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SPOILER: meer foto's
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Eman al-Obeidi Wiki


SPOILER: Alex Crawfort 'Bab-al-Aziziyah interview' en 'Gaddafi's hat' Noy Alooshe Remix
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SPOILER: eerdere topics
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Handige links:

Hoe beoordeel je bronnen?
Dingen die je kunt doen om de Libiërs te steunen
MO / Libië Fototopic
MO / Waarom grijpen we in in Libië ?
MO / Discussieer: Lange termijn geo-politieke effecten revoluties.

SPOILER: UN / NATO info
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Handige links en nieuwssites over Libië na de revolutie:

- tweepforum.ly
- ShababLibya.org
- Libya Herald
- Twitter





[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door Frikandelbroodje op 29-12-2012 18:49:51 ]
Incelfrikandel
pi_120918320
quote:
0s.gif Op vrijdag 28 december 2012 23:04 schreef Frikandelbroodje het volgende:

Thanks dude ^O^ Ga ik 'm meteen kijken.
Ik mag echt wel eens wat optimistischer zijn, en wat harder zoeken... :') :@
pi_120963713
quote:
Former revolutionaries joining state institutions

During Thursday’s press conference, Deputy Prime Minister Awad Al-Barasi reiterated the government’s support for the integration of former revolutionaries into the police and army, noting that all brigades would have to join these state institutions. In future, the existence of such brigades would be illegal.

Exactly when this will happen is still unsure. The head of the SSC in Tripoli, Hashim Bishar, said in October that the organisation would cease to exist by tomorrow, the end of the year. But since then Prime Minister Ali Zeidan has told the Libya Herald that it would still continue “for a while”. Nonetheless, many SCC members have been signing up to join the police and army, despite the fact that the pay in both organisations is lower than in the SSC.

Earlier this month it was announced that in just two days some 1,500 members of the SSC in Benghazi had applied to join the police there.

Since taking office, Interior Minister Ashour Shuwail has laid out clear plans to get the country’s security on track trough the collection of weapons, increased policing, the formation of a professional army and security forces. However, Shuwail’s immediate concern has been the deteriorating security situation in Benghazi.

The city, known as the cradle of the revolution, has become an epicentre of violence and targeted killings, particular after the death of US Ambassador Chris Stevens and more recently following the assassination of Benghazi’s police chief Faraj Drissi. The city’s police force has come under repeated attack leading to the death and injury of several police officers. This wave of lawlessness has been tied to attempts to release a suspect arrested in Drissi’s murder, as well as a show of force by armed groups beyond state control, generally believed to be extremists.

Friday’s “Save Benghazi Friday” protesters came out in support for the army and police, and to put an end to all militias. According to activist Bilal Bettamer, security forces were on hand to protect and direct the protest, and were greatly applauded for the role they played.

Bettamer was among those who organised “Rescue Benghazi”, a mass protest against armed groups that took place in the wake of the US consulate attack in the city. The lead organiser of the protest, Naji Hamad, narrowly escaped an attempt an his life earlier this month, however, the assault killed Hamad’s brother -in-law, Anees Al-Jahani.
Het artikel gaat verder

quote:
0s.gif Op zaterdag 29 december 2012 17:55 schreef zuiderbuur het volgende:

[..]

Ik mag echt wel eens wat optimistischer zijn, en wat harder zoeken... :') :@
Ach, ik heb 'm nu toch :P Ik was wel blij verrast dat er nog een flink stuk over Libië bij zat :) Jammer dat ze andere 'revolutielanden' zoals Jemen, Bahrain, Marokko etc ook niet bezoeken. De situatie daar weet ik over het algemeen wel van engelse/arabische sites, maar ik ben wel benieuwd hoe journalisten uit onze omgeving er dan tegenaan kijken.
Incelfrikandel
pi_120987260
Nee hè :N

quote:
Libya church blast kills two Egyptians

Tripoli (AFP) – An explosion rocked a Coptic church near the Libyan city of Misrata, killing two people and wounding two, all of them Egyptians, a diplomat told AFP on Sunday.

“Two men were killed and two others wounded,” said the diplomat at the Egyptian embassy in Tripoli who declined to be named, adding that it took place late Saturday but the embassy was only informed on Sunday.

“The blast was yesterday at 11:30 pm (2230 GMT) at the church of Mar Girgis (St. George) in the town of Dafniya in Misrata (province). We were informed at 6 am,” he said.

The embassy has dispatched the consul to Misrata to get details about the blast.

“We still don’t have clear information” about what caused it, the diplomat said.

But he added that, according to initial reports, the blast took place in an annexe of the church.

Earlier, a security official said the blast occurred on Sunday, killing an Egyptian and wounding three others.

“An investigation is now underway,” the security source said.

Another security source said the explosion struck “during prayers” but the embassy official could not confirm that a service was underway at the time.

Dafniya is a Mediterranean town 30 kilometres (20 miles) west of the city of Misrata, where brigades made up of former rebels hold a major checkpoint.

There were an estimated 1.5 million Egyptians living and working in Libya before the 2011 armed revolt that toppled Libyan dictator Moamer Gaddafi. About two-thirds left during the war but many returned in 2012.

Before the revolt Libya had a population of around 6.3 million – including some 1.5 million African immigrants many of whom fled during the fighting – that was 97 percent Muslim and only three percent Christian.

Christians in Libya are mostly expatriates, including migrant workers from neighbouring Egypt where Coptic Christians are the largest religious minority.

In August, the International Committee of the Red Cross shut its operations in Misrata, 180 kilometres (110 miles) east of the capital, after armed assailants laid siege to a staff residence.

Libya’s first elected authorities are keen to boost security but the fledgling army and police are often helpless in the face of well-armed militias made up of former rebels.

Extremism has become a source of growing concern in post-Gaddafi Libya, with several international agencies and diplomatic missions targeted this year by attacks blamed on radical Islamists.

The deadliest was a 11 September assault on the US consulate in second city Benghazi, which killed ambassador Chris Stevens and three other Americans.
http://dailynewsegypt.com(...)kills-two-egyptians/
Incelfrikandel
  maandag 31 december 2012 @ 09:11:10 #5
16466 BloodhoundFromHell
---------------------
pi_120998455
Er is maar 1 mogelijke oplossing voor de enorme chaos in Libie en dat is het installeren van Saif al Islam als leider, alleen hij kan de visie zoals verwoord in het groene boekje van zijn vader en de orde en stabiliteit in het land herstellen.

Zelfs een groot deel van de ex-rebellen hunkeren nog geen jaar na de door westerse terreur gesteunde opstand van Al-Quade gelieerde rebellen terug naar het stabiele en welvarende tijdperk Khadaffi. Ik hoop van harte dat Saif met een houdini truc ontsnapt en op de 1 of andere manier in het zadel komt om zo de erfenis van zijn vader in ere te herstellen. Hij heeft er het intellect, de capaciteit en gedrevenheid voor. Laten we het hopen, met name voor de arme mensen in Libie.
(__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")
pi_121000406
quote:
Rise of the Libyan resistance

Although the U.S. is in denial, there is every reason to believe that it was Tahloob, a movement of pro-Qadhafi loyalists, that killed Ambassador Stevens
http://www.thehindu.com/o(...)e/article4051658.ece
  maandag 31 december 2012 @ 11:31:50 #7
124676 RobertoCarlos
Zit je nou naar me te loeruh?
pi_121002044
quote:
0s.gif Op maandag 31 december 2012 09:11 schreef BloodhoundFromHell het volgende:
Er is maar 1 mogelijke oplossing voor de enorme chaos in Libie en dat is het installeren van Saif al Islam als leider,
Dat zijn wel heel erg weinig mogelijkheden :P Hoe zie je dat 'installeren' van Saif voor je? Denk je niet dat daar heel veel geweld aan vooraf gaat tegen juist die arme mensen die jij wilt helpen?
Maar ik ben het wel met je eens dat de 1e prioriteit in Libie de veiligheid is, als je dat eigenlijk bedoelt. Maar er zijn natuurlijk wel meer mogelijkheden...
!!! Go 49-ers !!!
pi_121122788
quote:
Head of Libya’s Copts speaks out on Misrata killing

The head of the Coptic Church in Libya, Father Timothaus Bishara Adla, today condemned the bomb attack in the port city of Misrata that left two Egyptian Christians dead and several more wounded.

Father Timothaous Bishara Adly told the Libya Herald today that he visited Misrata yesterday to visit the church in Dafniya that was targeted by a bombing late on Saturday night, saying the families of those killed were facing a “very difficult situation.”

He said that the two men killed in the blast had been attending a service late on Saturday night in a building attached to the church when the bomb went off.

Members of the congregation present at the time of the attack told Adly that there was a “huge explosion”, which they thought had been caused by a bomb placed next to the building some time before. Adly, however, was keen to stress that the investigation into the attack was in its early stages, and that it was impossible to give more precise details at this time.

Adly said that the two victims of the attack were both male, and had been living and working in Libya with their families for some time.

Both men were married he said, and one, 42, had three young daughters who are also living in Libya. The second, he added, was 25 years old, and his wife was six months pregnant.

Adly said that the church, Saint George’s, was a focal point for the Coptic community in Misrata, and catered exclusively to Egyptian Christians, estimating that there are around 20,000 members of the church in Libya.

The attack seemed to have been totally unexpected, as Adly told the Libya Herald that there had ben “no threats at all against the churches here in Libya,” pointing out that “on the other hand, we had very good relations with Muslims here in Libya”.

Saturday marks the first attack specifically targeting a church in Libya since the revolution last year, and at the time of publication, it is not clear who was responsible for the bombing.

Officials from the Interior Minstry and the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and International Cooperation had been in contact with the head of the church in Misrata, Father Marcus Zaghloul, Adly said, to condemn the “terrorist incident”, and had reassured him that they would launch an investigation into the attack immediately.

Adly said that the Egyptian ambassador in Tripoli, Hisham Abdul Hamid, had called for more security outside Libya’s Coptic churches, and the Egyptian foreign minister had also condemned the attack.
Bron

Ongeveer 3% van de Libiërs zijn Christen.

quote:
2s.gif Op maandag 31 december 2012 11:31 schreef RobertoCarlos het volgende:

[..]

Dat zijn wel heel erg weinig mogelijkheden :P Hoe zie je dat 'installeren' van Saif voor je? Denk je niet dat daar heel veel geweld aan vooraf gaat tegen juist die arme mensen die jij wilt helpen?
Maar ik ben het wel met je eens dat de 1e prioriteit in Libie de veiligheid is, als je dat eigenlijk bedoelt. Maar er zijn natuurlijk wel meer mogelijkheden...
Hij is maar aan het trollen hoor :P
Incelfrikandel
pi_121132134
Voor de geïnteresseerden:
http://www.canvas.be/prog(...)A13bae8811da%3A-7cda
Een bewerkte reportage :
quote:
2012 was het jaar van de Arabische lente. Dictators werden van hun troon gestoten, het volk sprak, riep uit dat het anders moest. Het democratisch optimisme, de euforie van de eerste dagen maakte al snel plaats voor de realistische vaststelling dat democratie niet altijd een eenvoudige oefening is.
Met interviews met een aantal prominente geestelijken, en waarin op een gegeven moment een ploeg journalisten niet meer mag vertrekken van Syrische verzetsstrijders.
Wordt herhaald: Vrijdag 4 januari om 14u22, ,Zondag 6 januari om 18u00.
  zaterdag 5 januari 2013 @ 12:57:29 #10
1234 HiZ
Istanbullu
pi_121188256
Er zijn opvallend veel Libiers die met vakantie komen naar Istanbul.
  dinsdag 8 januari 2013 @ 23:06:52 #11
172669 Papierversnipperaar
Cafeïne is ook maar een drug.
pi_121334675
quote:
Libyan revolution casualties lower than expected, says new government

Deputy minister of martyrs says 4,700 rebel supporters died and 2,100 are missing, down from 2011's estimate of 25,000

Libya's new government has drastically reduced its estimate of the number of people who were killed in the revolution against Muammar Gaddafi's regime, concluding that 4,700 rebel supporters died and 2,100 are missing, with unconfirmed similar casualty figures on the opposing side.

Miftah Duwadi, the deputy minister of martyrs and missing persons, told the Libya Herald newspaper that the numbers for revolutionary losses were still being checked but officials did not expect any major changes.

Arguments about casualty figures have become bound up in bitter political disagreements about the 2011 conflict. Opponents of Nato's armed intervention in support of the uprising often argue that it caused many more deaths than would have been the case without it.

The UN security council authorised action to protect Libyan civilians from the Gaddafi regime but Russia, China and other critics believe that the western alliance exceeded that mandate and moved to implement regime change.

Initially rebel officials believed that some 50,000 people had been killed, a figure that was revised down to 25,000 dead and 4,000 missing in October 2011. The latest statistics have been compiled after research by the ministry, though they do not include the final figure for fatalities on the Gaddafi side.

"I can't tell you the exact figure but, as of now, the number of martyrs from the side of revolutionaries is in the range of 4,700,″ Duwadi told the paper. "But the number of missing persons from both … sides [Gaddafi forces and revolutionaries] is around 2,100. We are working hard to finish the final numbers. It is very important for the reconciliation process as well, that we know the exact [total] losses."

During the eight-month conflict, the rebels' National Transitional Council, which was backed by western and Arab governments, estimated that tens of thousands of people had been killed by Gaddafi's forces, while the regime accused the rebels and Nato of being responsible for the deaths of tens of thousands of civilians. The ministry's research so far suggests that the death toll for the old regime may be about the same as among revolutionaries, if not less, the paper said.
Free Assange! Hack the Planet
[b]Op dinsdag 6 januari 2009 19:59 schreef Papierversnipperaar het volgende:[/b]
De gevolgen van de argumenten van de anti-rook maffia
pi_121336531
Ik ben nog altijd op het bewijs aan het wachten dat Ghadaffi de opdracht gaf op onbewapende demonstranten te schieten of om überhaupt op burgers te schieten. Helaas weet ik toch al dat dit bewijs nooit zal komen.

Verder missen nog de burgerslachtoffers in die figuren en die van het leger natuurlijk.
  donderdag 24 januari 2013 @ 15:07:21 #13
343860 UpsideDown
Baas Boven Baas
pi_121986119
Er schijnt een significante kans voor represailles op westerlingen te zijn voor de Franse aanval op moslimextremisten in Mali.

quote:
Britten onmiddellijk weg uit Libië

Toegevoegd: donderdag 24 jan 2013, 14:00
Update: donderdag 24 jan 2013, 14:16


Alle Britse burgers die in Benghazi zijn moeten die Libische stad onmiddellijk verlaten.

Het Britse ministerie van Buitenlandse Zaken zegt over zeer duidelijke aanwijzingen te beschikken dat er gevaar dreigt voor westerse burgers in Benghazi. Wat de dreiging precies inhoudt, is niet bekendgemaakt.

Gasveld
Waarnemers denken dat de dreiging te maken heeft met de Franse interventie in Mali. Franse troepen helpen de Malinese regeringstroepen in hun strijd tegen de fundamentalistische islamieten die het noorden beheersen.

Vorige week vielen islamitische terroristen een BP-gasveld in Algerije aan. Daarbij kwamen tientallen westerse werknemers om het leven.
NOS
Say what?
pi_121986727
Lijkt me verstandig dat niet alleen in Benghazi te doen. Die gijzeling vond plaats vlakbij de grens met Libië.

quote:
0s.gif Op zaterdag 5 januari 2013 12:57 schreef HiZ het volgende:
Er zijn opvallend veel Libiers die met vakantie komen naar Istanbul.
Waarom? :P
Incelfrikandel
  donderdag 24 januari 2013 @ 19:15:53 #15
1234 HiZ
Istanbullu
pi_121996504
Wat ik kan zien; winkelen, drinken (alcohol), seks en cultuur. In die volgorde ongeveer.
pi_121997190
Interessant, Istanbul is natuurlijk wel een stuk vaker toleranter in die dingen dan Libië. Is dat al langer zo of pas sinds de revolutie?
Incelfrikandel
  donderdag 24 januari 2013 @ 19:42:34 #17
1234 HiZ
Istanbullu
pi_121998089
Sinds de revolutie. Daarvoor zag je eigenlijk nagenoeg alleen maar Golf arabieren. Gemiddeld zijn Libiers leukere mensen, voelen zich niet god omdat ze wat geld in hun zak hebben.
pi_121999456
Flinke verandering. Zover ik weet had je weinig vrijheid van beweging of reizen onder Khadaffi.
Incelfrikandel
pi_123012824
Het is vandaag 2 jaar geleden dat de revolutie (officieel) begon. Er wordt al dagen flink gefeest in Libië :P











Maar veel problemen blijven aanhouden:
Divisions in Libya put aside, for now
Incelfrikandel
  maandag 18 februari 2013 @ 17:14:47 #20
56633 JimmyJames
Unspeakable powers
pi_123036674
http://www.guardian.co.uk(...)foreign-missionaries

quote:
Libya arrests foreign 'missionaries'
Four foreign nationals accused of distributing Christian literature, a charge that could carry the death penalty.
Het gaat daar lekker sinds het Westen Kadhafi heeft weggebombardeerd.
Please Move The Deer Crossing Sign
pi_123039140
quote:
14s.gif Op zondag 17 februari 2013 22:49 schreef Frikandelbroodje het volgende:
Het is vandaag 2 jaar geleden dat de revolutie (officieel) begon. Er wordt al dagen flink gefeest in Libië :P

Maar veel problemen blijven aanhouden:
Divisions in Libya put aside, for now
Het is groots gevierd, zag het op tv. De Libiers zijn blij en trots, zij weten wel beter dan de niet-Libische conspiracy freaks waar Khadafi's 42-jarige bewind uit bestond.
Oorlog is de verderzetting van de politiek maar met andere middelen - Clausewitz
pi_123716378
http://english.ahram.org.(...)tortured-in-Lib.aspx

Gaat lekker daar :N
Dit is niet de eerste keer dat de Christenen worden gearresteerd daar.
pi_123717983
Barbaars.
Incelfrikandel
  donderdag 4 april 2013 @ 14:11:08 #24
172669 Papierversnipperaar
Cafeïne is ook maar een drug.
pi_124874954
quote:
Gaddafi's fire-starting daughter proves too hot for the Algerians to handle

When the daughter of a deposed dictator was forced to flee her home, she had no problem in finding a safe retreat.

But Aisha Gaddafi proved too hot to handle for those who welcomed her in - she has been thrown out of her Algerian safe-house for repeatedly setting it on fire.

Colonel Muammar Gaddafi's 37-year-old daughter has an arrest warrant against her name after she fled Libya when her father was deposed and then killed two years ago.

The western educated lawyer arrived in Algeria with other family members after her husband - an army general - was killed in the bombing raids that destroyed Gaddafi's regime.
Advertisement

The widowed mother was accorded a presidential residence in the south of the country.

Algeria's ambassador to Libya confirmed last month that the dictator's widow and three of his children, including Aisha, had left Algeria "a long time ago", without giving further details. It has now emerged that Algerian authorities lost patience with Miss Gaddafi, a one-time UN goodwill ambassador, after she kept vandalising furniture and attacking guards out of rage over her father's fate.
"She ended up blaming Algeria for many of her problems, and also began starting fires in the house," said a government source in Algiers.

"Shelves in the library went up in flames, and she regularly attacked army personnel looking after her safety."

The last straw was when the bleach blonde, nicknamed the "Claudia Schiffer of North Africa", destroyed a portrait of Abdulaziz Bouteflika, the Algerian president, local newspaper Ennahar reported.

For this sign of disrespect she was kicked out of the country, eventually finding asylum in Oman, Britain's Gulf ally.

Aisha, Gaddafi's widow Safiya and her sons Muhammad and Hannibal, as well as their children, have all been living there since October 2012.

They have been granted sanctuary on "humanitarian grounds" and their expenses are reportedly covered entirely by the Omani government. The Gulf state has apparently turned a blind eye to the controversial pasts of family members wanted back home for squandering the wealth and privilege they enjoyed during Gaddafi's reign. His children were known for their lavish lifestyles while he was in power and some oversaw key sectors in the economy, such as shipping and the state's telecommunications company.

Aisha Gaddafi gave birth to a girl after evading rebel forces in her home country.

She is Gaddafi's only biological daughter, and was an outspoken supporter throughout the civil war.

"He is my remedy against pain and my fortress against grief," she said.

She also came out in support of Saddam Hussein following the Iraq war.

"When you have an occupying army coming from abroad, raping your women and killing your own people, it is only legitimate that you fight them," she said at the time.

In 2006 she married her cousin Ahmed al-Gaddafi al-Qahsi, an army colonel with whom she had three children.

Qahsi was killed, along with two of their children, in bombing raids.

Hannibal Gaddafi was notorious for his abuse of servants. He once faced charges in Geneva for allegedly causing "bodily harm" to hotel staff, and he allegedly beat up his wife in a suite at Claridge's hotel in London.

Aisha and Hannibal are both wanted on Interpol arrest warrants issued at the request of Libya's new government.

Another of Gaddafi's sons, Saadi, whom Libyan officials claim played a crucial role in organising the brutal crackdown on protesters, fled across Libya's southern border to Niger.

Only Saif al-Islam, his father's presumed successor, remained inside Libya.

He is wanted by the International Criminal Court in The Hague for allegedly ordering Gaddafi's forces to open fire on unarmed protesters and faces possible execution in Libya.

Bitterly opposed to Nato's bombing campaign against Gaddafi's forces, which they said would fuel Islamic terrorism, Algerian officials were initially sympathetic to his family's plight. But the risks to the country of its decision to shelter the Gaddafis had grown.

Since Gaddafi's demise, there have been fears that family members will seek to return to Libya to gain power.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/wor(...)v.html#ixzz2PUoE2SmO

Free Assange! Hack the Planet
[b]Op dinsdag 6 januari 2009 19:59 schreef Papierversnipperaar het volgende:[/b]
De gevolgen van de argumenten van de anti-rook maffia
pi_124953687
quote:
Libya’s fight for the rule of law

On Sunday, March 31, armed gunmen stormed Libya's Ministry of Justice. The gunmen (reportedly militia members under the Supreme Security Committee) threw Justice Minister Salah Marghani and his staff out of the building in protest over recent televised remarks the minister made during an interview with Libya AhrarTV.

Marghani (second from left) had spoken out against unlawful detentions and the practices of prisons being run by armed militias. He promised that all prisons will be brought under the control of the ministry's judicial police and the attorney general. Marghani, like Prime Minister Zeidan (pictured at the podium), is making an effort to act as an honest communicator with the Libyan people. Marghani is handling the issue in the same responsible manner as he did in his response to the Human Rights Watch report on Libya: in that case, he publicly admitted the country's failure to prevent human rights abuses and promised to take urgent action on the issue.

His honesty and transparency did not, however, prove popular with the armed militias and groups running their own secret prisons and detention facilities. The gunmen demanded that Marghani be sacked from his post and accused him of trying to help former regime officials escape (laughable allegations even by militias' standards).

Marghani and Prime Minister Zeidan held a joint press conference just a few hours after the storming of the ministry in which they condemned the incident. They both refused to give into pressure to allow militias to control prisons or hold prisoners. Standing firm, they stressed that the decision to prevent militias from holding prisoners would not be changed.

Since it took charge a few months ago, the government has successfully maintained its media presence by holding at least one press conference a week.

Most Libyans welcome the government's tough line. The responses on social media and television show that public support for Zeidan and his government appears to be getting stronger by the day. This is what Zeidan and his team have been working hard to achieve, but the tough talk needs to be translated into action on the ground. This is ultimately what matters to Libyans.

A battle is under way between two forces in Libya. The government is striving to establish the rule of law, while the militias, clinging to revolutionary legitimacy, want things done their own way, with general disregard for the law. This is the core issue. Everything else is secondary.

The government cannot win without the support of the Libyan people. Zeidan and his cabinet ministers echo this sentiment whenever they get the chance. Moreover, in a clear contrast to the position of the previous government led by Prime Minister el-Keib (which allowed the growing influence of militias), the minister of justice has commended the people of Benghazi for the mass demonstrations, famously known as the "Benghazi Rescue Friday" on September 21, 2012 -- and the "Benghazi Won't Die Friday" on December 28, 2012, that were held against militias and armed groups in the city. He has urged all cities, especially Tripoli, to follow this path.

The government has already set up a joint task force to clear Tripoli of all armed militias and groups, and has so far cleared 36 locations out of 500 possible locations including private residential villas that belonged to former regime figures in the capital. A similar effort will follow in Benghazi. The government is clearly determined to establish control throughout Libya, and it seems to be making progress. In addition, public tolerance of militias is diminishing as ordinary Libyans' support for the state (and, implicitly, for its monopoly on violence to maintain order) increases. This provides a real opportunity for the government to act decisively.

Minister Marghani put it perfectly during his press conference with Prime Minister Zeidan following the storming of the Ministry of Justice: "The building may be stormed and the justice minister may get killed, but justice won't die, for justice is God and justice is truth, and falsehood and intolerance won't prevail over truth and justice."
Bron

Dat gaat meer de goede kant op.
Incelfrikandel
pi_125639900
quote:
Aanslag op Franse ambassade Libië

In de Libische hoofdstad Tripoli is vanochtend een aanslag gepleegd op de Franse ambassade. Dat heeft een medewerker van de ambassade laten weten.

"Er is een aanval geweest op de ambassade en we denken dat het een autobom was'', aldus de functionaris. Volgens hem was er behoorlijk wat schade aan het pand. De aanslag werd gepleegd met een autobom. Bij de explosie raakten twee bewakers gewond. Wie er achter de aanslag zit, is nog niet bekend.

In september vorig jaar was de Amerikaanse ambassade nog doelwit van een aanslag. Bij die aanval kwamen de Amerikaanse ambassadeur Christopher Stevens en drie andere Amerikanen om het leven.
quote:
Tripoli conference produces Sebha peace deal

Rival groups who have been the cause of continuing instability in Sebha and elsewhere on the south of the country today signed a peace deal under which both agreed to disarm and put aside past animosities.

Representatives from Tebus and the Arab tribe, the Awlad Suleiman, were brought together this morning at the Congress building in a reconciliation conference organised by the government and the General National Congress.

Sebha and the surrounding area have been the scene of intermittent clashes for over a year despite ceasefires and peace agreements.

Fighting between Tebus and Arab residents in the town, mainly from the Abu Seif tribe, broke out in March last year in a dispute supposedly over a vehicle. Some 150 people were killed and 400 wounded in the following few days before a ceasefire was brokered. Later, the conflict turned into one between the Tebus and the Awlad Suleiman.

Today’s conference, entitled ‘Reconciliation in the South of Libya’ and organised with the help of a number of reconciliation committees and elders following long negotiations between the rivals, was opened by the Chief of Staff, Major-General Yousef Mangoush.

It was attended by the President of Congress, Mohamed Magarief, the Prime Minister, Ali Zeidan, and Defence Minister Mohamed Bargathi as well as several members of Congress.

In his opening remarks, Mangoush said that everyone was aware of the problems in Libya during its present transitional stage. The challenges, he stated, were massive and difficult.

Magarief said reconciliation was the right path for the new Libya. There had been “enough Libya wounds, enough Libya bleeding, enough Libya sensitivities, enough Libya barriers”. More than ever, the country needed “reconciliation with ourselves and with our history”. The conference would set the pattern “for reconciliation in all parts of the country”, he stated.

For his part, Ali Zaidan, said his government hoped that this reconciliation process would build the new Libya, but that what was needed was determination. Reconciliation would not happen, he said, unless people returned to the values and morality of their fathers and grandfathers.

At the end of conference, a representative from each of the two groups signed a peace agreement, but not before a heated exchange of words by some of those attending the conference almost wrecked it.

A number of attendees said that they did not approve the deal and that the views of some of the conflicting parties had been ignored. The Misrata representatives quit the conference complaining they were not mentioned in the reconciliation programme.

Following the departure of Magarief and other officials, two journalists covering the conference became embroiled in a dispute with GNC security guards and were beaten. One, Mohamed Al-Ghariani, a cameraman with Al-Aan TV, had to be hospitalized as a result. The other, a freelance photographer, was able to walk away.

In a statement later today, Magarief said it was the result of misunderstanding by both sides and high emotions but he still condemned it. “Any attack on journalists is an attack on freedom of speech”, he said. However, he called on both sides to exercise restraint in future.
Bron
Incelfrikandel
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Gaat weer lekker daar. Na de belegeringen van "democratisch gekozen" ministeries, is er vandaag een bomaanslag geweest in Benghazi. 12 doden zo ver.

Arabische lente :')
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Rana_J01 twitterde op dinsdag 14-05-2013 om 18:46:42 Officials 2day- #Benghazi #Libya blast "could have been 'accidental' all being investigated" Wld have bn helpful if that was said frm start. reageer retweet
quote:
Benghazi blast an 'accident', Libya ministers say

A blast outside a hospital in the Libyan city of Benghazi on Monday might have been an accident, ministers say.

The government initially said that a car bomb exploded in a "terrorist act" that killed three people.

But on Tuesday, Interior Minister Ashur Shwayel said "all the signs point to an accidental" blast, in a car transporting explosives.

Security remains precarious in Libya since the uprising against long-time leader Muammar Gaddafi.

The city was terrorized, a 16-year old died, investigations need to be concluded”

Since then, Libya has been hit by a wave of bombings - often blamed on militant Islamists or Gaddafi loyalists - and battles between rival militias who fought the ousted regime.

Justice Minister Salah al-Mirghani said it was "too early to draw any conclusions" about Monday's car explosion.

"Even if it was detonated accidentally [by those inside] as it was heading somewhere else, or whatever the reason - it is not normal to be driving around with explosives like that," he told the BBC from Benghazi.

"The city was terrorized, a 16-year old died, investigations need to be concluded. There are two unidentified bodies, but we also have not concluded whether they were the ones in the car or not."

He said he could not discount reports that the explosives might have been transported by fishermen, who often use such material to catch fish.

A report by an explosive expert from Libya's ministry of defence said a grey Mazda exploded while it was travelling with material used to make anti-tank mines, says BBC Libya correspondent Rana Jawad.

In the immediate aftermath of the blast, government officials and eyewitnesses said a grey Toyota parked near the hospital exploded.

Angry crowds protested at the scene, blaming militants for the bombing and urging the authorities to drive them out of the city.

Many demonstrators chanted "Rise, Benghazi!"

There were wildly conflicting reports on casualty figures, with Deputy Interior Minister Abdallah Massoud saying that up to 15 may have been killed and at least 30 wounded.

On Tuesday, the health ministry, said it reached a "definitive toll" of three dead and 14 wounded in the explosion.

At least three police stations were bombed in Benghazi last week - causing damage but not casualties.

Earlier this month, the UK said it had withdrawn some of its embassy staff in Libya because of "ongoing political uncertainty".
Mocht het toch gaan om een opzettelijke aanval, dan is dit de eerste terreuraanslag die duidelijk is gericht tegen burgers.

Ik denk wel dat de komende tijd het geweld gaat toenemen in Libië. De overheid probeert nu met een nieuwe veiligheidsstrategie de milities geleidelijk te ontbinden en te vervangen door een veiligheidsapparaat die loyaal is aan de overheid. Dit door middel van bijvoorbeeld het hoofdkwartier van milities te ontbinden. Logisch dat daar verzet tegen is en groeit. Een andere reden tot zorg is dat verjaagde jihadisten uit Mali nu een nieuwe schuilplaats zoeken, veelal gaan naar Libië. Iedere keer wanneer het weer beter lijkt te gaan krijgt men te maken met dit soort setbacks. Ik hoop dat het land er tegen bestand is.
Incelfrikandel
  zondag 9 juni 2013 @ 21:02:58 #29
343860 UpsideDown
Baas Boven Baas
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quote:
Zeker 28 doden bij rellen Libië

Zeker 28 mensen zijn zaterdag om het leven gekomen bij hevige rellen tussen demonstranten en gewapende milities in de Libische stad Benghazi.


55 anderen raakten gewond, zei een arts uit de oostelijke havenstad tegen staatspersbureau LANA.

De demonstranten hadden zich verzameld voor het hoofdkwartier van een plaatselijke militie. Ze eisten de opheffing van de gewapende groep. De situatie liep vervolgens uit de hand. Hoe dat precies kon gebeuren, is nog niet bekend.

Milities brachten in 2011 het regime van Muammar Kaddafi ten val. Daarna kwamen zijn wapens in handen van de strijders. De nieuwe leiding in Libië heeft de milities nog niet onder controle gekregen.
NU.nl

quote:
Libische legerleider stapt op

Toegevoegd: zondag 9 jun 2013, 20:34
Update: zondag 9 jun 2013, 20:55


De chef-staf van het Libische leger stapt op naar aanleiding van het geweld tussen betogers en aanhangers van milities in de oostelijke stad Benghazi. Daarbij vielen gisteren zeker dertig doden.

Legerleider Youssef al-Mangoush bood vandaag zijn ontslag aan. Het parlement, het Nationaal Congres, stemde daarmee in.

Geen grip
Sinds de val van de Libische leider Kadhafi twee jaar geleden is de Libische overheid er niet in geslaagd grip te krijgen op de gewapende milities. Al-Mangoush wordt gezien als een van de hoofdverantwoordelijken voor die machteloosheid.

De doden vielen toen tientallen demonstranten gisteren optrokken naar het hoofdkwartier van een van de milities in Benghazi. Ze eisten dat die de wapens zou neerleggen. Daarop braken urenlange gevechten uit.
NOS
Say what?
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Tsja, dat was te verwachten. De militie waar het hier om gaat heet 'Libya Shield'. Drie weken geleden heeft de overheid speciale eenheden van het leger ingezet in Benghazi na aanleiding van die explosie. Hun doel is de orde te herstellen, de politie te versterken en eventueel milities te ontbinden, wat tot nu toe goed ging. De bevolking zijn de milities flink zat, maar willen niet ontbinden. Vandaar deze uitspatting. Het leger gaat de basissen van 'Libya Shield' nu overnemen.

Ik ben blij dat Mangoush opgestapt is, hij weigerde aanvankelijk 'Libya Shield' te ontbinden, ondanks eerdere incidenten.
Incelfrikandel
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quote:
0s.gif Op zondag 9 juni 2013 21:32 schreef Frikandelbroodje het volgende:
Tsja, dat was te verwachten. De militie waar het hier om gaat heet 'Libya Shield'. Drie weken geleden heeft de overheid speciale eenheden van het leger ingezet in Benghazi na aanleiding van die explosie. Hun doel is de orde te herstellen, de politie te versterken en eventueel milities te ontbinden, wat tot nu toe goed ging. De bevolking zijn de milities flink zat, maar willen niet ontbinden. Vandaar deze uitspatting. Het leger gaat de basissen van 'Libya Shield' nu overnemen.

Ik ben blij dat Mangoush opgestapt is, hij weigerde aanvankelijk 'Libya Shield' te ontbinden, ondanks eerdere incidenten.
Lijkt me tijd voor de NATO om in te grijpen en die milities eens flink kapot te bombarderen toch? 'vredige' demonstraties worden immers met zeer dodelijk geweld neergedrukt. En zo ging dat toch ook in de tijd van Ghadaffi en daar werd ook ingegrepen.

Ik wed dat die demonstraties, (net zoals in het begin van de 'revolutie') helemaal niet vredig verliepen. Zoals hier beschreven staat worden het al 'rellen' genoemd en bij het nieuws van nu.nl staat dat de 'demonstranten' mogelijk zelf ook wapens hadden.

Echter, de eerste 'demonstraties' tegen Ghadaffi begonnen ook met het in de fik steken van auto's en politiegebouwen, en daar zullen behalve wapens als molotov cocktails, ook zwaardere wapens gebruikt zijn, wat tot het aantal doden van onze subjectieve media gedeeld door 10 leidde.

Verzin er nog wat leugens bij zoals bij Ghadaffi is gedaan: huurlingen, luchtaanvallen, wrede dictator, verkrachtingen.
en hoppaa, je hebt er bijna weer een 'revolutie' bij.
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quote:
0s.gif Op maandag 10 juni 2013 00:19 schreef JaJammerJan het volgende:

[..]

Lijkt me tijd voor de NATO om in te grijpen en die milities eens flink kapot te bombarderen toch? 'vredige' demonstraties worden immers met zeer dodelijk geweld neergedrukt. En zo ging dat toch ook in de tijd van Ghadaffi en daar werd ook ingegrepen.
Wat een vergelijkingen weer. Ik denk dat ze dat nu zelf wel kunnen als ze willen, Libië heeft haar eigen luchtmacht.

quote:
Ik wed dat die demonstraties, (net zoals in het begin van de 'revolutie') helemaal niet vredig verliepen. Zoals hier beschreven staat worden het al 'rellen' genoemd en bij het nieuws van nu.nl staat dat de 'demonstranten' mogelijk zelf ook wapens hadden.
En andere ooggetuigen meldde weer dat de demonstranten er pas wapens bij haalden toen ze werden beschoten door Shield. Net als met Khadaffi, als je toch van vergelijken houdt. Dus dat weten we niet.

quote:
Echter, de eerste 'demonstraties' tegen Ghadaffi begonnen ook met het in de fik steken van auto's en politiegebouwen, en daar zullen behalve wapens als molotov cocktails, ook zwaardere wapens gebruikt zijn, wat tot het aantal doden van onze subjectieve media gedeeld door 10 leidde.

Verzin er nog wat leugens bij zoals bij Ghadaffi is gedaan: huurlingen, luchtaanvallen, wrede dictator, verkrachtingen.
en hoppaa, je hebt er bijna weer een 'revolutie' bij.
Volgens Khadaffi.

Wat een vergelijkingen ook weer, alsof een paar gebouwen in de fik zetten massamoord goedpraat.

[ Bericht 0% gewijzigd door Frikandelbroodje op 10-06-2013 21:17:10 ]
Incelfrikandel
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quote:
Violence Against Libyan Protesters Threatens to Undercut Power of Militias

BENGHAZI, Libya — Gathering here to bury nearly 30 civilian protesters killed the night before by a powerful militia, mourners said Sunday that they hoped a backlash after the massacre would finally cow Libya’s freewheeling brigades into submitting to the central government.

“It is sad that whenever we reach our goals we have to lose souls in the process,” said Naja Abdel Wanis, 28, an engineer. The militia, known as Libya Shield, had already fled, he said, adding, “There is no longer a Libya Shield.”

Militia leaders argue that Libya’s weak transitional government still badly needs their superior firepower. But after this weekend’s clashes, there were signs on Sunday that Libyans’ shock at the violence against civilians might undercut the influence of the biggest militia leaders just as they appeared poised to consolidate their political power.

On Sunday afternoon, the transitional Parliament said it had accepted the resignation of the government official closest to the militia leaders, Yousef al-Mangoush, the military chief of staff and the brigades’ chief advocate. Libya Shield’s compound here was all but deserted, and its fighters were scattered after the melee on Saturday night. A handful of looters pawed over the rubble of a burned-out car, a tank and a rocket launcher left in the yard.

The militia’s leaders appeared to be in hiding; in a telephone interview late Saturday, a spokesman declined to disclose his location because of safety concerns. By Sunday night, several other militias reportedly announced their own dissolution as well.

After weeks of anonymous bombings and assassinations aimed at the former security forces of Col. Muammar el-Qaddafi, new police officers in blue uniforms appeared for the first time since the revolution on the streets of Benghazi. A contingent of regular, uniformed troops was also patrolling the cemetery to deter any new violence, and about a dozen soldiers were lined up in a row along the road outside.

“This is a historic day for our revolution,” said Jamal Bennor, a judge who attended the burials. “Now all the people are determined that there is no room for ‘security committees’ or ‘militias’ outside the official authorities,” he said. “Be satisfied. Everything is going well. The local government has no power, but the power is with the people.”

The Libya Shield militia has been a bellwether among the many autonomous brigades that emerged out of the revolt against Colonel Qaddafi two years ago. Although the militia was outside government control, its leaders distinguished themselves by offering their services to help quell regional unrest. Government officials cited it as a vital, “legitimate” militia, and it became a template for a handful of other brigades, which adopted the names Libya Shield 2, 3, 4 and so on.

But as the transitional government came to depend on Libya Shield and its imitators, the militia leaders also used their leverage to influence the government, most notably in pushing for the passage last month of a law barring former senior Qaddafi government officials from public posts for 10 years.

The broad legislation had the effect of disqualifying many of the big militias’ leading civilian opponents. And to push it through, armed militia members surrounded the Ministries of Justice and Foreign Affairs as well as the transitional Parliament, implicitly threatening the use of force.

The Parliament’s swift acquiescence had appeared to seal the militia leaders’ hold on power, and Wissam bin Hamid, the leader of Libya Shield, was chosen to lead a committee of top brigade leaders who would advise the civilian government.

Then on Saturday, what began as a dispute with neighbors over the deed to Libya Shield’s compound escalated into a lopsided slaughter. A swelling crowd of hundreds attacked the compound with rocks, and a few fired Kalashnikovs. The ill-trained militia inside retaliated with heavy gunfire, antiaircraft guns, rocket-propelled grenades and at least one round of mortar fire.

Thirty-one people were killed, officials said Sunday, raising the death toll from the 27 reported the night before. Only two were members of Libya Shield, its leaders said, and the rest were protesters.

In a radio interview on Saturday night, Mr. Bin Hamid of Libya Shield was unapologetic, portraying the protesters as angry members of a local tribe, Qaddafi loyalists and “federalists” aiming to break up the country into a union of three autonomous states.

“They had strange demands,” Mr. Bin Hamid said. “We did not understand what they wanted.”

But on Sunday, some mourners said that Mr. Bin Hamid had badly damaged his image. “He looked for bogus excuses,” said Nasser Ghaffer, 32, a former brigade leader who put down his weapon to resume civilian life. Libya Shield’s “legitimacy,” he said, is just “decoration.”

Mr. Abdel Wanis, the engineer, said: “His blood is wanted, as we say in Libyan culture. He can no longer come here. He is finished.”
Incelfrikandel
  woensdag 10 juli 2013 @ 21:18:25 #34
38496 Perrin
Toekomst. Made in Europe.
pi_128812187
quote:
Libya Oil Output Slides as Power Cuts Mix With Protests

Since the overthrow of Muammar Qaddafi in 2011, Libya’s oil industry has become the target of violent attacks and civil protests. The latest challenge is a lack of electricity.

Production dropped 16 percent to 1.13 million barrels a day last month, the lowest since January, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. The decline is partly because power shortages are disrupting the pumps that lift oil from beneath the ground, said Abdel Jalil Mayuf, a spokesman for state-run Arabian Gulf Oil Co., which pumps crude in eastern Libya.

The oil and natural gas industry makes up more than 70 percent of Libya’s economy and generates almost all the state’s revenue, according to the International Monetary Fund. Falling output is also a challenge for international companies including Italy’s Eni SpA (ENI), which gets more output from Libya, North Africa’s largest producer, than any other country.

“The country has been through a tumultuous time,” said Sana Abid, an oil analyst at KBC Energy Economics. “It looks bleak for Libya at the moment. They are going to struggle and that’s reflected in declining output.”

Austrian producer OMV AG (OMV) said today its fields in Libya, which produced 30,000 barrels a day last year, have been shut since June 25 because of the political situation.

The Libyan government is trying to address the problems facing oil producers, quadrupling the size of a special guard to protect the industry from attacks to 12,000 people this year.

To ensure electricity supply, Libya signed a deal with London-based contractor APR Energy Plc (APR) to provide 450 megawatts of power through mobile generators, the largest ever single contract for temporary power supply.
quote:
Major Upgrading
“Stop-gap solutions are unlikely to be enough,” John Hamilton, a director at U.K.-based consultant Cross-Border Information, said in an interview in Tripoli. “Power generation and a major upgrading of power lines crossing hundreds of miles of desert are essential to keep production at existing levels.”

Civil protests at oil fields, where demonstrators have demanded jobs and changes in the way oil revenue is distributed, have cost Libya about 250,000 barrels a day in lost output, Oil Minister Abdulbari Al-Arusi said last month. Production is now 30 percent below the post-revolution peak of 1.6 million barrels a day reached last July.

Violence is also a risk. A shooting in June near Zueitina, a city in eastern Libya with a major oil export terminal, left an employee at power grid supplier ABB Ltd. (ABBN) and a contractor injured, according to state-run news agency LANA.

The Tripoli headquarters of the Defence Ministry Petroleum Facilities Guard was stormed by militiamen from Zintan late last month, leading to a gun battle in the streets of the capital that left at least six people injured.

Security Problem
“There is a general security problem in the country,” Total SA (FP) Chairman and Chief Executive Officer Christophe De Margerie said in an interview. “We have reduced our expatriate staff a little so that in case of a big problem we can evacuate more quickly.”

Demonstrations have been held at terminals in Tobruk and Zueitina -- shut down at least four times since November -- and at the Al-Fil oil field in the south, Al-Arusi said. Eni was forced to halt gas exports to Europe through its Greenstream pipeline for a week this year.

An explosion in April at pipelines serving Zueitina also heightened tensions after LANA reported it was a rocket-propelled grenade attack, citing an army officer. While the state-run National Oil Corp. called it an accident, results from an investigation haven’t been released.

“The way in which the Libyan institutions will settle down is at the center of our attention,” Eni CEO Paolo Scaroni said in an interview last month. “In principle, there are all the reasons to get to a peaceful democracy.”
quote:
Saharan Wilderness
As well as holding back production, unrest makes some companies wary of looking for new fields in a country with Africa’s largest oil reserves. Explorers have become particularly wary of exploring the wilderness of the Saharan desert after an attack in January by al-Qaeda-linked militants on the In Amenas gas plant in neighboring Algeria left at least 38 foreign workers dead.

“Companies are extremely worried,” said Cross-Border’s Hamilton. “BP said in 2012 they were going to resume exploration in 2013, and here we are, there’s no sign of resuming exploration. A company like BP right now couldn’t commit hundreds of millions of dollars and send large numbers of its employees into the desert.”

BP Plc (BP/) has pulled its foreign workers due to insecurity, though the company remains operational with its Libyan staff, according to a spokesman.

Worsening Relations
Thomas Schmidt, a spokesman for ABB, confirmed an incident had taken place in Libya and he said the company has no plans to leave for the moment. Neither does Total.

The biggest risk for the oil and gas industry may be the worsening relations between the country’s two halves -- western Libya, where the capital Tripoli is located, and the oil-producing regions in the east.

Many of the protests that disrupted oil production in the east were led by federalists seeking a greater share of oil revenue for the region, according to Arabian Oil’s Mayuf. The east is also where U.S. Ambassador Chris Stevens and three colleagues were killed in Benghazi in September.

“Libya’s oil industry is the football that all groups and protagonists seek to kick around,” said Duncan Bullivant, CEO of U.K.-based consulting company Henderson Risk.
Vóór het internet dacht men dat de oorzaak van domheid een gebrek aan toegang tot informatie was. Inmiddels weten we beter.
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quote:
Picking Up the Pieces in Libya

During the week of July 22nd, 2013, three Libyan officials were killed in a wave of violence that shook Libya as a whole, and the city of Benghazi, in particular.

Since the country’s liberation from the regime of Muammar Ghaddafi, assassinations have become an increasingly common phenomenon.

Attacks against two Libyan army officials, Colonel Salem Al Sarah (head of police in southern Libya) and Lieutenant Khattab Younis Zwai (a local Benghazi police officer) followed the usual pattern. As with previous attempts, these assassinations aimed to quash efforts to establish a national army and police force to replace the militias that continue to run Libya.

But, the third victim of these attacks, prominent activist and lawyer, Abdulsalam Al-Mismari, highlights a shift in targeting practices – civil society is now on the hit list.

Al-Mismari was the founder of the February 17 Coalition, a collection of activists at the forefront of the country’s uprising. He had always been outspoken, and had previously received death threats for speaking out against Islamist factions in the former interim government, the National Transitional Council.

Most recently, Al-Mismari had publically expressed concerns about the assassination of General Abdelfatah Younis, who was killed on July 28th, 2011, and criticized the Muslim Brotherhood for attempting to sway the government through the use of armed groups.

Al-Mismari’s assassination sparked nation-wide protests condemning the violence and calling for the disbanding of all militias.

To date, Libya’s spate of assassinations, which began with the Younis killing, has claimed 62 victims. Perpetrators have yet to be identified or brought to justice in these cases.

A Sobering Reality: Have We Reached a Breaking Point?

As assassinations and violence increased over the last 2.5 years, Libyans persevered and continued to remain hopeful.

Recent events have, however, definitively shattered this bubble.

Hassan Al-Amin, a human rights lawyer, opponent of the Ghaddafi regime, and former representative from Misrata in the General National Council (GNC), Libya’s interim parliament, has continuously spoken out about the issues plaguing the country.

Al-Amin resigned from the GNC in May, in opposition to the forced passage of the controversial political isolation law. The law prohibits officials with ties to the Ghaddafi regime from working in the government for a period of ten years. The legislation was passed under duress, after various militia groups threatened violence if the law was not approved.

Since stepping down from office, Al-Amin has continued to speak out against the chaos in the country.

“Libya has reached its breaking point, the situation is getting worse by the day” he observes.

In a country where militias are strong and the government weak, the current crisis can only be described as inevitable.

Since Ghaddafi’s ouster, the militias, which were created to battle the regime, have been prone to fighting amongst themselves. These conflicts have typically been about settling scores that more often than not are extensions of tensions between other factions in Libya.

The government has attempted to incorporate the militias into the national security services. Nevertheless, many militia groups continue to pursue local and individuals interests, instead of the public good, making them ill-suited to provide security for the general population.

“Militias are divided, they can’t work together. They have differing views, demands, and have gained status, prestige, and power that they are not willing to give up on easily,” says Al-Amin.

The troubling situation is compounded by internal tensions within the Libyan army, which is national only in name. As the country’s circumstances continue to deteriorate, army heads are consistently shuffled around with no real ground being made.

Local police forces across the country are uncoordinated. Most critically, they lack a central intelligence system, which makes, rampant violence, like on-going assassinations, impossible to resolve.

Outside forces, whether regional or international, also play a role in destabilizing the country. Those with vested interests, which may or may not align with peaceful developments in the nation, constantly threaten to push Libya to its limits. It is commonly believed, for example, that Libya’s Islamists are backed by regional forces that will not rest until an Islamic state is established.

These experiences are further aggravated by the inexperience of the Libyan government and the GNC and their collective unwillingness to genuinely address the issues threatening the country’s security.

In the face of growing violence, both bodies have been complacent to say the least. Each assassination has been met with vague, though prompt, statements condemning violence and promising justice. Little effort has been made, however, to investigate these crimes, capture responsible parties, and prevent similar incidents from occurring in the future.

On top of all this, the government remains disconnected from the street and has made little effort to cultivate support among the Libyan population.

“The government and parliament are an illusion. They have no standing or power in the country” says Al-Amin. He suggests that, for the first time in its history, Libya has begun to resemble the early days of post-war Iraq, where constant power struggles were a recurring phenomenon.

Al-Amin is firm when assigning responsibility for Libya’s failures, which he lays at the feet of numerous individuals and government bodies, particularly the interim parliament.

The GNC has failed to follow through on its responsibilities. The body was created for one reason: to help elect members for a constituent assembly that would draft a new constitution for the country.

No real headway has been made on this goal. A draft election law for the constitutional committee has been prepared, but has stalled while debates continue about representation in the assembly for Libya’s various constituencies.

Within the GNC, political parties pursue their own agendas. As with all political groups in the country, these parties were established after the country’s liberation. There has simply been insufficient time for these groups to develop real relationships with their constituencies, making it inevitable they would pursue the interests of a few over the many.

The Way Forward

In light of the recent assassinations, some have called for a boycott of the GNC.

It is clear the GNC and the government are too busy accommodating pressure groups to pursue the public interest. Nevertheless, their authority must be maintained.

The process for creating the constituent assembly must be accelerated. Once formed, the body must be empowered with the necessary tools to swiftly complete the task of drafting and voting on a constitution.

The government must approach Libya today as a country in a state of emergency. Great effort must be made to stabilize the country and engage the population in this work.

Redirecting the transitional period along these lines would help rectify the country’s current problematic course.

But, how does a fragmented nation, with the government on one side and the people on the other, forge a new path? Al-Amin maintains that honesty and transparency can mend ties between the government and the masses.

“It is not too late to restore the country but the government needs to clearly articulate a program of change. They must be honest and reveal who calls the shots, name the forces that are becoming obstacles. The people need to see a clear and innovative leadership, flexible but firm. The government needs to be smart about presenting the truth; gain back the respect of the Libyan street, then ask of them what they want.”

Al-Amin stresses this long overdue conversation should be televised, and occur sooner rather than later. Waiting too long will only make the situation worse and lead to more bloodshed.

Opportunity for Change

Many Libyans wish to see change but feel paralyzed.

How can the government become stronger when faced with militias that are fighting one another and undermining any attempts to create a professional state security service?

Al-Amin remains resolute that if the government acts wisely now, the country can be salvaged.

He suggests the government begin to cultivate relationships with young people who are interested in the political process and invested in creating a better future for Libya.

His logic is irrefutable. Including Libya’s disenfranchised youth in this transitional period would be a game changer.

In particular, Al-Amin believes reviving or in most cases introducing volunteerism among young people to establish localized security would create a viable alternative to current efforts at developing a police force and army, which are moving at a snail’s pace. Al-Amin believes money has been a factor in the militias’ ability to hold onto power, and that a volunteer force would re-establish loyalty to the state, neighborhood by neighborhood.

Efforts to engage young people could tap into on-going youth-led efforts, like Stand for Libya, which work to foster a more inclusive political sphere.

Stand for Libya is a coalition of several youth led NGOs across the country established in response to Libya’s instability. Malak Bouod, a founding member of the coalition, describes the goals of the initiative:

“We all have our own political opinions but have come together under one goal, to deliver Libya out of this ordeal. We are in agreement that this phase requires unity and synchronized efforts. Many NGOs and political parties have lost sight of what is important right now, to put pressure on the congress and the government until we make our way out of this crisis situation.”

“What good is it to us if Libya is dragged into a civil war, that we leave it to the disposal of terrorists and extremists? Now is the time for cohesion, once security and the state are established, we can all go back to our individual efforts,” explains Bouod.

Reservations and Obstacles

There are many hurdles to moving past this difficult time in the country’s history.

For instance, Ghaddafi sympathizers continue to use media and other forms of propaganda to undermine the revolution and break down all that has been achieved so far.

The continued absence of a unified, professional security apparatus is, obviously, a significant problem for stability in the country

The media has become a major obstacle post-revolution as well. Most media outlets subscribe to a distinct agenda and are devoid of journalistic integrity and ethics.

Rather than supporting the democratic process and cultivating the kind of national unity that existed during the uprising, Libyan media has become a divisive agent and has failed to provide the people with accurate information. It acts as a distracting force, deflecting attention away from important issues by broadcasting political rumors and baseless accusations.

Adding to the country’s many challenges, civil society has failed to step up to the plate. Reflecting the state of Libyan society, civic activities remain exclusive, localized, and disorganized.

Civil society in Libya, though nascent, would benefit from outreach, coordination, and consistency in its work. Furthering such efforts through comprehensive awareness and education campaigns would allow for civic-minded activities to become more widespread and continue for longer periods of time.

The Egypt Debate

In Libya, reactions to current events in Egypt vary.

Some insist the two countries have little in common: Egypt has a strong army while Libya does not; Egypt has suffered at the hands of one group (the Muslim Brotherhood) while Libya has been victimized by many organizations; the political arena in Egypt is well developed while Libya’s remains nascent.

Others believe Libya would be wise to learn from its neighbors.

Political activist and nationalist, Ayman Grada, believes that, in light of Egypt’s current turmoil, Libya has a chance to expel unwanted forces, like the Muslim Brotherhood, which threaten the state’s legitimacy.

He describes the country’s current political dynamics as a conflict between nationalists and Islamists. A power vacuum left behind post-revolution has allowed Islamists to thrive. Grada argues that Islamists, which include a matrix of radical jihadists, Muslim Brotherhood affiliates, and the Libyan Islamic Fighting Group (LIFG), all share the same goal of establishing a caliphate.

In Libya, the Islamists have allied with various militias and have been involved in sporadic clashes with the Libyan Special Armed Forces, as well as the storming of the GNC earlier this year to forcibly pass the political isolation law.

Nationalists, on the other hand, are made up of a coalition of tribes from all over the country including those in the east that support federalism. This group calls for a national state and rejects the Muslim Brotherhood’s purported globalist agenda.

“The two groups are in a constant power struggle, reflected in a severe partisan ideological schism inside the GNC, that sometimes devolves into street fights,” says Grada.

Libya’s Muslim Brotherhood has already stirred trouble across the border. According to recent report, the Libyan chapter of the Brotherhood supplied Egypt’s Brotherhood with weaponry.

There is no clear indication where the Brotherhood’s loyalty lies, although it is certainly not with the state. Nevertheless, reconciliation efforts must be pursued to ensure the schism between Islamists and nationalists is resolved, and does not continue to hamstring the country’s progress

Conclusion

While specific details on events inside Libya are hard to come by, the general sentiment in the country is clear.

Libyans are outraged by violence that continues to torment their communities without resolution, and want a country that will protect their rights both legally and physically, through a national security service.

The people of Libya are reaching a point of no return. Should the government fail to act swiftly and engage the population, it will lose these individuals for good and further expose the country to terrorists and extremists.

The people of Libya must continue to remind the government and militias they have no more patience left – it is time for change in the country.
quote:
Dispatches: A First Step toward Justice, for Some, in Libya

Libya is finally set to begin collecting evidence of crimescommitted by militias from the town of Misrata and people from Tawergha during the 2011 uprising to oust Muammar Gaddafi. This may be a first, hopeful step towards justice – but much needs to be done to ensure this difficult task is conducted fairly and thoroughly.

The Ministry of Justice announced on July 31, 2013, that a fact finding commission would begin its work, more than a year after the commission was established by a decree form the National Transitional Council.

Revolutionaries and civilians from Misrata have accused residents of neighboring Tawergha of siding with Gaddafi and his forces during the “17 February Revolution”. They have accused Tawerghans of committing serious crimes in Misrata, including unlawful killings, torture, and rapes, especially during the first months of the revolution, as Gaddafi forces besieged Misrata.

In August 2011, armed groups mostly from Misrata launched an onslaught on Tawergha, emptying the town, and subsequently looting and destroying its houses and rendering it inhabitable. Today, 35,000 Tawerghans were forced to leave their homes and now live in makeshift camps and private housing in Tripoli, Benghazi, and the South. Militias from Misrata have threatened Tawerghans with violence if they attempt to return. The Continued forced displacement of thousands of people amounts to a crime against humanity. Another 1,300 are missing or detained, mostly in Militia-run facilities in Misrata. Hundreds are dead.

The commission now has the daunting task of investigating these crimes and deciding which cases should be referred to the judiciary for prosecution and which people should receive compensation for their losses.

Despite the delay in launching investigations, this may be a step in the right direction. Authorities now need to show they are committed to justice by ensuring the commission is thorough, neutral, and independent. Much is at stake, and victims, from both sides, need to see a radical shift in the government’s attitude toward achieving justice.
Incelfrikandel
  zondag 1 september 2013 @ 21:04:59 #36
38496 Perrin
Toekomst. Made in Europe.
pi_130720287
quote:
'Libische olieproductie moet omhoog'

TRIPOLI (AFN/BLOOMBERG) - De Libische overheid kan mogelijk ambtenaren aan het eind van het jaar niet meer betalen als de olie-uitvoer niet toeneemt. Dat zei een lid van de Libische parlementaire energiecommissie zondag.

Die uitvoer staat sterk onder druk door protesten en stakingen van arbeiders en bewakers bij de belangrijkste oliefaciliteiten in het land. Libië produceert op dit moment 150.000 vaten olie per dag, terwijl het dagelijks 400.000 vaten zou moeten produceren om publieke salarissen te betalen. ,,De overheid draait op haar reserves. Als de situatie niet verbetert kunnen we eind dit jaar niet meer betalen'', aldus het commissielid.

Libië produceerde in augustus gemiddeld 575.000 vaten per dag, de laagste maandproductie sinds het einde van het regime van Moammar Kadhafi in 2011. Het land, dat de grootste bewezen oliereserves van Afrika zou hebben, zou met zijn faciliteiten in staat moeten zijn om 1,6 miljoen vaten per dag te produceren, een niveau dat in juli 2012 voor het laatst werd bereikt.
Vóór het internet dacht men dat de oorzaak van domheid een gebrek aan toegang tot informatie was. Inmiddels weten we beter.
pi_130721102
quote:
0s.gif Op zondag 1 september 2013 21:04 schreef Perrin het volgende:

[..]

Er wordt ook erg veel olie gejat daar en zwart verhandeld.
  woensdag 4 september 2013 @ 14:45:56 #38
38496 Perrin
Toekomst. Made in Europe.
pi_130812757
quote:
Special report: We all thought Libya had moved on – it has, but into lawlessness and ruin

A little under two years ago, Philip Hammond, the Defence Secretary, urged British businessmen to begin “packing their suitcases” and to fly to Libya to share in the reconstruction of the country and exploit an anticipated boom in natural resources.

Yet now Libya has almost entirely stopped producing oil as the government loses control of much of the country to militia fighters.

Mutinying security men have taken over oil ports on the Mediterranean and are seeking to sell crude oil on the black market. Ali Zeidan, Libya’s Prime Minister, has threatened to “bomb from the air and the sea” any oil tanker trying to pick up the illicit oil from the oil terminal guards, who are mostly former rebels who overthrew Muammar Gaddafi and have been on strike over low pay and alleged government corruption since July.

As world attention focused on the coup in Egypt and the poison gas attack in Syria over the past two months, Libya has plunged unnoticed into its worst political and economic crisis since the defeat of Gaddafi two years ago. Government authority is disintegrating in all parts of the country putting in doubt claims by American, British and French politicians that Nato’s military action in Libya in 2011 was an outstanding example of a successful foreign military intervention which should be repeated in Syria.

In an escalating crisis little regarded hitherto outside the oil markets, output of Libya’s prized high-quality crude oil has plunged from 1.4 million barrels a day earlier this year to just 160,000 barrels a day now. Despite threats to use military force to retake the oil ports, the government in Tripoli has been unable to move effectively against striking guards and mutinous military units that are linked to secessionist forces in the east of the country.
Vóór het internet dacht men dat de oorzaak van domheid een gebrek aan toegang tot informatie was. Inmiddels weten we beter.
pi_130813063
Ik kan me die roep naar democratie nog wel herinneren in Tunesie en Libie. Het is ze gelukt hoor ^O^

Arabische lente, democratie _O_

Vervolgens massaal met de boot naar de EU. Brussel zit vol met illegale tunesiers/libiers
pi_130975262
Ongehoord dat de Westerse leiders nog steeds niet durven toe te geven dat de regime change in Libie een blunder van jewelste was. Het welvarende Libie onder de prettig gestoorde, maar in principe uitstekende leider Khadaffi is veranderd in een uitzichtloze puinhoop met een permanente burgeroorlog. Ik zou hier wel eens wat meer media aandacht voor willen. Het is blijkbaar moeilijk toegeven dat men met deze bemoeienis volledig de plank heeft misgeslagen.

sec. militair gezien een succes, maar het uiteindelijke resultaat is rampzalig.
pi_130978172
Coming soon to a Syrian neighborhood near you.
"Oh shut up, silly woman," said the reptile with a grin
"You knew damn well I was a snake before you took me in."
  woensdag 6 november 2013 @ 13:07:30 #42
38496 Perrin
Toekomst. Made in Europe.
pi_132958378
quote:
Libya Is So Chaotic That It's Struggling To Buy Bread

TRIPOLI (Reuters) - Payments problems, chaos and corruption are hampering Libyan importers from making big deals to buy wheat, another setback as the country spins out of control two years after dictator Muammar Gaddafi was toppled by rebels and NATO warplanes.

In the latest disruption, the biggest wheat importer Mahatan Tripoli, which supplies most of the capital's bread, says it may have to put off its next major wheat purchase unless the state starts paying it nearly $100 million owed for previous imports.

For months, rogue militia members have disrupted Libya's oil exports, the main source of funding for a state that feeds its six million people with subsidized bread handed out for as little as 2 U.S. cents a loaf.

There are no signs of food shortages - quite the opposite: bread is still plentiful and cheap. But global grain traders say big Libyan buyers are now having difficulty arranging import deals. Exporters abroad are worried about being paid on time, and about the additional risks of unloading ships in chaotic ports where armed militia members run rampant.

The chairman of Matahan Tripoli, which buys wheat on international markets and sells flour and other processed foods to the state's subsidized distribution system, said the government owed it $96.7 million.

"If we don't get paid within two weeks then we don't have the funds to open new credit letters and make purchases again," Mustafa Abdel-Majid Idris told Reuters.
Vóór het internet dacht men dat de oorzaak van domheid een gebrek aan toegang tot informatie was. Inmiddels weten we beter.
pi_132963511
quote:
Seif Gaddafi Appears on TV in Libya for the First time

Tripoli—Gaddafi’s son Seif appeared on a Libyan TV channel Tuesday night for the first time since he was captured in 2011. He seemed nervous but in good health and insisting he would rather be tried in Zintan city.

In a brief interview obtained by Al Aseema TV channel, Seif Gaddafi said he was in good health, that he is being visited by human rights organizations and that he would rather be tried in the city of Zintan where he is being currently detained.

Prison authorities in Zintan agreed to the interview with Al Aseema TV after widespread rumours alleged that Seif escaped from prison and he had already left the country.

Both these authorities and the Libyan government in Tripoli wanted to bring an end to such rumours which have been used by some political factions to create instability in the country.

New details emerged in the interview about how Seif was captured in the early morning hours of 19 November 2011 in southern Libya.

Other new details were revealed in relation to the arrest in June 2012 of Australian lawyer Melinda Taylor as she smuggled electronic devices to Seif in prison. Taylor, a lawyer was appointed by International Criminal Court (ICC) to defend Seif.

Colonel Al Ajami Al-Atairi, commander of the brigade that captured Seif and which now securing his prison, revealed the name of the individual who was first to tip that there would be a VIP from the Gaddafi regime who was to secretly flee the country to neighboring Niger.

Not knowing who would be the VIP, Colonel Al-Atairi said he took necessary contingencies to monitor all escape routes that the suspected caravan may lead.

Al-Atairi was in command of a revolutionary brigade that was tasked with the mission to secure the southwestern part of Libya.

A few days later two SUVs appeared. In first there were two people including the driver, Yousef, who was also the desert guide and an aide to Seif with the rank of a Colonel.

Seif was in the second car with two other people. He tried to hide his identity by putting his face in the sand and decided to escape only to change his mind as a result of the heavy gunfire in the air.

Al-Atairi said he was rather surprised when one of the men who were riding with him said the man whose face was covered with sand wad Seif Gaddafi. They were all taken to a nearby camp and then were flown to Zintan, 800 kms to the north.

During the very brief interview with Al-Aseema TV, Seif was kind of nervous. In the beginning his lawyer, Mohamed Bousenna consulted with him and went back to the TV crew to tell them that Seif declined to go on TV.

Later Bousenna returned and told the interviewer that he could only ask three questions: one about his health, another about whether he is getting visitors from family and human rights organizations and the third about the place of his trial. Here is a translation to the full brief interview:

Interviewer: How is your health, tell about your health?

Seif Gaddafi: ‘Al-hamdu liallah’ (thanks to God).

Interviewer: Do your family and human rights organizations visit you?

Seif Gaddafi: Yes, ‘Al-hamdu liallah’ (thanks to God).

Interviewer: What is the secret behind your saying that you wish to finish your trial in Zintan and you do not want to be transfer to Tripoli?

Seif Gaddafi: Is not Zintan in Libya? There is no problem. What is the difference between it and Tripoli?

Interviewer: Do not you see that there is a problem in Zintan?

Seif Gaddafi: You, do you see that there is a problem?

Interviewer: I am asking you?

Seif Gaddafi: Is Zintan in Libya or outside Libya?

Interviewer: Inside Libya.

Seif Gaddafi: ‘khalas’ (then).
Incelfrikandel
  zondag 10 november 2013 @ 23:57:08 #44
343860 UpsideDown
Baas Boven Baas
pi_133135663
quote:
Premier Libië mobiliseert burgers tegen milities

De Libische premier Ali Zidan heeft de bevolking zondag opgeroepen geweldloos de strijd aan te binden met de vele milities die het land onveilig maken.


De betrekkingen van Libië met het buitenland staan op het spel, zei Zidan.

Afgelopen week legden rivaliserende strijdgroepen het openbare leven in de hoofdstad Tripoli lam. De milities hadden het aan de stok over de moord op een rebellencommandant uit Misurata. In Tripoli brak paniek uit en er vielen vier doden.

Sinds rebellen het bewind van Muammar Kaddafi in 2011 ten val brachten kampt Libië met milities die met elkaar wedijveren om de macht. De nieuwe machthebbers slagen er maar niet in de vele strijdgroepen in het gelid te dwingen en te ontwapenen.

Vorige maand was een militie zelfs brutaal genoeg Zidan zelf te ontvoeren. De strijders hielden de premier korte tijd gevangen, maar lieten hem al snel gaan.
quote:
Financiële problemen Libië door olieblokkade

Libië dreigt vanaf volgende maand betalingsproblemen te krijgen vanwege de aanhoudende stakingen en blokkades bij Libische olievelden en havens. Dat heeft de Libische premier Ali Zeidan zondag gezegd.


Arbeiders, bewakers en milities leggen al maanden de belangrijkste oliefaciliteiten van het land plat om hoger loon en meer politieke rechten te eisen.

De premier waarschuwt nu dat als de blokkades niet stoppen, de overheid door de gedaalde olie-inkomsten problemen zal krijgen met het dekken van haar uitgaven.

Hij gaf de actievoerders een week tot tien dagen de tijd om hun acties te staken, anders zullen maatregelen worden genomen, zonder nadere details te geven.

Door de onrust in de Libische olie- en gasindustrie is de productie van het OPEC-land gedaald naar nog maar een fractie van de capaciteit van 1,6 miljoen vaten per dag.
Say what?
pi_133260920
Er moet een nieuwe grote man komen die de tribale stammen, clans en milities onder de duim kan houden. Dat is de enige manier voor vrede en stabiliteit in een land als Libië. Het ironisch is dat die leider er zat. Zie zo'n man met die kwaliteiten nu nog maar eens terug te krijgen. Een 2e Khadaffi is er niet. Alleen hierom zal het nog een hels karwei worden om de stabiliteit en welvaart terug te krijgen in dat land.
  zaterdag 16 november 2013 @ 19:41:45 #46
343860 UpsideDown
Baas Boven Baas
pi_133324301
Nog altijd een chaos in Libië met veel doden tot gevolg:

quote:
Opnieuw gevechten in Libië

zaterdag 16 nov 2013, 15:57 (Update: 16-11-13, 19:10)

In buitenwijken van de Libische hoofdstad Tripoli zijn opnieuw gevechten uitgebroken tussen rivaliserende militieleden. De gevechten volgen op de geweldsexplosie van gisteren, waarbij meer dan veertig mensen omkwamen en honderden gewond raakten.

Leden van een militie uit de stad Misrata zouden zijn opgerukt naar Tripoli. Ze zijn in gevecht geraakt met lokale militieleden. Misrata ligt zo'n tweehonderd kilometer ten oosten van Tripoli.

Nieuwe gevechten
Gisteren liep het in Tripoli uit de hand toen demonstranten richting het hoofdkantoor van de militie uit Misrata liepen. Ze eisten het vertrek van de strijders uit de hoofdstad. Toen de betogers in de buurt kwamen, openden militieleden in burger het vuur.

Sommige betogers gingen daarop wapens halen en het kwam tot nieuwe gevechten bij het hoofdkantoor van de militie. Verschillende gebouwen werden in brand gestoken.

Nauwelijks vat
Premier Ali Zeidan deed vandaag een oproep aan alle partijen om kalm te blijven. Ook waarschuwde hij dat geen milities van buiten Tripoli naar de hoofdstad moeten komen. Regeringsgezinde milities hebben in de stad barricades opgeworpen.

De Libische regering heeft nauwelijks vat op de vele gewapende strijders in het land. Vorige maand werd de premier ontvoerd en urenlang vastgehouden.

Nog geen grondwet
Libië heeft twee jaar na de val van kolonel Kadhafi nog geen grondwet. In het parlement woedt een heftige strijd tussen seculiere en islamitische fracties.
quote:
Veertig doden bij gevechten Tripoli

zaterdag 16 november 2013, 18:48

Opnieuw zijn in buitenwijken van de Libische hoofdstad Tripoli gevechten uitgebroken. De gevechten volgen op de geweldsexplosie van gisteren, waarbij meer dan veertig mensen omkwamen en honderden gewond raakten.
Say what?
pi_133325222
Dat heeft het Westen allemaal keurig geregeld daar. Vrijheid, blijheid en democratie. Leve de revolutie.
pi_133325903
quote:
0s.gif Op zaterdag 16 november 2013 20:12 schreef Schurkenstaat het volgende:
Dat heeft het Westen allemaal keurig geregeld daar. Vrijheid, blijheid en democratie. Leve de revolutie.
inderdaad, voor herhaling vatbaar in Syrië ;)
pi_133327921
Het is bijna een kopie van de geweldexplosie in Benghazi in juli dit jaar, wat beiden is veroorzaakt door de militie zelf. Deze militie is vooral actief in het district in Gharghour, Tripoli, maar komen oorspronkelijk uit Misrata. Maar dat zijn niet de enige milities die problemen veroorzaken in het land.

Het probleem is dat de regering de mogelijkheden, maar vooral de wil niet heeft, om deze milities aan te pakken. De regering gebruikt milities in het hele land juist veelal om de veiligheid te regelen. Veel milities worden zelfs betaald door de regering om dit te doen, hoewel ik niet zeker weet of dat bij deze militie ook het geval was. Feit is, dat ze militie hier totaal niet aan voldeed en in de clinch ligt met andere milities in Tripoli. Vandaar dat de lokale bevolking ging eisen dat ze zouden vertrekken uit de stad, waarna de Gharghour militie reageerde met geweld.

In ieder geval is het gebruiken van milities geen goed alternatief voor politie of het leger, omdat hun loyaliteit niet bij de regering ligt natuurlijk. Wat de regering zou moeten doen is eens gaan doen wat de bevolking wilt en de milities ontbinden. Makkelijker gezegd dan gedaan natuurlijk, en hoewel ze daar eerder wel in zijn geslaagd, is het logische gevolg is dat de milities zich fel zullen verzetten. Echter, wanneer de regering de huidige situatie zo laat zal alleen meer chaos en meer bloedvergieten volgen.
Incelfrikandel
pi_133328127
quote:
0s.gif Op zaterdag 16 november 2013 20:12 schreef Schurkenstaat het volgende:
Dat heeft het Westen allemaal keurig geregeld daar. Vrijheid, blijheid en democratie. Leve de revolutie.
Veel te kort door de bocht om de schuld weer allemaal toe te schuiven op het Westen. De problemen na de revolutie in Libië worden vooral intern veroorzaakt. En voor buitenlandse bemoeienis om de boel toen te laten stabiliseren was geen behoefte, zowel in Libië als daarbuiten.
Incelfrikandel
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