Liveblog Al Jazeeraquote:Tijdlijn van de ontwikkelingen in Oekrane
NOVEMBER
* Nov 21: Kiev suddenly announces suspension of trade and association talks with the EU and opts to revive economic ties with Moscow, triggering months of mass rallies in Kiev.
* Nov 30: Riot police try to break up the Kiev demonstration by force. Protest turns against Yanukovich and his government.
DECEMBER
Protests continue with crowds of up to 800,000. Some clashes with police. Opposition forms bloc called Maidan. Yanukovich and Putin meet, Putin agrees to buy $15 billion of Ukrainian debt and to slash by a third the price of Russian gas supplies to Ukraine.
JANUARY
* Jan 22: Three people die in protests in Kiev. EU threatens action over crisis. Talks between opposition, Yanukovich fail.
* Jan 23: Washington threatens sanctions over violence.
* Jan 26: Unrest spreads to pro-Yanukovich east.
FEBRUARY
Anti-government protests turn increasingly violent. At least 77 people killed in clashes between demonstrators and police.
* Feb 21: Opposition leaders sign EU-mediated peace pact with Yanukovich.
* Feb 22: Ukraine's parliament votes to remove Yanukovich, who flees. Arch-rival Yulia Tymoshenko released from jail.
* Feb 26: Ukraine appoints new government. Angry Russia puts 150,000 troops on high alert.
* Feb 27-28: Armed men seize Crimea parliament, raise Russian flag. Militia take control of two airports in Crimea.
MARCH
* March 1: Putin wins parliamentary approval to invade Ukraine, angering the White House. Russian forces fan out in Crimea.
* March 6: Crimea's leadership votes to join Russia. U.S. President Barack Obama orders sanctions on those responsible for Moscow's actions in Ukraine.
EU leaders hold emergency summit to find ways to pressure Russia to back down and accept mediation.
* March 15: Two killed in clashes between pro-Russian demonstrators and Ukrainian nationalists.
* March 16: Referendum held in Crimea, shows overwhelming support for joining the Russian Federation.
* March 21: Putin signs laws completing annexation of Crimea. The U.S. imposes sanctions on Putin's close allies, EU follows with similar measures.
* March 23: NATO says Russia has amassed a large force at Ukraine's border.
* March 24: Ukraine pulls troops from Crimea.
APRIL
* April 2: NATO suspends cooperation with Russia.
* April 7: Pro-Russia activists in eastern Ukraine proclaim the creation of the "Donetsk People's Republic".
* April 12: Separatists take control of city of Slaviansk in eastern Ukraine. Kiev prepares troops.
* April 13: One Ukrainian state security officer killed and five wounded in operation against separatists.
* April 14: Obama warns Putin in phone call that Moscow would face further costs for its actions in Ukraine.
* April 17: Pro-Russian separatists seize armored vehicles of Ukraine forces trying to recapture rebel-controlled town.
* April 18: The United States, Russia, Ukraine and the EU reach deal for illegal armed groups to disarm and end occupations of public buildings and spaces.
* April 19: Separatists say they will not sign deal until the Kiev government steps down.
* April 24: Ukraine sends in troops again to try to expel the separatists in Slaviansk, kill five rebels.
* April 25: Ukrainian forces mount full blockade of Slaviansk. Separatists detain group of international observers, say a Kiev "spy" among them.
* April 26: G7 leaders agree to impose extra sanctions on Russia over Ukraine. Yatsenyuk cuts short a Vatican trip to see Pope Francis, saying Russian warplanes violated Ukraine's airspace seven times overnight. Russia denies the claim.
* April 27: Rebels say the OSCE observers are "prisoners of war" and present them in front of the press, where they say they have not been mistreated.
* April 28: West imposes new sanctions on Moscow. Russia vows a "painful" response. Russia says troops have returned to barracks after conducting exercises on the border with Ukraine. The West says there is no sign of this pull-back. Russia assures the US it will not invade Ukraine.
* April 29: Russia accuses Washington of seeking to revive Iron Curtain policies. Putin warns sanctions could harm Western interests in Russia's lucrative energy sector, denies there are Russian forces in eastern Ukraine.
* April 30: Kiev says its armed forces are on "full combat alert" against a possible Russian invasion. Interim president Oleksandr Turchynov admits Kiev is "helpless" to prevent rebels over-running towns. Rebels storm the regional police building and town hall in Gorlivka. The International Monetary Fund approves $17-billion aid deal for the beleaguered Ukrainian economy.
MAY
* May 1: Some 300 pro-Russian militants seize prosecutor's office in Donetsk amid violent clashes with police. Conscription reintroduced for all Ukrainian men aged 18-25.
* May 2: Ukrainian commandos launch pre-dawn raid to retake Slavyansk. Rebels shoot down two helicopters and two servicemen are killed.
* May 3: Slavyansk rebels free OSCE inspectors after Kremlin envoy intervenes. Two days of mourning proclaimed over Odessa deaths. Fierce firefights around Slavyansk and nearby towns as military seeks to retake control.
* May 4: Kiev vows to expand "anti-terrorism" operations. Yatsenyuk launches probe into security forces in Odessa over the deaths.
May 5: A fresh assault begins on Slovyansk. The interior minister says more than 30 rebels are killed. Four servicemen are also killed. Russia warns Europe's peace is at risk. UN chief Ban Ki-moon offers to mediate personally as the West launches new diplomatic push.
May 6: Russia rejects a German-led move for a new peace meeting. Germany says Ukraine is on the verge of war.
May 7: In a surprise announcement, Putin calls for rebel independence referendums to be pushed back and endorses Ukraine's planned presidential election. He says Russian troops pulled back from border. The new overall toll from Ukrainian military operations stands at 14 servicemen dead.
May 8: Rebels vow to press on with referendums despite Putin's call. Russia conducts military exercises, test-fires several missiles, and says nuclear capabilities are on "constant combat alert." NATO says there is no sign of a Russian troop pull-back.
May 9: Putin flies to annexed Crimea after overseeing a display of military might in the Red Square where he paid tribute to Russia's "all-conquering patriotic force." Clashes break out in Mariupol that the interior minister says leave 21 dead.
May 10: France and Germany threaten to step up sanctions against Russia if the May 25 election is disrupted and urge Kiev to cease "offensive" operations before the vote.
May 11: "Referendums" are held in the provinces of Luhansk and Donetsk. Fighting is reported around Slovyansk as rebels try to retake TV tower.
May 12: Pro-Russia activists declare resounding victory in a twin referendum on sovereignty for eastern Ukraine. The provinces of Donetsk and Luhansk voted on Sunday to secede from Ukraine. Russian gas giant Gazprom gives Ukraine until June 3 to pay $1.6bn for natural gas. The EU ramps up sanctions on Moscow.
May 13: Seven Ukrainian soldiers killed in rebel ambush in the deadliest single loss of life for the military since the start of the uprising.
May 14: Ukraine hosts "national unity" talks based on an OSCE roadmap but rebels are not invited.
twitter:Ruptly twitterde op donderdag 24-07-2014 om 16:55:19RT @RuptlyNewsroom: #Ukrainian PM #Yatseniuk resigns from office. Stay tuned for updates @Ruptly. reageer retweet
twitter:KuznetsovMedia twitterde op donderdag 24-07-2014 om 16:57:44BREAKING: #Ukraine's PM #Yatseniuk announces his resignation after pro-Western parliamentary coalition fallen apart earlier today. reageer retweet
How, ik zeg niet dat het een NAVO missie is, enkel dat de deelnemers leden van de NAVO zijn.quote:Op donderdag 24 juli 2014 16:49 schreef DeJori het volgende:
[..]
Gaat het niet door de UNSC dan? Want als het een NAVO ding is wordt meth's verhaal opeens een stuk waarschijnlijker.
Oh, grappig. Het pro-Westers parlement is hopelijk uiteen gevallen in pro-Westerse politici en pro-Westerse nazi's... Dan kunnen die nazi's opgeruimd worden, en kan er misschien een oplossing komen voor de situatie in Oost-Oekraine die NIET aan vele burgers het leven zal kosten.quote:Op donderdag 24 juli 2014 16:59 schreef Ketchupcurry het volgende:
twitter:KuznetsovMedia twitterde op donderdag 24-07-2014 om 16:57:44BREAKING: #Ukraine's PM #Yatseniuk announces his resignation after pro-Western parliamentary coalition fallen apart earlier today. reageer retweet
twitter:lennutrajektoor twitterde op donderdag 24-07-2014 om 17:08:33#Russian #Duma suspended its session on news of #Ukraine PM resignation & dissolve of coalition to have a standing ovation. reageer retweet
twitter:lennutrajektoor twitterde op donderdag 24-07-2014 om 16:56:37NSDC: #ATO forces liberated Northern districts of #Lisinchansk. #Donetsk #Ukraine reageer retweet
twitter:MiddleEast_BRK twitterde op donderdag 24-07-2014 om 17:06:21#BreakingNews Ukrainian forces claim,they encircled the city of #Lisiciansk and Russian invaders have nowhere to flee http://t.co/lJc2dxa0Ud reageer retweet
quote:Rada speaker announces dissolution of parliamentary coalition
Verkhovna Rada Chairman Oleksandr Turchynov has officially announced the dissolution of the European Choice parliamentary coalition in Ukraine's parliament.
Earlier on Thursday, the UDAR, Svoboda factions and 19 independent MPs announced their exit from the coalition in the Verkhovna Rada.
The coalition called European Choice comprised of 250 deputies was set up at the Rada on February 27, 2014. The coalition was formed by the factions of Batkivschyna, UDAR, Svoboda, Economic Development, Sovereign European Ukraine, and other MPs.
If no new coalition is formed within 30 days following the previous one's dissolution, this would entitle the president to dissolve the Verkhovna Rada and call early parliamentary elections.
The UDAR faction currently comprises 41, Svoboda 35, Batkivschyna 86, Economic Development 41, and Sovereign European Ukraine 35 parliamentarians.
Another 86 deputies belong to the parliamentary faction of the Party of Regions, 23 to the Communist Party's faction, which was dissolved on Thursday, and 34 to the For Peace and Stability group.
As of Thursday morning, 72 parliamentarians did not belong to any faction or group.
A ruling coalition is supposed to comprise at least 226 parliamentarians.
twitter:Kateryna_Kruk twitterde op donderdag 24-07-2014 om 17:09:06bill setting early parliamentary elections September 28 was registered in #Rada reageer retweet
quote:Rada registers bill setting early parliamentary elections date for September 28, 2014
The Verkhovna Rada has registered a bill scheduling the early parliamentary elections on September 28, 2014.
The bill was authored by the Sovereign European Ukraine parliamentary group member Volodymyr Lytvyn, and the group's representatives, Ihor Yeremeyev and Yaroslav Moskalenko.
Ik bedoelde ook dat wat je zei over dat Poetin niet blij zou zijn met zo'n missie.quote:Op donderdag 24 juli 2014 17:00 schreef meth1745 het volgende:
[..]
How, ik zeg niet dat het een NAVO missie is, enkel dat de deelnemers leden van de NAVO zijn.
Dit was vooraf gepland, er is niets gevallen. Dit is enkel bedoeld om nieuwe verkiezingen uit te schrijven.quote:Op donderdag 24 juli 2014 17:02 schreef RetepV het volgende:
[..]
Oh, grappig. Het pro-Westers parlement is hopelijk uiteen gevallen in pro-Westerse politici en pro-Westerse nazi's... Dan kunnen die nazi's opgeruimd worden, en kan er misschien een oplossing komen voor de situatie in Oost-Oekraine die NIET aan vele burgers het leven zal kosten.
http://www.rferl.org/media/video/25468569.htmltwitter:myroslavapetsa twitterde op donderdag 24-07-2014 om 13:48:39The moment insurgents' commander Alexander #Khodakovsky admitted separatists had a Buk - @Reuters audio via @RFERL http://t.co/R6f2TGopGC reageer retweet
quote:Op donderdag 24 juli 2014 17:50 schreef Automatisch het volgende:
Militairen mogen niet op verlof
Toegevoegd: donderdag 24 jul 2014, 17:32
Militairen van de Luchtmobiele Brigade zijn gevraagd om dit weekend niet op verlof te gaan en op de kazernes in Schaarsbergen en Assen te blijven. Wellicht heeft dat te maken heeft met een eventuele bewapende missie in het oosten van Oekrane.
Een woordvoerder van het crisisteam van het kabinet laat weten dat de terugkeer van alle slachtoffers en helderheid over de toedracht van de ramp de hoogste prioriteit is. En daarom wordt met alle mogelijkheden rekening gehouden.
"Zo worden bijvoorbeeld ook mensen geconsigneerd zodat direct gehandeld kan worden mocht daartoe aanleiding zijn. In dit geval betekent het dat militairen zich beschikbaar moeten houden en niet op verlof kunnen. Dit maakt standaard deel uit van een planningsproces", aldus de woordvoerder.
Brief
Het kabinet lijkt aan te sturen op een internationale politiemissie bij de rampplek in Oekrane. Waarschijnlijk volgt snel een notificatiebrief waarin staat dat het kabinet de mogelijkheid en wenselijkheid van zo'n missie onderzoekt. Het is bijna altijd de opmaat voor een daadwerkelijke missie.
Rusland heeft de afgelopen weken vanuit Rusland op het grondgebied van Oekraine geschoten om de grens open te houden voor de doorvoer van wapens en rebellen.quote:
Geloof ik, maar slechte timing wel...quote:Op donderdag 24 juli 2014 17:48 schreef DeJori het volgende:
[..]
Dit was vooraf gepland, er is niets gevallen. Dit is enkel bedoeld om nieuwe verkiezingen uit te schrijven.
Ja, dit verzoek is ook echt droevig, je kon bij voorbaat weten dat er 0% kans is dat het gehonoreerd wordtquote:Op donderdag 24 juli 2014 18:27 schreef deelnemer het volgende:
Russia Rejects Calls for Substantial Monitoring of Russian Side of Border
twitter:KyivPost twitterde op donderdag 24-07-2014 om 18:07:53Ukrainian troops enter #Lysychansk http://t.co/6gzdUSClfI reageer retweet
twitter:lennutrajektoor twitterde op donderdag 24-07-2014 om 18:58:14#USA Senat & #Australian parliament are considering announcing DPR & LDR terrorists organisations. #Ukraine #Donetsk #Luhansk reageer retweet
twitter:Interpreter_Mag twitterde op donderdag 24-07-2014 om 18:41:57Freed Russian Journalist Says RT Stringer Philips Still Held by Ukrainian Soldiers http://t.co/QR4LCKb5Gc reageer retweet
twitter:UKgrids twitterde op donderdag 24-07-2014 om 19:16:10@lennutrajektoor @AbraxasSpa @RutheniaRus Where the missing passengers were seated will be revealing. reageer retweet
Lichamen in bodybags:twitter:yuliagorbunova_ twitterde op donderdag 24-07-2014 om 20:31:00Exhumation of a mass grave in Sloviansk. Locals said they saw insurgents dumping bodies there in June http://t.co/3piLVFfzpm reageer retweet
SPOILEROm spoilers te kunnen lezen moet je zijn ingelogd. Je moet je daarvoor eerst gratis Registreren. Ook kun je spoilers niet lezen als je een ban hebt.Ik ben DeJori en ik wil aangesproken worden als DeJori. Ik heb handboeien en ik heb pepperspray. Ik los dat hier op op mijn manier. Aight?
Plus het feit dat het uiteenvallen van de drie basisstaten van de GOS in 1991-1992 zo totaal onverwacht kwam voor de Russen. Dat hadden zij van te voren niet ingeschat dat zelfs De Oekrane en Wit-Rusland zich destijds wilden afscheiden.quote:Op donderdag 24 juli 2014 16:40 schreef meth1745 het volgende:
Russen zitten nog steeds met de kater van ex-Jugoslavi, VN-resolutie Irak, Lybi...
Telkens is het Westen verder gegaan dan wat de Russen wilden toelaten; Irak had al z'n wapens vernietigd, de inspecteurs zouden het moeten checken maar werden teruggeroepen en de oorlog begon. In de Balkan is uit elk bevrijd gebied een groot deel van de Servische bevolking verdreven (en zoveel jaar later krijgen we te horen dat berichten over orgaanroof geen propaganda waren, gisteren werden eerste vervolgingen voor kosovo tribunaal aangekondigd). Lybi vonden ze ook niet leuk.
Ik denk dat die zaken zwaar meespelen voor de Russen, de vrees dat als NAVO een voet in de deur krijgt (zelfs al is het onrechtstreeks door politiemissie) het voor Rusland of de etnische Russen slecht zal aflopen.
Ik snap dat ze niet altijd alles kunnen vrijgeven, maar frustrerend is het wel...quote:Op donderdag 24 juli 2014 20:52 schreef deelnemer het volgende:
U.S. says Russia firing artillery across border at Ukrainian military
(Reuters) - The United States said on Thursday that Russia was firing artillery across the border into Ukraine to target Ukrainian military positions in the conflict against pro-Russian separatists.
"We have new evidence that the Russians intend to deliver heavier and more powerful multiple rocket launchers to the separatist forces in Ukraine, and have evidence that Russia is firing artillery from within Russia to attack Ukrainian military positions," State Department spokeswoman Marie Harf said.
Harf, speaking at a regular media briefing, said the information was based on intelligence reports. "I can't tell you what the information is based on," she said.
quote:Of the 54 rounds collected, only five appeared to have been manufactured after the Soviet collapse. All of these rounds bore stamps from Luhansk.
The presence of the ammunition from multiple Soviet factories that were busily manufacturing standard ammunition for Soviet rifles in the late Soviet period aligns neatly with historical factors at play in Ukraine. Put simply, these rounds, along with the samples from Luhansk, carried the headstamps one would expect in Ukrainian military arsenals and in the unregistered stockpiles from the Soviet collapse. The provenance of the stamps also aligns with rebel claims that much of their ammunition was captured from dispirited government troops, or was purchased from corrupt local police or sympathetic military officers.
This, of course, will not settle any arguments, and it shouldn’t, given the small sample size. (We invite other researchers to gather and pool more data and see where it leads.) Some commentators might want to claim that the presence of cartridges manufactured on Russian soil suggests that a recent Kremlin hand was involved in funneling these rounds to the fighters, and thereby stoking eastern Ukraine’s violence. This sample certainly does not disprove that possibility, as similar cartridges would be expected to be found over the border in Russia, in neighboring countries, and in the pro-Russian enclave of Transnistria. The Organized Crime and Corruption Reporting Project posted a video report earlier this month of a sting showing one possible way that arms have flowed into eastern Ukraine from Transnistria. And any smart arms pipeline to the rebels would match headstamps smuggled into Ukraine to those already in Ukrainian stockpiles.
Still, given Ukraine’s arms-trafficking circles, smuggling weapons into Ukraine might not be necessary. And a fuller read of Ukraine’s peculiar stockpiling history means that these cartridges cannot be pinned to any external foreign support by identification alone, and that local sources are more than plausible for much of what was fired at the edges of Slovyansk in May. If that was the case, Ukraine has been suffering from what its corrupt arms dealers once shipped. Its violence, tied to surplus arms far beyond what its military might ever need, and that might better have been destroyed long ago, is a reminder of the many excess stockpiles around the world, all of them latent firepower, waiting for their day.
Ik vond de theorie van KoosVogels in het MH17 topic best aannemelijk. Stuur alvast deze marechaussees en jaag er dan zo snel mogelijk een VN resolutie doorheen. Dan kun je de luchtmobiele brigade ernaartoe sturen.quote:Op donderdag 24 juli 2014 22:01 schreef AlexanderDeGrote het volgende:
Heeft iemand in dit topic er vertrouwen in dat het goed gaat komen met die 40 ongewapende marechaussees? Met al die vage mafkezen met een te groot geweer (van beide kanten) die daar zitten. Het lijkt wel een soort aas om een reactie uit te lokken van kwaadwillenden.
Echt een typisch Nederlandse halve oplossing. Of je maakt een goede deal met de rebellen of je imponeert ze met machtsvertoon. Wat moet zo'n man nu als hij geconfronteerd wordt met een agressieve rebel die al in Tsjetsjeni gevochten heeft?
In 2005 werd de overtollige munitie in Oekraine op 2 miljoen ton geschat, zoveel als de UK en US tesamen tijdens de tweede wereldoorlog boven Europa hadden gedropt. In 2009 was de inventaris volgens een wikileaks cable opgelopen tot 5 miljoen ton.quote:Op donderdag 24 juli 2014 21:08 schreef DeJori het volgende:
Een erg lang, maar interessant artikel over de gebruikte munitie in The New York Times:
http://atwar.blogs.nytime(...)s&smid=tw-share&_r=0
De 'conclusie':
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quote:Ukraine: Unguided Rockets Killing Civilians
(Donetsk) – Unguided Grad rockets launched apparently by Ukrainian government forces and pro-government militias have killed at least 16 civilians and wounded many more in insurgent-controlled areas of Donetsk and its suburbs in at least four attacks between July 12 and 21, 2014, Human Rights Watch said today.
The use of indiscriminate rockets in populated areas violates international humanitarian law, or the laws of war, and may amount to war crimes.
Grads are unguided rockets that cannot be targeted accurately, and are often fired in salvos from multi-barrel rocket launchers to saturate a wide area. Human Rights Watch called on all parties to the conflict in eastern Ukraine, particularly Ukrainian government forces, to stop using Grad rockets in or near populated areas because of the likelihood of killing and wounding civilians. Insurgent forces should minimize the risk to civilians under their control by avoiding deploying forces and weapons in densely populated areas.
“Grad rockets are notoriously imprecise weapons that shouldn’t be used in populated areas,” said Ole Solvang, senior emergencies researcher at Human Rights Watch. “If insurgent and Ukrainian government forces are serious about limiting harm to civilians, they should both immediately stop using these weapons in populated areas.”
[...]
http://www.hrw.org/news/2(...)ts-killing-civilians
Een bekend verhaal. Maar er zijn meer verhalen:quote:Op donderdag 24 juli 2014 21:08 schreef DeJori het volgende:
Een erg lang, maar interessant artikel over de gebruikte munitie in The New York Times:
http://atwar.blogs.nytime(...)s&smid=tw-share&_r=0
De 'conclusie':
[..]
Ik vind het de verstandigste beslissing die ze konden nemen. Geen gevaar voor vuurgevecht omdat n partij zich bedreigd voelt, ook geen discussie mogelijk over wie met schieten is begonnen.quote:Op donderdag 24 juli 2014 22:01 schreef AlexanderDeGrote het volgende:
Heeft iemand in dit topic er vertrouwen in dat het goed gaat komen met die 40 ongewapende marechaussees? Met al die vage mafkezen met een te groot geweer (van beide kanten) die daar zitten. Het lijkt wel een soort aas om een reactie uit te lokken van kwaadwillenden.
Echt een typisch Nederlandse halve oplossing. Of je maakt een goede deal met de rebellen of je imponeert ze met machtsvertoon. Wat moet zo'n man nu als hij geconfronteerd wordt met een agressieve rebel die al in Tsjetsjeni gevochten heeft?
twitter:StateOfUkraine twitterde op donderdag 24-07-2014 om 22:55:15As a result of a two-day military operation #Ukraine troops took control over #Lysychansk; some RU left the city before the main assault. reageer retweet
twitter:MiddleEast_BRK twitterde op donderdag 24-07-2014 om 22:23:51#BreakingConfirmation Ukrainian forces liberate #Lisiciansk! "All administrative buildings of the town are under the control of the ATO." reageer retweet
twitter:MiddleEast_BRK twitterde op donderdag 24-07-2014 om 22:49:12#Maps Left: Russian one, Right: Ukrainian one. I marked, where I fear, the Russian one is more accurate ... http://t.co/fLU1qlKx6a reageer retweet
Ik vind het onverstandig. Want je hebt geen controle over de situatie, maar bent afhankelijk van de goede wil van anderen. Daarbij zijn de rebellen ongebonden aan iedere norm of regel. Je kan als menselijk schild gebruikt worden, gegijzeld worden, in de weg staan....quote:Op donderdag 24 juli 2014 22:01 schreef AlexanderDeGrote het volgende:
Heeft iemand in dit topic er vertrouwen in dat het goed gaat komen met die 40 ongewapende marechaussees? Met al die vage mafkezen met een te groot geweer (van beide kanten) die daar zitten. Het lijkt wel een soort aas om een reactie uit te lokken van kwaadwillenden.
Echt een typisch Nederlandse halve oplossing. Of je maakt een goede deal met de rebellen of je imponeert ze met machtsvertoon. Wat moet zo'n man nu als hij geconfronteerd wordt met een agressieve rebel die al in Tsjetsjeni gevochten heeft?
twitter:ggatehouse twitterde op donderdag 24-07-2014 om 12:52:16But int'l observers on the ground say: only Dutch experts present are forensic, not aviation. reageer retweet
twitter:ggatehouse twitterde op donderdag 24-07-2014 om 12:53:23Malaysian experts I spoke to said they were civil aviation, not qualified to inspect shrapnel-shredded fuselage reageer retweet
twitter:ggatehouse twitterde op donderdag 24-07-2014 om 12:55:213 Australians arrived today as well but two of them diplomats, not experts. #MH17. In short, there currently isn't really an investigation reageer retweet
quote:Ukraine Advances After Heavy Fighting
DONETSK, Ukraine – While most eyes of the world were focused on the July 17 downing of Malaysia Airlines Flight MH17 that killed 298 people, Ukraine’s government forces continued assaults that regained territory from Russian-backed separatist fighters.
Using everything from small arms and mortars to heavy artillery and airstrikes, they have managed to retake some key cities in Donetsk and Luhansk oblasts, home to 15 percent of Ukraine’s population, forcing the insurgents to retreat to provincial capitals and their outskirts.
The military is closer than ever to fully encircling the rebels. But the wins have come at a steep cost. Hundreds of civilians have been killed since the government launched its anti-terrorist operation in mid-April.
In the past week alone, there have been dozens more casualties as well as heavy damage to residential buildings and infrastructure. The military also lost two more warplanes this week, shot down at an altitude of 5,200 meters by what Kyiv authorities say were rockets fired from Russian territory. Brought down near Savur-Mohyla and Dmytrivka, their shooting-down brought the total number of aircraft downed or damaged since the start of the conflict to nearly 20.
Kremlin-backed guerillas also continue to control a strategic border crossing near Izvaryye in Luhansk Oblast, which they use to transport weapons and reinforcements from Russia into Ukraine, according to Kyiv and Western intelligence sources.
[...]
http://www.kyivpost.com/c(...)fighting-357839.html
quote:If the West doesn’t do more for Ukraine now, it might soon be too late
VLADIMIR PUTIN has responded to the international outrage over the destruction of a Malaysian airliner by his proxies in eastern Ukraine by escalating his aggression. According to U.S. officials, tanks, artillery and other heavy weapons have continued to cross from Russia to Ukraine since the passenger jet was shot down. On Wednesday, two more Ukrainian military jets were hit by anti-aircraft missiles, which Ukrainian officials said had been fired from Russia. The State Department also said Thursday that Russian artillery was firing at Ukrainian positions from across the border.
The Russian president is clearly not impressed by Western responses to the killing of 298 innocent people and the subsequent attempt by his government and its proxies to deny and cover up the crime. And why should he be? After making a statement Monday that contained no tangible response and only a vague threat that “the costs for Russia’s behavior” will increase, President Obama departed for three days of fundraising on the West Coast. The message to Mr. Putin — not to mention the Israelis, Palestinians and Iraqis fighting their own wars — was that the president was not engaged enough by the crises to set aside the purely political activity of collecting checks from donors.
In Brussels, European Union officials met Thursday to discuss potential sanctions against Russia, including new measures against the banking, energy and arms industries. But no decisions will be made before next week, and even then Moscow will likely be given a new deadline for meeting a demand that it stop supplying the Ukrainian rebels. Previous deadlines to cease weapons deliveries have passed with no significant action.
While the West temporizes, a de facto Russian army is rapidly assembling in occupied portions of eastern Ukraine. A report in the Financial Times, sourced to U.S. intelligence officials, says it includes dozens of T-64 battle tanks, Grad rocket launchers, self-propelled guns, infantry combat vehicles with automatic cannons and armored personnel carriers, in addition to anti-aircraft systems like the one that shot down the Malaysian plane. This force is commanded by Russian citizens who infiltrated Ukraine from Moscow, including a Russian secret police colonel, and made up in large part of fighters from Russia.
Incredibly, the European Union’s position — tacitly supported by Mr. Obama — is that the Ukrainian government should stop attempting to expel the invaders from its territory and instead negotiate with them about the political future of Ukraine. Fortunately, newly elected President Petro Poroshenko has not capitulated to this appeasement strategy. However, his appeals for military aid from the United States and NATO, or at least more substantial sanctions, have so far been turned aside by Mr. Obama and the Europeans.
Frustration with Mr. Obama’s weakness now extends to the top ranks of the Democratic Party. A letter released Tuesday by three Senate committee chairs — Dianne Feinstein (Calif.), Carl Levin (Mich.) and Robert Menendez (N.J.) — called on Mr. Obama to “impose immediate broad sanctions” against Russia’s defense sector, as well as broader measures against energy and financial industries, and to explore designating the rebels’ political structure as a foreign terrorist organization. While cooperation with Europe is desirable, the senators said, “the United States must not limit its own national security strategy when swift action will help fulfill our strategic objectives.”
Mr. Obama has already missed the opportunity for swift action to stop Mr. Putin’s escalation. If he does not act soon, it may be too late to save Ukraine.
http://www.washingtonpost(...)a85133bc9_story.html
quote:Poroshenko seeks urgent Rada debate on Yatsenyuk's resignation
Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko has asked Verkhovna Rada Speaker Oleksandr Turchynov to urgently arrange a parliamentary debate concerning the possible resignation of Prime Minister Arseniy Yatsenyuk.
http://www.kyivpost.com/c(...)ignation-357852.html
Uit de bovenstaande tekst:quote:Op vrijdag 25 juli 2014 12:12 schreef deelnemer het volgende:
Een verslag van de (pro)Russische zijde.
Donbass Military Situation Report, July 23, 2014
De belangrijke verbindingen tussen Lugansk en Donetsk.quote:At this time, the following units and field commanders have subordinated to Strelkov and his staff:
Bezler, Mozgovoi, Battallion Oplot, Battalion Kalmius, the Russian Orthodox Army, Brigade Vostok, and the forces operating near Saur-Mogila and Marinovka (DPR).
It is unknown whom the militiamen in Debaltsevo obey. It is also uncertain to whom Ataman Kozitzyn subordinates, and, considering that he is not on good terms with both Bolotov and Strelkov, it is clear that he does not obey them.
Bolotov commands the large part of the Militia units on the LPR territory. In other words, the issue of unified command has not been resolved to date, which is what has been causing public controversies among field commanders.
According to Zakharchenko:quote:The Junta forces remain encircled. This includes the battered 79th and 24th Brigades and the remnants of the 72nd Brigade, as well as the remains of the punitive Battalion Shakhtersk.
For several days now, the bottleneck near Marinovka (DPR), occupied by the Militia, has been under continuous attack by the Junta forces, which are seeking to de-blockade their surrounded troops, but the militiamen have been steadfastly repelling the attacks.
Because the surrounded troops have nowhere to advance, most of their military equipment has been destroyed, and they experience severe difficulties with supplies of fuel, their primary hope for salvation lies either in a breakout through Marinovka (DPR) or in overall success on other fronts.
(Kozhevnya, Dubrovka and Chervonaya Zarya liggen bij de grens)quote:Yesterday there was an assault in the area of Kozhevnya, Dubrovka and Chervonaya Zarya. Strelkovs units, Battalion Oplot and Battalion Steppe took part in the operation.
By the end of the day, Kozhevnya was liberated from the enemy forces. At the very least, the settlement and the river crossing were freed. This morning, according to my information, Dubrovka was also taken. The Dubrovka-Kozhevnya direction is practically in our hands.
The enemy has taken position on the heights near the border. That is where they have their strongholds, pillboxes, bunkers, artillery, and the border crossing checkpoint near Maryanovka. I believe that their liberation is only a question of time it will be done today or tomorrow.
quote:At this time, the hole on the border is approximately 60-80 kilometres and has a tendency to expand. The collapse of the Juntas offensive against the border crossing checkpoints ended up with a heavy defeat and large casualties.
As the border guard service has fallen part, and the Junta has no capacity quickly to grow its forces on the border (they have all been drawn into battles on various directions), then, overall, the border has been safeguarded and the aid continues to flow
The 72nd Brigade, encircled to the south of Izvarino and Krasnodon, has, by the looks of it, ceased to exist as an organized unit. A part of its personnel has fled, a part has joined the encircled 24th and 79th Brigades.
Practically all of the 79th Brigades military equipment has been destroyed or damaged (needs repairs either in field workshops or in factory conditions); there are large manpower losses. It can be confirmed that this is the first completely routed unit of the Ukrainian army itself, apart from the punitive Battalions that had been destroyed earlier.
In general, the situation remains difficult, but the character of the fighting is such that for now there is no suggestion of a DPRs and LPRs complete defeat.
quote:Op donderdag 24 juli 2014 14:53 schreef deelnemer het volgende:
twitter:MiddleEast_BRK twitterde op donderdag 24-07-2014 om 13:51:51The Ukr army 79th airborne brigade was completely destroyed by Rus armed forces and invaders.https://t.co/GnXfhUmRFN http://t.co/yBEaOq1sbv reageer retweet
twitter:MiddleEast_BRK twitterde op donderdag 24-07-2014 om 13:59:49Correction: PARTS of the brigade got destroyed. The ones, stationed near the Russian border in #Luhansk oblast. reageer retweet
quote:vr 25 jul 2014, 11:57
Rusland verhoogt rentetarief onverwacht
MOSKOU (AFN) - De Russische centrale bank heeft het belangrijkste rentetarief onverwacht verhoogd. Dat is vrijdag bekend geworden.
Het tarief staat nu op 8 procent, terwijl het eerder op 7,5 procent stond. Geen enkele van de 23 door persbureau Bloomberg ondervraagde economen had de verhoging verwacht. Een van hen rekende zelfs op een verlaging. Met de jongste verhoging probeert de centrale bank de financile gevolgen van de crisis rond Oekrane en de dreiging van verdere sancties in te dammen.
De rente werd begin maart al met 1,5 procentpunt verhoogd in een poging de aanhoudende devaluatie van de roebel te stoppen. Die verhoging was de grootste sinds de roebelcrisis in 1998. Daarna volgde nog een verhoging eind april.
Naar eigen zeggen lijken de rebellen niet bepaald verslagen. Ook ontvangen ze naar eigen zeggen wapens vanuit Rusland en ligt de grens open. De crash-site, waar de politiemissie naartoe gaat, ligt niet ver ten noorden van de bottleneck Marynivka (Маринівка).quote:Op vrijdag 25 juli 2014 13:15 schreef deelnemer het volgende:
In general, the situation remains difficult, but the character of the fighting is such that for now there is no suggestion of a DPRs and LPRs complete defeat.
ik hoop niet dat ze als kippen zonder kop sancties gaan invoerenquote:'Duurder brood bij sancties Rusland'
Als de spanningen tussen Rusland en Oekrane en Rusland en de Europese landen verder toenemen, kan brood in de supermarkten duurder worden. Agrarische sancties richting graanproducent Rusland "hebben zeker impact" op de graanprijzen.
'Duurder brood bij sancties Rusland' Foto: Thinkstock
Dat stelt sectoreconoom van ABN AMRO Frank Rijkers vrijdag.
Vooralsnog gaan de politieke spanningen in Oekrane en Rusland aan de graanhandel voorbij, stelt ABN AMRO in een sectorupdate.
Begin dit jaar, toen het conflict tussen Rusland en Oekrane escaleerde, werd daar juist wel op gerekend.
Goede vooruitzichten
Als agrarische sancties uitblijven, liggen er juist prijsdalingen in het verschiet. Afgezien van de politieke situatie in Oost-Europa lijken de vooruitzichten goed.
De oogsten zijn beter dan begin dit jaar, toen extreme droogte in Brazili en regen- en sneeuwval in Noord-Amerika roet in het eten gooiden.
De effecten van de ongunstige omstandigheden vorig jaar zwakken af, wat volgens ABN AMRO tot betere productie leidt.
Laagste niveau
Door het toegenomen graanaanbod worden tarwe en andere granen al sinds mei goedkoper. "De graanprijzen naderen de laagste niveau's in vier tot vijf jaar tijd", zegt Rijkers.
Lagere graanprijzen leiden overigens niet automatisch tot goedkoper brood. De lagere prijzen moeten dan wel in de keten worden doorberekend.
Veel van het graan voor de Europese markt komt uit het gebied rondom de Zwarte Zee. Rusland en ook Oekrane zijn belangrijke exporteurs.
http://www.nu.nl/economie(...)ancties-rusland.html
Kan dit iets te maken hebben met de opgeblazen brug bij Donetsk? Die lijkt namelijk een snelweg te blokkeren.quote:Op vrijdag 25 juli 2014 13:15 schreef deelnemer het volgende:
De belangrijke verbindingen tussen Lugansk en Donetsk.
De snelweg E40 / M-04 (Donetsk - Debaltsevo - Alchevsk - Lugansk- Izvaryne) is van groot strategisch belang. Debaltsevo is een belangrijk kruispunt in het gebied van de rebellen.
De H21 van Donetsk naar Lugansk is tweede keus. Hier werd eerder in de week gevochten ten zuiden van Lugansk rond Lutuhyne / Heorhiivka. Daarbij werd gemeld dat Heorhiivka was ingenomen.
Is dat de brug bij Novobakhmutivka die 7 Juli is vernield, maar dan later en wat verder ingestort?quote:Op vrijdag 25 juli 2014 14:32 schreef DeJori het volgende:
[..]
Kan dit iets te maken hebben met de opgeblazen brug bij Donetsk? Die lijkt namelijk een snelweg te blokkeren.
Volgens de bron [671]quote:Timeline of the 2014 pro-Russian unrest in Ukraine - July
7 July
At least three bridges were destroyed by rebel forces. All of the bridges lead into Donetsk city. One of the destroyed railroad bridges was over a highway. The highway was now also blocked.[671]
Novobakhmutivka ligt langs de H20 richting Kramatorsk en Slaviansk.quote:Ukraine crisis: Bridges destroyed outside Donetsk
The bridge destroyed in the village of Novobakhmutivka crossed over a main road out of Donetsk
Two other bridges on roads leading from Sloviansk to Donetsk were also destroyed in the villages of Zakitne and Seleznevka, Ukraine's transportation authority said on Monday.
Ziet er wel verdacht hetzelfde uit, ook de trein die er op staat. Ik heb een hiaat gehad in het zeer nauw volgen van dit conflict, dus had dit niet meegekregen. Bedankt voor de oplettendheid!quote:Op vrijdag 25 juli 2014 15:24 schreef deelnemer het volgende:
[..]
Is dat de brug bij Novobakhmutivka die 7 Juli is vernield, maar dan later en wat verder ingestort?
[..]
Volgens de bron [671]
[..]
Novobakhmutivka ligt langs de H20 richting Kramatorsk en Slaviansk.
Zakitne ligt langs de T-05-13 richting Krasnyi Lyman
Seleznevka ligt vlak bij Slaviansk
Het volgen van de ontwikkelingen is best lastig vanwege de taal barriere. Het eenvoudigst is gewoon Wikipedia lezen. Je loopt slechts 1 dag achter. En zij volgen de Russische berichtgeving beter dan wij in dit topic.quote:Op vrijdag 25 juli 2014 15:27 schreef DeJori het volgende:
[..]
Ziet er wel verdacht hetzelfde uit, ook de trein die er op staat. Ik heb een hiaat gehad in het zeer nauw volgen van dit conflict, dus had dit niet meegekregen. Bedankt voor de oplettendheid!![]()
Overigens hoop ik wel dat Phillips snel vrijkomt want die filmpjes van hem zijn vaak best interessant (als het geen interview op z'n Russisch is).
quote:24 July
The Ukrainian Government claimed that their forces entered Lysychansk and that after heavy fighting its forces began to round up the remaining separatists into custody.[805] Late in the evening Semen Semenchenko the commander of Donbass Battalion claimed on his Facebook page that his forces and elements of the 24th mechanized brigade reached the city hall and raised the Ukrainian flag [806] while the New Russia rebels claimed that Ukrainian force were repulsed with heavy losses.
Four Ukrainian servicemen were killed and 35 wounded in eastern Ukraine overnight.[807]
Vice News journalist Simon Ostrovsky posted that Slavyansk police started to exhume the bodies of those who were killed by pro-Russian separatist from a mass grave.[808][809]
Two pro-Russian tanks fired at the Ukrainian garrison besieged in Luhansk airport.[810]
The ukrainian government claimed the 79th Ukrainian airmobile brigade, besieged in Marynivka since 15 July, was partially relieved. More than 75 casualties were evacuated from the front line while the New Russia rebels claimed that the brigade was destroyed and doesn't exist anymore as a unit. [811]
Pentagon spokesman Col. Steve Warren said that "there is no question" that the Russian army was firing artillery at Ukrainian military targets through the common border in the last several days. Earlier, State Department spokeswoman Marie Harf declared that Russia is stepping up its delivery of weapons to pro-Russian rebels.[812]
http://en.wikipedia.org/w(...)rest_in_Ukraine#July
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