Vermeende genocides II

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Article 1
The Contracting Parties confirm that genocide, whether committed in time of peace or in time of war, is a crime under international law which they undertake to prevent and to punish.

Article 2
In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:
· (a) Killing members of the group;
· (b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
· (c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
· (d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
· (e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.

Article 3
The following acts shall be punishable:
· (a) Genocide;
· (b) Conspiracy to commit genocide;
· (c) Direct and public incitement to commit genocide;
· (d) Attempt to commit genocide;
· (e) Complicity in genocide

Bron: http://www.hrweb.org/legal/genocide.html

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Op maandag 20 september 2004 17:12 schreef KirmiziBeyaz het volgende:

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Mooie definities allemaal, maar wat hebben ze met de deportatie van de armenen te maken

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My mother fell on her knees before Tahir Agha. Even though he was a Turk, Tahir's
eyes brimmed with tears. He said, ‘Get up, my daughter. Whoever has caused this, let
both eyes be blinded.’ He turned to his brother and said, ‘Khurshud, you need a son.
They are to be pitied. We have eaten much bread from their hands. Take this boy.’
Khurshud said, ‘This boy is clean. I shall take him.’
...
My brother's commander, Zia Bey, whose word the Turks respected, came and said,
‘Give this boy to me.’ When the man saw that my mother and sister didn't want to give
me up, he summoned a Turk he knew, gave him a donkey, and told my mother, ‘Go with
him and see what they are doing to young Armenians.’ My mother went to the place
called Giulasar and saw that many Armenians had died there and were being ripped apart
by vultures. Finally, my mother was persuaded and delivered me to that man. Zia Bey
took me to his village near his family. They were not my mother and father, but the
people loved me and looked after me.... The man had a grown daughter, who would take
me in her lap and cuddle me.
After a month, I saw that there was a commotion in the house and that preparations were
being made.... I thought it was something like a wedding. It was a circumcision ceremony
for Zia Bey's son. They came and found me, too, and tried to circumcise me at the same
time. I fled to the garden and hid, but they came and found me and did it to me.
Afterwards, Zia Bey’s son lay on one side of the room and I lay on the other - but the
man liked me very much. And they gave me the name Said.
...
Turkish officials came to gather the children. They collected as many of us as there were.
They brought us to Mezre and put us into a house, of course one that had belonged to an
Armenian. Their purpose was to save our lives and to Islamicize us. They began to take
Armenian children and pass them out to Turks and Kurds. They adopted me as their child
and named me Fayek, a Turkish name. The family that adopted me was a man and wife, the
man at least 60 or 65. I was a cute little boy at the time. They had no children, and I must
say that they pampered me like their own child

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Op maandag 20 september 2004 22:08 schreef KirmiziBeyaz het volgende:

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Mwanatabu is helemaal niet dom. Ze wil het soms alleen niet snappen. Maar dat is geen reden om mensen zomaar dom te noemen. Hoe de omgangsvormen en benamingen van elkaar bij jullie thuis zijn, dat is je eigen zorg.

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Op dinsdag 21 september 2004 09:25 schreef KirmiziBeyaz het volgende:

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Er staat wel meer in, als je goed had gelezen.

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We believe that the most reasonable conclusion to draw from the various accounts of the [1915] Events is that at least some of the perpetrators of the Events knew that the consequences of their actions would be the destruction, in whole or in part, of the Armenians of eastern Anatolia, as such, or acted purposively towards this goal, and, therefore, possessed the requisite genocidal intent,” ITCJ experts believe.

They stress that the massacres therefore “include all of the elements of the crime of genocide as defined in the [UN] Convention, and legal scholars as well as historians, politicians, journalists and other people would be justified in continuing to so describe them.

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The ICTJ report makes it clear that although the term “genocide” defined by the 1948 convention is applicable to the bloody events of 1915, the Armenians can not use it to lay “legal, financial or territorial claim” to Turkey. “The Genocide Convention contains no provision mandating its retroactive application,” it explains.

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Op woensdag 22 september 2004 14:43 schreef Lord_Vetinari het volgende:
Zeg Kirmizi, als je iets beweert, zou het leuk zijn als je het onderbouwt. Dus nogmaals:
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Je Oostindisch doof houden helpt niet hoor. Al moet ik de rest van dit topic ermee volspammen, ik ga door tot ik een antwoord van je heb..

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Op donderdag 23 september 2004 17:34 schreef sp3c het volgende:

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het is vermeend als iedereen vind dat het is gebeurd behalve de dader

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Op donderdag 23 september 2004 17:59 schreef Johan_de_With het volgende:

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Nee, hij is natuurlijk een betrouwbare vertaling aan het maken van de processtukken.

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In 1919, there was a military tribunal in Turkey, which tried and sentenced to death in abstentia the main perpetrators: Talaat, Enver, and Jemal. Yep, that kangaroo court by the puppet government cringing under Allied occupation sure carried the full letter of the law. Newspapers around the world reported on the events in Turkey. Thank God! We all know how impartial the newspapers could be. Archives in the U.S., for example, store much information of communiques, photographs, letters, newspaper articles, and other evidence. They must have been withholding all that evidence when the desperate British searched as far as America's shores to keep the Ottoman officials in the hoosegow, during the Malta War Crimes Tribunal... the "Nuremberg" of the Armenian Falsified Genocide. The U.S. Ambassador to Turkey at the time, Henry Morgenthau, has written extensively on his dealings with the ruling elite, as have the historians Viscount Bryce and Arnold Toynbee. I feel much better now, being able to rely on the testimony of these fellows who were totally interested in the truth. See Morgenthau and British Propaganda. Yet, the Ottoman Archives (after 1895) in Turkey remains closed for scrutiny. Izzat so? That plain ain't true.

Most people in Turkey really do believe there was no genocide: they believe that there was a civil war in which people from both sides died, that Armenians were traitors siding with the Russians, and needed to be removed.

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Armeni-lemmings simply cannot utilize independent and objective thought; they only know how to follow their leaders... sometimes off cliffs.

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It’s one thing to consider the evidence of Armenian web sites, where the same hogwash is repeated over and over... the validity of the Sevres Treaty, the incriminating pronouncements of the Allied-controlled Turkish kangaroo courts, the forged Andonian documents and telegrams, the fake and/or undocumented pictures, biased testimonies from missionaries and racist Turcophobes like Ambassador Morgenthau, the repetition as fact of wartime propaganda perpetuated by the likes of the British Blue Book, historians like Arnold Toynbee (in his early period), or coverage in prestigious but prejudiced newspapers like The New York Times... not to mention what unethically biased Armenian historians have to say, and the unverifiable hearsay of Armenian oral history. None of these web sites address the damning evidence against them, at the head of which is the outcome of the Malta Tribunal; none utter a peep about the Armenians’ murderous ethnic cleansing of their non-Christian countrymen, which ironically followed the lines of a real genocide. (Any occasional violence on their helpless and innocent part is usually explained as “self-defense.”) Perhaps Armenians feel they can afford to bypass the inconsistencies of their claims simply because there is a wealth of support by those whose eyes the wool has been successfully pulled over, along with the cumulative effect of their expertly constructed Big Lie. Armenians have learned the value of repeating their “misstatements”... anything goes, as long as the unwary can be persuaded to offer their sympathy, and join the cause