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Other accounts of aliens and alien spacecraft recoveries
Numerous other people say they heard reports of recovered aliens and/or an alien craft from others. In some cases, several people heard similar alien stories from the same person. Numerous others claimed to have seen, handled or been told about crash material with strange physical properties.[29]
Barney Barnett story. Accounts of an alien recovery at Roswell first publicly emerged in "The Roswell Incident", by Charles Berlitz and William Moore, published in 1980. An incident recounted by soil engineer Barney Barnett to various people was mentioned, where Barnett said that he and a team of archaeologists stumbled across a flying saucer crash with four aliens on the Plains of San Augustin, near Socorro, New Mexico in July 1947. The military arrived almost simultaneously and led them away.[30]
Dr. Charles Bertrand Schultz, a vertebrate paleontologist from the University of Nebraska. Schultz told a similar crash story, but closer to Roswell. Schultz said he had been in Roswell at the time, and while driving out north of town along Highway 285, had seen a military cordon blocking access west of the highway. Later he met with archeologist Dr. William Curry Holden of Texas Tech, who told him he and his archeological team had been at a crash site north of Roswell and west of the highway and had come across a strange craft with alien bodies. They contacted the military, which took them away when they arrived.[31]
Retired Air Force Brig. Gen. Arthur E. Exon, a former commanding officer at Wright-Patterson AFB, has been identified as the highest-ranking military figure to suggest that an alien spacecraft and bodies could have been recovered at Roswell in 1947. He cautioned that though his information was second-hand, it came from men directly involved whom he knew personally and trusted. Exon said he was told about anomalous debris analysis at Wright-Patterson. "A couple of guys thought it might be Russian, but the overall consensus was that the pieces were from space. ...Roswell was the recovery of a craft from space." He said he was also told about bodies being recovered from a nearby related crash site. He flew over the area a few months later and saw at least two impact regions. He said the whole matter was covered up at the highest levels of government.[32]
Chester Lytle, an engineer who designed and manufactured the implosion detonator for the first A-bomb and subsequently held top-secret clearances with the Atomic Energy Commission and other government agencies, related in 1998 that former Roswell base commander Gen. William Blanchard, a personal friend, told him in 1953 that Roswell was the crash of an alien spacecraft and four humanoid bodies had been recovered. From another high Air Force source, Lytle said he learned some of the bodies had gone originally to Muroc Army Air Field, but all eventually wound up at Wright-Patterson AFB in a highly secure facility. Lytle related he also learned some details about the autopsies carried out on the bodies.[33]
Retired Air Force Lt. Colonel Raymond Madson was the Project Officer for the Air Force's "crash test dummy" program from 1956 to 1960 at Holloman Air Force Base. The program was used by the Air Force to debunk stories of Roswell alien bodies in their 1997 "Case Closed" report, citing Madson as a key witness. However, Madson, in a recent interview, says the crash dummy explanation was nonsense, part of a coverup, and his personal views on the Roswell case were completely misrepresented by the Air Force. Madson instead believes that an extraterrestrial crash actually happened and that the alien bodies were stored for a period of time at Wright-Patterson AFB. This was based on his service in the early 1950s at Wright-Patterson and speaking to "others who would have been positioned to know" that there was a "very secure facility" at the base where the recovered bodies were stored. His wife was also employed at the base in the early 1950s in the medical laboratory. Madson said she was told by coworkers about child-sized beings "from another world" who had crashed to Earth sometime prior to her employment and brought to the base to be studied.[34]
June Crain was employed at Wright-Patterson from 1942 to 1952 with a top-secret clearance. In a 1997 interview with Jim Clarkson, shortly before her death, she spoke of learning from coworkers about the 1947 Roswell alien spacecraft crash and two later New Mexico alien spacecraft crashes from 1948 and 1951 or 1952 and recovery of bodies taken to Wright-Patterson. The bodies were taken to the Aeromedical Lab for study. She also said she personally handled an extremely strong thin metal material with memory properties similar to that described by a number of Roswell witnesses and described to her as being from one of the recent crashes.[35]
CIC agent Lewis Rickett said he accompanied Sheridan Cavitt to the ranch, witnessed high security and a large military debris recovery, handled strange metal debris, and saw a gouge in the ground. In September 1947, Rickett said he and Cavitt assisted astronomer Dr. Lincoln La Paz try to determine the speed and trajectory of the device that crashed on the Brazel ranch. “According to Rickett, La Paz formed the opinion that [the object] was a probe from another planet.” Rickett said they found a touchdown point five miles (8 km) from the debris field where the sand had crystallized, possibly from the heat.[36] Shortly before he died, it is also claimed he confirmed that the object’s shape was long, thin with a 'bat-like' wing."[37]
Colonel Edwin Easley, Roswell base Provost Marshal in charge of the Military Police. When asked what happened, he said he had sworn a security oath and couldn’t talk about it. However, when asked if the extraterrestrials theories was the right path to follow, Easley replied, “Let’s put it this way. That’s not the wrong path.” Easley also admitted they held rancher Mack Brazel at the base under armed guard for several days.[38] It is also claimed that Easley’s doctor, Harold Granik, and a granddaughter, reported that Easley spoke about the “creatures” at Roswell on his deathbed.[39]
Lydia Sleppy was a Teletype operator working at an Albuquerque radio station in 1947. She said they received a telephone call from John McBoyle of KSWS Radio in Roswell. In her affidavit she recalled McBoyle saying, "There's been one of those flying saucer things crash down here north of Roswell." He'd met Brazel in a coffee shop. Brazel said he'd discovered the object and "had towed it underneath a shelter on his property. Brazel offered to take McBoyle to the ranch to see the object. McBoyle described it as a 'big crumpled dishpan.'" She added the FBI then interrupted the teletype as she tried to send it and ordered that they cease transmission. She said her boss, Karl Lambertz, spoke to McBoyle the next day. "He told Mr. Lambertz the military had isolated the area where the saucer was found and was keeping the press out. He saw planes come in from Wright Field, Ohio, to take the thing away." [40] The station owner, Merle Tucker, confirmed hearing the story at the time. In an interview shortly before his death, McBoyle confirmed seeing an object that looked like “a crushed dishpan,” about 25–30 feet long, impacted in a slope.[41]
Bill Brazel Jr. reported that his father towed a large object off the field and stored it in a livestock shed. Marcel in one early interview likewise recounted Brazel showing them the largest piece he had found, about 10 feet (3.0 m) in diameter, which he had dragged from the field.[42]
Frank Joyce, Roswell radio KGFL news announcer, said he spoke to Brazel when he first reported the incident to Sheriff Wilcox. In earlier interviews, Joyce wouldn't discuss the details of what Brazel told him, saying only that he didn't believe the story, but suggested he report the incident to the base. After Brazel gave his press interview, he called Joyce again and said, "We haven't got the story right." Brazel went to the radio station and told Joyce a balloon story. Joyce responded, "Look, this is completely different than what you told me on the phone the other day about the little green men. Joyce said Brazel responded to the effect, "No they weren't green. Our lives will never be the same again." [43] However, he initially was quoted by Roswell researcher William Moore as saying that he had this conversation with his dying boss Walt Whitmore Sr. Joyce later objected that he had been misquoted; the conversation was with Brazel. Moore was provided corrections by Joyce and changed the attribution to Brazel.[44] In more recent interviews, as first reported by Tom Carey and Don Schmitt in 1998, Joyce has explained this cryptic conversation by saying Brazel first mentioned small, nonhuman beings when he first spoke to him. Initially Brazel was highly stressed over the large quantities of debris that needed to be cleaned up. "Who's gonna clean all that shit up?" Then Joyce said Brazel really began "losing it," talking about the "horrible stench" from the dead "little people" he had found at another location. Joyce suggested maybe he had found monkeys from a military experiment. "They're not monkeys, and they're not human!" Joyce then went on to explain that his "little green men comment [referred] back to our original phone conversation." [45]
According to Brazel’s neighbor Loretta Proctor, her 7-year old son Timothy or "Dee" was with Brazel when he first discovered the debris field. But he was also with Brazel when he discovered something else at another site 2-1/2 miles to the east that left him deeply traumatized for the rest of his life. He never told her exactly what he saw there but did take her to the location in 1994 saying, "Here is where Mack found something else." Dee Proctor would also duck all attempts at interview and died in 2006. However, other rancher children are believed to have visited the site, including Sydney "Jack" Wright, who said that two sons of rancher Thomas Edington and one of rancher Truman Pierce’s daughters got to "the other location." Wright in 1998 would state, "There were bodies, small bodies with big heads and eyes. And Mack was there too. We couldn’t get away from there fast enough." [46]
Private First Class Ed Sain was an MP in the 390th Air Service Squadron. On the evening of July 7, he and Cpl. Raymond Van Why were told to report to the ambulance pool outside the base hospital and boarded a military ambulance. It was driven north of town and then west into the desert. When they got there at night somewhere in the desert, there were a few tents and a number of floodlights. They were told to guard the entrance to the site from a tent set up for that purpose and to “Shoot anyone that tries to get in.” They were returned to the base at daybreak. His son Steven said his father was still reluctant to talk about it, being under a security oath and fearing for his life. According to Steven Sain, his father told both him and his brother that his job was to "guard the bodies at the crash site," which he said "were kept in one of the other tents until being transported to the base." He also thought his father had seen the craft, because he said "it was the strangest thing he had ever seen in his life." Raymond Van Why’s wife, Leola, said her husband first talked about it in 1954 when he got out of the service. He told her that he had been a guard at a crash site "out in the desert" where a spaceship had crashed. "My husband told me that it was a UFO that had crashed, that it was a round disc. ..he was out there and saw it!" [47]
Sgt. LeRoy Wallace was another MP in the 390th Air Service Squadron. According to his widow, he was called away one evening to go to a crash site outside of Corona "to help load the bodies." When he returned home the next morning, the first thing she noticed was the horrible stench on his clothes, which she burned. The horrible smell lingered on his body for another two weeks despite repeated bathing.[48]
Beverly Bean, daughter of Sgt. Melvin Brown, said her father also helped guard the crash site where alien bodies were recovered. She claimed her father told her he saw two or three alien bodies packed in ice as they drove back to the base in a truck. "He said they were smaller than a normal man--about four feet--and had much larger heads than us, with slanted eyes, and that the bodies looked yellowish, a bit Asian-looking." That night, he stood guard outside a hangar where either debris or bodies awaited shipment to Texas.[49]
Sgt. Homer G. Rowlette, Jr. was with the 603rd Air Engineering Squadron at Roswell. According to his son Larry and daughter Carlene Green, he told them about the "crash of a flying saucer" on his deathbed in March 1988. Larry Rowlette said his father was part of the cleanup detail sent to the impact site north of Roswell. There were also two other sites near Corona, N.M. He had handled the "memory material" which he described as "thin foil that kept its shape." He saw the actual ship that was "somewhat circular." Finally, he said he had seen "three little people. They had large heads and at least one was alive." Carlene Green said her father, still lucid, told her, "I was at Roswell when they recovered the spaceship in 1947. I was involved. I saw it. It’s all true." [50]
Private First Class Rolland Menagh was another MP in the 390th Air Service Squadron. He later became a security specialist for the Air Force Office of Special Investigations. According to sons Michael and Rolland Jr., their father first spoke about his involvement in the 1960s. Rolland Jr. recalled, "He was an MP who guarded the UFO crash site north of Roswell. He saw the ship, which he described as being round or egg-shaped and seamless." Rolland Jr. didn’t remember his father talking about bodies, but Michael recalled he mentioned three bodies. He added, "He said the spaceship was loaded onto an 18-wheeler with a tarp covering it and then driven right through the center of town down to the air base. My father said he accompanied it in a Jeep all the way from the crash site to the hangar where it was deposited." [51]
A number of other witnesses have been found to a flatbed, 18-wheeler truck with an oval or egg-shaped tarped object being driven through the center of Roswell toward the base on the afternoon of July 8, accompanied by an escort of armed MPs in Jeeps, some with machine guns. One, Richard Talbert, said he saw what was under the tarp when it momentarily lifted up. It was "silver, oval-shaped... approximately 4 to 5 feet (1.5 m) wide by about 12 feet (3.7 m) long and 5 to 7 feet (2.1 m) high. It had a dome on it, but it was damaged because it was cut off at one end." Other eyewitnesses were Paul McFerrin, Bob Rich and Jobie MacPherson. At the base, Sgt. Earl Fulford said he saw the truck and covered object, about the size and shape of a Volkswagen Beetle, being driven to Hangar 84 around 4:00 p.m. by a close friend of his.[52]
Frankie Rowe, was the daughter of Roswell fireman Dan Dwyer. Her father told the family of being on a run outside of Roswell to what they thought was a plane crash. "He said it was a crash of something that was not from the earth. ...the crash left a lot of pieces of small material around, and two small bodies and one person walking around. He said it was from another planet...they were very small, and the one that was walking around was about the size of a ten-year-old child, and it didn't have any hair...it had very small ears and rather large dark eyes. They had on a one-piece suit that covered the whole body." [53] Afterwards she claimed the military threatened to kill the whole family if they talked. (See accounts of threats below)
In recent interviews with Tony Bragalia and Kevin Randle, the last surviving Roswell fireman (with only the surname of "Smith" given) stated that the fire department knew of the crash and were warned by an intimidating colonel from the base not to go out to the site, that "everything was being handled by the military." It was the base fire department that was heavily involved, giving rise to confusion. Nevertheless, several town firemen did go out to the site on their own volition, including Dan Dwyer, but not in an official capacity. The fireman added that the colonel told them that an "unknown object from someplace else" had crashed in the desert outside Roswell. The fireman referred to the object as a "UFO" or an "unidentified--a flying saucer," clarifying they were told that it was a craft not from Earth, the military didn't know where it was from and were greatly concerned. They were never to talk about it again. The sheriff's department and the city manager were also involved in covering it up.[54]
Barbara Dugger, granddaughter of Sheriff George Wilcox, said her grandmother, Inez Wilcox once told her what happened: “there was a spacecraft--a flying saucer--that crashed outside Roswell.” After Brazel reported the incident to the Sheriff, he had gone out to the site in the evening. "There was a big burned area, and he saw debris. He also saw four 'space beings.' One of the little men was moving. Their heads were large. They wore suits like silk." The military threatened the entire family with death if he ever talked about it.[55]
Miriam Bush was the secretary of the hospital administrator Lt. Col. Harold Warne. According to siblings Jean and George, she came home after work in a highly stressed state. She claimed that Warne took her to an examination room and she saw several small childlike bodies. One was moving. Their skin was greyish to brown in tone and they were covered in something like white linens. Their heads and eyes were large. The next day she came home and said nobody was to ever talk about it. The family thought she had received heavy-handed threats.[56]
Mortician Glenn Dennis said the Roswell base called him asking for small caskets for three corpses that had been recovered. Soon after, after transporting an injured airman to the base hospital, Dennis said he saw strange metallic objects in an ambulance, ran into a worried nurse friend inside the hospital who warned him to leave, and was then threatened by an officer, who had him thrown out. The next day, he went to the base to meet the nurse. She described an alien autopsy and drew pictures for Dennis of alien corpses she had seen. "She said the head was disproportionately large for the body… There were three bodies; two were very mangled and dismembered, as if destroyed by predators; one was fairly intact. They were three-and-a-half to four feet tall." They had four long fingers. They had to move the operation to an aircraft hangar because of the horrible stench.[57]
S/Sgt. Milton Sprouse, a B-29 crew chief, said a medic friend who worked in the hospital emergency room, told him of seeing "humanoid" bodies and that autopsies had been hurriedly carried out on two of them by two doctors and two nurses. The bodies were taken out to a heavily guarded hangar. The next day, the medic was transferred and they never found out his fate. The doctors and nurses were also immediately transferred, and their fate was also unknown. A few years later, Glenn Dennis told him about a call from the base for child-size caskets. Five members of his crew were part of the massive clean-up of the Foster Ranch and told him of debris that was "out of this world," including metal foil with memory properties.[58]
Ruben, Pete, and Mary Anaya, related Ruben receiving a call from the base from New Mexico Lt. Governor Joseph Montoya, a personal friend, to pick him up outside a base hangar. (Ruben worked at the base.) Bringing him to their home, Montoya was pale and frightened. He related how a platter-shaped object had crashed. In a hangar, he saw pieces of crash debris and two (or four) non-human “little men,” one barely alive, being worked on by doctors. They were short, white, bald and skinny with big eyes and four long fingers. They wore a tight-fitting suit. Montoya warned them not to talk about it or somebody in the government would get them.[59] In another interview, Ruben Anaya said he spoke to a nurse outside the hangar who told him of the bodies "not of this world." He got a distant glimpse of two small bodies in the hangar covered with a sheet, one moving. Pete Anaya also said he spoke to a nurse outside the hangar, who he knew. She warned him not to go in the hangar. He never saw her again.[60]
Pvt. Francis Cassidy was an MP in the 1395th Military Police Company at Roswell. According to his wife Sarah Mounce, her husband told her during his final days in 1976 to guarding Hangar P-3 and seeing the bodies inside. Cpl. Robert J. Lida was another MP in the 1395th. His wife Wanda Lida said her husband also told her in the final months of his life in 1995 about guarding the bodies inside the same hangar. He observed wreckage inside the hangar and a number of “small bodies” being prepared for shipment elsewhere.[61]
Captain Oliver "Pappy" Henderson, a pilot at Roswell in 1947, told various family members and friends that he flew alien wreckage and had seen alien corpses. His wife, Sappho, said in an affidavit: "He pointed out [a 1980/81 newspaper article on Roswell] to me and said, 'I want you to read this article, because it's a true story. I'm the pilot who flew the wreckage of the UFO to Dayton, Ohio. I guess now that they're putting it in the paper, I can tell you about this. I wanted to tell you for years.' Pappy Henderson never discussed his work because of his security clearance. He described the beings as small with large heads for their size. He said the material from their suits were made of was different than anything he had ever seen. He said they looked strange. I believe he mentioned that the bodies had been packed in dry ice to preserve them." His daughter Mary Groode in an affidavit similarly wrote, "He told me that he saw the crashed craft and the alien bodies described in the article, and that he had flown the wreckage to Ohio. He described the alien beings as small and pale, with slanted eyes and large heads. He said they were humanoid-looking, but different from us. I think he said there were three bodies." Vere McCarthy said Henderson told his old WWII flight crew about seeing the alien bodies at a reunion in 1982. Henderson said "...something to the effect that they were badly deteriorated from exposure and gnawed at by predators." [62]
Lt. Robert Shirkey, assistant operations officer, (see above) said there were other flights, another to Fort Worth, and a B-29 flight directly to Wright Field piloted by Henderson. He also said that he later learned that: “a Sergeant and some airmen went to the crash site and swept up everything, including bodies. The bodies were laid out in Hangar 84. Henderson's flight contained all that material. All of those involved--the Sergeant of the Guards, all of the crewmen, and myself--were shipped out to different bases within two weeks.” [63]
Blanche Wahnee, daughter of Capt. Meyers Wahnee, said her father told the family that the Roswell Incident was true in the last year of his life. A pilot during WWII, in 1947 he was a top-tier security officer. He was flown from Fort Simmons in Colorado to Roswell to oversee the transport of a “Top Secret item” from Roswell to Fort Worth on a special B-29 flight. The item was a single, large, wooden crate that Wahnee was to accompany as a security guard in the bomb bay, which he said contained the alien bodies recovered near Roswell. He also said there were three sites.[64] Three crew members on a special B-29 flight from Roswell to Fort Worth on July 9, Sgt. Robert Slusher, PFC Lloyd Thompson, and S/Sgt. Arthur Osepchook, also spoke of the unusual crate flight with security detail in the bomb bay, that was met in Fort Worth by a mortician.[65]
According to four sons of Lt. Col. Marion M. Magruder, their father told them on his deathbed of being shown crash wreckage and a live alien at Wright Field, Ohio, in mid or late July 1947. He had been attending Air War College at Maxwell Field, Montgomery, Alabama, composed solely of the best high-ranking officers in the various services, including generals. They were flown up to Wright Field to get their opinion on a matter of utmost urgency and importance. There the surprised officers were told about the recovery to Wright Field of an extraterrestrial spaceship that had crashed just two weeks previously near Roswell. Wreckage was brought out for them to examine. Then they were taken to another room and shown a surviving alien. According to the description from Mike Magruder, his father said the “creature” was under 5 feet (1.5 m) tall, “human-like” but with longer arms, larger eyes, and an oversized, hairless head. It had a slit for a mouth and two holes but no appendages for a nose and ears. There was no question that it “came from another planet.” [66]
Steven Lovekin, who served in the White House Army Signal Corp between 1959 and 1961 (handling encrypted and classified White House communications), said he and others received UFO briefings at the Pentagon. According to Lovekin, they were shown a metal beam covered with hieroglyphs and a piece of foil-like debris. They were told it had come from a "New Mexico crash in 1947 of an extraterrestrial craft." Further, "...they did discuss the fact that there were bodies, extraterrestrial bodies... there were either 3 or 5... One was alive, partially alive, at the time that this happened." Lovekin added he heard Pres. Eisenhower talking and worrying about how control was slipping out of government hands and being assumed by corporations tasked with studying the situation.[67]
Numerous other people say they heard reports of recovered aliens and/or an alien craft from others. In some cases, several people heard similar alien stories from the same person. Numerous others claimed to have seen, handled or been told about crash material with strange physical properties.[29]
Barney Barnett story. Accounts of an alien recovery at Roswell first publicly emerged in "The Roswell Incident", by Charles Berlitz and William Moore, published in 1980. An incident recounted by soil engineer Barney Barnett to various people was mentioned, where Barnett said that he and a team of archaeologists stumbled across a flying saucer crash with four aliens on the Plains of San Augustin, near Socorro, New Mexico in July 1947. The military arrived almost simultaneously and led them away.[30]
Dr. Charles Bertrand Schultz, a vertebrate paleontologist from the University of Nebraska. Schultz told a similar crash story, but closer to Roswell. Schultz said he had been in Roswell at the time, and while driving out north of town along Highway 285, had seen a military cordon blocking access west of the highway. Later he met with archeologist Dr. William Curry Holden of Texas Tech, who told him he and his archeological team had been at a crash site north of Roswell and west of the highway and had come across a strange craft with alien bodies. They contacted the military, which took them away when they arrived.[31]
Retired Air Force Brig. Gen. Arthur E. Exon, a former commanding officer at Wright-Patterson AFB, has been identified as the highest-ranking military figure to suggest that an alien spacecraft and bodies could have been recovered at Roswell in 1947. He cautioned that though his information was second-hand, it came from men directly involved whom he knew personally and trusted. Exon said he was told about anomalous debris analysis at Wright-Patterson. "A couple of guys thought it might be Russian, but the overall consensus was that the pieces were from space. ...Roswell was the recovery of a craft from space." He said he was also told about bodies being recovered from a nearby related crash site. He flew over the area a few months later and saw at least two impact regions. He said the whole matter was covered up at the highest levels of government.[32]
Chester Lytle, an engineer who designed and manufactured the implosion detonator for the first A-bomb and subsequently held top-secret clearances with the Atomic Energy Commission and other government agencies, related in 1998 that former Roswell base commander Gen. William Blanchard, a personal friend, told him in 1953 that Roswell was the crash of an alien spacecraft and four humanoid bodies had been recovered. From another high Air Force source, Lytle said he learned some of the bodies had gone originally to Muroc Army Air Field, but all eventually wound up at Wright-Patterson AFB in a highly secure facility. Lytle related he also learned some details about the autopsies carried out on the bodies.[33]
Retired Air Force Lt. Colonel Raymond Madson was the Project Officer for the Air Force's "crash test dummy" program from 1956 to 1960 at Holloman Air Force Base. The program was used by the Air Force to debunk stories of Roswell alien bodies in their 1997 "Case Closed" report, citing Madson as a key witness. However, Madson, in a recent interview, says the crash dummy explanation was nonsense, part of a coverup, and his personal views on the Roswell case were completely misrepresented by the Air Force. Madson instead believes that an extraterrestrial crash actually happened and that the alien bodies were stored for a period of time at Wright-Patterson AFB. This was based on his service in the early 1950s at Wright-Patterson and speaking to "others who would have been positioned to know" that there was a "very secure facility" at the base where the recovered bodies were stored. His wife was also employed at the base in the early 1950s in the medical laboratory. Madson said she was told by coworkers about child-sized beings "from another world" who had crashed to Earth sometime prior to her employment and brought to the base to be studied.[34]
June Crain was employed at Wright-Patterson from 1942 to 1952 with a top-secret clearance. In a 1997 interview with Jim Clarkson, shortly before her death, she spoke of learning from coworkers about the 1947 Roswell alien spacecraft crash and two later New Mexico alien spacecraft crashes from 1948 and 1951 or 1952 and recovery of bodies taken to Wright-Patterson. The bodies were taken to the Aeromedical Lab for study. She also said she personally handled an extremely strong thin metal material with memory properties similar to that described by a number of Roswell witnesses and described to her as being from one of the recent crashes.[35]
CIC agent Lewis Rickett said he accompanied Sheridan Cavitt to the ranch, witnessed high security and a large military debris recovery, handled strange metal debris, and saw a gouge in the ground. In September 1947, Rickett said he and Cavitt assisted astronomer Dr. Lincoln La Paz try to determine the speed and trajectory of the device that crashed on the Brazel ranch. “According to Rickett, La Paz formed the opinion that [the object] was a probe from another planet.” Rickett said they found a touchdown point five miles (8 km) from the debris field where the sand had crystallized, possibly from the heat.[36] Shortly before he died, it is also claimed he confirmed that the object’s shape was long, thin with a 'bat-like' wing."[37]
Colonel Edwin Easley, Roswell base Provost Marshal in charge of the Military Police. When asked what happened, he said he had sworn a security oath and couldn’t talk about it. However, when asked if the extraterrestrials theories was the right path to follow, Easley replied, “Let’s put it this way. That’s not the wrong path.” Easley also admitted they held rancher Mack Brazel at the base under armed guard for several days.[38] It is also claimed that Easley’s doctor, Harold Granik, and a granddaughter, reported that Easley spoke about the “creatures” at Roswell on his deathbed.[39]
Lydia Sleppy was a Teletype operator working at an Albuquerque radio station in 1947. She said they received a telephone call from John McBoyle of KSWS Radio in Roswell. In her affidavit she recalled McBoyle saying, "There's been one of those flying saucer things crash down here north of Roswell." He'd met Brazel in a coffee shop. Brazel said he'd discovered the object and "had towed it underneath a shelter on his property. Brazel offered to take McBoyle to the ranch to see the object. McBoyle described it as a 'big crumpled dishpan.'" She added the FBI then interrupted the teletype as she tried to send it and ordered that they cease transmission. She said her boss, Karl Lambertz, spoke to McBoyle the next day. "He told Mr. Lambertz the military had isolated the area where the saucer was found and was keeping the press out. He saw planes come in from Wright Field, Ohio, to take the thing away." [40] The station owner, Merle Tucker, confirmed hearing the story at the time. In an interview shortly before his death, McBoyle confirmed seeing an object that looked like “a crushed dishpan,” about 25–30 feet long, impacted in a slope.[41]
Bill Brazel Jr. reported that his father towed a large object off the field and stored it in a livestock shed. Marcel in one early interview likewise recounted Brazel showing them the largest piece he had found, about 10 feet (3.0 m) in diameter, which he had dragged from the field.[42]
Frank Joyce, Roswell radio KGFL news announcer, said he spoke to Brazel when he first reported the incident to Sheriff Wilcox. In earlier interviews, Joyce wouldn't discuss the details of what Brazel told him, saying only that he didn't believe the story, but suggested he report the incident to the base. After Brazel gave his press interview, he called Joyce again and said, "We haven't got the story right." Brazel went to the radio station and told Joyce a balloon story. Joyce responded, "Look, this is completely different than what you told me on the phone the other day about the little green men. Joyce said Brazel responded to the effect, "No they weren't green. Our lives will never be the same again." [43] However, he initially was quoted by Roswell researcher William Moore as saying that he had this conversation with his dying boss Walt Whitmore Sr. Joyce later objected that he had been misquoted; the conversation was with Brazel. Moore was provided corrections by Joyce and changed the attribution to Brazel.[44] In more recent interviews, as first reported by Tom Carey and Don Schmitt in 1998, Joyce has explained this cryptic conversation by saying Brazel first mentioned small, nonhuman beings when he first spoke to him. Initially Brazel was highly stressed over the large quantities of debris that needed to be cleaned up. "Who's gonna clean all that shit up?" Then Joyce said Brazel really began "losing it," talking about the "horrible stench" from the dead "little people" he had found at another location. Joyce suggested maybe he had found monkeys from a military experiment. "They're not monkeys, and they're not human!" Joyce then went on to explain that his "little green men comment [referred] back to our original phone conversation." [45]
According to Brazel’s neighbor Loretta Proctor, her 7-year old son Timothy or "Dee" was with Brazel when he first discovered the debris field. But he was also with Brazel when he discovered something else at another site 2-1/2 miles to the east that left him deeply traumatized for the rest of his life. He never told her exactly what he saw there but did take her to the location in 1994 saying, "Here is where Mack found something else." Dee Proctor would also duck all attempts at interview and died in 2006. However, other rancher children are believed to have visited the site, including Sydney "Jack" Wright, who said that two sons of rancher Thomas Edington and one of rancher Truman Pierce’s daughters got to "the other location." Wright in 1998 would state, "There were bodies, small bodies with big heads and eyes. And Mack was there too. We couldn’t get away from there fast enough." [46]
Private First Class Ed Sain was an MP in the 390th Air Service Squadron. On the evening of July 7, he and Cpl. Raymond Van Why were told to report to the ambulance pool outside the base hospital and boarded a military ambulance. It was driven north of town and then west into the desert. When they got there at night somewhere in the desert, there were a few tents and a number of floodlights. They were told to guard the entrance to the site from a tent set up for that purpose and to “Shoot anyone that tries to get in.” They were returned to the base at daybreak. His son Steven said his father was still reluctant to talk about it, being under a security oath and fearing for his life. According to Steven Sain, his father told both him and his brother that his job was to "guard the bodies at the crash site," which he said "were kept in one of the other tents until being transported to the base." He also thought his father had seen the craft, because he said "it was the strangest thing he had ever seen in his life." Raymond Van Why’s wife, Leola, said her husband first talked about it in 1954 when he got out of the service. He told her that he had been a guard at a crash site "out in the desert" where a spaceship had crashed. "My husband told me that it was a UFO that had crashed, that it was a round disc. ..he was out there and saw it!" [47]
Sgt. LeRoy Wallace was another MP in the 390th Air Service Squadron. According to his widow, he was called away one evening to go to a crash site outside of Corona "to help load the bodies." When he returned home the next morning, the first thing she noticed was the horrible stench on his clothes, which she burned. The horrible smell lingered on his body for another two weeks despite repeated bathing.[48]
Beverly Bean, daughter of Sgt. Melvin Brown, said her father also helped guard the crash site where alien bodies were recovered. She claimed her father told her he saw two or three alien bodies packed in ice as they drove back to the base in a truck. "He said they were smaller than a normal man--about four feet--and had much larger heads than us, with slanted eyes, and that the bodies looked yellowish, a bit Asian-looking." That night, he stood guard outside a hangar where either debris or bodies awaited shipment to Texas.[49]
Sgt. Homer G. Rowlette, Jr. was with the 603rd Air Engineering Squadron at Roswell. According to his son Larry and daughter Carlene Green, he told them about the "crash of a flying saucer" on his deathbed in March 1988. Larry Rowlette said his father was part of the cleanup detail sent to the impact site north of Roswell. There were also two other sites near Corona, N.M. He had handled the "memory material" which he described as "thin foil that kept its shape." He saw the actual ship that was "somewhat circular." Finally, he said he had seen "three little people. They had large heads and at least one was alive." Carlene Green said her father, still lucid, told her, "I was at Roswell when they recovered the spaceship in 1947. I was involved. I saw it. It’s all true." [50]
Private First Class Rolland Menagh was another MP in the 390th Air Service Squadron. He later became a security specialist for the Air Force Office of Special Investigations. According to sons Michael and Rolland Jr., their father first spoke about his involvement in the 1960s. Rolland Jr. recalled, "He was an MP who guarded the UFO crash site north of Roswell. He saw the ship, which he described as being round or egg-shaped and seamless." Rolland Jr. didn’t remember his father talking about bodies, but Michael recalled he mentioned three bodies. He added, "He said the spaceship was loaded onto an 18-wheeler with a tarp covering it and then driven right through the center of town down to the air base. My father said he accompanied it in a Jeep all the way from the crash site to the hangar where it was deposited." [51]
A number of other witnesses have been found to a flatbed, 18-wheeler truck with an oval or egg-shaped tarped object being driven through the center of Roswell toward the base on the afternoon of July 8, accompanied by an escort of armed MPs in Jeeps, some with machine guns. One, Richard Talbert, said he saw what was under the tarp when it momentarily lifted up. It was "silver, oval-shaped... approximately 4 to 5 feet (1.5 m) wide by about 12 feet (3.7 m) long and 5 to 7 feet (2.1 m) high. It had a dome on it, but it was damaged because it was cut off at one end." Other eyewitnesses were Paul McFerrin, Bob Rich and Jobie MacPherson. At the base, Sgt. Earl Fulford said he saw the truck and covered object, about the size and shape of a Volkswagen Beetle, being driven to Hangar 84 around 4:00 p.m. by a close friend of his.[52]
Frankie Rowe, was the daughter of Roswell fireman Dan Dwyer. Her father told the family of being on a run outside of Roswell to what they thought was a plane crash. "He said it was a crash of something that was not from the earth. ...the crash left a lot of pieces of small material around, and two small bodies and one person walking around. He said it was from another planet...they were very small, and the one that was walking around was about the size of a ten-year-old child, and it didn't have any hair...it had very small ears and rather large dark eyes. They had on a one-piece suit that covered the whole body." [53] Afterwards she claimed the military threatened to kill the whole family if they talked. (See accounts of threats below)
In recent interviews with Tony Bragalia and Kevin Randle, the last surviving Roswell fireman (with only the surname of "Smith" given) stated that the fire department knew of the crash and were warned by an intimidating colonel from the base not to go out to the site, that "everything was being handled by the military." It was the base fire department that was heavily involved, giving rise to confusion. Nevertheless, several town firemen did go out to the site on their own volition, including Dan Dwyer, but not in an official capacity. The fireman added that the colonel told them that an "unknown object from someplace else" had crashed in the desert outside Roswell. The fireman referred to the object as a "UFO" or an "unidentified--a flying saucer," clarifying they were told that it was a craft not from Earth, the military didn't know where it was from and were greatly concerned. They were never to talk about it again. The sheriff's department and the city manager were also involved in covering it up.[54]
Barbara Dugger, granddaughter of Sheriff George Wilcox, said her grandmother, Inez Wilcox once told her what happened: “there was a spacecraft--a flying saucer--that crashed outside Roswell.” After Brazel reported the incident to the Sheriff, he had gone out to the site in the evening. "There was a big burned area, and he saw debris. He also saw four 'space beings.' One of the little men was moving. Their heads were large. They wore suits like silk." The military threatened the entire family with death if he ever talked about it.[55]
Miriam Bush was the secretary of the hospital administrator Lt. Col. Harold Warne. According to siblings Jean and George, she came home after work in a highly stressed state. She claimed that Warne took her to an examination room and she saw several small childlike bodies. One was moving. Their skin was greyish to brown in tone and they were covered in something like white linens. Their heads and eyes were large. The next day she came home and said nobody was to ever talk about it. The family thought she had received heavy-handed threats.[56]
Mortician Glenn Dennis said the Roswell base called him asking for small caskets for three corpses that had been recovered. Soon after, after transporting an injured airman to the base hospital, Dennis said he saw strange metallic objects in an ambulance, ran into a worried nurse friend inside the hospital who warned him to leave, and was then threatened by an officer, who had him thrown out. The next day, he went to the base to meet the nurse. She described an alien autopsy and drew pictures for Dennis of alien corpses she had seen. "She said the head was disproportionately large for the body… There were three bodies; two were very mangled and dismembered, as if destroyed by predators; one was fairly intact. They were three-and-a-half to four feet tall." They had four long fingers. They had to move the operation to an aircraft hangar because of the horrible stench.[57]
S/Sgt. Milton Sprouse, a B-29 crew chief, said a medic friend who worked in the hospital emergency room, told him of seeing "humanoid" bodies and that autopsies had been hurriedly carried out on two of them by two doctors and two nurses. The bodies were taken out to a heavily guarded hangar. The next day, the medic was transferred and they never found out his fate. The doctors and nurses were also immediately transferred, and their fate was also unknown. A few years later, Glenn Dennis told him about a call from the base for child-size caskets. Five members of his crew were part of the massive clean-up of the Foster Ranch and told him of debris that was "out of this world," including metal foil with memory properties.[58]
Ruben, Pete, and Mary Anaya, related Ruben receiving a call from the base from New Mexico Lt. Governor Joseph Montoya, a personal friend, to pick him up outside a base hangar. (Ruben worked at the base.) Bringing him to their home, Montoya was pale and frightened. He related how a platter-shaped object had crashed. In a hangar, he saw pieces of crash debris and two (or four) non-human “little men,” one barely alive, being worked on by doctors. They were short, white, bald and skinny with big eyes and four long fingers. They wore a tight-fitting suit. Montoya warned them not to talk about it or somebody in the government would get them.[59] In another interview, Ruben Anaya said he spoke to a nurse outside the hangar who told him of the bodies "not of this world." He got a distant glimpse of two small bodies in the hangar covered with a sheet, one moving. Pete Anaya also said he spoke to a nurse outside the hangar, who he knew. She warned him not to go in the hangar. He never saw her again.[60]
Pvt. Francis Cassidy was an MP in the 1395th Military Police Company at Roswell. According to his wife Sarah Mounce, her husband told her during his final days in 1976 to guarding Hangar P-3 and seeing the bodies inside. Cpl. Robert J. Lida was another MP in the 1395th. His wife Wanda Lida said her husband also told her in the final months of his life in 1995 about guarding the bodies inside the same hangar. He observed wreckage inside the hangar and a number of “small bodies” being prepared for shipment elsewhere.[61]
Captain Oliver "Pappy" Henderson, a pilot at Roswell in 1947, told various family members and friends that he flew alien wreckage and had seen alien corpses. His wife, Sappho, said in an affidavit: "He pointed out [a 1980/81 newspaper article on Roswell] to me and said, 'I want you to read this article, because it's a true story. I'm the pilot who flew the wreckage of the UFO to Dayton, Ohio. I guess now that they're putting it in the paper, I can tell you about this. I wanted to tell you for years.' Pappy Henderson never discussed his work because of his security clearance. He described the beings as small with large heads for their size. He said the material from their suits were made of was different than anything he had ever seen. He said they looked strange. I believe he mentioned that the bodies had been packed in dry ice to preserve them." His daughter Mary Groode in an affidavit similarly wrote, "He told me that he saw the crashed craft and the alien bodies described in the article, and that he had flown the wreckage to Ohio. He described the alien beings as small and pale, with slanted eyes and large heads. He said they were humanoid-looking, but different from us. I think he said there were three bodies." Vere McCarthy said Henderson told his old WWII flight crew about seeing the alien bodies at a reunion in 1982. Henderson said "...something to the effect that they were badly deteriorated from exposure and gnawed at by predators." [62]
Lt. Robert Shirkey, assistant operations officer, (see above) said there were other flights, another to Fort Worth, and a B-29 flight directly to Wright Field piloted by Henderson. He also said that he later learned that: “a Sergeant and some airmen went to the crash site and swept up everything, including bodies. The bodies were laid out in Hangar 84. Henderson's flight contained all that material. All of those involved--the Sergeant of the Guards, all of the crewmen, and myself--were shipped out to different bases within two weeks.” [63]
Blanche Wahnee, daughter of Capt. Meyers Wahnee, said her father told the family that the Roswell Incident was true in the last year of his life. A pilot during WWII, in 1947 he was a top-tier security officer. He was flown from Fort Simmons in Colorado to Roswell to oversee the transport of a “Top Secret item” from Roswell to Fort Worth on a special B-29 flight. The item was a single, large, wooden crate that Wahnee was to accompany as a security guard in the bomb bay, which he said contained the alien bodies recovered near Roswell. He also said there were three sites.[64] Three crew members on a special B-29 flight from Roswell to Fort Worth on July 9, Sgt. Robert Slusher, PFC Lloyd Thompson, and S/Sgt. Arthur Osepchook, also spoke of the unusual crate flight with security detail in the bomb bay, that was met in Fort Worth by a mortician.[65]
According to four sons of Lt. Col. Marion M. Magruder, their father told them on his deathbed of being shown crash wreckage and a live alien at Wright Field, Ohio, in mid or late July 1947. He had been attending Air War College at Maxwell Field, Montgomery, Alabama, composed solely of the best high-ranking officers in the various services, including generals. They were flown up to Wright Field to get their opinion on a matter of utmost urgency and importance. There the surprised officers were told about the recovery to Wright Field of an extraterrestrial spaceship that had crashed just two weeks previously near Roswell. Wreckage was brought out for them to examine. Then they were taken to another room and shown a surviving alien. According to the description from Mike Magruder, his father said the “creature” was under 5 feet (1.5 m) tall, “human-like” but with longer arms, larger eyes, and an oversized, hairless head. It had a slit for a mouth and two holes but no appendages for a nose and ears. There was no question that it “came from another planet.” [66]
Steven Lovekin, who served in the White House Army Signal Corp between 1959 and 1961 (handling encrypted and classified White House communications), said he and others received UFO briefings at the Pentagon. According to Lovekin, they were shown a metal beam covered with hieroglyphs and a piece of foil-like debris. They were told it had come from a "New Mexico crash in 1947 of an extraterrestrial craft." Further, "...they did discuss the fact that there were bodies, extraterrestrial bodies... there were either 3 or 5... One was alive, partially alive, at the time that this happened." Lovekin added he heard Pres. Eisenhower talking and worrying about how control was slipping out of government hands and being assumed by corporations tasked with studying the situation.[67]
"An educated citizenry is a vital requisite for our survival as a free people."
Accounts of intimidation
Several people claimed, or knew people who claimed, that they were threatened by military or government personnel into keeping silent about what they saw or knew. In some cases, these threats including death threats.
Mortician Glenn Dennis said he received a death threat at the base hospital from a redheaded captain, who warned him if he talked “somebody will be picking your bones out of the sand.” The following day, Sheriff Wilcox talked to his father, a personal friend, and said, “…tell your son that he doesn’t know anything and hasn’t seen anything at the base. They want you and your wife’s name, and they want your and your children’s addresses.” His father told him about the conversation with the Sheriff, so Dennis related the events of the previous day to him. Dennis also claimed that the nurse who confided in him about alien corpses subsequently was shipped off base and attempts to contact her via mail resulted in letters returned with "deceased" marked on the envelopes.[68]
Frankie Rowe, claims her father was a firefighter who on a fire run outside of town encountered a wrecked craft and alien bodies. Later, after seeing a state trooper with a piece of dull gray metallic foil from the downed craft that “would unfold itself”, she and her family were threatened into silence by military personnel who visited her house. She said they told them: "They could take us out in the desert, and no one would ever find us again." In her affidavit she wrote, “I was told that if I ever talked about it, I could be taken out into the desert never to return, or that my mother and father would be taken to ‘Orchard Park’, a former POW camp.” [69] Rowe's older sister Helen Cahill said her parents told her a similar story.[70]
Barbara Dugger, granddaughter of Sheriff George Wilcox, said her grandmother, Inez Wilcox, told her the Sheriff had gone to the ranch and seen four alien bodies. "My grandmother said 'Don't tell anybody. When the incident happened, the military police came to the jail house and told George and I that if we ever told anything about the incident, not only would we be killed, but our entire family would be killed.'" [71] Others said that Inez Wilcox told them similar stories.[72][73]
The Anaya family (see above) told the story of picking up Lt. Governor Joseph Montoya at the base, and a shaken Montoya relating the story of a crashed craft and seeing alien bodies in a hangar. Montoya then warned them, and in future visits, not to talk about it because somebody in the government might come after them. They said they also received a warning from Sheriff George Wilcox and N.M. Senator Dennis Chavez.
George "Jud" Roberts was manager of radio station KGFL in Roswell. He signed an affidavit where he claimed to have been threatened if he ran an interview his station had done with Brazel. "I got a call from someone in Washington, D.C. It may have been someone in the office of [New Mexico Senators] Clinton Anderson or Dennis Chavez. This person said, 'We understand that you have some information, and we want to assure you that if you release it, it's very possible that your station's license will be in jeopardy, so we suggest that you not to do it.' The person indicated that we might lose our license in as quickly as three days. I made the decision not to release the story." [74]
Walt Whitmore Jr., son of the KGFL station owner, also recalled how his father had hidden Brazel at their home and done a recorded interview. Whitmore Sr. was unable to get the story through on the Mutual wire and instead began broadcasting a preliminary release locally over KGFL. At this point, a long distance phone call came to the station from a man named Slowie, saying he was with the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) in Washington. Slowie informed Whitmore that the story involved national security and that if he valued his station license he should cease transmitting it and forget about it. Immediately afterwards, another call from Washington came from Senator Dennis Chavez, who suggested he had better do what Slowie advised.[75]
Frank Joyce, news announcer and disc jockey at KGFL, said he spoke to Brazel by telephone when he first came to town and Brazel described finding nonhuman bodies. (see above) Later, Joyce received the base press release announcing the recovery of a “flying disk” and put it on the United Press teletype. When the first UP bulletins came in on the station teletype, Joyce said the phones went crazy. He received an irate call from a Colonel Johnson at the Pentagon, demanding to know who had told him to issue the press release. Joyce said he was a civilian and couldn’t be ordered around like that, to which the colonel responded, “I’ll show you what I can do to you.” Joyce said he decided to collect and hide the press release copy and the various teletypes so he could later prove to his boss Whitmore that he hadn’t made anything up. Later, somebody came through the station, found some of the hidden material, and removed it. However, some of the original teletypes were not found, and Joyce still has them. Jud Dixon, of United Press in Santa Fe, New Mexico, said the same thing happened in his office.[76] However, Karl Pflock said Dixon told him he had no memory at all about the Roswell incident, much less any confiscation.[77]
Mac Brazel was seen escorted by military personnel and spent some time in military custody, where he said he was intimidated into not talking about what he saw, according to several witnesses. For example, base provost marshal Lt. Col. Edwin Easley admitted to researcher Kevin Randle that they held Brazel at the base for several days.[78] Frank Joyce said the story Brazel told him after the news conference Brazel appeared at was different than the original story he had told Joyce when Brazel first reported to Sheriff Wilcox. “I remember him changing the story. …I told him, what you’re saying is not what you were saying the other night. [He admitted] that he had been told to come in or else. …He told me what they were going to do to us. …He was really scared. …[Brazel said] ‘You’re not going to tell them anything, are you?’” Joyce promised he wouldn’t. Brazel said he had to tell the new story or “it would go hard on him.” [79] Brazel's son Bill and various neighbors said Brazel also complained bitterly about his treatment by the military afterwards.
Accounts of cover-ups
Lydia Sleppy (see above) was one of the first witnesses to claim the government tried to conceal what happened. She was a Teletype operator working at an Albuquerque radio station in 1947. She said that when she tried to transmit a phoned-in reporter's story of the crashed flying saucer and seeing an object like a smashed dishpan at the Brazel ranch, the FBI cut it off and ordered that they cease transmission.[80]
Lt. Walter Haut, Roswell public information officer, in his 2002 affidavit claimed an elaborate coverup was carried out: "On Tuesday morning, July 8, I would attend the regularly scheduled staff meeting at 7:30 a.m. Besides Blanchard, Marcel, CIC Capt. Sheridan Cavitt [names other senior officers], and from Carswell AAF in Fort Worth, Texas, Blanchard's boss, Brig. Gen. Roger Ramey and his chief of staff, Col. Thomas J. Dubose were also in attendance. The main topic of discussion was reported by Marcel and Cavitt regarding an extensive debris field in Lincoln County... A preliminary briefing was provided by Blanchard about the second site approx. 40 miles (64 km) north of town. ...One of the main concerns discussed at the meeting was whether we should go public or not with the discovery. Gen. Ramey proposed a plan, which I believe originated with his bosses at the Pentagon. Attention needed to be diverted from the more important site north of town by acknowledging the other location. Too many civilians were already involved and the press already was informed. I was not completely informed how this would be accomplished. At approximately 9:30 a.m. Col. Blanchard phoned my office and dictated the press release of having in our possession a flying disc, coming from a ranch northwest of Roswell, and Marcel flying the material to higher headquarters..." In addition, Haut stated that he "was aware two separate teams would return to each site months later for periodic searches for any remaining evidence." [81]
Major Jesse Marcel, Roswell intelligence officer, was ordered to Fort Worth to show Gen. Roger Ramey recovered crash materials. In one interview, he said a photo was taken of him with the real debris, but then everything was removed and other material substituted for subsequent press photos. He then claimed that the original debris was in the photos, but covered by paper to shield it from the press.
"The stuff in that one photo was pieces of the actual stuff we had found. It was not a staged photo. Later, they cleared out our wreckage and substituted some of their own. They then allowed more photos. Those photos were taken while the actual wreckage was on its way to Wright Field." [82]
"[referring to photo of Ramey with weather balloon] "That's a fake. ...What you see there is nothing but a piece of brown paper that I put over [the real debris] so that the news media couldn't get a picture of what I had. [I covered the real stuff, including in the photo of me you are showing. Ramey told me] 'Just don't say anything. Don't show anything.' ...[Ramey] claimed that it was fragments of a weather balloon. ...I knew it wasn't a weather balloon, and Ramey knew it wasn't a weather balloon. They had the picture made strictly for the press..." [83]
"To get them [the press] off my back, I told them we were recovering a downed weather balloon. I was told later that a military team from my base was sent to rake the entire area." [84]
Brigadier General Thomas Dubose, chief of staff to Gen. Ramey (and both of whom appear in press photos with weather balloon in Ramey's office), said in an affidavit: "The material shown in the photographs taken in Maj. Gen. Ramey's office was a weather balloon. The weather balloon explanation for the material was a cover story to divert the attention of the press." In several interviews, like Marcel, he indicated they substituted material they had brought in from elsewhere for the real debris, which he said even he was never allowed to see because of all the secrecy. He said Deputy Chief of the Strategic Air Command, General Clements McMullen ordered him by phone to start a coverup. Several days before the press photos were taken, Dubose said McMullen also ordered a shipment of debris from Roswell to Washington by "colonel courier," and subsequently was flown on to Wright Field for analysis. McMullen ordered absolute secrecy, said Dubose, and said it was so secret it was "beyond top secret." Dubose was not to discuss this with anybody. [1]
"[Gen.] McMullen said, Look, why don't you come up with something, anything you can use to get the press off our back? So we came up with this weather balloon story. Somebody got one and we ran it up a couple of hundred feet and dropped it to make it look like it crashed, and that's what we used." [85]
"Actually, it was a cover story, the balloon part of it... Somebody cooked up the idea as a cover story ...we'll use this weather balloon. ...We were told this is the story that is to be given to the press, and that is it, and anything else, forget it. …McMullen told me, ‘You are not to discuss this… this is more than top secret… it’s beyond that. It’s within my priority as deputy to George Kenney, and he in turn responsible to the President, this is the highest priority you can exhibit. And you will say nothing.’”[86]
Brigadier General Arthur Exon, former commanding officer at Wright-Patterson AFB, stated, "I know that at the time the sightings happened, it was to General Ramey ... and he, along with the people at Roswell, decided to change the story while they got their act together and got the information into the Pentagon and into the president." Also, he said, "all these guys at the top of government" (such as Air Force Chief of Staff Carl Spaatz and Secretary of the Air Force Stuart Symington) ...They were the ones who knew the most about Roswell, New Mexico. They were involved in what to do about the residue from that." [87]
Moon-walker and Apollo 14 astronaut Edgar Mitchell has made various public statements about the reality of Roswell: "Make no mistake, Roswell happened. I've seen secret files which show the government knew about it — but decided not to tell the public. I wasn't convinced about the existence of aliens until I started talking to the military old-timers who were there at the time of Roswell. The more government documentation on aliens I was told about, the more convinced I became." [88] Mitchell has also spoken about bodies: "A few insiders know the truth . . . and are studying the bodies that have been discovered." Mitchell added that a cabal of insiders stopped briefing Presidents after Kennedy.[89]
http://en.wikipedia.org/w(...)Roswell_UFO_incident
Several people claimed, or knew people who claimed, that they were threatened by military or government personnel into keeping silent about what they saw or knew. In some cases, these threats including death threats.
Mortician Glenn Dennis said he received a death threat at the base hospital from a redheaded captain, who warned him if he talked “somebody will be picking your bones out of the sand.” The following day, Sheriff Wilcox talked to his father, a personal friend, and said, “…tell your son that he doesn’t know anything and hasn’t seen anything at the base. They want you and your wife’s name, and they want your and your children’s addresses.” His father told him about the conversation with the Sheriff, so Dennis related the events of the previous day to him. Dennis also claimed that the nurse who confided in him about alien corpses subsequently was shipped off base and attempts to contact her via mail resulted in letters returned with "deceased" marked on the envelopes.[68]
Frankie Rowe, claims her father was a firefighter who on a fire run outside of town encountered a wrecked craft and alien bodies. Later, after seeing a state trooper with a piece of dull gray metallic foil from the downed craft that “would unfold itself”, she and her family were threatened into silence by military personnel who visited her house. She said they told them: "They could take us out in the desert, and no one would ever find us again." In her affidavit she wrote, “I was told that if I ever talked about it, I could be taken out into the desert never to return, or that my mother and father would be taken to ‘Orchard Park’, a former POW camp.” [69] Rowe's older sister Helen Cahill said her parents told her a similar story.[70]
Barbara Dugger, granddaughter of Sheriff George Wilcox, said her grandmother, Inez Wilcox, told her the Sheriff had gone to the ranch and seen four alien bodies. "My grandmother said 'Don't tell anybody. When the incident happened, the military police came to the jail house and told George and I that if we ever told anything about the incident, not only would we be killed, but our entire family would be killed.'" [71] Others said that Inez Wilcox told them similar stories.[72][73]
The Anaya family (see above) told the story of picking up Lt. Governor Joseph Montoya at the base, and a shaken Montoya relating the story of a crashed craft and seeing alien bodies in a hangar. Montoya then warned them, and in future visits, not to talk about it because somebody in the government might come after them. They said they also received a warning from Sheriff George Wilcox and N.M. Senator Dennis Chavez.
George "Jud" Roberts was manager of radio station KGFL in Roswell. He signed an affidavit where he claimed to have been threatened if he ran an interview his station had done with Brazel. "I got a call from someone in Washington, D.C. It may have been someone in the office of [New Mexico Senators] Clinton Anderson or Dennis Chavez. This person said, 'We understand that you have some information, and we want to assure you that if you release it, it's very possible that your station's license will be in jeopardy, so we suggest that you not to do it.' The person indicated that we might lose our license in as quickly as three days. I made the decision not to release the story." [74]
Walt Whitmore Jr., son of the KGFL station owner, also recalled how his father had hidden Brazel at their home and done a recorded interview. Whitmore Sr. was unable to get the story through on the Mutual wire and instead began broadcasting a preliminary release locally over KGFL. At this point, a long distance phone call came to the station from a man named Slowie, saying he was with the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) in Washington. Slowie informed Whitmore that the story involved national security and that if he valued his station license he should cease transmitting it and forget about it. Immediately afterwards, another call from Washington came from Senator Dennis Chavez, who suggested he had better do what Slowie advised.[75]
Frank Joyce, news announcer and disc jockey at KGFL, said he spoke to Brazel by telephone when he first came to town and Brazel described finding nonhuman bodies. (see above) Later, Joyce received the base press release announcing the recovery of a “flying disk” and put it on the United Press teletype. When the first UP bulletins came in on the station teletype, Joyce said the phones went crazy. He received an irate call from a Colonel Johnson at the Pentagon, demanding to know who had told him to issue the press release. Joyce said he was a civilian and couldn’t be ordered around like that, to which the colonel responded, “I’ll show you what I can do to you.” Joyce said he decided to collect and hide the press release copy and the various teletypes so he could later prove to his boss Whitmore that he hadn’t made anything up. Later, somebody came through the station, found some of the hidden material, and removed it. However, some of the original teletypes were not found, and Joyce still has them. Jud Dixon, of United Press in Santa Fe, New Mexico, said the same thing happened in his office.[76] However, Karl Pflock said Dixon told him he had no memory at all about the Roswell incident, much less any confiscation.[77]
Mac Brazel was seen escorted by military personnel and spent some time in military custody, where he said he was intimidated into not talking about what he saw, according to several witnesses. For example, base provost marshal Lt. Col. Edwin Easley admitted to researcher Kevin Randle that they held Brazel at the base for several days.[78] Frank Joyce said the story Brazel told him after the news conference Brazel appeared at was different than the original story he had told Joyce when Brazel first reported to Sheriff Wilcox. “I remember him changing the story. …I told him, what you’re saying is not what you were saying the other night. [He admitted] that he had been told to come in or else. …He told me what they were going to do to us. …He was really scared. …[Brazel said] ‘You’re not going to tell them anything, are you?’” Joyce promised he wouldn’t. Brazel said he had to tell the new story or “it would go hard on him.” [79] Brazel's son Bill and various neighbors said Brazel also complained bitterly about his treatment by the military afterwards.
Accounts of cover-ups
Lydia Sleppy (see above) was one of the first witnesses to claim the government tried to conceal what happened. She was a Teletype operator working at an Albuquerque radio station in 1947. She said that when she tried to transmit a phoned-in reporter's story of the crashed flying saucer and seeing an object like a smashed dishpan at the Brazel ranch, the FBI cut it off and ordered that they cease transmission.[80]
Lt. Walter Haut, Roswell public information officer, in his 2002 affidavit claimed an elaborate coverup was carried out: "On Tuesday morning, July 8, I would attend the regularly scheduled staff meeting at 7:30 a.m. Besides Blanchard, Marcel, CIC Capt. Sheridan Cavitt [names other senior officers], and from Carswell AAF in Fort Worth, Texas, Blanchard's boss, Brig. Gen. Roger Ramey and his chief of staff, Col. Thomas J. Dubose were also in attendance. The main topic of discussion was reported by Marcel and Cavitt regarding an extensive debris field in Lincoln County... A preliminary briefing was provided by Blanchard about the second site approx. 40 miles (64 km) north of town. ...One of the main concerns discussed at the meeting was whether we should go public or not with the discovery. Gen. Ramey proposed a plan, which I believe originated with his bosses at the Pentagon. Attention needed to be diverted from the more important site north of town by acknowledging the other location. Too many civilians were already involved and the press already was informed. I was not completely informed how this would be accomplished. At approximately 9:30 a.m. Col. Blanchard phoned my office and dictated the press release of having in our possession a flying disc, coming from a ranch northwest of Roswell, and Marcel flying the material to higher headquarters..." In addition, Haut stated that he "was aware two separate teams would return to each site months later for periodic searches for any remaining evidence." [81]
Major Jesse Marcel, Roswell intelligence officer, was ordered to Fort Worth to show Gen. Roger Ramey recovered crash materials. In one interview, he said a photo was taken of him with the real debris, but then everything was removed and other material substituted for subsequent press photos. He then claimed that the original debris was in the photos, but covered by paper to shield it from the press.
"The stuff in that one photo was pieces of the actual stuff we had found. It was not a staged photo. Later, they cleared out our wreckage and substituted some of their own. They then allowed more photos. Those photos were taken while the actual wreckage was on its way to Wright Field." [82]
"[referring to photo of Ramey with weather balloon] "That's a fake. ...What you see there is nothing but a piece of brown paper that I put over [the real debris] so that the news media couldn't get a picture of what I had. [I covered the real stuff, including in the photo of me you are showing. Ramey told me] 'Just don't say anything. Don't show anything.' ...[Ramey] claimed that it was fragments of a weather balloon. ...I knew it wasn't a weather balloon, and Ramey knew it wasn't a weather balloon. They had the picture made strictly for the press..." [83]
"To get them [the press] off my back, I told them we were recovering a downed weather balloon. I was told later that a military team from my base was sent to rake the entire area." [84]
Brigadier General Thomas Dubose, chief of staff to Gen. Ramey (and both of whom appear in press photos with weather balloon in Ramey's office), said in an affidavit: "The material shown in the photographs taken in Maj. Gen. Ramey's office was a weather balloon. The weather balloon explanation for the material was a cover story to divert the attention of the press." In several interviews, like Marcel, he indicated they substituted material they had brought in from elsewhere for the real debris, which he said even he was never allowed to see because of all the secrecy. He said Deputy Chief of the Strategic Air Command, General Clements McMullen ordered him by phone to start a coverup. Several days before the press photos were taken, Dubose said McMullen also ordered a shipment of debris from Roswell to Washington by "colonel courier," and subsequently was flown on to Wright Field for analysis. McMullen ordered absolute secrecy, said Dubose, and said it was so secret it was "beyond top secret." Dubose was not to discuss this with anybody. [1]
"[Gen.] McMullen said, Look, why don't you come up with something, anything you can use to get the press off our back? So we came up with this weather balloon story. Somebody got one and we ran it up a couple of hundred feet and dropped it to make it look like it crashed, and that's what we used." [85]
"Actually, it was a cover story, the balloon part of it... Somebody cooked up the idea as a cover story ...we'll use this weather balloon. ...We were told this is the story that is to be given to the press, and that is it, and anything else, forget it. …McMullen told me, ‘You are not to discuss this… this is more than top secret… it’s beyond that. It’s within my priority as deputy to George Kenney, and he in turn responsible to the President, this is the highest priority you can exhibit. And you will say nothing.’”[86]
Brigadier General Arthur Exon, former commanding officer at Wright-Patterson AFB, stated, "I know that at the time the sightings happened, it was to General Ramey ... and he, along with the people at Roswell, decided to change the story while they got their act together and got the information into the Pentagon and into the president." Also, he said, "all these guys at the top of government" (such as Air Force Chief of Staff Carl Spaatz and Secretary of the Air Force Stuart Symington) ...They were the ones who knew the most about Roswell, New Mexico. They were involved in what to do about the residue from that." [87]
Moon-walker and Apollo 14 astronaut Edgar Mitchell has made various public statements about the reality of Roswell: "Make no mistake, Roswell happened. I've seen secret files which show the government knew about it — but decided not to tell the public. I wasn't convinced about the existence of aliens until I started talking to the military old-timers who were there at the time of Roswell. The more government documentation on aliens I was told about, the more convinced I became." [88] Mitchell has also spoken about bodies: "A few insiders know the truth . . . and are studying the bodies that have been discovered." Mitchell added that a cabal of insiders stopped briefing Presidents after Kennedy.[89]
http://en.wikipedia.org/w(...)Roswell_UFO_incident
"An educated citizenry is a vital requisite for our survival as a free people."
Vertaald:quote:Op woensdag 18 juli 2012 19:54 schreef Snapcount2 het volgende:
[..]
Nee, de 'null hypothesis' is dat er in Roswell niets bijzonders gebeurd is. Jullie roepen dat er een ruimteschip is neergestort waarin buitenaardse wezens zaten. 'Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence' en dat bewijs heb ik nog niet gezien.
"Ik wil of kan niet voor mezelf nadenken en wil dat alles me op een presenteerblaadje wordt aangereikt. Ik presenteer mezelf als wetenschappelijk maar ik verberg me eigenlijk achter de wetenschap zodat ik niet zelf hoef na te denken en me niet hoef te begeven in alu-hoedjes gebied want dat mag ik niet van mijn te grote ego".
Ik zeg alleen dat ik niet bereid al die getuigenverklaringen zo aan de kant te schuiven. Ik zeg niet dat er daadwerkelijk iets is neergestort in Roswell. Daar heb ik nog geen bewijs voor gezien.quote:Als er iemand is die zijn conclusie al vast heeft staan, dan ben jij dat.
"An educated citizenry is a vital requisite for our survival as a free people."
Maar zou het dan niet veel gemener gespeeld worden? 'Als je topsecret informatie lekt, dan krijgt een willekeurig familielid een ongelukje.' Zoiets..quote:
[..]
Ja dat risico loopt hij idd net zoals veel van die mensen in de Disclosure Project. Alleen als de overheid ingrijpt, dan geven ze toe dat hij de waarheid vertelt. Dat is het spelletje dat gespeeld wordt.
Nou gebeuren er in iedereens familie wel ongelukken, dus zoiets zou nauwelijks aantoonbaar zijn.
Dat schijnt ook wel gebeurd te zijn. Er zijn genoeg verhalen van intimidatie. Er zijn ook meer dan genoeg mensen waarschijnlijk die soortgelijke verhalen hebben als we zien bij de Disclosure Project alleen een enkeling heeft het lef om erover te praten.quote:
[..]
Maar zou het dan niet veel gemener gespeeld worden? 'Als je topsecret informatie lekt, dan krijgt een willekeurig familielid een ongelukje.' Zoiets..
Nou gebeuren er in iedereens familie wel ongelukken, dus zoiets zou nauwelijks aantoonbaar zijn.
En sommigen in de Disclosure Project praten nu omdat bepaalde files zijn vrijgegeven. Bijv. het verhaal van Milton Torres, hij praat omdat de file van deze encounter is vrijgegeven door de UK:
"An educated citizenry is a vital requisite for our survival as a free people."
Heel jammer dat je alleen maar kan discussieren door middel van persoonlijke aanvallen. Deze post zegt overigens meer over jou dan over mij.quote:
[..]
Vertaald:
"Ik wil of kan niet voor mezelf nadenken en wil dat alles me op een presenteerblaadje wordt aangereikt. Ik presenteer mezelf als wetenschappelijk maar ik verberg me eigenlijk achter de wetenschap zodat ik niet zelf hoef na te denken en me niet hoef te begeven in alu-hoedjes gebied want dat mag ik niet van mijn te grote ego".
Getuigenverklaringen zijn niets waard zonder aanvullend bewijs. Als je nog geen bewijs hebt gezien, waarom hecht je dan zoveel waarde aan de getuigenverklaringen?quote:[..]
Ik zeg alleen dat ik niet bereid al die getuigenverklaringen zo aan de kant te schuiven. Ik zeg niet dat er daadwerkelijk iets is neergestort in Roswell. Daar heb ik nog geen bewijs voor gezien.
[ Bericht 1% gewijzigd door Snapcount2 op 18-07-2012 20:19:30 ]
Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard. - H.L. Mencken
Sorry ik vind je gewoon irritant. Mijn geduld is helemaal op met skeptici zoals jij. Toen ik nog skeptisch was kwam ik niet in UFO topics om mijn verheven mening continu te ventileren. Ik weet inmiddels wat de positie is van de skeptici en dat vind ik prima, maar ik kan wel tienduizend keer mijn positie genuanceerd geven maar ik word toch keer op keer op keer in het hoekje van domme believer gedrukt. Ik ben gewoon doodmoe van continu maar weer hetzelfde herhalen.quote:
Heel jammer dat je alleen maar kan discussieren door middel van persoonlijke aanvallen.
Dat getuigenverklaringen niets waard zijn is jouw mening. Ik ben een mens en ik kan lichaamstaal lezen en mensen in de ogen kijken en naar de toon van hun stem luisteren om zodoende te bepalen of iemand als leugenaar op mij overkomt.quote:Getuigenverklaringen zijn niets waard zonder aanvullend bewijs. Als je nog geen bewijs hebt gezien, waarom hecht je dan zoveel waarde aan de getuigenverklaringen?
Deze "gave" van lichaamstaal lezen werkt heel goed voor mij in het dagelijks leven, dus waarom zou ik het niet toepassen op de verklaringen van mensen die iets ongelofelijks vertellen?
"An educated citizenry is a vital requisite for our survival as a free people."
er is contact met de sterrenstelsels van sirius en de pleiaden,,
zei hebben een bepaalde boodschap voor ons omdat ze willen dat wij ons in bewustzijn zullen verhogen de pleiaden zitten voornamelijk in de 9e dimensie en wij in de derde.. ze ervaren geen tijd en praten telepatisch met elkaar.
en als ik het over dimensies heb dan heb ik het over bewustzijns werkelijkheden.
dit is wat ze ons willen zeggen,,kijk het hele filmpje, zonder vooroordelen..
zei hebben een bepaalde boodschap voor ons omdat ze willen dat wij ons in bewustzijn zullen verhogen de pleiaden zitten voornamelijk in de 9e dimensie en wij in de derde.. ze ervaren geen tijd en praten telepatisch met elkaar.
en als ik het over dimensies heb dan heb ik het over bewustzijns werkelijkheden.
dit is wat ze ons willen zeggen,,kijk het hele filmpje, zonder vooroordelen..
ik vind het knap dat je nog steeds de moeite neemt om de debunkers te woord te staan.quote:
[..]
Sorry ik vind je gewoon irritant. Mijn geduld is helemaal op met skeptici zoals jij. Toen ik nog skeptisch was kwam ik niet in UFO topics om mijn verheven mening continu te ventileren. Ik weet inmiddels wat de positie is van de skeptici en dat vind ik prima, maar ik kan wel tienduizend keer mijn positie genuanceerd geven maar ik word toch keer op keer op keer in het hoekje van domme believer gedrukt. Ik ben gewoon doodmoe van continu maar weer hetzelfde herhalen.
[..]
Dat getuigenverklaringen niets waard zijn is jouw mening. Ik ben een mens en ik kan lichaamstaal lezen en mensen in de ogen kijken en naar de toon van hun stem luisteren om zodoende te bepalen of iemand als leugenaar op mij overkomt.
Deze "gave" van lichaamstaal lezen werkt heel goed voor mij in het dagelijks leven, dus waarom zou ik het niet toepassen op de verklaringen van mensen die iets ongelofelijks vertellen?
jaren geleden deed ik dat ook geregeld hier maar je schoot er niks van op omdat een aantal lieden toch niet willen begrijpen of zich er "echt" in willen verdiepen.
frustatie alom.
nu reageer ik nog sporadisch hier en volg het gebeuren nog wel een beetje via de betrouwbare Ufo kanalen .
denk trouwens dat deze lieden nog aardig op hun neus zullen kijken als de beerput helemaal open gaat.
Jammer dat je niet inhoudelijk op zaken in kan gaan die ik post zonder persoonlijk te worden. Ik weet niet hoe je erbij komt dat ik een 'verheven mening' hebt of jou een 'domme believer' zou vinden, maar zoals de waard is vertrouwt hij zijn gasten zullen we dan maar zeggen.quote:
[..]
Sorry ik vind je gewoon irritant. Mijn geduld is helemaal op met skeptici zoals jij. Toen ik nog skeptisch was kwam ik niet in UFO topics om mijn verheven mening continu te ventileren. Ik weet inmiddels wat de positie is van de skeptici en dat vind ik prima, maar ik kan wel tienduizend keer mijn positie genuanceerd geven maar ik word toch keer op keer op keer in het hoekje van domme believer gedrukt. Ik ben gewoon doodmoe van continu maar weer hetzelfde herhalen.
Ik ben blij voor je dat die gave heel goed voor je werkt in het dagelijks leven, maar dat ik vind getuigenverklaringen niets waard zijn verzin je ter plekke, getuigenverklaringen kunnen heel veel waard zijn mits de getuigenverklaringen leiden tot het vinden van fysiek bewijs. Maar tot op heden hebben we in het geval van het Roswell-incident alleen maar de getuigenverklaringen.quote:[..]
Dat getuigenverklaringen niets waard zijn is jouw mening. Ik ben een mens en ik kan lichaamstaal lezen en mensen in de ogen kijken en naar de toon van hun stem luisteren om zodoende te bepalen of iemand als leugenaar op mij overkomt.
Deze "gave" van lichaamstaal lezen werkt heel goed voor mij in het dagelijks leven, dus waarom zou ik het niet toepassen op de verklaringen van mensen die iets ongelofelijks vertellen?
Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard. - H.L. Mencken
dat komt omdat je de motieven niet weet waarom dit achter word gehouden en dat het uberhaupt wordt achtergehouden,,ik raad je aan zeitgeist te gaan kijken..quote:
[..]
Jammer dat je niet inhoudelijk op zaken in kan gaan die ik post zonder persoonlijk te worden. Ik weet niet hoe je erbij komt dat ik een 'verheven mening' hebt of jou een 'domme believer' zou vinden, maar zoals de waard is vertrouwt hij zijn gasten zullen we dan maar zeggen.
[..]
Ik ben blij voor je dat die gave heel goed voor je werkt in het dagelijks leven, maar dat ik vind getuigenverklaringen niets waard zijn verzin je ter plekke, getuigenverklaringen kunnen heel veel waard zijn mits de getuigenverklaringen leiden tot het vinden van fysiek bewijs. Maar tot op heden hebben we in het geval van het Roswell-incident alleen maar de getuigenverklaringen.
Bij mij is de koek nu ook bijna op hoor, ben dr ook helemaal klaar mee. Die frustratie die het met zich meebrengt is het niet meer waard.quote:
[..]
ik vind het knap dat je nog steeds de moeite neemt om de debunkers te woord te staan.
jaren geleden deed ik dat ook geregeld hier maar je schoot er niks van op omdat een aantal lieden toch niet willen begrijpen of zich er "echt" in willen verdiepen.
frustatie alom.
nu reageer ik nog sporadisch hier en volg het gebeuren nog wel een beetje via de betrouwbare Ufo kanalen .
denk trouwens dat deze lieden nog aardig op hun neus zullen kijken als de beerput helemaal open gaat.
Maar af en toe moeten we idd van ons laten horen om even een ander perspectief te geven dan dat van de debunkers.
En als de beerput open zou gaan.... dat zou echt smullen worden! Sommigen zullen dan schoorvoetend toegeven dat de alu-hoedjes toch gelijk hadden, anderen blijven bij hun standpunt dat ze altijd juist hebben gehandeld en de echt koppige mensen zullen blijven volhouden dat het allemaal onzin is.
Ik ben in ieder geval benieuwd wat de toekomst brengen gaat als het op dit onderwerp aankomt
"An educated citizenry is a vital requisite for our survival as a free people."
Het is idd belangrijk om het hele verhaal te kennen. Zaken die nogal belachelijk lijken mbt het UFO fenomeen, kunnen er ineens heel anders uitzien als je het hele plaatje overziet. Dat is iets dat ik zelf ook heb meegemaakt.quote:
[..]
dat komt omdat je de motieven niet weet waarom dit achter word gehouden en dat het uberhaupt wordt achtergehouden,,ik raad je aan zeitgeist te gaan kijken..
"An educated citizenry is a vital requisite for our survival as a free people."
idd wat je niet kent kun je ook niet weten..daarom is het zinloos om iemand te veroordelen om dat hij of zij simpelweg de kennis niet heeft en het daarom ziet vanuit een ander perspectief.quote:
[..]
Het is idd belangrijk om het hele verhaal te kennen. Zaken die nogal belachelijk lijken mbt het UFO fenomeen, kunnen er ineens heel anders uitzien als je het hele plaatje overziet. Dat is iets dat ik zelf ook heb meegemaakt.
Meen je dit echt?!quote:
het amerikaanse leger heeft/had bepaalde toestellen (onbemand)die 3 keer sneller gingen dan het licht
Whaaaat???? No money?
Ja maar het is wel belangrijk je te verdiepen in iemands perspectief. Ik ben eigenlijk ook altijd skeptisch geweest en vond het hele fenomeen een beetje onzinnig. Toen was er hier een user die zei dat hij ook altijd heeft getwijfeld maar dat de uitzending van de Disclosure Project zijn kijk heeft veranderd.quote:
[..]
idd wat je niet kent kun je ook niet weten..daarom is het zinloos om iemand te veroordelen om dat hij of zij simpelweg de kennis niet heeft en het daarom ziet vanuit een ander perspectief.
In plaats van toen in de verdediging te schieten dacht ik bij mezelf "interessant dat iemand op basis van 1 filmpje zijn mening zomaar kan herzien". Ik vond dat ik toen dat filmpje moest gaan kijken om te snappen waarom iemand van mening was veranderd.
En na de uitzending van de Disclosure Project was ik nog niet overtuigd en ik ben daarna niets anders gaan doen dan informatie verzamelen om meer te weten te komen van het fenomeen. En ik weet gewoon dat de meeste skeptici dat niet doen en dat is hetgene wat ik veroordeel.
"An educated citizenry is a vital requisite for our survival as a free people."
ik heb het fout geschreven het is ander half keer de lichtsnelheid omdat het ontwerp niet helemaal goed is en het is afhankelijk van de kracht van het magnetisch veld wat varieert, het kan dus nog veel sneller. en geloof het of niet maar deze technologie kwam van buiten aartsen met goede intensies maar dit is genegeerd, de brandstof is het elektromagnetisch veld dat de aardse sfeer polariseerd. er zijn er iets van 600. ze liggen voor de kust van de bahamas en chili in ondergrondse basissen.quote:
Op de overheden houden de info achter omdat de kennis van die energie de fossiele brandstoffen en het geld dat daarmee wordt verdient te niet zou doen,,omdat de kanditaten van regeringen met dit geld worden gefinancieerd, en die zelfde kanditaten komen soms zelf uit die grote concerns.
even over graancirkels,, sommige graancirkels komen van de regeringen, en sommige van buitenaardsen die boodschappen doorgeven van veranderingen die aanstaande zijn, zoals laatst wat een verandering aangaf in de zogenaamde kundalini energie.
ik moet er aan toevoegen dat sommige buitenaardsen van sirius toegang hebben tot technieken die helemaal geen tijd kosten, ze gebruiken de snelheid van het licht als een soort van katapult.
als buitenaardsen soms boodschappen komen doorgeven dan gebruiken ze soms niet eens voertuigen,,omdat in de hogere dimensies gedachten zoveel kracht hebben dat ze gewoon in gedachtevorm komen die een ruimteschip materialiseren net zoals gedachten hier op aarde ooit materie hebben gecreeerd..in de hogere dimensies is gedachte kracht anders dan hier op aarde waar de universele wet van oorzaak en gevolg/karma pas vertraagt plaats vind.
[ Bericht 24% gewijzigd door valandil25 op 19-07-2012 15:19:50 ]
En hier heb je een bron voor?quote:
[..]
ik heb het fout geschreven het is ander half keer de lichtsnelheid omdat het ontwerp niet helemaal goed is en het is afhankelijk van de kracht van het magnetisch veld wat varieert, het kan dus nog veel sneller. en geloof het of niet maar deze technologie kwam van buiten aartsen met goede intensies maar dit is genegeerd, de brandstof is het elektromagnetisch veld dat de aardse sfeer polariseerd. er zijn er iets van 600. ze liggen voor de kust van de bahamas en chili in ondergrondse basissen.
de overheden houden de info achter omdat de kennis van die energie de fossiele brandstoffen en het geld dat daarmee wordt verdient te niet zou doen,,omdat de kanditaten van regeringen met dit geld worden gefinancieerd, en die zelfde kanditaten komen soms zelf uit die grote concerns.
even over graancirkels,, sommige graancirkels komen van de regeringen, en sommige van buitenaardsen die boodschappen doorgeven van veranderingen die aanstaande zijn, zoals laatst wat een verandering aangaf in de zogenaamde kundalini energie.
ik moet er aan toevoegen dat sommige buitenaardsen van sirius toegang hebben tot technieken die helemaal geen tijd kosten, ze gebruiken de snelheid van het licht als een soort van katapult.
als buitenaardsen soms boodschappen komen doorgeven dan gebruiken ze soms niet eens voertuigen,,omdat in de hogere dimensies gedachten zoveel kracht hebben dat ze gewoon in gedachtevorm komen die een ruimteschip materialiseren net zoals gedachten hier op aarde ooit materie hebben gecreeerd..in de hogere dimensies is gedachte kracht anders dan hier op aarde waar de universele wet van oorzaak en gevolg/karma pas vertraagt plaats vind.
Nou ja, ik ben erg benieuwd. Ik kan ook een verhaaltje verzinnen over SDL reizen, maar als je het serieus meent kun je ook vertellen waar je de info vandaan hebt.
welke bron ik hier nu ook ga geven ik zelve, denk je echt dat er dan iemand hier gaat zeggen, JA nu geloof ik je..mensen die ook alle getuigenverklaringen van andere mensen in de wind slaan, inclusief piloten en ex cia personen die er geen geld aan verdiend hebben.quote:
Nou ja, ik ben erg benieuwd. Ik kan ook een verhaaltje verzinnen over SDL reizen, maar als je het serieus meent kun je ook vertellen waar je de info vandaan hebt.
alle info die ik geef over buitenaardsen kan pas echt begrepen worden, als de oude gedachten over onszelf en hun verdwijnen. en het niet meer geridiculiseerd word maar als kennis wordt beschouwt.
wij zijn zelf namelijk multidimensionale wezens(je hogere zelf) maar zitten pas in de 3e dimensie, van dit universum. zij zitten zelf in de 9e.,dimensies zijn bewustzijnswerkelijkheden, en hoe hoger de dimensie hoe hoger het bewustzijn, en hoe dichter bij energie in ruste, daar wij energie in beweging zijn.
[ Bericht 1% gewijzigd door valandil25 op 19-07-2012 23:44:42 ]
ps: naast je materiele lichaam heb je ook een lichtlichaam, dit is je bewustzijn en dat is multidimensionaal, dit is niet te zien met het oog, omdat de trillingsfreqeuntie ervan hoger is dan die van materie.
naast dat materiele vormen als mensen en dieren onderhevig zijn aan de evolutie, is je bewustzijn dat ook, maar dan meer door middel van ervaringen die je opdoet en waarvan je leert, dit verschilt eigenlijk niet zoveel van het dierenrijk.
[ Bericht 71% gewijzigd door valandil25 op 19-07-2012 23:48:02 ]
naast dat materiele vormen als mensen en dieren onderhevig zijn aan de evolutie, is je bewustzijn dat ook, maar dan meer door middel van ervaringen die je opdoet en waarvan je leert, dit verschilt eigenlijk niet zoveel van het dierenrijk.
[ Bericht 71% gewijzigd door valandil25 op 19-07-2012 23:48:02 ]
Ik kan me nog een 4e dimensie (tijd) voorstellen, maar 9? Pfff.....als er al 9 dimensies zijn, wat voor levens(zijn)doel heb je dan nog?
“To destroy a people you must first sever their roots.”
je leert dan dingen van universele wetten en wat je er mee kunt aan bijvoorbeeld ons, als wij namelijk in de 5e dimensie komen worden we bijgestaan door bewustzijnsvormen van de pleiaden.quote:
Ik kan me nog een 4e dimensie (tijd) voorstellen, maar 9? Pfff.....als er al 9 dimensies zijn, wat voor levens(zijn)doel heb je dan nog?
het menselijk dna is ontworpen als iets dat niet per se materie hoeft te zijn maar door evalueert naar vormen met een veel hogere trilling dan materie.
de dimensies lopen tot de 12e dimensie.
Ah, dus als ik het goed begrijp is mijn aards zijn tijdelijk en leeft mijn bewustzijn door?quote:
[..]
je leert dan dingen van universele wetten en wat je er mee kunt aan bijvoorbeeld ons, als wij namelijk in de 5e dimensie komen worden we bijgestaan door bewustzijnsvormen van de pleiaden.
het menselijk dna is ontworpen als iets dat niet per se materie hoeft te zijn maar door evalueert naar vormen met een veel hogere trilling dan materie.
de dimensies lopen tot de 12e dimensie.
“To destroy a people you must first sever their roots.”
