Veel doden door treinongeluk in Spanje

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Op vrijdag 25 juni 2010 11:36 schreef Lagrinta het volgende:
Iedereen maakt fouten, zeker in het verkeer. Echter als je een spoor oversteekt moeten alle alarmbellen bij je gaan rinkelen. Dat betekent dat je kijkt of er een trein aankomt, vervolgens welke afstand en snelheid deze heeft en dan maak je een afweging.

Ik zou zelf niet snel een spoor oversteken, maar het kan best. Mensen nemen verkeer gewoon niet serieus. Dat zie je overal. Moeders met kinderen steken zonder uit te kijken over. Als mijn kind zonder uitkijken overstak zou ie dat een week later nog voelen. Kwestie van opvoeding.
Daarnaast zijn mensen slecht in het inschatten van een naderend object. Daarom zou ik graag zien dat snelheid inschatten verplicht onderdeel van het rijexamen wordt. Bijvoorbeeld vertellen over hoeveel seconden een object passeert.

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Op vrijdag 25 juni 2010 08:24 schreef Redux het volgende:

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http://www.google.com/hos(...)bhSpqbhS9S9PmTGP-4eA

Er is blijkbaar twijfel over de duidelijkheid van de aangegeven route. De brug was afgesloten en wellicht was de voetgangerstunnel niet goed aangegeven.

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Op vrijdag 25 juni 2010 12:47 schreef Gia het volgende:
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Dat is dus zoeken naar een zondebok. Het is altijd de schuld van iets of iemand anders.

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Op vrijdag 25 juni 2010 12:47 schreef Gia het volgende:
Dat is dus zoeken naar een zondebok. Het is altijd de schuld van iets of iemand anders.

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but others said a new underground exit was poorly marked and an old crossing was blocked off, leaving travellers confused

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Op vrijdag 25 juni 2010 12:50 schreef Leandra het volgende:

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Dat de brug afgesloten is terwijl er een enorme meute mensen verwacht wordt is een zondebok zoeken?

Er waren dus 2 manieren om het station veilig te verlaten en daarvan heeft men één simpelweg afgesloten....
Gisteren waren ze nog dommer dan dom omdat ze 2 manieren hadden het station te verlaten, en nu blijkt dat één van de twee afgesloten was telt dat ineens niet mee??

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Op vrijdag 25 juni 2010 12:54 schreef Redux het volgende:

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Mocht dit inderdaad zo blijken, dan lijkt het me dat je de spaanse spoorwegen aansprakelijk kunt stellen.

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Op vrijdag 25 juni 2010 12:56 schreef Ripley het volgende:

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Als er maar 1 route is om het station veilig te verlaten lijkt dat me nog steeds 1 route. Geen excuus om dan maar levensgevaarlijke capriolen uit te gaan halen.

Tuurlijk is de dood altijd tragisch, maar dom blijft het wel

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Op vrijdag 25 juni 2010 13:04 schreef Redux het volgende:

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Als blijkt dat de route naar de voetgangerstunnel slecht was aangegeven, dan kun je hier de schuld bij de verantwoordelijken neerleggen.

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"People who have recovered the remains say they have not seen anything like it"

A team of doctors, nurses and six psychologists Emergency Medical Service ( EMS ) prepared since early this morning to the families of victims of train collision occurred last night in Castelldefels (Barcelona) to receive confirmation of the death of their relatives.

Psychologists meet with the family every three hours to report the progress of the case, and I explained that the identification is "complex and long, more than expected, so the suffering will be greater," according to the team psychologist attending them.

Currently there is no body has been identified, and both victims are officially missing. "Pero cuando pasan las horas y no se encuentran, todo apunta a ello", confirma un portavoz del equipo de asistencia. 'But when we spend hours and are not, everything points to it, "confirmed a spokesman for the support team. Las familias, que llevan "unas doce horas de incertidumbre" van haciéndose a la idea de que han perdido a uno de los suyos. The families, who have "a dozen hours of uncertainty" are getting the idea that they have lost one of theirs.

An identification that will expand until tomorrow

The identification of the bodies of 13 people swept away by a train in Castelldefels will continue throughout Thursday, all night and part of Friday due to poor condition have been many bodies and human remains after the tremendous impact received .

Tura has to be identified added that five people - two women and three men - and that the nationalities predominate among all bodies are Ecuadorian, Bolivian and Colombian

The remains, which comes in 20 bags, are badly deteriorated since the brutal impact that the victims were to be hit by a fast train Alaris, to the extent that the identification of many bodies can not be done by the facial features and that the faces have been disfigured.

"People who have worked on the task of recovering the remains of the bodies say that they had never seen a similar thing," Tura said

Three of the injured remain in critical condition

The 10 people are swept away by train from Barcelona admitted to several hospitals, including three in critical condition. Otras cuatro han recibido el alta y dos pasan a pronóstico leve tras mejorar , mientras las 12 víctimas mortales han sido trasladadas al Instituto de Medicina Legal para su identificación. Another four have been discharged and two pass prognosis after improving slightly, while 12 deaths have been moved to the Institute of Legal Medicine for identification.

Montilla, who has declared today an official day of mourning in Catalonia, has attributed the tragedy to a "reckless gesture 'of the victims, who were overwhelmed by the Euromed train Alaris when, after descending from a commuter train, crossed the tracks directly to go to the beach instead of an underpass by the station.

In this regard, Secretary of State for Infrastructure, Victor Morlan, has avoided talking about negligence, but has indicated in a press conference that the station had been remodeled last fall and halt facilities met "the highest standards of accessibility."

Open the judicial investigation to see if could be avoided
The judicial investigation into the accident will determine whether the underpass from the station was enough to absorb the large number of travelers who descended on the station, apparently about 700, and if the closure of the upper walkway existing municipally owned, was one of the reasons why those who died and were injured chose to cross the tracks.

Marcelo Carmona, a Bolivian witnessed the tragic train accident last night, has ensured that the underpass of the station was currently Castelldefels 'crowded' and that a few seconds before the incident, there was a "wave of people who ran for ways "to go to the beach to celebrate the festival.

"We heard the train horn several times and in three seconds ... everything was filled with corpses, there were many shouts and much distress," has told Carmona, who prided himself: "The train on which we were very crowded, Hundreds of people, especially young people and adolescents. "

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Op vrijdag 25 juni 2010 13:04 schreef Redux het volgende:

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1 route was afgezet, een andere route was niet duidelijk aangegeven.
Mensen raken in verwarring, omdat ze geen route naar de overkant zien.

Als blijkt dat de route naar de voetgangerstunnel slecht was aangegeven, dan kun je hier de schuld bij de verantwoordelijken neerleggen.

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A mayor of Castelldefels warned that the station could be a "trap" in San Juan

Angels Coté, warned in November 2009 in a council meeting that the renewed halt last night where there was a train crash that killed 13 people 'on the night of San Juan that can be a trap, and the months of July and August , too.

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Op vrijdag 25 juni 2010 13:21 schreef TheThirdMark het volgende:

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Inderdaad. De schuld bij de verantwoordelijken neerleggen. Oftewel --> de mensen die over het spoor liepen.

Zoals in die nieuwsberichten al aangegeven werd: overal stonden borden, de route was gemarkeerd en er werd via een audio installatie opgeroepen om de juiste route te nemen en weg te blijven bij de rails.

De verantwoordelijken hebben dit allemaal opzettelijk genegeerd.

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However, friends and relatives of the victims stated throughout the day that the area was not well marked and pointed out that the underpass was "collapsed" by the large influx of people. At the same time, the flyover was closed since the opening of the subway, with 3.5 meters wide and lift access for disabled users

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The mayor of Castelldefels Àngels Coté (ERC) said in November 2009 at a council meeting that the renewed halt last night where there was a train crash that killed 13 people 'on the night of San Juan that can be a trap, and the months of July and August, too. "

The accident occurred when about thirty people who had descended from a commuter train and heading to the beach to celebrate the festival of San Juan chose to cross the tracks instead of using an underpass of the station-Platja de Castelldefels , when they were overwhelmed by the Euromed train.

Councilwoman Àngels Coté, ERC was concerned, in a plenary session on November 26, 2009, by some security issues that respondents felt could occur in the new season, especially at the exits of the facility, due to some turnstiles that in his opinion hampered the passage of travelers.

"This station is now in winter can be a transition but, for example, the night of San Juan that may be a trap, and the months of July and August also," said the councilman, who added: 'not so much how they have been works, but the security of this station, 'because' stay in a cage ', as recorded in the transcript of his speech.

Adif corresponded to ensure the safety of the facility, and the criticisms and requests the City arrived at the offices of Development. Adif, meanwhile, reiterated that the installation was safe.

The agency has said the station facilities were "open and in service ', and that the tunnel allows traffic between the platform where they were passengers and the beach meets all legal and safety requirements.

Adif specified that the 'comprehensive redevelopment' of last year also marked the raising of the platforms to a height of 68 centimeters on the elevation of the lane.

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Op vrijdag 25 juni 2010 13:23 schreef Redux het volgende:

Daarnaast was de voetgangerstunnel blijkbaar te smal/krap.
Zo duidelijk is het dus allemaal niet.

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Op vrijdag 25 juni 2010 13:28 schreef Gia het volgende:

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Dat kan een probleem zijn op het moment dat er een bommelding is en iedereen zo snel mogelijk het perron moet verlaten. In zo'n geval zou een te krappe tunnel een reden kunnen zijn om via de rails te gaan.

Maar dat was niet het geval. Er was geen gevaar, er was geen reden om over de rails te gaan, anders dan haast hebben, er sneller willen zijn, niet wachten tot je via de tunnel kan enz....

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In addition to the dead, at least 14 were injured in the beach resort of Castelldefels, south of Barcelona, shortly before midnight on Wednesday as crowds of young people left a train heading for bonfires on a Mediterranean beach. Many jammed the underpass leading to the beach, but about 30 others climbed down from the platform and tried to scurry across the tracks.

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They were struck by a train passing through the station in north-eastern Spain.

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Development Minister Jose Blanco has denied claims the underpass was poorly marked, and insisted that passengers should have known that "you never, never, never cross the tracks".

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"Everything pointed to negligence," Mr Blanco added, saying he hoped the tragedy would make passengers understand that they must obey station rules.

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But Arrellano Ruiz, the Ecuadorian consul in Barcelona, said passengers did not see the signs for the underpass exit and mistakenly headed to a footbridge that had been closed since a 2009 renovation.

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Victor Morlan, Spain's infrastructure secretary, acknowledged that the bridge has been blocked off since last year but insisted there were enough signs telling passengers how to safely reach the beach.

"It had a sign system that was well made and it had a loudspeaker service that pointed out that the tracks must not be crossed," Mr Morlan said.

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Op vrijdag 25 juni 2010 13:42 schreef TheThirdMark het volgende:

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Ze kwamen verdomme nog uit een trein ook nog. Ze klommen van het perron af (dus niet een verlaagd perron om over te steken, wat je in Nederland ook hebt)
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Dat schijn te gebeuren in gebieden waar rails ligt.
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Ok, wij wijzen met vingers, logisch. Een Minister kan het beter wat politieker brengen
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Ditto
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Ze probeerden via die rails bij die voetbrug te komen? Om dan weer terug te lopen naar het perron?
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En de Tunnel zelf was 3.5mtr breed. Daar kunnen met gemak 4 man naast elkaar lopen. Breed zat.

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The accident occurred when about thirty people who had descended from a commuter train and heading to the beach to celebrate the festival of San Juan chose to cross the tracks instead of using an underpass of the station-Platja de Castelldefels , when they were overwhelmed by the Euromed train.

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cilwoman Àngels Coté, ERC was concerned, in a plenary session on November 26, 2009, by some security issues that respondents felt could occur in the new season, especially at the exits of the facility, due to some turnstiles that in his opinion hampered the passage of travelers.

"This station is now in winter can be a transition but, for example, the night of San Juan that may be a trap, and the months of July and August also," said the councilman, who added: 'not so much how they have been works, but the security of this station, 'because' stay in a cage ', as recorded in the transcript of his speech.

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They got off the train and the elevated access to the other side of the road was closed. Not have realized that was another convoy ", denounced, in tears, Richard Oliva, sorry for the disappearance of her sister, Rosa Maria, 19 years." They say the train was no light and has not whistled until they occurrence of the brutal impact, "he added, concluding:" I consider my daughter, who is saved and who are operating in one leg, who wanted to climb the top step, but it was closed and there was no person . Let there be justice, there is no impunity! "Demanded.

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It's not fair to say that it was unwise, "wailed Quevedo." Access to the bridge should have been open. There was not a guard, or signaling. In addition, the train was without lights and with such speed that did not stop until a mile later. That's incredible. My cousins went with a group of five people. Another of my cousins is in Bellvitge very serious. "

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"The train carried no lights on"

They were the first. They saw the bridge closed and decided to jump the tracks. The others followed. "Here comes the train!" Shouted José Manuel, a boy of 18 years of Guinean origin, when they reached the other side of the tracks, and be safe from the platform.

The announcement came late. A crowd of people were trapped. And the train passed over them like paper dolls. "Blood spattered and saw what we had," he explained yesterday Kiny, also from Guinea-Bissau. What was destroyed were 12 bodies and 14 wounded. The group of Jose Manuel and Kiny, about 20 children, was safe, but two: Where are Diego and Eduardo? ". Not a trace of them.

Like the other victims and their families, Kiny, José Manuel and rest of the crew spent the night at the civic center of Castelldefels (Barcelona). But 12 hours after the event, decided to leave the coastal village and planted in the City of Justice, to the forensic institute.

"None of us knows anything," said Kiny, sometimes angry, sometimes sunk. "Everybody always complains of Renfe, I, today, I do really, not nonsense."

The boys were provided with food Castelldefels "and even sheets to spend the night on the beach", regretted that the station "would not have anyone Prosegur" and that the train "did not bear the lights on." Also that the underground tunnel would be impossible to do with all the people who had. " "How do we know?" Lamented. And with all the fatigue accumulated during the worst night of his life yet over, Kiny swung his body forward and back, and whispering a litany are kept repeating: "What bad luck, what bad luck." And suddenly, as if waking up, startled him an idea, a thought of relief: "Diego must be out there, must have lost the phone and when we find will tell us: Where have you been?".

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Op vrijdag 25 juni 2010 14:33 schreef Strani het volgende:
Als dat al zo is, dat de trein geen verlichting had (en ik betwijfel dat), dan is dat een secondaire reden van dit ongeluk. De primaire reden blijft nog altijd dat deze mensen zelf het spoor betraden.

Wat het afsluiten van 1 van de uitgangswegen betreft: Op station Amersfoort had men eind jaren negentig één van de bruggen afgesloten wegens verbouwingen. De andere was dus nog gewoon beschikbaar. Als daar mensen het spoor hadden betreden om sneller het station uit te komen, hadden we dan ook allemaal geroepen dat het de schuld is van de NS?

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Op vrijdag 25 juni 2010 14:35 schreef Redux het volgende:

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De tunnel aldaar bleek vol te zitten, er was dus geen doorgang door de tunnel door de hoeveelheid mensen. Dat was een bekend probleem, zie de artikelen.

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Op vrijdag 25 juni 2010 15:15 schreef Strani het volgende:


Ja, maar het is niet zo dat die tunnel dan permanent volzat. Aan het andere eind van de tunnel liepen mensen namelijk gewoon weer naar buiten. Dus had men maar even een paar minuten gewacht...