9/11-complot of *-->niet<--*? #02 [NWS]

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Op zaterdag 1 juli 2006 09:55 schreef atmosphere1 het volgende:

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Dat klopt , dus dat wil ik er ook niet mee aantonen. Wel wil ik aantonen dat men bewust niet ingegrepen heeft op 9/11 en er vooraf van wist

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Op zaterdag 1 juli 2006 10:37 schreef atmosphere1 het volgende:

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Ze dachten onkwetsbaar te zijn ?? De PNAC (latere regerings)leden dachten dat toch echt niet .
sterker nog ze hadde neen aanval op eigen grond verwacht van Osama Bin Laden
artikel van neocons / begin 2001 http://www.newamericancentury.org/defense-20010730.pdf

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Ook opmerkelijk is de luchtmacht oefening die overeen kwam met de echte aanslagen ,en ook nog op hetzelfde moment plaatsvonden. Had bin laden dat zo gepland?

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Earlier, Tenet told the commission that both the Clinton and Bush administrations took the threat of terrorism seriously and worked actively to disrupt al Qaeda.

"There was no lack of care or focus in the face of one of the greatest dangers our country has ever faced," Tenet said.

In a a staff statement on intelligence released Wednesday, the commission said "no agency did more to attack al Qaeda" than the CIA, but said there was an absence of a "robust, offensive, engagement across the entire U.S. government."

Tenet said the CIA, working with other agencies around the world, disrupted a number of terror plots during the alert leading up to January 1, 2000, celebrations.

But he said that the United States was "not systemically protected" against terrorism before the September 11 attacks.

Tenet said antiterror efforts were complicated because of the failure of various intelligence agencies to integrate data.

If intelligence had been shared, "We might have had a chance" to prevent the attacks, he said.

However, Tenet said he didn't think U.S. capture or killing of bin Laden would have prevented the attacks because the plot was already in place.

The failure to prevent the attacks was not purely a matter of intelligence sharing, he said.

"We didn't steal the secret that told us what the plot was, we didn't recruit the right people or technically collect the data, notwithstanding enormous effort to do so," Tenet said.

Tenet told the panel that the CIA began focusing on bin Laden in the early 1990s, even before bin Laden emerged as a leader of Islamic terrorist planning. Tenet said the CIA set up a special unit in 1996 to track bin Laden.

The CIA director testified that the terrorism threat changed fundamentally after bin Laden moved his operation in 1996 to Afghanistan, where he was sheltered by the country's Taliban rulers.

He said that in 1999 -- after bin Laden issued a 1998 fatwa calling on Muslims to kill Americans -- the CIA began developing a new plan to develop human and technical resources to use against bin Laden.

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Op zaterdag 1 juli 2006 13:20 schreef Verbal het volgende:

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Ik maak mij meer zorgen om de cover-up van een actief beleid om 9-11 mogelijk te maken en het uitwissen van sporen die leiden naar mensen die er aantoonbaar mee te maken hadden.

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Overigens, iemand zei in het vorige topic dat 'men' liever een bekende vijand ziet en daarom wil geloven in (op zijn minst) medeplichtigheid van types binnen het overheidsapparaat, want een onbekende vijand is eng.

Ik denk eerder dat het andersom is en dat mensen zo krampachtig en tegen beter weten in vasthouden aan de onschuld van de Amerikaanse regering omdat het enger is om het kwaad daar te zoeken dan bij een stel bebaarde soepjurken met kromzwaarden uit Mohammistan.

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Op zaterdag 1 juli 2006 16:02 schreef YuckFou het volgende:

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Dat denk ik dus ook, je hebt echt geen honderden mensen nodig om zoiets te flikken, een paar heel hoge gasten en wat mensen daaronder is genoeg om de zaak aan te sturen...


_{tevens TVP}

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Op zaterdag 1 juli 2006 18:13 schreef YuckFou het volgende:

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Doe 'es een gok...
Het is vrij simpel....piramides lopen spits toe, d.w.z. bovenin weinig mensen, onderin veel, bovenin weet wat er speelt en stuurt aan, onderin heeft geen weet en doet wat opgedragen wordt.
Ik ben er zelf redelijk van overtuigd dat diegene die ook aan het R.A.D. document hebben meegewerkt en nu in de Bush-administration dienen (en al meer dan 30/40 jaar in Washington zitten) van te voren wisten dat er een aanslag aan zat te komen en alles in het werk hebben gesteld om die aanslag door te laten gaan, niet zo drastisch door zelf het WTC op te blazen, wel door FBI onderzoek tegen te werken, wargames op 9-11 te oefenen en achteraf de fouten hebben proberen te verdoezelen, en dat is voor mij genoeg om over een conspiracy te spreken...

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The story...

Some criticise 9/11 conspiracy theories because they say must have involved "thousands of people", but that's missing the point. Governments work on a "need to know" basis, people may have some local knowledge of their own involvement, but only a few need to have the full picture.

Our take...

We've seen this argument used several times, and consider it misleading in the extreme. Why? Let's consider one example.

The "Flight 77 didn't hit the Pentagon" argument has to explain the debris that appeared, and damage like the broken street lights. Some suggest the answer is simple: the debris was planted, the street light damage faked. Now, if that happened, it's certainly most unlikely that those involved would also have in-depth knowledge of explosives in the WTC, but so what? That doesn't matter. If one person came forward to say "I was in a secret army team that planted fake debris at the Pentagon on 9/11", then don't you think that's going to be enough to create some considerable headlines?

And it's the same in many other areas. Planting explosives at the WTC, say. Being a member of Bush's secret service detail on 9/11 and saying you had advance knowledge of the attack, therefore knew he was in no danger. Being on the NIST or FEMA teams and explaining how you were leaned on to produce a conclusion that you don't believe makes sense. None of these people need know everything about 9/11, but they would all have enough information to completely change what we think about the event.

What's more, the "small conspiracy" argument also ignores what's supposed to be a huge coverup. Have you ever looked at the list of people involved in the FEMA and NIST WTC reports, for instance? What's the explanation for these academics, engineers and scientists producing something that others would have us believe is an incompetent tissue of lies? Why they've been "leaned on", of course, or they're scared of speaking out. In which case they're now also a part of the conspiracy, if only after the fact, and have to be included in the total.

What is the total? It's hard to say, not least because some people could have more than one conspiracy or coverup-related task. Still, here are some of the people who have very useful knowledge about 9/11 events (assuming you accept all the 9/11 conspiracy theories; cross off names here for the ones you don’t)

CIA agent Larry Mitchell for meeting with bin Laden in the months before 9/11, and everyone else in the CIA who knows they're not actually trying to capture him after all
GW Bush and various family members (if you're to believe the relevance of Bush family members being involved with the WTC security company Stratesec)
Condoleezza Rice (if you believe she had enough knowledge to warn Willie Brown that he might be in danger)
John Ashcroft (if you believe he had enough knowledge to decide not to fly commercial flights)
Larry Silverstein (if you believe he knew 9/11 was coming and that there were explosives in WTC7)
The 19 people who played the part of the hijackers, if you believe they were just their to play a role and were never on the planes
Enough senior people at the FBI to block progress in the Moussaoui case, ensure the Phoenix memo was ignored, and more
Ahmad Umar Sheikh for funding the hijackers, General Mahmoud Ahmad for ordering him to do so, and enough of the ISI to get the money and cover up that they were doing this for the US
Everyone who found out about the attacks in advance, and chose not to go into work rather than warn anyone else, and didn't mention this after the fact (thousands of Israelis in the towers, and so on), and everyone who warned them
Everyone responsible for the insider trading before the attacks, the CIA for supposedly monitoring these transactions but doing nothing about them, and enough of the SEC and FBI to ensure that the report was a whitewash
The members of Bush’s secret service team on 9/11 (who presumably either knew in advance that he was safe, or haven’t spoken out about their surprise about what happened subsequently)
The five "dancing Israelis" who filmed the attack "as it happened", and presumably many others in Israeli Intelligence, and enough people in the police or FBI to cover up the details of the case and get them shipped out
Everyone responsible for planting evidence in the hijackers cars, bags and so on
Everyone responsible for planting evidence in the WTC wreckage (passports etc), or removing it (WTC black boxes)
Air Traffic Control and flight schedulers at the takeoff airports (to cope with the double flights), and to make sure they didn't follow procedure in reporting the hijackings promptly
Whoever prepared the "special" planes swapped for the real flights, complete with "missile pod" for firing into the towers just before impact, and the ATC and Norad staff who didn't mention the swap
Norad and senior officers working at the day (so they could lie about the war games and their lack of response)
Fighter pilots who deliberately flew too slowly so they wouldn't reach the aircraft in time
Whoever shot down Flight 93, and the senior officers who helped cover it up
Everyone who researched the passengers, then all the actors who used that research to make fake mobile calls to their relatives, and either the phone company or the FBI for covering up the phone records
Everyone involved in killing hundreds of passengers, assuming they didn't die in the crashes and were killed later
Everyone involved in transporting their bodies to the various scenes if they did, or faking the DNA evidence if they didn't
The people who researched the WTC to find out the best place to place explosives
The people who planted the explosives through the WTC towers and WTC7
Whoever detonated the WTC explosives at various different times of the day
Enough of the New York Fire and Police Departments to shut up everyone else and make sure they didn't try to investigate why all their friends and colleagues died
Everyone who prepared the remote control plane that really flew into the Pentagon, and whoever remote-controlled it, and the Washington Air Traffic Controllers who aren't allowed to talk about the extra radar blip they saw over the Pentagon (if Flight 77 really flew over it)
The Sheraton hotel staff who reportedly saw the video of the plane as it flew past to the Pentagon, but have never said that it wasn't the "official" flight
The people who ensured the Pentagon missile defence systems were disabled to the plane could hit
The people who planted the fake Pentagon evidence, from body parts to black boxes, and those who prepared it
The people who faked additional evidence around the Pentagon, bringing down lampposts etc in an effort to make it look like a large winged plane carried out the attack
Rudolph Giuliani for having advance knowledge that the WTC was going to collapse, and for helping to ensure that the steel was disposed of quickly
Enough people at American and United Airlines to keep quiet about the absence of the hijackers names from the passenger manifests
Enough people at CNN not to question the absence of the hijackers names from the flight manifests, if you believe that's what their victims lists really are
Enough people at FEMA and NIST to ensure any reports and analyses produced were whitewashes
Enough senior officials at the many WTC insurance companies to ensure the doubts were ignored and claims were paid
Everyone involved in producing the fake bin Laden "confession" video(s)
Khalid Al-Sheikh Mohammed and Ramzi Bin Al-Sheeba for discussing how they planned 9/11 on audio tape even though this didn’t happen, and perhaps al Jazeera reporter Yosri Fouda for getting the interview (if we assume he knows it isn't true)
All the other Al Qaeda members who've either implicitly or explicitly accepted responsibility for 9/11, even when they know it was carried out by someone else
The staff of the 9/11 Commission for deliberately obscuring the truth
Sounds reasonable, I think, but this is only the start. If you discuss 9/11 conspiracies online anywhere, try keeping your own list, and add to it everyone someone implies that another person or group was “in on it”. Then produce the list after a month or two and see just how realistic it looks...

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Op zaterdag 1 juli 2006 20:34 schreef 6833-228 het volgende:

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Zie je door wie dit artikel trouwens geschreven is?: Caspar W. Weinberger. Een hoofdrolspeler uit het Iran-Contra schandaal.

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Op zaterdag 1 juli 2006 20:20 schreef 6833-228 het volgende:
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Ja dat is echt de eerste de beste man die ik zou geloven, de baas van de CIA.

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Op zondag 2 juli 2006 10:05 schreef YuckFou het volgende:

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Knap om zo blind te blijven voor de waarheid Klez, maar ik probeer jou verder ook niet te overtuigen ofzo hoor, dat is toch zinloos, maar beweren dat ze nooit zo'n aanslag wilden staat haaks op de al vaak aangehaalde 'second Pearl Harbor' uit R.A.D.

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daarnaast bestaan de NeoCons uit niet zo'n heel klein clubje, maar zie je een groot deel niet 'in public' maar achter de schermen en onder de wel zichtbare NeoCons werken nog veel meer gelijkgestemden, een deel van die kliek is wel erg hecht en zit al sinds midden jaren '60 op hoge functies in en om het Witte Huis,

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en wat betreft die Wargames, het is mij veels te toevallig, zeg maar net zo toevallig als de oefeningen in London die ook zomaar ineens overgingen in 'the real thing' jaja allemaal heel toevallig...

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Op zondag 2 juli 2006 12:22 schreef Hallulama het volgende:
MetLife Will Sell Sears Tower

Two investors who are part of Larry Silverstein's group that owns the World Trade Center lease are among the buyers of the Sears Tower, which MetLife Inc. agreed to sell Thursday for more than $800 million, according to people familiar with the situation



Sears Tower's next

Tja. Het blijft een jood...

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Op zondag 2 juli 2006 21:23 schreef atmosphere1 het volgende:

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Zij hebben we beweerd dat ze militair willen ingrijpen wereldwijd om amerikaanse dominantie bevorderen. Neo-cons met overeenkomstige visies hebben zich verenigd in het PNAC

Betrekkingen die binnen de regering van George W. Bush worden bekleed
door mede-oprichters van PNAC : Elliot Abrams, National Security Council,
Dick Cheney, Vice-President, Paula Dobriansky, Dept. of State, Under Sec.=
of Global Affairs, Aaron Friedberg, Vice President's Deputy National Security
Advisor, Francis Fukuyama, Presidents Council on Bioethics, Zalmay
Khalilzad, US Ambassador to Afghanistan, Lewis Libby, Chief of Staff for =
the
Vice President, Peter Rodman, DOD, Assist. Sec. Of Defense for
International Security, Henry S. Rowen, Defense Policy Board, Comm. On
Intelligence Capabilities of US regarding WMDs, Donald Rumsfled, Secre=
tary
of Defense, Vin Weber, National Commission Public Service, Paul Wolfow=
itz,
Dep. Sec. Of Defense, Pres. World Bank.

Deze PNAC figuren zitten allen op belangrijke posities als het gaat om buitenlands beleid

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Op maandag 3 juli 2006 12:01 schreef Verbal het volgende:

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Niet nu
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Dan ben je vrij selectief, want mij valt op dat met name NorthernStars bijdragen in dit en het vorige topic vrijwel worden genegeerd. En hij komt aan met allesbehalve 'vage bronnen'.

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Dan heb ik nog een boek thuis liggen over de instorting van het WTC. Ik heb het niet bij me (ik zit op mijn werk), maar ik zal er nog een keer in duiken.

Vast staat in ieder geval dat FEMA heeft aangegeven niet uit te kunnen leggen waarom WTC7 is ingestort.

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En ook de officiële verklaringen rondom de Twin Towers geven ontoereikend antwoord op de instortingen.

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Dus waar dat hooghartige toontje vandaan komt mbt het uitleggen van de oorzaak door aanhangers van die ernstig gemankeerde officiële versie is mij een raadsel. Net zoals het mij een raadsel is waarom men mensen die een grondig, onafhankelijk onderzoek voorstaan worden afgefikt en afgedaan als conspiracy nuts door mensen die blijkbaar genoegen nemen met een op vele (te vele) punten niet kloppend officieel verhaal.

V.

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Net zoals het mij een raadsel is waarom men mensen die een grondig, onafhankelijk onderzoek voorstaan worden afgefikt en afgedaan als conspiracy nuts door mensen die blijkbaar genoegen nemen met een op vele (te vele) punten niet kloppend officieel verhaal.

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Op maandag 3 juli 2006 12:28 schreef One_of_the_few het volgende:

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Ik ga er vanuit dat het rapport van de regering niet 100% goed is. Maar ik kan me niet vinden in ook maar 1 conspiracy theorie. Die invulling levert zo veel meer vragen over. Vreemd dat ze daar geen aandacht aan besteden.

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Op maandag 3 juli 2006 12:40 schreef NorthernStar het volgende:

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Als je het niet voor mogelijk houdt dat men in staat zou zijn om 3000 eigen burgers "op te offeren voor het hogere doel" dan houdt het op idd. Dat is de bepalende vraag die ieder voor zichzelf moet beantwoorden. Als je die negatief beantwoordt heb je weinig andere keus dan het 'officiële verhaal' aan te nemen en alle inconsistenties weg te redeneren met 'enkele hiaten' en 'incompetentie'.

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Op maandag 3 juli 2006 12:54 schreef Verbal het volgende:


Nogmaals, waarom zou je in 's hemelsnaam genoegen willen nemen met zoveel gaten en onbeantwoorde vragen? Ik vind die houding van de pro-officiële uitleg enigszins zorgwekkend, om eerlijk te zijn.

V.