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  vrijdag 23 augustus 2002 @ 14:22:05 #1
1986 Jane
agnostic dyslexic insomniac
pi_5505071
Full name: Charles Hardin Holley
Born: September 7, 1936 in Lubbock, Texas
Died: February 3, 1959 near Mason City, Iowa

Buddy Holly, de man met waarschijnlijk het grootste invloed in de moderne popgeschiedenis, als je die invloed deelt door de duur van zijn carriere.
Hij heeft nog geen 2 jaar van zijn succes kunnen genieten en toch was hij een grote inspiratie voor degenen die na hem kwamen, vooral in de zestiger jaren. The Stones en The Beatles namen nummers van hem op. John Lennon zei ooit "He made it easy to wear glasses. I WAS Buddy Holly." en Paul McCartney zei over BH: "Buddy Holly gave you confidence. He was like the boy next door.". Op zijn beurt was Buddy Holly weer geinspireerd door Elvis ("Without Elvis, none of us would have made it."), maar er was één groot verschil: Holly schreef veel van zijn eigen nummers en had er zelf hits mee. Daarin was hij zeker een pionier.
De meeste mensen kennen wel nummers van hem, misschien zelfs zonder te weten dat ze oorspronkelijk van Buddy Holly zijn. Nummers als That'll be the day en Peggy Sue, maar ook bijvoorbeeld Not Fade Away, It's So Easy, I'm Gonna Love You Too, Oh Boy of mijn persoonlijke favoriet Well...All Right.

Buddy Holly kwam voort uit de rock 'n roll, maar zijn muziek gaat al weer meer richting de popmuziek zoals we die uit de jaren 60 kennen. Tenminste, zo hoor ik het.

Ik zou mezelf geen grote Buddy Holly kenner willen noemen, maar ik ben wel al vroeg met zijn muziek in aanraking gekomen. Toen ik me ging interesseren in the Beatles, kwam daarbij al heel snel de naam Buddy Holly naar boven. En McCartney is misschien wel de beroemste Holly-fan. Hij bezit de rechten op de muziek van BH en terwijl je hem nooit en te nimmer op een Beatlesconventie zult aantreffen, heeft hij wel ooit opgetreden op een Buddy Holly bijeenkomst.

Zijn er nog meer mensen die Buddy Holly kunnen waarderen of ben ik de enige Fok!ker die zijn muziek wel eens draait? Of misschien hebben jullie nog favoriete Buddy Holly-covers die je kunt aanraden?

De officiele website: http://www.buddyholly.com

[Dit bericht is gewijzigd door Seborik op 26-01-2004 20:42]

Lying awake, wondering if there is a Dog...
Tijn won het Morlvision Songfestival 2023
  vrijdag 23 augustus 2002 @ 14:26:34 #2
11029 WiSeGuY187
goodfella 4 life
pi_5505128
Vroeger als héél klein ventje had ik er een dubbel-lp (nee geen schrijffout ) van maar draai het nooit meer zou op dit moment niet eens weten waar die lp gebleven is..... zal nog wel bij mij ouders op zolder staan. Terwijl de muziek toch echt niet slecht was......
you know that film ? what's it called ... the oklahoma kid... well i'm the oklahoma kid
pi_5505140
Ben wel naar zijn officiele musical geweest in London. Kon het wel waarderen en is heel leuk om eens mee te maken. De muziek is zeker niet slecht. Maar ben wel erg jong.....ver voor mijn tijd. Ben meer ehm techno freak, maar voor de verandering: zeer goede muziek ja.
  vrijdag 23 augustus 2002 @ 14:31:27 #4
1986 Jane
agnostic dyslexic insomniac
pi_5505198
Ik ben ook naar die musical geweest in London! Was erg leuk zelfs! Het hele publiek deed op het laatst mee alsof het een echt Buddy Holly concert was.

Enne...ik denk dat er hier maar heeeel weinig mensen rondhangen voor wie Buddy Holly niet van ver voor hun tijd is. Maar goed, zoals ik ergens anders al eens heb gezegd: dat is geen reden om de muziek niet te kunnen waarderen.

Lying awake, wondering if there is a Dog...
Tijn won het Morlvision Songfestival 2023
  vrijdag 23 augustus 2002 @ 14:33:29 #5
33309 El_Jefe
WHY??????????????
pi_5505223
idd, de musical in london was fantastisch, en de muziek is nog steeds errug lekker luisteren soms.
WHY NOT?????????????????????????????????????
pi_5505872
Het debuutalbum van Buddy Holly is de meest complete rock 'n roll-plaat uit de jaren 50.
In die tijd was het gebruikelijk dat als een artiest een hit had er algauw een album volgde met die hit en voor de rest snel in elkaar geflansde liedjes.
Voor zover ik weer is 'The Chirping Crickets' de eerste R 'n R plaat die bol stond van de kwaliteit.

En volgens mij is Buddy Holly ook de eerste anti-held van de Rock 'n Roll. Hij ziet er zo typisch uit met die bril en dat jongensachtige gezicht.
Ik vind 'm cool!

Keeping an eye on the world going by my window.
  vrijdag 23 augustus 2002 @ 15:28:46 #7
7810 FooFighters
 Dave rocks on !!
pi_5506007
Buddy Holly... een van de beste Rock & Roll muzikanten.
samen met " The Crickets " verantwoordelijk voor veel bekende en gecoverde nummers.

Helaas vroegtijdig omgekomen bij een vliegtuig ongeval 3 february 1959 samen met " The Big Bopper "( J.P. Richardson )en Ritchie Valens..

Ik heb een paar originele singles van hem in mijn jukebox ( Coral label )

Peggy sue / Everyday (1957)
Crying, waitin, hopin / peggy sue got married (1959)
That'll be the day / looking for someone to love (1957)
Oh Boy / not fade away (1957)

heerlijk zo'n 1956 Wurlitzer.....

You heard of those dirty jalopies,
you heard of the noise they make,
let me reintroduce my new Rocket 88,
  vrijdag 23 augustus 2002 @ 15:31:54 #8
1986 Jane
agnostic dyslexic insomniac
pi_5506048
quote:
Op vrijdag 23 augustus 2002 15:28 schreef FooFighters het volgende:
heerlijk zo'n 1956 Wurlitzer.....
* Jane is jaloers...
Lying awake, wondering if there is a Dog...
Tijn won het Morlvision Songfestival 2023
  FOK!-Schrikkelbaas vrijdag 23 augustus 2002 @ 15:33:12 #9
1012 Doc
Loves C, M & R
pi_5506065
Volgens mij de eerste artiest waar ik fan van was. Xal een jaar of 9 of 10 geweest zijn. In die tijd zond de TROS op Hilversum 3 een paar weken tussen 7 en 8 een radio serie uit over het leven en werk van Buddy Hollie. Later hebben ze dat ook eens met The Beatles gedaan.
OG X BC - Orange Goblin Beer Core: Straight Edge - 'til the bar opens
Liverpool - JFT 96 - Never forgotten
  vrijdag 23 augustus 2002 @ 15:39:29 #10
7810 FooFighters
 Dave rocks on !!
pi_5506152
quote:
Op vrijdag 23 augustus 2002 15:31 schreef Jane het volgende:

[..]

* Jane is jaloers...


en mijn wurlitzer zit vol met dit soort plaatjes

Ritchie Valens - La Bamba en Come on lets go
Jerry Lee Lewis - High school confidential / Great balls
Carl Perkins - Boppin the blues
The pinguins - Earth angel
Dion - Runaway en runaround sue
Eddie Cochran - C'mon everybody

en eentje die niet vergeten mag worden..
Billy Lee Riley - Red hot en Flying Saucer R&R

en vele anderen....... ( 52 singles 104 selectie )

You heard of those dirty jalopies,
you heard of the noise they make,
let me reintroduce my new Rocket 88,
  vrijdag 23 augustus 2002 @ 15:49:19 #11
1986 Jane
agnostic dyslexic insomniac
pi_5506260
Nu ophouden hè, FooFighters?
* Jane zet gelijk ff Eddie Cochran op...

Maar op Buddy Holly terug te komen: zijn muziek is inderdaad heel veel gecoverd. Zelf kende ik bijvoorbeeld de versie van Well...All Right van Blind Faith eerder dan het origineel. Dat was dus zo'n nummer waarvan ik niet eens wist dat het van Holly was! Wel een goeie versie trouwens.

Lying awake, wondering if there is a Dog...
Tijn won het Morlvision Songfestival 2023
  maandag 26 augustus 2002 @ 10:44:19 #12
1986 Jane
agnostic dyslexic insomniac
pi_5538186
Ik was nog wat vergeten... Natuurlijk hebben The Beatles hun naam ook nog eens te danken aan The Crickets!
Lying awake, wondering if there is a Dog...
Tijn won het Morlvision Songfestival 2023
  maandag 26 augustus 2002 @ 12:46:25 #13
7810 FooFighters
 Dave rocks on !!
pi_5539499
quote:
Op vrijdag 23 augustus 2002 15:31 schreef Jane het volgende:

[..]

* Jane is jaloers...


kan het niet laten....

een linkje naar mijn jukebox ( onder personal file )

http://members.rott.chello.nl/ddenboer/mainframe.htm

Rock & Roll forever !!!

You heard of those dirty jalopies,
you heard of the noise they make,
let me reintroduce my new Rocket 88,
  maandag 26 augustus 2002 @ 13:03:13 #14
1986 Jane
agnostic dyslexic insomniac
pi_5539744
Hij's heel mooi!
Lying awake, wondering if there is a Dog...
Tijn won het Morlvision Songfestival 2023
  dinsdag 27 augustus 2002 @ 21:10:29 #15
35099 Scoff
Politiek Betweter
pi_5561250
Moest bij het lezen van dit topic denken aan Weezer
[b]:* Mady O+[/b][br]Nederland Is Vooral Vol Van Zichzelf[br]There Is No Right Way, Only [b]Your[/b] Way[br][b]Vandalism:[/b] Beautiful As a Rock In a Cop's Face[br][b]Flower Sniffin' Kitty Pettin' Baby Kissin' Corperate Rockwhores[/b]
pi_5569795
"Multi-talented Singer/Songwriter Steve Richards Teams With Former Megadeth Members To Record Buddy Holly Song"

Op dit moment wordt er gewerkt aan de opname van een nooit eerder uitgebracht nummer van Buddy Holly. Het is een van de laatste nummers die hij net voor zijn dood heeft geschreven.

Voor de geïnteresseerden is hier het hele artikel te vinden:

http://www.mi2n.com/press.php3?press_nb=39986

Take no prisoners... take no shit!
  maandag 26 januari 2004 @ 21:00:23 #17
1986 Jane
agnostic dyslexic insomniac
pi_16608472
Wist u dat The Hollies: ook een goede jaren '60 band. zich naar Buddy Holly vernoemd hebben?
Lying awake, wondering if there is a Dog...
Tijn won het Morlvision Songfestival 2023
  maandag 26 januari 2004 @ 22:22:47 #18
22975 mandark2000
Roxanne (put on the red light)
pi_16611286
quote:
Op maandag 26 januari 2004 21:00 schreef Jane het volgende:
Wist u dat The Hollies: ook een goede jaren '60 band. zich naar Buddy Holly vernoemd hebben?
Yep! Maar ik ken hun muziek niet. Van Buddy Holly ken ik elk nummer, en ik vind ze allemaal goed. In zo weinig jaren zoveel nrs opgenomen, waarvan het meerendeel single waardig en door m zelf geschreven. Echt een prestatie! Mijn favoriet is It Doesn't Matter Anymore, maar die's gescheven door Paul Anka.
  maandag 26 januari 2004 @ 22:28:59 #19
21578 Elvislives
Fietstas, Pumista
pi_16611539
ik bedenk me net, zou er geen soort van conspiracy theory (goed gespeld) zijn over de dood van buddy Holly en Ritchie Valens, door het neerstorten van dat vliegtuig dus?

ik bedoel, 2 toonaangevende muziekanten tegelijk dood, amerikanen zoeken overal iets achter, waarom hier dan niet?

iemand die iets weet? of anders wil meehelpen te verzinnen?

No chingues con mi barrio!
Vamos el TRI!
pi_16621529
Ik heb ergens gelezen over een theorie dat de piloot van het vliegtuig door een kogel om het leven zou zijn gekomen
  dinsdag 27 januari 2004 @ 12:07:42 #21
76173 bramos-elvis
FC Eindhoven 1909-2009
pi_16621828
Goed topic

Ik vind de muziek van Buddy Holly ook ontzettend goed. Hep 2 LP's van em. Hoewel die muziek ver voor mijn tijd is ben ik toch verzot op de oude Rock & Roll. Heb een paar oude singles, maar voornamelijk oude LP's. Heb de musical op tv gezien, ook La Bamba, de film over Ritchie Valens, heb ik gezien. Beide zeer indrukwekkend!

Holly's mooiste nummer vind ik denk ik True Love Ways, prachtig gewoon.

Heb trouwens ook 2 Lp's van Ritchie Valens en 2 van Eddie Cochran. En nog een zooi Rock & Roll LP's

Rock on........

ps. Wie zou die kogel dan agevuurd hebben, aangezien ze met 4-en in een vliegtuig zaten. Zelfmoord??? De rockers waren echt nog niet levensmoe!

ppss. Voor die meneer met de ouwe jukebox. Een single La Bamba/Come on let's go ?? De officiele single is Donna/La Bamba!

Accept you're dead and start living
pi_16622827
quote:
Op vrijdag 23 augustus 2002 14:31 schreef Jane het volgende:
Ik ben ook naar die musical geweest in London! Was erg leuk zelfs! Het hele publiek deed op het laatst mee alsof het een echt Buddy Holly concert was.

Enne...ik denk dat er hier maar heeeel weinig mensen rondhangen voor wie Buddy Holly niet van ver voor hun tijd is. Maar goed, zoals ik ergens anders al eens heb gezegd: dat is geen reden om de muziek niet te kunnen waarderen.


Ik heb die musical ook gezien en zoals je al zegt, idd voor mijn tijd (ver) Maar heb me prima vermaakt was echt heel leuk
  dinsdag 27 januari 2004 @ 12:58:16 #23
7810 FooFighters
 Dave rocks on !!
pi_16623040
quote:
Op dinsdag 27 januari 2004 12:07 schreef bramos-elvis het volgende:

ppss. Voor die meneer met de ouwe jukebox. Een single La Bamba/Come on let's go ?? De officiele single is Donna/La Bamba!


Er staat niet dat dat 1 single is er staat dat ik beide singles in mijn jukebox heb / had ( Donna / La Bamba en Come on let's go / Framed )... Ik heb inmiddels mijn jukebox ingeruild voor een Oldsmobile uit 1958.

You heard of those dirty jalopies,
you heard of the noise they make,
let me reintroduce my new Rocket 88,
  dinsdag 27 januari 2004 @ 13:00:01 #24
76173 bramos-elvis
FC Eindhoven 1909-2009
pi_16623087
Aaaaah soooooo
Accept you're dead and start living
pi_16843525
Vandaag precies 45 jaar geleden omgekomen bij een vliegtuigongeluk, veel te jong natuurlijk...
Respect voor deze grote artiest.
  dinsdag 3 februari 2004 @ 12:31:38 #26
1986 Jane
agnostic dyslexic insomniac
pi_16844530
The day the music died...
Bedankt voor het helpen herinneren, Hans12581. Doordat ik het net las, ben ik even gaan zoeken en vond op deze site een interessante uitleg over Don McLean's American Pie dat, zoals wellicht bekend, voor een groot gedeelte gaat over de dood van Buddy Holly.


THE ANNOTATED AMERICAN PIE
(What the song is talkin' about!)
By Rich Kulawiec

The entire song is a tribute to Buddy Holly and a commentary on how rock and roll changed in the years since his death. McLean seems to be lamenting the lack of "danceable" music in rock and roll and (in part) attributing that lack to the absence of Buddy Holly et. al. (Verse 1)

A long, long time ago...

"American Pie" reached #1 in the US in 1972, but the album containing it was released in 1971. Buddy Holly died in 1959.

I can still remember how
That music used to make me smile.
And I knew if I had my chance,
That I could make those people dance,
And maybe they'd be happy for a while

One of early rock and roll's functions was to provide dance music for various social events. McLean recalls his desire to become a musician playing that sort of music.

But February made me shiver,

Buddy Holly died on February 3, 1959 in a plane crash in Iowa during a snowstorm.The news came to most of the world on the morning of February 3, which is why it's known as The Day The Music Died.

With every paper I'd deliver,

Don McLean's only job besides being a full-time singer-songwriter was being a paperboy.

Bad news on the doorstep...
I couldn't take one more step.
I can't remember if I cried
When I read about his widowed bride

Holly's recent bride, Maria Elena, was pregnant when the crash took place; she had a miscarriage shortly afterward.

But something touched me deep inside,
The day the music died.

The same plane crash that killed Buddy Holly also took the lives of Richie Valens ("La Bamba") and The Big Bopper ("Chantilly Lace"). Since all three were so prominent at the time, February 3, 1959 became known as "The Day The Music Died".

So...
(Refrain)

Bye bye Miss American Pie,

Miss American Pie *is* rock and roll music. Don McLean dated a Miss America candidate during the pageant. (unconfirmed)

Drove my Chevy to the levee but the levee was dry
Them good ole boys were drinkin' whiskey and rye
Singing "This'll be the day that I die,
This'll be the day that I die."

One of Holly's hits was "That'll be the Day"; the chorus contains the line "That'll be the day that I die"

VERSE TWO

Did you write the book of love,

"The Book of Love" by the Monotones; hit in 1958.

And do you have faith in God above,
If the Bible tells you so?

In 1955, Don Cornell did a song entitled "The Bible Tells Me So". Rick Schubert pointed this out, and mentioned that he hadn't heard the song, so it was kinda difficult to tell if it was what McLean was referencing. Dave Tutelman tells me that this particular song wasn't exactly a gem of rock 'n roll.

There's also an old Sunday School song which goes: "Jesus loves me this I know, for the Bible tells me so" (Stephen Joseph Smith tells me that Bartlett's gives the source of this as "The Love of Jesus", by Anna Bartlett Warner, 1858.)

Now do you believe in rock 'n roll?

The Lovin' Spoonful had a hit in 1965 with John Sebastian's "Do you Believe in Magic?". The song has the lines: "Do you believe in magic/it's like trying to tell a stranger 'bout rock and roll."

Can music save your mortal soul?
And can you teach me how to dance real slow?

Dancing slow was an important part of early rock and roll dance events -- but declined in importance through the 60's as things like psychedelia and the 10-minute guitar solo gained prominence.

Well I know you're in love with him
'Cause I saw you dancing in the gym

Slowdancing COULD just be dancing, or it could be vertical "making out". It wasn't hard to watch a couple slow-dancing and figure out whether they had some sort of relationship, if you knew anything about slow dancing. So just the fact they were dancing didn't tell you anything, but if "I saw you dancing in the gym" I could tell from watching whether there was anything between you (figuratively :-). (Thanks to Dave Tutelman for this note.)

You both kicked off your shoes

A reference to the beloved "sock hop".(Leather-soled street shoes tear up wooden basketball floors, and rubber-soled sneakers grip too much for dance moves, so dancers had to take off their shoes.)

Man, I dig those rhythm 'n' blues

Some history. Before the popularity of rock and roll, music, like much else in the U. S., was highly segregated. The popular music of black performers for largely black audiences was called, first, "race music", later softened to rhythm and blues. In the early 50s, as they were exposed to it through radio personalities such as Allan Freed, white teenagers began listening, too. Starting around 1954, a number of songs from the rhythm and blues charts began appearing on the overall popular charts as well, but usually in cover versions by established white artists, (e. g. "Shake Rattle and Roll", Joe Turner, covered by Bill Haley; "Sh-Boom", the Chords, covered by the Crew-Cuts; "Sincerely", the Moonglows, covered by the Mc Guire Sisters; Tweedle Dee, LaVerne Baker, covered by Georgia Gibbs). By 1955, some of the rhythm and blues artists, like Fats Domino and Little Richard were able to get records on the overall pop charts. In 1956 Sun records added elements of country and western to produce the kind of rock and roll tradition that produced Buddy Holly. (Thanks to Barry Schlesinger for this historical note. ---Rsk)

I was a lonely teenage broncin' buck
With a pink carnation and a pickup truck

"A White Sport Coat (And a Pink Carnation)", was a hit for Marty Robbins in 1957. The pickup truck has endured as a symbol of sexual independence and potency, especially in a Texas context. (Also, Jimmy Buffet does a song about "a white sport coat and a pink crustacean".

But I knew that I was out of luck
The day the music died
I started singing...

Refrain

VERSE THREE

Now for ten years we've been on our own

McLean was writing this song in the late 60's, about ten years after the crash.

And moss grows fat on a rolling stone

It's unclear who the "rolling stone" is supposed to be. It could be Dylan, since "Like a Rolling Stone" (1965) was his first major hit; and since he was busy writing songs extolling the virtues of simple love, family and contentment while staying at home (he didn't tour from '66 to '74) and raking in the royalties. This was quite a change from the earlier, angrier Dylan.

The "rolling stone" could also be Elvis, although I don't think he'd started to pork out by the late sixties. It could refer to rock and rollers in general, and the changes that had taken place in the business in the 60's, especially the huge amounts of cash some of them were beginning to make, and the relative stagnation that entered the music at the same time.

Or, perhaps it's a reference to the stagnation in rock and roll.

Or, finally, it could refer to the Rolling Stones themselves; a lot of musicians were angry at the Stones for "selling out". Howard Landman points out that John Foxx of Ultravox was sufficiently miffed to write a song titled "Life At Rainbow's End (For All The Tax Exiles On Main Street)". The Stones at one point became citizens of some other country merely to save taxes.

But that's not how it used to be
When the jester sang for the King and Queen

The jester is Bob Dylan, as will become clear later. There are several interpretations of king and queen: some think that Elvis Presley is the king, which seems pretty obvious. The queen is said to be either Connie Francis or Little Richard. But see the next note.

An alternate interpretation is that this refers to the Kennedys -- the king and queen of "Camelot" -who were present at a Washington DC civil rights rally featuring Martin Luther King. (There's a recording of Dylan performing at this rally.)

In a coat he borrowed from James Dean

In the movie "Rebel Without a Cause", James Dean has a red windbreaker that holds symbolic meaning throughout the film (see note at end of Annotated American Pie). In one particularly intense scene, Dean lends his coat to a guy who is shot and killed; Dean's father arrives, sees the coat on the dead man, thinks it's Dean, and loses it. On the cover of "The Freewheelin' Bob Dylan", Dylan is wearing just such as red windbreaker, and is posed in a street scene similar to one shown in a well-known picture of James Dean. Bob Dylan played a command performance for the Queen and Prince Consort of England. He was *not* properly attired, so perhaps this is a reference to his apparel.

And a voice that came from you and me

Bob Dylan's roots are in American folk music, with people like Pete Seeger and Woody Guthrie. Folk music is by definition the music of the masses, hence the "...came from you and me".

Oh, and while the King was looking down
The jester stole his thorny crown

This could be a reference to Elvis's decline and Dylan's ascendance. (i.e. Presley is looking down from a height as Dylan takes his place.) The thorny crown might be a reference to the price of fame. Dylan has said that he wanted to be as famous as Elvis, one of his early idols.

The courtroom was adjourned,
No verdict was returned.

This could be the trial of the Chicago Seven, but McLean seems to be talking about music, not politics at this point in the song. With that in mind, perhaps he meant that the arguments between Dylan and Elvis fans over who was better just couldn't be settled.

And while Lennon read a book on Marx,

Literally, John Lennon reading about Karl Marx; figuratively, the introduction of radical politics into the music of the Beatles. (Of course, he could be referring to Groucho Marx, but that doesn't seem quite consistent with McLean's overall tone. On the other hand, some of the wordplay in Lennon's lyrics and books is reminiscint of Groucho.) The "Marx-Lennon" wordplay has also been used by others, most notably the Firesign Theatre on the cover of their album "How Can You Be In Two Places At Once When You're Not Anywhere At All?". Also, a famous French witticism was "Je suis Marxiste, tendance Groucho."; "I'm a Marxist of the Groucho variety".

It's also a pun on "Lenin".

The quartet practiced in the park

There are two schools of thought about this; the obvious one is the Beatles playing in Shea Stadium, but note that the previous line has John Lennon *doing something else at the same time*. This tends to support the theory that this is a reference to the Weavers, who were blacklisted during the McCarthy era. McLean had become friends with Lee Hays of the Weavers in the early 60's while performing in coffeehouses and clubs in upstate New York and New York City. He was also well-acquainted with Pete Seeger; in fact, McLean, Seeger, and others took a trip on the Hudson river singing anti-pollution songs at one point. Seeger's LP "God Bless the Grass" contains many of these songs.

And we sang dirges in the dark

A "dirge" is a funeral or mourning song, so perhaps this is meant literally...or, perhaps, this is a reference to some of the new "art rock" groups which played long pieces not meant for dancing.

The day the music died.
We were singing...

Refrain

VERSE FOUR

Helter Skelter in a summer swelter

"Helter Skelter" is a Beatles song which appears on the "white" album. Charles Manson, claiming to have been "inspired" by the song (through which he thought God and/or the devil were taking to him) led his followers in the Tate-LaBianca murders. Is "summer swelter" a reference to the "Summer of Love" or perhaps to the "long hot summer" of Watts?

The birds flew off with the fallout shelter
Eight miles high and falling fast

The Byrd's "Eight Miles High" was on their late 1966 release "Fifth Dimension". It was one of the first records to be widely banned because of supposedly drug-oriented lyrics.

It landed foul on the grass.

One of the Byrds was busted for possession of marijuana.

The players tried for a forward pass

Obviously a football metaphor, but about what? It could be the Rolling Stones, i.e. they were waiting for an opening which really didn't happen until the Beatles broke up.

With the jester on the sidelines in a cast

On July 29, 1966, Dylan crashed his Triumph 55 motorcycle while riding near his home in Woodstock, New York. He spent nine months in seclusion while recuperating from the accident.

Now the halftime air was sweet perfume

Drugs, man.

Well, now, wait a minute; that's probably too obvious. It's possible that this line and the next few refer to the 1968 Democratic National Convention. The "sweet perfume" is probably tear gas.

While sergeants played a marching tune

Following from the thought above, the sergeants would be the Chicago Police and the Illinois National Guard, who marched the protestors out of the park and into jail.

Alternatively, this could refer to the Beatles' "Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band". Or, perhaps McLean refers to the Beatles' music in general as "marching" because it's not music for dancing. Or, finally, the "marching tune" could be the draft.

We all got up to dance
Oh, but we never got the chance

The Beatles' 1966 Candlestick Park concert only lasted 35 minutes. Or, following on from the previous comment, perhaps he meant that there wasn't any music to dance to.

'Cause the players tried to take the field,
The marching band refused to yield.

Some folks think this refers to either the 1968 Deomcratic Convention or Kent State; following on from the Chicago reference above, this could be another comment on protests. But perhaps the players are the protestors at Kent State, and the marching band the Ohio National Guard...

This could be a reference to the dominance of the Beatles on the rock and roll scene. For instance, the Beach Boys released "Pet Sounds" in 1966 -- an album which featured some of the same sort of studio and electronic experimentation as "Sgt. Pepper" (1967) -- but the album sold poorly.

This might also be a comment about how the dominance of the Beatles in the rock world led to more "pop art" music, leading in turn to a dearth of traditional rock and roll.

Or finally, this might be a comment which follows up on the earlier reference to the draft: the government/military-industrial-complex establishment refused to accede to the demands of the peace movement.

Do you recall what was revealed,
The day the music died?
We started singing

Refrain

VERSE FIVE

And there we were all in one place

Woodstock.

A generation lost in space

Some people think this is a reference to the US space program, which it might be; but that seems a bit too literal. Perhaps this is a reference to "hippies", who were sometimes known as the "lost generation", partially because of their particularly acute alientation from their parents, and partially because of their presumed preoccupation with drugs. It could also be a reference to the awful TV show, "Lost in Space", whose title was sometimes used as a synonym for someone who was rather high...but I keep hoping that McLean had better taste. :-)

With no time left to start again

The "lost generation" spent too much time being stoned, and had wasted their lives? Or, perhaps, their preference for psychedelia had pushed rock and roll so far from Holly's music that it couldn't be retrieved.

So come on Jack be nimble Jack be quick

Probably a reference to Mick Jagger of the Rolling Stones; "Jumpin' Jack Flash" was released in May, 1968.

Jack Flash sat on a candlestick

The Stones' Candlestick park concert?

'Cause fire is the devil's only friend

"Sympathy for the Devil", by the Stones -- seems to fit with some of the surrounding material.

It's possible that this is a reference to the Grateful Dead's "Friend of the Devil". But I doubt it.

An alternative interpretation of the last four lines is that they may refer to Jack Kennedy and his quick decisions during the Cuban Missile Crisis; the candlesticks/fire refer to ICBMs and nuclear war.

And as I watched him on the stage
My hands were clenched in fists of rage
No angel born in hell
Could break that Satan's spell

While playing a concert at the Altamont Speedway in 1968, the Stones appointed members of the Hell's Angels to work security (on the advice of the Grateful Dead). In the darkness near the front of the stage, a young man named Meredith Hunter was beaten and stabbed to death -- by the Angels. Public outcry that the song "Sympathy for the Devil" had somehow incited the violence caused the Stones to drop the song from their show for the next six years. This incident is chronicled in the documentary film "Gimme Shelter".

It's also possible that McLean views the Stones as being negatively inspired (remember, he had an extensive religious background) by virtue of "Sympathy for the Devil", "Their Satanic Majesties' Request" and so on. I find this a bit puzzling, since the early Stones recorded a lot of "roots" rock and roll, including Buddy Holly's "Not Fade Away".

And as the flames climbed high into the night
To light the sacrificial rite

The most likely interpretation is that McLean is still talking about Altamont, and in particular Mick Jagger's prancing and posing while it was happening. The sacrifice is Meredith Hunter, and the bonfires around the area provide the flames.

(It could be a reference to Jimi Hendrix burning his Stratocaster at the Monterey Pop Festival, but that was in 1967 and this verse is set in 1968.)

I saw Satan laughing with delight

If the above is correct, then Satan would be Jagger.

The day the music died
He was singing...

Refrain

VERSE SIX

I met a girl who sang the blues

Janis Joplin.

And I asked her for some happy news
But she just smiled and turned away

Janis died of an accidental heroin overdose on October 4, 1970

I went down to the sacred store
Where I'd heard the music years before

There are two interpretations of this: The "sacred store" was Bill Graham's Fillmore West, one of the great rock and roll venues of all time. Alternatively, this refers to record stores, and their longtime (then discontinued) practice of allowing customers to preview records in the store. (What year did the Fillmore West close?)

It could also refer to record stores as "sacred" because this is where one goes to get "saved". (See above lyric "Can music save your mortal soul?")

But the man there said the music wouldn't play

Perhaps he means that nobody is interested in hearing Buddy Holly et.al.'s music? Or, as above, the discontinuation of the in-store listening booths.

It's also possible that this line and the two before it refer to the closing of the Fillmore West in 19?? -- but I've been unable to verify that it was actually closed when this song was written.

And in the streets the children screamed

"Flower children" being beaten by police and National Guard troops; in particular, perhaps, the People's Park riots in Berkeley in 1969 and 1970.

The lovers cried and the poets dreamed

The trend towards psychedelic music in the 60's?

But not a word was spoken
The church bells all were broken

It could be that the broken bells are the dead musicians: neither can produce any more music.

And the three men I admire most The Father Son and Holy Ghost

Holly, The Big Bopper, and Valens
-- or -- Hank Williams, Presley and Holly
-- or -- JFK, Martin Luther King, and Bobby Kennedy
-- or -- the Catholic aspects of the deity. McLean had attended several Catholic schools.

They caught the last train for the coast

Could be a reference to wacky California religions, or could just be a way of saying that they've left (or died -- western culture often uses "went west" as a synonym for dying). Or, perhaps this is a reference to the famous "God is Dead" headline in the New York Times. David Cromwell has suggested that this is an oblique reference to a line in Procol Harum's "Whiter Shade of Pale", but I'm not sure I buy that; for one thing, all of McLean's musical references are to much older "roots" rock and roll songs; and secondly, I think it's more likely that this line shows up in both songs simply because it's a common cultural metaphor.

The day the music died.

This tends to support the conjecture that the "three men" were Holly, The Big Bopper, and Valens, since this says that they left on the day the music died.

And they were singing...

Refrain (2x)

Lying awake, wondering if there is a Dog...
Tijn won het Morlvision Songfestival 2023
  dinsdag 3 februari 2004 @ 12:39:57 #27
1986 Jane
agnostic dyslexic insomniac
pi_16844723
Bij de 'other notes' op die site staat trouwens ook nog dit:
quote:
Dan Stanley mentioned an interesting theory involving all of this; roughly put, he figures that if Holly hadn't died, then we would not have suffered through the Fabian/Pat Boone/et.al. era...and as a consequence, we wouldn't have *needed* the Beatles -- Holly was moving pop music away from the stereotypical boy/girl love lost/found lyrical ideas, and was recording with unique instrumentation and techniques...things that Beatles wouldn't try until about 1965. Perhaps Dylan would have stuck with the rock and roll he played in high school, and the Byrds never would have created an amalgam of Dylan songs and Beatle arrangements.
Hmmm, met andere woorden, als Holly niet gestorven zou zijn, zouden de Beatles misschien helemaal niet zo groot zijn geworden. Valt nooit te bewijzen natuurlijk, maar wel een interessant punt. In mijn optiek was Buddy Holly namelijk inderdaad zijn tijd ver vooruit, hoe gedateerd de arrangementen misschien tegenwoordig ook mogen klinken. Zoals ik in de openingspost geloof ik ook al zei, ging zijn muziek al veel meer naar de popmuziek toe die we verder pas een paar jaar later in de Jaren 60 tegenkomen. Ja, what if...
Lying awake, wondering if there is a Dog...
Tijn won het Morlvision Songfestival 2023
  woensdag 4 februari 2004 @ 12:34:36 #28
76173 bramos-elvis
FC Eindhoven 1909-2009
pi_16876587
quote:
Op dinsdag 3 februari 2004 12:39 schreef Jane het volgende:
Bij de 'other notes' op die site staat trouwens ook nog dit:
[..]

Hmmm, met andere woorden, als Holly niet gestorven zou zijn, zouden de Beatles misschien helemaal niet zo groot zijn geworden. Valt nooit te bewijzen natuurlijk, maar wel een interessant punt. In mijn optiek was Buddy Holly namelijk inderdaad zijn tijd ver vooruit, hoe gedateerd de arrangementen misschien tegenwoordig ook mogen klinken. Zoals ik in de openingspost geloof ik ook al zei, ging zijn muziek al veel meer naar de popmuziek toe die we verder pas een paar jaar later in de Jaren 60 tegenkomen. Ja, what if...


Niet alleen the Beatles!
quote:
They caught the last train for the coast
is die niet het vliegtuig dat verongelukte...ze waren volgenms mij op weg richting het laatste concert van de tour....:S
Accept you're dead and start living
pi_16981387
"Brown eyed handsome man!"
Wereld nummer
Macca deed het trouwens ook te gek!
Blondie's "Denise" is toch ook van Holly?

In La Bamba stond "hij" naast mijn held Brian Setzer op het podium!
Top film!
De Stray Cats spelen trouwens nummers van hem.
Oh boy, Looking for someone to love....
En de Cats komen in juli dit jaar weer naar Paradiso!

Holly was trouwens de eerste Fender Stratocaster held met zijn "guitar from outer space!"

  zondag 8 februari 2004 @ 18:39:05 #30
22975 mandark2000
Roxanne (put on the red light)
pi_17006154
quote:
Op zaterdag 7 februari 2004 21:06 schreef Mes het volgende:
"Brown eyed handsome man!"
Wereld nummer
Macca deed het trouwens ook te gek!
Blondie's "Denise" is toch ook van Holly?

In La Bamba stond "hij" naast mijn held Brian Setzer op het podium!
Top film!
De Stray Cats spelen trouwens nummers van hem.
Oh boy, Looking for someone to love....
En de Cats komen in juli dit jaar weer naar Paradiso!

Holly was trouwens de eerste Fender Stratocaster held met zijn "guitar from outer space!"


Mja, Brown Eyed Handsome Man is origineel van Chuck Berry, hè. Vind het Mambo stukje dat Buddy aan zijn versie toegoevoegd wel leuk klinken.
  zondag 8 februari 2004 @ 22:57:17 #31
9568 Witchfynder
/dev/bassguitar
pi_17014812
quote:
Op zaterdag 7 februari 2004 21:06 schreef Mes het volgende:
Blondie's "Denise" is toch ook van Holly?
Randy & the Rainbows.
Mijn band: Conorach || MySpace || Twitter || Lastfm
"The band makes it rock. The crew makes it roll" - Dave Mustaine
There are two kinds of people in the world: those who like Heavy Metal and those who hate music.
  dinsdag 17 februari 2004 @ 12:10:10 #32
76173 bramos-elvis
FC Eindhoven 1909-2009
pi_17251054
quote:
Op zaterdag 7 februari 2004 21:06 schreef Mes het volgende:
"Brown eyed handsome man!"
Wereld nummer
Macca deed het trouwens ook te gek!
Blondie's "Denise" is toch ook van Holly?

In La Bamba stond "hij" naast mijn held Brian Setzer op het podium!
Top film!
De Stray Cats spelen trouwens nummers van hem.
Oh boy, Looking for someone to love....
En de Cats komen in juli dit jaar weer naar Paradiso!

Holly was trouwens de eerste Fender Stratocaster held met zijn "guitar from outer space!"


wanneer komen de cats naar paradiso???
Accept you're dead and start living
  zondag 28 maart 2004 @ 11:56:00 #33
41509 Mes
Go Cat!
pi_18018280
14 juli.
Maar dat wist je vast al!
En op 30 juli extra concert!!
  dinsdag 22 juni 2004 @ 14:04:18 #34
76173 bramos-elvis
FC Eindhoven 1909-2009
pi_20092071
Vanacht op TV, de Buddy Holly story. eve over 12 op de BBC!
Kheb em al welles gezien, maar ik ga hem toch tapen!
Accept you're dead and start living
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