POL Politiek
Discussies en diepgaande gesprekken over de politiek in de breedste zin van het woord kun je hier voeren.
Welkom in het politiek cafe van het politieke subforum van Fok!. Hier kan gepraat worden over politieke complotjes die niet worden besproken in POL, of over niet-politieke zaken die óók niet worden besproken in dit subforum, oftewel: het passioneel spuien van politieke ideeën en populistisch geblaat zonder feitelijke justificatie. Ook geschikt voor al het politieke non-nieuws en andere onzin. Niet iedereen is welkom.
Maar helpt daarentegen wel. Lekendokters hebben we al genoeg.quote:Op maandag 31 juli 2006 16:41 schreef Mutant01 het volgende:
[..]
Ik baseer mijn uitspraken op theorieen gepresenteerd door geleerden. Bronnen dus. Je hoeft niet rechten te studeren om iets van recht te weten, net zoals je niet bouwkunde hoeft te studeren om iets van de bouw te kunnen weten
Ik vind de verklaring die door de bronnen van Johan wordt gegeven zeer plausibel. Ze stroken
met wat ik heb geleerd bij materiaalkunde en andere vakken tijdens mijn studie werktuigbouwkunde en technische bedrijfskunde. Je moet niet vergeten dat er 40 verdiepingen aan gewicht boven verdieping 7 liggen. Dat is voldoende om het gebouw te laten verpulveren onder zijn eigen gewicht. Dat houdt een stalen skelet, zoals gebleken is, niet tegen. Kijk maar s op 1 van die discovery channel prog wat er overblijft na een gecontroleerde explosie van een gebouw: voor namelijk stof en kleine brokstukken.
"I think I'm in a tragedy"
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZFG5PKw504[/youtube]
"In America today profit is privatized but risk is increasingly socialized"
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZFG5PKw504[/youtube]
"In America today profit is privatized but risk is increasingly socialized"
Als je de video ziet, en het commentaar van geleerden goed beluisterd, zal je tot een geheel ander inzicht komen.quote:Maar helpt daarentegen wel. Lekendokters hebben we al genoeg.
Ik vind de verklaring die door de bronnen van Johan wordt gegeven zeer plausibel. Ze stroken
met wat ik heb geleerd bij materiaalkunde en andere vakken tijdens mijn studie werktuigbouwkunde en technische bedrijfskunde. Je moet niet vergeten dat er 40 verdiepingen aan gewicht boven verdieping 7 liggen. Dat is voldoende om het gebouw te laten verpulveren onder zijn eigen gewicht. Dat houdt een stalen skelet, zoals gebleken is, niet tegen.
Allah Al Watan Al Malik
Nee Dat is Johannesburg. Daar eindigt de toch na 3,5 week.quote:Op maandag 31 juli 2006 16:43 schreef Mutant01 het volgende:
[..]
Brr, stad met hoogste criminaliteit ter wereld.
Dat is Johannesburg. Daar eindigt de toch na 3,5 week.
"I think I'm in a tragedy"
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZFG5PKw504[/youtube]
"In America today profit is privatized but risk is increasingly socialized"
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZFG5PKw504[/youtube]
"In America today profit is privatized but risk is increasingly socialized"
Anti-Americanism's Deep Roots - The Current Wave of Hostility Will Ebb. But This Is About More Than the Iraq War.
By Robert Kagan
Monday, June 19, 2006; Page A21
http://www.washingtonpost(...)AR2006061800900.html
I recently took part in a panel discussion in London about civil conflict and "failed states" around the world, centered on the interesting work of the British economist Paul Collier. The panelists included the son of a famous African liberation-leader-turned-dictator, the former leader of a South American guerrilla group, a Pakistani journalist, a U.N. official and the head of a nongovernmental humanitarian organization. Naturally, our reasoned and learned discussion quickly transmogrified into an extended round-robin denunciation of American foreign policy.
The interesting thing was that the Iraq war was far from the main topic. George W. Bush hardly came up. The panelists focused instead on a long list of grievances against the United States stretching back over six decades. There was much discussion of the "colonial legacy" and "neo-colonialism," especially in the Middle East and Africa. And even though the colonies in question had been ruled by Europeans, panelists insisted that this colonial past was the source of most of the world's resentment toward the United States. There was much criticism of American policy during the Cold War for imposing evil regimes, causing poverty and suffering throughout the world, and blocking national liberation movements as a service to oil companies and multinational corporations. When the moderator brought up nuclear weapons proliferation and Iran, the panelists talked about Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
As for "failed states" and civil conflict, several panelists agreed that they were always and everywhere the fault of the United States. The African insisted that Bosnia and Kosovo were destroyed by American military interventions, not by Slobodan Milosevic, and that Somalia was a failed state because of American policy. The Pakistani insisted the United States was to blame for Afghanistan's descent into anarchy in the 1990s. The former guerrilla leader insisted that most if not all problems in the Western Hemisphere were the product of over a century of American imperialism.
Some of these charges had more merit than others, but even the moderator became exasperated by the general refusal to place any responsibility on the peoples and leaders of countries plagued by civil conflict. Yet the panelists held their ground. When someone pointed out that the young boys fighting in African tribal and ethnic wars could hardly be fighting against American "imperialism," the African dictator's son insisted they were indeed. When the head of the NGO paused from gnashing his teeth at American policy to suggest that perhaps the United States was not to blame for the genocide in Rwanda, the African dictator's son argued that it was, because it had failed to intervene. The United States was to blame both for the suffering it caused and the suffering it did not alleviate.
The discussion was illuminating. There is no question that the Iraq war has aroused hostility toward the United States around the world. And there are many legitimate criticisms to be made about America's conduct of the war. But it is worth keeping in mind that this anger against the United States also has deep roots.
The Iraq war has rekindled myriad old resentments toward the United States, a thousand different complaints, each one specific to a time and place far removed from the present conflict. It has united a diverse spectrum of anti-American views in common solidarity -- the Marxist Africans still angry over American policy in the 1960s and '70s, the Pakistanis still furious at America's (bipartisan) support for the dictator Gen. Mohammed Zia ul-Haq in the 1970s and '80s, the French theoreticians who started railing against the American "hyperpower" in the 1990s, the Latin ex-guerrillas still waging their decades-old struggle against North American imperialism, the Arab activists still angry about 1948. At a conference in the Middle East a few months ago, I heard a moderate Arab scholar complaining bitterly about how American policy had alienated the Arab peoples in recent years. A former Clinton official sitting next to him was nodding vigorously but then suddenly stopped when the Arab scholar made clear that by "recent years" he meant ever since 1967.
The Iraq war has also made anti-Americanism respectable again, as it was during the Cold War but had not been since the demise of the Soviet Union. People who a decade ago would not have been granted a platform to spout the kind of arguments I heard on this panel are now given star treatment in the Western and global media. Such people were always there, but no one was listening to them. Today they dominate the airwaves, and this in turn is helping produce an increasingly hostile global public opinion, as evidenced in a recent Pew poll.
There are two lessons to be drawn from all this. One is that in time the current tidal wave of anti-Americanism will ebb, just as in the past. Smarter American diplomacy can help, of course, as can success in places such as Iraq. But the other lesson is not to succumb to the illusion that America was beloved until the spring of 2003 and will be beloved again when George W. Bush leaves office. Some folks seem to believe that by returning to the policies of Harry Truman, Dean Acheson and John F. Kennedy, America will become popular around the world. I like those policies, too, but let's not kid ourselves. They also sparked enormous resentment among millions of peoples in many countries, resentments that are now returning to the fore. The fact is, because America is the dominant power in the world, it will always attract criticism and be blamed both for what it does and what it does not do.
No one should lightly dismiss the current hostility toward the United States. International legitimacy matters. It is important in itself, and it affects others' willingness to work with us. But neither should we be paralyzed by the unavoidable resentments that our power creates. If we refrained from action out of fear that others around the world would be angry with us, then we would never act. And count on it: They'd blame us for that, too.
Robert Kagan, a senior associate at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace and transatlantic fellow at the German Marshall Fund, writes a monthly column for The Post.
By Robert Kagan
Monday, June 19, 2006; Page A21
http://www.washingtonpost(...)AR2006061800900.html
I recently took part in a panel discussion in London about civil conflict and "failed states" around the world, centered on the interesting work of the British economist Paul Collier. The panelists included the son of a famous African liberation-leader-turned-dictator, the former leader of a South American guerrilla group, a Pakistani journalist, a U.N. official and the head of a nongovernmental humanitarian organization. Naturally, our reasoned and learned discussion quickly transmogrified into an extended round-robin denunciation of American foreign policy.
The interesting thing was that the Iraq war was far from the main topic. George W. Bush hardly came up. The panelists focused instead on a long list of grievances against the United States stretching back over six decades. There was much discussion of the "colonial legacy" and "neo-colonialism," especially in the Middle East and Africa. And even though the colonies in question had been ruled by Europeans, panelists insisted that this colonial past was the source of most of the world's resentment toward the United States. There was much criticism of American policy during the Cold War for imposing evil regimes, causing poverty and suffering throughout the world, and blocking national liberation movements as a service to oil companies and multinational corporations. When the moderator brought up nuclear weapons proliferation and Iran, the panelists talked about Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
As for "failed states" and civil conflict, several panelists agreed that they were always and everywhere the fault of the United States. The African insisted that Bosnia and Kosovo were destroyed by American military interventions, not by Slobodan Milosevic, and that Somalia was a failed state because of American policy. The Pakistani insisted the United States was to blame for Afghanistan's descent into anarchy in the 1990s. The former guerrilla leader insisted that most if not all problems in the Western Hemisphere were the product of over a century of American imperialism.
Some of these charges had more merit than others, but even the moderator became exasperated by the general refusal to place any responsibility on the peoples and leaders of countries plagued by civil conflict. Yet the panelists held their ground. When someone pointed out that the young boys fighting in African tribal and ethnic wars could hardly be fighting against American "imperialism," the African dictator's son insisted they were indeed. When the head of the NGO paused from gnashing his teeth at American policy to suggest that perhaps the United States was not to blame for the genocide in Rwanda, the African dictator's son argued that it was, because it had failed to intervene. The United States was to blame both for the suffering it caused and the suffering it did not alleviate.
The discussion was illuminating. There is no question that the Iraq war has aroused hostility toward the United States around the world. And there are many legitimate criticisms to be made about America's conduct of the war. But it is worth keeping in mind that this anger against the United States also has deep roots.
The Iraq war has rekindled myriad old resentments toward the United States, a thousand different complaints, each one specific to a time and place far removed from the present conflict. It has united a diverse spectrum of anti-American views in common solidarity -- the Marxist Africans still angry over American policy in the 1960s and '70s, the Pakistanis still furious at America's (bipartisan) support for the dictator Gen. Mohammed Zia ul-Haq in the 1970s and '80s, the French theoreticians who started railing against the American "hyperpower" in the 1990s, the Latin ex-guerrillas still waging their decades-old struggle against North American imperialism, the Arab activists still angry about 1948. At a conference in the Middle East a few months ago, I heard a moderate Arab scholar complaining bitterly about how American policy had alienated the Arab peoples in recent years. A former Clinton official sitting next to him was nodding vigorously but then suddenly stopped when the Arab scholar made clear that by "recent years" he meant ever since 1967.
The Iraq war has also made anti-Americanism respectable again, as it was during the Cold War but had not been since the demise of the Soviet Union. People who a decade ago would not have been granted a platform to spout the kind of arguments I heard on this panel are now given star treatment in the Western and global media. Such people were always there, but no one was listening to them. Today they dominate the airwaves, and this in turn is helping produce an increasingly hostile global public opinion, as evidenced in a recent Pew poll.
There are two lessons to be drawn from all this. One is that in time the current tidal wave of anti-Americanism will ebb, just as in the past. Smarter American diplomacy can help, of course, as can success in places such as Iraq. But the other lesson is not to succumb to the illusion that America was beloved until the spring of 2003 and will be beloved again when George W. Bush leaves office. Some folks seem to believe that by returning to the policies of Harry Truman, Dean Acheson and John F. Kennedy, America will become popular around the world. I like those policies, too, but let's not kid ourselves. They also sparked enormous resentment among millions of peoples in many countries, resentments that are now returning to the fore. The fact is, because America is the dominant power in the world, it will always attract criticism and be blamed both for what it does and what it does not do.
No one should lightly dismiss the current hostility toward the United States. International legitimacy matters. It is important in itself, and it affects others' willingness to work with us. But neither should we be paralyzed by the unavoidable resentments that our power creates. If we refrained from action out of fear that others around the world would be angry with us, then we would never act. And count on it: They'd blame us for that, too.
Robert Kagan, a senior associate at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace and transatlantic fellow at the German Marshall Fund, writes a monthly column for The Post.
dit kan niet sterk genoeg benadrukt worden:
..................People who a decade ago would not have been granted a platform to spout the kind of arguments I heard on this panel are now given star treatment in the Western and global media. Such people were always there, but no one was listening to them. Today they dominate the airwaves, and this in turn is helping produce an increasingly hostile global public opinion ................
..................People who a decade ago would not have been granted a platform to spout the kind of arguments I heard on this panel are now given star treatment in the Western and global media. Such people were always there, but no one was listening to them. Today they dominate the airwaves, and this in turn is helping produce an increasingly hostile global public opinion ................
"Jan" kan nu wel zijn spullen gaan pakken.
[ Bericht 30% gewijzigd door Finder_elf_towns op 31-07-2006 17:10:10 ]
http://www.janmarijnissen(...)jan-loopt-zich-warm/quote:Historicus, tv-commentator en Telegraaf-columnist Arend-Jan Boekestijn wil in november Kamerlid worden. Voor de VVD. In HP/De Tijd antwoordt hij in een strijdbaar interview op de vraag welk kamerlid hij als eerste gaat aanpakken:
‘Jan Marijnissen kan wel wat intellectueel tegenspel gebruiken. Ik vind dat hij erg veel ruimte krijgt in de Kamer. Het lijkt wel alsof men bang van hem is.’
[ Bericht 30% gewijzigd door Finder_elf_towns op 31-07-2006 17:10:10 ]
Het lijkt net alsof ze het over jou hebben.quote:Op maandag 31 juli 2006 16:54 schreef Godslasteraar het volgende:
dit kan niet sterk genoeg benadrukt worden:
..................People who a decade ago would not have been granted a platform to spout the kind of arguments I heard on this panel are now given star treatment in the Western and global media. Such people were always there, but no one was listening to them. Today they dominate the airwaves, and this in turn is helping produce an increasingly hostile global public opinion ................
Allah Al Watan Al Malik
massamedia gevolgd door massahysterie. De dommen en de schreeuwlelijkerds domineren de publieke opinie.quote:Op maandag 31 juli 2006 16:54 schreef Godslasteraar het volgende:
dit kan niet sterk genoeg benadrukt worden:
..................People who a decade ago would not have been granted a platform to spout the kind of arguments I heard on this panel are now given star treatment in the Western and global media. Such people were always there, but no one was listening to them. Today they dominate the airwaves, and this in turn is helping produce an increasingly hostile global public opinion ................
gevolgd door massahysterie. De dommen en de schreeuwlelijkerds domineren de publieke opinie.
"I think I'm in a tragedy"
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZFG5PKw504[/youtube]
"In America today profit is privatized but risk is increasingly socialized"
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZFG5PKw504[/youtube]
"In America today profit is privatized but risk is increasingly socialized"
Touche.quote:Op maandag 31 juli 2006 16:54 schreef Mutant01 het volgende:
[..]
Het lijkt net alsof ze het over jou hebben.
Allah Al Watan Al Malik
Hoe voorspelbaar.quote:Op maandag 31 juli 2006 16:54 schreef Mutant01 het volgende:
[..]
Het lijkt net alsof ze het over jou hebben.
Ik dacht al dat die lap tekst voor sommigen teveel van het goede zou zijn. Daarom poste ik nog maar even een elementje eruit, waarbij ik nauwlettend in de gaten hield dat dat stukje niet meer dan 5 regels zou bevatten.
Ja en, ik had het dan ook precies over dat stukje. Wellicht voorspelbaar, maar die kon ik dan ook niet anders dan inkoppen.quote:Op maandag 31 juli 2006 16:59 schreef Godslasteraar het volgende:
[..]
Hoe voorspelbaar.
Ik dacht al dat die lap tekst voor sommigen teveel van het goede zou zijn. Daarom poste ik nog maar even een elementje eruit, waarbij ik nauwlettend in de gaten hield dat dat stukje niet meer dan 5 regels zou bevatten.
Allah Al Watan Al Malik
Ik ga maar s voorbereidingen treffen.
"I think I'm in a tragedy"
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZFG5PKw504[/youtube]
"In America today profit is privatized but risk is increasingly socialized"
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZFG5PKw504[/youtube]
"In America today profit is privatized but risk is increasingly socialized"
Voor de witte school?quote:Op maandag 31 juli 2006 17:09 schreef Rock_de_Braziliaan het volgende:
Ik ga maar s voorbereidingen treffen.
Zelden schryf ik wat ik wil, en nooit wat 'n ander wil.
jammer, ik vond 'm waardiger als (objectief) historicusquote:Op maandag 31 juli 2006 16:54 schreef Finder_elf_towns het volgende:
"Jan" kan nu wel zijn spullen gaan pakken.
[afbeelding]
[..]
http://www.janmarijnissen(...)jan-loopt-zich-warm/
Ingenieur in de ornithologische huisvesting <- Urbanus :P
Good ol' Buck : http://youtube.com/watch?v=VmxXIS2ot8w <- Fun
N.W.O : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WOeCpMwZo6o <- Pol
Good ol' Buck : http://youtube.com/watch?v=VmxXIS2ot8w <- Fun
N.W.O : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WOeCpMwZo6o <- Pol
Ik zat al op een witte schoolquote:
De afwas, doelde ik op.
"I think I'm in a tragedy"
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZFG5PKw504[/youtube]
"In America today profit is privatized but risk is increasingly socialized"
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZFG5PKw504[/youtube]
"In America today profit is privatized but risk is increasingly socialized"
Uiteraard is er vandaag ook weer moslim-nieuws.
Bulgarian Fined for Disrupting Anti-Mosque Sign-up
Басурманы руки прочь от Болгарии - Секир башка!
[ Bericht 8% gewijzigd door Finder_elf_towns op 31-07-2006 19:05:02 ]
Bulgarian Fined for Disrupting Anti-Mosque Sign-up
http://www.novinite.com/view_news.php?id=67312quote:A Bulgarian man has been fined for hooliganism because he disrupted a nationalist sign-up against the loudspeakers placed on the mosque in the Danube city of Ruse.
The 29-year-old Filip Chernev insulted Ataka (Attack) activists who were gathering signatures against the mosque, and jumped on the table where the sign-up sheets were. He tore Bulgaria's flag and tried to destroy the papers too, Ataka members told the court.
The man was charged with hooliganism, but the nationalists want him charged with desecrating a national symbol too.
The judge has sent all the materials to the prosecution, who have to decide whether they are going to charge the young man with a second offence.
Tension over Sofia's downtown mosque has been escalating as well, after a nationalistic Bulgarian party launched a campaign claiming that the "ezan," a Muslim invitation to prayer via loudspeakers, was too loud and disturbing for people in the capital's central area. The nationalists say they collected over 35,000 signatures in support of their move to silence the speakers.
In the midst of the campaign, Ataka's official website was attacked by hackers, who moderated the main page and replaced its content with Turkish national symbols and music.
Басурманы руки прочь от Болгарии - Секир башка!
[ Bericht 8% gewijzigd door Finder_elf_towns op 31-07-2006 19:05:02 ]
quote:Op maandag 31 juli 2006 16:48 schreef -IksRee- het volgende:
Welkom in het politiek cafe van het politieke subforum van Fok!. Hier kan gepraat worden over politieke complotjes die niet worden besproken in POL, of over niet-politieke zaken die óók niet worden besproken in dit subforum, oftewel: het passioneel spuien van politieke ideeën en populistisch geblaat zonder feitelijke justificatie. Ook geschikt voor al het politieke non-nieuws en andere onzin. Niet iedereen is welkom.
Briljant!
ik moet verrassend weinig
Es ist heute schlecht und wird nun täglich schlechter werden, – bis das Schlimmste kommt
Es ist heute schlecht und wird nun täglich schlechter werden, – bis das Schlimmste kommt
en nu zou ik wel zin hebben in een dutjequote:Op maandag 31 juli 2006 17:02 schreef Mutant01 het volgende:
Eet ze.
Goede vraag. Er staat me bij dat hij een aardige tijd geleden geband is.quote:Op maandag 31 juli 2006 18:25 schreef Godslasteraar het volgende:
waar is Rm_rf eigenlijk? komt ie nog wel eens langs?
