NWS Nieuws & Achtergronden
Discussieer hier diepgaander over de actualiteiten.
Oh ja, heb ik ook eens gezien in Griekenland. Ik vind zulke kinderen fucking eng manquote:Op dinsdag 22 oktober 2013 09:37 schreef SteveBudin het volgende:
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Paar keer dat soort kinderen in actie gezien. Het maakt niet uit wat je doet. Als je geld geeft (wat ik nooit zal doen) dan gaat het naar een dikke crimineel in een kapitale villa en indirect hou je dan het systeem in stand. Als niemand wat geeft slaat diezelfde dikke zigeuner dat kind verrot omdat hij niet aan zijn dagquotum is gekomen.
, ik zag een meisje van ongeveer 12/13 jaar die flirtend/seksueel-achtig deed bij een toerist. Een oudere man ook echt. Snap echt niet hoe dat soort kinderen worden opgevoed.
De kinderen zijn niet eng, de mensen die ze ''opvoeden'' zijn eng.quote:
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Oh ja, heb ik ook eens gezien in Griekenland. Ik vind zulke kinderen fucking eng man
In Thailand is dit normaal hoor...quote:
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Oh ja, heb ik ook eens gezien in Griekenland. Ik vind zulke kinderen fucking eng man
Waarom? Of lul je maar wat? Kan het mij niet voorstellen namelijk. Er zijn zoveel van dat soort kinderen met zo'n standaard blond blank uiterlijk. Kinderen met krulletjes zijn veel schattiger.quote:
zulke kinderen (lichte ogen huid en haar) zijn tonnen geld waard
Ubermenschen....quote:
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Waarom? Of lul je maar wat? Kan het mij niet voorstellen namelijk. Er zijn zoveel van dat soort kinderen met zo'n standaard blond blank uiterlijk. Kinderen met krulletjes zijn veel schattiger.
Ik vind ze wel eng, dan ben je nog maar 12 jaar en bespring je iedere man voor letterlijk 50 cent. Bovendien zijn die mensen ook best opdringerig.quote:
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De kinderen zijn niet eng, de mensen die ze ''opvoeden'' zijn eng.
Ja zekerquote:
Op 
, maar ik denk dat alle kinderen wel veel waard zijn als je het hebt over kinderhandel. Of een kind nou blond of bruin is.
Ben jij wel een man eigenlijk?quote:
Ik kan de afkomst van dat kind niet plaatsen. Heeft ook niet bepaald de gelaatsuitdrukkingen/kenmerken van een Nederlands, Duits of Belgisch kind, zoveel is zeker.
Waarom?quote:
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Ben jij wel een man eigenlijk?
Die kinderen worden daartoe gedwongen of begrijp je dat niet?quote:
[quote]Ik vind ze wel eng, dan ben je nog maar 12 jaar en bespring je iedere man voor letterlijk 50 cent. Bovendien zijn die mensen ook best opdringerig.
Dat bedelen doen ze ook niet uit zichzelf, die kinderen zijn ''het bezit'' van iemand, want
soms zijn het niet eens de ouders, het zijn net circusdieren, tenminste zo worden ze behandeld.
Luister naar de video hoe het meisje er aan toe was toen ze gevonden werd.
Dat is logisch, het punt is dat die kinderen op een gegeven moment net zo worden omdat ze niet beter weten. En daarom vind ik ze eng.quote:
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Die kinderen worden daartoe gedwongen of begrijp je dat niet?
Dat bedelen doen ze ook niet uit zichzelf, die kinderen zijn ''het bezit'' van iemand, want
soms zijn het niet eens de ouders, het zijn net circusdieren, tenminste zo worden ze behandeld.
Luister naar de video hoe het meisje er aan toe was toen ze gevonden werd.
Ik vind het nog aparter dat daar 14 kinderen leven, de moeder 6 kinderen heeft gekregen in 10 maanden (haha
) en dus meerdere kinderen niet van deze mensen zijn en dat er dan alleen drama wordt gemaakt om een blond meisje. Al deze kinderen leven dus in een kut omgeving en meerdere kinderen zijn niet van deze mensen.
Ja wat er met die andere kinderen gaat gebeuren is mij ook nog niet helemaal duidelijk, misschienquote:
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Dat is logisch, het punt is dat die kinderen op een gegeven moment net zo worden omdat ze niet beter weten. En daarom vind ik ze eng.
Ik vind het nog aparter dat daar 14 kinderen leven, de moeder 6 kinderen heeft gekregen in 10 maanden (haha
zijn ze dat nog aan het uitzoeken.
laatste nieuws...
http://www.ekathimerini.c(...)_1_21/10/2013_524167
Mijn oma waarschuwde ons vroeger altijd al voor Roma's, ze woonde vroeger in een dorp in Tsjechoslowakije waar de Roma's toen al regelmatig kinderen kwamen halen naast paarden, geiten, ezels, geld, sieraden, gereedschap en voedsel. Ze is teruggekomen naar Nederland omdat ze te bang was om daar te blijven nadat ze had opgevangen dat de Roma daar in de gaten hielden of ze al een baby had gebaard.
Om overigens toch een antwoord op je vraag te geven: ja.quote:
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Ben jij wel een man eigenlijk?
Die 14 kinderen waren toch merendeel alleen op papier?quote:
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Dat is logisch, het punt is dat die kinderen op een gegeven moment net zo worden omdat ze niet beter weten. En daarom vind ik ze eng.
Ik vind het nog aparter dat daar 14 kinderen leven, de moeder 6 kinderen heeft gekregen in 10 maanden (haha
Zouden die zigeuners ook kindjes overkopen als ik er een paar in de aanbieding doe?
"For the man sound of body and serene of mind, there is no such thing as bad weather; Every day has its beauty. And storms which whip the blood, do make it pulse more vigorously."
'Ik heb mijn vrouw verteld dat ik Maria niet in ons huis wilde, het was alsof we een bom in huis haalden'. Dat stelt Christos Salis, de 39-jarige Roma-zigeuner die samen met zijn vrouw Eleftherina Dimopoulou (40) beschuldigd wordt van ontvoering van het meisje Maria, volgens de Daily Mail. De 'blonde engel' werd vorige week aangetroffen in een Roma-kamp in Griekenland.
Het koppel dat zich uitgaf voor de ouders bleek genetisch niet verwant met het meisje. Kennissen van het Roma-koppel suggereren dat Salis en Dimopoulou het kind kochten voor 1.000 euro. De internationale politieorganisatie Interpol laat weten dat het meisje niet gelinkt kan worden aan één van de vermiste kinderen in hun database.
Salis probeert de schuld in de schoenen van zijn vrouw te schuiven. De twee werden gisteren officieel in beschuldiging gesteld van kidnapping en schriftvervalsing.
Volgens de voorzitter van de ngo Lach van een Kind, die Maria opvangt, werd het meisje ingezet als 'een dansende beer' om geld te verdienen. Dat lijkt bevestigd te worden door twee video's waarop te zien is hoe het meisje in het openbaar danst. Volgens omwonenden werd Maria twee weken geleden nog gezien terwijl ze bedelde op een marktplein. Volgens een ooggetuige vroeg ze mensen om geld, in haar eentje maar ook in het bijzijn van Dimopoulou.
Zakgeld
Nikos Paiteris, woordvoerder van de Roma in Griekenland, verklaart: 'Ik denk dat het kind aan het koppel werd geschonken en dat ze er misschien een beetje zakgeld voor betaalden. We geloven niet dat het om een ontvoering gaat'.
Salis en Dimopoulou houden vol dat ze het kind niet ontvoerden. De man probeerde op borgtocht vrij te komen om de Bulgaarse vrouw op te sporen die Maria voor adoptie zou hebben afgestaan toen het kind nog een baby was. Dat werd hem geweigerd. Bij gebrek aan bewijzen werd het koppel niet in beschuldiging van kinderhandel gesteld.
Niet volgens het boekje
De ondervragingen vonden achter gesloten deuren plaats, maar de Daily Mail citeert een bron die stelt dat Salis de schuld op zijn vrouw probeert af te schuiven. 'Hij verklaarde dat hij in 2009 enkele dagen van huis weg was toen hij een telefoontje kreeg van zijn vrouw, die zei dat er een Bulgaars koppel was dat van hun kind af wou. Hij zei toen dat hij geen kind wilde, omdat hij geen bom in zijn huis wilde'.
Salis verklaarde echter dat hij de man kent die de overdracht van het kind 'onderhandelde'. Zijn advocaat stelt: 'Het was een adoptie die niet helemaal volgens het boekje verliep maar waarvoor de moeder wel haar toestemming gaf'.
http://www.ad.nl/ad/nl/10(...)n-als-een-beer.dhtml
Het koppel dat zich uitgaf voor de ouders bleek genetisch niet verwant met het meisje. Kennissen van het Roma-koppel suggereren dat Salis en Dimopoulou het kind kochten voor 1.000 euro. De internationale politieorganisatie Interpol laat weten dat het meisje niet gelinkt kan worden aan één van de vermiste kinderen in hun database.
Salis probeert de schuld in de schoenen van zijn vrouw te schuiven. De twee werden gisteren officieel in beschuldiging gesteld van kidnapping en schriftvervalsing.
Volgens de voorzitter van de ngo Lach van een Kind, die Maria opvangt, werd het meisje ingezet als 'een dansende beer' om geld te verdienen. Dat lijkt bevestigd te worden door twee video's waarop te zien is hoe het meisje in het openbaar danst. Volgens omwonenden werd Maria twee weken geleden nog gezien terwijl ze bedelde op een marktplein. Volgens een ooggetuige vroeg ze mensen om geld, in haar eentje maar ook in het bijzijn van Dimopoulou.
Zakgeld
Nikos Paiteris, woordvoerder van de Roma in Griekenland, verklaart: 'Ik denk dat het kind aan het koppel werd geschonken en dat ze er misschien een beetje zakgeld voor betaalden. We geloven niet dat het om een ontvoering gaat'.
Salis en Dimopoulou houden vol dat ze het kind niet ontvoerden. De man probeerde op borgtocht vrij te komen om de Bulgaarse vrouw op te sporen die Maria voor adoptie zou hebben afgestaan toen het kind nog een baby was. Dat werd hem geweigerd. Bij gebrek aan bewijzen werd het koppel niet in beschuldiging van kinderhandel gesteld.
Niet volgens het boekje
De ondervragingen vonden achter gesloten deuren plaats, maar de Daily Mail citeert een bron die stelt dat Salis de schuld op zijn vrouw probeert af te schuiven. 'Hij verklaarde dat hij in 2009 enkele dagen van huis weg was toen hij een telefoontje kreeg van zijn vrouw, die zei dat er een Bulgaars koppel was dat van hun kind af wou. Hij zei toen dat hij geen kind wilde, omdat hij geen bom in zijn huis wilde'.
Salis verklaarde echter dat hij de man kent die de overdracht van het kind 'onderhandelde'. Zijn advocaat stelt: 'Het was een adoptie die niet helemaal volgens het boekje verliep maar waarvoor de moeder wel haar toestemming gaf'.
http://www.ad.nl/ad/nl/10(...)n-als-een-beer.dhtml
Ik noem een Tony van Heemschut,een Loeki Knol,een Brammetje Biesterveld en natuurlijk een Japie Stobbe !
Dat blonde meisje daar in het kamp was natuurlijk verdacht, anders was het misschien niet eensquote:
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Die 14 kinderen waren toch merendeel alleen op papier?
opgevallen, bedelende kinderen in Griekenland is namelijk ook niet zeldzaam.
Als er nog meer kinderen zijn waarvan bewezen kan worden dat ze niet het kind van de ouders zijn,
dan zullen ze wel naar dit, of een soortgelijk opvangtehuis gaan en dan hopen dat ze geadopteerd worden.
http://www.ekathimerini.c(...)_1_22/10/2013_524153
The bigger picture
During this period when few could have missed the pictures in the media of a young girl found living with a couple who were not her parents at a Roma camp in Farsala, striking fear into our hearts about the weaknesses of a system that cannot provide protection even for children, maybe we should also be concerned about the entire spectrum of organizations that are tasked with the protection of minors.
Maybe we need to spend some time looking not just at The Smile of the Child, the nonprofit organization that is currently caring for the young girl found in Farsala, but also at state-run agencies for the protection of minors that receive neither support from individuals and sponsors nor from EU structural funds.
Let’s start our inquiries into the state of such organizations at Kaminia, a suburb of Piraeus. There, in one of the most run-down parts of the district near Thivon Avenue, a 1,200 square meter building is home to the Piraeus Shelter for Minors, where the housing conditions of abused children is at least several decades out of date.
The kitchen and dining area are located in the basement, with little in the way of natural light. A television, a few worn couches and tables and wooden chairs from a cafe compose the furnishings of the recreational room for these children, children who grew up in abusive families or with parents who were drug addicts.
For these youngsters, who have already had a tough time of it, even the playground hides dangers. Overgrown with nettles and other weeds, it is almost impossible to reach the area. Even the goalposts in an area where the kids play soccer are dangerously rusty.
Transporting the children to and from school every day is a task that has fallen on the shoulders of the home’s workers, most of whom are not trained as educators and, more importantly, have no formal training for a job that requires such sensitivity and carries so many responsibilities. Recently, five public sector office workers were transferred as part of the civil service mobility scheme to the Kaminia facility to supervise the children. They were given no training and no time to learn the job.
“We have absolutely no training to work under such conditions and we cannot maintain the kind of distanced stance that is necessary,” one of these employees told Kathimerini recently. “The emotional burden is unmanageable.”
The children at the shelter live in hope of being taken in by a foster family, though this rarely lasts long as such arrangements tend to be for short periods. Meanwhile, the director of the shelter is due to retire in the summer and as no one is slated to replace her, the shelter will simply be closed down. And when that happens, we will once again express our surprise at the problems faced by the institutions whose job it is to protect children.
Door dat gezemel over de blonde engel moet ik steeds aan The Marathon Man denken.quote:
'
http://www.ad.nl/ad/nl/10(...)n-als-een-beer.dhtml
Curiosity cultured the cat
Hoge dames vangen veel wind
Whadda ya hear! Whadda ya say!
What is any ocean but a multitude of drops?
Hoge dames vangen veel wind
Whadda ya hear! Whadda ya say!
What is any ocean but a multitude of drops?
http://www.ekathimerini.c(...)_1_22/10/2013_524230
'Maria' not on Interpol's list of missing children, Greek Police says
The young girl found living with a couple who are not her biological parents in a Roma camp in central Greece last week is not on Interpol's list of missing children, the Greek Police told Skai on Tuesday.
The child, who is aged between 5 and 6 and has come to be known as "Maria," is not on the international agency's list of 610 missing children, DNA findings have confirmed.
The finding has led local authorities to believe that the most likely scenario is that Maria ended up at the Roma camp in Farsala, central Greece, following a crackdown on illegal adoptions in neighboring Bulgaria in the 2008-2010 period.
The Roma couple charged with Maria's abduction have insisted that the child was left in their care by a Bulgarian Roma couple, which local authorities are now trying to trace.
The discovery of the blonde, blue-eyed girl at the Roma camp in Farsala has triggered an international search for her biological parents, with The Smile of the Child - which is caring for Maria - and local authorities receiving thousands of telephone calls from parents around the world looking for their missing children.
Responding to concerns from rights groups that the Maria incident may lead to discrimination against the country's Roma, Greek Police spokesman Christos Parthenis told Skai on Tuesday that recent raids on Roma camps across Greece are part of a general crackdown on crime.
"The police's operations are in no way targeting specific individuals or social groups, but are part of an effort to prevent and quell crime in particular areas, including Roma camps," Parthenis said.
'Maria' not on Interpol's list of missing children, Greek Police says
The young girl found living with a couple who are not her biological parents in a Roma camp in central Greece last week is not on Interpol's list of missing children, the Greek Police told Skai on Tuesday.
The child, who is aged between 5 and 6 and has come to be known as "Maria," is not on the international agency's list of 610 missing children, DNA findings have confirmed.
The finding has led local authorities to believe that the most likely scenario is that Maria ended up at the Roma camp in Farsala, central Greece, following a crackdown on illegal adoptions in neighboring Bulgaria in the 2008-2010 period.
The Roma couple charged with Maria's abduction have insisted that the child was left in their care by a Bulgarian Roma couple, which local authorities are now trying to trace.
The discovery of the blonde, blue-eyed girl at the Roma camp in Farsala has triggered an international search for her biological parents, with The Smile of the Child - which is caring for Maria - and local authorities receiving thousands of telephone calls from parents around the world looking for their missing children.
Responding to concerns from rights groups that the Maria incident may lead to discrimination against the country's Roma, Greek Police spokesman Christos Parthenis told Skai on Tuesday that recent raids on Roma camps across Greece are part of a general crackdown on crime.
"The police's operations are in no way targeting specific individuals or social groups, but are part of an effort to prevent and quell crime in particular areas, including Roma camps," Parthenis said.
dublin - De Ierse politie heeft een 7-jarig blond meisje weggehaald bij een Romagezin in Dublin. De zaak toont opvallende gelijkenissen met die in Griekenland, waar vorige in een Romakamp bij Farsala een meisje met blond haar en blauwe ogen is gevonden.
De politie in Dublin kwam het meisje op het spoor dankzij een tip van iemand die het opvallend vond dat het uiterlijk van het kind in niets leek op dat van de rest van de zigeunerfamilie. De zelfverklaarde ouders konden geen geldig geboortebewijs tonen, waarna agenten het meisje hebben overgedragen aan jeugdzorg. Het echtpaar houdt wel vol de biologische ouders te zijn. Dna-onderzoek moet nu uitsluitsel geven. Er is nog niemand aangehouden.
De Griekse autoriteiten proberen ondertussen te achterhalen waar het blonde meisje vandaan komt dat vorige week bij Farsala werd gevonden. Maria, of de blonde engel zoals ze wordt genoemd, moet ongeveer 5 of 6 jaar zijn. Het Roma-stel bij wie ze werd gevonden is aangehouden en door justitie aangeklaagd voor ontvoering. Het echtpaar beweert dat het meisje door haar moeder aan hen is gegeven, omdat ze niet meer voor haar kon zorgen.
De politie in Dublin kwam het meisje op het spoor dankzij een tip van iemand die het opvallend vond dat het uiterlijk van het kind in niets leek op dat van de rest van de zigeunerfamilie. De zelfverklaarde ouders konden geen geldig geboortebewijs tonen, waarna agenten het meisje hebben overgedragen aan jeugdzorg. Het echtpaar houdt wel vol de biologische ouders te zijn. Dna-onderzoek moet nu uitsluitsel geven. Er is nog niemand aangehouden.
De Griekse autoriteiten proberen ondertussen te achterhalen waar het blonde meisje vandaan komt dat vorige week bij Farsala werd gevonden. Maria, of de blonde engel zoals ze wordt genoemd, moet ongeveer 5 of 6 jaar zijn. Het Roma-stel bij wie ze werd gevonden is aangehouden en door justitie aangeklaagd voor ontvoering. Het echtpaar beweert dat het meisje door haar moeder aan hen is gegeven, omdat ze niet meer voor haar kon zorgen.
Ik noem een Tony van Heemschut,een Loeki Knol,een Brammetje Biesterveld en natuurlijk een Japie Stobbe !
Ben benieuwd of ze de ouders van dat meisje nog gaan terugvinden. Ik geloof niet dat ze ontvoerd is, dan was dat wel bekend bij Interpol. Ze zal verkocht zijn.
Hoe slecht moeten de biologische ouders het wel niet hebben dan dat ze tot zoiets in staat zijn...
Hoe slecht moeten de biologische ouders het wel niet hebben dan dat ze tot zoiets in staat zijn...
Filmpje.. Het meisje is ondertussen ondergebracht in het opvangcentrum van The Smile of the Child.
Ze werd toevallig ontdekt in het zigeunerkamp omdat ze zo blond is, de politie was daar vanwege
een onderzoek naar drugs.
http://www.usatoday.com/s(...)-roma-gypsy/3142559/
Greek authorities are asking for help in identifying a young girl found in a raid on a Roma camp last week.
ATHENS — An unknown little blond girl found living in a Roma camp with a couple who are not her parents has opened an international hunt for her real mother and father and sparked age-old anger against the Roma who are among the poorest people in Europe.
Police in Greece have released photographs of a couple charged with abducting a girl known "Maria" and taken them into pre-trial custody.
An international search for the young girl's parents has intensified.
A 39-year-old man and a 40-year-old woman, identified as Christos Salis and Eleftheria Dimopoulou, were detained Monday on charges of abduction and document fraud following their arrest last week. Police raided a Roma encampment near the central Greek town of Farsala and found the girl, who a DNA test has shown is not the couple's child.
"This story shocked me," said Vassilis Sarantidis, 37, a civil engineer in Athens. "We all see on the streets how the Roma use their children — they hit them, they force them to beg. They must all be investigated."
But the couple insists they were given the child by a destitute mother and some people are warning Greeks not to give in to bigotry over a child whose story is being sensationalized in the press.
"The allegation that Roma steal children is a long-lasting myth about the Roma minority," said Andreas Hieronymus, a researcher at the European Network Against Racism based in Hamburg, Germany.
The case has triggered a global outpouring of sympathy and possible tips to police about the case but no breakthrough yet in identifying the child.
Thousands of people have called the Smile of the Child charitable group that has been caring for the girl, named Maria, to ask about her welfare and give tips on who she may be. She remains unidentified, and the group said a dental exam indicates she is 4 to 6 years old.
She was found during a police raid on a Roma, or Gypsy, settlement near Farsala in central Greece, where many residents try to make a living selling fruits, blankets, baskets and shoes. Police were looking for suspects for gun-running, drug dealing and other crimes.
The couple claimed they were the girl's biological parents, but because her appearance was so different from the adults, the girl was given a DNA test that confirmed she did not belong to them.
The couple appeared Monday before an investigating judge in Larissa to face criminal charges of child abduction, which carries a maximum 10-year prison sentence.
Christos Salis, 39, who is charged with charged with abducting a little girl found living with him and a companion in a Gypsy settlement.(Photo: Greek police via AP)
Both denied the charges. They say they adopted the child when she was just days old and were motivated by charity, after being approached by an intermediary for a destitute foreign mother who reportedly could not afford to raise the child, Greek newspapers reported their lawyer as saying.
Police allege the woman said she gave birth to six children in less than 10 months, while 10 of the 14 children the couple had registered as their own were not found. Investigators said it is unclear whether all the children exist or were falsified to qualify for child care payments from the Greek welfare system.
Police say the two suspects received about $3,420 a month in subsidies from three different cities where they had registered the children.
The couple has been charged with illegally obtaining official documents such as birth records. The man also faces separate charges, together with other people from the settlement, for allegedly possessing an illegal firearm and drug-related offenses.
Greek police have also sought assistance from Interpol, the international police agency, which has 38 girls younger than 6 on its missing persons database. None of them, however, fit the girl's description and the agency only receives cases when member governments seek its help.
Eleftheria Dimopoulou, 40, is seen in the Larisa regional police headquarters, Greece. Dimopoulou and her companion have been charged with abducting a little girl found living with them in a Gypsy settlement.(Photo: Greek police via AP)
Meanwhile, several Greek media outlets reported that police believe her real parents might be a Bulgarian couple that worked in the area.
Smile of the Child, the child welfare agency caring for the girl, said that Maria is finding it hard to communicate because she speaks mostly Roma but she has told a psychologist taking care of her that she is happy, according to the Greek news website, Kathimerini.
The head of the agency, Constantinos Yiannopoulos, said the girl has not asked to see any member of the family she previously lived with.
"In contrast to the first day, when she was in a state of shock, little Maria is now feeling absolutely calm," Yiannopoulos said. "She felt our support and warmth and it's significant that she is in an environment that is clean."
But some worry that the incident will be used to stigmatize and harass Romas, a people with their own language who live primarily in Central and Eastern Europe.
Hieronymus said Europeans feel free to complain about Roma and promote stereotypes about them. And as economic conditions worsen, so too do attitudes toward the group, he said. Greece is in its fifth year of recession and unemployment has almost hit 30%, and most Roma are on Greece's welfare system.
Amnesty International has detailed "massive discrimination" against Roma in housing, education and other areas, in a report on its website. In Greece, more than 80% of Roma are illiterate, according to Greece media reports.
Public-opinion polling in the EU shows that anti-Roma sentiments are persistent. A survey in the Czech Republic earlier this year found that one-third of 12-to-15-year-olds said they would never be friends with a Roma.
The exact origins of the Roma are not certain; linguistic evidence suggests they originated from the Rajasthanis, an ethnic group that arrived from India after the 11th century.
The Roma are also often used as to describe traditionally migrant groups such as Gypsies and travelers who are not well-integrated into their societies. They have been stereotyped often in film and hundreds of thousands of Gypsies were rounded up by Nazi Germany and killed in World War II.
Statistics show that the Roma do much worse than the general European population on a variety of health, educational and economic indicators. A 2012 survey by the European Union Advocacy for Fundamental Rights said more than 80% of Roma in the EU live in households at risk of poverty. While 70% of EU citizens have completed higher level secondary education, only 15% of Roma had, according to the group.
Some Roma communities have been accused of involvement in criminal enterprises. In France, 27 Roma who came from Croatia went on trial in September on charges they enlisted their wives and children, some as young as age 10, to carry out burglaries across Europe.
A lack of modern labor skills and need for public assistance have made Roma increasingly unwelcome in countries of which they are not citizens.
France has been evicting Roma from the country regularly in recent months and is trying to stop them from crossing the border into the country. Last week a Roma girl was pulled off a school bus to be deported with her family back to Kosovo.
Matthias Reichelt, a Berlin-based journalist and curator who has worked on Roma issues, said that certain stereotypes are deeply ingrained in the European idea of who the Roma are.
"The problem is that anytime there is a case where Roma are involved, the case gets (ethnically loaded)," he said. "The preoccupation in the case of Roma means poverty, begging, slums, dirt, a lack of education and crime."
Reichelt said that the progress other minority groups have made in terms of their public perception seems not to have reached the Roma.
"But with respect to the prejudices and preoccupations concerning Roma we still have to learn the lesson," he said.
Some Greeks say the discrimination is justified.
"After what transpired with the kidnapping of Maria if you are not a racist sometimes you want to be a racist," said Chara Kokkinopoulou, 21, a university student in Athens. "These people do not have feelings and they do anything for money."
But some of the Roma in Greece are worried that they will be blamed for allegations they say they knew nothing about.
The case "doesn't reflect on all of us," said Babis Dimitriou, president of the local Roma community.
Ze werd toevallig ontdekt in het zigeunerkamp omdat ze zo blond is, de politie was daar vanwege
een onderzoek naar drugs.
http://www.usatoday.com/s(...)-roma-gypsy/3142559/
Greek authorities are asking for help in identifying a young girl found in a raid on a Roma camp last week.
ATHENS — An unknown little blond girl found living in a Roma camp with a couple who are not her parents has opened an international hunt for her real mother and father and sparked age-old anger against the Roma who are among the poorest people in Europe.
Police in Greece have released photographs of a couple charged with abducting a girl known "Maria" and taken them into pre-trial custody.
An international search for the young girl's parents has intensified.
A 39-year-old man and a 40-year-old woman, identified as Christos Salis and Eleftheria Dimopoulou, were detained Monday on charges of abduction and document fraud following their arrest last week. Police raided a Roma encampment near the central Greek town of Farsala and found the girl, who a DNA test has shown is not the couple's child.
"This story shocked me," said Vassilis Sarantidis, 37, a civil engineer in Athens. "We all see on the streets how the Roma use their children — they hit them, they force them to beg. They must all be investigated."
But the couple insists they were given the child by a destitute mother and some people are warning Greeks not to give in to bigotry over a child whose story is being sensationalized in the press.
"The allegation that Roma steal children is a long-lasting myth about the Roma minority," said Andreas Hieronymus, a researcher at the European Network Against Racism based in Hamburg, Germany.
The case has triggered a global outpouring of sympathy and possible tips to police about the case but no breakthrough yet in identifying the child.
Thousands of people have called the Smile of the Child charitable group that has been caring for the girl, named Maria, to ask about her welfare and give tips on who she may be. She remains unidentified, and the group said a dental exam indicates she is 4 to 6 years old.
She was found during a police raid on a Roma, or Gypsy, settlement near Farsala in central Greece, where many residents try to make a living selling fruits, blankets, baskets and shoes. Police were looking for suspects for gun-running, drug dealing and other crimes.
The couple claimed they were the girl's biological parents, but because her appearance was so different from the adults, the girl was given a DNA test that confirmed she did not belong to them.
The couple appeared Monday before an investigating judge in Larissa to face criminal charges of child abduction, which carries a maximum 10-year prison sentence.
Christos Salis, 39, who is charged with charged with abducting a little girl found living with him and a companion in a Gypsy settlement.(Photo: Greek police via AP)
Both denied the charges. They say they adopted the child when she was just days old and were motivated by charity, after being approached by an intermediary for a destitute foreign mother who reportedly could not afford to raise the child, Greek newspapers reported their lawyer as saying.
Police allege the woman said she gave birth to six children in less than 10 months, while 10 of the 14 children the couple had registered as their own were not found. Investigators said it is unclear whether all the children exist or were falsified to qualify for child care payments from the Greek welfare system.
Police say the two suspects received about $3,420 a month in subsidies from three different cities where they had registered the children.
The couple has been charged with illegally obtaining official documents such as birth records. The man also faces separate charges, together with other people from the settlement, for allegedly possessing an illegal firearm and drug-related offenses.
Greek police have also sought assistance from Interpol, the international police agency, which has 38 girls younger than 6 on its missing persons database. None of them, however, fit the girl's description and the agency only receives cases when member governments seek its help.
Eleftheria Dimopoulou, 40, is seen in the Larisa regional police headquarters, Greece. Dimopoulou and her companion have been charged with abducting a little girl found living with them in a Gypsy settlement.(Photo: Greek police via AP)
Meanwhile, several Greek media outlets reported that police believe her real parents might be a Bulgarian couple that worked in the area.
Smile of the Child, the child welfare agency caring for the girl, said that Maria is finding it hard to communicate because she speaks mostly Roma but she has told a psychologist taking care of her that she is happy, according to the Greek news website, Kathimerini.
The head of the agency, Constantinos Yiannopoulos, said the girl has not asked to see any member of the family she previously lived with.
"In contrast to the first day, when she was in a state of shock, little Maria is now feeling absolutely calm," Yiannopoulos said. "She felt our support and warmth and it's significant that she is in an environment that is clean."
But some worry that the incident will be used to stigmatize and harass Romas, a people with their own language who live primarily in Central and Eastern Europe.
Hieronymus said Europeans feel free to complain about Roma and promote stereotypes about them. And as economic conditions worsen, so too do attitudes toward the group, he said. Greece is in its fifth year of recession and unemployment has almost hit 30%, and most Roma are on Greece's welfare system.
Amnesty International has detailed "massive discrimination" against Roma in housing, education and other areas, in a report on its website. In Greece, more than 80% of Roma are illiterate, according to Greece media reports.
Public-opinion polling in the EU shows that anti-Roma sentiments are persistent. A survey in the Czech Republic earlier this year found that one-third of 12-to-15-year-olds said they would never be friends with a Roma.
The exact origins of the Roma are not certain; linguistic evidence suggests they originated from the Rajasthanis, an ethnic group that arrived from India after the 11th century.
The Roma are also often used as to describe traditionally migrant groups such as Gypsies and travelers who are not well-integrated into their societies. They have been stereotyped often in film and hundreds of thousands of Gypsies were rounded up by Nazi Germany and killed in World War II.
Statistics show that the Roma do much worse than the general European population on a variety of health, educational and economic indicators. A 2012 survey by the European Union Advocacy for Fundamental Rights said more than 80% of Roma in the EU live in households at risk of poverty. While 70% of EU citizens have completed higher level secondary education, only 15% of Roma had, according to the group.
Some Roma communities have been accused of involvement in criminal enterprises. In France, 27 Roma who came from Croatia went on trial in September on charges they enlisted their wives and children, some as young as age 10, to carry out burglaries across Europe.
A lack of modern labor skills and need for public assistance have made Roma increasingly unwelcome in countries of which they are not citizens.
France has been evicting Roma from the country regularly in recent months and is trying to stop them from crossing the border into the country. Last week a Roma girl was pulled off a school bus to be deported with her family back to Kosovo.
Matthias Reichelt, a Berlin-based journalist and curator who has worked on Roma issues, said that certain stereotypes are deeply ingrained in the European idea of who the Roma are.
"The problem is that anytime there is a case where Roma are involved, the case gets (ethnically loaded)," he said. "The preoccupation in the case of Roma means poverty, begging, slums, dirt, a lack of education and crime."
Reichelt said that the progress other minority groups have made in terms of their public perception seems not to have reached the Roma.
"But with respect to the prejudices and preoccupations concerning Roma we still have to learn the lesson," he said.
Some Greeks say the discrimination is justified.
"After what transpired with the kidnapping of Maria if you are not a racist sometimes you want to be a racist," said Chara Kokkinopoulou, 21, a university student in Athens. "These people do not have feelings and they do anything for money."
But some of the Roma in Greece are worried that they will be blamed for allegations they say they knew nothing about.
The case "doesn't reflect on all of us," said Babis Dimitriou, president of the local Roma community.
Nog een filmpje...
Parents worldwide hoping girl found in Greece is theirs
John Bacon, USA TODAY 12:42 p.m. EDT October 22, 2013
Ten cases of missing children are "being taken very seriously" in connection with the suspected abduction of a girl by a gypsy, or "Roma," couple in Greece.
A Kansas City couple whose daughter disappeared from their home more than two years ago are among hopeful parents lining up to find out if a girl found in a gypsy camp in Greece is their daughter.
Lisa Irwin was 10 months old when Deborah Bradley and Jeremy Irwin say someone broke into their home and kidnapped Lisa. Now the family has made contact through the local FBI office, which contacted Greek authorities through governmental channels, John Picerno, the attorney for Deborah Bradley and Jeremy Irwin, told The Kansas City Star.
"We are waiting to hear back from law enforcement," Picerno said Tuesday.
About 10 cases of missing children are "being taken very seriously" in connection with the suspected abduction of a girl by a gypsy, or "Roma," couple in Greece, a spokesman for a Greek children's charity told CNN.
"They include children from the United States, Canada, Poland and France," said Panagiotis Pardalis of the Smile of the Child charity.
The unidentified girl, called Maria, was found during a drug-related raid by police last week. Authorities became suspicious because the girl was more fair than her parents. DNA tests showed she was not their biological child as they had claimed.
Eleftheria Dimopoulou, 40, and Christos Salis, 39, are accused of falsifying documents, and the hunt for the real parents is on.
In Kansas City, Picerno tells the Star that Lisa's parents are following every possible lead and have not given up hope of finding her.
Medical tests indicate that Maria is 5 or 6 years old, Paralis said. Lisa Irwin would turn 3 years old next month. Police say their investigation continues, but few tips are coming in, the Star says.
The Greek case has also led to the seizure of another Roma child, this one in Ireland.
The Irish Times reports that police went to a home in the west of Dublin to investigate a tip involving a child about 6 or 7 years old. Their concerns were deepened after the couple gave a date of birth for the child in early 2006 at Dublin's Coombe Hospital, which had no record of the birth.
The child was taken from the couple pending further investigation and DNA tests.
Parents worldwide hoping girl found in Greece is theirs
John Bacon, USA TODAY 12:42 p.m. EDT October 22, 2013
Ten cases of missing children are "being taken very seriously" in connection with the suspected abduction of a girl by a gypsy, or "Roma," couple in Greece.
A Kansas City couple whose daughter disappeared from their home more than two years ago are among hopeful parents lining up to find out if a girl found in a gypsy camp in Greece is their daughter.
Lisa Irwin was 10 months old when Deborah Bradley and Jeremy Irwin say someone broke into their home and kidnapped Lisa. Now the family has made contact through the local FBI office, which contacted Greek authorities through governmental channels, John Picerno, the attorney for Deborah Bradley and Jeremy Irwin, told The Kansas City Star.
"We are waiting to hear back from law enforcement," Picerno said Tuesday.
About 10 cases of missing children are "being taken very seriously" in connection with the suspected abduction of a girl by a gypsy, or "Roma," couple in Greece, a spokesman for a Greek children's charity told CNN.
"They include children from the United States, Canada, Poland and France," said Panagiotis Pardalis of the Smile of the Child charity.
The unidentified girl, called Maria, was found during a drug-related raid by police last week. Authorities became suspicious because the girl was more fair than her parents. DNA tests showed she was not their biological child as they had claimed.
Eleftheria Dimopoulou, 40, and Christos Salis, 39, are accused of falsifying documents, and the hunt for the real parents is on.
In Kansas City, Picerno tells the Star that Lisa's parents are following every possible lead and have not given up hope of finding her.
Medical tests indicate that Maria is 5 or 6 years old, Paralis said. Lisa Irwin would turn 3 years old next month. Police say their investigation continues, but few tips are coming in, the Star says.
The Greek case has also led to the seizure of another Roma child, this one in Ireland.
The Irish Times reports that police went to a home in the west of Dublin to investigate a tip involving a child about 6 or 7 years old. Their concerns were deepened after the couple gave a date of birth for the child in early 2006 at Dublin's Coombe Hospital, which had no record of the birth.
The child was taken from the couple pending further investigation and DNA tests.
http://www.kansascity.com(...)s-contact-greek.html
Baby Lisa’s parents contact Greek police about girl found in Roma settlement
October 22
BY ROBERT A. CRONKLETON
The Kansas City Star
Baby Lisa’s parents have asked Greek police to see if their daughter could possibly be the girl who was found in a Roma encampment in central Greece.
The local attorney for Deborah Bradley and Jeremy Irwin of Kansas City, North, said Tuesday that they have contacted authorities in hopes that their daughter is the girl known as Maria.
The family made contact through the local FBI office, which contacted Greek authorities through governmental channels, said John Picerno, the attorney for Bradley and Irwin.
“We are waiting to hear back from law enforcement,” Picerno said Tuesday.
Lisa’s parents are following every possible lead, Picerno said, and will never give up hope of finding her.
An international search is underway for Maria’s biological parents after she was found in the custody of a couple in a Gypsy encampment near the central town of Farsala that police raided. The girl’s DNA shows she is not the couple’s child.
A dental exam indicates the girl in Greece is 5 or 6 years old, according to the charity that is caring for her. Lisa Irwin would turn 3 years old in November.
It’s been more than two years since Lisa, then 10 months old, disappeared from her home in the 3600 block of North Lister Avenue in Kansas City.
Bradley and Irwin say someone broke into their home and grabbed Lisa while she slept. Police say their investigation continues, but the calls and tips have dwindled.
The family recently released an age-progression image that shows what Lisa might look like today.
The inquiry into whether Maria could be Lisa is reportedly to be among eight leads being taken seriously by Greek police, according to The Telegraph.
Read more here: http://www.kansascity.com(...)k.html#storylink=cpy
Baby Lisa’s parents contact Greek police about girl found in Roma settlement
October 22
BY ROBERT A. CRONKLETON
The Kansas City Star
Baby Lisa’s parents have asked Greek police to see if their daughter could possibly be the girl who was found in a Roma encampment in central Greece.
The local attorney for Deborah Bradley and Jeremy Irwin of Kansas City, North, said Tuesday that they have contacted authorities in hopes that their daughter is the girl known as Maria.
The family made contact through the local FBI office, which contacted Greek authorities through governmental channels, said John Picerno, the attorney for Bradley and Irwin.
“We are waiting to hear back from law enforcement,” Picerno said Tuesday.
Lisa’s parents are following every possible lead, Picerno said, and will never give up hope of finding her.
An international search is underway for Maria’s biological parents after she was found in the custody of a couple in a Gypsy encampment near the central town of Farsala that police raided. The girl’s DNA shows she is not the couple’s child.
A dental exam indicates the girl in Greece is 5 or 6 years old, according to the charity that is caring for her. Lisa Irwin would turn 3 years old in November.
It’s been more than two years since Lisa, then 10 months old, disappeared from her home in the 3600 block of North Lister Avenue in Kansas City.
Bradley and Irwin say someone broke into their home and grabbed Lisa while she slept. Police say their investigation continues, but the calls and tips have dwindled.
The family recently released an age-progression image that shows what Lisa might look like today.
The inquiry into whether Maria could be Lisa is reportedly to be among eight leads being taken seriously by Greek police, according to The Telegraph.
Read more here: http://www.kansascity.com(...)k.html#storylink=cpy
Zigeuners (althans die in Oost-Europa) zijn zieke mensen hoor.quote:
Dit is een mythe man
Net zoals dat Japanners Koreanen opeten ofzo
geloof er geen zak van
http://www.metropolistv.n(...)esmarkt-in-bulgarije
"But the age of chivalry is gone; that of sophisters, economists, and calculators has succeeded, and the glory of Europe is extinguished forever."- Edmund Burke
De echte moeder van het onbekende meisje Maria, dat onlangs bij een stel Roma-zigeuners in Griekenland is aangetroffen, is een Bulgaarse Roma-prostituée. Dat heeft de advocaat van het paar tegen de Amerikaanse zender NBC gezegd. De Raad van Europa vindt ondertussen de berichtgeving over Roma stigmatiserend.
De 39-jarige Christos Salis en de veertigjarige Eleftheria Dimopoulou zijn aangeklaagd voor ontvoering van het kind. Hun dna klopt niet met dat van Maria.
Volgens hun advocate Marietta Palavra zochten een Bulgaarse Roma-prostituée en haar vriendje 'Michaelis' een onderkomen voor een ongewenste baby. Het stel zag dat eerst niet zitten want het heeft al vijf kinderen van henzelf. Vooral Salis, in het verleden gearresteerd voor een gewapende overval, spartelde tegen. Toen Dimopoulou het kind in haar armen kreeg kon zij er niet aan weerstaan en 'ging het stel overstag', meldt de advocate.
De laatste keer dat het paar de biologische moeder heeft gezien was vorig jaar, toen de vrouw even langskwam om Maria te zien en naar haar te zwaaien. Zondag belde Dimopoulou vanuit de gevangenis nog met het vriendje. Maar sindsdien zijn hij en de Bulgaarse onbereikbaar.
Volgens Palavra heeft het stel goed voor het kind gezorgd en was er een hartverscheurend tafereel toen Maria van het opgepakte stel werd gescheiden. Het kind gaf een stuk van de haar door de politie toegestopte chocolade aan Dimopoulou in een poging haar te troosten.
Het dna van Maria blijkt niet overeen te stemmen met een Interpol-database van vermiste kinderen in 190 landen, weet NBC ook.
De 39-jarige Christos Salis en de veertigjarige Eleftheria Dimopoulou zijn aangeklaagd voor ontvoering van het kind. Hun dna klopt niet met dat van Maria.
Volgens hun advocate Marietta Palavra zochten een Bulgaarse Roma-prostituée en haar vriendje 'Michaelis' een onderkomen voor een ongewenste baby. Het stel zag dat eerst niet zitten want het heeft al vijf kinderen van henzelf. Vooral Salis, in het verleden gearresteerd voor een gewapende overval, spartelde tegen. Toen Dimopoulou het kind in haar armen kreeg kon zij er niet aan weerstaan en 'ging het stel overstag', meldt de advocate.
De laatste keer dat het paar de biologische moeder heeft gezien was vorig jaar, toen de vrouw even langskwam om Maria te zien en naar haar te zwaaien. Zondag belde Dimopoulou vanuit de gevangenis nog met het vriendje. Maar sindsdien zijn hij en de Bulgaarse onbereikbaar.
Volgens Palavra heeft het stel goed voor het kind gezorgd en was er een hartverscheurend tafereel toen Maria van het opgepakte stel werd gescheiden. Het kind gaf een stuk van de haar door de politie toegestopte chocolade aan Dimopoulou in een poging haar te troosten.
Het dna van Maria blijkt niet overeen te stemmen met een Interpol-database van vermiste kinderen in 190 landen, weet NBC ook.
Ik noem een Tony van Heemschut,een Loeki Knol,een Brammetje Biesterveld en natuurlijk een Japie Stobbe !
Zo te zien zijn die kinderen slechter af bij de biologische ouders.
En zo blijkt het verhaal toch anders, minder sensationeel, want geen rovende zigeuners, in elkaar te zitten
En zo blijkt het verhaal toch anders, minder sensationeel, want geen rovende zigeuners, in elkaar te zitten
Curiosity cultured the cat
Hoge dames vangen veel wind
Whadda ya hear! Whadda ya say!
What is any ocean but a multitude of drops?
Hoge dames vangen veel wind
Whadda ya hear! Whadda ya say!
What is any ocean but a multitude of drops?
En toen was het stil... in dit topic.quote:Op donderdag 24 oktober 2013 14:49 schreef Copycat het volgende:
Zo te zien zijn die kinderen slechter af bij de biologische ouders.
En zo blijkt het verhaal toch anders, minder sensationeel, want geen rovende zigeuners, in elkaar te zitten
The Art Of Lying
Ik dacht dat die broer en zu ook geadopteerd waren.quote:
Dus die andere kinderen op die foto zijn broer en zus die nog bij die prostituee leven?
signatuurloos
Ik weet niet of Maria wel terug kan naar haar ''ouders'' die haar gratis en voor niks zouden hebben gekregen van een Bulgaarse prostituee die geen geld had om te eten.
Want de ''adoptieouders'' hebben nogal wat op hun kerfstok.
http://www.ekathimerini.c(...)_1_24/10/2013_524628
After Maria's discovery, police found that her purported mother had registered one ID card and six children in Larissa, starting from 1993. In nearby Trikala, using a fake identity, she registered four more.
A few dozen kilometers away in Farsala, which houses the Roma camp, her partner registered another four children. Police say at least 10 children registered by the couple are unaccounted for and may not exist.
That allowed the couple to claim 2,790 euros in child benefits a month in a country dependent on EU/IMF loans and desperate to show it is making progress on tackling such fraud.
With no national birth registry until May and with some municipalities yet to move their files to the database, there had been no way to cross-check the births, officials said.
Indeed, the births and child registrations all appeared legal until the woman's arrest, when police realized she appeared to have given birth to six children in under 10 months.
The couple have been jailed pending trial on charges of abducting a minor and procuring fake documents, which they deny.
Maria was discovered during a surprise raid by police looking for drugs and weapons on the Roma settlement.
The couple say Maria's real mother gave her up willingly after birth because she could not raise her - an adoption that was "not exactly legal" but consensual, their lawyers said.
Officials say Maria's case is not isolated, though data is scarce.
Sifting through piles of papers on birth registration laws strewn across his desk, Tzanakoulis said the extent of the fraud carried out by the Roma couple showed the state's weaknesses.
"It was a complete shock," he said. "The level of fraud would have been the last thing to cross anyone's mind."
In this case, the woman was able to declare Maria's birth nearly four years after the fact, even though home births must be registered within 100 days. She even used her own fake ID as one of the two witnesses needed to prove the girl was born at home.
The mayor of Athens has since launched a probe into the local registry there and suspended two employees who dealt with such cases. Greece's top court has also ordered an investigation into all birth certificates issued in the past six years on the basis of a signed declaration rather than a hospital birth.
De échte moeder moet eerst een DNA test ondergaan, ik zie hier nog een blond kindje zitten.
Ze ontkent dat ze geld voor het kind heeft gekregen, maar dat moet ze wel ontkennen anders
zou ze strafbaar zijn. Een blond kind is een goudmijntje, niemand in Griekenland gelooft dat ze het
kind gratis en voor niks heeft weggegeven, maar voor de goede vrede gaan we daar maar gewoon
even van uit dan.
http://www.ekathimerini.c(...)_1_24/10/2013_524762
A picture taken on Thursday shows four of the children of Sasha Ruseva and Atanas Rusev in the Roma district of the central Bulgarian town of Nikolaevo.
DNA test conducted for Bulgarian woman over Maria case
A Bulgarian Roma woman from a camp near the town of Nikolaevo in southern Bulgaria has undergone a DNA test to establish the veracity of her claims to be the biological mother of a blond girl known as Maria who was removed from a Roma settlement near Larissa last week after tests showed that she was not related to a Roma couple posing as her parents.
Bulgarian police had made no official statement by late last night but Bulgarian media aired footage of a woman called Sasha Ruseva claiming to have given birth to the girl in January 2009 at a hospital in Lamia, central Greece.
According to her claims on Bulgarian TV, Ruseva gave the child to a Greek Roma couple as she was unable to support it financially in addition to the 10 children she already has. She rebuffed reports that she received 250 euros in cash in exchange for the child.
Television footage showed some of the children in her home who were fair-skinned and blond and not dissimilar in appearance to Maria.
Ruseva’s claims tally with those of the Roma couple who had posed as Maria’s parents, and are now in custody pending trial for abduction. The pair had told Greek police that they adopted Maria from a Bulgarian Roma woman in Athens in 2009.
Want de ''adoptieouders'' hebben nogal wat op hun kerfstok.
http://www.ekathimerini.c(...)_1_24/10/2013_524628
After Maria's discovery, police found that her purported mother had registered one ID card and six children in Larissa, starting from 1993. In nearby Trikala, using a fake identity, she registered four more.
A few dozen kilometers away in Farsala, which houses the Roma camp, her partner registered another four children. Police say at least 10 children registered by the couple are unaccounted for and may not exist.
That allowed the couple to claim 2,790 euros in child benefits a month in a country dependent on EU/IMF loans and desperate to show it is making progress on tackling such fraud.
With no national birth registry until May and with some municipalities yet to move their files to the database, there had been no way to cross-check the births, officials said.
Indeed, the births and child registrations all appeared legal until the woman's arrest, when police realized she appeared to have given birth to six children in under 10 months.
The couple have been jailed pending trial on charges of abducting a minor and procuring fake documents, which they deny.
Maria was discovered during a surprise raid by police looking for drugs and weapons on the Roma settlement.
The couple say Maria's real mother gave her up willingly after birth because she could not raise her - an adoption that was "not exactly legal" but consensual, their lawyers said.
Officials say Maria's case is not isolated, though data is scarce.
Sifting through piles of papers on birth registration laws strewn across his desk, Tzanakoulis said the extent of the fraud carried out by the Roma couple showed the state's weaknesses.
"It was a complete shock," he said. "The level of fraud would have been the last thing to cross anyone's mind."
In this case, the woman was able to declare Maria's birth nearly four years after the fact, even though home births must be registered within 100 days. She even used her own fake ID as one of the two witnesses needed to prove the girl was born at home.
The mayor of Athens has since launched a probe into the local registry there and suspended two employees who dealt with such cases. Greece's top court has also ordered an investigation into all birth certificates issued in the past six years on the basis of a signed declaration rather than a hospital birth.
De échte moeder moet eerst een DNA test ondergaan, ik zie hier nog een blond kindje zitten.
Ze ontkent dat ze geld voor het kind heeft gekregen, maar dat moet ze wel ontkennen anders
zou ze strafbaar zijn. Een blond kind is een goudmijntje, niemand in Griekenland gelooft dat ze het
kind gratis en voor niks heeft weggegeven, maar voor de goede vrede gaan we daar maar gewoon
even van uit dan.
http://www.ekathimerini.c(...)_1_24/10/2013_524762
A picture taken on Thursday shows four of the children of Sasha Ruseva and Atanas Rusev in the Roma district of the central Bulgarian town of Nikolaevo.
DNA test conducted for Bulgarian woman over Maria case
A Bulgarian Roma woman from a camp near the town of Nikolaevo in southern Bulgaria has undergone a DNA test to establish the veracity of her claims to be the biological mother of a blond girl known as Maria who was removed from a Roma settlement near Larissa last week after tests showed that she was not related to a Roma couple posing as her parents.
Bulgarian police had made no official statement by late last night but Bulgarian media aired footage of a woman called Sasha Ruseva claiming to have given birth to the girl in January 2009 at a hospital in Lamia, central Greece.
According to her claims on Bulgarian TV, Ruseva gave the child to a Greek Roma couple as she was unable to support it financially in addition to the 10 children she already has. She rebuffed reports that she received 250 euros in cash in exchange for the child.
Television footage showed some of the children in her home who were fair-skinned and blond and not dissimilar in appearance to Maria.
Ruseva’s claims tally with those of the Roma couple who had posed as Maria’s parents, and are now in custody pending trial for abduction. The pair had told Greek police that they adopted Maria from a Bulgarian Roma woman in Athens in 2009.
A MONTH!!!!!!!!!!!!!quote:
2,790 euros in child benefits a month
En wij maar lappen aan die bodemloze griekse put.
.
Schandalig natuurlijk, maar die Grieken mogen zelf hun administratie ook wel wat beter op orde brengen!quote:
[..]
A MONTH!!!!!!!!!!!!!
En wij maar lappen aan die bodemloze griekse put.
The End Times are wild
Ja maar al heb je legaal 10 kinderen, is het natuurlijk nog steeds een asociaal bedrag.quote:
[..]
Schandalig natuurlijk, maar die Grieken mogen zelf hun administratie ook wel wat beter op orde brengen!
.
Dat is een keuze. Maar geen fraude. Ik denk dat wanneer je écht 10 kinderen hebt, je dat geld ook wel nodig hebt.quote:
[..]
Ja maar al heb je legaal 10 kinderen, is het natuurlijk nog steeds een asociaal bedrag.
Maar waarom de Grieken zouden willen dat Roma in hun land 10 kinderen voortbrengen (want dat subsidieren ze immers), dat is pas écht een raadsel.
The End Times are wild
Crap, hier in Nederland krijg je tussen de 191 en 274 per kind per kwartaalquote:
[..]
Dat is een keuze. Maar geen fraude. Ik denk dat wanneer je écht 10 kinderen hebt, je dat geld ook wel nodig hebt.
Maar waarom de Grieken zouden willen dat Roma in hun land 10 kinderen voortbrengen (want dat subsidieren ze immers), dat is pas écht een raadsel.
.
Zo veel geld krijgen en dan je kinderen er nog zo laten bijlopen.... Ze zien er uit of ze allemaal aan de harddrugs zitten. Arme kinderen.... 
Het is ook bullshit maar zo staat het dus in de krant, Kinderbijslag in Griekenland ligt ergens
tussen de 50 á 70 euro per maand per kind óf niks, hangt ook weer van allerlei factoren af.
Dus hoe ze aan dat bedrag komen weet ik niet, zal wel iets met de fraude te maken hebben
misschien dat er gehandicapte kinderen op zijn gegeven, géén idee ....
maar zo staat het dus in de krant, Kinderbijslag in Griekenland ligt ergenstussen de 50 á 70 euro per maand per kind óf niks, hangt ook weer van allerlei factoren af.
Dus hoe ze aan dat bedrag komen weet ik niet, zal wel iets met de fraude te maken hebben
misschien dat er gehandicapte kinderen op zijn gegeven, géén idee ....
http://www.greeklawyerson(...)ld_support_in_greecequote:The issue of whether an obligation to support a child exists or not, is a case by case determination; the Court examines the specific facts regarding each child, their individual educational needs and status, their ability to find a job that can sustain them, etc. and then it determines whether a parent is liable for their support.
Waarom is een blond kind nou een goudmijn en alles? Iedereen zegt het hie rmaar als er im opheldering wordt gevraagd komt d'r geen onderbouwing.
Ze zal hier ook wel ietsje meer opbrengen misschien?quote:
Waarom is een blond kind nou een goudmijn en alles? Iedereen zegt het hie rmaar als er im opheldering wordt gevraagd komt d'r geen onderbouwing.
http://www.metropolistv.n(...)esmarkt-in-bulgarije
Weet je hoe veel dat kost? Harddrugs voor al je kinderen!quote:
Zo veel geld krijgen en dan je kinderen er nog zo laten bijlopen.... Ze zien er uit of ze allemaal aan de harddrugs zitten. Arme kinderen....
The End Times are wild
Dat dus, en dan zijn de kosten van levensonderhoud in NL ook beduidend hoger.quote:
[..]
Crap, hier in Nederland krijg je tussen de 191 en 274 per kind per kwartaal
Toeristen associëren een blond kind met hun eigen omgeving, waar ze dat met een typisch Roma-kindje veel minder doen, hebben dus sneller sympathie voor het kind, vinden het vervolgens veel zieliger voor het blonde kind dan voor het standaard Roma-kindje, en dus geven ze het blonde kind meer geld.quote:
Waarom is een blond kind nou een goudmijn en alles? Iedereen zegt het hie rmaar als er im opheldering wordt gevraagd komt d'r geen onderbouwing.
Aldus de Nederlandse. Ondertussen zie je in Bulgarije, Roemenie of Griekenland kinderen niet of zo goed als nooit op straat bedelen en woonde dit meisje in een dorpje in the middle of fucking nowhere waar zo goed als geen toeristen ook maar enigszins in de buurt komen. Voor de rest een leuke theorie hoor.quote:
[..]
Toeristen associëren een blond kind met hun eigen omgeving, waar ze dat met een typisch Roma-kindje veel minder doen, hebben dus sneller sympathie voor het kind, vinden het vervolgens veel zieliger voor het blonde kind dan voor het standaard Roma-kindje, en dus geven ze het blonde kind meer geld.
"For the man sound of body and serene of mind, there is no such thing as bad weather; Every day has its beauty. And storms which whip the blood, do make it pulse more vigorously."
Ah ja, het befaamde marktje waar een paar honderd van de ruim een miljoen zigeuners in Bulgarije op afkomen.quote:
[..]
Ze zal hier ook wel ietsje meer opbrengen misschien?
http://www.metropolistv.n(...)esmarkt-in-bulgarije
"For the man sound of body and serene of mind, there is no such thing as bad weather; Every day has its beauty. And storms which whip the blood, do make it pulse more vigorously."
Zigeuners zijn natuurlijk ook te stom om het haar van hun kinderen blond te verven. Blondjes moeten gestolen wordenquote:
Waarom is een blond kind nou een goudmijn en alles? Iedereen zegt het hie rmaar als er im opheldering wordt gevraagd komt d'r geen onderbouwing.
"For the man sound of body and serene of mind, there is no such thing as bad weather; Every day has its beauty. And storms which whip the blood, do make it pulse more vigorously."
Hee, ik leg alleen maar uit waarom wordt geroepen dat het kind een goudmijn zou zijn, je hebt mij nergens zien posten dat het kind een goudmijn is.quote:
[..]
Aldus de Nederlandse. Ondertussen zie je in Bulgarije, Roemenie of Griekenland kinderen niet of zo goed als nooit op straat bedelen en woonde dit meisje in een dorpje in the middle of fucking nowhere waar zo goed als geen toeristen ook maar enigszins in de buurt komen. Voor de rest een leuke theorie hoor.
Je presenteerde het meer als eigen mening, enfin, excuses danquote:
[..]
Hee, ik leg alleen maar uit waarom wordt geroepen dat het kind een goudmijn zou zijn, je hebt mij nergens zien posten dat het kind een goudmijn is.
"For the man sound of body and serene of mind, there is no such thing as bad weather; Every day has its beauty. And storms which whip the blood, do make it pulse more vigorously."
Neu, ik denk niet dat ze het meisje hadden laten bedelen, die valt te veel op en zo werkt
het ook niet, ik heb nog nooit zo'n blond kindje in Griekenland zien bedelen.
Toeristen geven juist eerder aan zo'n kind wat er écht uitziet als een zigeunerkindje
de Grieken weten wel hoe het zit, die geven niks of iets te eten.
Maar hier gebeurt dus hetzelfde wat in Mexico gebeurde met een blond meisje.
http://www.panoramas.pitt(...)s-racism-controversy
In October 2012, the Associated Press reported that a photo had surfaced on the internet of a blonde child begging for money in Guadalajara, which prompted Mexican officials to place the child in an orphanage on suspicions that she had been kidnapped. The incident started a debate about the state of racism in Mexico today, as the mother of the child was darker-skinned. Officials found the young girl, put her in a Guadalajara orphanage and detained her mother for two days. The child's grandmother — who also has green eyes — was able to hand over the birth certificate of the girl, quelling accusations that the girl had been kidnapped. Nevertheless, the incident managed to outrage Mexicans and others all over the world for its obvious racist motivations. Additionally, the internet activity focused on the racial aspect of the story, rather than the tragedy that a 5-year-old child was forced to beg on the streets
See more at: http://www.panoramas.pitt(...)sthash.t5VCPm91.dpuf
het ook niet, ik heb nog nooit zo'n blond kindje in Griekenland zien bedelen.
Toeristen geven juist eerder aan zo'n kind wat er écht uitziet als een zigeunerkindje
de Grieken weten wel hoe het zit, die geven niks of iets te eten.
Maar hier gebeurt dus hetzelfde wat in Mexico gebeurde met een blond meisje.
http://www.panoramas.pitt(...)s-racism-controversy
In October 2012, the Associated Press reported that a photo had surfaced on the internet of a blonde child begging for money in Guadalajara, which prompted Mexican officials to place the child in an orphanage on suspicions that she had been kidnapped. The incident started a debate about the state of racism in Mexico today, as the mother of the child was darker-skinned. Officials found the young girl, put her in a Guadalajara orphanage and detained her mother for two days. The child's grandmother — who also has green eyes — was able to hand over the birth certificate of the girl, quelling accusations that the girl had been kidnapped. Nevertheless, the incident managed to outrage Mexicans and others all over the world for its obvious racist motivations. Additionally, the internet activity focused on the racial aspect of the story, rather than the tragedy that a 5-year-old child was forced to beg on the streets
See more at: http://www.panoramas.pitt(...)sthash.t5VCPm91.dpuf
Ondertussen in Ierland...
http://news.yahoo.com/ire(...)rents-193730760.html
October 23, 2013 5:29 PM
Ireland returns 2 blond children to Gypsy parents
DUBLIN (AP) — Two blond children who were taken by Irish police from their Romanian Gypsy parents were returned Wednesday to their families after DNA tests determined that the children were rightfully theirs, an episode that raised accusations of racism.
The Irish police were responding to public tipoffs fueled by media coverage of an alleged child-abduction case in Greece involving a blond-haired girl and a family of Gypsies, known as Roma.
Justice Minister Alan Shatter told lawmakers he was "pleased and relieved" that the children had been returned to their homes. He ordered the police commander, Commissioner Martin Callinan, to produce a report explaining why officers felt it necessary to take the children — a 2-year-old boy and a 7-year-old girl — from their families.
"We must all be particularly conscious of the regrettable distress that arose for the two families and their children," Shatter said.
He defended the need for police and child welfare officers to remove children from potentially dangerous homes, but cautioned that Irish authorities must ensure "that no group or minority community is singled out for unwarranted suspicion in relation to child protection issues."
In both cases, police suspected that the children might be victims of abductions because they were blond-haired and blue-eyed, unlike the rest of their immediate relatives.
An estimated 5,000 Roma have settled over the past decade in Ireland, where many have been linked to organized street-begging rackets involving children.
On Monday, police went to one Roma family's home in southwest Dublin and sought the passport and birth certificate of the girl. The family produced them, but police opted to issue an emergency child protection order and place the child in state care. Police said the Romanian passport was not useful because it had a baby photo, not the girl's current appearance, while the birth certificate did not match Dublin hospital records.
On Tuesday, police in the midlands town of Athlone went to another Roma family's home and asked both parents to provide mouth-swab samples from their son and themselves. The boy then was taken away by social workers overnight and returned the next day after the child's parentage was confirmed.
Irish child protection law prohibits the publication of the names of either family because their cases involve the placement of children into state protective custody.
The Athlone family's father told reporters he had assured police that other relatives also had blond hair and blue eyes. He said his wife couldn't sleep all night and the boy's older sister cried much of the night.
The Dublin family's lawyer, Waheed Mudah, issued a statement outside the Family Court accusing the police of acting without justifiable cause.
Mudah said his clients were "very conscious of the fact that this case has been linked" with the Greek child-abduction case, "which has nothing to do with them."
He said his clients hoped parents across Ireland would "consider how they would feel if one of their children was taken away in similar circumstances for similar reasons. They hope no other family has to go through the experience they have suffered."
Pavee Point, a Dublin-based support group for Gypsies, said the police were guilty of racial profiling and child abduction.
The group's co-director, Martin Collins, said he feared that more children "of Roma parents who are not dark-skinned and have brown eyes could be taken away, one after the other, for DNA test after DNA test. It's outrageous. It's despicable."
Ireland's national police, the Garda Siochana, confirmed that both children were returned to their families Wednesday. In a statement the force defended its actions as consistent with child-protection laws, and said the public should be assured "that we take extremely serious(ly) all reports received from members of the public concerning child welfare issues."
http://news.yahoo.com/ire(...)rents-193730760.html
October 23, 2013 5:29 PM
Ireland returns 2 blond children to Gypsy parents
DUBLIN (AP) — Two blond children who were taken by Irish police from their Romanian Gypsy parents were returned Wednesday to their families after DNA tests determined that the children were rightfully theirs, an episode that raised accusations of racism.
The Irish police were responding to public tipoffs fueled by media coverage of an alleged child-abduction case in Greece involving a blond-haired girl and a family of Gypsies, known as Roma.
Justice Minister Alan Shatter told lawmakers he was "pleased and relieved" that the children had been returned to their homes. He ordered the police commander, Commissioner Martin Callinan, to produce a report explaining why officers felt it necessary to take the children — a 2-year-old boy and a 7-year-old girl — from their families.
"We must all be particularly conscious of the regrettable distress that arose for the two families and their children," Shatter said.
He defended the need for police and child welfare officers to remove children from potentially dangerous homes, but cautioned that Irish authorities must ensure "that no group or minority community is singled out for unwarranted suspicion in relation to child protection issues."
In both cases, police suspected that the children might be victims of abductions because they were blond-haired and blue-eyed, unlike the rest of their immediate relatives.
An estimated 5,000 Roma have settled over the past decade in Ireland, where many have been linked to organized street-begging rackets involving children.
On Monday, police went to one Roma family's home in southwest Dublin and sought the passport and birth certificate of the girl. The family produced them, but police opted to issue an emergency child protection order and place the child in state care. Police said the Romanian passport was not useful because it had a baby photo, not the girl's current appearance, while the birth certificate did not match Dublin hospital records.
On Tuesday, police in the midlands town of Athlone went to another Roma family's home and asked both parents to provide mouth-swab samples from their son and themselves. The boy then was taken away by social workers overnight and returned the next day after the child's parentage was confirmed.
Irish child protection law prohibits the publication of the names of either family because their cases involve the placement of children into state protective custody.
The Athlone family's father told reporters he had assured police that other relatives also had blond hair and blue eyes. He said his wife couldn't sleep all night and the boy's older sister cried much of the night.
The Dublin family's lawyer, Waheed Mudah, issued a statement outside the Family Court accusing the police of acting without justifiable cause.
Mudah said his clients were "very conscious of the fact that this case has been linked" with the Greek child-abduction case, "which has nothing to do with them."
He said his clients hoped parents across Ireland would "consider how they would feel if one of their children was taken away in similar circumstances for similar reasons. They hope no other family has to go through the experience they have suffered."
Pavee Point, a Dublin-based support group for Gypsies, said the police were guilty of racial profiling and child abduction.
The group's co-director, Martin Collins, said he feared that more children "of Roma parents who are not dark-skinned and have brown eyes could be taken away, one after the other, for DNA test after DNA test. It's outrageous. It's despicable."
Ireland's national police, the Garda Siochana, confirmed that both children were returned to their families Wednesday. In a statement the force defended its actions as consistent with child-protection laws, and said the public should be assured "that we take extremely serious(ly) all reports received from members of the public concerning child welfare issues."
http://www.thedailybeast.(...)-stealing-panic.html
Roma Face Persecution Across Europe In New Baby Stealing Panic
by Tom Sykes, Barbie Latza Nadeau Oct 24, 2013 1:00 PM EDT
From Ireland to Italy, Roma are facing a new wave of persecution and harassment in Europe—including
having their children taken in for genetic testing—in the wake of the discovery of little Maria. By Tom Sykes and Barbie Latza Nadeau.
It had been a long 72 hours for the Dublin Roma family whose seven year-old child was removed from them by the authorities, a series of events triggered after police read a Facebook message which called into question her parentage because she had blonde hair and blue eyes. But at about 5:30pm last night, after a ruling from a secret family court a few miles and a world away in the centre of Dublin, the mood in the hardscrabble suburb of Tallaght began to lighten.
A girl is seen at the door of a caravan at an encampment of Roma families in Triel-sur-Seine, near Paris, on October 18, 2013. (Benoit Tessier/Reuters)
The adults were tight-lipped, but the kids gave it away. The DNA tests had revealed that yes, the girl was indeed the biological daughter of the Roma parents who claimed her. The children started running up and down the street, waving balloons, calling out the little girl’s name in celebration.
Shortly afterwards, a 21-year-old sister (neither the girl nor her family can be identified under Irish family law) dressed in a traditional flowing Roma dress, topped off by a less traditional fluffy pink dressing gown with polka dots, came out of the house and confirmed to journalists that the seven-year-old was coming home.
Holding back tears, the woman said that she was happy that her sister was coming home but talked in broken English about the agonizing trauma of the past three days. The child, she said, had not eaten for three days. The whole family had been very worried and upset. They had been crying every day. They hoped this would never happen to another family.
“We’re going to have a big party tonight,” she told The Daily Beast, “A traditional Roma party with singing, dancing and music. We always had all the proofs and we never doubted she would come home.”
It was bitterly cold by 9:45pm, when the child finally arrived home and was rushed into the house covered in a blanket (ironically, covering her in a blanket meant that Irish papers were able to use the pictures, as the child’s identity was obscured).
The Roma family later issued a statement through their lawyer which called for an investigation and threatened legal action. “They do not accept that there was any proper or sufficient basis to take their daughter away from them,” the statement said, adding that they hoped no other family had to “go through the experience that they have just suffered.”
In fact, a family a hundred miles away in the provincial town of Athlone had been through exactly the same thing while the case in Dublin was playing out. The parents of two-year-old Iancu Muntean spoke of their trauma after he was removed by the gardai amid questions over his parentage.
“I say to guards: ‘What make you take my baby?’” Mr Muntean told the Irish Independent. “When somebody take your kid you feel sick, you feel bad.”
Did the Irish police really believe the ancient, pernicious myths that the Roma steal people’s children? What next, a swoop by the Irish cops on eagles lifting babies from prams?
Speaking in the Seanad last night, the Minister for Justice Alan Shatter said he would ask the Garda Commissioner for a report on the background to the cases with a view to reviewing procedures.
This morning, the Irish premier Enda Kenny tried to argue that race was not a factor in the removal of the children, telling the Irish Times: “This should not be seen to be about any group or any minority, this is about children, and there’s always a balance to be struck if there are genuine fears about the health, welfare and safety of children.”
His argument is likely to fall on deaf ears. The fact remains that the children were removed on the basis of claims that they did not resemble the couples who were their biological parents. The Irish are, for now at least, outraged, on behalf of the Roma, sensing their reputation for tolerance and open-mindedness, born of a history of enthusiastic emigration themselves, is under threat.
But mainland European Roma are enjoying no such public support. Europe’s Roma, who also are also referred to in less politically correct terms as gypsies, have been smeared with allegations of child abduction since Victorian times. Parents in Europe and the United States have been facetiously warning their children they’d be “stolen by gypsies” or “sold to the gypsies” for centuries.
Roma baby-stealing myths, fed by the ongoing fascination with the disappearance of British girl Madeline McCann in Portugal, have now been revived after the appearance of “Maria,” a blonde child not genetically linked to her supposed parents, who was discovered in the Fasala Roma camp in Greece. The couple who raised Maria claimed she was informally adopted from a mother who could not cope. As a global search for her real parents ensues, many European countries are scouring their own Roma camps in search of other missing children.
According to Greek media, investigators in Greece are considering a theory that Maria was supposed to be sold for around ¤20,000 after she arrived at the camp. But when the deal fell through after a crackdown in illegal adoptions between 2008—2010, her Roma parents supposedly bought her for around ¤1,000. Officials are also testing the DNA of a Bulgarian Roma woman who gave birth to a child in Greece in 2008 and says she had to leave her behind because the familiy could not support her.
Officials are adding fuel to the fire: “A plausible scenario is that the little girl ended up with the Roma family after the crackdown on a ring involving illegal adoptions via Bulgaria between 2008 and 2010,” according to police in a televised press conference on Greek SKAI television.
Meanwhile, in Italy, persecution of the Roma has become almost a national pastime. In 2007 the Italian government tried to introduce special legislation to make “zingari” or “sinti” people illegal immigrants even if they had valid European documents. The move was to rid the streets of the aggressive window washers, bolstered by claims that the gypsies were responsible for 75 percent of petty crimes in the country. One has to only go near a tourist attraction in Rome to see signs warning tourists in multiple languages about the “gypsy pickpockets.” Roma settlements are frequently targeted by hate groups. In the last five years, a dozen camps have been set alight across the country. Many camps have been razed by authorities, especially in the northern regions, where there is little tolerance for ethnic division.
Now, Italy’s right-wing political groups have seized on the discovery of Maria to try and introduce parliamentary legislation to allow for similar sweeps across Italy in search of “stolen” babies.
“The case of little Maria found in a Roma camp in Greece that authorities suspect was an abduction by a pair of nomads should give us pause,” said Edmondo Cirielli, a deputy with Brothers of Italy. “The government should put in place every possibly policy to have more controls over the Roma camps in Italy and not let the issue get lost in the banality of alleged racism.”
In France, an entire settlement of Roma in the heart of Marseille abandoned their encampment in the dead of night last week, out of fear they would be targeted by police. Swedish police were also condemned after the discovery of an NSA-style race-based database of more than 4,000 Roma, including details of 1,000 children.
Searches are also continuing in Greece, where an archaic birth registration system that makes it easy to facilitate benefit fraud is being examined. Three Roma people were arrested on the Greek island of Lesbos when they tried to register a two-and-a-half-month old baby with dodgy documents earlier this week. Like the case of Maria, the alleged parents claimed that someone had given them the child to take care of.
Amnesty International calls the persecution of the Roma worrying. Between 10 and 12 million Roma live in Europe. Amnesty International says that thousands of the Roma children “are placed in segregated schools and receive a substandard education.” In a recent report on maltreatment of the Roma people, they wrote, “When it comes to the treatment of the Roma, EU governments are not just failing to respect binding international human rights standards, but also to enforce EU anti-discrimination law.”
As in many other parts of the world, the Roma are not popular in Ireland, regularly indicted for everything from aggressive begging to benefits fraud. Many citizens born in the country resent that they have the same entitlements to Ireland’s generous welfare state, and accuse them of never working. They are particularly hated in Tallaght, as the brick-proof perspex windows and CCTV cameras mounted on the side of houses attest.
Appalling and shameful for Ireland as it has been, the Dublin case may, in the long run, work in the Roma’s favor as it exposes so graphically the casual, institutionalized racism doled out to these people as a matter of course.
And, for once, the Irish people are on the Roma’s side.
Roma Face Persecution Across Europe In New Baby Stealing Panic
by Tom Sykes, Barbie Latza Nadeau Oct 24, 2013 1:00 PM EDT
From Ireland to Italy, Roma are facing a new wave of persecution and harassment in Europe—including
having their children taken in for genetic testing—in the wake of the discovery of little Maria. By Tom Sykes and Barbie Latza Nadeau.
It had been a long 72 hours for the Dublin Roma family whose seven year-old child was removed from them by the authorities, a series of events triggered after police read a Facebook message which called into question her parentage because she had blonde hair and blue eyes. But at about 5:30pm last night, after a ruling from a secret family court a few miles and a world away in the centre of Dublin, the mood in the hardscrabble suburb of Tallaght began to lighten.
A girl is seen at the door of a caravan at an encampment of Roma families in Triel-sur-Seine, near Paris, on October 18, 2013. (Benoit Tessier/Reuters)
The adults were tight-lipped, but the kids gave it away. The DNA tests had revealed that yes, the girl was indeed the biological daughter of the Roma parents who claimed her. The children started running up and down the street, waving balloons, calling out the little girl’s name in celebration.
Shortly afterwards, a 21-year-old sister (neither the girl nor her family can be identified under Irish family law) dressed in a traditional flowing Roma dress, topped off by a less traditional fluffy pink dressing gown with polka dots, came out of the house and confirmed to journalists that the seven-year-old was coming home.
Holding back tears, the woman said that she was happy that her sister was coming home but talked in broken English about the agonizing trauma of the past three days. The child, she said, had not eaten for three days. The whole family had been very worried and upset. They had been crying every day. They hoped this would never happen to another family.
“We’re going to have a big party tonight,” she told The Daily Beast, “A traditional Roma party with singing, dancing and music. We always had all the proofs and we never doubted she would come home.”
It was bitterly cold by 9:45pm, when the child finally arrived home and was rushed into the house covered in a blanket (ironically, covering her in a blanket meant that Irish papers were able to use the pictures, as the child’s identity was obscured).
The Roma family later issued a statement through their lawyer which called for an investigation and threatened legal action. “They do not accept that there was any proper or sufficient basis to take their daughter away from them,” the statement said, adding that they hoped no other family had to “go through the experience that they have just suffered.”
In fact, a family a hundred miles away in the provincial town of Athlone had been through exactly the same thing while the case in Dublin was playing out. The parents of two-year-old Iancu Muntean spoke of their trauma after he was removed by the gardai amid questions over his parentage.
“I say to guards: ‘What make you take my baby?’” Mr Muntean told the Irish Independent. “When somebody take your kid you feel sick, you feel bad.”
Did the Irish police really believe the ancient, pernicious myths that the Roma steal people’s children? What next, a swoop by the Irish cops on eagles lifting babies from prams?
Speaking in the Seanad last night, the Minister for Justice Alan Shatter said he would ask the Garda Commissioner for a report on the background to the cases with a view to reviewing procedures.
This morning, the Irish premier Enda Kenny tried to argue that race was not a factor in the removal of the children, telling the Irish Times: “This should not be seen to be about any group or any minority, this is about children, and there’s always a balance to be struck if there are genuine fears about the health, welfare and safety of children.”
His argument is likely to fall on deaf ears. The fact remains that the children were removed on the basis of claims that they did not resemble the couples who were their biological parents. The Irish are, for now at least, outraged, on behalf of the Roma, sensing their reputation for tolerance and open-mindedness, born of a history of enthusiastic emigration themselves, is under threat.
But mainland European Roma are enjoying no such public support. Europe’s Roma, who also are also referred to in less politically correct terms as gypsies, have been smeared with allegations of child abduction since Victorian times. Parents in Europe and the United States have been facetiously warning their children they’d be “stolen by gypsies” or “sold to the gypsies” for centuries.
Roma baby-stealing myths, fed by the ongoing fascination with the disappearance of British girl Madeline McCann in Portugal, have now been revived after the appearance of “Maria,” a blonde child not genetically linked to her supposed parents, who was discovered in the Fasala Roma camp in Greece. The couple who raised Maria claimed she was informally adopted from a mother who could not cope. As a global search for her real parents ensues, many European countries are scouring their own Roma camps in search of other missing children.
According to Greek media, investigators in Greece are considering a theory that Maria was supposed to be sold for around ¤20,000 after she arrived at the camp. But when the deal fell through after a crackdown in illegal adoptions between 2008—2010, her Roma parents supposedly bought her for around ¤1,000. Officials are also testing the DNA of a Bulgarian Roma woman who gave birth to a child in Greece in 2008 and says she had to leave her behind because the familiy could not support her.
Officials are adding fuel to the fire: “A plausible scenario is that the little girl ended up with the Roma family after the crackdown on a ring involving illegal adoptions via Bulgaria between 2008 and 2010,” according to police in a televised press conference on Greek SKAI television.
Meanwhile, in Italy, persecution of the Roma has become almost a national pastime. In 2007 the Italian government tried to introduce special legislation to make “zingari” or “sinti” people illegal immigrants even if they had valid European documents. The move was to rid the streets of the aggressive window washers, bolstered by claims that the gypsies were responsible for 75 percent of petty crimes in the country. One has to only go near a tourist attraction in Rome to see signs warning tourists in multiple languages about the “gypsy pickpockets.” Roma settlements are frequently targeted by hate groups. In the last five years, a dozen camps have been set alight across the country. Many camps have been razed by authorities, especially in the northern regions, where there is little tolerance for ethnic division.
Now, Italy’s right-wing political groups have seized on the discovery of Maria to try and introduce parliamentary legislation to allow for similar sweeps across Italy in search of “stolen” babies.
“The case of little Maria found in a Roma camp in Greece that authorities suspect was an abduction by a pair of nomads should give us pause,” said Edmondo Cirielli, a deputy with Brothers of Italy. “The government should put in place every possibly policy to have more controls over the Roma camps in Italy and not let the issue get lost in the banality of alleged racism.”
In France, an entire settlement of Roma in the heart of Marseille abandoned their encampment in the dead of night last week, out of fear they would be targeted by police. Swedish police were also condemned after the discovery of an NSA-style race-based database of more than 4,000 Roma, including details of 1,000 children.
Searches are also continuing in Greece, where an archaic birth registration system that makes it easy to facilitate benefit fraud is being examined. Three Roma people were arrested on the Greek island of Lesbos when they tried to register a two-and-a-half-month old baby with dodgy documents earlier this week. Like the case of Maria, the alleged parents claimed that someone had given them the child to take care of.
Amnesty International calls the persecution of the Roma worrying. Between 10 and 12 million Roma live in Europe. Amnesty International says that thousands of the Roma children “are placed in segregated schools and receive a substandard education.” In a recent report on maltreatment of the Roma people, they wrote, “When it comes to the treatment of the Roma, EU governments are not just failing to respect binding international human rights standards, but also to enforce EU anti-discrimination law.”
As in many other parts of the world, the Roma are not popular in Ireland, regularly indicted for everything from aggressive begging to benefits fraud. Many citizens born in the country resent that they have the same entitlements to Ireland’s generous welfare state, and accuse them of never working. They are particularly hated in Tallaght, as the brick-proof perspex windows and CCTV cameras mounted on the side of houses attest.
Appalling and shameful for Ireland as it has been, the Dublin case may, in the long run, work in the Roma’s favor as it exposes so graphically the casual, institutionalized racism doled out to these people as a matter of course.
And, for once, the Irish people are on the Roma’s side.
http://www.dailymail.co.u(...)ico=home%5Eheadlines
PUBLISHED: 21:59 GMT, 23 October 2013 | UPDATED: 06:40 GMT, 24 October 2013
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.u(...)e.html#ixzz2ihugFSIG
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
Maria 'was groomed to be a child bride': Police claim girl found in gipsy camp was set to be married off at the age of 12 by couple who adopted her
Maria's pale features would make her a 'prize bride' among gipsies
She would have fetched 'parents' a hefty dowry
The little girl is likely to have been married off at 12
Little blonde Maria was being groomed by her gipsy captors to be a child bride, Greek police believe.
The distinctive blue-eyed girl was discovered in a Roma settlement during a police raid a week ago, when officers noticed she looked nothing like the couple posing as her parents.
DNA evidence has shown she is not related to Eleftheria Dimopoulou, 40, and her husband Hristos Salis, 39, who have been charged with child abduction and procuring false identity documents
Child bride: Little Maria may have been married off at 12 for a substantial dowry. She is pictured with Eleftheria Dimopoulou, and husband Hristos Salis
Police now believe that Maria, who is thought to be four or five, was being prepared for marriage at the age of 12.
Her pale skin, near-white hair and blue eyes would have made her a ‘prize bride’ among the gipsy community.
Police now believe that Maria, who is thought to be four or five, was being prepared for marriage at the age of 12. Right, a file picture of a child at a gipsy wedding
Maria was given her own room in the brick-built house where she was discovered, in the gipsy settlement of Tabakou on the edge of Farsala, central Greece.
There is growing evidence she was used by Salis and Dimopoulou to beg and dance for money.
They also made money from child benefit payments she entitled them to.
Neighbours say the couple purchased Maria for as little as £850 from a Bulgarian couple when she was a baby.
Detectives are now looking into the possibility that she was offered cheap by a gang on the run from police. The gang, smuggling children from Bulgaria into Greece, may have intended to sell her to a wealthy Greek couple for up to £22,000.
They are looking at case files of three illegal adoption circles that were dismantled by police between 2009 and 2011.
The earliest operation is said to be of most interest. The 2009 operation led to the arrests of 11 members of a gang operating in central and northern Greece.
The circle featured a Bulgarian ‘middle man’ who employed a local gipsy couple to locate potential buyers.
The case is of particular interest because when he appeared in court on Monday Salis provided officials with the name of a Bulgarian ‘mediator’ and his mobile phone number and urged the court to trace him.
In a separate case, Greek police yesterday arrested three gipsies on the Greek island of Lesbos on suspicion of abducting a two-month-old baby.
Arrested: Salis, 39, left, and Dimopoulou, 40, right, charged with child abduction and forging documents
They believe a young couple - a 21-year-old man and 19-year-old woman - and an older woman, 51, had obtained the child in Athens.
The Greek birth registration system has come under close scrutiny since Maria was discovered last Wednesday.
Konstantinos Tzanakoulis, mayor of Larissa, the closest city to the camp she was found, said yesterday that it was ‘pure luck’ that her case was uncovered at all.
‘Who knows how many such cases exist?’ he asked, blaming a system he said was riddled with loopholes. ‘We may never know.’
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.u(...)e.html#ixzz2ihwFMsHj
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
PUBLISHED: 21:59 GMT, 23 October 2013 | UPDATED: 06:40 GMT, 24 October 2013
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.u(...)e.html#ixzz2ihugFSIG
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
Maria 'was groomed to be a child bride': Police claim girl found in gipsy camp was set to be married off at the age of 12 by couple who adopted her
Maria's pale features would make her a 'prize bride' among gipsies
She would have fetched 'parents' a hefty dowry
The little girl is likely to have been married off at 12
Little blonde Maria was being groomed by her gipsy captors to be a child bride, Greek police believe.
The distinctive blue-eyed girl was discovered in a Roma settlement during a police raid a week ago, when officers noticed she looked nothing like the couple posing as her parents.
DNA evidence has shown she is not related to Eleftheria Dimopoulou, 40, and her husband Hristos Salis, 39, who have been charged with child abduction and procuring false identity documents
Child bride: Little Maria may have been married off at 12 for a substantial dowry. She is pictured with Eleftheria Dimopoulou, and husband Hristos Salis
Police now believe that Maria, who is thought to be four or five, was being prepared for marriage at the age of 12.
Her pale skin, near-white hair and blue eyes would have made her a ‘prize bride’ among the gipsy community.
Police now believe that Maria, who is thought to be four or five, was being prepared for marriage at the age of 12. Right, a file picture of a child at a gipsy wedding
Maria was given her own room in the brick-built house where she was discovered, in the gipsy settlement of Tabakou on the edge of Farsala, central Greece.
There is growing evidence she was used by Salis and Dimopoulou to beg and dance for money.
They also made money from child benefit payments she entitled them to.
Neighbours say the couple purchased Maria for as little as £850 from a Bulgarian couple when she was a baby.
Detectives are now looking into the possibility that she was offered cheap by a gang on the run from police. The gang, smuggling children from Bulgaria into Greece, may have intended to sell her to a wealthy Greek couple for up to £22,000.
They are looking at case files of three illegal adoption circles that were dismantled by police between 2009 and 2011.
The earliest operation is said to be of most interest. The 2009 operation led to the arrests of 11 members of a gang operating in central and northern Greece.
The circle featured a Bulgarian ‘middle man’ who employed a local gipsy couple to locate potential buyers.
The case is of particular interest because when he appeared in court on Monday Salis provided officials with the name of a Bulgarian ‘mediator’ and his mobile phone number and urged the court to trace him.
In a separate case, Greek police yesterday arrested three gipsies on the Greek island of Lesbos on suspicion of abducting a two-month-old baby.
Arrested: Salis, 39, left, and Dimopoulou, 40, right, charged with child abduction and forging documents
They believe a young couple - a 21-year-old man and 19-year-old woman - and an older woman, 51, had obtained the child in Athens.
The Greek birth registration system has come under close scrutiny since Maria was discovered last Wednesday.
Konstantinos Tzanakoulis, mayor of Larissa, the closest city to the camp she was found, said yesterday that it was ‘pure luck’ that her case was uncovered at all.
‘Who knows how many such cases exist?’ he asked, blaming a system he said was riddled with loopholes. ‘We may never know.’
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.u(...)e.html#ixzz2ihwFMsHj
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
ATHENE - Een Grieks echtpaar is door de politie gearresteerd omdat zij voor 4000 euro een baby hadden gekocht van Roma. De politie kwam het echtpaar op het spoor toen de vrouw zonder succes het kind wilde registreren bij de burgerlijke stand. De man van 53 en vrouw van 48, die zelf geen kinderen konden krijgen, kochten het kind in maart via een tussenpersoon.
Dinsdag werden twee Ierse Romakinderen weggehaald bij hun families omdat ze totaal niet op hun ouders leken. Toen DNA-testen de biologische banden met hun ouders bewezen, werden ze teruggebracht. Vorige week bleek dat het meisje 'Maria' in een Grieks Romakamp geen biologisch kind van haar ouders was, maar een ontvoerde baby zou kunnen zijn. De controle op Griekse Romakampen is na deze gevallen aangescherpt.
http://www.telegraaf.nl/b(...)_euro_gekocht__.html
Dinsdag werden twee Ierse Romakinderen weggehaald bij hun families omdat ze totaal niet op hun ouders leken. Toen DNA-testen de biologische banden met hun ouders bewezen, werden ze teruggebracht. Vorige week bleek dat het meisje 'Maria' in een Grieks Romakamp geen biologisch kind van haar ouders was, maar een ontvoerde baby zou kunnen zijn. De controle op Griekse Romakampen is na deze gevallen aangescherpt.
http://www.telegraaf.nl/b(...)_euro_gekocht__.html
Ik noem een Tony van Heemschut,een Loeki Knol,een Brammetje Biesterveld en natuurlijk een Japie Stobbe !
zo werkt mensenhandel nou eenmaal, dit is niet mijn mening. jij woont in europa waar blanke huid blond haar en lichte ogen voor jou heel normaal is, uiteraard. voor ons zijn aziaten exotisch, voor ons zijn afrikanen exotisch (tenzij je natuurlijk bent opgegroeid in een grote stad of een dergelijke plaats met etnische diversiteit, en natuurlijk zijn niet-europanen (als in niet slavisch, germaans, etc) in europa steeds meer een normaal verschijnsel)). in afrika en azië, die een veel grotere en ook wat meer homogene bevolking hebben, zijn lichte mensen exotisch. exotisch hier houdt in, 'bijzonder', 'niet vaak voorkomend' of 'zeldzaam', 'anders dan ons'. als ik het goed heb heeft meer dan 90% van de wereldbevolking donker haar en donkere ogen. ongeveer 2% van de wereldbevolking heeft blond haar en volgens ietsje minder dan 2% heeft rood haar. lichte kinderen zijn veel waard in de wereld van mensenhandel, dat is niet moeilijk voor te stellen. ik herinner me dat kinderen met donker/zwart haar en blauwe ogen ook veel geld vangen.quote:
[..]
Waarom? Of lul je maar wat? Kan het mij niet voorstellen namelijk. Er zijn zoveel van dat soort kinderen met zo'n standaard blond blank uiterlijk.
dat is dan jouw eigen mening. wij blanke mensen in onze westerse landen adopteren veel chinese meisjes en afrikaanse kindertjes.mijn grootouders hebben drie chinese meisjes geadopteerd. maar als we naar de hele wereld kijken, zijn er miljarden afrikanen en chinezen maar niet zoveel lichte europese kinderen die een wijd spectrum vertonen wat betreft huidskleur, oogkleur, haarkleur.quote:Kinderen met krulletjes zijn veel schattiger.
Je bent snel Tongquote:
ATHENE - Een Grieks echtpaar is door de politie gearresteerd omdat zij voor 4000 euro een baby hadden gekocht van Roma. De politie kwam het echtpaar op het spoor toen de vrouw zonder succes het kind wilde registreren bij de burgerlijke stand. De man van 53 en vrouw van 48, die zelf geen kinderen konden krijgen, kochten het kind in maart via een tussenpersoon.
Dinsdag werden twee Ierse Romakinderen weggehaald bij hun families omdat ze totaal niet op hun ouders leken. Toen DNA-testen de biologische banden met hun ouders bewezen, werden ze teruggebracht. Vorige week bleek dat het meisje 'Maria' in een Grieks Romakamp geen biologisch kind van haar ouders was, maar een ontvoerde baby zou kunnen zijn. De controle op Griekse Romakampen is na deze gevallen aangescherpt.
http://www.telegraaf.nl/b(...)_euro_gekocht__.html
http://www.ekathimerini.c(...)_1_25/10/2013_524808
Greek couple in Athens charged with abduction after allegedly buying Roma baby
Friday October 25, 2013 (11:30)
A Greek couple faced a prosecutor on Friday charged with abduction after reportedly purchasing an infant from a Roma woman in Zefyri, northern Athens, for 4,000 euros.
The 53-year-old man and 48-year-old woman were arrested in the area of Ano Liosia after police received a tipoff that they had a little girl in their home that was not their biological child.
According to police investigators, the couple were given the Roma child by its mother in Zefyri in March after giving her 4,000 euros in cash. The alleged exchange was made when the child was just a few days old.
The 48-year-old is alleged to have tried, unsuccessfully, to register the child at the local municipality.
The infant has been taken to Athens' Aghia Sofia children's hospital for medical tests.
Gepubliceerd op 23 okt 2013
The high-profile cases of two young girls in Greece and Ireland have highlighted the treatment of children in Roma communities across Europe.
DNA tests conducted in central Greece on a blonde-haired girl known as Maria have shown that the couple looking after her were not her biological parents.
Tests were also carried out on a girl taken into care in Dublin, although they have concluded that she was living with her biological parents. Police had initially not been persuaded by the birth certificate and passport provided by the family, reports said.
Both stories, one on the western fringes of Europe and the other in the east, involve blonde-haired girls with disputed documents.
"Not all Roma communities have dark skin: there are Roma who have light skin and green eyes," says Dezideriu Gergely, head of the Budapest-based European Roma Rights Centre. Criminal organisations bring hundreds of children from the Balkans to Greece, where they are subjected to forced labour, sex-trafficking or sold to couples" Greece's child-trafficking problem
He is concerned about the dangers of racial profiling and insists Maria's case in Greece should be viewed as unusual. While it is not uncommon for children to be raised by extended families, for example by grandparents, Mr Gergely considers it rare for children to be brought up beyond their biological families.
"Definitely there is a need for an answer. Something was not right and that is for the court to investigate." What alarms him is the labelling of an entire community.
There has been widespread interest in Maria, particularly because of the high-profile disappearances of two British blonde-haired children: Madeleine McCann in Portugal in 2007 and Ben Needham on the Greek island of Kos in 1991.
Indeed, the authorities have themselves internationalised the story with Interpol asking 190 countries to check for a possible match to Maria's DNA, to assess whether she has been a victim of child abduction or trafficking.
Mr Gergely believes the latest cases may resurrect old hatreds and myths of babies being stolen. Roma in already-marginalised communities such as Serbia have complained of racial discrimination. But he does acknowledge that the Roma may have been exposed to child traffickers.
"It's true the Roma are a vulnerable group because of extreme poverty, low income and low levels of education. But it's not related to cultural factors or to do with the Roma community, let's say, getting involved in trafficking."
The UN children's agency Unicef has told the BBC that Roma communities are often used by traffickers because they are seen as "under the radar of society".
As many as 3,000 children in Greece are in the hands of child-trafficking rings originating in Bulgaria, Romania and other Balkan countries, Unicef says.
Continue reading the main story
"Start Quote Social workers have contacted us with very serious child protection concerns"
Siobhan Curran Pavee Point, Ireland
Most cases are not thought to involve abduction but rather the buying and selling of children for a few thousand euros.
Part of the problem in Greece appears to lie in its localised and out-of-date child-registration system. And yet, ever since the mid-1990s, the European Union has tried to ensure all Roma communities across Europe are fully registered.
Most Roma, some 95%, are in settled communities in the EU and both Maria's case and that of the girl in the Tallaght suburb of Dublin involve settled families. In other words, there is no obvious need for paperwork problems.
But for all the efforts to bring Roma families into national databases, many are still clearly beyond the system.
The couple who registered Maria, according to the Greek authorities, used false identification and claimed to have had six children in under 10 months. And Greece's supreme court has called for an urgent investigation across the country into birth certificates issued since 2008.
The prosecutor's order warns that Maria's case may not be unique. "This could have happened in other parts of the country," it warns.
In Ireland, too, there are concerns about the registration system, which have alarmed Siobhan Curran, Roma project co-ordinator at the Pavee Point travellers and Roma centre.
She has seen many in Ireland's 5,000 Roma population struggle to get hold of social benefits because of what she sees as "very harsh criteria" needed to meet what is known as the habitual residence condition. Poor literacy and language can also be a problem for Roma looking for a job when they try to register for the Personal Public Service number (PPS), required for tax purposes.
She describes a vicious cycle where families are unable to obtain a medical card because they are unable to prove they are entitled to one. When they fail to take a child to a local doctor for care, social services are then called in.
Wat een tokkies, of mag ik dat niet hardop zeggen?
VDGG - Steven Wilson - Jacco Gardner - Pussy Riot - Malala Yousafzai - René Goscinny (RIP)
"The Least We Can Do, Is Wave To Each Other!"
"The Least We Can Do, Is Wave To Each Other!"
Wel 'grappig'. Nu blijkt dat de kinderen niet ontvoerd zijn, wordt het accent verlegd naar de levensomstandigheden.
Curiosity cultured the cat
Hoge dames vangen veel wind
Whadda ya hear! Whadda ya say!
What is any ocean but a multitude of drops?
Hoge dames vangen veel wind
Whadda ya hear! Whadda ya say!
What is any ocean but a multitude of drops?
http://www.telegraaf.nl/b(...)ria_Bulgaarse__.html
vr 25 okt 2013, 15:54
DNA-test: Moeder Maria Bulgaarse
LAMIA -
Maria, het meisje dat vorige week bij Roma-zigeuners in Griekenland werd gevonden, is van Bulgaarse afkomst. Dat staat nu defiinitief vast na een DNA-onderzoek.
Volgens lokale media is haar moeder de 35-jarige Sasha Ruseva uit Burgas, een stad aan de Zwarte Zee. Maria werd gevonden tijdens een politie-inval in het Roma-kamp. Het meisje viel op omdat ze met haar blonde haar totaal niet op haar 'ouders' leek. Uit DNA-testen bleek dat dat inderdaad niet het geval was.
Ruseva zou het meisje hebben gebaard in de Griekse stad Lamia, niet ver van het Roma-kamp waar Maria werd gevonden. Het ziekenhuis daar bevestigt dat ze op 31 januari 2009 beviel van een dochter. Die datum gaven de Roma-ouders ook op als geboortedatum.
vr 25 okt 2013, 15:54
DNA-test: Moeder Maria Bulgaarse
LAMIA -
Maria, het meisje dat vorige week bij Roma-zigeuners in Griekenland werd gevonden, is van Bulgaarse afkomst. Dat staat nu defiinitief vast na een DNA-onderzoek.
Volgens lokale media is haar moeder de 35-jarige Sasha Ruseva uit Burgas, een stad aan de Zwarte Zee. Maria werd gevonden tijdens een politie-inval in het Roma-kamp. Het meisje viel op omdat ze met haar blonde haar totaal niet op haar 'ouders' leek. Uit DNA-testen bleek dat dat inderdaad niet het geval was.
Ruseva zou het meisje hebben gebaard in de Griekse stad Lamia, niet ver van het Roma-kamp waar Maria werd gevonden. Het ziekenhuis daar bevestigt dat ze op 31 januari 2009 beviel van een dochter. Die datum gaven de Roma-ouders ook op als geboortedatum.
Large scale police operations in Roma camps
Police vow to step up law enforcement in Roma settlements across the country but deny the raids are related to the Maria case
Police had said that a number of recent raids on Roma settlements in Athens and Thessaloniki are unrelated to the case of the girl found living with a couple who were not her birth parents last week and are just a part of routine checks for criminal activity.
Some human rights groups had criticised the large-scale police operations, which took place in various Roma camps in the areas of Perea and Diavata in Thessaloniki and Zefyri and Auliza in Acharnes, northern Athens, on Tuesday and which resulted in a total of 156 detentions and 10 arrests.
According to the police statement, of the 51 people detained in Thessaloniki, one has pending conviction for tax evasion and will be led before a prosecutor. A total of 24 house searches also took place, in the presence of a prosecutor.
In Attica checks were carried out on 230 people and 50 vehicles, while the identities of a number of children in three Roma families were controlled.
Police said that they detained 105 people in total, of whom nine were arrested.
They added that two men, for whom warrants existed in relation to ATM robberies, and five undocumented migrants, were among those arrested. Deportation proceedings would be initiated against the migrants.
Police says that in the first nine months of 2013, 609 operations involving the Roma community took place in Attica, in which: 13,358 people were detained, 254 were arrested and 854 violations were confirmed.
At the same time, 1,131 police operations in Roma camps took place in the whole country. Where in total (including Attica) 19,067 were detained, 1,305 were arrested and 4,651 violations were confirmed.
Police said the will step up their activities in Roma settlements across the country in the coming months.
Typisch hèquote:Op vrijdag 25 oktober 2013 14:04 schreef Copycat het volgende:
Wel 'grappig'. Nu blijkt dat de kinderen niet ontvoerd zijn, wordt het accent verlegd naar de levensomstandigheden.
Er moet toch wat te kankeren zijn. En je moet je eigen leugens over al die kindslaafjes toch een beetje naar de achtergrond zien te praten. Al komen nu alweer de berichten op dat het meisje pas over een jaar of zeven verkocht zou worden..Maar goed, bronnen als the daily mail aanhalen is dan ook veelzeggend. Meisje zit nu in ieder geval in een foster home in Bulgarije.
"For the man sound of body and serene of mind, there is no such thing as bad weather; Every day has its beauty. And storms which whip the blood, do make it pulse more vigorously."
http://www.ekathimerini.c(...)_1_25/10/2013_524887
Friday October 25, 2013
Ombudsman slams treatment of Roma by Greek state and media
Greece’s citizens’ advocate issued a scathing assessment on Friday of the way authorities and the media had handled the case of Maria, the young girl taken from a Roma family last week after authorities found her DNA did not match that of her supposed parents.
The Ombudsman said that the case had highlighted the poor provisions for protecting minors in Greece and called on the government to make this “a priority of national policy.” The watchdog said authorities also needed to urgently examine the adoption process in Greece.
With officials waiting to see if a DNA test on a Roma woman in Bulgaria will prove she is Maria’s mother, the Ombudsman also criticized some media for reproducing “stereotypes and racist attitudes.” The watchdog emphasized that the state is doing too little to combat the Roma’s social exclusion. It called for more regular visits of social workers to Roma encampments and greater efforts to register Gypsies as full citizens of Greece.
Friday October 25, 2013
Ombudsman slams treatment of Roma by Greek state and media
Greece’s citizens’ advocate issued a scathing assessment on Friday of the way authorities and the media had handled the case of Maria, the young girl taken from a Roma family last week after authorities found her DNA did not match that of her supposed parents.
The Ombudsman said that the case had highlighted the poor provisions for protecting minors in Greece and called on the government to make this “a priority of national policy.” The watchdog said authorities also needed to urgently examine the adoption process in Greece.
With officials waiting to see if a DNA test on a Roma woman in Bulgaria will prove she is Maria’s mother, the Ombudsman also criticized some media for reproducing “stereotypes and racist attitudes.” The watchdog emphasized that the state is doing too little to combat the Roma’s social exclusion. It called for more regular visits of social workers to Roma encampments and greater efforts to register Gypsies as full citizens of Greece.
Toch fijn dat FANN ieder lullig berichtje dat hieromtrent opgemaakt wordt plaatst. Kan ze ook niet beginnen met Frans-, Duits-, Spaans-, en Griekstalige berichten?
"For the man sound of body and serene of mind, there is no such thing as bad weather; Every day has its beauty. And storms which whip the blood, do make it pulse more vigorously."
Oké als het persoonlijk wordt trek ik mij terug uit dit topic.quote:
Toch fijn dat FANN ieder lullig berichtje dat hieromtrent opgemaakt wordt plaatst. Kan ze ook niet beginnen met Frans-, Duits-, Spaans-, en Griekstalige berichten?
Ik geef alleen de berichten door. maar neem jij het maar over dan.
Doen wequote:
[..]
Oké als het persoonlijk wordt trek ik mij terug uit dit topic.
Ik geef alleen de berichten door. maar neem jij het maar over dan.
"For the man sound of body and serene of mind, there is no such thing as bad weather; Every day has its beauty. And storms which whip the blood, do make it pulse more vigorously."
Tja, misschien is het nu niet meer interessant omdat het toch een zigeunerkindje is?quote:
[..]
En toen was het stil... in dit topic.
Misschien is het hele onderwerp zigeunerkinderen die in die kampen leven niet meer interessant?
Dven zou het verder overnemen, maar ik heb het gevoel dat het onderwerp dood zal bloeden,
misschien valt er nog iets te lezen in de ''Zwarte Piet'' topics, die lopen als een trein
Goed artikel over de stereotyperingen en de gevolgen van deze hysterie voor de Roma-gemeenschappen in Europa:
http://www.nytimes.com/20(...)-their-own.html?_r=0
http://www.nytimes.com/20(...)-their-own.html?_r=0
Curiosity cultured the cat
Hoge dames vangen veel wind
Whadda ya hear! Whadda ya say!
What is any ocean but a multitude of drops?
Hoge dames vangen veel wind
Whadda ya hear! Whadda ya say!
What is any ocean but a multitude of drops?
Eindelijk weer nieuws !quote:Op zaterdag 26 oktober 2013 08:54 schreef Copycat het volgende:
Goed artikel over de stereotyperingen en de gevolgen van deze hysterie voor de Roma-gemeenschappen in Europa:
http://www.nytimes.com/20(...)-their-own.html?_r=0
Geen nieuws, maar duidende achtergrond.quote:
Op Ik denk ook dat er amper nog nieuws zal komen in deze non-zaak.
Curiosity cultured the cat
Hoge dames vangen veel wind
Whadda ya hear! Whadda ya say!
What is any ocean but a multitude of drops?
Hoge dames vangen veel wind
Whadda ya hear! Whadda ya say!
What is any ocean but a multitude of drops?
Nee, zo'n gevoel heb ik ook.quote:
[..]
Ik denk ook dat er amper nog nieuws zal komen.
[ Bericht 1% gewijzigd door FANNvanhetlaatsteuur op 26-10-2013 09:08:08 ]
quote:
[..]
A MONTH!!!!!!!!!!!!!
En wij maar lappen aan die bodemloze griekse put.
quote:
[..]
Schandalig natuurlijk, maar die Grieken mogen zelf hun administratie ook wel wat beter op orde brengen!
Nog eerst even dit ''misverstandje'' rechtzetten aangezien er komt toch geen nieuws meer te verwachten valt.quote:
[..]
Crap, hier in Nederland krijg je tussen de 191 en 274 per kind per kwartaal
Kinderbijslag in Griekenland is 40 euro per kind per maand, maar als je je eigen winkeltje hebt
bijvoorbeeld is het 0 euro's dus niks noppes nada.
Wanneer je inkomen meer dan 7000 euro per jaar is krijg je ook niks.
De meeste mensen zitten net een béétje boven die 7000 euro's.
Ik heb het even nagevraagd namelijk want ik wist het niet uit mijn hoofd.
Dus geen paniekquote:it's 40 euros per kid,it was 30 something but they raised it last year....
But,when you have your own shop,you get 0 euros
Just like my brother Elias
and,when your income per year is over 7000 euros,you also get 0 euros per kid....
and many people are just a little bit over the 7000 euros limit
Omdat er niets aan de hand is, maar weer eens door de nieuwsbladen een hoop drama is veroorzaakt. Puur omdat het over roma gaat...quote:
[..]
Tja, misschien is het nu niet meer interessant omdat het toch een zigeunerkindje is?
Misschien is het hele onderwerp zigeunerkinderen die in die kampen leven niet meer interessant?
Dven zou het verder overnemen, maar ik heb het gevoel dat het onderwerp dood zal bloeden,
misschien valt er nog iets te lezen in de ''Zwarte Piet'' topics, die lopen als een trein
The Art Of Lying
Natuurlijk is er wel iets aan de hand ik snap dat doodzwijgen nooit zo goed.quote:
[..]
Omdat er niets aan de hand is, maar weer eens door de nieuwsbladen een hoop drama is veroorzaakt. Puur omdat het over roma gaat...
Als het water wordt afgesloten bij de Hongaarse Roma's is dit ook ''nieuws''
http://www.volkskrant.nl/(...)-ondanks-hitte.dhtml
En juist omdat het in het nieuws komt veranderen er dingen en wordt het water weer aangesloten.quote:Gemeente sluit duizenden Hongaarse Roma af van water, ondanks hitte
06/08/13, 18:34
Duizenden Hongaarse Roma hebben ondanks de hitte al dagen bijna geen water tot hun beschikking. De gemeente Ozd, een stad in het noorden van Hongarije, is van mening dat Roma water verspillen en heeft een groot deel van hun watervoorziening afgesneden.
Roma in Oost-Europa zijn vaak te arm om aangesloten te worden op de watervoorziening in hun huizen en zijn daarom afhankelijk van waterpompen die aan de weg staan. Ozd heeft ongeveer 36.000 inwoners, van wie eenderde Roma is. De temperatuur kan daar in de zomer oplopen tot 40 graden Celsius.
Het gemeentebestuur van Ozd wordt geleid door Fidesz, de conservatieve partij van de Hongaarse premier Viktor Orban. Volgens de regeringspartij is het besluit van de gemeente Ozd 'verantwoord en rechtmatig'. De socialistische oppositiepartij heeft minister van Binnenlandse Zaken Sandor Pinter opgeroepen om de watertoevoer in de gemeente te herstellen.
Als dit niet in het nieuws was gekomen was het water echt niet binnen een dag weer aangesloten.quote:http://www.volkskrant.nl/(...)se-Roma-in-Ozd.dhtml
Weer water voor Hongaarse Roma in Ozd
07/08/13, 16:50
Hongaarse Roma in de gemeente Ozd, een stad in het noorden van Hongarije, zullen vanaf woensdagavond weer water tot hun beschikking hebben. Op verzoek van de minister van Binnenlandse Zaken Sandor Pinter beloofde de burgemeester van Ozd woensdag om de waterpompen weer aan te sluiten.
De gemeente Ozd was van mening dat de Roma-zigeuners water verspillen en had een groot deel van hun watervoorziening afgesneden. Naar verwachting wordt het donderdag 40 graden Celsius in Hongarije. Het is niet bekend of de pompen definitief weer worden aangesloten of tijdelijk wegens de hitte. Roma in Oost-Europa zijn vaak te arm om aangesloten te worden op de watervoorziening in hun huizen.
Maar dit topic gaat over ontvoerde kinderen ... Die niet ontvoerd bleken te zijn.
Curiosity cultured the cat
Hoge dames vangen veel wind
Whadda ya hear! Whadda ya say!
What is any ocean but a multitude of drops?
Hoge dames vangen veel wind
Whadda ya hear! Whadda ya say!
What is any ocean but a multitude of drops?
Niet gestolen dus..
We live at a time when emotions and feelings count more than truth, and there is a vast ignorance of science. - James Lovelock
en nu is alles weer goed?quote:
Maar dit topic gaat over ontvoerde kinderen ... Die niet ontvoerd bleken te zijn.
ook volgens unicef zijn roma vaak betrokken bij child trafficking, omdat ze onder de radar van de overheid opereren.quote:
[..]
Omdat er niets aan de hand is, maar weer eens door de nieuwsbladen een hoop drama is veroorzaakt. Puur omdat het over roma gaat...
The Guardian schrijft er nu over http://www.theguardian.co(...)ia-bulgaria-roma-dna
Waarom is er volgens jou niets aan de hand bij dit meisje?
Neh.... meer een illegale adoptie waarvan eerder werd geroepen dat ditquote:
sociaal geaccepteerd is in Griekenland, maar wat dus niet helemaal blijkt te kloppen.
aangezien er ook een kind is weggehaald bij een Grieks echtpaar die een Roma kind
hadden gekocht.
Nu blijt de hysterie ongegrond te zijn. En probeert men er andere zaken bij te slepen om toch maar die zwarte piet asn de Roma's toe te delen. Maar het onderwerp van dit topic bleek toch echt vals.quote:
en nu is alles weer goed?
Curiosity cultured the cat
Hoge dames vangen veel wind
Whadda ya hear! Whadda ya say!
What is any ocean but a multitude of drops?
Hoge dames vangen veel wind
Whadda ya hear! Whadda ya say!
What is any ocean but a multitude of drops?
Het zou toch beter zijn om een manier te vinden dat die kinderen niet ''per ongeluk'' bij de verkeerdequote:
[..]
Nu blijt de hysterie ongegrond te zijn. En probeert men er andere zaken bij te slepen om toch maar die zwarte piet asn de Roma's toe te delen. Maar het onderwerp van dit topic bleek toch echt vals.
mensen terecht komen? Dus dat die illegale adopties kunnen worden gestopt en de kinderen
op een ''normale'' manier geadopteerd zouden kunnen worden, zodat ze niet verkeerd terecht komen.
Tja en de fraude met kinderbijslag moet natuurlijk ook op de één of andere manier aangepakt worden
toch? Je kan dit ook niet zomaar afdoen als, ''niks aan de hand mensen, allemaal doorlopen''.
Ja TT klopt niet meer maar ik ben geen modje, vraag om een TT change ofzo
Ik ben trouwens ook niet TS..
Wie zegt dat je TS bent? Wil je over illegale adopties praten, open daar dan een topic over. Lijkt mij efficiënter dan in dit NWS-topic off topic gaan.
Curiosity cultured the cat
Hoge dames vangen veel wind
Whadda ya hear! Whadda ya say!
What is any ocean but a multitude of drops?
Hoge dames vangen veel wind
Whadda ya hear! Whadda ya say!
What is any ocean but a multitude of drops?
Niemand, ik zeg het even voor de zekerheid.quote:Op zaterdag 26 oktober 2013 14:54 schreef Copycat het volgende:
Wie zegt dat je TS bent? Wil je over illegale adopties praten, open daar dan een topic over. Lijkt mij efficiënter dan in dit NWS-topic off topic gaan.
Nee, ik ga geen topic openen
prima als iedereen dit onderwerp als afgesloten beschouwd,maar vreemd vind ik dat wel.
Het nieuwsonderwerp bleek niet te kloppen. Dan kun je het wel over een andere boeg gaan gooien, maar dan heeft het toch niets meer van doen met het initiële onderwerp?quote:
Niemand, ik zeg het even voor de zekerheid.
Nee, ik ga geen topic openen
maar vreemd vind ik dat wel.
Bij mij heeft de TS trouwens een kek kleurtje. Heel handig.
Curiosity cultured the cat
Hoge dames vangen veel wind
Whadda ya hear! Whadda ya say!
What is any ocean but a multitude of drops?
Hoge dames vangen veel wind
Whadda ya hear! Whadda ya say!
What is any ocean but a multitude of drops?
Het orginele nieuws heeft ander nieuws aan het licht gebracht natuurlijk.quote:Op zaterdag 26 oktober 2013 15:09 schreef Copycat het volgende:
[quote]Het nieuwsonderwerp bleek niet te kloppen. Dan kun je het wel over een andere boeg gaan gooien, maar dan heeft het toch niets meer van doen met het initiële onderwerp?
Dus dan is het oorzaak /gevolg, maar zei al, prima als het onderwerp daarmee afgesloten is.
Ja, da's hip, dat heb ik dan weer niet.quote:Bij mij heeft de TS trouwens een kek kleurtje. Heel handig.
Nee, het originele nieuws bleek geen nieuws en nu wordt er van alles bijgesleept.
Enfin, herhaling van zetten, we gaan het niet eens worden.
Enfin, herhaling van zetten, we gaan het niet eens worden.
Curiosity cultured the cat
Hoge dames vangen veel wind
Whadda ya hear! Whadda ya say!
What is any ocean but a multitude of drops?
Hoge dames vangen veel wind
Whadda ya hear! Whadda ya say!
What is any ocean but a multitude of drops?
quote:
Enfin, herhaling van zetten, we gaan het niet eens worden.
Dit topic gaat niet over water, dit gaat over het feit dat jij en je kornuiten de roma als kinderdieven te boek wil zetten.quote:Op zaterdag 26 oktober 2013 14:11 schreef FANNvanhetlaatsteuur het volgende:
[..]
Natuurlijk is er wel iets aan de hand ik snap dat doodzwijgen nooit zo goed.
Als het water wordt afgesloten bij de Hongaarse Roma's is dit ook ''nieuws''
http://www.volkskrant.nl/(...)-ondanks-hitte.dhtml
[..]
En juist omdat het in het nieuws komt veranderen er dingen en wordt het water weer aangesloten.
[..]
Als dit niet in het nieuws was gekomen was het water echt niet binnen een dag weer aangesloten.
The Art Of Lying
Wat een Bullshitquote:
[..]
Dit topic gaat niet over water, dit gaat over het feit dat jij en je kornuiten de roma als kinderdieven te boek wil zetten.
Ik zou niet weten wie hier ''mijn kornuiten'' zijn trouwens.
Door te ontkennen dat er flink iets mis is daar help je de boel niet hoor, want juist omdat er flink iets
mis is zijn dit soort Stichtingen opgericht, als je nu gaat ontkennen dat er van alles mis is, kunnen
ze die stichtingen wel opheffen.
http://stichtingroma.nl/
ook goed.
mis is zijn dit soort Stichtingen opgericht, als je nu gaat ontkennen dat er van alles mis is, kunnen
ze die stichtingen wel opheffen.
http://stichtingroma.nl/
ook goed.
Nogmaals daar gaat het in dit topic niet over, maak lekker je eigen drama topic aan. En daarnaast er zijn genoeg stichtingen voor van alles en nog wat dus ook voor roma kindjes.quote:
Door te ontkennen dat er flink iets mis is daar help je de boel niet hoor, want juist omdat er flink iets
mis is zijn dit soort Stichtingen opgericht, als je nu gaat ontkennen dat er van alles mis is, kunnen
ze die stichtingen wel opheffen.
http://stichtingroma.nl/
ook goed.
The Art Of Lying
Nogmaals, ik ga helemaal geen topic aanmaken, er was er al eentje, die ik ook niet geopend heb trouwensquote:
[..]
Nogmaals daar gaat het in dit topic niet over, maak lekker je eigen drama topic aan. En daarnaast er zijn genoeg stichtingen voor van alles en nog wat dus ook voor roma kindjes.
maar die is ook stilgelegd en zelf Dven geloofde niet dat het een zigeunerkind was NWS / mensenhandel door roma'sDus je moet gewoon niet de zaken gaan omdraaien en als een soort hooligan tegen mij tekeer
gaan, het maakt trouwens nul indruk op mij dat hooligangedrag.
Toch goed dat het ontdekt is en mooi dat in ieder geval 4 van de kinderen zo snel naar een pleeggezin
konden.
http://www.ad.nl/ad/nl/10(...)huis-geplaatst.dhtml
30-10-13
Broers en zussen Roma-meisje Maria uit huis geplaatst
Moeder Sasha Ruseva met een van Maria's zusjes
De meeste broertjes en zusjes van het 4-jarige Roma-meisje Maria zijn uit huis geplaatst door de Bulgaarse autoriteiten. Maria werd 2 weken geleden aangetroffen in een Roma-kamp in Griekenland, waar ze bij mensen woonde die niet haar ouders waren. De zoektocht naar de echte ouders van het blonde meisje werd wereldnieuws.
Vorige week bleek uit een DNA-test dat ze thuishoorde bij een Roma-familie in Bulgarije. Televisiebeelden van dat gezin zorgden echter voor ophef. De kinderen leefden in diepe armoede, waren slecht gekleed, sliepen op de grond en spraken nauwelijks Bulgaars.
Vier van de kinderen gaan naar een pleeggezin, twee andere naar een Bulgaars opvanginstituut.
Nog eens twee kinderen zijn boven de 18 en vallen niet meer onder de bescherming van de autoriteiten.
Maria zelf is opgevangen door een liefdadigheidsinstelling in de Griekse hoofdstad Athene. Naar haar biologische moeder Sasha Ruseva loopt nog een onderzoek. De vraag is of zij betaald heeft gekregen om Maria af te staan aan het Griekse stel. Ruseva ontkent dit.
konden.
http://www.ad.nl/ad/nl/10(...)huis-geplaatst.dhtml
30-10-13
Broers en zussen Roma-meisje Maria uit huis geplaatst
Moeder Sasha Ruseva met een van Maria's zusjes
De meeste broertjes en zusjes van het 4-jarige Roma-meisje Maria zijn uit huis geplaatst door de Bulgaarse autoriteiten. Maria werd 2 weken geleden aangetroffen in een Roma-kamp in Griekenland, waar ze bij mensen woonde die niet haar ouders waren. De zoektocht naar de echte ouders van het blonde meisje werd wereldnieuws.
Vorige week bleek uit een DNA-test dat ze thuishoorde bij een Roma-familie in Bulgarije. Televisiebeelden van dat gezin zorgden echter voor ophef. De kinderen leefden in diepe armoede, waren slecht gekleed, sliepen op de grond en spraken nauwelijks Bulgaars.
Vier van de kinderen gaan naar een pleeggezin, twee andere naar een Bulgaars opvanginstituut.
Nog eens twee kinderen zijn boven de 18 en vallen niet meer onder de bescherming van de autoriteiten.
Maria zelf is opgevangen door een liefdadigheidsinstelling in de Griekse hoofdstad Athene. Naar haar biologische moeder Sasha Ruseva loopt nog een onderzoek. De vraag is of zij betaald heeft gekregen om Maria af te staan aan het Griekse stel. Ruseva ontkent dit.
Ik heb niet gezegd dat ik niet geloof dat het een zigeunerkind is. Slechts gezegd dat ik het hoogst opmerkelijk zou vinden.quote:
[..]
Nogmaals, ik ga helemaal geen topic aanmaken, er was er al eentje, die ik ook niet geopend heb trouwens
Dus je moet gewoon niet de zaken gaan omdraaien en als een soort hooligan tegen mij tekeer
gaan, het maakt trouwens nul indruk op mij dat hooligangedrag.
"For the man sound of body and serene of mind, there is no such thing as bad weather; Every day has its beauty. And storms which whip the blood, do make it pulse more vigorously."
Dit.quote:
[..]
De kinderen zijn niet eng, de mensen die ze ''opvoeden'' zijn eng.
Klopt ja, de kinderen zelf kunnen er niks aan doen, heb ik vaak medelijden mee. Maar als die kinderen ouder worden en volwassen worden kunnen ze er wellicht meer aan doen om te integreren in de maatschappij. Ook al begrijp ik dat ze vaak gediscrimineerd worden alleen maar omdat ze er zo uitzien, ook als je als zigeuner moeite doet om je niet slecht te gedragen. Moeilijk issue.quote:
Vind wel dat die zigeuners westerse landen niet moeten lastigvallen met hun illegale kampen etc, oppleuren met dat.
Check my youtube channel with the best music and road movies: http://www.youtube.com/user/StarmanFR
Griekse Roma stel, hè.quote:
De vraag is of zij betaald heeft gekregen om Maria af te staan aan het Griekse stel. Ruseva ontkent dit.
Volgens mij komt het bij Roma vaker voor dat kinderen, om wat voor reden dan ook, door andere Roma worden opgevoed.
Maar goed, positieve nieuws is dat de schrijnende omstandigheden voor de boers en zussen van dit kind aan 't licht zijn gekomen en daar ingegrepen wordt.
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