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pi_138637737
De gasprijs die Oekraine nu aangerekend wordt is blijkbaar nog een gevolg van de deal die Tymoshenko sloot (en waarvoor ze veroordeeld werd). Blijkbaar hoopte ze toen dat de korting die Oekraine tijdens het eerste jaar zou krijgen haar de verkiezingswinst zou opleveren.

http://deutsche-wirtschaf(...)skrieg-mit-russland/

Een bericht van Reuters in 2011:
quote:
[..]
Viktor Yushchenko, president at the time, had limited powers following constitutional reform which clipped his wings, and was on bad terms with the Russian leadership over his nationalist rhetoric and NATO membership aspirations.

So it was natural that Tymoshenko stepped in and started negotiations with Russian Prime Minister Vladimir Putin.

However, the resulting deal with Gazprom raised eyebrows both at home and abroad.

After refusing Gazprom's offer to buy gas at $250 per thousand cubic meters (tcm) as too expensive, Ukraine agreed to a price formula that used $450 per tcm as the basis for calculations, with adjustments for global oil product prices.

According to a June 2009 U.S. Department of State cable published by anti-secrecy group WikiLeaks, a World Bank official said in a conversation with a U.S. diplomat that "Russia had a great deal."

Ukraine's gas prices were 10 percent higher than Germany's, whereas Ukraine was getting half of what it should for transit, according to the leaked cable.

Another cable quoted Ukrainian magnate Dmytro Firtash as saying that Ukraine could have won the gas war simply by waiting out Russia since disruptions of European supplies would have destroyed Gazprom's reputation.

SHORT-TERM GAINS

But Tymoshenko's team touted immediate gains from the agreement such as averting a domestic energy crisis and securing an average gas price of about $230 for 2009 thanks to a special first-year discount.

The strategy appeared to be working for some time, as evidenced by yet another leaked U.S. diplomatic cable, this time from September 2009 when campaigning for the January-February 2010 presidential election was in full force.

"Tymoshenko appears to come out on top, for now, with this agreement," the cable said.

"... Russia's decision to let Ukraine purchase only what it needs in gas will ease Naftogaz's growing financial burden and could bolster Tymoshenko's presidential campaign by showing she was able to avoid conflict with Russia."

However, Tymoshenko's arch-rival Yanukovich beat her by a few percentage points in the election run-off and she had to quit the premiership shortly afterwards while state prosecutors started investigating, among other things, the "gas affair."

Making matters worse, the gas price defined by the 2009 formula has since sky-rocketed and is expected to reach about $400 per tcm in the fourth quarter of this year -- taking into account a $100 discount brokered by the new government.

Attempts by Yanukovich's cabinet to renegotiate the 2009 deal have so far been unsuccessful and Moscow warned Kiev on Tuesday against trying to use Tymoshenko's trial as leverage.

"The gas agreements in question were drawn up in strict compliance with the laws of Russia and Ukraine and the applicable norms of international law," the Russian Foreign Ministry said in a statement.

It is not yet clear whether Tymoshenko will indeed serve a seven-year prison term as Yanukovich, pressured by the West, hinted Tuesday that criminal laws may be tweaked by the time an appeals court decides on her case.

But there is little doubt the current government will continue to blame her for rising gas prices, especially if it follows advice from the International Monetary Fund and passes the price hikes onto households.
[..]
http://www.reuters.com/ar(...)dUSTRE79A4AV20111011

De wikileaks cable over Dmytro Firtash, de man die nu door de VS aangeklaagd wordt wegens het omkopen van een Indiaas politicus, en waarvan Washington wil dat hij z'n zakenbelangen in Ukraine (waar hij 100.000 mensen tewerkstelt) opgeeft...:
http://www.wikileaks.org/plusd/cables/08KYIV2414_a.html
pi_138639109
quote:
0s.gif Op maandag 7 april 2014 23:05 schreef meth1745 het volgende:

[..]

Bloomberg TV, CNN International en BBC World zitten op de kabel in Moskou. En wie RFE/RL wil horen en geen internet of satellietschotel heeft kan nog steeds op de korte golf luisteren. BBC Russian Service heeft zelf z'n radiouitzendingen op MW en SW stopgezet in 2011 en is nu enkel op internet te vinden.
oohh ik zal het zelf wel een keer uitpluizen.
Exponentile deflatie van Bitcoin maakt arme mensen nog veel sneller armer dan het grote probleem van inflatie. Gematigde burning van Ethereum is de gulden middenweg.
pi_138639372
quote:
0s.gif Op dinsdag 8 april 2014 00:55 schreef meth1745 het volgende:
De gasprijs die Oekraine nu aangerekend wordt is blijkbaar nog een gevolg van de deal die Tymoshenko sloot (en waarvoor ze veroordeeld werd). Blijkbaar hoopte ze toen dat de korting die Oekraine tijdens het eerste jaar zou krijgen haar de verkiezingswinst zou opleveren.

http://deutsche-wirtschaf(...)skrieg-mit-russland/

Een bericht van Reuters in 2011:

[..]

http://www.reuters.com/ar(...)dUSTRE79A4AV20111011

De wikileaks cable over Dmytro Firtash, de man die nu door de VS aangeklaagd wordt wegens het omkopen van een Indiaas politicus, en waarvan Washington wil dat hij z'n zakenbelangen in Ukraine (waar hij 100.000 mensen tewerkstelt) opgeeft...:
http://www.wikileaks.org/plusd/cables/08KYIV2414_a.html
Als je wist hoe de wet in elkaar zit, dan wist je ook dat contracten ongeldig worden verklaard als ze illegaal tot stand zijn gekomen. Dit is zo'n geval, dus je kunt de verantwoordelijkheid niet weg schuiven van rusland.
Exponentile deflatie van Bitcoin maakt arme mensen nog veel sneller armer dan het grote probleem van inflatie. Gematigde burning van Ethereum is de gulden middenweg.
pi_138641791
quote:
1s.gif Op dinsdag 8 april 2014 07:57 schreef firefly3 het volgende:

[..]

Als je wist hoe de wet in elkaar zit, dan wist je ook dat contracten ongeldig worden verklaard als ze illegaal tot stand zijn gekomen. Dit is zo'n geval, dus je kunt de verantwoordelijkheid niet weg schuiven van rusland.
Zeg je nu dat Tymoshenko schuldig is, dat het geen politiek gemotiveerde veroordeling was? :o
pi_138643094
quote:
Wste Massenschlgerei im Parlament: In Kiew liegen die Nerven blank

10.38 Uhr: Wste Schlgerei im ukrainischen Parlament in Kiew: Eine Sitzung musste fr zehn Minuten unterbrochen werden, weil zwei Mitglieder der rechten Partei „Swoboda“ auf den Chef der kommunistischen Partei, Petro Simonenko, losgingen. Das meldet die ukrainische Agentur Ukrinform. Simonenko hielt offenbar gerade eine Rede, als die „Swoboda“-Abgeordneten auf Simonenko losstrmten und auf ihn einschlugen. Darauf kam es den Agentur-Angaben zufolge zu einer Massenschlgerei mit Abgeordneten „verschiedener Fraktionen“, die ebenfalls die Tribne strmten. Simonenko hatte dem Bericht zufolge ber die Lage in der Ostukraine gesprochen.

Igor Miroshnichenko, lid van de parlementaire commissie die moet toezien op de vrijheid van meningsuiting, die eerder het hoofd van de staatstelevisie aanviel en tot ontslag dwong, hoorde blijkbaar iets dat hem niet beviel...

http://www.focus.de/polit(...)aine_id_3749194.html

[ Bericht 7% gewijzigd door meth1745 op 08-04-2014 13:31:54 ]
pi_138643147
quote:
0s.gif Op dinsdag 8 april 2014 10:16 schreef meth1745 het volgende:

[..]

Zeg je nu dat Tymoshenko schuldig is, dat het geen politiek gemotiveerde veroordeling was? :o
Ik zeg dat rusland al jaren misbruik maakt van zijn gas monopolie en zich niet verantwoordelijk gedraagt en gedragen heeft mbt gas.
Exponentile deflatie van Bitcoin maakt arme mensen nog veel sneller armer dan het grote probleem van inflatie. Gematigde burning van Ethereum is de gulden middenweg.
pi_138643150
quote:
Russia will never let NGO be used for destructive purposes the way it happened in Ukraine

Russian President Vladimir Putin has said that the countrys authorities will prevent non-governmental organizations operating in its territory from being used for destructive purposes, the way it happened in Ukraine.

I would like to emphasize one fundamental idea: one should clearly distinguish between legal opposition activities, which exist in any democratic state, and extremism, which relies on hatred and fanning of inter-ethnic and social discord and on the denial of law and the Constitution, Putin said at a board meeting of the Federal Security Service (FSB) on Monday.

Putin called for a clear distinction between civilised criticism of the authorities and the servicing of other countries national interests to the detriment of ones country.

Putin said that modern Russian legislation creates every conditions for the transparent, free activity of non-governmental and public organizations.

But we shall never let them be used for destructive purposes, Putin said. This is precisely what happened in Ukraine, where non-governmental organizations were used as a channel to fund nationalist and neo-Nazi structures and militants who have become the main striking force of a government coup, Putin said.
http://en.itar-tass.com/russia/726773

[ Bericht 99% gewijzigd door meth1745 op 08-04-2014 12:32:15 ]
pi_138647939
quote:
Je blijft achter elkaar door gaan met Russische propaganda spam. Dingen die rusland verkeerd doet negeer je of nuanceer je dood. Dingen zoals "neo nazis" haal je weer uit zijn verband.
Exponentile deflatie van Bitcoin maakt arme mensen nog veel sneller armer dan het grote probleem van inflatie. Gematigde burning van Ethereum is de gulden middenweg.
  dinsdag 8 april 2014 @ 13:47:05 #260
192592 SureD1
------------------------------
pi_138648450
quote:
1s.gif Op dinsdag 8 april 2014 13:35 schreef firefly3 het volgende:

[..]

Je blijft achter elkaar door gaan met Russische propaganda spam. Dingen die rusland verkeerd doet negeer je of nuanceer je dood. Dingen zoals "neo nazis" haal je weer uit zijn verband.
Dat heet cherrypicking...net ff anders dan whataboutism, maar ook niet helemaal zuiver.
pi_138649392
oysteinbogen twitterde op dinsdag 08-04-2014 om 14:10:38 Here we go again...Russian senator says #Putin is free to do what he wants with army in #Ukraine. http://t.co/0JJObEnlpu reageer retweet
pi_138653189
quote:
1s.gif Op dinsdag 8 april 2014 13:35 schreef firefly3 het volgende:

[..]

Je blijft achter elkaar door gaan met Russische propaganda spam. Dingen die rusland verkeerd doet negeer je of nuanceer je dood. Dingen zoals "neo nazis" haal je weer uit zijn verband.
Oh dear, ik heb de uitspraken van Putin gepost, ipv te wachten op de veroordeling ervan door het witte huis of de EU. Hoe moeten de fokkertjes nu hun eigen mening erover bepalen?

Nee, geef ons dan maar twitter, jouw opinie, in n zin, zonder dat je je arme hersenen moet belasten met de feiten. Who cares wat Ozerov precies heeft gezegd, als een tweet het voor ons samenvat als "Putin mag met z'n leger doen wat ie wil in Ukraine".

En Russische propaganda spammen? Nee, dat zou er eerder zo uitzien:
quote:
It's not Russia that is destabilising Ukraine

The west has been needlessly whipping up tension – if we don't co-operate soon, chaos may take hold

The profound and pervasive crisis in Ukraine is a matter of grave concern for Russia. We understand perfectly well the position of a country which became independent just over 20 years ago and still faces complex tasks in constructing a sovereign state. Among them is the search for a balance of interests among its various regions, the peoples of which have different historical and cultural roots, speak different languages and have different perspectives on their past and present, and their country's future place in the world.

Given these circumstances, the role of external forces should have been to help Ukrainians protect the foundations of civil peace and sustainable development, which are still fragile. Russia has done more than any other country to support the independent Ukrainian state, including for many years subsidising its economy through low energy prices. Last November, at the outset of the current crisis, we supported Kiev's wish for urgent consultations between Ukraine, Russia and the EU to discuss harmonising the integration process. Brussels flatly rejected it. This stand reflected the unproductive and dangerous line the EU and US have been taking for a long time. They have been trying to compel Ukraine to make a painful choice between east and west, further aggravating internal differences.

Ukraine's realities notwithstanding, massive support was provided to political movements promoting western influence, and it was done in direct breach of the Ukrainian constitution. This is what happened in 2004, when President Viktor Yushchenko won an unconstitutional third round of elections introduced under EU pressure. This time round, power in Kiev was seized undemocratically, through violent street protests conducted with the direct participation of ministers and other officials from the US and EU countries.
http://www.theguardian.co(...)abilise-ukraine-west

quote:
Why Ukraine needs a new constitution fair to all

The situation in Ukraine is nothing short of a deep social and political crisis. With the rights of national minorities violated and the interests of regions disregarded, Crimeans found it necessary to quickly determine their own political future.

We have to respect their right to self-determination, a right guaranteed by the UN Charter.

There is currently no fully legitimate executive authority in Ukraine. The acting government was formed by the parliament under intimidation – and even direct use of force – against MPs by extremists. Local governments all over Ukraine are taking the situation into their own hands. With a real risk of civil war and social disintegration, there is still a chance to save Ukraine from political, social, and not least economic collapse.

[..]
quote:
Protest Movement in Eastern Ukraine: Security Forces Integrated by Foreign Mercenaries Hired by Private U.S. Military Outfit

Ukrainian authorities plan to attract US private military company Greystone Limited to suppress protest moods of the mostly Russian-speaking population in the east of the country.

According to Ukrainian Security Service, mercenaries will be engaged in political search and protection of state security over inability of Ukrainian law enforcement agencies to curb on leaders and activists of pro-Russian movement independently.

This initiative was put forward by oligarchs Ihor Kolomoyskyi, a co-owner of Ukraine’s PrivatBank, and Serhiy Taruta, head of the industrial union of Donbass, a coal basin in eastern Ukraine, as these business tycoons were appointed as governors in central Ukraine’s Dnepropetrovsk region and eastern Ukraine’s Donetsk region, respectively. A source in the Ukrainian Security Service which participated in a recent special meeting chaired by the parliament-appointed interim President Oleksandr Turchynov reported about this fact.

Private military company Greystone Limited was established 47 years ago and has British roots, as veterans of British commandoes SAS registered a basic organization of mercenaries in 1967.

The company was called WatchGuard International and drew attention to itself after an abortive first large-scale operation — an attempt on the life of Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi in 1971. Then the organization has undertaken the second operation already with retired US commandoes Navy SEALs during the US war in Iraq in 2003-2011, when major corporations used actively Greystone services. Now Greystone Limited is one of branches of a big mercenary empire in the United States which changes its names constantly, as this was Blackwater until 2009, then Xe Services and Academi and now US Training Center.

Murders, shootings of demonstrations, arms smuggling entailed ill fame through all flashpoints in the Middle East, Asia and Africa. Now Ukraine is next in line. But today there is no exact information about the volume of the market of private military services, as it is estimated only approximately at $200 billion annually.

US high-ranking officials have always occupied key posts in the empire of soldiers of fortune — from the US State Department Bureau of Counterterrorism, the Central Intelligence Agency’s Counterterrorism Center and US intelligence services.
http://www.globalresearch(...)-mercenaries/5377018

quote:
Europe Does About Face on Ukraine Crisis

Brussels, Apr 7 (Prensa Latina) After granting moral and physical support to violent protests for anti-constitutional change in Kiev, Europe is now demanding that political differences in other Ukrainian regions be resolved peacefully and democratically.
European Union officials were outspoken during the demonstrations against legitimate Ukrainian president, Viktor Yanukovich, forcefully ousted on February 22 after ultra-nationalists had taken power.

The EU immediately supported a government approved by a new legislative majority, created under a Rada (Unicameral Parliament) in the custody of neo-fascist forces and in violation of an agreement signed with three European ministers as guarantors.

However, the European Commission (EC) expressed concern today over events in East Ukraine, specifically in Donetsk, Jarkov and Lugan, where administrative headquarters were besieged by elements opposed to the interim government in Kiev.

Donetsk parliamentarians endorsed a declaration of independence for that coal-producing Ukrainian area and called for a referendum on sovereignty to be held by next May.

But EC spokesman Maja Kocijanic, insisted on first holding presidential elections on May 25, in an effort to achieve political aims through democratic methods.

The setting of such a date for presidential elections violates the agreement signed last February 21 by Yanukovich with the ultra-rightwing opposition that a few hours later attacked the government, the presidency and Rada with support from paramilitary forces.

The media here are highlighting that demonstrations in Donetsk, Lugan and Jarkov are in opposition to the draconian program of social cuts to be implemented by the Yatseniuk team wielding power in Kiev.
http://www.plenglish.com/(...)&id=2554941&Itemid=1
pi_138653525
fatimatlis twitterde op dinsdag 08-04-2014 om 15:56:58 #Putin to hold an "emergency" government meeting "due to the extreme situation in #Ukraine", reports @EchoMskNews: http://t.co/966rw4agJR” reageer retweet
  dinsdag 8 april 2014 @ 16:41:14 #264
312994 deelnemer
ff meedenken
pi_138655174
quote:
0s.gif Op dinsdag 8 april 2014 00:55 schreef meth1745 het volgende:
De gasprijs die Oekraine nu aangerekend wordt is blijkbaar nog een gevolg van de deal die Tymoshenko sloot (en waarvoor ze veroordeeld werd). Blijkbaar hoopte ze toen dat de korting die Oekraine tijdens het eerste jaar zou krijgen haar de verkiezingswinst zou opleveren.

http://deutsche-wirtschaf(...)skrieg-mit-russland/

Een bericht van Reuters in 2011:
Iedere betrokkene bij zo'n deal laat blijken een dwaas of een misbruiker te zijn. Geeft weer alle aanleiding om de bestuurselite te wantrouwen. Zelfs de vraag of ze de lagere school eerlijk hebben doorlopen is twijfelachtig.

[ Bericht 1% gewijzigd door deelnemer op 08-04-2014 17:03:18 ]
The view from nowhere.
pi_138656844
StefanoSerafi11 twitterde op dinsdag 08-04-2014 om 17:11:42 @ChernobayMariy reports 18 tanks entering #Lugansk, whilst separatism demonstration runs in the city centre. #Ukraine reageer retweet
EuromaidanPR twitterde op dinsdag 08-04-2014 om 17:25:05 BREAKING #Russian agents in #Lugansk mined SBU building & keep 60 hostages inside http://t.co/9hn1e9Bn8m | PR News http://t.co/pKeZjRXXUH reageer retweet
pi_138657414
quote:
1s.gif Op dinsdag 8 april 2014 13:47 schreef SureD1 het volgende:

[..]

Dat heet cherrypicking...net ff anders dan whataboutism, maar ook niet helemaal zuiver.
Haha bedankt voor de info :)
Exponentile deflatie van Bitcoin maakt arme mensen nog veel sneller armer dan het grote probleem van inflatie. Gematigde burning van Ethereum is de gulden middenweg.
pi_138657450
quote:
Ukraine's security service: Separatists have placed explosives in seized building in Luhansk, are holding around 60 people against their will - @Reuters
pi_138657514
quote:
0s.gif Op dinsdag 8 april 2014 15:51 schreef meth1745 het volgende:

[..]

Oh dear, ik heb de uitspraken van Putin gepost, ipv te wachten op de veroordeling ervan door het witte huis of de EU. Hoe moeten de fokkertjes nu hun eigen mening erover bepalen?

Nee, geef ons dan maar twitter, jouw opinie, in n zin, zonder dat je je arme hersenen moet belasten met de feiten. Who cares wat Ozerov precies heeft gezegd, als een tweet het voor ons samenvat als "Putin mag met z'n leger doen wat ie wil in Ukraine".

En Russische propaganda spammen? Nee, dat zou er eerder zo uitzien:

[..]

http://www.theguardian.co(...)abilise-ukraine-west

[..]


[..]

http://www.globalresearch(...)-mercenaries/5377018

[..]

http://www.plenglish.com/(...)&id=2554941&Itemid=1
Krijg je betaald ofzo om de boel met russische propaganda onder te spammen?
Exponentile deflatie van Bitcoin maakt arme mensen nog veel sneller armer dan het grote probleem van inflatie. Gematigde burning van Ethereum is de gulden middenweg.
pi_138657854
quote:
1s.gif Op dinsdag 8 april 2014 17:44 schreef firefly3 het volgende:

[..]

Krijg je betaald ofzo om de boel met russische propaganda onder te spammen?
Oh, je leert snel bij, een ad hominem in de vorm van Brunnenvergiftung
pi_138658022
quote:
13s.gif Op dinsdag 8 april 2014 17:54 schreef meth1745 het volgende:

[..]

Oh, je leert snel bij, een ad hominem in de vorm van Brunnenvergiftung
Wat is je doel dan?
Exponentile deflatie van Bitcoin maakt arme mensen nog veel sneller armer dan het grote probleem van inflatie. Gematigde burning van Ethereum is de gulden middenweg.
  dinsdag 8 april 2014 @ 18:12:55 #271
358102 Senor__Chang
Consider yourself changed.
pi_138658462
Is Kharkov (of was het Donetsk?) weer in handen van de regering?
Guilty as changed.
The Best of Seor Chang --- Part II
pi_138658588
quote:
0s.gif Op dinsdag 8 april 2014 11:06 schreef meth1745 het volgende:

[..]

[ afbeelding ]
Igor Miroshnichenko, lid van de parlementaire commissie die moet toezien op de vrijheid van meningsuiting, die eerder het hoofd van de staatstelevisie aanviel en tot ontslag dwong, hoorde blijkbaar iets dat hem niet beviel...

http://www.focus.de/polit(...)aine_id_3749194.html


Europese en Amerikaanse democratie _O_
Op woensdag 9 november 2016 06:02 schreef Anonymousz het volgende:
#superniger2020
  dinsdag 8 april 2014 @ 18:16:39 #273
343860 UpsideDown
Baas Boven Baas
pi_138658604
quote:
0s.gif Op dinsdag 8 april 2014 18:12 schreef Senor__Chang het volgende:
Is Kharkov (of was het Donetsk?) weer in handen van de regering?
In Charkov is een ontruiming geweest van het regeringsgebouw geloof ik, dus lijkt me wel.
Say what?
pi_138659227
real_breaking twitterde op dinsdag 08-04-2014 om 18:35:31 #UKRAINE TANKS HEADING TOWARDS CITY OF #Lugansk LIFE NEWS SAYS via @L0gg0l reageer retweet
pi_138660564
MarquardtA twitterde op dinsdag 08-04-2014 om 18:53:32 Lugansk police spokeswoman tells @ABC not a hostage situation, 200 well-armed pro-#Russia activists refusing to leave. Talks underway. reageer retweet
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