Israël, Libanon/Gaza, oorlog #56

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Op maandag 14 augustus 2006 18:28 schreef Mutant01 het volgende:

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Dat is natuurlijk onzin, want wie de oorlog nou opzocht is voor de twee strijdende partijen al duidelijk. Israel zegt Hezbollah, Hezbollah zegt Israel, dat is het twistpunt.

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Op maandag 14 augustus 2006 18:31 schreef nikk het volgende:

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Dat is het punt niet, het maakt op dit moment niet uit wie er begon. Het gaat erom dat er op dit moment een staakt-het-vuren is en dat mensen in Libanon een keuze hebben. Of een terroristische organisatie die oorlog met Israel zoekt, of weer normaal een leven opbouwen. Het is hun keuze.

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Op maandag 14 augustus 2006 18:36 schreef more het volgende:

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De libanese bevolking wil net als iedereen een normaal leven opbouwen, maar de dictatoriale regimes in Iran & Syrie zijn niet gebaat bij een goedlopende democratie in Libanon, het zou zomaar hun eigen absolute macht kunnen ondermijnen.

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Op maandag 14 augustus 2006 18:29 schreef NorthernStar het volgende:
Voor nu is het iig even rustig. Dat zie ik dan maar als de winst van het moment.

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Op maandag 14 augustus 2006 19:00 schreef The_Obdurate_Ozjish het volgende:
Baaj: Trollen doe je maar in Finland (Finntroll anyone? )
Weet iemand hoe de bevolking van Libanon uberhaupt aankijkt? We kunnen nou wel zeggen dat de Libanezen de keuze hebben tussen opbouwen of Hezbollah steunen, maar ik denk niet dat zij dat zo zien. Ik denk echt dat die in de armen van Hezbollah gedreven zijn.

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Op maandag 14 augustus 2006 18:58 schreef Godslasteraar het volgende:
Iraanse jeugd staat achter Ahmadinejad
...

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Op maandag 14 augustus 2006 19:17 schreef elcastel het volgende:

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Hier heb ik wel mijn twijfels over (zonder je bron te hebben gelezen).

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Op maandag 14 augustus 2006 19:10 schreef elcastel het volgende:

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Ik twijfel nog of ik dat als winst moet zien. Van mij hadden ze (wie dan ook) het wel een keer af mogen maken, kennelijk is er geen plek voor beide partijen (voor het gemak Israël en Iran/Hezbollah). Nu kom je weer terug bij de oude situatie, met nóg meer ellende achter de boeg. En zo oorlogsgezind ben ik ook niet, maar in deze regio werkt het kennelijk niet anders.

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Op maandag 14 augustus 2006 19:34 schreef B4CO het volgende:
Geweld heeft nog nooit iets opgelost, maar sommige "landen" zijn gewoon machtsgeil.
Die Hammas, die zichzelf opblaast in bussen, Israel die Libanon binnenvalt.
Ooit een oplossing geweest hierdoor?

De beste oplossing, is praten. en elkaar met rust laten, maar ook echt met rust laten, dan komt t wel goed.

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Op maandag 14 augustus 2006 19:39 schreef B4CO het volgende:
Ja, maar waarom moet dat met geweld...

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Op maandag 14 augustus 2006 19:45 schreef Mikrosoft het volgende:
Een afgang voor Israel. Grote bek en niets meer bereikt dan de vernietiging van Libanon en rond duizend burgers gedood. De nog levende burgers zijn in de armen van Hezbollah gedreven. Israel zou pas stoppen als de ontvoerde soldaten terug waren. Weer daarna was het pas stoppen zodra Hezbollah vernietigd was.

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Op maandag 14 augustus 2006 20:09 schreef franske19 het volgende:
Tot over 5 jaar wanneer het Libanese leger en de VN troepen weereens hen machteloosheid laten blijken en Hezbollah weer wat raketten lanceert of soldaten ontvoerd. Israel moet gewoon door blijven gaan met commando acties totdat ze Nasrallah en z'n aanhangers hebben uitgeroeid.

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Op maandag 14 augustus 2006 19:55 schreef B4CO het volgende:

En als ze doorgingen, dan lopen janken dat het barbaren zijn!

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Nee, dat Israel is gestopt ondanks dat de soldaten nog niet vrij zijn, is juist zeer goed, en een teken van menselijkheid!

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Eerder afgang voor Hezbollah,

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Op maandag 14 augustus 2006 20:16 schreef Hallulama het volgende:
Zijn er al Libanezen de straat op gegaan in Libanon om te protesteren tegen Hezbollah, of ben je dan als Libanees je leven niet zeker?

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Op maandag 14 augustus 2006 20:16 schreef Hallulama het volgende:
Zijn er al Libanezen de straat op gegaan in Libanon om te protesteren tegen Hezbollah, of ben je dan als Libanees je leven niet zeker?

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Op maandag 14 augustus 2006 19:55 schreef rutger05 het volgende:

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Een afgang voor de Hezbollah. Straks zal er een internationale troepenmacht gestationeerd worden in Libanon die hen ervan moet weerhouden om nog langer terroristische aanvallen op Israël te kunnen doen.

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Buoyed Hezbollah plans next move
By Martin Asser
BBC News website

As a member of Lebanon's multi-confessional government, the militant Shia Muslim movement Hezbollah is formally committed to its own removal as a military presence in south Lebanon.

Successive UN resolutions leave no room for doubt - Hezbollah must give up control of the south, allowing government forces and UN peacekeepers to hold sway at Israel's northern borders.

But what Resolutions 1559, 1655, 1680 and the latest ceasefire text, Resolution 1701, fail to stipulate is just how this is going to happen.

Hezbollah is Lebanon's most significant military power, drawing a considerable part of its support from the Shia Muslim population living in the territory it is being told to vacate.

In 2000, its guerrillas were credited with forcing the Israeli army to end a bloody 18-year occupation of the south.

Once again, in the summer of 2006, they have fought the region's military superpower to a standstill.

'Right to resist'

In the last six years, Hezbollah's magnanimity towards the large Christian population in the south - including many who are seen as collaborators with Israel - has broadened its support, as has this latest round of what many Lebanese regard as armed resistance.

Indeed, in the minds of many supporters, Hezbollah has a natural right to monopolise land it liberated and whose protection it continues to guarantee without assistance.

However, many other Lebanese are angry about the death and destruction brought about by Hezbollah's defiance of Israel.

The question is, how do Hezbollah and its charismatic leader Hassan Nasrallah want to take things forward now?

On the one hand, they are committed to disarm and leave the border region, but on the other they claim the right to resist Israel's continued presence in the south.

Given Hezbollah's military strength, there will be no disarmament without a political agreement at the national level in Lebanon.

For such a deal, Hezbollah might demand further concessions from Israel, such as prisoner releases and a handover of the Shebaa Farms, an area which Lebanon claims, but which Israel (backed by the UN) says is part of the Golan Heights - captured from Syria in 1967 and annexed by Israel.

And Hezbollah still has as bargaining chips the two Israeli soldiers it captured in a cross-border raid on 12 July - and whose release Israel said its bombardment was meant to secure.

Position of strength

The initial signs in Beirut do not indicate a trouble-free course ahead. Hezbollah's cabinet ministers threatened to boycott a cabinet meeting on Sunday set up to discuss the ceasefire, causing it to be postponed.

They are in a position of strength, because as far as its Islamic Resistance armed wing is concerned, Hezbollah has scored a great victory against the Israeli army.

In their martyrdom-orientated philosophy, victory is the fight itself - victory is emerging from four weeks of battling it out, toe-to-toe, against Israel's vastly superior weaponry.

Meanwhile, Israel - with strong backing from Washington (and somewhat more unusually from London) - is determined not to allow Hezbollah the kind of pre-eminence it has enjoyed in the south in recent years.

For the time being, it says it will keep up the air and sea blockade of Lebanon to prevent supplies to Hezbollah.

All this means there will be plenty of fuel for further conflict, with UN resolutions making little difference.

In the last hours before the ceasefire, Hezbollah militants were still killing Israeli soldiers in their tanks and raining death and destruction down on northern Israel in the form of Katyusha rockets.

It is not clear how much of Hezbollah's guerrilla and missile capability has been affected by Israel's bombing campaign and ground offensive, but it will be the focus of great scrutiny in the coming weeks and months.
Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/middle_east/4791873.stm

Published: 2006/08/14 16:07:28 GMT

© BBC MMVI

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Op maandag 14 augustus 2006 01:00 schreef sp3c het volgende:

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goed hoor jij hebt gelijk ... of niet

http://www.milhist.dk/post45/boellebank/boellebank_uk.htm
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tja oorlog is nu eenmaal niet cool

je infanterie zonder tanks dat dorp in laten wandelen is ook geen geweldig idee

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'Not the time to disarm'

Hizbullah leader says in first speech since ceasefire ‘it’s unfortunate that Lebanese government discussed disarmament in direct contrast to agreement between the sides’; adds: Soon I will address people in public squares

Hizbullah leader Hassan Nasrallah said during a speech aired on Al-Manar TV Monday that ‘we are at the brink of a great victory; a strategic and historic one. The Hizbullah fighters brought about this great triumph.”

In his first speech delivered after the ceasefire went into effect at 8 a.m., Nasrallah said "this is not the time for Hizbullah to disarm.

"It is unfortunate that the initial discussion on this matter and on the deployment of the army (in the south) was held by the (Lebanese) government in direct contrast to the agreement between the sides,” he said.

“Who will defend Lebanon in case of a new Israeli offensive?” he asked. “The Lebanese army and international troops are incapable of protecting Lebanon,” He said, flanked by Lebanese and Hizbullah flags.

But Nasrallah said he was open to dialogue about Hizbullah’s weapons at the appropriate time. And he credited his group’s weapons with proving to Israel that “War with Lebanon will not be a picnic. It will be very costly.”

'We will come to you'

Nasrallah said that beginning Tuesday Hizbullah would transfer initial funds to south Lebanon residents whose homes were destroyed so

they may rent apartments and buy furniture, adding that the terror group will fund the renovation of the homes ’15,000 damaged homes.’

“You (residents) will not wait in any line or for government funds because this may take too long,” the Hizbullah leader said. “We will come to you and grant you funds worth a year’s rent and for furniture. In the meantime we will rebuild your destroyed homes.”

Nasrallah, who remains in hiding, added that “soon I will address people in public squares and tell them the details of what happened."

The statement was a response to Ehud Olmert's speech to the Knesset plenum Sunday, in which the PM declared that Israel would continue to track down Hizbullah operatives.

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Soldiers' petition: Keep fighting

Reserve troops who fought in Lebanon urge government to continue operations until abducted soldiers released
Hanan Greenberg

Reserve soldiers called up by the army to join the fighting in Lebanon began Monday to circulate a petition where they protest the fact abducted IDF soldiers in Lebanon have not yet been released.

The troops, who are just outside Lebanon at this time, already managed to get hundreds of signatures on the petition.

Yisrael Kasirar, one of the soldiers who initiated the petition, told Ynet:: "Reserve soldiers feel solidarity with the substance of the
petition and it's circulating among many of them who are willing to sign it. The signing is taking place despite the current conditions, where reserve soldiers are spread across various areas in the north of the country."

The petition reads: "We, reserve soldiers who were called up for emergency duty, view with severity the acceptance of the ceasefire agreement in its current format, as a result of the abandonment of the abducted soldiers. We regret the fact that the fog of battle blurred the original war objectives we were enlisted for and the IDF values we were educated on. We're determined to complete the mission until the return of the abducted soldiers."

Kasirar says his comrades and him are willing to continue with reserve duty for many days and not come home until the mission is completed.

"We were in Lebanon, we fought in the Marjayoun region, our friends were killed and wounded, and we feel that the war objective was not achieved," he said, and added that initiators of the petition intend to forward it to as many reserve troops, including those currently in Lebanon.

'We didn't come to make fools of ourselves'

The purpose of the petition is to get as many troops to sign it, so it resonates among senior commanders, Kasirar said.

"We feel that a significant part of the Israeli public feels what we feel. We hope that despite the fact there's a ceasefire agreement someone will wake up and realize that this war mustn't be over with the abductees not coming back home," he said.

Itzik Ben-Naim, one of the troops who signed the petition, said: "We won't leave two of our comrades inside (Lebanon.) We didn't come to fight for the sake of playing. We didn't come to make fools of ourselves."

Ben-Naim, who saw a member of his regiment killed in battle, added the petition was not a political one.

"People are frustrated because the objectives were dissolved. It's important that we continue even just so the abductees' families know the soldiers haven't forgotten the values they were educated on."

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Op maandag 14 augustus 2006 20:48 schreef Napalm het volgende:

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GUNprofor

Ging volgens mij wel in tegen het mandaat enzo.