Ip logged in and and what time....these screenshots can be made in minutes with photoshop.
or some else has his login info including the paswword.
Also.....
Some claime 2 phone calls were made from Natalee's Cell phone....this would be intercepted by NSA, it was an US cell
calling a foreign number....i'm sure NSA would have intercepted the call and would still be logged in there databases,
NOT the conversation, but that the call was made and to wich number. the FBI can get this information from NSA. To clear all the doubt about the calls,
Also, Aruba is the US staging area for Covert ops on venuzuala....IF a boot went out it would have been detected by US assets in the area even though SOSUS. so to verify some of the events US intelligence assets would be able to provide some info on it.
Welcome Mr. President, How can we serve you,
The FBI can't do anything unless the Aruban authorities ask them to,so far the Arubans have asked very little of them. You should read my post again because you are missing it. Those screens are absolutely authentic and I saw it for my very own eyes someone was logging into his myspace account almost daily when he was in prison. Since he admitted his father smuggled in a cell phone when he was in prison and his father is on the Govt Prison Board it leads me to believe Joran indeed had a cell phone in prison. I don't have access to the Myspace servers or internal functions at MSN,I was simply sharing what I know.
As far as the phone calls reported from Natalee you can use your own assumptions as will I. The Family says now they did not take place.
As far as the phone calls reported from Natalee you can use your own assumptions as will I. The Family says now they did not take place.
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
How can you be sure it was Joran and not someone else using his login and password....... even if the screens are authentic. This is no PROOF it was Joran logging in, just SOMEONE was.quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 05:03 schreef observer777 het volgende:
The FBI can't do anything unless the Aruban authorities ask them to,so far the Arubans have asked very little of them. You should read my post again because you are missing it. Those screens are absolutely authentic and I saw it for my very own eyes someone was logging into his myspace account almost daily when he was in prison. Since he admitted his father smuggled in a cell phone when he was in prison and his father is on the Govt Prison Board it leads me to believe Joran indeed had a cell phone in prison. I don't have access to the Myspace servers or internal functions at MSN,I was simply sharing what I know.
As far as the phone calls reported from Natalee you can use your own assumptions as will I. The Family says now they did not take place.
A could have done, doesn't make it so. (Does anyone the data network on Aruba GPRS/EDGE dont think it was WIFI in jail
and the FBI can request (no warrent) the info from Myspace, even without a request from Aruban authorities.
I think Myspace would provide the info when requested by the FBI.
ok if there are no calls...there's no loggs so that one goes out the window
Note*(I dont trust the arubans to figure this one out to many hooks an angels on the little damn island...they just dont want to to many people in higher positions would be implicated in NOT doing there job properly)
Welcome Mr. President, How can we serve you,
Oh just to clear something up
PrdV als claimed to have solved the JFK murder.
He is very very selective in what to choose and what to believe from joran and what not.
I personaly think....Joran was very close to the truth in the car, Just that he switched the name of Daury with his dads the next day.....
Hope some day all 20+ hours of tape come out to see the raw un edited version of his "confessions"
PrdV als claimed to have solved the JFK murder.
He is very very selective in what to choose and what to believe from joran and what not.
I personaly think....Joran was very close to the truth in the car, Just that he switched the name of Daury with his dads the next day.....
Hope some day all 20+ hours of tape come out to see the raw un edited version of his "confessions"
Welcome Mr. President, How can we serve you,
The US government, and I'm sure the FBI alone as well, has the tools to investigate this on their own. They dont need permission from the Aruban authorities. They can trace phone calls and check web servers. We would know if they had done so? Obviously not. They wouldnt disclose their own findings and Joran isnt prosecuted in the US.quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 05:03 schreef observer777 het volgende:
The FBI can't do anything unless the Aruban authorities ask them to,so far the Arubans have asked very little of them. You should read my post again because you are missing it. Those screens are absolutely authentic and I saw it for my very own eyes someone was logging into his myspace account almost daily when he was in prison. Since he admitted his father smuggled in a cell phone when he was in prison and his father is on the Govt Prison Board it leads me to believe Joran indeed had a cell phone in prison. I don't have access to the Myspace servers or internal functions at MSN,I was simply sharing what I know.
As far as the phone calls reported from Natalee you can use your own assumptions as will I. The Family says now they did not take place.
If Joran had excess to a mobile while in prison, and he said so himself, my guess is the FBI investigators would know this or have the means to find out. Same goes for the Dutch investigators. If Joran had a phone than they know this. We cant check their findings but imo its pretty much established that Joran did.
Then a far more interesting question arises. Who provided the cell phone? If the investigators can prove it came from PVDS he is toast. Whatever else might happen, his career is ruined. Thats why Peter R. wrote today that Jorans parents now have a clear interest in discrediting Jorans confessions. In other words, their credibility has been shot, courtesy of their own precious Joran.
Interesting reading from a business man in Aruba named Rene Van Nie
------------------------------------
COVER UP?!
Van de 10 mails die ik ontvang wordt er in zeker 8 gesproken over een COVER UP.
De mensen geloven het niet meer. En dat is niet goed voor de geloofwaardigheid in ons rechten systeem. De mensen zijn het zat. Ze kunnen zich niet voorstellen dat alles eerlijk verloopt op Aruba. Ik weet het niet meer. Maar gevaarlijk is die ontwikkeling zeker. Want als er van een 'cover up' sprake is dat zijn die mensen verantwoordelijk voor een duidelijke teruggang in onze toeristen industrie van zeker zo'n 20%. Plus dat het misdadig is wat ze doen.
Er is ook een heel duidelijke theorie bij mijn lezers over de 100 tips die in Nederland zijn binnen gekomen na de uitzending Spoorloos. "Op Aruba durven de mensen niet te bellen, ze vertrouwen het niet' en 'ze geloven toch niet dat er iets met hun tips wordt gedaan'. en 'daarom hebben ze wel naar Nederland gebeld. Dat is niet gevaarlijk en dan moet er wél wat worden gedaan met hun tips'.
Kortom, foute boel allemaal!
BETROKKEN AMERIKANEN HEBBEN AL VANAF HET BEGIN OVER EEN COVER UP GESPROKEN. DAT IS HUN GROOTSTE PROBLEEM MET ARUBA.
EN ALS DAT NIET ZO IS DAN ZIJN DE INSTANTIES OP ARUBA IN ELK GEVAL HEEL ERG VERKEERD NAAR BUITEN GETREDEN. EN DOEN DAT NOG STEEDS.
UIT DE AMIGOE:
Van Cromvoirt is werkzaam bij het Visibility Team. Zijn vader heeft een bewakingsbedrijf, VCB, dat voor enkele grote hotels werkt. Het Openbaar Ministerie (OM) heeft bevestigd dat de aanhouding is verricht. Waarvan hij wordt verdacht is niet bekend gemaakt. Het zou dus kunnen dat hij informatie heeft achtergehouden, maar het zou ook kunnen dat hij met het meisje is gezien in de nacht van haar verdwijning. Of de aanhouding een gevolg is van een tip naar aanleiding van de uitzending van Opsporing Verzocht, vorige week, wilde het OM niet bevestigen.
UIT DE INTERNATIONALE PERS
Vriendje commissariszoon
De reden waarom Geoffrey niet eerder is gearresteerd, zo wordt gefluisterd in
Oranjestad, ligt aan het feit dat hij goed bevriend is met de zoon van de
Arubaanse politiecommissaris Gerold Dompig.
Dompig was leider van het team dat onderzoek doet
naar de verdwijning van Natalee Holloway. Dompig
was de tweede onderzoeksleider van het team. Hij
volgde Jan van der Straten op, die met pensioen ging.
Geoffrey heeft wat problemen. Hij is hyperactief. Er is een naam voor die kwaal maar die ben ik even kwijt. Dat maakt ook duidelijk waarom hij tijdens de verhoren onophoudelijk huilt.
http://www.renevannie.com/inhoud/kritisch/_kritisch2005.html
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door observer777 op 11-02-2008 06:00:11 ]
------------------------------------
COVER UP?!
Van de 10 mails die ik ontvang wordt er in zeker 8 gesproken over een COVER UP.
De mensen geloven het niet meer. En dat is niet goed voor de geloofwaardigheid in ons rechten systeem. De mensen zijn het zat. Ze kunnen zich niet voorstellen dat alles eerlijk verloopt op Aruba. Ik weet het niet meer. Maar gevaarlijk is die ontwikkeling zeker. Want als er van een 'cover up' sprake is dat zijn die mensen verantwoordelijk voor een duidelijke teruggang in onze toeristen industrie van zeker zo'n 20%. Plus dat het misdadig is wat ze doen.
Er is ook een heel duidelijke theorie bij mijn lezers over de 100 tips die in Nederland zijn binnen gekomen na de uitzending Spoorloos. "Op Aruba durven de mensen niet te bellen, ze vertrouwen het niet' en 'ze geloven toch niet dat er iets met hun tips wordt gedaan'. en 'daarom hebben ze wel naar Nederland gebeld. Dat is niet gevaarlijk en dan moet er wél wat worden gedaan met hun tips'.
Kortom, foute boel allemaal!
BETROKKEN AMERIKANEN HEBBEN AL VANAF HET BEGIN OVER EEN COVER UP GESPROKEN. DAT IS HUN GROOTSTE PROBLEEM MET ARUBA.
EN ALS DAT NIET ZO IS DAN ZIJN DE INSTANTIES OP ARUBA IN ELK GEVAL HEEL ERG VERKEERD NAAR BUITEN GETREDEN. EN DOEN DAT NOG STEEDS.
UIT DE AMIGOE:
Van Cromvoirt is werkzaam bij het Visibility Team. Zijn vader heeft een bewakingsbedrijf, VCB, dat voor enkele grote hotels werkt. Het Openbaar Ministerie (OM) heeft bevestigd dat de aanhouding is verricht. Waarvan hij wordt verdacht is niet bekend gemaakt. Het zou dus kunnen dat hij informatie heeft achtergehouden, maar het zou ook kunnen dat hij met het meisje is gezien in de nacht van haar verdwijning. Of de aanhouding een gevolg is van een tip naar aanleiding van de uitzending van Opsporing Verzocht, vorige week, wilde het OM niet bevestigen.
UIT DE INTERNATIONALE PERS
Vriendje commissariszoon
De reden waarom Geoffrey niet eerder is gearresteerd, zo wordt gefluisterd in
Oranjestad, ligt aan het feit dat hij goed bevriend is met de zoon van de
Arubaanse politiecommissaris Gerold Dompig.
Dompig was leider van het team dat onderzoek doet
naar de verdwijning van Natalee Holloway. Dompig
was de tweede onderzoeksleider van het team. Hij
volgde Jan van der Straten op, die met pensioen ging.
Geoffrey heeft wat problemen. Hij is hyperactief. Er is een naam voor die kwaal maar die ben ik even kwijt. Dat maakt ook duidelijk waarom hij tijdens de verhoren onophoudelijk huilt.
http://www.renevannie.com/inhoud/kritisch/_kritisch2005.html
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door observer777 op 11-02-2008 06:00:11 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
He has his own scenario or theory. Just like everybody else does. His claims that he had solved the case where indeed way over the top. However in the broadcast itself he took a more "humble" position. And he now refers to it as a breakthrough. He said so himself he underestimated the response it would get. In retrospect there wasn’t a need to make it this "sensational".quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 05:23 schreef WallOfStars het volgende:
Oh just to clear something up
PrdV als claimed to have solved the JFK murder.
He is very very selective in what to choose and what to believe from joran and what not.
I hope so too.quote:I personaly think....Joran was very close to the truth in the car, Just that he switched the name of Daury with his dads the next day.....
Hope some day all 20+ hours of tape come out to see the raw un edited version of his "confessions"
The FBI may have the tools to Investigate,but they will not get involved unless the Arubans ask them to pertaining to crimes that happened in Aruba. Trust me on this. Also Rudy Croes and Jossy Mansur spoke out the other day and said they will look into Jorans cell phone use in the KIA. If it is true,they may kick PVDS off of the Govt Prison Committee,Hospital and whatever other committees he is on. There was a article about that on SM FP.quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 05:38 schreef NorthernStar het volgende:
[..]
The US government, and I'm sure the FBI alone as well, has the tools to investigate this on their own. They dont need permission from the Aruban authorities. They can trace phone calls and check web servers. We would know if they had done so? Obviously not. They wouldnt disclose their own findings and Joran isnt
prosecuted in the US.
If Joran had excess to a mobile while in prison, and he said so himself, my guess is the FBI investigators would know this or have the means to find out. Same goes for the Dutch investigators. If Joran had a phone than they know this. We cant check their findings but imo its pretty much established that Joran did.
Then a far more interesting question arises. Who provided the cell phone? If the investigators can prove it came from PVDS he is toast. Whatever else might happen, his career is ruined. Thats why Peter R. wrote today that Jorans parents now have a clear interest in discrediting Jorans confessions. In other words, their credibility has been shot, courtesy of their own precious Joran.
scaredmonkeys.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Geraldo 2/10/08 Beth and Peter R Interview
Part 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=178zR_ul7Yw
Part 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2OaIMz5Oz9E
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Letter From Paul Reynolds
Natalee Holloway's Uncle, Paul Reynolds penned a letter to the Editor and sent it to Amigoe, Aruba AM and Aruba Today. He was on MSNBC's Scarborough Country Tuesday night to discuss the letter and related topics.
Below is the unedited text of the letter.
Letter to the Editor
I have been reading Aruba AM, the English Aruban newspaper sent out over the internet. There appears to be a growing backlash against the Holloway family that I am very concerned about. I am sure the people in Aruba wish this investigation could be resolved as much as our family does.
The people in Aruba have been overwhelming supportive of our entire family since Natalie's disappearance. When I arrived on the Island two days after she was reported missing, I was always greeted with expressions of concern and hope for Natalie's return. There are hundreds if not thousands of stories of people coming together and helping each other during this incident. Bernadett from Economy Car Rental, the people at Holiday Inn, the Aruban Government Workers who left work to search the island are just a few of the examples. This is the good story of Aruba . The compassion and desire to help has meant more than you can imagine to our family.
Unfortunately, there are a very small number of individuals that are holding the people of Aruba , the Holloway family and what seems like the whole world hostage. These individuals are not a reflection of the Aruban people or the system of Justice in Aruba . These individuals know what happened and are refusing to accept responsibility for their actions. It also appears that certain individuals may be attempting to protect those individuals that know what happened. Helping them hide from their responsibility will destroy rather than preserve what is left of their lives, hopes and dreams.
The concerns that we have about the investigation are real. It began with the 10 day delay with taking the three original suspects into custody. My sister, Beth and her husband, Jug, arrived on the island the same day Natalie was reported missing. They were able to identify the three individuals she had last been seen with and report this to the police. The three suspects were briefly questioned and released. Their stories turned out to be false and their allegations led to the detainment of two innocent individuals. In a missing person case, every day is critical. Ten days would allow those individuals responsible time to hide evidence and coordinate their stories. What if the missing person was alive in those first few days? The failure to take those individuals into custody and seek evidence may have damaged this investigation beyond repair. Why was this done? Was it an attempt to cover up whatever happened and or protect those individuals involved?
Because the father of one of the suspects is a member of the Judicial system, there was immediate concern on behalf of the family that the investigation might not be fair and objective. The interest and presence of the FBI along with assurances from the US Government and the Prime Minister of Aruba reduced those concerns.
Actions since then have again increased concerns that the investigation is not being done in an objective manner. Why would you refuse assistance from the FBI in resolving a difficult case? Why would you hinder a private search team, composed of a group of volunteers whose director has experienced a similar loss of his own?
The release of two of the suspects is also a matter of concern.
Although the latest (third) story of one of the suspects places him alone with Natalie on the beach, the other two have admitted to lying. Is this not obstruction of justice, interfering with an investigation or conspiracy to cover up a crime? Aren't these illegal activities whether or not you are involved in the actual crime itself? How can these individuals be allowed to go free and possibly leave the country? Why would they lie unless they had knowledge of a crime either before or after the fact? Why would the father of one of the suspects tell all three that without a body, there is no crime?
As you can see, our many questions and concerns are about the investigation, not the Island or the people of Aruba . They are as much a victim of these individuals as we are. Please join us in our request to the Prime Minister of Aruba and the Dutch Authorities to launch an independent investigation of this matter and allow all of us to learn the truth, return Natalie to her home and go forward with our lives.
Respectfully yours,
Paul Reynolds
Natalie Holloway's Uncle
Wednesday, July 06, 2005 at 12:50 AM
http://www.riehlworldview(...)05/week27/index.html
Paul Reynolds
'Scarborough Country' for July 12
July 12, 2005
PAUL REYNOLDS, UNCLE OF NATALEE HOLLOWAY: i know that my sister had a meeting with the FBI June 10, Friday. And from that meeting, she became convinced that Natalee was no longer alive. She called her mother and told her that. And our family was—was—began the grieving process.
You know, we were told the report would come out the next day. Later that night, we saw the reports that confessions had been made, that something bad had happened. Shortly thereafter, it was retracted. The next morning, there was a report that said Natalee was confirmed dead. And these reports came from the deputy commissioner. They came from the spokesperson from the Ministry of Justice.
And then, all of a sudden, these statements and these confessions just disappeared.
SCARBOROUGH: And wait a second. I mean, these confessions were so rock solid that you actually had the FBI coming to you, coming to your family, Natalee's family, saying, we are sorry to tell you this, but there has been a confession. One of these boys has confessed, and Natalee is no longer alive.
How do you pull something like that back off the table? Have you had or has your sister had or has anybody in the family had any explanation from Aruban officials whatever happened to this confession, where they buried it?
REYNOLDS: I am not aware of any follow-up information. You know, this seemed to disappear from sight, these confessions did.
At the time, we thought that because the investigation is kept secret, we thought it was ongoing, and maybe they just didn't want to release it officially at that time. But, as we see that the appeals, the hearings are showing there's no evidence, but yet we have these confessions, it doesn't make any sense. It's as if they are being hidden or taken away.
SCARBOROUGH: You know, you said—talked about June the 10th. That's when you all were told that the confession had been made, and you said that the family actually started a grieving process. What did the family do?
REYNOLDS: You know, grieving is—it's a difficult process. We were all notified. We exchanged phone calls, making sure everyone in the family was notified. I even had to tell my children, very upsetting to them, very upsetting to all of us.
SCARBOROUGH: Wait, Paul. Are you telling me, back on June the 10th, you told your children, based on the confession of one of these—these punks that took Natalee away from the bar, that Natalee was dead? This was over a month ago. You had to break it to your family, the entire family, Natalee's entire family, because of the confessions, knew that she was dead, and yet here we are over a month later, and they are still claiming they don't have enough evidence to nail these guys?
REYNOLDS: That's absolutely correct.
You know, the FBI had informed my sister based on the initial interrogations that that was their belief. That information was given to our family. And it's just—it's a very difficult thing to go through. Grieving should only be a process you have to go through one time.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8551822
Natalee Holloway's Uncle, Paul Reynolds penned a letter to the Editor and sent it to Amigoe, Aruba AM and Aruba Today. He was on MSNBC's Scarborough Country Tuesday night to discuss the letter and related topics.
Below is the unedited text of the letter.
Letter to the Editor
I have been reading Aruba AM, the English Aruban newspaper sent out over the internet. There appears to be a growing backlash against the Holloway family that I am very concerned about. I am sure the people in Aruba wish this investigation could be resolved as much as our family does.
The people in Aruba have been overwhelming supportive of our entire family since Natalie's disappearance. When I arrived on the Island two days after she was reported missing, I was always greeted with expressions of concern and hope for Natalie's return. There are hundreds if not thousands of stories of people coming together and helping each other during this incident. Bernadett from Economy Car Rental, the people at Holiday Inn, the Aruban Government Workers who left work to search the island are just a few of the examples. This is the good story of Aruba . The compassion and desire to help has meant more than you can imagine to our family.
Unfortunately, there are a very small number of individuals that are holding the people of Aruba , the Holloway family and what seems like the whole world hostage. These individuals are not a reflection of the Aruban people or the system of Justice in Aruba . These individuals know what happened and are refusing to accept responsibility for their actions. It also appears that certain individuals may be attempting to protect those individuals that know what happened. Helping them hide from their responsibility will destroy rather than preserve what is left of their lives, hopes and dreams.
The concerns that we have about the investigation are real. It began with the 10 day delay with taking the three original suspects into custody. My sister, Beth and her husband, Jug, arrived on the island the same day Natalie was reported missing. They were able to identify the three individuals she had last been seen with and report this to the police. The three suspects were briefly questioned and released. Their stories turned out to be false and their allegations led to the detainment of two innocent individuals. In a missing person case, every day is critical. Ten days would allow those individuals responsible time to hide evidence and coordinate their stories. What if the missing person was alive in those first few days? The failure to take those individuals into custody and seek evidence may have damaged this investigation beyond repair. Why was this done? Was it an attempt to cover up whatever happened and or protect those individuals involved?
Because the father of one of the suspects is a member of the Judicial system, there was immediate concern on behalf of the family that the investigation might not be fair and objective. The interest and presence of the FBI along with assurances from the US Government and the Prime Minister of Aruba reduced those concerns.
Actions since then have again increased concerns that the investigation is not being done in an objective manner. Why would you refuse assistance from the FBI in resolving a difficult case? Why would you hinder a private search team, composed of a group of volunteers whose director has experienced a similar loss of his own?
The release of two of the suspects is also a matter of concern.
Although the latest (third) story of one of the suspects places him alone with Natalie on the beach, the other two have admitted to lying. Is this not obstruction of justice, interfering with an investigation or conspiracy to cover up a crime? Aren't these illegal activities whether or not you are involved in the actual crime itself? How can these individuals be allowed to go free and possibly leave the country? Why would they lie unless they had knowledge of a crime either before or after the fact? Why would the father of one of the suspects tell all three that without a body, there is no crime?
As you can see, our many questions and concerns are about the investigation, not the Island or the people of Aruba . They are as much a victim of these individuals as we are. Please join us in our request to the Prime Minister of Aruba and the Dutch Authorities to launch an independent investigation of this matter and allow all of us to learn the truth, return Natalie to her home and go forward with our lives.
Respectfully yours,
Paul Reynolds
Natalie Holloway's Uncle
Wednesday, July 06, 2005 at 12:50 AM
http://www.riehlworldview(...)05/week27/index.html
Paul Reynolds
'Scarborough Country' for July 12
July 12, 2005
PAUL REYNOLDS, UNCLE OF NATALEE HOLLOWAY: i know that my sister had a meeting with the FBI June 10, Friday. And from that meeting, she became convinced that Natalee was no longer alive. She called her mother and told her that. And our family was—was—began the grieving process.
You know, we were told the report would come out the next day. Later that night, we saw the reports that confessions had been made, that something bad had happened. Shortly thereafter, it was retracted. The next morning, there was a report that said Natalee was confirmed dead. And these reports came from the deputy commissioner. They came from the spokesperson from the Ministry of Justice.
And then, all of a sudden, these statements and these confessions just disappeared.
SCARBOROUGH: And wait a second. I mean, these confessions were so rock solid that you actually had the FBI coming to you, coming to your family, Natalee's family, saying, we are sorry to tell you this, but there has been a confession. One of these boys has confessed, and Natalee is no longer alive.
How do you pull something like that back off the table? Have you had or has your sister had or has anybody in the family had any explanation from Aruban officials whatever happened to this confession, where they buried it?
REYNOLDS: I am not aware of any follow-up information. You know, this seemed to disappear from sight, these confessions did.
At the time, we thought that because the investigation is kept secret, we thought it was ongoing, and maybe they just didn't want to release it officially at that time. But, as we see that the appeals, the hearings are showing there's no evidence, but yet we have these confessions, it doesn't make any sense. It's as if they are being hidden or taken away.
SCARBOROUGH: You know, you said—talked about June the 10th. That's when you all were told that the confession had been made, and you said that the family actually started a grieving process. What did the family do?
REYNOLDS: You know, grieving is—it's a difficult process. We were all notified. We exchanged phone calls, making sure everyone in the family was notified. I even had to tell my children, very upsetting to them, very upsetting to all of us.
SCARBOROUGH: Wait, Paul. Are you telling me, back on June the 10th, you told your children, based on the confession of one of these—these punks that took Natalee away from the bar, that Natalee was dead? This was over a month ago. You had to break it to your family, the entire family, Natalee's entire family, because of the confessions, knew that she was dead, and yet here we are over a month later, and they are still claiming they don't have enough evidence to nail these guys?
REYNOLDS: That's absolutely correct.
You know, the FBI had informed my sister based on the initial interrogations that that was their belief. That information was given to our family. And it's just—it's a very difficult thing to go through. Grieving should only be a process you have to go through one time.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8551822
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
very interesting stuff this.quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 02:38 schreef NorthernStar het volgende:
[..]
Peter R. obviously chose the moment. I remember he said something about it along the lines that he could have gone on with the operation, well almost indefinitely. So yes the decision to end it and to bring it out in the open with the broadcast was deliberately chosen. Balkenende's visit could very well have been a factor in that discussion decision. But to what extent, I dont know.
My feeling is, and there are some indications that point in that direction, that Peter R. has done this in coordination with elements within the law enforcement and judiciary. He is well connected anyway so there would be contacts but it seems to me that there's a little more to it. The official story is that Patrick came out of the blue and offered his services to Peter, but is that what really happened? Or was this initiated and organized by elements within the law enforcement? It has also been suggested that Patrick's appearance was arranged by the organized crime. The boundaries between law enforcement and organized crime are probably a bit more murkier anyway on places like Aruba.
If Peter R. is working in coordination with "others" then who knows what will be taken into consideration in their decision making. What interests are in play.
Thats the problem imo, we know nothing about whats going on behind the scenes.
only thing i hope, because of very much at stake in Aruba - nobody will get hurt.
if there's unrest maybe Chavez thinks, lets take sides - i don't think it will be the side of The Netherlands.
mmm... i am going to check the Venezuelan blogs/forums i think.
they must have noticed at least something...
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door Caesu op 11-02-2008 07:05:13 ]
Dostojewski: "Je kunt je niet van je eigen gezond verstand overtuigen door je buurman op te sluiten."
Wim Dankbaar claims to have solved the JFK murder. He has his own site about this subject. Peter R. went to the USA together with Wim Dankbaar to make a program. Peter mentioned later that he was not too proud about the program.quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 05:23 schreef WallOfStars het volgende:
Oh just to clear something up
PrdV als claimed to have solved the JFK murder.
Didnt the guy in the car said: 'higher power" and Joran answered "higher powers"?"quote:I personaly think....Joran was very close to the truth in the car, Just that he switched the name of Daury with his dads the next day.....
Hope some day all 20+ hours of tape come out to see the raw un edited version of his "confessions"
02 - 10 - 2008 / 8:45 p.m. (G.M.T.)
What's Joran's parents' case?
A few weeks ago, the parents of Joran van der Sloot appeared with me in the Dutch talk show Pauw & Witteman. They asserted that Joran was a boy with a good upbringing, who always treated girls with respect. They also stated that if they had any indication that Joran was indeed involved in the disappearance of Natalee, they would have gone to the police immediately.
- BORDERING ON NAÏVITÉ -
On this occasion, Joran’s mother – who was in the Netherlands at the time of Natalee’s disappearance – gave me the impression of a kind, honest woman, who loves her son dearly, but has no idea about what really made him tick. However, even naïveté has its limits, which I feel she should have reached after watching our program.
Especially in the USA, Joran’s father is seen as someone who knows more about the case than he is willing to let on. He was indeed on Aruba at the time of the disappearance, and later advised his son not to say anything to the police during questioning. According to Joran, his father has devoted himself to filing compensation claims.
In conversations recorded by us, Joran expressly denies that his father was involved in Natalee’s disappearance. However, many see his assertion that on the night in question, his ‘helper’ urged him to ‘get home quickly because he had to go to school the next day’, as an indication that his father could indeed be involved.
- SMUGGLED MOBILE PHONE -
There is also something else that Joran admitted to Patrick in some detail. He said that when visiting him in custody after his initial arrest, his father Paul van der Sloot, who was a Judge at the time, smuggled a mobile phone to his son. The story comes across as highly plausible, and implies an unforgivable transgression by the Judge/attorney.
This story, casually related by Joran, could understandably cast Joran’s parents’ role in a very different light from what they would have liked us to believe during Pauw & Witteman. It is, after all, in their best interests that everything Joran has stated be dismissed as fabrications. Any veracity afforded to Joran’s statements will effectively also ‘hang’ his father for smuggling the mobile phone into the prison. In that case, he would undoubtedly be disbarred as an attorney, with his reputation in Aruba in tatters. Until recently, the parents enjoyed a reasonably respected position on the island. That reputation will be history, should it be verified that Paul van der Sloot deliberately sabotaged the investigation into the disappearance that has caused Aruba so much damage.
- REPORTING TO THE POLICE -
If the parents’ earlier pronouncements were in earnest, one would expect that following our program – during which their son admits his involvement no fewer than ten times – they would confront their son saying: ‘enough is enough. We are going to the police and you will tell them everything that happened. You will not reserve your right to remain silent for another instant.’
This did not occur, however. Instead, Joran issued a statement through his attorney, saying that all his pronouncements were made while under the influence of marijuana joints and that his litany of admissions is a bizarre fabrication. Surely the parents must realize that this is a cheap attempt at a cop-out, that actually also works to the benefit of father Paul. If everything is a fabrication, then so is the story about the mobile phone. Contrarily, if everything is in fact true, it will undoubtedly be assumed that the story about the smuggled mobile phone is true as well, with appropriate consequences.
- NO SMOKE WITHOUT FIRE -
Anyone who has done any thinking, or has themselves smoked marijuana, must surely realize that Joran’s story about the joints just doesn’t hold water. During the course of five separate drives, on different days – sometimes separated by more than a week – Joran made extensive confessions. His confession was confirmed and repeated during each subsequent drive. Not once did he say that last time, while under the influence of marijuana, he had been sprouting a lot of hot air. On the contrary. ‘Coincidentally’, the bulk of his admissions fall perfectly in line with the vein of the earlier police investigation, and in them, Joran provides answers to several open-ended questions (how he got home, what he did with his shoes, the involvement of the Kalpoe brothers etc. etc.).
Furthermore, I have to point out that there were several drives during which he either DID NOT smoke marijuana, or only did so AFTER discussing Natalee’s case. The TV footage shows this quite clearly. He made and/or repeated confessions even while he was ‘as sober as a Judge’. Or does Joran now allege that when Patrick came to pick him up him at around noon, he had already got stoned sitting on his grandma’s sofa?
- CONFESSION COMPULSION? -
But even if he was already stoned – which I don’t believe – the question remains whether he would suddenly start to confess to all manner of bizarre crimes of which he is actually innocent? Or would the parents and grandma now like us to believe that he was in the daily habit of confessing to unsolved murders each time he rolled a reefer??? Of course not. A marijuana joint does not have that effect at all. If it did, the corridors of police stations in the Netherlands and elsewhere would be chock-full of marijuana users, spontaneously confessing to all manner of unsolved crimes. That is, of course, not the case. Joran’s story is untenable. In my opinion It's simply the only excuse he could think of to explain his constant confessions – an explanation that suits his parents just fine. After all, it is now also in their best interests….
Peter R. DeVries
http://www.peterrdevries.com/news-parents-joran.htm
What's Joran's parents' case?
A few weeks ago, the parents of Joran van der Sloot appeared with me in the Dutch talk show Pauw & Witteman. They asserted that Joran was a boy with a good upbringing, who always treated girls with respect. They also stated that if they had any indication that Joran was indeed involved in the disappearance of Natalee, they would have gone to the police immediately.
- BORDERING ON NAÏVITÉ -
On this occasion, Joran’s mother – who was in the Netherlands at the time of Natalee’s disappearance – gave me the impression of a kind, honest woman, who loves her son dearly, but has no idea about what really made him tick. However, even naïveté has its limits, which I feel she should have reached after watching our program.
Especially in the USA, Joran’s father is seen as someone who knows more about the case than he is willing to let on. He was indeed on Aruba at the time of the disappearance, and later advised his son not to say anything to the police during questioning. According to Joran, his father has devoted himself to filing compensation claims.
In conversations recorded by us, Joran expressly denies that his father was involved in Natalee’s disappearance. However, many see his assertion that on the night in question, his ‘helper’ urged him to ‘get home quickly because he had to go to school the next day’, as an indication that his father could indeed be involved.
- SMUGGLED MOBILE PHONE -
There is also something else that Joran admitted to Patrick in some detail. He said that when visiting him in custody after his initial arrest, his father Paul van der Sloot, who was a Judge at the time, smuggled a mobile phone to his son. The story comes across as highly plausible, and implies an unforgivable transgression by the Judge/attorney.
This story, casually related by Joran, could understandably cast Joran’s parents’ role in a very different light from what they would have liked us to believe during Pauw & Witteman. It is, after all, in their best interests that everything Joran has stated be dismissed as fabrications. Any veracity afforded to Joran’s statements will effectively also ‘hang’ his father for smuggling the mobile phone into the prison. In that case, he would undoubtedly be disbarred as an attorney, with his reputation in Aruba in tatters. Until recently, the parents enjoyed a reasonably respected position on the island. That reputation will be history, should it be verified that Paul van der Sloot deliberately sabotaged the investigation into the disappearance that has caused Aruba so much damage.
- REPORTING TO THE POLICE -
If the parents’ earlier pronouncements were in earnest, one would expect that following our program – during which their son admits his involvement no fewer than ten times – they would confront their son saying: ‘enough is enough. We are going to the police and you will tell them everything that happened. You will not reserve your right to remain silent for another instant.’
This did not occur, however. Instead, Joran issued a statement through his attorney, saying that all his pronouncements were made while under the influence of marijuana joints and that his litany of admissions is a bizarre fabrication. Surely the parents must realize that this is a cheap attempt at a cop-out, that actually also works to the benefit of father Paul. If everything is a fabrication, then so is the story about the mobile phone. Contrarily, if everything is in fact true, it will undoubtedly be assumed that the story about the smuggled mobile phone is true as well, with appropriate consequences.
- NO SMOKE WITHOUT FIRE -
Anyone who has done any thinking, or has themselves smoked marijuana, must surely realize that Joran’s story about the joints just doesn’t hold water. During the course of five separate drives, on different days – sometimes separated by more than a week – Joran made extensive confessions. His confession was confirmed and repeated during each subsequent drive. Not once did he say that last time, while under the influence of marijuana, he had been sprouting a lot of hot air. On the contrary. ‘Coincidentally’, the bulk of his admissions fall perfectly in line with the vein of the earlier police investigation, and in them, Joran provides answers to several open-ended questions (how he got home, what he did with his shoes, the involvement of the Kalpoe brothers etc. etc.).
Furthermore, I have to point out that there were several drives during which he either DID NOT smoke marijuana, or only did so AFTER discussing Natalee’s case. The TV footage shows this quite clearly. He made and/or repeated confessions even while he was ‘as sober as a Judge’. Or does Joran now allege that when Patrick came to pick him up him at around noon, he had already got stoned sitting on his grandma’s sofa?
- CONFESSION COMPULSION? -
But even if he was already stoned – which I don’t believe – the question remains whether he would suddenly start to confess to all manner of bizarre crimes of which he is actually innocent? Or would the parents and grandma now like us to believe that he was in the daily habit of confessing to unsolved murders each time he rolled a reefer??? Of course not. A marijuana joint does not have that effect at all. If it did, the corridors of police stations in the Netherlands and elsewhere would be chock-full of marijuana users, spontaneously confessing to all manner of unsolved crimes. That is, of course, not the case. Joran’s story is untenable. In my opinion It's simply the only excuse he could think of to explain his constant confessions – an explanation that suits his parents just fine. After all, it is now also in their best interests….
Peter R. DeVries
http://www.peterrdevries.com/news-parents-joran.htm
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
No I agree. My comment was was only about the question if they have the means. They probably do, and so do the Dutch, but we wont hear about it anyway. Not at this stage at least. Its no little matter if PVDS actually has done this. Thats a whole new scandal right there. And serious enough for the highest circles to get involved.quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 06:17 schreef observer777 het volgende:
[..]
The FBI may have the tools to Investigate,but they will not get involved unless the Arubans ask them to pertaining to crimes that happened in Aruba. Trust me on this.
If it is true he's done. He will lose everything.quote:Also Rudy Croes and Jossy Mansur spoke out the other day and said they will look into Jorans cell phone use in the KIA. If it is true,they may kick PVDS off of the Govt Prison Committee,Hospital and whatever other committees he is on. There was a article about that on SM FP.
this connects to Maurice de Hond and Ernest Louwes.quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 07:40 schreef kinkajoe het volgende:
[..]
Wim Dankbaar claims to have solved the JFK murder. He has his own site about this subject. Peter R. went to the USA together with Wim Dankbaar to make a program. Peter mentioned later that he was not too proud about the program.
Peter R. says Louwes is rightfully convicted.
Maurice and Wim Dankbaar think he is innocent
Wim Dankbaar hacked into Peter R. mailbox and the police searched Maurice house and took copies of his hard disks.
i don't read Maurice site but i think he might be be bashing Peter R. because of the Louwes case.
http://www.maurice.nl/
Dostojewski: "Je kunt je niet van je eigen gezond verstand overtuigen door je buurman op te sluiten."
Dutch Cameraman and a Reporter are on the Persistence. This is todays update!
The Persistence will be on the Greta show tomorrow evening . Tim spent the day aboard the boat yesterday and so far all is a go! This is great. They are out today and the dutch news guys I am told are getting sick over the rail.... about 12 foot seas.... John said they are not doing well... I hope this doesn't deter them from helping!
XVII. Support the Effort
Special Notice:
The dedicated ocean search for Natalee Holloway has been underway since mid-November, 2007. What began in Louisiana during mobilization now culminating in Aruba, the search has utilized some of the best search equipment and personnel in the world. To date, approximately 900 miles of sonar data has been collected covering a geographic area 80% the size of Aruba. The search has required a painstakingly slow approach which in the end leaves no stone unturned.
Although slow, this approach is extremely effective in marine search and recovery. Since the beginning, the search has been privately funded by Louis Schaefer Jr. of Underwater Expeditions who remarkably and gracefully accepted the financial burden when requested by Texas Equusearch and Natalee's parents. John Silvetti of Marine Surveys, Greg Landry of Offshore Innovative Solutions, Erik McGuire of Seatronics, along with Agiosat and Wilkens Weather Service came beside Louis to conduct this humanitarian effort. To put this search effort in financial perspective, an equivalent search conducted for industry would involve costs well exceeding several million dollars. This project has been conducted for about 35 cents on the dollar, with costs still exceeding a million dollars.
Although we have searched and ruled out an extensive portion of the original planned search area, a substantial portion of the high-probability area yet remains to be explored. Now, following a publicly confirmed admission that Natalee Holloway was disposed at sea, we are confident that completing the focused search area will bring closure. We therefore formally invite and request anyone who this humanitarian effort has touched to get involved and to help support the remaining search efforts. Donations are being handled by Texas Equusearch, a 501 (c) (3) nonprofit organization. Please come beside those who have already given so much to help ensure a proper funeral in Alabama for Natalee Holloway. Please make all donations marked as: "Holloway search".
To learn more about Texas Equusearch and to help support the search for Natalee Holloway, check out: http://www.texasequusearch.org/donate.html
Texas EquuSearch Office:
4013 FM 517, Suite B
Dickinson, Texas 77539
P. O. Box 395, Dickinson, Texas 77539
Office: (281) 309-9500
Fax: (281) 534-6719
Toll Free: (877) 270-9500
Email: donate@texasequusearch.org
http://nholloway.blogspot.com/
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
The disagreement between Dankbaar and Peter R. started earlier I think. The hacking of the e-mails was because of the DMZ. Peter was not allowed to give his opinion about the DMZ. There were more computers hacked (even from lawyers) in the same period.quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 08:37 schreef Caesu het volgende:
[sub]this connects to Maurice de Hond and Ernest Louwes.
Peter R. says Louwes is rightfully convicted.
Maurice and Wim Dankbaar think he is innocent
Wim Dankbaar hacked into Peter R. mailbox and the police searched Maurice house and took copies of his hard disks.
i don't read Maurice site but i think he might be be bashing Peter R. because of the Louwes case.
This is off topic but there are 21 parts on this forum about DMZ with links etc. etc.
Exactly the same happens in the Holloway case (bashing Nathalee and her family) as what happened in the DMZ.
If you think someone is innocent there is no need to hack computers
and there is also no need to intimidate citizens.
Observer 777,
Don't you think there is more chance on the island?
I hope you'r write, but I think there is more change to find evidence on the island.
Don't you think there is more chance on the island?
I hope you'r write, but I think there is more change to find evidence on the island.
Yep Maurice and his comrades where furious with Peter R. because he wouldnt go along with their theories. Maurice et al where orchestrating a big media campaign trying to change public opinion about the suspect -even multiple times convicted- Ernst Louwes. Along comes Peter R. who had already looked into the case earlier and states he wont change his opinion about Louwes. This infuriates Maurice et al because Peter R.'s word carries alot of clout and he is considered impartial. Major spoiler for Maurice his party.quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 09:22 schreef kinkajoe het volgende:
[..]
The disagreement between Dankbaar and Peter R. started earlier I think. The hacking of the e-mails was because of the DMZ. Peter was not allowed to give his opinion about the DMZ. There were more computers hacked (even from lawyers) in the same period.
This is off topic but there are 21 parts on this forum about DMZ with links etc. etc.
Exactly the same happens in the Holloway case (bashing Nathalee and her family) as what happened in the DMZ.
If you think someone is innocent there is no need to hack computers
I am convinced all the evidence was destroyed back in May/June 2005. To seek the truth you have to go back to that time as since then everything has been in the wrong direction. I don't think there is any evidence anymore except if they can locate Natalee,it is crucial they find her! To solve this case someone has to speak up or the wall of this cover up has to come down. I haven't seen even a incling of either happening. To be honest I haven't seen anything go right for Natalee since she dissapeared but I hope the recent events have given the public a glimpse of the truth and that they demand answers in Aruba. She deserves a honest Investigation for once and so do the Aruban people,the people that were in charge of the initial Investigation need to be interrogated or this case may never be solved.quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 09:35 schreef kinkajoe het volgende:
Observer 777,
Don't you think there is more chance on the island?
I hope you'r write, but I think there is more change to find evidence on the island.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
I have a feeling this will be a very big week..Everyone please say a special prayer for Natalee
Natalee Holloway - Have You Seen Her
http://youtube.com/watch?v=z5T9oUoQBbk
[ Bericht 8% gewijzigd door observer777 op 11-02-2008 09:59:41 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
I fully agree with that! One of the most important things to do is to go back to where it started and to find out were, when and why things went in de wrong direction.quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 09:54 schreef observer777 het volgende:
I am convinced all the evidence was destroyed back in May/June 2005. To seek the truth you have to go back to that time as since then everything has been in the wrong direction.
Maurice is remarkable quiet about the Van der Sloot-scandal.quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 09:51 schreef NorthernStar het volgende:
[..]
Yep Maurice and his comrades where furious with Peter R. because he wouldnt go along with their theories. Maurice et al where orchestrating a big media campaign trying to change public opinion about the suspect -even multiple times convicted- Ernst Louwes. Along comes Peter R. who had already looked into the case earlier and states he wont change his opinion about Louwes. This infuriates Maurice et al because Peter R.'s word carries alot of clout and he is considered impartial. Major spoiler for Maurice his party.
i did look at his site. he isn't negative at all.
in other words he realizes he shoudn't even attempt to embarras himself this time.
Dostojewski: "Je kunt je niet van je eigen gezond verstand overtuigen door je buurman op te sluiten."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ko3XpZOBod0&feature=related
This video is from 30 nov 2006 where Beth says Joran had confessed to interrogators that he raped Natalee? Is this true?
This video is from 30 nov 2006 where Beth says Joran had confessed to interrogators that he raped Natalee? Is this true?
WEB / [HaxBall #64] Jos is God
Arguing on the Internet is like running in the Special Olympics.
Arguing on the Internet is like running in the Special Olympics.
Observer 777,quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 12:24 schreef -jos- het volgende:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ko3XpZOBod0&feature=related
This video is from 30 nov 2006 where Beth says Joran had confessed to interrogators that he raped Natalee? Is this true?
Do you have the confession that Nathalee's mother claims to have in which Joran confessed dat he raped Nathalee at the house?
Do I hear this right? The K-brothers on a video with a 14-year old? Nobody does anything against it?
This is OK on Aruba?
Laat ik dat nou zien gebeuren hierquote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 01:43 schreef NorthernStar het volgende:
[..]
sow doubts and confusion, trying to influence public opinion, and when public opinion has sufficiently been molded, try to use public opinion as their own tool in exerting pressure unto the authorities.
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
Ik denk zeker dat bij veel mensen de motivatie in het begin wel zuiver was; bij m.n. onze Amerikaanse vrienden zie je nu gaandeweg dat ook andere motieven een rol spelen. Afkeer tegen overheden en een zekere tendentie om in complotten en cover-ups te denken. Afkeer tegen liberals. Zelfs een beetje xenofobie (?).quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 13:16 schreef BwennieBren het volgende:
[..]
Laat ik dat nou zien gebeuren hier
I´m back.
Een beetje?quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 13:32 schreef Ryan3 het volgende:
[..]
Ik denk zeker dat bij veel mensen de motivatie in het begin wel zuiver was; bij m.n. onze Amerikaanse vrienden zie je nu gaandeweg dat ook andere motieven een rol spelen. Afkeer tegen overheden en een zekere tendentie om in complotten en cover-ups te denken. Afkeer tegen liberals. Zelfs een beetje xenofobie (?).
Zeg maar gerust: genoeg. Ik word eerlijk gezegd een beetje moe van bepaalde aannames die bij onze Amerikaanse vrienden van SM (laat ik het maar een naam geven) spelen. M.i. gaat het allemaal een beetje te ver. Maar goed, er zijn altijd lezers die ervan smullen natuurlijk.
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
Kennelijk stoort het je erg dat er mensen zijn die het allemaal maar raar vinden, die bekentenis van Joran in combinatie met zijn voorgeschiedenis.quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 13:45 schreef BwennieBren het volgende:
[..]
Een beetje?
Nathalee is wel verdwenen na te zijn vertrokken met Joran en vrienden.
Heb ik het hier over Joranquote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 13:51 schreef kinkajoe het volgende:
[..]
Kennelijk stoort het je erg dat er mensen zijn die het allemaal maar raar vinden, die bekentenis van Joran in combinatie met zijn voorgeschiedenis.
Nathalee is wel verdwenen na te zijn vertrokken met Joran en vrienden.
Als ik geintereseerd ben hoe mensen over bepaalde dingen denken in deze zaak dan zoek ik als het even kan altijd even terug, jij niet? Kan het wel begrijpen hoor, zal best teveel moeite zijn. He?quote:Op woensdag 6 februari 2008 13:54 schreef BwennieBren het volgende:
[..]
Hi observer777,
Do I come from an Anti-Beth site? No, not that I know of, is FOK an anti-Beth site? I suppose that you are posting on the wrong forum then
FYI make no mistake, I think Joran and his father are scum and lying mofu's. However, I don't agree completely with the actions of the family of Natalee, the Aruban boycot for example, yep, imo a BS action. In this I agree with Scorpie. Also, it didn't help the case any further.
<knip>
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
Ik ben pas sinds de berichten van Johan 555 en de uitzending bij Paul en Witteman geinteresseerd geraakt.quote:[
Als ik geintereseerd ben hoe mensen over bepaalde dingen denken in deze zaak dan zoek ik als het even kan altijd even terug, jij niet? Kan het wel begrijpen hoor, zal best teveel moeite zijn. He?
Ook ik denk niet dat half Aruba in het complot zit, maar sluit het (vooralsnog) ook niet uit.
Vandaar ook dat ik Observer vraag of hij een verklaring kan laten zien waarin Joran bekent dat hij Nathalee heeft verkracht in dat huis. Als het waar is wat in dat fimpje gezegd wordt, moet het niet zo'n probleem zijn die verklaringen op Internet te zetten.
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door kinkajoe op 11-02-2008 14:26:15 ]
Die verklaring is m.i. alleen maar gebaseerd op de verklaring van Joran dd 14 juni 2005 dat ze naar het huis van Joran zijn gereden.quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 14:17 schreef kinkajoe het volgende:
[..]
Ik ben pas sinds de berichten van Johan 555 en de uitzending bij Paul en Witteman geinteresseerd geraakt.
Ook ik denk niet dat half Aruba in het complot zit, maar sluit het (vooralsnog) ook niet uit.
Vandaar ook dat ik Observer vraag of hij een verklaring kan laten zien waarin Joran bekent dat hij Nathalee heeft verkracht in dat huis. Als het waar is wat in dat fimpje gezegd wordt, moet het niet zo'n probleem zijn die verklaringen op Internet te zetten.
laatste alinea
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
@ BwennieBren,
Dus ze gingen volgens Joran "even stoppen voor het huis van Joran" met de auto van Deepak.
Vreemd, maar geen bekentenis van een verkrachting in dat huis.
Als de Amerikaanse TV beweert dat ze een verklaring hebben dat Joran etc. etc., zullen ze die ook moeten kunnen laten zien. Je kunt wel van alles gaan roepen.
Misschien komt Observer777 of iemand van Scared Monkeys later nog met zo'n verklaring.
Dus ze gingen volgens Joran "even stoppen voor het huis van Joran" met de auto van Deepak.
Vreemd, maar geen bekentenis van een verkrachting in dat huis.
Als de Amerikaanse TV beweert dat ze een verklaring hebben dat Joran etc. etc., zullen ze die ook moeten kunnen laten zien. Je kunt wel van alles gaan roepen.
Misschien komt Observer777 of iemand van Scared Monkeys later nog met zo'n verklaring.
En DAT bedoel ik dus... vooralsnog zijn er niet veel werkelijke bewijzen snap je?quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 14:59 schreef kinkajoe het volgende:
@ BwennieBren,
Dus ze gingen volgens Joran "even stoppen voor het huis van Joran" met de auto van Deepak.
Vreemd, maar geen bekentenis van een verkrachting in dat huis.
Als de Amerikaanse TV beweert dat ze een verklaring hebben dat Joran etc. etc., zullen ze die ook moeten kunnen laten zien. Je kunt wel van alles gaan roepen.
Misschien komt Observer777 of iemand van Scared Monkeys later nog met zo'n verklaring.
Overigens las ik in de verklaring van Deepak Kalpoe dd 13 juli 2005 (pagina 4)
Natalee zou gezien zijn door een van haar familileden samen met Joran in de middag van 13 juli?
De camerabeelden die er van Joran en Natalee zijn, zijn van het Excelsior Casino in het Holliday Inn hotel en niet van het Wyndham Casino.
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
i asked maurice to join the tropic
Wanneer domme mensen domme dingen beweren, dan moet je ze niet corrigeren, maar glimlachend gelijk geven.
Nee, als de Twitty's met vrienden en PVDS bij de Wyndham gaan kijken (joran zat daar in een tournament) zegt één van de medewerksters dat ze de foto van Natalee herkend als iemand die samen met een lange jongen daar 'smiddags zou zijn geweest. Dat is volgens mij 31/05/2005... Maar er zijn verder geen meldingen meer over, dus kon e.e.a. niet bevestigd worden, denk ik...quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 15:29 schreef BwennieBren het volgende:
[..]
En DAT bedoel ik dus... vooralsnog zijn er niet veel werkelijke bewijzen snap je?
Overigens las ik in de verklaring van Deepak Kalpoe dd 13 juli 2005 (pagina 4)
[ afbeelding ]
Natalee zou gezien zijn door een van haar familileden samen met Joran in de middag van 13 juli?
De camerabeelden die er van Joran en Natalee zijn, zijn van het Excelsior Casino in het Holliday Inn hotel en niet van het Wyndham Casino.
Uit het verhoor van PVDS op 23/06/2005:
I asked him where he was and the told me he was at the “Wyndham”. That he was at the “Wyndham” did not surprise me at that moment. He was supposed to be playing in the “Free tournament” there. That could also be a clue that I indeed did not see him after I had dropped him off at the “Racquet Club”. I told him that people wanted to talk to him with regard to a girl that had gone missing and that I would come to where he was. I then got into the police-car and the whole group drove over to the “Wyndham”. I walked towards the casino that was locking up. I could not see Joran there and I again called him on his mobile phone. He answered and told me that he was at home now.
To your question whether I told Joran who were with me, I can state the following. I cannot remember whether I did.
A few people in the group showed the picture of the missing woman to several members of staff at the casino. At least one of the women said that she had seen the girl a few hours earlier in the company of a tall boy. Serious discussions took place but I suggested that we should go to my house again because that was where Joran had gone to.
To your question whether, in front of the casino, I had mistakenly thought someone was Joran and pointe him out, I can state the following. I cannot remember whether I did. Maybe I did see a tall boy and from a distance mistook him for Joran and walked into that direction.
I once again entered the police car and the whole group followed me to my house. When we arrived there I found Joran together with Deepak, leaning against the car. I asked Joran why he did not stay at the Wyndham and he said that he must have misunderstood
This statement is about May 31, when the family arrived and met Deepak and Joran at the VDS home. The casino they are talking about is the security tape of Natalee and Joran playing blackjack on the same table. This is to my knowledge not the Wyndham Casino but the HI Casino.quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 15:29 schreef BwennieBren het volgende:
Natalee zou gezien zijn door een van haar familileden samen met Joran in de middag van 13 juli?
De camerabeelden die er van Joran en Natalee zijn, zijn van het Excelsior Casino in het Holliday Inn hotel en niet van het Wyndham Casino.
Joran did play in Wyndham on Monday though. Could be a mixup.
Where facts are few, experts are many.
Ik word een beetje moe van die meningen die als feiten gebracht worden.
I liked it. I was good at it. It made me feel alive.
Wat jij zegt.quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 17:02 schreef Harajuku. het volgende:
Ik word een beetje moe van die meningen die als feiten gebracht worden.
Was just watching pieces of tape again and saw the following. Joran mentioned in the car tapes that he only knew/has been with Natalee for 2 days, then correcting himself by saying "oh 1 day, I met her that day". This actually gives the idea that he was not yet finished disposing her on the first night and he got busy with it again the day after? Bah, sometimes I wished it would be just a scary movie and soon we will see the end of it
Where facts are few, experts are many.
Aha, thanxquote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 16:25 schreef kabouterjong het volgende:
[..]
Nee, als de Twitty's met vrienden en PVDS bij de Wyndham gaan kijken (joran zat daar in een tournament) zegt één van de medewerksters dat ze de foto van Natalee herkend als iemand die samen met een lange jongen daar 'smiddags zou zijn geweest. Dat is volgens mij 31/05/2005... Maar er zijn verder geen meldingen meer over, dus kon e.e.a. niet bevestigd worden, denk ik...
<knip>
foto dus.... hoewel in het verslag staat "camera van het Wyndham"
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
Yes indeed the Excelsior Casino in the Holliday Innquote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 16:32 schreef Atreidez het volgende:
[..]
This statement is about May 31, when the family arrived and met Deepak and Joran at the VDS home. The casino they are talking about is the security tape of Natalee and Joran playing blackjack on the same table. This is to my knowledge not the Wyndham Casino but the HI Casino.
Joran did play in Wyndham on Monday though. Could be a mixup.
I know this statement is about May 31, but I read it differently, my bad.
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
Give me a minute...quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 17:02 schreef Harajuku. het volgende:
Ik word een beetje moe van die meningen die als feiten gebracht worden.
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
Jij denkt dat het voeren van een discussie op een forum tot doel heeft de publieke opinie te beinvloeden?quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 13:16 schreef BwennieBren het volgende:
[..]
Laat ik dat nou zien gebeuren hier
Ok...
Waarom moet er steeds geprobeerd worden de discussie af te leiden van het onderwerp naar naastliggende dingen als bijvoorbeeld de discussievoerders zelf? Het is zooo vermoeiend. Ga je dan uitleven in R&P ofzo. Daar is misschien wel iemand die op je projecties zit te wachten. Mijn hemel, wat een gepijpzeik zeg.
Ach comeon zeg, jij weet best wel waarom ik dat stukje gequote hebt van jou. Ik leid de discussie in het geheel niet af van het onderwerp, sommige verhalen hier daarentegen wel en die zijn veel te ver gezocht. En ik ben blijbaar niet de enige die er zo over denkt. Ik ga alleen uit van de verklaringen die bekend zijn en niet van aannames, laten we wel zijn.quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 18:55 schreef NorthernStar het volgende:
[..]
Jij denkt dat het voeren van een discussie op een forum tot doel heeft de publieke opinie te beinvloeden?
Ok...
Waarom moet er steeds geprobeerd worden de discussie af te leiden van het onderwerp naar naastliggende dingen als bijvoorbeeld de discussievoerders zelf? Het is zooo vermoeiend. Ga je dan uitleven in R&P ofzo. Daar is misschien wel iemand die op je projecties zit te wachten. Mijn hemel, wat een gepijpzeik zeg.
En in R&P kom ik nooit en pijpzeiken is lekker.
Well this an example...quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 12:24 schreef -jos- het volgende:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ko3XpZOBod0&feature=related
This video is from 30 nov 2006 where Beth says Joran had confessed to interrogators that he raped Natalee? Is this true?
Rape is not a crime within the Dutch Government?
Do not travel to Aruba or the Dutch territories?
Was that necessary to say?
So:
1. There is a porno tape from the Kalpoe brother with a 14-year old girl? Where is that tape and who'd seen it?
In one of the statements of Deepak/Kalpoe it is stated that during the ride on May 30th, 2005 with Natalee they played a porno tape in the car??
2. Beth stated she had seen 5 statements from Joran.
Actually there are 7:
On June 6, 2005
On June 10, 2005
On June 13, 2005
On June 14, 2005
On June 18, 2005 (2 statements)
On June 24, 2005
That being said, so according to the dissapeared statements (so I've read)
3. Joran is heaving sex with Natalee (in his home?) See my post above of statement of Joran dated 14 june 2005, that they went to his home)
Here is a statement of Joran, dated June 14, 2005 (page 3) saying: "wij hadden droog sex met elkaar gedaan. Ik lag op het zand en zij kwam op mij zitten en zij deed net alsof wij sex aan het doen waren", {Transl: We had dry sex with each other. I was lying on the sand she she was sitting on me and pretended like we were having sex.)
3. Natalee went in and out consiousness
Statement Joran dated June 9, 2005 (page 11): "Driving past the front of the Marriot Hotel Natalee half fell asleep/half dozed off. After that she startled awake* and I asked her if she was OK."
Statement Joran dated June 14, 2005 (page 14): "Natalee was still asleep"
and in earlier statements of also Deepak and Satish Natalee fell asleep in the car when they arrived at the lighthouse (the statements where all of them lied that the dropped Natalee off at the Holiday Inn)
Deepak statement dated June 9, 2005 (page 7)
Satish statement dated June 11, 2005 (page 7)
Deepak statement dated June 29, 2005 (page 3)
According to :
See: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159252,00.htmlquote:You know, we were told the report would come out the next day. Later that night, we saw the reports that confessions had been made, that something bad had happened. Shortly thereafter, it was retracted. The next morning, there was a report that said Natalee was confirmed dead. And these reports came from the deputy commissioner. They came from the spokesperson from the Ministry of Justice.
And then, all of a sudden, these statements and these confessions just disappeared.
Here is a statement of Deepak dated 11 june 2005 (last page):
"I think he raped her and is afraid to say so".
Here is a statement of Joran dated June 13, 2005 saying Natalee was raped by Deepak and did something to Natalee
So in other words, from every statement you can make up a story...
Ook aannemelijk toch?
Ja? Nee?
Nou, zoiets dus...
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door BwennieBren op 11-02-2008 19:46:11 ]
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
yes! slip of the tongue or something else...?quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 17:30 schreef Atreidez het volgende:
Was just watching pieces of tape again and saw the following. Joran mentioned in the car tapes that he only knew/has been with Natalee for 2 days, then correcting himself by saying "oh 1 day, I met her that day". This actually gives the idea that he was not yet finished disposing her on the first night and he got busy with it again the day after? Bah, sometimes I wished it would be just a scary movie and soon we will see the end of it
2 days or a few hours makes a big difference.
this is whole thing is such a nasty trainwreck
i can't help but think it's a massive house of cards with proportions beyond believe.
Joran is just one of the cards supporting the structure...
Dostojewski: "Je kunt je niet van je eigen gezond verstand overtuigen door je buurman op te sluiten."
-----------------------------------------------quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 17:30 schreef Atreidez het volgende:
Was just watching pieces of tape again and saw the following. Joran mentioned in the car tapes that he only knew/has been with Natalee for 2 days, then correcting himself by saying "oh 1 day, I met her that day". This actually gives the idea that he was not yet finished disposing her on the first night and he got busy with it again the day after? Bah, sometimes I wished it would be just a scary movie and soon we will
see the end of it
That very well could be true. As I said before when Natalee's Family arrived at the VDS house,Deepaks car was gone but was spotted just shortly before in the sloot property. PVDS came out of the house after 10 minutes of sirens and honking with a cell phone already in hand. PVDS called Anita's phone which Joran was using and he said he was playing poker at the Wyndham I believe. They all drove to the casino and he wasn't there. PVDS talked to him again and him and Deepak were waiting at the VDS house. Later the Family found out he was never at that Casino and he never played tennis,koen lied about that. The boys were dirty and sweaty and did not look like they were in a casino at all. What were they doing?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
This website does a decent job of theorizing what happened the next day,PVDS going to the bank,Joran playing tennis and at the Wyndham. None of those events happened I do not think.
IN THE FACE OF EVIL
What was going on between 7:00 pm and 8:30 pm?
We believe this is when Paulus and Joran took Miss Holloway's remains out to sea on the Gottenbos boat. Here Joran sets himself up to be highly visible that night after 8:00 pm .
Part 3 detailed the most likely movements of Paulus van der Sloot during this time, and here now are Joran's activities for this timeframe.
JORAN SAYS TENNIS LESSON ENDED AT 7:00, HE SHOWERED AND THEN CALLED ANDRE ANDRE AGREES TO MEET HIM AT 8:00 AT THE WYNDHAM
Approximately 19.00 pm, I was ready with playing tennis. I showered in the clubhouse. After I had finised showering I got dressed. Then I called "Andre". We had agreed that we would meet at the Wyndham Hotel at approximately 20.00 pm to play poker.
JVDS 6-14
JORAN SAYS HE ALSO CALLS GUIDO AND ASKS HIM TO GO TO THE WYNDHAM GUIDO DECLINES SAYING HE HAS TO WORK, BUT MIGHT COME LATER
Approximately 19.00 pm, I was ready with playing tennis. I had then also called Guido. Guido had told me that he had to go to work. He would come later and try to enter the tournament for half time
JVDS 6-14
According to Paulus, this conversation took place in person, not over the phone. What then was the true nature of this phone call from Joran to Paulus at around 7:00 pm?
Giving confirmation that the boat was at the launch and ready to go?
JORAN SAYS HE THEN CALLED PAULUS TO ASK PERMISSION TO GO TO THE WYNDHAM TO GAMBLE
Approximately 19.00 pm, I was ready with playing tennis. I showered in the clubhouse. After I had finised showering I got dressed. I had also called my father and asked if I could play poker at the Wyndham Casino. My father gave me permission.
JVDS 6-14
Then we have Joran claiming to have been bouncing from one casino to the next for the hour of 7:00 - 8:00 pm
http://nataleesfreebirds.(...)-may-30-2005_19.html
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This is interesting reading and if you hear Juniors accounts he says he saw PVDS and the boys dumping Natalees body at the Landfill. A lot of suspicious activity took place there and continious attempts were made on impeding the efforts of the searchers. Eventually they made them get a permit to search,blamed a fire on them and then filled all the holes up ending weeks of work in that hell hole.
+++++++++++++++++++
ON THE MORNING OF MAY 30, 2005 ... A DECEASED NATALEE IS PLACED IN A WHITE PICKUP.
Jossy Mansur
NANCY GRACE
July 29, 2005
GRACE: OK. Jossy, is there any way to tie in a white pick-up to this scenario?
MANSUR: Yes, ma`am, because there`s another witness that, before that, told someone that works at the hotels that he saw a white pick-up over there by the Holiday Inn, in which three persons were also in, all of them male, carrying what looked like the body of a girl, putting it in the back of the white pick-up and driving away with it.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0507/29/ng.01.html
ON THE MORNING OF MAY 30, 2005 ... THERE IS A RUMORED 6:30 AM CALL FROM ONE OF THE SUSPECTS CELL IN THE SANTA LUCIA AREA OF THE ISLAND AND ... JORAN IS ALLEGEDLY PICKED UP BY THE SCHOOL BUS NEAR THE HOME OF LORENZO VAN RIJN.
Thursday, June 16, 2005 at 04:53 AM in Natalee Holloway | Permalink | Comments (270) | TrackBack (2)
On Natalee's Yahoo forum there there is a report that a helicopter is searching Santa Lucia area because according to the cell phone records of one of the three suspects there was a call in the Santa Lucia area at 6:30 am the morning Natalee was to have met up with the group to leave for airport.
http://www.riehlworldview(...)rvative/2005/week24/
Greta Van Susteren
On the Record w/ Greta
July 3, 2005
SUSTEREN: .... I am also curious whether Paul van der Sloot used his phone between midnight and 7 a.m. on May 30. He told me no... he told the Dutch TV correspondent on camera no... but after the interview with the Dutch TV correspondent, he pulled him aside and said maybe he did make a call and that he was not sure.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,161474,00.html
Dave Holloway
Question and Answer Chat - BFN
January 23, 2006
14. Why was the school bus driver called the next morning and told to pick up Joran at Lorenzo's house?
DAVE: Joran was allegedly dropped off at a bus stop on the main highway. The bus driver had not made it there yet and saved Paulus about 30 minutes. Lorenzo's house was nearby.
http://blogsfornatalee.com/forum/index.php?topic=2256.0
ON JUNE 1, 2005 ... NATALEE'S REMAINS ARE OBSERVED BY JUNIOR BEING TAKEN FROM A WHITE PICKUP AND PLACED IN THE LANDFILL.
Jossy Mansur
NANCY GRACE
July 29, 2005
MANSUR: … But it`s very important to note that the witness on the beach by the Holiday Inn has absolutely no knowledge of the witness over there to the east side of the island by the landfill or dump. They don't know each other, but still they give the same description of the same white pick-up.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0507/29/ng.01.html
Susan Candiotti - Cnn Correspondent
NANCY GRACE
July 29, 2005
CANDIOTTI:his same witness claims to have told police that he saw a vehicle and was able to provide a tag number to police. I am told that this is a registered car in Aruba, but I can`t tell you more than that.
JUNIOR CONVEYS HIS OBSERVATION TO HIS BROTHER WHO ... ON JUNE 3, 2005 ... CONVEYS THE ACCOUNT TO THE ARUBAN AUTHORITIES.
Tim Miller
CBS NEWS
July 30, 2005
The witness told his brother what he saw soon afterward, and the brother told police, he said.
http://www.cbsnews.com/st(...)?source=search_story
Edwin Comenencia
Associated Press
August 1, 2005
Police spokesman Edwin Comenencia said police searched the landfill after receiving the tip days after Holloway's disappearance May 30th, but found nothing.
http://www.wtvynews4.com/home/headlines/1756907.html
COULD JUNIOR'S OBSERVATION IMPLIES THAT THE "POWERS THAT BE" IN THE COVERUP REMOVED NATALEE'S REMAINS FROM THE LANDFILL AND ... SHE WAS BURIED OR ... TAKEN OUT TO SEA OR ... BOTH.
Tim Miller
RED - SCARED MONKEYS
July 24, 2005
RED: There have been reports that a shallow grave was discovered in the area of Boca Tortuga, on the eastern part of the island. There are also reports that cell-phone calls made by Joran earlyin the morning came from a location on the eastern side of the island. It seems plausible that thisarea could yield more clues
TIM MILLER: We found a site that we feel as though was a possible gravesite. Our thoughts are that Natalee may have been buried in that hole for 1 or 2 days then moved. We have information that the cell phones were possibly being used in that area
http://scaredmonkeys.com/(...)ller-july-24th-2005/
Dave Holloway
NANCY GRACE
April 24, 2006
GRACE: Well, Dave Holloway, aren`t there logs and isn`t there surveillance in place in Aruba of all the ships that go out of the tiny island, even at night?
HOLLOWAY: Well, there is but on one of those nights, I think it was June the 7th or June the 8th, the electricity went out on the island for about two hours so you wonder if that would have been the prime opportunity to do it. Small boats, I don`t think, can be picked up as well as the big ones.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/24/ng.01.html
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door observer777 op 11-02-2008 21:34:11 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Grapefield Beach where the Bloody Mattress was found is on the very southern part of the island not to far from the VCB Shirt and other items found the next day on June 6th 2005. "Another search took place near Weg Fontein Rd. Here Volunteers,Police and Warda Nos Costa members started searching intensely after police received a suspicious phone call. According to officials,an anxious sounding person told them to focus on the area of Weg Fontein"
After talking with Aruban authorities, Tacopina says his investigators believe the suspect, identified only as "G-V-C," was picked up because of a T-shirt with "relevant forensic information."
Items found were a VCB security shirt with blood on it,styraphone with teeth marks,sunglasses and a lysol bottle with suspicious substance in it. Joran's American Attorney has said several times that the shirt has forensic evidence on it that is part of Natalee's case.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This Video talks about a bloody Mattress found on June 5th 2005 and sandles were found with it. Even more suspicious,because we know Joran killed his own Dog and Lorenzo was rumored to kill dogs as well. Did this Mattress have anything to do with Natalee? DId someone slaughter a dog to cover forensic evidence already on the Mattress?
(Click to see Video)
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Did Deepak slip in his statement about Joran's Mattress?
Deepak Kalpoe
Suspect Statement
June 13, 2005
The police officers drove from the Holiday Inn to Joran's house. The police had dropped us off at Joran's house.
We then went to Joran's room because Joran's dad wanted to talk to us so we sat down on the floor, because Joran's mattresses were on the floor in his room.
It was already about 06:10 hours, and I said that it really is late and that I had to go home. I got up and walked to the door.
I said my goodbyes and drove home. I went with my car and drove home via the road leading through Paradera. At approximately 06:45 hours, I got home.
----------------------------------------------------------
June 4th 2005 AM Digital reports after Interrogating the three young men that were last with Natalee,The Three Young Men declared that they took Natalee to that area,had sex with her and then dropped her off at the HI.
[ Bericht 14% gewijzigd door observer777 op 11-02-2008 22:05:43 ]
After talking with Aruban authorities, Tacopina says his investigators believe the suspect, identified only as "G-V-C," was picked up because of a T-shirt with "relevant forensic information."
Items found were a VCB security shirt with blood on it,styraphone with teeth marks,sunglasses and a lysol bottle with suspicious substance in it. Joran's American Attorney has said several times that the shirt has forensic evidence on it that is part of Natalee's case.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This Video talks about a bloody Mattress found on June 5th 2005 and sandles were found with it. Even more suspicious,because we know Joran killed his own Dog and Lorenzo was rumored to kill dogs as well. Did this Mattress have anything to do with Natalee? DId someone slaughter a dog to cover forensic evidence already on the Mattress?
(Click to see Video)
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Did Deepak slip in his statement about Joran's Mattress?
Deepak Kalpoe
Suspect Statement
June 13, 2005
The police officers drove from the Holiday Inn to Joran's house. The police had dropped us off at Joran's house.
We then went to Joran's room because Joran's dad wanted to talk to us so we sat down on the floor, because Joran's mattresses were on the floor in his room.
It was already about 06:10 hours, and I said that it really is late and that I had to go home. I got up and walked to the door.
I said my goodbyes and drove home. I went with my car and drove home via the road leading through Paradera. At approximately 06:45 hours, I got home.
----------------------------------------------------------
June 4th 2005 AM Digital reports after Interrogating the three young men that were last with Natalee,The Three Young Men declared that they took Natalee to that area,had sex with her and then dropped her off at the HI.
[ Bericht 14% gewijzigd door observer777 op 11-02-2008 22:05:43 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
I just love when hypocrits come here and add nothing but wrong information and attack good people trying to help a country,a murdered girl and victims. Talk about the need for getting a life!!quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 22:08 schreef Nielsch het volgende:
-
[ Bericht 6% gewijzigd door NorthernStar op 12-02-2008 04:10:05 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
I watched the interview with David Kock who was then Satish's attorney early in the case on TV and he clearly said they made a stop at another Bar after C&C. Deepak ran in briefly and then they left. Why are they keeping this out of the timeline,PV'S and series of events? What are they trying to hide if this is irrelevant? Did they stop at Choose-A-Name Bar..If they did,does it have anything to do with Pitbull who was murdered and then the bar he worked at burned down?
---------------------------------------
"They said they left the bar around 1:30 a.m. with van der Sloot and an intoxicated Holloway in the back seat, then stopped briefly at another restaurant about a block away before heading out of town", Kock said.
http://tinyurl.com/2tbgfz (June 9th)
[ Bericht 2% gewijzigd door observer777 op 11-02-2008 23:39:26 ]
---------------------------------------
"They said they left the bar around 1:30 a.m. with van der Sloot and an intoxicated Holloway in the back seat, then stopped briefly at another restaurant about a block away before heading out of town", Kock said.
http://tinyurl.com/2tbgfz (June 9th)
[ Bericht 2% gewijzigd door observer777 op 11-02-2008 23:39:26 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
they are trying to hide because Deepak came in to buy some GHB and everybody knows it and then Deepak said to Natalee here sniff some GHB very nice and then Natalee said no I just had cocaine those two don't mix and last but not least I've epilepsy so I'm gonna freak out you know, so Joran said shut up bitch, sniff! but Natalee didn't want to and then all of a sudden she freaked out, she shaked so much everyone was freakin' out and then she dropped dead and then they said to each other 'what now?' and then Joran said let's rape her and Deepak said yeah good idea, so they raped her, and then Joran said I know some people here, some higher forces you know, so they left Natalee on the beach while the higher forces came with a boat and went to Venezuela and the higher forces turned Natalee into a donkey so that no one nows the bones of the donkey were in fact those of Natalee and then Joran and Deepak and Satish went to the place where they bought GHB and they punished Pitbull for the bad quality of the drugs so they killed Pitbull and burned the place down and then the great forces came with the elephant with the big snout and blew the story out.quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 23:29 schreef observer777 het volgende:
I watched the interview with David Kock who was then Satish's attorney early in the case on TV and he clearly said they made a stop at another Bar after C&C. Deepak ran in briefly and then they left. Why are they keeping this out of the timeline,PV'S and series of events? What are they trying to hide if this is irrelevant? Did they stop at Choose-A-Name Bar..If they did,does it have anything to do with Pitbull who was murdered and then the bar he worked at burned down?
Interesting video just minutes ago from John Q Kelly (Holloway Attorney)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=94X3TaqaXWo
--------------------------------------------------
Geraldo 2/10/08 Beth and Peter
Part 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=178zR_ul7Yw
Part 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2OaIMz5Oz9E
[ Bericht 49% gewijzigd door observer777 op 12-02-2008 00:20:10 ]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=94X3TaqaXWo
--------------------------------------------------
Geraldo 2/10/08 Beth and Peter
Part 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=178zR_ul7Yw
Part 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2OaIMz5Oz9E
[ Bericht 49% gewijzigd door observer777 op 12-02-2008 00:20:10 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Yeah, this story with Pitbull was a strange thing... They found wih with his legs cut off, but it was decided that he committed suicide...quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 23:29 schreef observer777 het volgende:
I watched the interview with David Kock who was then Satish's attorney early in the case on TV and he clearly said they made a stop at another Bar after C&C. Deepak ran in briefly and then they left. Why are they keeping this out of the timeline,PV'S and series of events? What are they trying to hide if this is irrelevant? Did they stop at Choose-A-Name Bar..If they did,does it have anything to do with Pitbull who was murdered and then the bar he worked at burned down?
---------------------------------------
"They said they left the bar around 1:30 a.m. with van der Sloot and an intoxicated Holloway in the back seat, then stopped briefly at another restaurant about a block away before heading out of town", Kock said.
http://tinyurl.com/2tbgfz (June 9th)
[ afbeelding ]
And then the bar was set in flames... It could be a total coincidence, but somehow i feel it's related. Just as strange is the fact that the woman who helped PVDS at his bank died shortly thereafter. It gets crazier and crazier the more you read about it.
http://arubanboycott.blog(...)urdered-bouncer.htmlquote:SURRIE said...
dineSH
djOeGAN
SHANGO
CHOOSE-A-NAME-BAR
TATTOOS
SHANGO HAS NOT DANCED WITH THE LIONS, NOR ARAWAKS, AND DOES NOT KEEP THEIR COMPANY.
SHANGO LOOKS FROM AFAR BUT SPEAKS WITH TRUTH. HE DOES NOT CONVERSE WITH THE SIMIAN, OR ANY OTHER WORLDLY SOURCES, AND ATTEMPTS TO BRING DIRECTION TO SPECULATION.
THIS IS WHAT SURRIE BELIEVES.
MAY 7, 2006
BLESS Dinesh Djoegan's family. My sincerest sympathies to your family.
May he have not died in vain. He was just getting ready to tell the Americans who is responsible for Natalee and what has happened to her and where her family can find her. But the Arubian Goverment/CARTEL sent Americans sent us a message through this horrible event. This soul was mutilated, tortured, like an animal, worse than an animal and the Arubian Government wishes to tell Americans that there is no crime on the island.
Yet, bodies keep stacking up and then, POOF, dissapearing.
Again, my deepest sympathies to the Djoegan family.
May 7, 2006
Sun May 07, 06:36:00 PM EDT
The address doesn't really allow for any decent reactions being posted there, but quoted reaction about this guy is very disturbing. I red some of those Shango things, but mainly out of context since I didn't read them at the time they were posted, but from what ive heard he was very well informed. Could it be that this bouncer was idd Shango?
Where facts are few, experts are many.
Yes,and Also Rene Van Heyningen who worked for Valero Refinery(Rumored to run the Incinerater) and Part time at the Hospital Incinerater. His Murder is almost as supicious as Pitbulls. Both Famalies complained to the newspapers,arrests were made and it became even more suspicious after that for many reasons. In Rene's case they arrested and convicted his GF who said she didn't do it and that it was two men. The timeline of events of questioning in Natalee's case is very interesting leading up to finding his almost decapitated body on June 18th 2005. Just a day or two before the Gottenbo's were questioned,Lorenzo Van Rijn,Steve Croes and Max Arendsz(Provided Alibi for LVR)quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 00:17 schreef kabouterjong het volgende:
[..]
Yeah, this story with Pitbull was a strange thing... They found wih with his legs cut off, but it was decided that he committed suicide...
(Bank employee who met with PVDS on June 30th 2005)He mentions her in his PV
Ruth Gisela Dijkhoff-Holtmann
17 May 1955 - 18 Jun 2005
http://www.mementomori.net/05148.html
Rene Van Heyningen
12 Jan 1973- 18 jun 2005
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10/14/05
Victim’s family is none too happy
“While they can’t even resolve the case of Natalee Holloway…what is of a poor dark skinned San Nicolas born Arubian?” This is the reaction of the family of the deceased, Rene van Heinegin, which they indicated to DIARIO in a telephone interview from St. Maarten.
http://getagripmonkey.blogspot.com/2005_10_09_archive.html
More on Rene Van Heyningen
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2481.msg322067#msg322067
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Relatieproblemen gingen aan moord vooraf
ORANJESTAD — Aan de dood van René van Heyningen, in de nacht van donderdag 16 op vrijdag 17 juni 2005, gingen relatieproblemen vooraf. De man zou gewelddadig zijn en de vrouw jaloers. De rechter doet vrijdag uitspraak en dan zal duidelijk zijn of de vrouw Y.C.H. een slachtoffer was dat in een roes van angst handelde, of met voorbedachten rade een moord heeft gepleegd.
Het stel zou die donderdagavond samen gaan stappen, maar Van Heyningen ging in zijn eentje weg. C.H. was teleurgesteld en dacht na over hun relatie. Ze dronk daarbij een fles wijn. Volgens C.H. kwam haar vriend rond vier uur ’s nachts thuis en kregen ze ruzie. Van Heyningen zou een machete hebben gepakt en haar gedreigd hebben te doden als ze zich met zijn leven zou blijven bemoeien. Daarna ging hij slapen.
Rond half zes ’s morgens pakte C.H. het kapmes en stak in zijn hals. De man werd hiervan wakker, maar was niet meer in staat om geluid uit te brengen. Hij kwam uit bed en probeerde weg te lopen. C.H. bleef echter op hem inhakken, tot hij in de keuken neerviel en niet meer reageerde.
C.H. zag dat Van Heyningen dood was en sleepte zijn lichaam naar de slaapkamer van hun nog geen jaar oude dochtertje. Dit meisje sliep op dat moment in de ouderslaapkamer. Daarna hing ze een laken voor het raam, zodat er van buitenaf niets zichtbaar zou zijn. Ze maakte haar dochtertje wakker, bracht haar naar de oppas en ging naar haar werk. Ze belde verschillende mensen om te vragen of zij wisten waar haar vriend was, omdat hij die nacht niet zou zijn thuisgekomen.
Toen C.H. in de loop van de ochtend weer thuiskwam, wikkelde ze naar eigen zeggen het lijk in een laken, legde het in zijn pick-up en bracht het naar begraafplaats te Sabana Basora. De politie ontdekte het lichaam een dag later. Op dat moment werd C.H. niet als verdachte beschouwd. Pas toen agenten in de woning van C.H. in een plas bloed een voetafdruk aantroffen die van C.H. bleek te zijn, werd ze verdachte. Op 24 juni legde de vrouw een bekentenis af.
MACHETE
De officier van justitie zette vraagtekens bij het in huis hebben van een pasgeslepen machete. Volgens C.H. gebruikten ze het mes om de tuin te kappen. “Welke tuin? Op de foto’s die van het huis en de omgeving zijn gemaakt, zie ik geen tuin en ook niets om te kappen.” C.H. zei dat haar vriend haar had gevraagd de machete te laten slijpen om in de tuin mee te werken. Ze bracht de machete op 9 juni naar een slijper en haalde het mes op 15 juni weer op.
Op de kwitantie stond de voornaam van C.H., maar een compleet andere achternaam. C.H. gaf aan dat ze alleen haar voornaam had opgeschreven en de slijper de achternaam noteerde. Toen ze echter goed naar het handschrift keek, erkende ze dat ze het zelf had opgeschreven. “Het was erg druk bij de slijper en ik denk dat ik daardoor een fout heb gemaakt. Maar ik begrijp niet hoe dat kan.”
Op de vraag van de rechter waarom C.H. haar vriend had omgebracht, reageerde ze huilend. “In mijn hoofd klikte iets, ik had een black-out. Die nacht kwam een duivel in mij.” Ze vertelde over hun jarenlange relatie. “Niets was goed voor hem. Ik moest alles voor hem doen, hij deed niets voor mij. Tijdens mijn zwangerschap was hij er niet voor me en hij kwam niet opdagen bij de doop van onze dochter. Jarenlang deed hij me emotioneel pijn. Toch houd ik nog van hem. Het doet pijn dat hij er niet meer is.”
HULP
Bij de reconstructie op de begraafplaats van Sabana Basora bleek dat het zware lijk niet door één persoon over de omheining getild had kunnen worden. De Technische Recherche heeft geen sleepsporen gevonden en geen geknakte takken. C.H. zei dat ze dat toch echt had gedaan. “Ik had onverklaarbare kracht in me.”
Volgens het psychiatrisch onderzoek was de vrouw op het moment van de steekpartij volledig toerekeningsvatbaar, is er geen kans op herhaling en vormt ze geen gevaar voor de maatschappij.
Het OM schetst C.H. als een vrouw die heftig reageerde als haar vriend niet deed wat ze wilde en jaloers was omdat Van Heyningen er meerdere vriendinnen op na hield. Dat C.H. de dag na het ombrengen van haar vriend gewoon ging werken en mensen belde om te vragen waar hij was, vond de officier van justitie een toneelstuk. “Het ging dus om een doelbewuste daad.” De officier van justitie was ook van mening dat C.H. liegt dat ze het in haar eentje heeft gedaan.
De advocaat van C. vond de bewijslast niet sluitend. Uit de lijkschouwing bleek bijvoorbeeld dat er vermoedelijk meerdere wapens zijn gebruikt. “Wat zou het tweede wapen dan zijn geweest?”, vroeg de advocaat zich af.
Ze ging ook in op de machete. “In elke tuin groeit yerba en een machete is niet ongewoon om dit gras mee weg te halen.” De dag na het ombrengen van Van Heyningen beschouwt de advocaat als een dag van ontkenning. Volgens haar is pijn het motief voor deze daad. “Veel vrouwen gaan jarenlang gebukt onder een gewelddadige relatie, maar houden zoveel van hun partner dat ze de relatie niet kunnen verbreken. Hier is inderdaad sprake van een crime passionnel: een daad als gevolg van psychische overmacht.” (Amigoe)
http://tinyurl.com/2hg87b
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Dutch posters discussing the events after Lorenzo Van Rijn,Steve Croes and Max Arendsz were questioned
Op zondag 19 juni 2005 19:33 schreef milagro het volgende:
[..]
Ms is het wel raar, ja.
Die zoon heeft dacht ik een soort van eigen appartementje, aan zijn ouderlijk huis, eigen opgang dus ook neem ik aan, dus ik neem wederom aan, dat zoonlief kan komen en gaan zonder dat Pa en Ma in de gaten hebben hoe of wat en met wie etc.
Zoonlief heeft om 06.30 die morgen gebeld met de 5e verdachte, dat is dus onlangs pas gebleken, daarom is die 5e man nu ook verdachte,.
mss willen ze daarom nu pas weten van Pa of hij iets gemerkt heeft die morgen van af en aan rijden van derden, of zo
Vermist meisje op Aruba #2
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door observer777 op 12-02-2008 00:47:43 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
I am not a expert on Shango and Simian and have avoided these discussions for facts,but it is speculated that could have been him or even Charles Croes. Many believe Simian was ALE. Some posters at SM have discussed these two at great lengths.quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 00:32 schreef Atreidez het volgende:
[..]
http://arubanboycott.blog(...)urdered-bouncer.html
The address doesn't really allow for any decent reactions being posted there, but quoted reaction about this guy is very disturbing. I red some of those Shango things, but mainly out of context since I didn't read them at the time they were posted, but from what ive heard he was very well informed. Could it be that this bouncer was idd Shango?
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=1952.0
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Its 2008 what has so far been result of your help?quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 22:49 schreef observer777 het volgende:
[..]
I just love when hypocrits come here and add nothing but wrong information and attack good people trying to help a country,a murdered girl and victims. Talk about the need for getting a life!!
“I'm in trouble because I'm normal and slightly arrogant. A lot of people don't like themselves and I happen to be totally in love with myself.”
I have done everything I can from the very beginning to help solve this case and support Natalee and her Family. I am not a paid researcher or FBI,ALE or KLPD,Just a blogger like all of you trying my very best to help. The results are none of your business,but I see almost 5,000 hits on this thread which I provided years of research from many people that was painstakingly put together through much research. The Dutch people that read my posts here learned the real facts about this case all in just a short time. What have you done to help?quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 00:59 schreef -MyLove- het volgende:
[..]
Its 2008 what has so far been result of your help?
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
So you have nothing except that some people saw your thread? So in the end you did it all for the attention?quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 01:15 schreef observer777 het volgende:
The results are none of your business,but I see almost 5,000 hits on this thread which I provided years of research from many people that was painstakingly put together through much research. The Dutch people that read my posts here learned the real facts about this case all in just a short time. What have you done to help?
“I'm in trouble because I'm normal and slightly arrogant. A lot of people don't like themselves and I happen to be totally in love with myself.”
Holy hell that is disgusting that I get attacked for telling people the facts from thousands of hours of research and doing it out of complete kindness and love for this girl and her Family,on my own time and my own dime. When disgusting people like yourself lie and spread wrong information about a murdered girl and her Family. The truth hurts doesnt it? Well at least you are getting paid or are friends of the perps,now go back where you came from and tell your friends they are going down!!!!quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 01:19 schreef -MyLove- het volgende:
[..]
So you have nothing except that some people saw your thread? So in the end you did it all for the attention?
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Everything I wrote here is 100% on the money and has already proven to be true and fact,unless stated otherwise You lost all credibiity and holy hell it is disgusting when people come here just to derail the truth,spread lies and attack people telling the truth to people. Now that is pathetic! Get a life chump!quote:
I see the trolls are coming because we are close to the truth! Tell your friends they are going down!!!
[ Bericht 12% gewijzigd door NorthernStar op 12-02-2008 04:09:38 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Oh my gosh...quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 01:34 schreef observer777 het volgende:
[..]
Everything I wrote here is 100% on the money and has already proven to be true and fact,unless stated otherwise You lost all credibiity and holy hell it is disgusting when people come here just to derail the truth,spread lies and attack people telling the truth to people. Now that is pathetic! Get a life chump!
I see the trolls are coming because we are close to the truth! Tell your friends they are going down!!!
oh my gosh... Observer why so hostile? This is the I N T E R N E T, we can have our own opinions can we? I asked you in the 2nd topic to provide us with some facts. Sorry, I can hardly see any. A lot of assumptions yes, but no real facts and yes I've read all of your posts. Some of the assumptions are interesting, really...but along your way of posting on FOK you're getting more hostile and because some of us just have another opinion, you call us names? Tell us our so called friends are going down? Hilarious.
This is not Scared Monkeys you know, this is FOK and we are certaintly NOT are the Dutch Monkeys. So if you can't stand the heat, get out dear. This heat could get much worser in this matter.
[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door BwennieBren op 12-02-2008 02:04:15 ]
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
Proof stands up in court, your research wich is pretty good, but nowhere is becomes proof, only possiblequote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 01:34 schreef observer777 het volgende:
[..]
Everything I wrote here is 100% on the money and has already proven to be true and fact,unless stated otherwise You lost all credibiity and holy hell it is disgusting when people come here just to derail the truth,spread lies and attack people telling the truth to people. Now that is pathetic! Get a life chump!
I see the trolls are coming because we are close to the truth! Tell your friends they are going down!!!
surcumstancial (is that a word) evidence. nowhere you proof it as Fact.
Observer777 be open for critical repley's that's the path to be a good researcher. else it's not research if it's not open for PEER review.
It can only make see things in a different light.
John 8:32
Welcome Mr. President, How can we serve you,
Mensen, mensen, easy on the canadian dude..
Hij meent het goed, er staat TE veel info op SM..dat is het probleem, maar er staat zeker goede info die te gebruiken is...vergeet niet hun zijn zeker 2 jaar verder als wij qua berichtgeving...geeft je ook te denken he?
Observer 777 please go on and post your relevant info, thanks!
Hij meent het goed, er staat TE veel info op SM..dat is het probleem, maar er staat zeker goede info die te gebruiken is...vergeet niet hun zijn zeker 2 jaar verder als wij qua berichtgeving...geeft je ook te denken he?
Observer 777 please go on and post your relevant info, thanks!
I have some good questions that puzzled me and may be you have the answers:
Rudy Croes: why is he mad/ abandonning the Sloots?
Is there a 2way war on aruba between...say 1 and 2 without saying they are workers and elite..but just one is mansur and one is the rest? If so, it will explain a lot..is there any rivalty?
Rudy Croes: why is he mad/ abandonning the Sloots?
Is there a 2way war on aruba between...say 1 and 2 without saying they are workers and elite..but just one is mansur and one is the rest? If so, it will explain a lot..is there any rivalty?
information about the truth doesnt change over time. And all the info on SM is a lot of hypothetical, and assumptions.quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 02:38 schreef letsgetthiscasesolved het volgende:
Mensen, mensen, easy on the canadian dude..
Hij meent het goed, er staat TE veel info op SM..dat is het probleem, maar er staat zeker goede info die te gebruiken is...vergeet niet hun zijn zeker 2 jaar verder als wij qua berichtgeving...geeft je ook te denken he?
Observer 777 please go on and post your relevant info, thanks!
The truth will not be known, for the next 15 years. (statue of limitation of murder is 18 years, i think aruba has almost the same laws as the Netherlands)
Joran told as much as he knows, he doesnt know what happend to the body.
(I assume his DAD coverd his back)
But all those people at SM talk as if there is PROOF that would stand up in court, it not! It wouldn't stand up in a US court if it would have been a beach in Florida.
I can give you 100+ muders in the US that aren't solved, but ofcourse that's not a White girl from Alabama on vacation
YES Joran was with natalee when she DIED, (His own words thinks the recording data 29 Jan 2008)
Natalee DIED, reason......ONLY speculation's. (Trembling/shakking doesnt sound like an alcohol overdose)
Then it gets intressting....Who cleared the body.....
Jorans own words, The person sends him home. and knew about his exames the next day. Friends dont provide that kind of service (he would have been asked to help himself together with that friend)
Parents however DO. well his mother was out of the country. so that leaves, his Dad.
NOW PROVE THAT. then you can sleep wel again.
Welcome Mr. President, How can we serve you,
Well, first of all you'll have to proof then that they drove to the Van der Sloot estate instead of driving to the beach, don't you?quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 03:03 schreef WallOfStars het volgende:
[..]
information about the truth doesnt change over time. And all the info on SM is a lot of hypothetical, and assumptions.
The truth will not be known, for the next 15 years. (statue of limitation of murder is 18 years, i think aruba has almost the same laws as the Netherlands)
Joran told as much as he knows, he doesnt know what happend to the body.
(I assume his DAD coverd his back)
But all those people at SM talk as if there is PROOF that would stand up in court, it not! It wouldn't stand up in a US court if it would have been a beach in Florida.
I can give you 100+ muders in the US that aren't solved, but ofcourse that's not a White girl from Alabama on vacation
YES Joran was with natalee when she DIED, (His own words thinks the recording data 29 Jan 2008)
Natalee DIED, reason......ONLY speculation's. (Trembling/shakking doesnt sound like an alcohol overdose)
Then it gets intressting....Who cleared the body.....
Jorans own words, The person sends him home. and knew about his exames the next day. Friends dont provide that kind of service (he would have been asked to help himself together with that friend)
Parents however DO. well his mother was out of the country. so that leaves, his Dad.
NOW PROVE THAT. then you can sleep wel again.
I´m back.
Well see, those are good questions...but don't get too hard on observer777 he has seen it all in 2 + years..may be he says, just all go to ... and find the info yourself..the things they digged up the last years..i'm convident that it's more than Hans Mos has..because they wrecked all the info when he started, yes, from scratch with nothing, was probably all shredded..that's why they have 2+ more info on us
Why what would that prove....that his dad met natalee?? (he did that in a casino hours earlier. there video proof and multiple parties state that, even Joran and his dad do)quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 03:09 schreef Ryan3 het volgende:
[..]
Well, first of all you'll have to proof then that they drove to the Van der Sloot estate instead of driving to the beach, don't you?
Welcome Mr. President, How can we serve you,
Btw Peter R de Vries'll disagree on observer777's theory. As I understood, he thinks that they drove to the beach, that Natalee died there under mysterious circumstances, not necessarily due to anything Joran did, or slipped in the bacardi 151 earlier, that Joran thereupon phoned a friend and that the friend disposed of the body. Peter R de Vries don't think that they necessarily slipped something in her bacardi 151, that they drove to Joran's den, that he and de Kalpoe brothers violently raped her, that she awakened during this rape and that they then killed her, on which she suffered a major blow on her head and that subsequently Paul van der Sloot disposed of her body. That's not - and perhaps I'm wrong - what Peter R believes.
I´m back.
Ok and after that whats the timeplan casino..off..natalee out/in out/ fight?or some talk with students..off..and then..Sloots?( 1:30)
No, that's the first stepstone of observers777's theory. If you can proof that, then the rest of it might follow.quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 03:17 schreef WallOfStars het volgende:
[..]
Why what would that prove....that his dad met natalee?? (he did that in a casino hours earlier. there video proof and multiple parties state that, even Joran and his dad do)
I´m back.
So far as we are Ryan3 is right, we simply don't know more than what ryan3 has just stated and that's what Joran has confessed...is there something where it gives duplicates..as in somebody claimed that at an interogation or..
Sure,I was just called pathetic and doing all this for attention and have done nothing,how did you expect me to respond? All this from a few who are just here for diversions and to spend there time attacking people and derailing the thread and the truth. I noticed you said nothing to them but included yourself as one of them. Since you read all my posts and it's so easy to discredit them and they are mostly assumptions name one thing I was wrong about? I already told you I don't have this on Video or a smoking gun,If I did this case would be solved and none of us would be here.Like your first post stated,you swallowed the dis-information story hook like and sinker and I have no clue why you are attacking the truth of 2.5 years of research,unless you have other motives. If you don't want to learn the truth then don't listen! Maybe you should go back to RU because apparently that is where you are getting your information. I expected that here in this Forum but I already know there is plenty of people here that want to know the truth and appreciate the research that has been done since May 30th 2005. It's a shame that you are confusing opinions with trolls,who won't stop attacking me until I leave this forum. All so people here at FOK don't hear the truth as we know it.quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 01:56 schreef BwennieBren het volgende:
[..]
Oh my gosh...
Observer why so hostile? This is the I N T E R N E T, we can have our own opinions can we? I asked you in the 2nd topic to provide us with some facts. Sorry, I can hardly see any. A lot of assumptions yes, but no real facts and yes I've read all of your posts. Some of the assumptions are interesting, really...but along your way of posting on FOK you're getting more hostile and because some of us just have another opinion, you call us names? Tell us our so called friends are going down? Hilarious.
This is not Scared Monkeys you know, this is FOK and we are certaintly NOT are the Dutch Monkeys. So if you can't stand the heat, get out dear. This heat could get much worser in this matter.
I had people here saying that it was BS that it was reported there was blood in the car,I posted a enormous amount of links. I did the same thing with Jorans confession and many other topics. Did I have a video of Joran confessing in June 2005? Did I claim to have one? No,I simply stated it was reported all over the American Media which I provided the links as the first hand account from the Diario reporter who witnessed it. Some like the Cover up,I posted relevent information but there is tons more as it has happened since the first day and is a enormous amount of info.! We have been on to the trolls,dis-information team,paid plants,friends of the perps and the weird internet people since the very beginning. They didn't stop me then and they certainly wont stop me now from trying to learn the full truth. I hope that the people just starting to learn about this case are aware of them because opinion is one thing but being one of them is another.
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Observer please understand that even we in NL don't get the truth, i found it out myself, and I will tell you later, but there is of course another Renee Gielen post in the dutch media...figure..please don't feel bad about this, we need also your explanations about who where aand what since you are 2+ more years in front of info...
Ok..The link is:
http://witheet.com/buiten(...)et-zogenaamde-gelijk
It's in dutch and starts ok but then...
http://witheet.com/buiten(...)et-zogenaamde-gelijk
It's in dutch and starts ok but then...
If that's true, I think it would be quite reasonable to assume that from the perspective of Observer777 Peter R would be disavowed as part of the cover-up, wouldn't it? I mean, if what Peter R revealed and believes to be true, would in actual fact be the truth; Joran wouldn't be liable as murderer. And he wouldn't spend a day more in jail.quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 03:29 schreef letsgetthiscasesolved het volgende:
So far as we are Ryan3 is right, we simply don't know more than what ryan3 has just stated and that's what Joran has confessed...is there something where it gives duplicates..as in somebody claimed that at an interogation or..
I´m back.
Hi Ryan,quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 03:24 schreef Ryan3 het volgende:
Btw Peter R de Vries'll disagree on observer777's theory. As I understood, he thinks that they drove to the beach, that Natalee died there under mysterious circumstances, not necessarily due to anything Joran did, or slipped in the bacardi 151 earlier, that Joran thereupon phoned a friend and that the friend disposed of the body. Peter R de Vries don't think that they necessarily slipped something in her bacardi 151, that they drove to Joran's den, that he and de Kalpoe brothers violently raped her, that she awakened during this rape and that they then killed her, on which she suffered a major blow on her head and that subsequently Paul van der Sloot disposed of her body. That's not - and perhaps I'm wrong - what Peter R believes.
I appreciate his work and applaud him for his efforts and I admire him as a crime investigator. I don't know anyone personally that knows what happened for sure,and I have seen so many theories and speculations on what happened from so many people. My theory was just a theory,which I did not go into detail or tell you my other theory.The same will be told from him as a theory,which I have not heard yet as you just said mysterious circumstances is how she died. I analyzed everything since day from info that was not available on TV/Newspapers and other credible sources and listened to the thoughts of people who have researched everything like I have since then and the parents of Natalee. Peter R and Dr.Hodges have not done anywhere near the research that has been done at SM and I do not think they know near as much yet. I do believe Peter R knows more about the corruption/cover up but is choosing not to reveal or talk about yet. I look forward to hearing what he thinks happened.
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Well what Peter R thinks is what I toldya. I just saw it in the reruns of a program called De wereld draait door. Aired here in Holland in the evening.quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 03:46 schreef observer777 het volgende:
[..]
Hi Ryan,
I appreciate his work and applaud him for his efforts and I admire him as a crime investigator. I don't know anyone personally that knows what happened for sure,and I have seen so many theories and speculations on what happened from so many people. My theory was just a theory,which I did not go into detail or tell you my other theory.The same will be told from him as a theory,which I have not heard yet as you just said mysterious circumstances is how she died. I analyzed everything since day from info that was not available on TV/Newspapers and other credible sources and listened to the thoughts of people who have researched everything like I have since then and the parents of Natalee. Peter R and Dr.Hodges have not done anywhere near the research that has been done at SM and I do not think they know near as much yet. I do believe Peter R knows more about the corruption/cover up but is choosing not to reveal or talk about yet. I look forward to hearing what he thinks happened.
So perhaps Peter R is getting Joran of the hook with this confession business then?
Hi btw.
.
I´m back.
Hi..I know I have spoken to many Dutch,Americans and Arubans and was startled by how little they knew. It's understandable because the MSM has done a horrible job relaying the full true story in all 3 countries especially Aruba. So much wrong dis-information has come out and it has confused many who did not know any better. At SM we have been amazed for the longest time what is being reported on Fox,Cnn et all and how little the reporters know and the terrible Investigative reporting they have done.quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 03:32 schreef letsgetthiscasesolved het volgende:
Observer please understand that even we in NL don't get the truth, i found it out myself, and I will tell you later, but there is of course another Renee Gielen post in the dutch media...figure..please don't feel bad about this, we need also your explanations about who where aand what since you are 2+ more years in front of info...
Another post from Rene'e Gielen? Oh brother,well we have been expecting it. Nothing she has said has been anywhere near the truth. All lies!
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
I enjoy reading all the material Observer is writing here, it opened my eyes, and now im diggig myself.. it costs a HUGE amount of time.. And he researched 2.5 plus years!! And for all the people that dont believe all these things, just come here and come with proof to show otherwise.. Just attacking someone without backing something up is plain stupid..
Well he knows because that was a part of :let's give it a aname: Devries1
This Joran confessing is Devriies2
In 1 he opened a file that says he met ben (vo)King at the doora justice guy and wrecked up the investigation of the propertij no 19,Monjana?, he found out more...but I have to see it back on 1
This Joran confessing is Devriies2
In 1 he opened a file that says he met ben (vo)King at the doora justice guy and wrecked up the investigation of the propertij no 19,Monjana?, he found out more...but I have to see it back on 1
Yes I found out by myself Gielen is lying in a 1..2.she says:.im' a sloots representative(I have proof on a dutch newspaper-worker who says..hey..again..their methods are sleazy)
Well..and I found there are trolls everywhere, even at greta.blog etc...just lurking what you know and then bang..wrong!!!..sorry..I saw it on tv...
We followed Mr.De Vries work very closely in his first show about Natalee but I have not heard him explain what he fully thinks happened. Only that he says mysterious events and the father knows more and that they were at the beach. It is known Joran had drugged girls in the past,it all adds up in the PV'S and witness accounts as well as his latest confession. 18 year old girls do not die like that for no reason and people do not hide bodies like that if it was a accident or she killed herself,nor do they lie and block the home from ever being searched if they had nothing to hide. When I gave just a tad bit of my theory it was from so many sources of info that is very logical and backs up the real events of everything since day one and also things that Joran has done before Natalee arrived in Aruba. It is not just my theory but many who have followed this closely at SM.quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 03:53 schreef Ryan3 het volgende:
[..]
Well what Peter R thinks is what I toldya. I just saw it in the reruns of a program called De wereld draait door. Aired here in Holland in the evening.
So perhaps Peter R is getting Joran of the hook with this confession business then?
Hi btw.
I can't wait for his next show as hopefully he has more. I know you all aren't his biggest fans but there is no one else that is making a impact on solving this case.
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
I think the link that letsgetthiscasesolved has given is very interesting. I also have some questions about the mother of Natalee, but I don't think it's a cover-up like I see people talking about here. But, I just signed up here and there's so much info on SM.. I'm not very good at english (as you may have noticed) so it's hard for me to understand everything on SM.
So ehm.. do I have to only write in english here or...? because I see some of the posts in dutch but I see english posts also.. it's confusing
So ehm.. do I have to only write in english here or...? because I see some of the posts in dutch but I see english posts also.. it's confusing
Now you're talkin' Jackanese.
Oh, btw Observer I would like your comment on my earlier observation.quote:Op maandag 11 februari 2008 13:32 schreef Ryan3 het volgende:
[..]
Ik denk zeker dat bij veel mensen de motivatie in het begin wel zuiver was; bij m.n. onze Amerikaanse vrienden zie je nu gaandeweg dat ook andere motieven een rol spelen. Afkeer tegen overheden en een zekere tendentie om in complotten en cover-ups te denken. Afkeer tegen liberals. Zelfs een beetje xenofobie (?).
I stated above that in the beginning the motivation of the internet sleuths might have been pure all right, but that namely with our American friends the motives seem to be slurred. Also resentment of govertments plays a big roll and a certain tendency to think in conspiracies and cover-ups. Rensentment of liberals (of which I think the Van der Sloots are a fine example) and even a bit of bigotry might motivate them...
Otherwise I can't explain certain reactions on SM.
I´m back.
please only english, else use babelfish for translation
Welcome Mr. President, How can we serve you,
First of all Observer, this is a Dutch forum, totally different than SM. People here have their own opinion about things. Second of all, I know you have done a lot of work over the past 2/3 years in this case but for most of the Dutch it has just begun after Peter de Vries opened this case again.quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 03:29 schreef observer777 het volgende:
[..]
Sure,I was just called pathetic and doing all this for attention and have done nothing,how did you expect me to respond? All this from a few who are just here for diversions and to spend there time attacking people and derailing the thread and the truth. I noticed you said nothing to them but included yourself as one of them. Since you read all my posts and it's so easy to discredit them and they are mostly assumptions name one thing I was wrong about? I already told you I don't have this on Video or a smoking gun,If I did this case would be solved and none of us would be here.Like your first post stated,you swallowed the dis-information story hook like and sinker and I have no clue why you are attacking the truth of 2.5 years of research,unless you have other motives. If you don't want to learn the truth then don't listen! Maybe you should go back to RU because apparently that is where you are getting your information. I expected that here in this Forum but I already know there is plenty of people here that want to know the truth and appreciate the research that has been done since May 30th 2005. It's a shame that you are confusing opinions with trolls,who won't stop attacking me until I leave this forum. All so people here at FOK don't hear the truth as we know it.
I had people here saying that it was BS that it was reported there was blood in the car,I posted a enormous amount of links. I did the same thing with Jorans confession and many other topics. Did I have a video of Joran confessing in June 2005? Did I claim to have one? No,I simply stated it was reported all over the American Media which I provided the links as the first hand account from the Diario reporter who witnessed it. Some like the Cover up,I posted relevent information but there is tons more as it has happened since the first day and is a enormous amount of info.! We have been on to the trolls,dis-information team,paid plants,friends of the perps and the weird internet people since the very beginning. They didn't stop me then and they certainly wont stop me now from trying to learn the full truth. I hope that the people just starting to learn about this case are aware of them because opinion is one thing but being one of them is another.
How difficult would it be for you to ignore some of the posters. For me its not. Simply, if I am irritated about something on a forum, i'd hit that nice little white X in the upper rightside corner. You know what I mean? Also I think you are reacting way too emotional in this case.
BTW why would I say something to the posters that you think attacks you? Would you protect me if I was bashed here? No better, did you protect MadMaster (or whatever his name was) on SM when he got so many unfriendly posts cause he just had another opinion? And FYI I do not discredit all your post but some of them yes, I don't share your vision, it's to farfetched. And if I say so and if you want to call that an attack, oh well, suits me.
Also, how do you know I swallowed the disinformation? Have I told you that? Did I wrote it down here somewhere or did I just asked you to clarify some questions I had? I already told you I was interested in several aspects in this matter, so don't turn my words around, I know exactly what I have written down here. You also seem to know which sites I surf regarding this matter.... strange.... it seems that you can think what I think. Mmmmm....
With my post to you I try to explain to you in a reasonable and respectfull way that posting on this forum is different than on SM and of course a lot of the FOK posters are interested in your findings but don't expect that everybody here shares your vision. And really... I really can't find here that anybody said to you to leave this forum or stop giving the info. Do you? And if their would be one or two who said that. oh well, its not he end of the world is it?
Think what you want to think but don't put words in my/our mouth(s) or thoughts what I/we did not said or did not do. Just an advise, maybe you should post here differently than you do at SM. By that, I don't mean your findings in the case and maybe less hostile toward others who have another opinion. It's just an advise, do whatever you want dear. The reactions you get on this case will sometimes be positive and sometimes negative, I can only say: deal with it!
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
I went back several times to research every blog in June 2005 and was stunned to see these trolls infiltrated every single blog since the very beginning. Alot of them use many names and are payed by the ATA to lie and slander the victim,spread wrong info and to protect Aruba's image. Others are just creepy internet people and a few are friends of JK2. In the end it is the Aruban Govt who bankrolled this and they have never let up. They did a little bit of this to others who went missing before Natalee. You can find many of those posters at RU and FOB2. They are reading here and I am sure I will be attacked once again very soon.quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 04:10 schreef letsgetthiscasesolved het volgende:
Well..and I found there are trolls everywhere, even at greta.blog etc...just lurking what you know and then bang..wrong!!!..sorry..I saw it on tv...
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Yes , it's all clear now, take it to your local police office and they will guide you along.
***** Kraak.....
Just look at it as being this, even last night, Peter,has some trouble with jet-lag, shows up at a show in NL they ask and ask..how was it etc...but the deal was I show up and promote the book my right-hand Kees made of all the Peter R. de Vries show-work work we did and how we did it.
What happened is that they talked about the book for 30 seconds and then Peter said,,this is not what we made a contract of...anyways..Peter made a dutch statement but the story is still not ended...
http://www.depers.nl/ente(...)schond-afspraak.html
What happened is that they talked about the book for 30 seconds and then Peter said,,this is not what we made a contract of...anyways..Peter made a dutch statement but the story is still not ended...
http://www.depers.nl/ente(...)schond-afspraak.html
Observer 777..you know..they are here now..just see to pick them out and if they really bother just report them to anyone..
Who is here now? And what does Observer has to report?quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 04:26 schreef letsgetthiscasesolved het volgende:
Observer 777..you know..they are here now..just see to pick them out and if they really bother just report them to anyone..
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
Um Observer I'd like to ask you a question. A few posts back I saw your posts about hairs being found and more. But the date that news came out was from 2005. Now, I may be wrong, but if it had anything to do with Natalee, it would be brought up now by Peter or whoever don't you think? I'd say it would at least be still on the news or anything but I don't read or see anything about it anymore.
Now you're talkin' Jackanese.
ahhh fresh monkeys, welcomequote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 04:29 schreef I.B het volgende:
Um Observer I'd like to ask you a question. A few posts back I saw your posts about hairs being found and more. But the date that news came out was from 2005. Now, I may be wrong, but if it had anything to do with Natalee, it would be brought up now by Peter or whoever don't you think? I'd say it would at least be still on the news or anything but I don't read or see anything about it anymore.
u2 btw letsgetthiscasesolved
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
I'm still busy translating, a serious reply will come.quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 04:28 schreef letsgetthiscasesolved het volgende:
LOL..did you read more? btw kraak?
***** Kraak.....
Right observer..I found out the same thing...good to see I wasn't wrong...but I already met reading and you reporting at least two one was the Man....with his holliday and at the arubans..
Kraaksandaal: ROFL..I laughed already...skip the translation..aruban?
want this to be solved, get rid of Sloot or what?
want this to be solved, get rid of Sloot or what?
Thanks! Well I'm not from SM but I'll write in english here because I see Observer's english.. sometimes I don't know the words but I'll do the best I canquote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 04:30 schreef BwennieBren het volgende:
[..]
ahhh fresh monkeys, welcome
u2 btw letsgetthiscasesolved
Now you're talkin' Jackanese.
Wat een belachelijke opmerking en typ eens in het Nederlandsquote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 04:35 schreef letsgetthiscasesolved het volgende:
Kraaksandaal: ROFL..I laughed already...skip the translation..aruban?
want this to be solved, get rid of Sloot or what?
I used to work in a morgue........I am a people person
Only Human
Only Human
Yes, well. I've read that before, that bit about that Joran used party drugs to rape girls, I asked whether there was any proof, other then rumors, but I'd never gotten any answer really. And yes an 18 year old kid does not die like that, that's true. So mysterious, suspisous even, it'll remain. Unless you have proof that Joran used to rape girls after he drugged them.quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 04:11 schreef observer777 het volgende:
[..]
We followed Mr.De Vries work very closely in his first show about Natalee but I have not heard him explain what he fully thinks happened. Only that he says mysterious events and the father knows more and that they were at the beach. It is known Joran had drugged girls in the past,it all adds up in the PV'S and witness accounts as well as his latest confession. 18 year old girls do not die like that for no reason and people do not hide bodies like that if it was a accident or she killed herself,nor do they lie and block the home from ever being searched if they had nothing to hide. When I gave just a tad bit of my theory it was from so many sources of info that is very logical and backs up the real events of everything since day one and also things that Joran has done before Natalee arrived in Aruba. It is not just my theory but many who have followed this closely at SM.
That was just an interview in an talk show called 'De wereld draait door'.quote:I can't wait for his next show as hopefully he has more. I know you all aren't his biggest fans but there is no one else that is making a impact on solving this case.
I´m back.
all the info is on Aruba, no doubt. inside the building of the OM.quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 03:15 schreef letsgetthiscasesolved het volgende:
Well see, those are good questions...but don't get too hard on observer777 he has seen it all in 2 + years..may be he says, just all go to ... and find the info yourself..the things they digged up the last years..i'm convident that it's more than Hans Mos has..because they wrecked all the info when he started, yes, from scratch with nothing, was probably all shredded..that's why they have 2+ more info on us
but nobody has the balls to come forward because heads are going to roll because of incompetence.
this Aruba thing is very messed up in all sort of ways.
there is talk of independence since 1986. then they said within 10 years.
justice minister Croes says he doesn't like his Dutch passport.
prime minister Oduber als talks about indepence sometimes.
friday Croes and Hirsch Ballin were hitting at eachother in covert press releases.
Croes said: don't send me bad Dutchies (Joran), if you are going to send me bad Arubans.
(Hirsch Ballin wants to make a law sending bad Arubans/Antillans back).
that says a lot. why not send them to prison?
friday will be interesting to see how Balkenende behaves on Aruba.
Hirsch Ballin is also around, but i doubt he will even go to Aruba, because then he has te meet his rival Croes.
and they are pretending it is a low-key visit.
just ask around people you meet: how many of them know Balkenende is visiting the Antilles/Aruba this week?? very few.
but it is one of the most important visits in years by Balkenende regarding the Kingdom.
and then on top of that: the Natalee / van der Sloot-scandal.
i really don't know how they are going to spin this thing.
if you ask me to make a very wild prediction Aruba might declare indepence and Joran will never be prosecuted on Aruba. Joran made those outrageous comments in the car while he was in driving around in The Netherlands. are those comments in itself not reason enough for TBS. i don't know. what a mess.
that happens when the economy is more important than the justice department.
Dostojewski: "Je kunt je niet van je eigen gezond verstand overtuigen door je buurman op te sluiten."
This is what the mean by They...quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 04:20 schreef observer777 het volgende:
[..]
I went back several times to research every blog in June 2005 and was stunned to see these trolls infiltrated every single blog since the very beginning. Alot of them use many names and are payed by the ATA to lie and slander the victim,spread wrong info and to protect Aruba's image. Others are just creepy internet people and a few are friends of JK2. In the end it is the Aruban Govt who bankrolled this and they have never let up. They did a little bit of this to others who went missing before Natalee. You can find many of those posters at RU and FOB2. They are reading here and I am sure I will be attacked once again very soon.
wiki this one (this is just an example)
the Rendon group. Media Managment to the full and best...
The rendon group is not involved in this. But other wich do the same are.
Remember were Aruba is located, and it has NOTHING todo with tourists.
Observer777: could you provide me info on the attacks on you.
John 8:32
Welcome Mr. President, How can we serve you,
Oh god het is nog wakkerquote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 04:38 schreef Morwen het volgende:
[..]
Wat een belachelijke opmerking en typ eens in het Nederlands
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
Ryan,quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 04:17 schreef Ryan3 het volgende:
[..]
Oh, btw Observer I would like your comment on my earlier observation.
I stated above that in the beginning the motivation of the internet sleuths might have been pure all right, but that namely with our American friends the motives seem to be slurred. Also resentment of govertments plays a big roll and a certain tendency to think in conspiracies and cover-ups. Rensentment of liberals (of which I think the Van der Sloots are a fine example) and even a bit of bigotry might motivate them...
Otherwise I can't explain certain reactions on SM.
I am a very skeptical person and it takes a lot to prove something to me. I havent looked into these conspiracy theories or Govt politics too much,it's not my cup of tea. So many people give there thoughts on this case and some are radical theories,some are ignorant and others are purely speculation. I try to take it all in but like some of you hear I must see proof. I am most interested in the politics in Aruba as they have most definetly come into play regarding Natalee. I wish I knew more about this,I know some things but not enough.
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
loeter Ryanquote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 04:42 schreef Ryan3 het volgende:
[..]
'It' is still awake you mean?
Anyway, I'm off, 'loeter' as we say in Holland.
sleep tight, don't let the bedbugs bite 
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
Me has some nize connection to Aruba the sunny islannd in the sun.quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 04:35 schreef letsgetthiscasesolved het volgende:
Kraaksandaal: ROFL..I laughed already...skip the translation..aruban?
want this to be solved, get rid of Sloot or what?
And yes this case is demestating for this small island.
***** Kraak.....
To Morwen: Ja man als ik het in nl kon doen, geen probleem.
Maar goed, de naam is sloot, ik heb een vriend die heeft een boot....
Maar goed, de naam is sloot, ik heb een vriend die heeft een boot....
Is that it? The serious post you mean?quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 04:44 schreef kraaksandaal het volgende:
[..]
Me has some nize connection to Aruba the sunny islannd in the sun.
And yes this case is demestating for this small island.
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
Jah, alleen ben ik hier geen modquote:
Was sneller als het licht dicht, Engels gezwam en ook nog totaal oninteressant>Yeah, read this and I am no Joran fan, maar ik kan wel normaal typen. Try it. Really
I used to work in a morgue........I am a people person
Only Human
Only Human
Sjulle we dan maar es naar ons mandje gaan Mor, saampies, gesjellugquote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 04:46 schreef Morwen het volgende:
[..]
Jah, alleen ben ik hier geen mod
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
Echt hoor, get a lifequote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 04:44 schreef letsgetthiscasesolved het volgende:
To Morwen: Ja man als ik het in nl kon doen, geen probleem.
Maar goed, de naam is sloot, ik heb een vriend die heeft een boot....
I used to work in a morgue........I am a people person
Only Human
Only Human
I still have one question (sorry I'm new and already posting my ass off) that keeps bothering me.. Joran said the size of his shoes were size 14, but he actually has size 11.4 or something right? That's what I read.. that's really a difference in sizes, and definitally with walking on a beach.. I don't know why he'd say he has a bigger size of shoes that he actually has.. especially since the shoes haven't been found so why would he say that? Why would he say at all that he left his shoes behind when nobody asks about it?
Now you're talkin' Jackanese.
Hey kraak: I have a licence plate: One Happy island...sorry.. i threw it at the garbage last week..not funny anymore at least to say..if you know something or are just a troll..sorry, but we have our hearts,pride and mind!!
This looks like the same lying crap she put out last year. Right?quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 03:38 schreef letsgetthiscasesolved het volgende:
Ok..The link is:
http://witheet.com/buiten(...)et-zogenaamde-gelijk
It's in dutch and starts ok but then...
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
When the shoes would be found......he could then explaine that they weren't his.
Welcome Mr. President, How can we serve you,
Uhhm, nee, maar dat is niet persoonlijkquote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 04:48 schreef BwennieBren het volgende:
[..]
Sjulle we dan maar es naar ons mandje gaan Mor, saampies, gesjellug
Ik hou wel van die stervende muisjes
I used to work in a morgue........I am a people person
Only Human
Only Human
quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 04:49 schreef observer777 het volgende:
[..]
This looks like the same lying crap she put out last year. Right?
YEP
Welcome Mr. President, How can we serve you,
10.5 measured by a KLPD Interrogator while earlier it was reported many times they were looking for size 14. I am glad some of you are starting to catch onquote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 04:48 schreef I.B het volgende:
I still have one question (sorry I'm new and already posting my ass off) that keeps bothering me.. Joran said the size of his shoes were size 14, but he actually has size 11.4 or something right? That's what I read.. that's really a difference in sizes, and definitally with walking on a beach.. I don't know why he'd say he has a bigger size of shoes that he actually has.. especially since the shoes haven't been found so why would he say that? Why would he say at all that he left his shoes behind when nobody asks about it?
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Observer777:Yes almost the same and then she says she has new info..keep in mind S-she works for them
quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 04:50 schreef Morwen het volgende:
[..]
Uhhm, nee, maar dat is niet persoonlijk
Ik hou wel van die stervende muisjes
now well then i go alone all by myself, because i verveel me a bit and so... and i only like mices when they are lying on my bread, in chocolate, dead, in cremebutter
By all! Have a nice day/night whatever
Ik ben niet labiel. Ik ben emotioneel flexibel.
Observer777: could you provide me info on the attacks on you. Or link to the blog or website.
John 8:32
John 8:32
Welcome Mr. President, How can we serve you,
witheetquote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 04:49 schreef observer777 het volgende:
[..]
This looks like the same lying crap she put out last year. Right?
there is also Steve Brown. he hates Peter R. guts.
not sure why. his blogs are so ridiculious it is funny.
here he is kicking Peter R.
http://www.dumpert.nl/med(...)/komt_die_schop.html
so without even reading witheet they must be making up stories.
Dostojewski: "Je kunt je niet van je eigen gezond verstand overtuigen door je buurman op te sluiten."
Bye, Bwen, ben er ook weg vanquote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 04:53 schreef BwennieBren het volgende:
[..]
and i only like mices when they are lying on my bread, in chocolate, dead, in cremebutter
By all! Have a nice day/night whatever
Vert: Bye, Bwen, I am of too Neem mij niet serieus, daar heb ik anderen voor
I used to work in a morgue........I am a people person
Only Human
Only Human
Hallo,quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 04:29 schreef I.B het volgende:
Um Observer I'd like to ask you a question. A few posts back I saw your posts about hairs being found and more. But the date that news came out was from 2005. Now, I may be wrong, but if it had anything to do with Natalee, it would be brought up now by Peter or whoever don't you think? I'd say it would at least be still on the news or anything but I don't read or see anything about it anymore.
I never posted about the duct tape and hairs but the Bloody Mattress and the Security shirt and other items found. They were found the 5th and 6th of June 2005 and because zero forensic evidence has been found,many people wonder if this as well as other evidence was overlooked or destroyed. The Security shirt,no one has ever stated it was not linked to this case and Jorans Attorney says that is why GVC was arrested and the shirt contained forensic evidence that is part of this case. It is very interesting where it was found and the area that surrounds it. Julia Renfro and others were guiding search teams up north while this evidence was found in the south. Often times in this investigation the opposite has been proven true.
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Brown has a derayled drugs case to solve with peter which didn't exist..still..steve want's to show peter he's something..with slippertje..to my honest believing..steve is now a writer and peter is trying to get rid off al this fuss..so the vendetta stays....
I know everething about smoking pot there, problem is in this case, there is no dead body.quote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 04:48 schreef letsgetthiscasesolved het volgende:
Hey kraak: I have a licence plate: One Happy island...sorry.. i threw it at the garbage last week..not funny anymore at least to say..if you know something or are just a troll..sorry, but we have our hearts,pride and mind!!
Yes the Sloot guy talks allot of rubbish, maybe he just don't knew where he was and maybe he exactly knew.
Who can say?
***** Kraak.....
I do not want to get into the attacks on me as they have been plentiful. Some strange people are on the internet and these things happen in general,however this case has attracted many strange birds since the beginning. The other side of this is the trolls,the plants,the dis-information posters who have attacked most everyone that has searched for the truth. Since 2005 I have been threatened,stalked,harrased,slandered..You name itquote:Op dinsdag 12 februari 2008 04:39 schreef WallOfStars het volgende:
[..]
This is what the mean by They...
wiki this one (this is just an example)
the Rendon group. Media Managment to the full and best...
The rendon group is not involved in this. But other wich do the same are.
Remember were Aruba is located, and it has NOTHING todo with tourists.
Observer777: could you provide me info on the attacks on you.
John 8:32
Remember Aruba relies on something like 70% of there income is from American tourists and 3/4 of Arubans work in the tourism Industry. Much of what they are doing is to protect there precious tourism as well as the truth about the corruption and the cover up of what happened to Natalee.
Ryan: I posted a few things about Joran giving date rape drugs to others before Natalee arrived here at FOK. He bragged to classmates,he told a adult proffessional(Shrink)and three girls at one time did come forward about this. One of the fathers spoke out in a interview in a newspaper about this and said it was similar to what he read happened to Natalee. If you are that interested I can put together all what I have learned. You will not find it in a PV because we believe the girls were threatened,the classmates were probably scared and it was probably deleted from the statements. No doubt in my mind this happened to Natalee and Joran did it to others before her. You can even read up on his buddy's arrest(Freddy)who was suspected of having sex with a unconscious person. His arrest was related to this case and he was arrested when K2 were arrested the second time in 2005.
[ Bericht 32% gewijzigd door observer777 op 12-02-2008 05:17:10 ]
"I lied and that's the truth"--Joran Van Der Sloot--
Sorry for the mix-up Observer.. I don't get the bloody mattrass.. they say it's dog's blood because Joran killed one with a paintgun (I really wanna know if this was on purpose) but how could the shirt be involved in the case? If it was then Joran, the Kalpoe-brothers or Natalee had to wear this on that night but then everyone or at least her girlfriends would have seen it.. and that's not the case otherwise this would be really important evidence in the case.
Now you're talkin' Jackanese.
