Inderdaad. Ik gaf hem ook alle rondes, 29-28 zou je nog over kunnen discussiėren, maar The Dragon was duidelijk de betere en heeft meer damage veroorzaakt dan Hendo. Hendo wist Machida nauwelijks te raken, hij ontweek praktisch alles.quote:Op donderdag 28 februari 2013 17:00 schreef LitmanenAFCA het volgende:
Machida Hendo een draw? Machida domineerde het hele gevecht en ik gaf hem zelfs alle rondes net zoals de meeste mensen
het gaat niet meer om winst of verlies, als je maar tickets verkooptquote:Op donderdag 28 februari 2013 17:13 schreef Fyodor het volgende:
[..]
Inderdaad. Ik gaf hem ook alle rondes, 29-28 zou je nog over kunnen discussiėren, maar The Dragon was duidelijk de betere en heeft meer damage veroorzaakt dan Hendo. Hendo wist Machida nauwelijks te raken, hij ontweek praktisch alles.
Holy crap. Deze week nog wat compilatiefilmpjes van hem op youtube gezien.quote:Op woensdag 27 februari 2013 19:48 schreef Seamonkey- het volgende:
http://www.bndestem.nl/re(...)-overleden-1.3688970
Hartfalen tijdens training op de fiets. Ken die plek ook goed woon ik vlakbij
Dan verschillen wij van mening over wat domineren inhoudt. Begrijp me niet verkeerd, als ik zou moeten kiezen zou ik ook voor Machida gaan, maar ik vind dat er door beide kanten absoluut niet genoeg en significant gescoord is dat er eentje de winst verdiende.quote:Op donderdag 28 februari 2013 17:00 schreef LitmanenAFCA het volgende:
Machida Hendo een draw? Machida domineerde het hele gevecht en ik gaf hem zelfs alle rondes net zoals de meeste mensen
SPOILEROm spoilers te kunnen lezen moet je zijn ingelogd. Je moet je daarvoor eerst gratis Registreren. Ook kun je spoilers niet lezen als je een ban hebt.Je zou kunnen zeggen dat Machida deze ronde steelt door de trip + wat punches op het einde. Ik vind 'het stelen van een ronde' echter bullshit. Dit was een ronde waar er nauwelijks actie was en als die er al was was het nergens echt hard of gevaarlijk. Qua scorende technieken vind ik niet dat er een vechter dermate boven uit stak dat je een rondewinst kan rechtvaardigen, het ging gelijk op (of beter gezegd: er gebeurde bijna niets).
Ronde 2:SPOILEROm spoilers te kunnen lezen moet je zijn ingelogd. Je moet je daarvoor eerst gratis Registreren. Ook kun je spoilers niet lezen als je een ban hebt.Dit was de ronde met de meeste aktie van het gevecht. Hendo kwam een aantal keren in met zijn rechtse (en raakt 1 keer met een goede linkse), maar werd tegengehouden door Machida, soms gevolgd door een counterpunch/knee. Machida land een paar goede kicks + een 3 punch combination, Hendo heeft op het einde van de ronde wat succes.
Dit vind ik de "duidelijkste" ronde voor Machida, maar wederom is het bepaald niet overtuigend. Ja hij ontwijkt een paar keer goed, maar verder leverde er niets gevaar op. Hendo probeerde het hier wel, maar kwam er niet bij.
Ronde 3:SPOILEROm spoilers te kunnen lezen moet je zijn ingelogd. Je moet je daarvoor eerst gratis Registreren. Ook kun je spoilers niet lezen als je een ban hebt.In deze ronde gebeurde echt bijna niets. Paar minuten topcontrol (waar nauwelijks iets mee gedaan werd) voor de een versus een paar kicks van de ander. Ik kan er echt niet meer van maken dan dat dit een 10/10 was, tenzij we rondes uit gaan delen voor 1 kick naar het lichaam.
Mijn conclusie:
2 gave vechters (maakt me dus niets uit wie er wint), saai gevecht zonder aktie. De ene probeert wat, de ander ontwijkt. Nauwelijks gelande technieken en als ze al landen was het nooit hard of gevaarlijk, damage heeft het ook niet opgeleverd. Bovendien scoorde de een wat mij betreft niet meer technieken dan de ander. Dominant is het dus absoluut niet.![]()
Hier dan een lange breakdown over waarom Machida gewonnen heeft. Komt van sherdog.quote:Well, you were warned before you came in. If you've got "didn't read lol" .gifs, dig 'em up now. Here's my breakdown of the fight. Unlike a lot of folks here (and fucking Cecil Peoples) I scored this fight strongly for Machida. This article explains why. And I apologize for Sherdog messing up the picture formatting. I don't really know how to resize photos on here, so bear with the giant images, if you please.
Breakdown: Henderson vs. Machida
Well, the day came, and it went. The historic UFC 157 was a success and, while it didn’t possess the greatest card of fights, the event delivered what was promised. There were plenty of exciting moments: Urijah Faber clambered onto Ivan Menjivar’s back and sunk in a thrilling rear naked choke while the Salvadoran-Canadian stood helpless. And apparently unafraid of inviting even further comparison to the California Kid, Liz Carmouche attempted the same submission against Ronda Rousey, but ultimately failed to prevent the Rowdy One from adding yet another arm to her collection. And, as I predicted in last week’s article, Lyoto Machida walked away with the decision win over Dan Henderson.
The decision didn’t come easily, and I mentioned last week that Lyoto would have some struggles in this bout. The nature of the struggle, however, was not one that I predicted. Yes, Dan was a game opponent, and he remained a threat until the very last bell. But it wasn’t Dan that gave Lyoto trouble; it was the judges. Shockingly, the first score announced after the fight was in favor of Dan Henderson, 29 points to 28.
Lyoto’s face at the sound of that announcement mirrored my own. “What?” I thought. “How could anyone have scored that bout with two rounds in Dan’s favor?” I began having vivid flashbacks of Henderson vs. Ninja Rua. But my dear friend Machida and I were both relieved to hear that the next two judges had given Lyoto two of the rounds, securing him the win. Granted, I was convinced that Lyoto had won every round. But I wasn’t about to complain about the victory being given to the right person.
Looking it up later that night, I saw that this man was one of the judges:
…and immediately knew who to blame the pro-Henderson score on. I happily attributed the bizarre scores to the fifteen minute smoke break that Mr. Peoples undoubtedly took during the fight, and called it a day.
So imagine my surprise when I checked the message boards in the morning, and saw that a great number of people had scored the fight similarly. Machida was accused of running, being overly tentative, and failing to engage. I was puzzled, because the fight I watched gave me a different impression. The fight I watched looked an awful lot like, well… a Machida fight. I had expected no different. But lots of folks were disappointed with the Dragon’s performance, so I decided to review the fight and see if my initial assessment was wrong.
Well, people, I watched it again. And a third time, and a fourth. And, fortunately for me, I don’t feel there is any cause for me to rescind my initial opinion. I can go on being unrepentantly proud of my fight prediction skills, because that fight was Machida’s all the way. Furthermore, I still think there’s a strong case for giving him all three rounds. Let’s break down why.
(Note: This will not be a “Winning the Round” style of breakdown, despite the decision result. I just can’t limit myself to three techniques here. I hope you’re down for a long one. Grab a beer or fix some coffee–I’ll wait.)
ROUND ONE
Immediately after the fight began, Dan Henderson made his strategy clear. Machida struggled with defending low kicks against Mauricio Rua, and clearly Henderson’s camp thought this would be useful. Unfortunately, Hendo isn’t close to the kicker that Shogun was, and this was evident as he threw the first of many awkward, stiff-hipped low kicks.
There was some reasoning behind this. It’s well known that Dan loves to throw the lead inside leg kick as set up for his right hand. And if you didn’t know about it before the fight, Mike Goldberg saw fit to inform the audience appoximately seventeen times per round that it is, in fact, Dan’s favorite set up. But not everything Goldie talks about is stupid. It’s a smart combo. The opponent is immobilized by the kick, and the simple action of setting the kicking leg down leads very smoothly into the massive slobberknockin’ overhand that Dan favors. It’s worked well many times in the past.
But Lyoto is (usually) a southpaw. You could see Dan hungrily leap for the lead leg kick whenever Machida went orthodox in the first round, but Machida was wise to it and danced out of range, and otherwise the classic H-Bomb set up wasn’t an option. So Dan was relegated to throwing arthritic rear leg kicks instead. These kicks account for the relatively high number of strikes listed under Dan’s name in the CompuStrike summary, but they certainly didn’t count for much in the fight, and they’re no reason to give Henderson the first round.
A good jab would have really helped Dan here. If Hendo had prepared himself to step in behind a jab, he might have actually been able to pin Lyoto down or catch him mid-counter. Simple boxing suits Dan much better than the “Muay Thai” he was trying to bust out throughout this fight. And whereas a simple 1-2 is far from a guarantee against Machida, Dan’s kicks couldn’t have been hurting the Dragon any more than they were hurting his own toes. Very ineffective.
Machida, on the other hand, spent the first portion of the round just watching Henderson. He’s well known for his feinting movements, including the lady-killing rear-leg hip twist that he’s so fond of, and the Machida dance was on full display tonight. For over two full minutes the Brazilian read Henderson’s reactions carefully and avoided his strikes, only attacking himself with a handful of front kicks to the body. And then:
Lyoto unleashes his legendary straight left. This punch went largely unnoticed because of the camera angle and Machida’s blinding speed, but it lands solidly. As proof, Dan was wearing a shiny new contusion under his right eye for the rest of the fight. Notice how Lyoto intercepts Henderson–his left hand connects while Hendo is still in the process of loading up his right– and then immediately takes the angle and puts himself in a position to defend. Dan bullrushed him after this, but to no avail.
This little encounter proved to be the model for the rest of the night’s exchanges. Dan would jump in loading up the big punch, and Lyoto would intercept. Moments after this straight left, a hard left body kick interrupted another of Dan’s awkward kicks, followed by a pair of punches. Seconds later Dan lunged forward into the first knee of the night, which didn’t land perfectly, but certainly stopped the All-American’s momentum well enough.
And then Dan’s only real success in the entire fight.
Blammo! Lyoto takes the H-bomb to the chin, and another one to follow up. I’d like to say that I was impressed with Dan’s quickness on these shots, but at the time I was shitting myself. I was sure that Hendo had just knocked out Lyoto Machida. But the Brazilian ate the punches like Acai and, tying up with ten seconds remaining, sealed the round for good with a beautiful takedown.quote:
Machida has a very strong underhook, and he walks slowly backwards, feeling for Henderson’s weight to shift. As soon as he feels Dan step and put his weight on his left leg, Machida kicks out the right leg and twists the Greco-Roman wrestler down to the mat. Seconds left and Machida connects with a hard left hand and a forearm to the temple before walking away, mouthing the Portuguese for “like a boss” to himself. Meanwhile, Dan staggers back to his corner breathing hard, undoubtedly haunted by the ghost of Thiago Silva, whose fate he almost just met.
ROUND TWO
Round two showed us an increasingly frustrated Dan Henderson. Aside from those awkward kicks and one solid left hook, Henderson still finds it nearly impossible to lay a hand on the dragon. But far too many people are making the mistake of blaming this on Henderson. No, Dan did not present a wide array of attacks. He was pretty much always looking for that right hand, and his assault was further hampered by his reluctance to commit himself to that one attack the way he might have against a slower striker like Shogun. Granted, that conservative attitude might have saved Dan from suffering his first knockout at the precise hands of Machida.
Regardless, Dan’s frequent overhands couldn’t find their mark because of an adaptation that Machida has made recently to his game, one that I, for one, am very glad to see. Dan very well might have knocked out the Machida that fought Shogun, or even the one that was knocked down by Jon Jones just over a year ago. But not this Machida. Check out these stills:
Here we have what I believe is called Chudan Haishu Uke, or a high back hand block. It’s basically a variant of one of the first techniques you would learn as a six year old at a Karate dojo. And wouldn’t you know–the damn thing works! The Machida who used to backpedal away from strikes with his hands down and his chin in the air is no more! Well, he still carries his chin high, true. And yes, he still backpedals an awful lot. But by gum, he blocks when he does it now!
Would this sort of defense fly in high level boxing or kickboxing? Probably not. But Lyoto Machida proves once again that the simple self-defense minded techniques of Karate can be very effective in MMA.
Aside from defending, the Dragon was also able to land a front kick to the face followed by a series of punches, a spinning back kick at the end of the round, and a whole slew of vicious knees to the body. But the one attack that stood out in the second frame was this tremendous body kick.
Dan wants to throw a right hand. It would be nice for this one to catch Machida off-guard, but he’s Dan Henderson, damn it, so he telegraphs the shit out of it. Machida, of course, sees it coming, and immediately hop-steps into a huge left body kick. Notice how his head pulls back and slightly off-center when he kicks. Also, I don’t know if those two days in the company of Melvin Manhoef had any real effect, but this is much more of a powerful Thai-style kick than we’re used to seeing from Lyoto. He catches Henderson right across the liver with his shinbone while the American is reaching with a pawing jab, still cocking back his right hand. And the kick is so powerful, and catches Henderson at just the right moment, that it rips Hendo clean off his feet. Dan sprang right back up after this blow landed, and seemed determined to teach Tito Ortiz a thing or two about absorbing body shots, but the kick was spectacular nonetheless.
ROUND THREE
Final round, and Dan is getting frustrated. He threw up his hands in exasperation before walking back to his corner after the second round, and he comes out in the third still breathing heavily. Machida blasts him with a cracking bodykick, and then decides to play around with some sort of Zab Judah-esque 52 Blocks hand movement. You could call it feinting, but I call it too much time spent hanging out with Anderson Silva.
After another right hand is blocked (kiyah!), Dan tries a new technique. Wait, no. He tries an inside leg kick. Except this time it has a visible effect.
He catches Lyoto while the Brazilian is trying to counter him, and knocks his leg out from under him. The Karateka falls to the canvas with Dan inside his guard. This, right here, is the only justifiable reason I see to give Hendo a round. He controls Machida from the top and tries to land elbows to the body and leg, but Lyoto’s closed guard is very strong. I was a bit disappointed by this at first. I was hoping to see some submissions or sweeps from Machida. At one point he could have taken Dan’s back, but he seemed content to protect himself and ride out Dan’s assault. But then he showed us that there are some facets to his ground game with a slick hip bump sweep. He couldn’t put Dan in mount, but he managed to disengage and get back to his feet.
And, for those detractors of Machida’s evasive style, I would point to the final minutes of this fight as a counter. For the rest of the round, it’s Machida on the front foot and the gassed Dan Henderson retreating. The roles are reversed, except that Lyoto’s aggression is actually effective.
Lyoto first teaches Dan a lesson on throwing inside leg kicks with a vicious blow to the thigh. Soon after he throws the jumping front kick that he used against Couture, and follows it up with a blistering roundhouse kick. Both land directly on Dan Henderson’s granite chin, and he smiles at Lyoto. In response, Lyoto makes sure to do even more absurd hand movements for the rest of the round, including what appears to be the Lyoto Machida version of Nick Diaz’s favorite taunt.
Considering that Hendo was unable to do any considerable damage from his top position and spent the rest of the round retreating and defending without countering, there is still a very strong case for giving this round to Machida.
Throughout the fight, Machida landed the cleaner shots and avoided being hit himself, taking only two punches in the entire fight. Octagon control is a factor, but Lyoto displayed more of the coveted generalship than Dan throughout the bout. Remember, walking forward is not control. Allowing a guy to walk into your strikes while avoiding his is. Pat Barry recently said it best, and I’m paraphrasing: “Guy A is walking forward, Guy B is walking backward. If Guy B is landing more shots, then it’s time for Guy A to start running forward.” Simply walking into counters is not effective aggression.
So, Dan: I love you, buddy. But you knew coming into this what Machida was going to do. And Lyoto, despite all the detractors and booing goons in the crowd, I thought you did your work beautifully.
So. Who’s up for another try at the Machida Era?
‘Cause I sure as hell am.
There you go. Hope you enjoyed it. Don't forget to check out my other stuff at The Performance Enhancing Blog if you did.Now bring on the gifs!
Andrei Arlovski is a Belarusian heavyweight who has been in the MMA game for quite some time. His first professional fight dates back to 540 B.C. where Leonidas won as the underdog in Sparta![]()
Volgens dat systeem heeft Forrest Griffin meer strikes uitgedeeld dan Anderson Silva in hun gevechtquote:Op donderdag 28 februari 2013 19:41 schreef THEFXR het volgende:
http://blog.fightmetric.c(...)on-official-ufc.html![]()
'Stats don't always tell the story'Andrei Arlovski is a Belarusian heavyweight who has been in the MMA game for quite some time. His first professional fight dates back to 540 B.C. where Leonidas won as the underdog in Sparta![]()
dat klopt ook, alleen waren ze niet raak,lolquote:Op donderdag 28 februari 2013 19:43 schreef Fyodor het volgende:
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Volgens dat systeem heeft Forrest Griffin meer strikes uitgedeeld dan Anderson Silva in hun gevecht![]()
'Stats don't always tell the story'![]()
Thanks! Ga ik na het eten even lezen! Ik kom er op terug.quote:Op donderdag 28 februari 2013 19:35 schreef Fyodor het volgende:
Hier dan een lange breakdown over waarom Machida gewonnen heeft. Komt van sherdog.
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Volgens Compustrike heeft Forrest meer geraakt dan Silva:quote:Op donderdag 28 februari 2013 19:45 schreef THEFXR het volgende:
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dat klopt ook, alleen waren ze niet raak,lol
http://www.compustrike.com/stats_files/ufc_101/Silva-Griffin.HTM
Andrei Arlovski is a Belarusian heavyweight who has been in the MMA game for quite some time. His first professional fight dates back to 540 B.C. where Leonidas won as the underdog in Sparta![]()
ik gaf een link van fightmetric dat is wat anders dan compustrike!quote:Op donderdag 28 februari 2013 19:50 schreef Fyodor het volgende:
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Volgens Compustrike heeft Forrest meer geraakt dan Silva:
http://www.compustrike.com/stats_files/ufc_101/Silva-Griffin.HTM![]()
I know, maar het geeft gewoon aan dat je zulk soort systemen niet altijd even serieus moet nemen. Of het nou fightmetric of compustrike is.quote:Op donderdag 28 februari 2013 19:51 schreef THEFXR het volgende:
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ik gaf een link van fightmetric dat is wat anders dan compustrike!Andrei Arlovski is a Belarusian heavyweight who has been in the MMA game for quite some time. His first professional fight dates back to 540 B.C. where Leonidas won as the underdog in Sparta![]()
bij twijfel neem ik het serieus, net zoals bij diaz vs condit, blijkt uit de stats dat condit echt wel meer had geraakt.quote:Op donderdag 28 februari 2013 19:53 schreef Fyodor het volgende:
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I know, maar het geeft gewoon aan dat je zulk soort systemen niet altijd even serieus moet nemen. Of het nou fightmetric of compustrike is.![]()
Perfecte reviewquote:Op donderdag 28 februari 2013 19:35 schreef Fyodor het volgende:
Hier dan een lange breakdown over waarom Machida gewonnen heeft. Komt van sherdog.
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[..]![]()
O ja, fuckquote:Op woensdag 27 februari 2013 16:05 schreef THEFXR het volgende:
@Hooidraad, wat is de juiste stand aangezien Matthew Riddle's win is omgezet naar een NC?
Wordt z.s.m. aangepast.![]()
Uhm WTF, wordt deze pick echt aangepast?
Attended: UFC 99 - UFC 167 - UFC 175 - TUF 19 Finale - Invicta 13 - UFC 189 - Fight Night 84 / 87 / 90 - TUF 23 Finale - UFC 200 - UFC 205
4 time, 4 time, 4 time, 4 time TUP champion!!!![]()
tuurlijk, anders is het niet realistisch, het staat gewoon op de verboden lijst en gezien zijn ontslag neemt de UFC het ook hoog op, Vera werd ook uncut, ben benieuwd wat ze met mills gaan doen.quote:Op donderdag 28 februari 2013 20:59 schreef Fenomeno het volgende:
Deze zou voor mij voordelig uitpakken, maar gaan we dat soort dingen echt meenemen?![]()
Ik vind van niet eigenlijk.quote:Op donderdag 28 februari 2013 21:06 schreef Hooidraad het volgende:
Wat vindt de rest?
Ik lees het net van FXR, verder had ik er nog niet bij stilgestaan. Hoeft voor mij niet per se aangepast te worden hoor.![]()
ja tuurlijk, als sonnen had van silva gewonnen en wordt daarna positief getest, ja we passen het niet aan![]()
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Ik twijfel nog hoor, FXR heeft natuurlijk wel gelijk want uiteindelijk heeft Riddle niet gewonnen.
Maar aan de andere kant heeft Taz het in de andere seizoenen ook nooit gewijzigd (neem ik aan) en toen was er ook nooit een discussie over.
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