Betogingen Hong Kong lopen uit de hand

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Op zondag 28 september 2014 13:16 schreef Evienne het volgende:

[..]

Het lijkt niet veel, maar gezien de volgzame aard die na eeuwen aan hersenspoeling de norm leek te zijn, vind ik het toch veelbelovend.

Het protest stond ook eigenlijk gepland voor aanstaande woensdag maar is spontaan vervroegd.

quote:

Op zondag 28 september 2014 13:16 schreef Evienne het volgende:

[..]

Het lijkt niet veel, maar gezien de volgzame aard die na eeuwen aan hersenspoeling de norm leek te zijn, vind ik het toch veelbelovend.

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China’s Hong Kong Mistake

In the summer of 1996, the Chinese Communist Party erected a giant digital clock, fifty feet tall and thirty feet long, beside Tiananmen Square, which counted down the seconds until, as it said in large characters across the top, “The Chinese Government Regains Sovereignty Over Hong Kong.” After a century and a half under British colonial rule, Hong Kong’s restoration, in 1997, was a hugely symbolic moment for China’s national identity, an end to a history of invasion in which, as the Chinese put it, their land was “cut up like a melon” by foreign powers.

Under a deal brokered with the British, China agreed not to alter Hong Kong’s internationalized way of life—including freedom of expression, freedom of assembly, and other political rights not permitted on the mainland—for half a century. The theory was that, as mainland China continued to climb out of the poverty and political instability of the past, its leaders would gradually allow more political openness on the mainland. After a half century, or so the thinking went, the gap between the mainland and its reunited territory would have narrowed so much that they could mesh without much difficulty.

But, after nearly two decades, things are turning out differently. On Sunday, the Beijing government rejected demands for free, open elections for Hong Kong’s next chief executive, in 2017, enraging protesters who had called for broad rights to nominate candidates. China’s National People’s Congress announced a plan by which nominees must be vetted and approved by more than fifty per cent of a committee that is likely to be stacked with those who heed Beijing’s wishes. If that plan comes to pass, opposition figures who favor more democracy have little chance of making it onto the ballot. (As Boss Tweed liked to say, “I don’t care who does the electing, so long as I get to do the nominating.”)

The crisis, which will likely grow, is proving to be a test not only of Hong Kong’s political culture but also of which political ethic will prevail across China in the years ahead: globalism or nationalism, two fundamentally different conceptions of how China will relate to the rest of the world. Hong Kong takes pride in its role as Asia’s original global city, a cultural and political mashup with a raucous, multilingual press corps and hot and noisy local politics—a largely borderless world of money, people, and ideas. Its courts rely on English common law, which is, in theory, free from political influence.

But, on the mainland, even as China’s economy has continued to grow and its population has become more integrated with the world, leaders have set new limits on political liberalization. They have concluded that greater democracy would threaten political stability and sovereignty, and they believe that China must instead adhere to its own centralized, one-party model. Last summer, as the scholar Sebastian Veg described, the Party circulated an internal directive to members that singled out seven “do not mention” topics: “democracy, universal values, civil society, market liberalism, media independence, criticizing errors in the history of the Party (‘historical nihilism’), and questioning the policy of opening up and reforms and the socialist nature of the regime.”

Hong Kong’s growing activist network, known as Occupy Central (named after the city’s downtown) has increasingly alarmed leaders in Beijing, and they now describe the activism as a brush fire that could sweep over the mainland. In a piece published on Saturday, the People’s Daily, the Communist Party mouthpiece, hinted about foreign agitators “attempting to turn Hong Kong into a bridgehead for subverting and infiltrating the Chinese mainland. This can absolutely not be permitted.”

In theory, China’s President, Xi Jinping, could have sought a middle road that would have opened up the nominating process enough to produce a competitive election. But, when the protests began earlier this year, Beijing worried that backing down would embolden further acts of resistance, not only in Hong Kong but also on the mainland. “If we yield because some people threaten to commence radical, illegal activities, it would only result in more, bigger illegal activities,” Li Fei, a mainland official, told Hong Kong lawmakers.

That is a strategy that points toward confrontation. Beijing chose the safer, short-term solution, but it left in place the ingredients for growing tension. Benny Tai, a law professor and opposition leader, said that the announcement opened a new “era of resistance.” “Today is not only the darkest day in the history of Hong Kong’s democratic development,” he told reporters. “Today is also the darkest day of one country, two systems,” a reference to the relationship between Hong Kong and the government in Beijing.

The most important questions are now up to the opposition: How far will pro-democracy activists go? Historically, Hong Kong’s political culture is loud and demonstrative, but not violent. The protesters have vowed to block Hong Kong’s financial district, in order to bring it to a standstill. But will it be a symbolic effort or a functional attempt to force a confrontation?

In turn, how will the Beijing-backed local government respond? Not long ago, it would have been unthinkable to imagine People’s Liberation Army vehicles on the streets of Hong Kong, but in the past quarter century the Party has shown that it is prepared to take whatever steps it deems necessary to tamp down public protests. On Sunday, hundreds of local police, and dozens of their vehicles, were arrayed around Hong Kong’s government headquarters. Last week, at least four P.L.A. armored personnel carriers were spotted in the streets.

Most important, if the confrontation becomes more acute, how will Hong Kong’s largely moderate middle class respond? So far, it has provided ambivalent support for the Occupy Central movement, fearing that unrest, even for popular ideas, could undermine the city’s business climate or invite harsher measures from Beijing. But how many of Hong Kong’s citizens will see a show of force as a reason to back down, and how many will see it as a reason to join the more radical pro-democracy camp?

The struggle over political values at the center of this crisis runs much deeper than the technical debate over Hong Kong’s elections. It is likely to get worse before it gets better. In a statement on Sunday, the Occupy Central activists described a sense of desperation, a belief that “all chances of dialogue have been exhausted and the occupation of Central will definitely happen.” It did not say when that occupation will begin.

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Op zondag 28 september 2014 13:10 schreef HighVolume het volgende:
Het volk een keuze geven

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Op zondag 28 september 2014 13:10 schreef HighVolume het volgende:
Het volk een keuze geven

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Hong Kong citizens urged to continue protests as police withdraw

Numbers of pro-democracy demonstrators rise, paralysing parts of financial hub, after riot police are taken off streets

An organiser of Hong Kong’s civil disobedience movement has urged thousands of citizens to keep up pro-democracy protests across the city until the government addresses their demands.

Crowds of demonstrators blocking key roads swelled again on Monday afternoon, despite an apparent step back by police, with others saying they planned to join the throng as soon as they finished work.

Police attempts to use teargas to clear huge protests from Admiralty and Central in downtown Hong Kong late on Sunday backfired, instead spurring more people to take to the streets, with numbers peaking in the tens of thousands. New protests sprang up in Causeway Bay and Mongkok, in Kowloon.

“What we have seen is spontaneous – without leadership, without prior organisation, of its own volition … a people’s movement. We simply want basic dignity. We simply want to be respected,” said lawmaker Alan Leong of the Civic party.

Parts of the financial hub, generally known for its orderliness, were paralysed by the protesters on Monday. Banks, schools and some businesses were closed. But in Central, businesses operated as usual and in Causeway Bay, tourists and shoppers made their way around the demonstrations.

The government announced on Monday morning that riot police had been taken off the streets – though a few were later seen on duty – as citizens had “mostly calmed down”. It urged people to unblock roads and disperse. Police later told a press conference they had used what they believed to be a minimal level of force.

Chan Kin-man, one of Occupy Central’s leaders, said Hong Kong residents should continue to protest as long as there was no risk of escalated force, pointing out that the chief executive of Hong Kong, Leung Chun-ying, had said police would not shoot at protesters or seek help from the People’s Liberation Army. But he told the South China Morning Post: “We’re worried that there are people infiltrating to cause trouble.”

Protests have been peaceful to date, with participants holding their hands in the air as they confronted police.

Hong Kong enjoys considerable autonomy under the “one country, two systems” framework and China has long promised universal suffrage for the election of the next chief executive in 2017. But protesters are furious that rules announced by Beijing will impose such tight controls on candidates that a democrat could not even stand. They see the decision as part of a broader attempt to tighten controls on the region.

The non-violent civil disobedience movement was expected to start on Wednesday, a public holiday. But it kicked off over the weekend after students who had been running class boycotts invaded the government compound at Admiralty, which police had blocked off.

The organisers spent months planning Occupy Central with Love and Peace, but it has now taken on a life and perhaps a name of its own. Some dubbed it “the umbrella revolution” in reference to the umbrellas that have sprung up over protesters’ heads each time they fear a teargas or pepper spray attack. Demonstrators are also equipped with masks, and hardware stores said they had sold out of goggles.

“This is a watershed,” said Hung Ho-fung of Johns Hopkins University, noting that mass protests in the past had occurred with police approval.

“This time people are using civil disobedience and setting up barricades. There’s also the disruptive aspect; in the past, they emphasised that demonstrations would not affect everyday life. This time they really don’t care. I really haven’t seen anything like this in Hong Kong history.”

But, he warned: “Beijing has put itself in a corner and I don’t think it can back down. I think it’s out of Beijing’s expectations that Hong Kong people would be so persistent and so provoked by the decision.”

In previous cases where protests against Chinese government plans have led to those plans being dropped – such as 2012’s plans for compulsory “national education” – the decisions have formally been made by the Hong Kong leadership. This time, the framework for reforms was announced by the standing committee for Beijing’s National People’s Congress, meaning Beijing is explicitly tied to it and cannot portray a shift as a decision by the Hong Kong government.

Hung predicted that they would use loyalists to mobilise the counter-argument, with people warning of the need to prevent chaos.

“That might gain ground over time. But people see very clearly that the chaos has been created by the government’s use of force,” he said.

In some parts of the city, commuters cheered protesters. But Agence France-Presse reported that there were angry confrontations in Mong Kok between the activists and people annoyed by the disruption.

The Hong Kong dollar fell to a six-month low when trading opened, and shares slipped to a three-month low.

More schools have gone on strike – students had already announced that last week’s class boycott was now an indefinite campaign – and the government decided to close schools in the Central, Wanchai and Western districts. Several banks closed branches and around 200 bus routes were suspended, the South China Morning Post reported. Civil servants were sent home early.

The government has cancelled plans for the annual firework display to celebrate China’s national holiday on Wednesday, when a surge in mainland visitors is expected.

Coca-Cola transport workers went on strike in support of the protests, as did some social workers.

Officials say 41 people, including police, have been injured since protests began and 78 arrested for offences including forcible entry into government premises, unlawful assembly and obstructing police.

Occupy Central and others appear to be prioritising the demand to oust Leung, the highly unpopular chief executive. That seems a more achievable outcome than a rolling back of the electoral reform plans. Although, since the protests have taken on a momentum of their own, uniting all those on the streets could prove difficult.

In a statement, Occupy Central said Leung’s refusal to enter direct talks with people had driven Hong Kong into a crisis of disorder, which would be defused by his resignation.

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Op maandag 29 september 2014 13:11 schreef Igen het volgende:
Interessant.

Als ik kijk naar een paar statusupdates op de sociale media van mensen uit mainland China:

Eén iemand is geïrriteerd dat Instagram geblokkeerd

En iemand heeft een link naar een artikeltje "It's the economy, stupid!" (maar dan in het Chinees) gepost, maar de inhoud is gecensureerd.

Met de titel is het nog wel terug te vinden hier. Met een vertaalprogramma begrijp ik dat het een opiniestuk is dat stelt dat Hong Kong eigenlijk nog steeds een koloniaal bestuur heeft. Een uitsluitend uitvoerend apparaat, dat voor strategische visies altijd van Londen afhankelijk is geweest en nu stuurloos is geworden, en lukraak heen en weer zwalkt al naar de waan van de dag in de publieke opinie. Een angstige publieke opinie, die alleen maar bedreigingen ziet in plaats van kansen - wat uiteindelijk ook de economie afknijpt. De suggestie wordt gewekt dat de mensen van Hong Kong daarom mainland China als vervanging voor Londen als strategische beleidsbepaler zouden moeten zien, en zichzelf in de voet schieten door zich daartegen te verzetten.

Maar dat is blijkbaar toch ook weer niet de boodschap die de Chinese internetcensureerders graag zien.

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Protest marches and vigils are fairly common in Hong Kong, but what began on Friday and escalated dramatically on Sunday is unprecedented. Mass acts of civil disobedience were met by a shocking and swift police response, which has led to clashes in the streets and popular outrage so great that analysts can only guess at what will happen next.

What's going on in Hong Kong right now is a very big deal, and for reasons that go way beyond just this weekend's protests. Hong Kong's citizens are protesting to keep their promised democratic rights, which they worry — with good reason — could be taken away by the central Chinese government in Beijing. This moment is a sort of standoff between Hong Kong and China over the city's future, a confrontation that they have been building toward for almost 20 years.

This began with a movement called Occupy Central but escalated when police surprised them with force

On Wednesday, student groups led peaceful marches to protest China's new plan for Hong Kong's 2017 election, which looked like China reneging on its promise to grant the autonomous region full democracy (see the next section for what that plan was such a big deal). Protest marches are pretty common in Hong Kong so it didn't seem so unusual at first.

Things started escalating on Friday. Members of a protest group called Occupy Central (Central is the name of Hong Kong's downtown district) had planned to launch a "civil disobedience" campaign on October 1, a national holiday celebrating communist China's founding. But as the already-ongoing protesters escalated they decided to go for it now. On Friday, protesters peacefully occupied the forecourt (a courtyard-style open area in front of an office building) of Hong Kong's city government headquarters along with other downtown areas.

The really important thing is what happened next: Hong Kong's police cracked down with surprising force, fighting in the streets with protesters and eventually emerging with guns that, while likely filled with rubber bullets, look awfully militaristic. In response, outraged Hong Kong residents flooded into the streets to join the protesters, and on Sunday police blanketed Central with tear gas, which has been seen as a shocking and outrageous escalation. The Chinese central government issued a statement endorsing the police actions, as did Hong Kong's pro-Beijing chief executive, a tacit signal that Beijing wishes for the protests to be cleared.

You have to remember that this is Hong Kong: an affluent and orderly place that prides itself on its civility and its freedom. Hong Kongers have a bit of a superiority complex when it comes to China, and see themselves as beyond the mainland's authoritarianism and disorder. But there is also deep, deep anxiety that this could change, that Hong Kong could lose its special status, and this week's events have hit on those anxieties to their core.

This all goes back to a promise China made in 1997 — and might be breaking

This began in 1997, when the United Kingdom handed over Hong Kong, one of its last imperial possessions, to the Chinese government. Hong Kong had spent over 150 years under British rule; it had become a fabulously wealthy center of commerce and had enjoyed, while not full democracy, far more freedom and democracy than the rest of China. So, as part of the handover, the Chinese government in Beijing promised to let Hong Kong keep its special rights and its autonomy — a deal known as "one country, two systems."

A big part of that deal was China's promise that, in 2017, Hong Kong's citizens would be allowed to democratically elect their top leader for the first time ever. That leader, known as the Hong Kong chief executive, is currently appointed by a pro-Beijing committee. In 2007, the Chinese government reaffirmed its promise to give Hong Kong this right in 2017, which in Hong Kong is referred to as universal suffrage — a sign of how much value people assign to it.

But there have been disturbing signs throughout this year that the central Chinese government might renege on its promise. In July, the Chinese government issued a "white paper" stating that it has "comprehensive jurisdiction" over Hong Kong and that "the high degree of autonomy of [Hong Kong] is not an inherent power, but one that comes solely from the authorization by the central leadership." It sounded to many like a warning from Beijing that it could dilute or outright revoke Hong Kong's freedoms, and tens of thousands of Hong Kong's citizens marched in protest.

Then, in August, Beijing announced its plan for Hong Kong's 2017 elections. While citizens would be allowed to vote for the chief executive, the candidates for the election would have to be approved by a special committee just like the pro-Beijing committee that currently appoints the chief executive. This lets Beijing hand-pick candidates for the job, which is anti-democratic in itself, but also feels to many in Hong Kong like a first step toward eroding their promised democratic rights.

It's about much more than one election: democracy, Tiananmen, and an uncertain future

People in Hong Kong have long wondered whether the Chinese government, famous for its heavy-handed authoritarianism and its fear of democracy, would really allow Hong Kong to become fully democratic or even keep what freedoms it had under British rule. The 2017 election was going to be a test case. So when China began to break its promises for the election, it raised a very scary question: is Beijing just going to erode Hong Kong's freedoms a little bit, or is it going to impose the same dictatorial rule it uses in mainland China, one of the least free societies in the world?

So these protests aren't just about Beijing's plan to hand-pick candidates for the 2017 election, they're about whether Hong Kong will remain fundamentally free, an ongoing and open-ended question that will continue for years no matter how these protests resolve.

The other thing you have to understand is that the memory of the 1989 Tiananmen Square massacre, in which the Chinese military mowed down 2,600 peaceful pro-democracy protesters in Beijing and other cities, looms awfully large in Hong Kong. While Hong Kong was unaffected by the massacre (it was under British rule at the time), the city holds an annual vigil in memory of the event, which has been so heavily censored in China itself that many young people have never heard of it.

Hong Kongers feel they have a responsibility to keep memory of Tiananmen for the fellow Chinese who cannot, but they also earnestly fear that it could happen to them. So that is a big part of why Hong Kong's residents are so upset to see their police donning military-like uniforms and firing tear gas this weekend; it feels like an echo, however faint, of 1989's violence. And in July, when Hong Kong residents protested the Chinese "white paper" implicitly arguing that China could revoke their freedoms, some pro-Beijing officials seemed to warn, even so subtly, that China's military could hypothetically put down any unrest in Hong Kong.

The protesters and Beijing are both hoping to force Hong Kong's divided public to decide on their future
This crisis comes in the middle of a political division among the citizens of Hong Kong, who embrace their freedoms but also tend to be conservative, over their future as part of China. Some are okay with integrating with the rest of China, or at least accept it as inevitable and don't want to kick up too much of a fuss, while some want to fight for democracy and autonomy. (There are other layers to this debate, such as Chinese nationalism versus Hong Kong exceptionalism; there's also a strong law-and-order constituency.)

You saw that split in a mid-September opinion poll asking Hong Kongers whether or not they should accept Beijing's plan for the 2017 election: 48 percent said Hong Kong should reject the plan as insufficiently democratic, while 39 percent said they should accept the deal despite the tradeoffs.

That public opinion split among Hong Kong residents is what makes this week really important. The protesters were hoping to galvanize public opinion against Beijing's plan for the 2017 election, and against China's more gradual erosion of Hong Kong's freedoms. But Beijing (and Hong Kong's pro-Beijing chief executive) seemed to hope that, by unleashing this highly unusual crackdown, they could nudge Hong Kong's ever-conservative mainstream against the protesters and in favor of the status quo.

In other words, both the pro-democracy protesters and Beijing are hoping to force Hong Kong's public to choose whether or not to accept, at a fundamental level, China's growing control over Hong Kong politics. If the public tacitly accepts Beijing's terms for the 2017 election, it will likely be taken as a green light for more limits on Hong Kong's democracy and autonomy, however subtle those limits end up being. But if Hong Kong residents join the protesters en masse, they will be rejecting not just the 2017 election terms, but the basic terms of Hong Kong's relationship with the central Chinese government.

It is simply too early to tell which direction these protests will go. Although early indications suggest that thousands of residents began joining the students in protest on Sunday, it's not clear if this will grow significantly larger, as is probably necessary to force change, or will fizzle out under police pressure. However it resolves, though, this is a potentially decisive moment for Hong Kong and the uncertainty that has hung over its future ever since 1997.

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Op maandag 29 september 2014 13:21 schreef Igen het volgende:

[..]

Lijkt erop alsof de Chinese overheid bang is dat elke aandacht voor het probleem, hoe slijmerig dan ook, toch aandacht is en toch burgers kan laten nadenken of het misschien niet toch anders is, en het daarom maar liever gewoon helemaal dood wil zwijgen. Over de protesten op het Plein van de Hemelse Vrede van 25 jaar geleden is immers ook geen officiële lezing, dat wordt ook gewoon compleet doodgezwegen.

Hier trouwens nog een interessant achtergrondartikel:
http://www.vox.com/2014/9(...)shes-china-explainer

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From Gary Pollard (former head of RTHK English TV):

"The overseas news reports keep trying to explain why so many Hong Kong people are so dispirited and angry, and they keep only scratching the surface. Start with this: that the parents or grandparents of almost every Hongkonger came here to escape the politics and the chaos of mainland China.

Today, they look at a local government made up almost entirely of people chosen for their loyalty to the PRC, irrespective of their ability or their personal ethics. Almost every government minister has profound "communist" sympathies or former DAB or leftist connections. That is the only reason they are there. It feels to many Hong Kong people that they are trapped, ruled by these people. No one voted for them.

That would not seem so bad if the Legislative Council could impose any restraints on the government. But too few observers understand or care that the Legislative Council is half made up of functional constituencies who are either kowtowing to Beijing or to big business. There is a split voting system where legislation must be passed both by geographically elected legislators and these special interest legislator, who are basically lobbyists. The public did not vote for them, but they can veto ANY legislation aimed at controlling the government or supporting grassroot interests.That is why Legco becomes solely a space for political theatre. Because democrats and pro-grassroots legislators can achieve nothing there. NO WORTHWHILE LEGISLATION THE GOVERNMENT DOES NOT LIKE CAN BE PASSED. EVER. It feels to many Hong Kong people that they are trapped, ruled by this system.

More and more young people feel they can't have children. Many cannot even afford to get married. Rents sky rocket. Homes of their own are too expensive. Prices are being driven up by property developers and mainland investors. The government and the CE hare the idea of rent control or seriously changing this. If you send your kids to public school, the government wants to feed them a propagandist version of history. The compulsory application of this is blocked for now, but some schools are doing it anyway. If you want to send them to a good private school, forget it. You probably can't afford it. It feels to many Hong Kong people that they and their next generation are trapped, ruled by these circumstances.

The media could help. But look at the people given pride of place when the tycoons went to Beijing. And you know that the media are not inclined to help. Hong Kong has about one and a half papers that do not toe the line. Its commercial TV stations are both pandering to political interests. Self censorship is rife. Local broadcast media are turning away from international English-language programming, which lowers HK's profile worldwide. It feels to many Hong Kong people that they are finding no help there, so they turn to social media instead. But they feel the forums for debate are shrinking.

And then there's the influx of mainlanders. This is nothing against the mainlanders themselves, but Hongkongers do feel they are being used as a deliberate part of assimilation: to mainlandise their home and remove it of its identity.

So, international press, look deeper. This is NOT just a petty argument about public nomination for the Chief Executive. It's about having room to breathe. It is about a sense of complete despair, of seeing no direction open.

Hongkongers are not stupid. I to not believe they would choose a Chief Executive that the PRC has the ability to reject anyway. They just want to breathe and not feel they are being boxed into an ever tighter and tighter corner where someone is about to turn the lights out for good. This is no rebellion. It's desperation."

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Opnieuw grote protesten in Hongkong

De protesten voor democratie in Hong Kong breiden zich uit. Op steeds meer plekken in de Chinese stad verschenen maandag betogers.

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Op maandag 29 september 2014 13:50 schreef One_conundrum het volgende:
https://www.facebook.com/(...)911.686680699&type=1

Het zal aanzwellen, tot er woensdag makkelijk meer dan 200k mensen in de benen zijn.

twitter:

libdave twitterde op zondag 28-09-2014 om 19:41:34 Chinese TV describes #OccupyCentral crowds 'a mass celebration of Oct 1st National Day'. Utterly shameless http://t.co/7cDw62RwNr reageer retweet

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Op maandag 29 september 2014 17:27 schreef One_conundrum het volgende:
https://t.co/lfQaKdzykG

vine

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Op maandag 29 september 2014 17:29 schreef One_conundrum het volgende:
http://i.instagram.com/p/th9fC8JVs1/

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Op maandag 29 september 2014 17:45 schreef One_conundrum het volgende:
dat is geen nieuws helaass

http://www.scmp.com/news/(...)references-hong-kong

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Op maandag 29 september 2014 17:14 schreef El_jefe07 het volgende:
Mooie fotoreportage:

http://www.demetrisevastopulo.com/Hong-Kong/i-5JqXs4n

Oh, en:

[ afbeelding ]

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Witte Huis steunt betogers Hongkong

Het Witte Huis heeft de autoriteiten in Hong Kong maandag opgeroepen zich in te houden tegenover de demonstranten die meer democratie willen.

Woordvoerder Josh Earnest liet weten dat de Verenigde Staten de vrijheid van meningsuiting en vreedzame vergadering van de inwoners van Hong Kong steunen.

De politie van Hong Kong heeft geprobeerd de demonstraties in het financiële centrum van de stad in te tomen met traangas en andere middelen.

De betogers zijn het er niet mee eens dat de centrale Chinese regering in Beijing geen open selectie toestaat van kandidaten voor de hoogste bestuursfunctie in Hong Kong. In 2017 moeten voor die post voor het eerst verkiezingen worden gehouden.

Earnest zei dat de legitimiteit van de functie in de ogen van de VS alleen maar wordt vergroot als de kiezers 'echt kunnen kiezen tussen kandidaten'. Hong Kong heeft volgens het Witte Huis een open samenleving nodig met zo veel mogelijk autonomie.

_{Door: Novum}

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Op maandag 29 september 2014 20:38 schreef JCats het volgende:
Lekker stoken door de US, waar vaak keihard wordt opgetreden tegen demonstraties.

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Op maandag 29 september 2014 22:52 schreef Igen het volgende:

[..]

Ik denk niet dat daar zomaar statistieken over zijn. Sowieso is de situatie niet erg vergelijkbaar. Maar als je meer algemeen kijkt:
USA: Per miljoen inwoners 7000 gevangenen en 1 uitgevoerde doodstraf per vijf jaar
China: Per miljoen inwoners 1500 gevangenen en 1 uitgevoerde doodstraf per half jaar
(Nederland: Per miljoen inwoners 800 gevangenen en geen doodstraf)

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Op maandag 29 september 2014 23:02 schreef JCats het volgende:
In de US wordt aanmerkelijker harder opgetreden:
http://roarmag.org/2011/0(...)-street-in-pictures/

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Op maandag 29 september 2014 23:09 schreef Igen het volgende:

[..]

In China is de vrijheid van meningsuiting beperkt, maar het is in principe geen staat van geweld, ook niet van politiegeweld. Tot voor kort hadden agenten bijv. nooit een vuurwapen bij zich of überhaupt vuurwapentraining gehad.

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Op maandag 29 september 2014 23:14 schreef Igen het volgende:

[..]

Er zijn natuurlijk uitzonderingen, maar dat doet niks af aan het totaalplaatje.

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Op maandag 29 september 2014 22:43 schreef JCats het volgende:
[ afbeelding ]

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Op maandag 29 september 2014 23:47 schreef JCats het volgende:
Vooral die paar miljoen gevangenen in de US zijn daar uitermate blij mee.

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Op maandag 29 september 2014 23:47 schreef JCats het volgende:
Vooral die paar miljoen gevangenen in de US zijn daar uitermate blij mee.

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Op dinsdag 30 september 2014 00:18 schreef Tukker87 het volgende:

[..]

De meeste mensen in de US zitten in de gevangenis vanwege drugs gerelateerde zaken....

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Op dinsdag 30 september 2014 00:24 schreef TweeGrolsch het volgende:

[..]

Een steeds groter deel van de bevolking wordt tegenstander dat je daarvoor de gevangenis in moet. En aangezien de VS een democratie is zie je dat het beleid aan het veranderen is .

Democratie

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Op dinsdag 30 september 2014 00:27 schreef JCats het volgende:

[..]

Dat is nieuw voor me. Zou verheugend zijn.
Slecht nieuws voor al die private gevangenissen, die dik geld verdienen aan lange gevangenisstraffen.
Heb je ook een bron?

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Op dinsdag 30 september 2014 00:32 schreef TweeGrolsch het volgende:

[..]

Je hebt serieus gemist dat marihuana in een paar staten is gelegaliseerd?

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Op dinsdag 30 september 2014 00:35 schreef JCats het volgende:

[..]

Je hebt serieus gemist dat dat marihuana nauwelijks een rol speelt?
http://learnaboutsam.org/the-issues/marijuana-and-whos-in-prison/

quote:

Op dinsdag 30 september 2014 00:43 schreef JCats het volgende:
"There are very few people in state or federal prison for marijuana-related crimes."

quote:

Op maandag 29 september 2014 19:11 schreef JCats het volgende:
Pro Democratie activisten hebben vanmiddag de tunnel onder de Noord afgesloten.
Door blokkades was tussen 13:00 en 16:15 geen verkeer mogelijk.
De demonstranten eisen een direct gekozen burgemeester en een direct gekozen premier.

quote:

Op maandag 29 september 2014 23:32 schreef JCats het volgende:
Verstoringen van de openbare orde zoals in Kiev en nu in Hong Kong worden in het Westen beslist niet geaccepteerd.
Ordentelijke, netjes aangevraagde, betogingen leveren weinig problemen op (als men zich aan de voorwaarden houdt).
Doet me denken aan het volgende: Vlak voor de inval in Irak waren er in het Westen massale betogingen.
Door de pers en vooral door de politiek genegeerd....

quote:

Op maandag 29 september 2014 23:52 schreef BlaZ het volgende:

[..]

Hoeveel van die miljoenen gevangenen zitten daar om politieke en of ideologische redenen?

quote:

Betogers Hongkong stellen ultimatum voor overheid
De betogers in Hongkong stellen de regering een ultimatum. Als bestuurder Leung Chun-ying niet voor woensdag aftreedt en er geen goed plan komt om de democratie te herstellen, worden de protesten uitgebreid.

Tienduizenden betogers gingen dinsdag voor de vijfde dag op rij de straat op. Anders dan dit weekend, toen de oproerpolitie traangas en pepperspray inzette, verliep de demonstratie maandagnacht zonder grote problemen.

Wel zijn scholen nog altijd gesloten en blijven hoofdwegen bezet.
De betogers willen de democratie in het land herstellen en zijn het er niet mee eens dat de centrale Chinese regering in Peking geen open selectie toestaat van kandidaten voor de hoogste bestuursfunctie in Hongkong. In 2017 moeten voor die post voor het eerst verkiezingen worden gehouden.

Vrije verkiezingen

Leung zegt dat China geen compromis gaat sluiten en haar positie ten aanzien van Hongkong dezelfde blijft. Hij roept de demonstranten op de bezetting te staken, meldt CNN. ''De hoofdwegen worden gebruikt door brandweerwagens en ambulances. Zij moeten nu omrijden. Daar moet de maatschappij over nadenken", aldus de regeringsleider.

Het Chinese Nationale Volkscongres besloot eind vorige maand tegen de zin van veel inwoners van de stad, dat er geen vrije verkiezingen voor de nieuwe regeringsleider in Hongkong komen. Leung werd in 2012 gekozen door een 1.200 leden tellende commissie, waarvan de regering in Peking de samenstelling had bepaald.

Hongkong werd in 1997 een onderdeel van China, maar de inwoners behielden onder de noemer 'één staat, twee systemen' rechten die de overige Chinezen niet kennen. De regering in Peking voelt er echter niets voor dat de inwoners van Hongkong hun politiek leider vrij kunnen kiezen.

quote:

Op maandag 29 september 2014 17:33 schreef ClapClapYourHands het volgende:
[ afbeelding ]

Stukje bij beetje probeert men China op te delen...Zijn de Amerikanen weer bezig met een projectje?

quote:

Op maandag 29 september 2014 22:50 schreef JCats het volgende:
[ afbeelding ]

quote:

Op maandag 29 september 2014 23:09 schreef JCats het volgende:
Ga lekker met cijfertjes spelen joh, wat het onderwerp betreft weet je het immers toch allemaal al gezien je rhetorische vraagjes.

quote:

Op dinsdag 30 september 2014 10:55 schreef Igen het volgende:

[..]

Buitenlandse NGO's in China?

Je hebt staatsbedrijven en buitenlandse bedrijven die een joint-venture met een staatsbedrijf doen. Er zijn wel een soort-van NGO's, maar die zitten sowieso al in de informele sector.

quote:

Op dinsdag 30 september 2014 10:42 schreef theunderdog het volgende:

[..]

Wat heeft dit nu weer met de Amerikanen te maken..

quote:

Taiwan shows growing support for Hong Kong protests

Hundreds of student protesters gather in Tapei for solidarity demonstration amid concerns over China’s influence

As people around the world anxiously follow the pro-democracy protests in Hong Kong, perhaps one audience is watching more closely than the rest.

Residents of democratic, self-governing Taiwan have expressed solidarity with Chinese protesters, not least because Beijing yearns for the island to “reunite” with the mainland under the same arrangement that has polarised the southern city. Many Taiwanese look at the demonstrations, and see an alternate future for themselves.

Taiwanese broadcasters have been running near-constant footage of the protests since they began over the weekend, and hundreds of supporters have gathered in Taipei for solidarity demonstrations.

Hong Kong exchange students in Taiwan have reportedly bought tickets home to participate in the protests.

“This is a critical moment for Hong Kong. We understand the danger, but we have no time to fear. Fighting for our freedom is the only way out of this mess,” Clementine Ho, a graduate student from Hong Kong studying at National Chengchi University, told the Wall Street Journal.

Taiwan, a thriving democracy of 23 million people, has been self-governed since China’s nationalist army fled there 65 years ago to escape a communist victory on the mainland. Yet Beijing still believes in a “one China” principle, and considers the island a renegade province. Although Taiwan-mainland trade ties have warmed significantly in recent years – China is by far the island’s largest export market – the relationship remains rife with mistrust.

In March, the student-led Sunflower Movement mobilised thousands of people to occupy the island’s legislature to protest against the government’s handling of a proposed cross-straits trade pact. Critics said that the tie-up, despite its economic perks, would give Beijing undue influence over the island’s affairs.

On Sunday, the Sunflower leader, Chen Weiting, gathered about a hundred people outside Hong Kong’s trade office in the Taiwan capital, Taipei, to demand that the government end high-level cross-strait talks. “We can’t tolerate any more economic or political dealings between Taiwan and China,” Chen said.

The Chinese president, Xi Jinping, told a visiting Taiwanese delegation on Friday that a one country, two systems framework would be the best way to mend Taiwan-mainland ties.

Taiwan’s president, Ma Ying-jeou, said the island would never accept the arrangement, and expressed support for the pro-democracy movement in Hong Kong.

“In the early 1980s the one country, two systems concept was created for Taiwan, not for Hong Kong. But Taiwan has sent a clear message that we do not accept the concept,” Ma told Al-Jazeera on Monday. “If the system is good, then we believe it should be one country, one system.”

quote:

Op dinsdag 30 september 2014 14:46 schreef Elan het volgende:
Hier gaan vast weer veel doden bij vallen a la Tiananmenprotest, of zou de regering daadwerkelijk openstaan voor rigoureuze veranderingen ditmaal?

quote:

Op dinsdag 30 september 2014 19:16 schreef JCats het volgende:
Sinds het akkoord v/d BRICS landen hebben we ellende in Brazilië (pres.kandidaat stort neer), Rusland/Oekraine, Al Qaeda breidt uit naar India, nu is China aan de beurt, eens kijken wat er binnenkort in S-Africa gaat gebeuren.

quote:

Op maandag 29 september 2014 23:32 schreef JCats het volgende:
Verstoringen van de openbare orde zoals in Kiev en nu in Hong Kong worden in het Westen beslist niet geaccepteerd.
Ordentelijke, netjes aangevraagde, betogingen leveren weinig problemen op (als men zich aan de voorwaarden houdt).
Doet me denken aan het volgende: Vlak voor de inval in Irak waren er in het Westen massale betogingen.
Door de pers en vooral door de politiek genegeerd....

quote:

Op dinsdag 30 september 2014 19:46 schreef icecreamfarmer_NL het volgende:

[..]

Waar was jij toen. Die zijn juist enorm in de pers geweest. De algehele tendens in NL was sowieso tegen de oorlog.

quote:

Op dinsdag 30 september 2014 19:16 schreef JCats het volgende:
Sinds het akkoord v/d BRICS landen hebben we ellende in Brazilië (pres.kandidaat stort neer), Rusland/Oekraine, Al Qaeda breidt uit naar India, nu is China aan de beurt, eens kijken wat er binnenkort in S-Africa gaat gebeuren.

quote:

Op maandag 29 september 2014 19:47 schreef Brum_brum het volgende:
In Nederland vertellen mensen nog trots dat ze PvdA, PVV of SP stemmen

quote:

Op dinsdag 30 september 2014 20:00 schreef JCats het volgende:
Vrij kleine impact?
Vraag dat maar eens aan Saddam of Ghadaffi, oh w8..

Nee de CIA houdt zich bezig met ontwikkelingswerk en zending.

quote:

Op maandag 29 september 2014 23:35 schreef Aloulou het volgende:
Wanneer gaat Van Baalen in Hong Kong de demonstranten een flinke steun in de rug geven en schreeuwen dat ze in hun recht staan en door moeten blijven zetten de centrale overheid in Peking en het volk "zal overwinnen"?

quote:

Op dinsdag 30 september 2014 20:18 schreef icecreamfarmer_NL het volgende:

[..]

En die hebben met die brics te maken omdat?

quote:

Op dinsdag 30 september 2014 20:22 schreef betyar het volgende:
Het westen ziet zijn imperialisme instorten en proberen nu de BRICS aan te pakken. Want de NAVO zal en moet uitbreiden!!!

quote:

Op dinsdag 30 september 2014 20:48 schreef JCats het volgende:
Straw Man

quote:

Op dinsdag 30 september 2014 21:06 schreef Opa2012 het volgende:

[..]

Doe dan je plicht en geef pacifistisch Rusland wat geld (want ze lenen nu tegen bijna 10%).

quote:

Op dinsdag 30 september 2014 19:16 schreef JCats het volgende:
Sinds het akkoord v/d BRICS landen hebben we ellende in Brazilië (pres.kandidaat stort neer), Rusland/Oekraine, Al Qaeda breidt uit naar India, nu is China aan de beurt, eens kijken wat er binnenkort in S-Africa gaat gebeuren.

quote:

Op dinsdag 30 september 2014 22:52 schreef JCats het volgende:
Straw Man

quote:

Op dinsdag 30 september 2014 23:45 schreef JCats het volgende:
????

quote:

Op dinsdag 30 september 2014 20:18 schreef icecreamfarmer_NL het volgende:

[..]

En die hebben met die brics te maken omdat?

quote:

Op dinsdag 30 september 2014 10:42 schreef theunderdog het volgende:

[..]

Wat heeft dit nu weer met de Amerikanen te maken..

quote:

Op woensdag 1 oktober 2014 14:34 schreef ClapClapYourHands het volgende:

[..]

Amerika is al jaren bezig landen op de delen door de lokale bevolking hier en daar op te stoken

quote:

Op woensdag 1 oktober 2014 14:55 schreef Speculant. het volgende:

[..]

Klopt. In India, Brazilie, China, Zuid Afrika, Rusland is er volkomen politieke vrijheid, vrijwel geen corruptie nu alles beter gaat en is de sociale ongelijkheid ook veel minder geworden verder wordt er ook geen onderscheid gemaakt tussen lokale bevolkingsgroepen. Iedereen heeft het daar goed en er is geen reden tot demonstraties/rellen.

Het is dus minstens een CIA complot en waarschijnlijk zelfs een zionistisch complot opdat het fout gaat in die landen.

quote:

Op woensdag 1 oktober 2014 15:01 schreef ClapClapYourHands het volgende:

[..]

Die dingen die je opnoemt gelden ook voor Amerika zelf. Alleen op het moment dat een land zich opsplitst gaat het vaak hand in hand met geweld (India, Balkan landen, Irak). Dat soort dingen gaan niet zonder steun van bepaalde instanties.

Ooit landen met macht en nu niks meer.

quote:

Taiwan achter protest Hongkong

_{woensdag 1 okt 2014, 14:30 (Update: 01-10-14, 14:48)}

De regering van Taiwan heeft steun uitgesproken voor de protestbeweging in Hongkong. President Ma Ying-jeou heeft verklaard dat China zich moet houden aan de belofte van autonomie in de voormalige Britse kroonkolonie.

Als Hongkong volledig kiesrecht krijgt, zullen de betrekkingen tussen "het vasteland" en Taiwan verbeteren, zei Ma. Anders zal de antipathie onder de bevolking van Taiwan jegens het buurland volgens hem toenemen.

Taiwan scheidde zich in 1949 af van China toen de communisten de burgeroorlog hadden gewonnen. Op het eiland Formosa vestigden de Chinese nationalisten toen een eigen staat, die door niet veel landen wordt erkend.

quote:

Op woensdag 1 oktober 2014 15:11 schreef UpsideDown het volgende:

[..]

quote:

Op woensdag 1 oktober 2014 18:22 schreef Papierversnipperaar het volgende:
[ afbeelding ]

quote:

Op woensdag 1 oktober 2014 18:37 schreef ems. het volgende:

[..]

Ik weet dat het fout is maar ik moest lachen.

quote:

Op woensdag 1 oktober 2014 19:38 schreef hmmmmmmm het volgende:

[..]

Zelfde reactie wel vreselijk.

quote:

Op woensdag 1 oktober 2014 15:01 schreef ClapClapYourHands het volgende:

[..]

Die dingen die je opnoemt gelden ook voor Amerika zelf. Alleen op het moment dat een land zich opsplitst gaat het vaak hand in hand met geweld (India, Balkan landen, Irak). Dat soort dingen gaan niet zonder steun van bepaalde instanties.

Ooit landen met macht en nu niks meer.

quote:

Op woensdag 1 oktober 2014 18:22 schreef Papierversnipperaar het volgende:
[ afbeelding ]

quote:

Op woensdag 1 oktober 2014 14:34 schreef ClapClapYourHands het volgende:

[..]

Amerika is al jaren bezig landen op de delen door de lokale bevolking hier en daar op te stoken

quote:

Op woensdag 1 oktober 2014 19:44 schreef ems. het volgende:

[..]

Ironisch genoeg bleek de Chinees in kwestie de mensen op te roepen de politie niet als de vijand te zien en rustig te blijven.

quote:

Kerry maant Chinezen tot kalmte

_{woensdag 1 okt 2014, 20:42 (Update: 01-10-14, 21:09)}

De Amerikaanse minister van Buitenlandse Zaken Kerry vraagt het bestuur van Hongkong terughoudend te reageren op de massabetogingen in de stad. Hij deed zijn oproep voor een ontmoeting met zijn Chinese ambtgenoot Wang Yi in Washington.

Wang reageerde met de opmerking dat niemand zich moet bemoeien met de binnenlandse aangelegenheid van China. "Alle landen moeten de Chinese soevereiniteit respecteren", zei hij.

Tot dusver had de Chinese regering gezwegen over de betogingen voor meer democratie in Hongkong. Hoewel Hongkong een aparte positie inneemt binnen de volksrepubliek China, bepaalt Peking in hoge mate wie er in de stad aan de touwtjes trekt.

Transparant
Kerry zei verder dat de voormalige Britse kolonie het meest gebaat is bij een transparant bestuur en meer autonomie ten opzichte van de autoriteiten in Peking.

Sinds vijf dagen protesteren vele duizenden inwoners van Hongkong voor minder Chinese bemoeienis met hun stad.

quote:

Op woensdag 1 oktober 2014 22:10 schreef UpsideDown het volgende:

[..]

quote:

Op woensdag 1 oktober 2014 23:14 schreef JCats het volgende:
Kerry? Curry!, dat is de C van BRICS, niet waar?
Hoe zat dat ook al weer met Saddam en Ghadaffi?
Is op de vorige pagina al uitgelegd, ook voor die Straw Man figuren

quote:

Op donderdag 2 oktober 2014 00:52 schreef Igen het volgende:
Hoe harder Kerry zich ermee bemoeit, hoe meer aanleiding het is om de protesten inderdaad als Westerse inmenging af te doen en juist geen concessies aan de demonstranten te doen.

Sowieso heb ik het idee dat het allemaal wel heel erg opgezweept wordt. Zoals ik het begrijp zijn er nog nooit eerder verkiezingen voor deze positie geweest, ook niet onder het Engelse bestuur. Een verkiezing waarbij de kandidaten gescreend zijn, maar waarbij wel iedereen z'n stem mag uitbrengen, is dus nog altijd democratischer dan het ooit eerder is geweest.

Het is alleen een minder grote toename aan democratie dan eerder is beloofd. Maar om daar nou gelijk een hellend-vlak-drogredenering van hier tot Tokio achteraan te plakken...

quote:

US Now Admits it is Funding “Occupy Central” in Hong Kong
Just as the US admitted shortly after the so-called “Arab Spring” began spreading chaos across the Middle East that it had fully funded, trained, and equipped both mob leaders and heavily armed terrorists years in advance, it is now admitted that the US State Department through a myriad of organizations and NGOs is behind the so-called “Occupy Central” protests in Hong Kong.

The Washington Post would report in an article titled, “Hong Kong erupts even as China tightens screws on civil society,” that:

Chinese leaders unnerved by protests elsewhere this year have been steadily tightening controls over civic organizations on the mainland suspected of carrying out the work of foreign powers.

The campaign aims to insulate China from subversive Western ideas such as democracy and freedom of expression, and from the influence, specifically, of U.S. groups that may be trying to promote those values here, experts say. That campaign is long-standing, but it has been prosecuted with renewed vigor under President Xi Jinping, especially after the overthrow of Ukrainian President Viktor Yanukovych following months of street demonstrations in Kiev that were viewed here as explicitly backed by the West.

The Washington Post would also report (emphasis added):

One foreign policy expert, who spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss a sensitive subject, said Putin had called Xi to share his concern about the West’s role in Ukraine. Those concerns appear to have filtered down into conversations held over cups of tea in China, according to civil society group members.

“They are very concerned about Color Revolutions, they are very concerned about what is going on in Ukraine,” said the international NGO manager, whose organization is partly financed by the National Endowment for Democracy (NED), blamed here for supporting the protests in Kiev’s central Maidan square. “They say, ‘Your money is coming from the same people. Clearly you want to overthrow China.’ ”

Congressionally funded with the explicit goal of promoting democracy abroad, NED has long been viewed with suspicion or hostility by the authorities here. But the net of suspicion has widened to encompass such U.S. groups as the Ford Foundation, the International Republican Institute, the Carter Center and the Asia Foundation.

Of course, NED and its many subsidiaries including the International Republican Institute and the National Democratic Institute do no such thing as “promoting democracy,” and instead are in the business of constructing a global network of neo-imperial administration termed “civil society” that interlocks with the West’s many so-called “international institutions” which in turn are completely controlled by interests in Washington, upon Wall Street, and in the cities of London and Brussels.

The very concept of the United States ”promoting democracy” is scandalous when considering it is embroiled in an invasive global surveillance scandal, guilty of persecuting one unpopular war after another around the planet against the will of its own people and based on verified lies, and brutalizing and abusing its own citizens at home with militarized police cracking down on civilians in towns like Ferguson, Missouri – making China’s police actions against “Occupy Central” protesters pale in comparison. “Promoting democracy” is clearly cover for simply expanding its hegemonic agenda far beyond its borders and at the expense of national sovereignty for all subjected to it, including Americans themselves.

In 2011, similar revelations were made public of the US’ meddling in the so-called “Arab Spring” when the New York Times would report in an article titled, “U.S. Groups Helped Nurture Arab Uprisings,” that:

A number of the groups and individuals directly involved in the revolts and reforms sweeping the region, including the April 6 Youth Movement in Egypt, the Bahrain Center for Human Rights and grass-roots activists like Entsar Qadhi, a youth leader in Yemen, received training and financing from groups like the International Republican Institute, the National Democratic Institute and Freedom House, a nonprofit human rights organization based in Washington.

The article would also add, regarding NED specifically, that:

The Republican and Democratic institutes are loosely affiliated with the Republican and Democratic Parties. They were created by Congress and are financed through the National Endowment for Democracy, which was set up in 1983 to channel grants for promoting democracy in developing nations. The National Endowment receives about $100 million annually from Congress. Freedom House also gets the bulk of its money from the American government, mainly from the State Department.

Pro-war and interventionist US Senator John McCain had famously taunted both Russia’s President Vladimir Putin and President Xi Jinping’s predecessor in 2011 that the US subversion sweeping the Middle East was soon headed toward Moscow and Beijing. The Atlantic in a 2011 article titled, “The Arab Spring: ‘A Virus That Will Attack Moscow and Beijing’,” would report that:

He [McCain] said, “A year ago, Ben-Ali and Gaddafi were not in power. Assad won’t be in power this time next year. This Arab Spring is a virus that will attack Moscow and Beijing.” McCain then walked off the stage.

Considering the overt foreign-funded nature of not only the “Arab Spring,” but now “Occupy Central,” and considering the chaos, death, destabilization, and collapse suffered by victims of previous US subversion, “Occupy Central” can be painted in a new light – a mob of dupes being used to destroy their own home – all while abusing the principles of “democracy” behind which is couched an insidious, diametrically opposed foreign imposed tyranny driven by immense, global spanning corporate-financier interests that fear and actively destroy competition. In particular, this global hegemon seeks to suppress the reemergence of Russia as a global power, and prevent the rise of China itself upon the world’s stage.

The regressive agenda of “Occupy Central’s” US-backed leadership, and their shameless exploitation of the good intentions of the many young people ensnared by their gimmicks, poses a threat in reality every bit as dangerous as the “threat” they claim Beijing poses to the island of Hong Kong and its people. Hopefully the people of China, and the many people around the world looking on as “Occupy Central” unfolds, will realize this foreign-driven gambit and stop it before it exacts the heavy toll it has on nations that have fallen victim to it before – Libya, Syria, Ukraine, Egypt, and many others.
http://www.globalresearch(...)in-hong-kong/5405680

quote:

Op donderdag 2 oktober 2014 00:52 schreef Igen het volgende:
Hoe harder Kerry zich ermee bemoeit, hoe meer aanleiding het is om de protesten inderdaad als Westerse inmenging af te doen en juist geen concessies aan de demonstranten te doen.

Sowieso heb ik het idee dat het allemaal wel heel erg opgezweept wordt. Zoals ik het begrijp zijn er nog nooit eerder verkiezingen voor deze positie geweest, ook niet onder het Engelse bestuur. Een verkiezing waarbij de kandidaten gescreend zijn, maar waarbij wel iedereen z'n stem mag uitbrengen, is dus nog altijd democratischer dan het ooit eerder is geweest.

Het is alleen een minder grote toename aan democratie dan eerder is beloofd. Maar om daar nou gelijk een hellend-vlak-drogredenering van hier tot Tokio achteraan te plakken...

quote:

Op donderdag 2 oktober 2014 11:44 schreef Igen het volgende:

[..]

Klopt, het vasteland is deels nog achtergebleven en onbeschaafd, en deels door de culturele revolutie redelijk westers en een stuk minder typisch Aziatisch dan Hong Kong en bijv. ook Japan.

Maar intussen is de houding op het vasteland volgens mij ook aardig dubbel geworden. Hong Kong is aantrekkelijk vanwege de lage btw, de rijkdom en de hoge kwaliteit van de spullen daar, maar in moreel opzicht wordt er vanuit het vasteland toch wel behoorlijk op neergekeken hoor.

quote:

Op donderdag 2 oktober 2014 11:50 schreef Igen het volgende:

[..]

Ik ben te kort in HK geweest om dat te kunnen beoordelen. Maar vasteland-China is zeker een stuk westerser dan Japan. Meer individualisme en egoïsme ipv. het typisch Aziatische jezelf wegcijferen als radertje in de maatschappelijke machine; Westerse stedenbouw (Le Corbusier!); eten aan een hoge tafel met stoelen ipv. gehurkt op de grond aan een lage tafel zoals in Azië gebruikelijk is; atheïsme ipv. traditionele Aziatische religies, enz.

quote:

Op donderdag 2 oktober 2014 12:02 schreef Igen het volgende:

[..]

Maar dat zal vooral een kwestie zijn van economische regelgeving en van hoe verbreid het Engels is.

Op grond van wat ik in Japan heb gezien en wat Gimmick schrijft, denk ik niet dat Hong Kong cultureel gezien een middenpositie tussen oost en west inneemt. In tegendeel.

quote:

Op donderdag 2 oktober 2014 12:11 schreef Igen het volgende:

[..]

En hoe vaak en hoe lang ben je in China geweest, met alle respect?

twitter:

15MBcn_int twitterde op woensdag 01-10-2014 om 18:55:09 You can tweet directly to the crowds at the #OccupyCentral movement at http://occupier.hk/standbyyou/ #HongKong reageer retweet

quote:

An editorial Wednesday in the People’s Daily newspaper called the demonstrations illegal and said ominously that if they continue, the “consequences will be unimaginable.”

The paper, considered the flagship mouthpiece for the ruling Communist Party, followed up with front-page editorial Thursday warning that continued protests would drive Hong Kong into “chaos.”

twitter:

AnonymousPress twitterde op donderdag 02-10-2014 om 19:22:56 RT @tlng13: all the best to the Anonymous!! #UmbrellaRevolution Operation Hong Kong http://t.co/ynkB5qTe3n reageer retweet

Anonymous Declares War Against Hong Kong Police

quote:

Report: Hacker collective Anonymous joins Hong Kong’s Occupy Central

Reporting on the hacker collective Anonymous is always fraught. This loosely organized group has no clear leader and no clear agenda. The anarchic nature of its technological attacks make it difficult to establish a who-what-where-when-why. And, of course, hackers use nom de guerres. Heck: Even the Islamic State has a spokesman.

Yet, in attacks on Israel, Visa and, to a lesser extent, Ferguson, Mo., showed that Anonymous — whoever and whatever it is at any given time — can be effective. Unlike 4chan, which revels in naked celebrity pics, it seems to have a social conscience. And its propaganda — straight out of “V for Vendetta” — makes good copy.

“Members of Anonymous — the shadowy, snide international collective of hackers and online activists — have played a key role in the growing confrontation outside St. Louis over Mr. Brown’s death,” the New York Times wrote in August, “goading and threatening the authorities, and calling the effort Operation Ferguson.”

So here goes: Anonymous has code on the ground in Hong Kong, the South China Morning Post reports. The group announced it will wage cyberwar on the government in a video circulated through the Web site News2share.

“It has come to our attention that recent tactics used against peaceful protesters here in the United States have found their way to Hong Kong,” a mechanical-sounding voice in the video says. “To the protesters in Hong Kong, we have heard your plea for help. Take heart and take to your streets. You are not alone in this fight. Anonymous members all over the world stand with you, and will help in your fight for democracy.

The video goes on to threaten to “deface and take every Web-based asset of your government off line.”

The South China Morning Post posted images of some Web sites it said were affected (warning: link contains profanity), but did not identify them. “Despite these vehement threats, the hacks thus far appear to be not on government websites but rather small organisations – including an Autism Partnership site – registered with a .hk domain name,” the paper wrote.

A list of Hong Kong government agency Web sites appears here. Early Thursday morning, many seemed un-hacked. Then again, Anonymous said it was offering its “first and only warning,” so perhaps it hasn’t acted yet.

quote:

Op donderdag 2 oktober 2014 11:10 schreef SadPanda het volgende:

[..]

quote:

Op donderdag 2 oktober 2014 11:44 schreef Igen het volgende:

[..]

Klopt, het vasteland is deels nog achtergebleven en onbeschaafd, en deels door de culturele revolutie redelijk westers en een stuk minder typisch Aziatisch dan Hong Kong en bijv. ook Japan.

Maar intussen is de houding op het vasteland volgens mij ook aardig dubbel geworden. Hong Kong is aantrekkelijk vanwege de lage btw, de rijkdom en de hoge kwaliteit van de spullen daar, maar in moreel opzicht wordt er vanuit het vasteland toch wel behoorlijk op neergekeken hoor.

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Violent clashes break out in Hong Kong after counter-protesters storm sit-in

About 1,000 people opposed to pro-democracy movement fight 100 demonstrators after Leung Chun-ying’s talks offer

quote:

Violent scuffles have broken out in one of Hong Kong’s most famous and congested shopping districts, as supporters of Chinese rule stormed tents and ripped down banners belonging to pro-democracy protesters.

In the gritty, bustling district of Mongkok – considered one of the most crowded places on Earth with its high-rise apartment blocks packed closely together over neon lights, bars, restaurants and open-air markets – about 1,000 Beijing supporters clashed with about 100 protesters on Friday, spitting and throwing water bottles.

Police formed a human chain to separate the two groups amid the wail of sirens.

Some demonstrators held umbrellas for police in the rain while Beijing supporters shouted at police for failing to move the demonstrators.

Protesters in Mong Kok meanwhile asked why police had not sent reinforcements to break up the clashes. A spokeswoman for the Hong Kong police force refused to comment on the number dispatched or whether they were ordinary or riot police.

“The police will take appropriate action,” the spokeswoman said. “We will deploy enough police to the scene to help safeguard safety and restore public order.”

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Op donderdag 2 oktober 2014 11:10 schreef SadPanda het volgende:

[..]

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Op vrijdag 3 oktober 2014 16:17 schreef ASSpirine het volgende:
Verschrikkelijk wat er nu aan het gebeuren is... Zit nu zelf in HK, en continu nieuws hierover.

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Op vrijdag 3 oktober 2014 21:08 schreef Igen het volgende:
Jij struint ook echt elk topic af om je Amerikahaat kwijt te kunnen hè.

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Op vrijdag 3 oktober 2014 12:17 schreef Igen het volgende:

[..]

Ik heb het niet gevraagd, maar ik gok op een stukje propaganda, maar vast ook uit ergernis over Hong Kong'ers die zich beter voelen dan de rest van China terwijl grote delen van Hong Kong nou niet echt eruit zien alsof het er nou aangenaam vertoeven is.

[ afbeelding ]
http://www.panoramio.com/photo/1777155

twitter:

BreeNewsome twitterde op vrijdag 03-10-2014 om 20:13:45 Interesting: Hong Kong resistance labeled "revolution", #Ferguson's as "tragedy", #Gaza's not labeled at all http://t.co/zYzrLlTcGq reageer retweet

quote:

Hong Kong legislator says government using triads against protesters

Deputy chairman of legislative council’s security panel says ‘organised, orchestrated forces’ used to disperse citizens

The deputy chairman of the Hong Kong legislative council’s security panel has accused the government of working with criminal gangs to break up pro-democracy protests.

Legislator James To told his fellow pan-democratic members on Saturday that “the [Hong Kong] government has used organised, orchestrated forces and even triad gangs in [an] attempt to disperse citizens,” according to the South China Morning Post.

His comments came as fresh clashes erupted between pro-democracy protesters and armed thugs on Saturday, with student leaders also accusing the government and the police of allowing triad gangs to attack them.

Witnesses said about 1,000 protesters faced off in Mong Kok, a densely populated known for its gang presence, at mid-morning on Saturday, but there were no uniformed police in sight.

Pro-democracy activists vowed to stand their ground over the weekend. “We will retreat after that if the situation gets worse, such as if mobs start flashing their knives at us,” Daniel Tang, who is in his 30s, told Reuters.

Thugs punched and kicked protesters on Friday night, drawing blood as they tore down their tents and attempted to force them out.

At least 12 people and six police officers were injured during the clashes on Friday, senior superintendent Patrick Kwok Pak-chung told the Associated Press.

Student leaders called off talks with the government, which were offered on Thursday, accusing officials of allowing violence to be used against them. It dashed the hopes of a resolution of the standoff prompted by a mass movement that has seen tens of thousands of people take to the streets of the city.

Demonstrators were already angry that Hong Kong’s chief executive, Leung Chun-ying, had not resigned and they had little faith in the promise of dialogue bringing change.

At times over the past week police have left the streets, saying they wanted to ease tensions, but the reason for their apparent absence on Saturday morning was unclear.

The Federation of Students said the government must provide further explanation for the violence in Mong Kok on Friday before they can hold talks with the administration, the South China Morning Post reported.

They also called on supporters to attend an assembly at the main protest site in Admiralty on Saturday evening to voice their opposition to the violence.

Alex Chow, the federation’s secretary general, said they would decide whether to escalate the demonstrations after the assembly and dependant on the government’s response.

On Friday, the veteran democracy activist Martin Lee and the Occupy Central leader, Benny Tai, blamed triads for the violence in Mong Kok. Police later confirmed that some of the 19 people arrested had triad backgrounds.

The renewed violence came as the ruling Communist party’s official newpaper, the People’s Daily, praised Hong Kong police for their restraint in the face of what it said in a front-page editorial were lawless protests, including the “poking” of police with umbrellas.

“A democratic society should respect the opinions of the minority, but it does not mean those minorities have the right to resort to illegal means,” it stated.

The protests will never spill over into the rest of China … For the minority of people who want to foment a ‘colour revolution’ on the mainland by way of Hong Kong, this is but a daydream,” it said.

Mong Kok has also seen angry confrontations between protesters and residents, who said the occupation had disrupted their lives and damaged business – reflected in the large number of bystanders yelling at the remaining demonstrators.

“We are in China. If you don’t like it go away. This is the fucking motherland,” a middle-aged member of the crowd, who gave his name as CL Fu, told Reuters. He said he was a resident and was angry about the disruption caused.

“Of course we love China, but we are worried about damage to Hong Kong economics. That’s why we’re here,” he added.

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Op woensdag 1 oktober 2014 22:10 schreef UpsideDown het volgende:

[..]

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Hong Kong pro-democracy protesters vow new wave of civil disobedience

Scheduled talks between government and student groups called off shortly after press conference

Hong Kong authorities have called off negotiations with leaders of the pro-democracy “umbrella movement”, accusing them of undermining efforts to break the impasse that has paralysed the city’s main commercial hubs for almost two weeks.

Representatives of the protest movement Occupy Central with Love and Peace, the student groups Scholarism and the Hong Kong Federation of Students, and a group of pro-democracy legislators held a press conference on Thursday near the city government headquarters, where they vowed to begin a “new wave of civil disobedience”.

The demonstrators’ numbers have diminished as many of them returned to work on Monday after a national holiday, but the protest zones remain barricaded, causing traffic jams and angering scores of business owners. At the press conference, student leaders said the protests would continue until the government eased political tensions by addressing the protesters’ main demands, including free elections in 2017.

Joshua Wong Chi-fung, Scholarism’s 17-year-old leader and one of the movement’s figureheads, said students might mobilise a secondary school boycott. Pan-democrats in Hong Kong’s legislature said they would call for the impeachment of the city’s beleaguered chief executive, Leung Chun-ying, and block the government’s financial applications within subcommittees under their control.

Carrie Lam, the city’s chief secretary, cancelled scheduled talks between the government and student groups shortly after the press conference, saying that the students’ remarks had “undermined the basis for a constructive dialogue”, according to the South China Morning Post.

“This is sacrificing public good for their political demand and is against public interests and political ethics,” she said.

Beijing has approved an electoral framework that would effectively bar a democrat from running for chief executive, and has not shown any willingness to budge on the arrangement.

“My feeling is that [the government] wants to drag this out so that the rest of the citizens will be annoyed at the inconvenience, splitting society even further, before they decide what they do,” said Martin Lee, a prominent pro-democracy campaigner and former legislator.

On Wednesday, Australian media reported that Leung had accepted £4m in undisclosed payouts from an Australian engineering firm during his first two years in office. The report said the engineering firm UGL agreed to give Leung the payment as part of its acquisition of DTZ, an insolvent real estate firm that Leung helped lead for many years. Leung’s office has denied that the arrangement was illegal.

John Garnaut, one of the report’s authors, told Voice of America that reporters had been tipped off to the arrangement by an anonymous source last Sunday.

Lee said protesters have been buzzing about the revelation, with many wondering whether the tip had come from Beijing. He said many protesters wanted Leung removed from office, which would allow the government to restart a consultation process on electoral reform.

“He is the most available sacrificial lamb, from Beijing’s point of view,” Lee said. His removal “would be a good way to set aside confrontation between the two sides, and show goodwill.”

A pro-democracy group, the NeoDemocrat party, has lodged a formal complaint with Hong Kong’s anti-corruption watchdog, demanding an investigation into the arrangement, the South China Morning Post reported. The city’s department of justice has said it will field the complaint.

Mainland authorities continue to tightly restrict discussion of the pro-democracy movement on social media. Police have detained dozens of activists countrywide for supporting the protests, including up to a dozen people in Songzhuang, an artist community in western Beijing, who held a pro-umbrella movement poetry recital last week.

quote:

Hong Kong protesters take to streets after government pulls out of talks

Decision expected to reinvigorate mass pro-democracy rallies that have paralysed parts of Hong Kong for almost two weeks

Thousands of pro-democracy supporters took to Hong Kong’s streets on Friday night after protest leaders called on them to dig in for the long haul following the collapse of talks with the government.

Negotiations between protesters and Beijing-backed city officials were scheduled for Friday, but were cancelled on Thursday after the government pulled out blaming protesters for threatening to expand their campaign.

The decision deepened the political crisis in the Asian financial hub, with the failure of talks expected to reinvigorate mass rallies that have paralysed parts of the city for nearly two weeks.

Demonstrators are calling for Beijing to grant the former British colony full democracy and for Hong Kong’s chief executive, Leung Chun-ying, to resign.

About 7,000 people gathered on Friday evening at the main protest site, a stretch of road opposite the government’s headquarters.

But while crowds were smaller than ay previous rallies, the protest sites have begun to take on an air of permanence, with tents, portable showers and beds.

“I will continue to stay here until the government talks to us,” sais Yuki Law, a 21-year-old nursing student.

Student leaders on Friday blamed the government for pulling out of talks, and insisted they were still open to finding a middle ground. But they vowed no let up in their occupation of parts of Hong Kong despite growing public anger about the disruption they have caused.

“Come to occupy the road outside the public headquarters, come bring your tents to show our persistence on long term occupy action,” student leader Joshua Wong told supporters before the planned mass gathering.

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Op woensdag 15 oktober 2014 13:35 schreef static het volgende:
Rodney King praktijken hier in Hong Kong. Was net op het lokale nieuws een man die gearresteerd was (geboeid aan handen en voeten) en waar de politie - man of 6 - een minuut of 4 op losgaat met slaan, trappen, etc. terwijl de man op de grond lag.

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Op woensdag 15 oktober 2014 13:53 schreef Jibberism_ het volgende:
[..]
Tsja... Ooit worden die Chinezen en Amerikanen beste pliessiemaatjes.

Joe Lieberman U..S. needs Internet kill switch like China

quote:

Politie Hongkong arresteert tientallen demonstranten

De oproerpolitie van Hongkong heeft vandaag 26 demonstranten gearresteerd. Agenten en duizenden betogers vochten urenlang om de straten van de wijk Mong Kok, die de politie eerder op de dag nog had schoongeveegd.

Volgens de politie probeerde een menigte van ongeveer negenduizend demonstranten weer bezit te nemen van de wijk. Ze zouden herhaaldelijk hebben ingebeukt op politiekordons. Ordetroepen grepen vervolgens in. Verscheidene betogers, onder wie veel studenten, werden tegen de grond geslagen en tientallen anderen weggevoerd door de politie.

'Politie heeft zichzelf niet in de hand'
'De politie heeft zich niet meer in de hand', zei Tommy Lee, ooggetuige van de rellen, ontzet. 'Ze slaan demonstranten in elkaar alsof we beesten zijn. We zijn boos. De studenten zijn onze toekomst.' Voor Lee was naar eigen zeggen de maat vol toen hij agenten vier betogers in de boeien zag slaan die oogden als middelbare scholieren.

Eerder op de dag had de politie tenten en barricades van het kleine protestkamp in Mong Kok verwijderd. Het kampement lag niet ver van de belangrijkste plek waar betogers samen zijn gekomen, bij Victoria Harbor in het financiële hart van de stad.

twitter:

PRHacks twitterde op woensdag 05-11-2014 om 17:01:46 Live: I am marching with students in Central for #MillionMaskMarch. Police very nervous. #Anonymous #OccupyHK http://t.co/o627R1EAIq reageer retweet

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China helpt Hongkong de orde te herstellen

De Chinese president Xi Jinping heeft zondag de leider van Hongkong, Leung Chun-ying, beloofd te helpen met het herstellen en bewaken van de orde in Hongkong. Daar is het al lange tijd chaos door demonstrerende studenten. Zo zijn belangrijke wegen in het economisch en bestuurlijk centrum al weken geblokkeerd. Op welke manier China gaat helpen is niet bekend.

De studenten willen minder bemoeienis van China en eisen volledige democratie in Hongkong. Op het hoogtepunt waren er meer dan 100.000 demonstranten op de been.

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Op zondag 9 november 2014 14:45 schreef Papierversnipperaar het volgende:
Tienamin part deux?

[..]

quote:

Chinese President Xi Jinping told Hong Kong leader Leung Chun-ying on Sunday that he supports Hong Kong's efforts to maintain social order and safeguard the rule of law, state news agency Xinhua reported.

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Op zondag 9 november 2014 15:13 schreef crashbangboom het volgende:

[..]

dit is het artikel van reuters waar naar wordt verwezen. Vertalen is ook een kunst, want daar staat toch echt wat anders

http://www.reuters.com/ar(...)dUSKBN0IT03W20141109

[..]

support = steunt.

en niet "gaat helpen"

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Op zondag 9 november 2014 15:18 schreef Eyjafjallajoekull het volgende:

[..]

Vertalen is inderdaad een kunst.

Als je denkt dat dit soort vertaal 'slordigheden' per ongeluk zijn ben je naief. En er hoeft niet eens een conspiracy achter te zitten, kan gewoon zijn om meer ad inkomsten te krijgen omdat meer mensen op de link klikken.

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Op zaterdag 18 oktober 2014 17:45 schreef static het volgende:
Gerucht gaat dat de politie een grote schoonmaak-actie gaat houden vannacht (het is hier nu bijna middernacht).

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Op zondag 9 november 2014 15:20 schreef crashbangboom het volgende:

[..]

Het is toch gvd de frontpage niet?

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Hong Kong protesters face arrest after court rules on evictions

Violence feared as authorities say there is no room for further dialogue with student-led protesters

Pro-democracy protesters camped out on the streets of Hong Kong for more than six weeks face arrest after a court authorised police to help bailiffs clear them from occupation sites, a senior government official has warned.

The acting chief secretary, Carrie Lam, also said there was no room for further dialogue with the student-led protesters, whom she said had hardened their position, raising the prospect of more violence as the government struggles to end the mostly peaceful standoff.

Lam’s remarks to reporters came a day after Hong Kong’s high court extended injunctions requiring protesters to leave two of the three protest sites while also authorising bailiffs to seek police assistance to clear the areas.

Lam said “the police will give full assistance, including making arrests where necessary” to enforce the injunctions.

She urged protesters to “voluntarily and peacefully” leave the occupied areas so that roads and building entrances could be reopened.

The demonstrators have been occupying key thoroughfares since 28 September to protest against the Chinese central government’s requirement that candidates for inaugural 2017 elections for Hong Kong’s top leader be screened by a panel of Beijing-friendly elites.

On Monday, a judge extended interim restraining orders taken out three weeks ago by bus, minibus and taxi operators against protesters blocking streets in Hong Kong’s densely populated Mong Kok district. The owner of an office building next to the main protest site surrounding city government headquarters in Admiralty district also had a restraining order extended.

Previous police attempts to clear protesters from occupied areas with force have backfired, drawing more demonstrators on to the streets and forcing authorities to back off.

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Hong Kong student leaders plan to fly to China for talks

Group hold plane tickets for Beijing on Saturday, where they hope to meet China’s top officials to press case for voting rights

Student leaders of the mass pro-democracy protests that have rocked Hong Kong since September have said they plan to fly to Beijing on Saturday to try to meet China’s top officials to press their case for a greater say in choosing the territory’s next leader.

Eason Chung, a member of a student group that played a main role in organising street protests that started nearly two months ago, said on Friday that he and two others had bought plane tickets for the trip.

If they are allowed to enter mainland China, they said they will go straight to China’s legislature to seek talks with Premier Li Keqiang and other officials.

The students have already asked the Hong Kong government’s No 2 official as well as former leader Tung Chee-hwa to arrange a meeting, but their requests have been rebuffed.

“When those bridges between the Hong Kong government and Beijing rejected all our demands, we think they are not doing their due responsibility, so we’ll go ourselves,” said Chung, a member of the Hong Kong Federation of Students.

Federation leader Alex Chow and two deputies, Chung and Nathan Law, are scheduled to depart the former British colony for the Chinese capital on a Cathay Pacific flight at 5pm on Saturday.

They had previously considered going to Beijing during a major summit of Pacific Rim leaders that ended Wednesday but decided against it.

The protesters have been occupying streets in three business and shopping districts to oppose Beijing’s decision that a panel screen candidates for the territory’s inaugural 2017 elections.

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Op woensdag 12 november 2014 07:35 schreef static het volgende:
Donderdag gaan ze los (althans, wat er nog van over is; het is allemaal niet zo indrukwekkend meer); er staan 7.000 politie-agenten klaar.

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Hong Kong protesters break into government building

quote:

A small group of Hong Kong pro-democracy protesters broke into the city’s legislature via a side door early on Wednesday, and police stopped others forcing their way in as tensions in the Chinese-controlled city escalated following a period of calm.

The flare-up came just hours after court bailiffs managed to clear part of a protest camp in the heart of the city that has been occupied by pro-democracy demonstrators for nearly two months, while leaving most of the main protest site intact.

About 100 riot police with helmets, batons and shields stood guard outside the government building in the early hours of Wednesday, facing off with protesters who are demanding free elections for the city’s next leader in 2017.

“Police retreat!” the protesters chanted.

It was the first time protesters had broken into a key public building, defying the expectations of many political analysts who had predicted that Hong Kong’s most tenacious and protracted protest movement would slowly wind down.

quote:

A democratic lawmaker at the scene, Fernando Cheung, said he and other protesters had tried to stop the small group of radical activists from breaking through.

“This is a very, very isolated incident. I think it’s very unfortunate and this is something we don’t want to see happen because the movement so far has been very peaceful,” he said.

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Betogers Hongkong bestormen parlementsgebouw

Betogers hebben woensdag het parlementsgebouw in Hongkong bestormd. Een groepje demonstranten wist via een zij-ingang binnen te komen.

In de twee maanden tijd dat in Hongkong wordt geprotesteerd, is het voor het eerst dat ze een belangrijk overheidsgebouw aanvallen.

Volgens getuigen probeerden de demonstranten ramen en deuren open te slaan. Het lukte overigens niet iedereen om binnen te komen, omdat de politie traangas inzette.

Vier mannen zijn aangehouden omdat ze spullen hadden vernield. Drie agenten raakten gewond door de confrontaties, zei de politie. Niet lang na de botsingen was de rust weer teruggekeerd.

Een deel van de plek waar betogers al maanden bivakkeren, werd dinsdag ontruimd. Een rechter had daartoe opdracht gegeven. De demonstranten willen meer democratie en vrije verkiezingen in 2017.

_{Door: ANP}

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Op vrijdag 14 november 2014 13:08 schreef ASSpirine het volgende:
En tijdens de weekends wakkert het iedere keer weer aan.

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Hong Kong protesters denied entry into mainland China

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A growing number of people in Hong Kong who have taken part in the city’s recent pro-democracy protests are suddenly finding themselves denied entry into China. The action has shocked many and sparked widespread belief that Chinese authorities have assembled a blacklist with hundreds, perhaps thousands, of names in recent months.

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Weer gevechten in straten Hongkong

Duizenden actievoerders hebben zaterdagochtend vroeg (plaatselijke tijd) in Hongkong slag geleverd met de politie. Ze trokken naar het district Mong Kok, naar plekken waar ze eerder waren weggejaagd.

Nadat de politie zich enkele uren vrij afzijdig had gehouden, begon oproerpolitie met charges tegen de actievoerders. Ze gebruikte daarbij wapenstokken en pepperspray en dwong tientallen demonstranten tegen de grond.

Actievoerders, die strijden voor democratische verkiezingen, bekogelden de politie met eieren en flessen water. Demonstranten trokken zich af en toe terug om zich te hergroeperen en nieuwe barricades op te werpen. Over arrestaties of gewonden is niets bekend.

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Op vrijdag 28 november 2014 23:07 schreef Papierversnipperaar het volgende:

[..]

quote:

Hong Kong: clashes escalate between pro-democracy protesters and police

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Thousands of pro-democracy protesters forced their way past police and poured on to a main road in Hong Kong late on Sunday night, escalating their direct action campaign.

But within hours, officers using dogs and wielding batons and an apparently powerful pepper-based spray had forced demonstrators out of the road tunnel they had barricaded, chasing them into a nearby park in chaotic scenes close to government offices and the main protest zone in Admiralty.

There were injuries on both sides and multiple arrests amid the clashes, with police and protesters seemingly braced for a long and unpredictable confrontation.

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Op maandag 1 december 2014 12:36 schreef static het volgende:
Off duty politie - niet in uniform - wordt nu ook aangevallen. Zag even een flits op het nieuws net, maar het lijkt erop dat de demonstranten zelfs zwaarden bij zich hebben.

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Hong Kong protest leader Joshua Wong goes on hunger strike

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Op maandag 1 december 2014 19:42 schreef Papierversnipperaar het volgende:

[..]

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Op maandag 1 december 2014 12:36 schreef static het volgende:
Off duty politie - niet in uniform - wordt nu ook aangevallen. Zag even een flits op het nieuws net, maar het lijkt erop dat de demonstranten zelfs zwaarden bij zich hebben.

quote:

Op dinsdag 2 december 2014 13:07 schreef ASSpirine het volgende:
en plots meer en meer geweld...

quote:

Confrontatie dreigt in Hongkong

Zeker 10.000 betogers zijn in het Chinese Hongkong bijeengekomen, net nu de politie een belangrijke protestlocatie gaat ontruimen.

Daarmee dreigt weer een confrontatie tussen de betogers en de autoriteiten in de stad.

De politie heeft aangekondigd om 02.00 uur in de nacht van woensdag op donderdag (Nederlandse tijd) de protestlocatie in de wijk Admiralty op te doeken.

Die locatie is een symbool voor de protestbeweging, die zich al tweeënhalve maand inzet voor meer democratie en vrije verkiezingen in 2017.

Studentenorganisaties riepen dan ook op om naar de locatie te komen, en dat doen veel mensen. Als ze daar nog zijn als de politie ingrijpt, kunnen ze opgepakt worden. Geweld is ook een optie; Carrie Lam, de op één na machtigste persoon in Hongkong, zei dat ''we niet kunnen garanderen dat er geen confrontaties zullen zijn''.

quote:

Last of Hong Kong protesters arrested amid police clearance

Politicians, pop singer and media tycoon among those held as pro-democracy campaigners removed from city centre

Hong Kong police have arrested legislators, student leaders, a pop singer and a media tycoon in a final push to remove the “umbrella movement” from the centre of the city after 10 weeks of pro-democracy protests.

The clearance of the main occupation zone in the Admiralty district closes a chapter for a movement that galvanised the region, drawing tens of thousands to the streets at its height. But even as police moved in on Thursday, the overall message was of peaceful defiance, with participants vowing “We will be back”, and pledging to develop new tactics.

Despite warnings from the city’s chief executive before the clearance operation that radicals could mount “furious resistance”, about 100 protesters waited patiently to be detained on charges of unlawful assembly. As police moved in, some chanted: “We want real universal suffrage.”

Groups of officers carried away several protesters by their arms and legs and there was applause for an older activist as he was pushed away in a wheelchair by police.

Others walked away under police escort. They included the veteran activist Martin Lee and pan-democrat lawmakers Emily Lau, Claudia Mo, Albert Ho, Alan Leung and Leung Kwok-hung, known as “Long Hair”.

Officers also arrested the singer Denise Ho and media mogul Jimmy Lai, with one of his photographers shouting: “Boss, your staff are to your right!” as Lai passed. Eason Chung, of the Hong Kong Federation of Students, was also detained.

After violent skirmishes in the earlier clearance of a secondary protest site at Mong Kok, both authorities and protesters had been braced for conflict. Previous clashes left protesters battered and bloodied as officers wielded batons and sprayed them with a powerful pepper solution. Police have said they used the minimum force necessary and that officers were also injured.

Law Yuk-kai, the head of Hong Kong Human Rights Monitor, said on Thursday: “Besides some minor points, the police have finally done an all right job. The pressure from the media, from the international community and from the UN has been useful. The clearance today will not deepen the wound that now separates police from society, which will still take decades to heal.”

Around 1,000 people had gathered at the site in the morning, but many left when officers announced that those remaining after 2pm would have their details taken before they could depart.

Several high-profile activists had been arrested earlier near their homes on charges of unlawful assembly and internet incitement, friends and local media reported. Wong Yeung-Tat, the leader of the Civic Passion group, reportedly faces more than 50 charges of unlawful assembly.

quote:

Leiders protest Hongkong moeten zich melden bij politie

De politie in de Chinese stad Hongkong is maandag begonnen met het oproepen en arresteren van meer dan dertig mensen die een sleutelrol speelden in de protesten van vorig jaar.

Volgens de South China Morning Post is er een lijst met daarop de namen van de mensen die zullen worden vervolgd.

Op die lijst staan belangrijke zakenlui, de drie oprichters van de protestbeweging en leiders van de Studentenfederatie in de miljoenenstad.

Ze worden verdacht van het starten, organiseren of faciliteren van onwettige samenscholing, laat een politiebron weten. Vorig jaar werd ruim 2,5 maand lang betoogd voor meer democratie in Hongkong.

''Ze worden gevraagd om zich te melden op het politiebureau en zo bij te dragen aan een gerechtelijk onderzoek. Als ze niet komen, zoeken we ze op en arresteren we ze'', aldus de bron.

quote:

Activisten Hongkong gaan weer de straat op

Activisten die meer democratie willen in Hongkong, zijn dit weekeinde weer de straat op gegaan. Het was de eerste grote actie in ruim een maand tijd.

Dat meldt de BBC.

De politie was in grote getalen aanwezig om te voorkomen dat de demonstranten weer de belangrijkste straten en pleinen van de stad zouden bezetten. Dit leidde in oktober en november tot enorme verkeersopstoppingen en chaos.

China deed eind vorig jaar de toezeggingen dat er in 2017 verkiezingen zullen worden gehouden in het semi-autonome gebiedsdeel. Maar de kandidaten moeten wel van tevoren worden goedgekeurd door Peking.

Gele paraplu

In Hongkong gingen zaterdag naar schatting zo’n drieduizend demonstranten de weg op. Veel demonstranten droegen weer gele paraplu’s, dat de afgelopen maanden het symbool is geworden van de protestacties.

Volgens de organisatoren van de acties hebben de protesten de afgelopen maanden de bevolking van Hong Kong wakker geschud en veel bewuster gemaakt van het gebrek aan democratie in de stad.

quote:

Hong Kong student leader Joshua Wong charged over protests | World news | The Guardian

Teenager says he is target of ‘political prosecution’ after charges filed that could result in sentence of up to five years

A Hong Kong student leader has said he is the target of a “political prosecution” after he was charged over protests that led to last year’s mass pro-democracy rallies.

Joshua Wong, 18, who became the face of the democracy movement, was already due in court on Friday on separate charges of obstructing police at an earlier demonstration.

The teenager and other activists have accused the authorities of a witch-hunt against those at the forefront of the so-called umbrella movement that brought parts of the city to a standstill for more than two months.

Protesters called for fully free elections of the city’s next leader, in the face of a Beijing-backed political reform package under which candidates would have been vetted by a loyalist committee.

That bill was vetoed in June in an unprecedented rebuke to Beijing, leaving the city politically polarised.

Wong was charged on Thursday with “unlawful assembly, and inciting others to take part in an unlawful assembly”. The charges, which could result in a sentence of up to five years, relate to a student protest on 26 September last year during which some climbed into a square that is part of the city’s government complex.

Wong and other activists were arrested, sparking wider demonstrations which exploded two days later when police fired teargas to disperse the crowds. Thousands more took to the streets in the wake of what they saw as heavy-handed policing.

“Today … is political prosecution,” said Wong before he entered a police station in the central neighbourhood of Wan Chai. “Being involved in the civic square action is the best mission I have made in the four years I’ve been involved in social student movements. I will not regret it … if I have to pay the price.”

Wong’s lawyer Michael Vidler confirmed later that the teen had been charged. “I think the whole rationale for proceeding at this stage, a year after the event, is totally flawed,” Vidler said. “In my view it’s a clear abuse of process.”

Another prominent student protester, Alex Chow, was charged with taking part in an unlawful assembly. Nathan Law, a student leader, was charged with inciting others to take part in an unlawful assembly. The three will have their charges heard at a magistrates court on 2 September.
Bron: www.theguardian.com

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Op vrijdag 28 augustus 2015 14:00 schreef Igen het volgende:

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Leuke framing toch altijd.

Toen Hong Kong nog van Engeland was, waren er nooit vrije verkiezingen voor deze positie. Na de overdracht van China is beloofd dat Hong Kong in dit opzicht op termijn democratischer zou worden, maar die hervorming is nu uitgesteld. Maar dit uitstel wordt dus in westerse media consequent gepresenteerd als een "Beijing-backed political reform package".

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Op vrijdag 28 augustus 2015 14:57 schreef icecreamfarmer_NL het volgende:

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Daar en tegen zijn Engelse politici meer te vertrouwen dan Chinese.

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Hong Kong 'umbrella movement' marks first anniversary and vows to fight on | World news | The Guardian

Pro-democracy activists say struggle is not over but there is little appetite for renewed occupations in the near future

Activists in Hong Kong have vowed to continue their fight for democracy, one year after clashes between police and student protesters sparked some of the largest demonstrations ever seen in the former British colony.

Hundreds of campaigners descended on Hong Kong’s government headquarters on Monday afternoon to remember the 79-day “umbrella movement” demonstrations that began on 28 September last year.

“I have a very simple message: we must continue the fight until we get democracy for Hong Kong,” Benny Tai, a university professor who helped launch the occupation, told the Guardian before addressing the crowd. “It is not over.”

Joshua Wong, a prominent student leader, vowed to stay on the frontline of his city’s battle for universal suffrage, and said his message for China’s president, Xi Jinping, was: “Give Hong Kong democracy and autonomy. It is the commitment … that China’s government made in 1984.”

At 5.58pm on Monday – the exact time last year that police fired a volley of teargas that is credited with kicking off the movement – protesters had planned to hold a moment of silence. Instead, there was chanting and shouts as police surrounded the protest site and demonstrators held up yellow umbrellas and banners reading: “I want genuine universal suffrage”.

“Hong Kong is not afraid of teargas,” they bellowed. “Hong Kong will never be the same again.”

Hundreds of police guarded the expressway running past Hong Kong’s government headquarters to prevent protesters from reoccupying an area they turned into a sprawling campsite for more than two months last year.

But activists said there was neither the energy nor the appetite for renewed occupations in the near future. “Right now people need to take a rest,” said a front-page editorial in the pro-democracy newspaper Apple Daily. “We will put away our umbrellas so that one day we can reopen them again.”

Chan Kin-man, a Hong Kong University academic who helped launch last year’s protests, said: “I don’t think in the short run there will be a large-scale occupation.”

He said students in the former colony were now split about “whether they should maintain non-violence, civil disobedience tactics or should move in another [direction]”.

Chan said: “They are very puzzled about whether they should use more radical means, including violence, to fight for democracy. Some even contemplate the independence of Hong Kong. There is lots of debate so it is not the time to have a large-scale mobilisation.”

Erica Yuen, the chair of Hong Kong’s pro-democracy People Power party, said there would be further protests if Beijing refused to offer concessions that gave citizens of its “special administrative region” a real say in the choice of their leader.

“I’m sure it is not over. Anyone who participated last year is ready to go again when the timing is right,” she said.

Yuen urged protesters to keep their faith in the fight for democracy and wait for Beijing to make a mistake. “[Then] they will collapse from the inside,” she said. “I’m still waiting for that day for the Communist party.”

Experts say it is too early to judge the impact of the umbrella movement – which was named after the way protesters defended themselves from teargas and pepper spray – on Hong Kong’s political landscape. The first real tests of whether the protests benefited the former colony’s pro-Beijing or pro-democracy politicians will come during district council elections in November and parliamentary elections next year.

Related: One year on, Hong Kong democracy activists ask what protest achieved

The demonstrations ultimately failed in their two main goals – forcing Hong Kong’s unpopular pro-Beijing leader CY Leung from office and achieving genuine universal suffrage. However, as they returned to the scene of last year’s occupation outside government headquarters in Admiralty on Monday, activists young and old vowed to fight on.

Leung Pik-Sheung, a 69-year-old grandmother who distributed food to the student protesters during last year’s occupation, said: “It was not a failure but there is a long way to go before we succeed. If we all work together there is a chance of success.”

Alex Chow, a student leader, said: “We have to go beyond elections and promote democracy in a broader sense. We have to think of new ideas to relaunch [our campaign] and set the political agenda.”

Chan, the university professor, urged students to look to the examples of Nelson Mandela and the Czech dissident and former president Václav Havel, who were both jailed because of their struggles. “Many, many societies spend tens of years fighting for democracy [before they] succeed,” Chan said.

In mainland China, where a political crackdown is under way and public dissent is outlawed, there was scant media coverage of the anniversary of the pro-democracy protests.

An editorial in a Communist party-controlled tabloid, the Global Times, compared umbrella movement protesters to “cult members”. It said the protesters claimed to be fighting for universal suffrage but were in fact “stupidly heading in the opposite direction of democracy”.

Lester Shum, a student leader, said it was pointless to debate whether the umbrella movement had been a success or a failure and said activists now needed to find different ways of pushing for democracy.

In time such pressure would pay off, Shum predicted. “From history we know that every authoritarian government is doomed to fail.”
Bron: www.theguardian.com

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Hong Kong activist hits out at Beijing in video over missing booksellers | World news | The Guardian

After fifth disappearance, umbrella movement’s Agnes Chow criticises China regime in video that has gone viral

A young pro-democracy activist in Hong Kong has released a video, which has gone viral, attacking Beijing’s campaign of “political suppression” following the disappearances of five booksellers.

Agnes Chow, a 19-year-old student who was a prominent figure during the former colony’s 2014 ”umbrella movement” protests, posted the five-minute video on Facebook on Saturday, three days after a bookshop owner, Lee Bo, became the latest member of Hong Kong’s publishing community to vanish.

By Monday lunchtime Chow’s video – titled “An urgent cry from Hong Kong” and filmed in English – had been viewed more than 820,000 times.

In her video message, Chow, a second-year student at Hong Kong’s Baptist University, hit out at Chinese authorities over the apparent abductions of five booksellers who specialised in tabloid-style tomes about the private lives of Communist party officials.

Related: Hong Kong politicians call for Beijing to answer over bookseller's 'abduction'

“I have an important message that I hope to spread to the world,” says Chow, who is also a prominent member of the student protest group Scholarism.

“Unlike mainland China, Hong Kong does not adopt authoritarian governance. Citizens who sell politically sensitive books are not supposed to be suppressed by any threats of disappearance and imprisonment, with the existence of freedom of press and speech.”

Chow recorded the video message after Lee, 65, went missing in Hong Kong last Wednesday.

One of the others who have gone missing, Gui Minhai, 51, was apparently abducted from his beachfront holiday home in Thailand. Supporters suspect Chinese security officials, possibly angered by the publishers’ books, have spirited them into custody in the mainland.

An editorial in the Communist party-controlled Global Times newspaper on Monday lashed out at the booksellers, who, it claimed, “relied on causing trouble in mainland China to survive”. It made no comment on the whereabouts of the missing publishers but said their books were filled with “vicious fabrication”.

Chow said the apparent abduction of Lee Bo called into question the “one country, two systems” formula that guarantees citizens of Hong Kong far greater freedoms than their counterparts in mainland China.

“In the past we were safe because we lived in Hong Kong instead of mainland China,” she said. “However, the circumstances have changed with the abduction.”

Speaking to the Guardian on Monday, Chow said she had made the English-language video in order to raise global awareness of the apparent abductions and what she said was Beijing’s increasing meddling in Hong Kong’s affairs.

“I am really surprised by the huge numbers of views,” she said. “I didn’t really expect so many people to watch my video but I think that it shows [how much] Hong Kong people [care] about this issue.”

Related: Gui Minhai: the strange disappearance of a publisher who riled China's elite

She added: “We feel like Hong Kong is becoming more dangerous – more and more dangerous – and [we feel] the erosion of the ‘one country, two systems’ [when] even something like cross-border abduction can happen in Hong Kong.

“Political suppression in Hong Kong didn’t start today but we feel like more and more political suppression will happen after this cross-border abduction.”

At the end of her video, Chow says the disappearance of the five Hong Kong booksellers reminded her of the words of Martin Niemöller, the German pastor who opposed the Nazis.

“First they came for the activists, and I did not speak out because I was not an activist,” Chow says. “Then they came for the journalists, and I did not speak out because I was not a journalist. Then they came for the bookseller, and I did not speak out because I was not a bookseller. Then they came for me and there was no one left to speak for me.”

Beijing has not commented so far about the missing publishers. But Hong Kong’s pro-Beijing chief executive, CY Leung, was forced to speak out against Lee Bo’s apparent abduction on Monday amid growing anger from pro-democracy groups.

Leung said it would be “unacceptable and unconstitutional” for mainland security officials to operate in Hong Kong, the South China Morning Post reported. “No other law enforcement agencies, outside of Hong Kong, has such authority,” he said.

Writing in the same newspaper, the columnist Alex Lo said answers were needed. “The midnight knock on the door is not something we have had to worry about in Hong Kong. But if we do now, that would be the end of our way of life,” he said.

Bron: www.theguardian.com

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Op maandag 4 januari 2016 18:51 schreef SeLang het volgende:

An Urgent Cry from Hong Kong

https://www.facebook.com/(...)76928537/?permPage=1

We moeten dit meisje steunen

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Op dinsdag 5 januari 2016 02:30 schreef Kenzi het volgende:

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Wat ze doen nu werkt compleet averechts. De vrouw van de bookseller heeft zelf aangegeven geen media attentie te willen omdat dan de kans veel groter is dat haar man nooit terug komt.
Nu dit incident gekaapt wordt door de actievoerders krijgt die bookseller waarschijnlijk een showproces en mag hij 10 jaar de cel in. Als het stil was gebleven was hij waarschijnlijk weer terug gestuurd.

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Op dinsdag 5 januari 2016 07:09 schreef Basp1 het volgende:

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Dus iedereen moet maar zijn hoofd in het zand steken en dan komt het goed, wat een fatalistische instelling. Verder lees ik nergens dat de 4 eerder verdwenen medewerkers al terug zijn waarom denk jij dat bij een mediastilte dit 5 verdwijningsgeval dan wel een kans zou hebben.

Ik ben benieuwd hoe de internationale gemeenschap zou reageren op een show proces zonder duidelijke aanklachten.

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Op dinsdag 5 januari 2016 07:12 schreef Igen het volgende:
Een showproces kan toch ook moeilijk, omdat ze (de mainland-justitie) dan openlijk zouden toegeven dat ze buiten hun jurisdictie illegaal mensen ontvoeren.

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Op dinsdag 5 januari 2016 08:07 schreef Igen het volgende:

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Wat averechts is, hangt natuurlijk ook van je doelstelling af. Als het doel is om die man vrij te krijgen heb je gelijk.

Maar hoe frame je dit verhaal? Is het een schending van "één land twee systemen"? Zo wordt het door die actievoerders gepresenteerd. Dan kan die boekverkoper geofferd worden voor het hogere doel, zeg maar.

Of is deze actie meer zoiets waar ook de Mossad volgens mij bekend om stond - waar ook ter wereld bedreigende elementen uitschakelen? Dat er ook iemand in Thailand ontvoerd zou zijn, spreekt hier wel een beetje voor.

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Op dinsdag 5 januari 2016 08:20 schreef Kenzi het volgende:

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Hopelijk komt die man gewoon vrij. Op dit moment is er gewoon nog te weinig bekend om directe conclusies te trekken maar de kans is groot dat hij over de grens is gesmokkeld omdat zijn permit nog thuis in HK ligt.
Dat zou een grove schending zijn van het systeem. Maar eerste prioriteit is in mijn ogen eerst die man thuis krijgen, daarna de politieke gevolgen. Nu wordt er door verschillende partijen er direct een politiek schouwspel van gemaakt wat niet in het belang is van die man.

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Op dinsdag 5 januari 2016 08:38 schreef Basp1 het volgende:

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Zo kun je ook beredeneren dat als je niets zou doen is het ook niet in het belang van die man want dan weet niemand ervan en hoeven de leiders op het vaste land zich helemaal nergens zorgen over te maken.