Oorlog in Oekraïne #1245 waar is torentje?

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Op vrijdag 5 december 2025 14:24 schreef Straatcommando. het volgende:

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Spul moet ergens blijven en aan het front zien we het niet of mondjesmaat.

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Tja, men kan ervan zeggen wat men wil, en ook niet bepaald dat iedereen het met hem eens is, maar dat de Russische president Poetin 'n doorbijter is en van origine een sterk leider kan niet worden ontkend.

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Op vrijdag 5 december 2025 14:29 schreef ExTec het volgende:

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So evil vilain lair it is

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Op vrijdag 5 december 2025 14:28 schreef Scjvb het volgende:
Het is verder prima dat de westerse alliantie letterlijk en figuurlijk haar grenzen blijft aangeven m.b.t. meest russische zienswijzen met als gevolg agressie/bedreigingen jegens het westen aangaande alle verwikkelingen omtrent Oekraïne, waarbij meer dan ooit het dialoog van belang is om nader tot elkaar te komen.

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Op vrijdag 5 december 2025 11:29 schreef LXIV het volgende:
Maar om terug te komen op mijn oorspronkelijke vraag; bij jullie leeft dit thema ook, maar in de kranten lees ik vooral over de hoofdpiet, Marco Borsato en het songfestival. Maar niks hierover!
Waarom?

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FOUR UNIDENTIFIED MILITARY-STYLE drones breached a no-fly zone and flew towards the flight path of Ukrainian president Volodymyr Zelenskyy’s plane at sea near Dublin Airport late on Monday night, The Journal has learned.

The plane landed, slightly ahead of schedule, just moments before the incident happened at about 11pm. The drones reached the location where Zelenskyy’s plane was expected to be at the exact moment it had been due to pass.

The drones then orbited above an Irish Navy vessel that had secretly been deployed in the Irish Sea for the Zelenskyy visit.

Sources have said that the drones took off from the north-east of Dublin, possibly near Howth, and flew for up to two hours. Enquiries are being carried out to determine whether the drones took off from land or from an undetected ship.

It is not yet known who launched and controlled the drones or where the drones are now.

Military-style drones are capable of a large range of functions. In this case, the fact that the drones had their lights on has led security forces to suspect that the aim was to disrupt the flight’s arrival into Dublin.

Garda Commissioner Justin Kelly was told about the incident in the early hours of Tuesday morning. It is understood that the Taoiseach and Ministers for Justice and Defence were also told in the hours after it happened. It is not known if Irish authorities briefed the Ukrainian president’s team.

The incident mirrors similar drone incursions in Europe in recent months which led to the closure of airports in Brussels and Denmark and caused significant security tensions.

Ireland’s security services have found that the drones in the Irish Sea were large, hugely expensive, of military specification, and that the incident could be classed as a hybrid attack.

Hybrid warfare is the use of military and non-military tactics, such as drone incursions, cyber attacks, sabotage and disinformation, to weaken or destabilise opponents without declaring a full-scale war. It is generally carried out by state-level military and intelligence services.

It is understood that the drones missed the approach of the Ukrainian leader’s plane and then turned their attention to the LÉ William Butler Yeats, the Irish naval vessel which was secretly deployed off Dublin. The drones operated within the 12 nautical mile limit of Irish-controlled waters.

A decision was made not to shoot down the drones, and there was no ability onboard the naval vessel to disable them. It is understood an Irish Air Corps aircraft was also patrolling at the time but did not get involved.

Irish forces had limited other options for dealing with the drones, which are technically known as Unmanned Aerial Vehicles (UAVs). Handheld equipment purchased by An Garda Síochána could not be used to take down the drones as it was out of range. There was also no air defence capability save for the machine guns of the naval vessel. The LÉ Yeats has no air radar capability.

It is understood that deck look-outs who were working on the ship spotted the drones, which were lit up against the night sky.

No-fly zone
The Irish Aviation Authority (IAA) had issued a drone no-fly zone over Dublin and surrounding areas for the duration of the president’s visit.

The drones are believed to have been quadcopters as they were able to hover above the naval vessel. This type of drone has four propellers or rotors which allow it to stay in one position.

A high-level meeting between An Garda Sochána, the Irish Defence Forces and senior civil servants with responsibility for national security was called yesterday in Dublin to discuss the incident.

Zelenskyy’s visit to Dublin went off without any major hitches. However, his aircraft did use a specialist take off as it left Dublin Airport to limit exposure to any drone incidents.

The incident echoes the similar drone incursions in other parts of Europe in recent weeks. A drone swarm recently forced the closure of Brussels Airport, after causing similar issues in Denmark in September. The Dutch military fired on drones in an incident also.

The Dublin incident is not thought to have involved a drone swarm. Instead, sources say that the UAVs moved independently of each other, meaning they were likely operated by four pilots.

The incident comes just weeks after The Journal revealed significant concerns around Ireland’s security shortcomings ahead of the EU Presidency next year.

This morning we also revealed issues with the Joint Committee on Defence and National Security and its inability to investigate the issue of state security.

In a statement, the Defence Forces said: “For operational security reasons, Óglaigh na hÉireann has no comment on the specifics of any alleged incidents.

“However, DF support to the security operation, led by AGS [An Garda Siochána], was successfully deployed in multiple means, ultimately leading to a safe and successful visit by the President Zelensky to Ireland.”

A spokesman for An Garda Siochána said: “In general and without commenting on any particular incident, any such incident occurring on Irish waters is a matter for the Defence Forces.”

The Department of Defence said “no comment”.

The IAA and the Departments of Foreign Affairs, Taoiseach and Justice have also been contacted for comment.

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Op vrijdag 5 december 2025 14:40 schreef Lospedrosa het volgende:

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Omdat de jubelverhalen over een Oekraïne welke Rusland terugvecht over de grens, Rusland ineenstort, niet meer verteld kunnen worden.

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Op vrijdag 5 december 2025 14:56 schreef ExTec het volgende:

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Gewoon weer de bekende onzin, vriend.

Ondanks het feit dat dit de eerste oorlog in europa is sinds WO2, heeft de MSM het daar sowieso amper over.

Dit is feitelijk zo impactvol dat het elke dag voorpagina nieuws dient te zijn, maar onze MSM hebben het liever over de laatste scheet van een BN'er.

En dat is gewoon vanaf het begin al zo.

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Op vrijdag 5 december 2025 14:40 schreef Lospedrosa het volgende:

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Omdat de jubelverhalen over een Oekraïne welke Rusland terugvecht over de grens, Rusland ineenstort, niet meer verteld kunnen worden.
Rusland heeft de overmacht op het huidige slagveld en de kaarten in de onderhandeling, helaas.
Nu stopt de gestuurde propoganda vanuit de EU hoek.
Ervoor terug komen de angstverhalen over noodpakketten en Poetin die de EU bedreigt.
Nu hoorde ik dat er niet in. Het was een waarschuwing dat Rusland klaar is voor een directe confrontatie met de NAVO ALS de NAVO-landen oorlog zoeken. Niet dat Rusland nog actief grenzen wil overgaan. Vooralsnog.

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Op vrijdag 5 december 2025 15:02 schreef Lospedrosa het volgende:
Waar zijn dan de columns van een Ko Colijn en andere oorlogsduiders.

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Op vrijdag 5 december 2025 14:28 schreef Scjvb het volgende:
Poetin laat door bezoek aan bevriend India zien dat hij geen paria is
© https://www.msn.com/nl-nl(...)83a91e2af04d56&ei=24

Tja, men kan ervan zeggen wat men wil, en ook niet bepaald dat iedereen het met hem eens is, maar dat de Russische president Poetin 'n doorbijter is en van origine een sterk leider kan niet worden ontkend.

Het is verder prima dat de westerse alliantie letterlijk en figuurlijk haar grenzen blijft aangeven m.b.t. meest russische zienswijzen met als gevolg agressie/bedreigingen jegens het westen aangaande alle verwikkelingen omtrent Oekraïne, waarbij meer dan ooit het dialoog van belang is om nader tot elkaar te komen.

Maar goed, hopelijk komt er snel een bevredigend compromis met Poetin waardoor duurzame vrede misschien toch een kans krijgt.

Afwachten maar!

[ afbeelding ]

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Op vrijdag 5 december 2025 15:08 schreef Joppiez het volgende:

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Er moeten eerst nog heel veel Russische soldaten dood van deze sterke leider. Alles voor het moederland. Die Russische wijven neuken de gesneuvelde aantallen wel weer terug, dus laat maar gaan. Lang leven de Sovjet mentaliteit.

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Op vrijdag 5 december 2025 13:51 schreef ExTec het volgende:

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Dan zouden we meer BMP4's en T-90s zien. Maar dat is niet het geval.

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Op vrijdag 5 december 2025 15:08 schreef Joppiez het volgende:

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Er moeten eerst nog heel veel Russische soldaten dood van deze sterke leider. Alles voor het moederland. Die Russische wijven neuken de gesneuvelde aantallen wel weer terug, dus laat maar gaan. Lang leven de Sovjet mentaliteit.

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Op vrijdag 5 december 2025 15:04 schreef Spablauw214 het volgende:

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Het is Rusland dat Oekraïne is binnengevallen en het is Rusland dat al bijna 4 jaar dagelijks Europa bedreigt met een kernoorlog als het Ruslands eisen niet inwilligt. Het is gewoon blackmail en gaslighting. Niemand in het Westen is geïnteresseerd in het binnenvallen van Rusland. Wij hebben daar ook nooit maar een seconde mee gedreigd en de NAVO is nog steeds een defensieve alliantie die geen enkele bedreiging voor Rusland vormt. Maar nu zijn wij de oorlogshitsers

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Op vrijdag 5 december 2025 16:10 schreef LXIV het volgende:

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Er wordt helemaal niks teruggeneukt. Noch in Rusland noch in Oekraïne. Naast een menselijk drama is deze oorlog ook nog een demografisch drama.

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Op vrijdag 5 december 2025 15:10 schreef Timwonnacott het volgende:
Jaja, het is allemaal een complot van de media.

Het is natuurlijk niet zo dat de situatie in Oekraïne al bijna een jaar, zo niet langer, in een patstelling zit en er dus weinig nieuws is om te vermelden. Het is uiteraard ook niet zo dat het weinige nieuws dat er te vermelden staat gewoon op de NOS staat, inclusief de momenteel slechtere vooruitzichten van Oekraïne.

Drommels toch die MSM met hun complotten.

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Op vrijdag 5 december 2025 16:10 schreef LXIV het volgende:

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Er wordt helemaal niks teruggeneukt. Noch in Rusland noch in Oekraïne. Naast een menselijk drama is deze oorlog ook nog een demografisch drama.

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Ukraine stares down the barrel of population collapse

As the country spirals into a demographic disaster, Ukrainian authorities face a quandary: who will be left to pick up the pieces once the war ends?

HOSHCHA, Ukraine - While many Ukrainian hospitals are struggling to cope with the endless influx of wounded, a maternity ward in the western town of Hoshcha lies eerily deserted.
The hospital in Hoshcha has recorded just 139 births so far this year, down from 164 in 2024, and a far cry from just over a decade ago when more than 400 babies were born every year, according to local authorities.

"Many young men have died," gynaecologist Yevhen Hekkel lamented in his office. "Young men who, bluntly speaking, were supposed to replenish Ukraine's gene pool."

Authorities are wrestling with a crucial question as Ukraine barrels towards a demographic disaster: Once the war ends, who will be left to rebuild the shattered country?

Hundreds of thousands of people have been killed and wounded in almost four years of fighting, while millions more have fled the country and births are drying up.

Hoshcha, a small town of about 5,000 people, is hundreds of miles from the nearest front but is nonetheless facing the full force of the population crisis.

In the nearby village of Sadove, a school that once taught more than 200 pupils has been shut down.

"Two years ago, we were forced to close this institution. Why? Because there were only nine children there," Mykola Panchuk, head of Hoshcha's town council, told Reuters.

Millions of people needed to rebuild

Ukraine's population - 42 million before the full-scale invasion in February 2022 - has already shrunk to below 36 million, including several million in areas captured by Russia, according to the demography institute at Ukraine's National Academy of Sciences.

It estimates the figure will drop to 25 million by 2051.

The collapse is gathering pace.

The country has both the highest death rates and lowest birth rates in the world, according to 2024 estimates in the CIA World Factbook: for every birth there are around three deaths.

Every Ukrainian region has more deaths than births

Number of deaths for every birth in Ukraine's regions in 2024. Births are down everywhere, most heavily in areas near the frontline.

According to government estimates, Ukraine's average male life expectancy dropped from 65.2 years before the war to 57.3 years in 2024. For women, the figure fell from 74.4 to 70.9.

Ukraine will need millions of people to rebuild its shattered economy, experts and politicians say, and to be able to defend itself in a post-war future should Moscow attack again, as many Ukrainians fear it will.

The Kyiv government sought to address the crisis last year when it outlined a demographic strategy to 2040. The document warned that Ukraine faced a deficit of 4.5 million workers over the next decade. Sectors that would be most in need of labour included construction, technology and administrative services.

The strategy centres on stemming further emigration and luring Ukrainians back from abroad, including by improving housing, infrastructure and education, as well as attracting immigrants from other countries if jobs remain unfilled.

Authorities estimate these measures could push the population back up to 34 million by 2040, but also warn that it could fall to 29 million by then if current dynamics continue.

Faces of the fallen

Portraits of fallen soldiers lined the path to Hoshcha's town hall during a Reuters visit in October.

An old woman laid flowers at one image, wiping away tears on a cold autumn morning. A steady stream of people passed by on the high street, mostly middle-aged or elderly.

Panchuk, from the town council, said 141 people from Hoshcha and its surrounding district - home to about 24,000 people - had been killed in the war since 2022. Another 11 had died fighting against Russian-backed militants in eastern Ukraine since 2014.

At one of Hoshcha's two remaining schools, headteacher Marianna Khrypa said the number of first-graders was falling and that about 10% of school leavers were heading abroad, mostly boys.

"Parents take their children out of the country before they reach the age of 18," she said. Kyiv has barred most men over 18 from leaving the country during the war, although President Volodymyr Zelenskiy raised the age to 22 in August.

Ukraine, whose population exceeded 48 million in 2001, faced demographic decline well before the conflict, with millions of citizens heading westward from eastern Europe to escape economic strife and rampant corruption at home.

The exodus accelerated when Russia invaded, prompting millions more to flee.

The Centre for Economic Strategy, a Ukrainian think-tank, said in March that about 5.2 million Ukrainians who had left since the invasion remained overseas, in a host of mainly European countries including Russia, Germany and Poland.

The centre predicted that between 1.7 and 2.7 million of those people would remain abroad, and could be joined by hundreds of thousands of adult men - who are currently not allowed to leave Ukraine - when the war ends.

Oleksandr Gladun, deputy head of the National Academy of Sciences' demography institute, said the population crisis was exacerbated by the fact that younger women are disproportionately represented among refugees since 2022.

Independent predictions are alarming: Ukraine's population is expected to fall to between 9 and 23 million people by 2100, according to U.N. forecasts published in 2024.

Villages emptied, homes abandoned

The maternity ward of Hoshcha's hospital lost its government funding in 2023 after failing to reach the target of 170 births in a year: "We had a child who was born 15 minutes too late, so we had 169," said Panchuk, the head of the council.

The ward is now kept afloat by whatever the town council can spare from its own budget.

The unpredictability of war has been a major deterrent for people deciding whether to start a family.

Inna Antoniuk, the head of the maternity ward, said that about a third of the women coming through had husbands serving in the military, some of whom are dead or missing.

While the front lines in the east and south have moved slowly as Russian forces gradually advance, Moscow has stepped up missile and drone attacks across Ukraine, causing widespread damage to civilian, energy and military infrastructure.

Panchuk said the population of Hoshcha itself was not shrinking noticeably, partly because surrounding villages were emptying out and their residents heading into the town as local schools, clinics and other services shut down.

On the road to the village of Duliby, less than 10 km (6 miles) from Hoshcha, several homes lie abandoned.

Local resident Oksana Formanchuk said even in this small village where fewer than 200 residents remained, nine men had been mobilized to fight.

Among them was her husband, who has been missing in action since July, said Formanchuk, adding that she feared her two adult sons would also be drafted.

"What if they are taken away too? What would I do without them?"

'There is nothing to build on'

Anastasiia Yushchuk, a 21-year-old who was serving coffee from a van on Hoshcha's high street, said many of her friends were hesitant to have children. She said that although she hoped to start a family some day, she had no intention of doing so in the next couple of years.

"There is no stability, nothing to build upon."

Existing financial pressures have been exacerbated by the war, such as rising rents and the cost of living, she said.

"It's very hard for young people to buy a home now. We need to be financially stable, both me and my partner, and the situation in the country is changing all the time, every month or two, so it's hard to plan."

Anastasiia Tabekova, Panchuk's deputy on the town council, has a husband who's serving in the military.

"After I found out I was pregnant, a few days later my husband was mobilized," she said. "They gave him leave to attend the birth. He left with tears in his eyes."

Children can provide hope for the future, she said.

"I know many wives whose husbands are fighting, I know wives whose husbands are unfortunately no longer with us," she added. "They are holding on, some are in therapy, for some their children are a moment of joy, a reason to not give up."

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Op vrijdag 5 december 2025 16:35 schreef Lospedrosa het volgende:

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Ik bedoel helemaal niet dat er een complot is.

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Het is gewoon zo dat media wel een bepaalde sturing krijgt vanuit Europese persbureaus

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Op vrijdag 5 december 2025 16:40 schreef AchJa het volgende:

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Reuters

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Op vrijdag 5 december 2025 12:38 schreef Momo het volgende:
Wel opvallend dat Rusland deze week WhatsApp, Facetime, Snapchat en Roblox (grootste game onder de jeugd waar je in groepen kan spelen) aan banden heeft gelegd. Zou daar meer achter zitten?

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Op vrijdag 5 december 2025 17:00 schreef BlaZ het volgende:

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Ik zie vooral mogelijkheden voor West-Europa om juist daar onze overbodige asielzoekers heen te sturen.

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Op vrijdag 5 december 2025 17:00 schreef BlaZ het volgende:

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Ik zie vooral mogelijkheden voor West-Europa om juist daar onze overbodige asielzoekers heen te sturen.