Rellen in Amerika #24

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Op vrijdag 5 juni 2020 11:41 schreef Lokale_Notabele het volgende:

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Blanken zijn in Amerika het grootste slachtoffer van dodelijk politiegeweld. Tevens komt black on white crime veel vaker voor dan white on black crime. Iedere kleuter kan deze cijfers opzoeken. Je zult ze ook zelf op moeten zoeken want op CNN zul je ze niet voorbij zien komen.

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Op donderdag 4 juni 2020 14:33 schreef Isdatzo het volgende:

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Zal ik je helpen?

A 2017 study of 4.5 million traffic stops by the 100 largest police departments in North Carolina found that blacks and Latinos were more likely to be searched than whites (5.4 percent, 4.1 percent and 3.1 percent, respectively), even though searches of white motorists were more likely than the others to turn up contraband (whites: 32 percent, blacks: 29 percent, Latinos: 19 percent).
https://arxiv.org/pdf/1607.05376.pdf

According to the Justice Department, between 2012 and 2014, black people in Ferguson, Mo., accounted for 85 percent of vehicle stops, 90 percent of citations and 93 percent of arrests, despite comprising 67 percent of the population. Blacks were more than twice as likely as whites to be searched after traffic stops, even though they proved to be 26 percent less likely to be in possession of illegal drugs or weapons. Between 2011 and 2013, blacks also received 95 percent of jaywalking tickets and 94 percent of tickets for “failure to comply.” The Justice Department also found that the racial discrepancy for speeding tickets increased dramatically when researchers looked at tickets based on only an officer’s word vs. tickets based on objective evidence, such as vs. radar. Black people facing similar low-level charges as white people were 68 percent less likely to see those charges dismissed in court. More than 90 percent of the arrest warrants stemming from failure to pay/failure to appear were issued for black people.
https://www.justice.gov/s(...)epartment_report.pdf

A study of “investigatory” traffic stops — that is, stops that did not result in a citation — by police in Kansas City found that blacks were 2.7 times more likely to be pulled over in an investigatory stop, and five times more likely to be searched.
https://www.kcur.org/show(...)ce-practice#stream/0

A study of stop and frisk incidents in Boston between 2007 and 2010 that did not result in a citation or arrest found that 63 percent of such stops were of black people. Blacks made up 24 percent of the city’s population. Incredibly, 97.5 percent of these encounters resulted in no arrest or seizure of contraband.
https://www.aclum.org/sit(...)own-and-targeted.pdf

A 2015 statistical analysis of police shootings from 2011 to 2014 found that the racial disparity in police shootings of black people could not be explained by higher crime rates in majority-black communities.
http://journals.plos.org/(...)journal.pone.0141854

a study published in June reviewed every reported homicide between 1976 and 2009 and found that “homicides with white victims are significantly more likely to be ‘cleared’ by the arrest of a suspect than are homicides with minority victims.”
https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3202470

Another ACLU study, this time on the use of stop-and-frisk in Milwaukee between 2010 and 2017, found that in nearly half of the more than 700,000 such stops, the police failed to demonstrate reasonable suspicion as required by the Constitution. The study found that between pedestrian stops and traffic stops, black people were six times more likely to be stopped and searched than white people, and that less than 1 percent of those searches turned up any contraband. Here again, while black and Latino drivers were more likely to be searched, they were 20 percent less likely to be in possession of any contraband.
https://www.aclu.org/blog(...)kee-police-stops-are

A 2017 study of interactions between officers and citizens taken from footage captured by police officer body cameras found that “officers speak with consistently less respect toward black versus white community members, even after controlling for the race of the officer, the severity of the infraction, the location of the stop, and the outcome of the stop.”
http://www.pnas.org/conte(...)/1702413114.full.pdf

An NAACP survey of citizen complaints against police officers in North Charleston, S.C., between 2006 and 2016 found that complaints by white citizens were about two-thirds more likely to be sustained than complaints filed by black citizens. When the complainant alleged excessive force, white complaints were sustained seven times more often than black complaints.
http://www.naacpldf.org/f(...)AL%20July%202017.pdf

According to a Justice Department study released in 2013, throughout the United States, black drivers are about 30 percent more likely to be pulled over than white drivers. Black drivers are also more likely to be pulled over for alleged mechanical or equipment problems with their automobiles, or for record checks. White people are actually more likely to get pulled over for noticeable traffic violations such as speeding. Black drivers are more likely to not be told why they were pulled over.
https://www.washingtonpos(...)=lk_inline_manual_41

In 2016, the ACLU of Florida released a report that found that black drivers in that state were twice as likely to be pulled over for seat-belt violations as white drivers.
https://www.aclu.org/repo(...)belt-law-enforcement

data from New York City showed that black people are arrested for marijuana at eight times the rate of white people. In Manhattan, it’s 15 times as much. Black neighborhoods produce far more arrests than white neighborhoods, despite data showing a similar rate at which residents complain about marijuana use.
https://www.nytimes.com/2(...)rticle®ion=Footer

A 2014 ACLU survey of SWAT teams across the country found that “dynamic entry” and paramilitary police tactics are disproportionately used against black and Latino people. Most of these raids were on people suspected of low-level drug crimes.
https://www.aclu.org/site(...)-report-web-rel1.pdf

In contrast to the assertion that blacks are more likely to be arrested because they’re more likely to use drugs in public, a 2002 study of narcotics search warrants in the San Diego area — that is, warrants to search for drugs in private homes — found that black and Hispanic residents were “significantly over-represented as targets of narcotics search warrants,” even after adjusting for usage rates. The study also found that “searches of White suspects were more successful in recovering the targeted drug than were searches of either Black or Hispanic suspects.”
http://faculty.cwsl.edu/b(...)csSearchWarrants.pdf

According to figures from the National Registry of Exonerations (NER) black people are about five times more likely to go to prison for drug possession than white people. According to exoneration data, black people are also 12 times more likely to be wrongly convicted of drug crimes.
http://www.law.umich.edu/(...)gful_Convictions.pdf

When Harris County, Tex., saw a flaw in how drug testing was conducted at its crime lab, officials went back and exonerated dozens of people who had been wrongly convicted for possession — most pleaded guilty, despite their innocence. This is because prosecutors often promise harsher sentences or more charges for defendants who take a case to trial. Black people comprise 20 percent of the Harris County population but made up 62 percent of the wrongful drug convictions.
https://www.texastribune.org/2017/03/07/report/

Black people comprise about 12.5 percent of drug users but 29 percent of arrests for drug crimes and 33 percent of those incarcerated.
https://www.naacp.org/criminal-justice-fact-sheet/

Blacks were also three times as likely to get hit with — and made up two-thirds of — the sentencing enhancements for committing drug crimes near a school zone, church, park or public housing. In all, when blacks and whites committed similar drug crimes, blacks on average received a sentence that was two-thirds longer. In some parts of the state, it was two or three times longer.
http://projects.heraldtribune.com/bias/bauer/

An analysis of drug war data by the Vera Institute of Justice published this year found that “the risk of incarceration in the federal system for someone who uses drugs monthly and is black is more than seven times that of his or her white counterpart.”
https://storage.googleapi(...)cial-disparities.pdf

A study of criminal cases from 1983 and 1993 found that prosecutors in Philadelphia removed 52 percent of potential black jurors vs. only 23 percent of nonblack jurors.
https://www.aclu.org/other/race-and-death-penalty

Between 2003 and 2012, prosecutors in Caddo Parish, La. — one of the most aggressive death penalty counties in the country — struck 46 percent of prospective black jurors with preemptory challenges, vs. 15 percent of nonblacks.
https://blackstrikes.com/(...)rish_August_2015.pdf

Between 1994 and 2002, Jefferson Parish prosecutors struck 55 percent of blacks, but just 16 percent of whites. Although blacks make up 23 percent of the population, 80 percent of criminal trials had no more than two black jurors in a state where it takes only 10 of 12 juror votes to convict.
https://www.newyorker.com(...)-strike-black-jurors & https://eji.org/sites/def(...)n-jury-selection.pdf

A 2011 study from Michigan State University College of Law found that between 1990 and 2010, state prosecutors struck about 53 percent of black people eligible for juries in criminal cases, vs. about 26 percent of white people. The study’s authors concluded that the chance of this occurring in a race-neutral process was less than 1 in 10 trillion. Even after adjusting for excuses given by prosecutors that tend to correlate with race, the 2-to-1 discrepancy remained. The state legislature had previously passed a law stating that death penalty defendants who could demonstrate racial bias in jury selection could have their sentences changed to life without parole. The legislature later repealed that law.
1.https://digitalcommons.la(...)1330&context=facpubs
2. https://deathpenaltyinfo.(...)e-act-ruling-summary
3. https://www.ncleg.net/Sessions/2009/Bills/Senate/PDF/S461v6.pdf
4. https://edition.cnn.com/2(...)h-penalty/index.html

In a 2010 study, “mock jurors” were given the same evidence from a fictional robbery case but then shown alternate security camera footage depicting either a light-skinned or dark-skinned suspect. Jurors were more likely to evaluate ambiguous, race-neutral evidence against the dark-skinned suspect as incriminating and more likely to find the dark-skinned suspect guilty.
https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=1601615

While white people make up less than half of the country’s murder victims, a 2003 study by Amnesty International found that about 80 percent of the people on death row in the United States killed a white person.
https://www.amnesty.org/en/documents/AMR51/046/2003/en/

A 2012 study of Harris County, Tex., cases found that people who killed white victims were 2.5 times more likely to be sentenced to the death penalty than other killers.

In Delaware, according to a 2012 study, “black defendants who kill white victims are seven times as likely to receive the death penalty as are black defendants who kill black victims. … Moreover, black defendants who kill white victims are more than three times as likely to be sentenced to death as are white defendants who kill white victims.”
https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=2019913

A study of death penalty rates of black perpetrators/white victims vs. white perpetrators/black victims through 1999 showed similar discrepancies. Interestingly, the study found that blacks are underrepresented on death row in proportion to the proportion of murders they commit. But this is largely because most black murderers kill other black people, and prosecutors are far less likely to seek the death penalty when the victim is black.
https://scholarship.law.c(...)=1240&context=facpub

A study of North Carolina murder cases from 1980 through 2007 found that murderers who kill white people are three times more likely to get the death penalty than murderers who kill black people.
https://scholarship.law.u(...)le=4522&context=nclr

A 2000 study commissioned by then-Florida Gov. Jeb Bush (R) found that the state had, as of that time, never executed a white person for killing a black person
http://www.elon.edu/docs/e-web/law/law_review/Issues/Slobogin.pdf

According to a 2002 study commissioned by then-Gov. Frank O’Bannon (D), Indiana had executed only one person for killing a nonwhite victim, and though 47 percent of homicides in the state involved nonwhite victims, just 16 percent of the state’s death sentences did.
https://www.in.gov/ipdc/f(...)0death%20penalty.pdf

A 2014 study looking at 33 years of data found that after adjusting for variables such as the number of victims and brutality of the crimes, jurors in Washington state were 4.5 times more likely to impose the death penalty on black defendants accused of aggravated murder than on white ones.

A 2014 study looking at 33 years of data found that after adjusting for variables such as the number of victims and brutality of the crimes, jurors in Washington state were 4.5 times more likely to impose the death penalty on black defendants accused of aggravated murder than on white ones.
https://files.deathpenalt(...)ashRaceStudy2014.pdf

Black people are also more likely to be wrongly convicted of murder when the victim was white. Only about 15 percent of people killed by black people were white, but 31 percent of black exonorees were wrongly convicted of killing white people. More generally, black people convicted of murder are 50 percent more likely to be innocent than white people convicted of murder.
http://www.law.umich.edu/(...)gful_Convictions.pdf

Innocent black people are also 3.5 times more likely than white people to be wrongly convicted of sexual assault and 12 times more likely to be wrongly convicted of drug crimes. (And remember, data on wrongful convictions is limited in that it can only consider the wrongful convictions we know about.)
https://www.vox.com/polic(...)ocence-prison-racism

A 2000 study of federal cases found that federal prosecutors were about 50 percent more likely to offer a plea bargain to white murder suspects than black suspects that allowed them to avoid the death penalty.
https://www.washingtonpos(...)=lk_inline_manual_96

A 2006 Stanford report found that when a black person was accused of killing a white person, defendants with darker skin and more “stereotypically black” features were twice as likely to receive a death sentence. When the victim was black, there was almost no difference.
https://news.stanford.edu/news/2006/may3/deathworthy-050306.html

A 2016 study found that in Louisiana, killers of white victims were 14 times more likely to be executed than killers of black victims. Black men who killed white women were 30 times more likely to get the death penalty than black men who killed black men. Those convicted of killing white people were also less likely to have their sentences overturned on appeal, and Louisiana hasn’t executed a white person for killing a black person since 1752.
https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=2770761

Studies in other states have produced similar results: In Oklahoma, killers of white women were 9.5 times more likely to get the death penalty than killers of minority men. In Ohio, they were 6 times more likely, and in Florida, 6.5 times more likely.
https://scholarlycommons.(...)le=7615&context=jclc

A 2017 study of about 48,000 criminal cases in Wisconsin showed that white defendants were 25 percent more likely than black defendants to have their most serious charge dismissed in a plea bargain. Among defendants facing misdemeanor charges that could carry a sentence of incarceration, whites were 75 percent more likely to have those charges dropped, dismissed or reduced to a charge that did not include such a punishment.
https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3036726

A 2016 review of nearly 474,000 criminal cases in Hampton Roads, Va., found that whites were more likely to get plea deals that resulted in no jail time for drug offenses. While facing charges of drug distribution, 48 percent of whites received plea bargains with no jail time, vs. 22 percent of blacks. Among those with prior criminal records who pleaded guilty to robbery, 36 percent of whites got no jail time, vs. 8 percent of blacks.
https://www.yalelawjourna(...)he-effects-of-booker

A 2013 study found that after adjusting for numerous other variables, federal prosecutors were almost twice as likely to bring charges carrying mandatory minimums against black defendants as against white defendants accused of similar crimes.
A 2008 analysis found that black defendants with multiple prior convictions are 28 percent more likely to be charged as “habitual offenders” than white defendants with similar criminal records. The authors conclude that “assessments of dangerousness and culpability are linked to race and ethnicity, even after offense seriousness and prior record are controlled.”
http://citeseerx.ist.psu.(...)79&rep=rep1&type=pdf

A 2007 Harvard study found sentencing discrepancies among black people, depending on the darkness of their skin. The study looked at 67,000 first-time felons in Georgia from 1995 to 2002. The average sentence for white men was 2,689 days. The average for black men was 378 days longer. But light-skinned blacks received sentences of about three and a half months longer than whites. Medium-skinned blacks received a sentence of about a year longer. Dark-skinned blacks received sentences of a year and a half longer.
https://scholar.harvard.e(...)merican-racial-order

A 2011 study of bail in five large U.S. counties found that blacks received $7,000 higher bail than whites for violent crimes, $13,000 higher for drug crimes and $10,000 higher for crimes related to public order. These disparities were calculated after adjusting for the seriousness of the crime, criminal history and other variables.
https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=1990324

A 2011 investigation of presidential pardons by ProPublica found that white federal prisoners are almost four times as likely to receive a pardon than minority federal prisoners.
https://www.propublica.or(...)ons-what-can-be-done

About 16 percent of sexual assaults of white women are committed by black men, but half of the exonerations for sexual assault involve cases in which an eyewitness wrongly identified a black man for the rape of a white woman.
https://time.com/wrongly-convicted/

A study of the pardons granted in Mississippi during former governor Haley Barbour’s tenure found that although blacks make up almost two-thirds of the state’s prison population, they make up fewer than a third of the people to whom Barbour granted clemency. (It is worth noting that this isn’t about the severity of the crime — Barbour pardoned at least eight men who killed their wives or girlfriends.)
https://www.reuters.com/a(...)0120120?feedType=RSS
https://www.cbsnews.com/n(...)r-wives-girlfriends/

A 2015 county-level study of police shootings from 2011 to 2014 found “a significant bias in the killing of unarmed black Americans relative to unarmed white Americans, in that the probability of being black, unarmed, and shot by police is about 3.49 times the probability of being white, unarmed, and shot by police on average.” The study also found “no relationship between county-level racial bias in police shootings and crime rates (even race-specific crime rates), meaning that the racial bias observed in police shootings in this data set is not explainable as a response to local-level crime rates.”
https://journals.plos.org(...)journal.pone.0141854

A 2018 survey of bail practices in Miami and Philadelphia found that “bail judges are racially biased against black defendants, with substantially more racial bias among both inexperienced and part-time judges. We find suggestive evidence that this racial bias is driven by bail judges relying on inaccurate stereotypes that exaggerate the relative danger of releasing black defendants.”
https://university.pretri(...)8e9eef&forceDialog=0

Met droge ogen beweren dat institutioneel racisme niet bestaat is onmogelijk. Ik denk dat je dat aardig als "wegkijken" kan kwalificeren. En let op hè, dit is slechts een selectie.

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Op vrijdag 5 juni 2020 11:38 schreef Isdatzo het volgende:

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Is dit feitelijk bewezen? Nee.

Waarom niet? Omdat het recht niet gesproken heeft.

Hoe komt dat? Nou, omdat meneer ter plekke praktisch gewurgd is.

In die zin is Floyd nog steeds onschuldig tot het tegendeel bewezen is. We weten niet of het briefje daadwerkelijk vals was, en mocht dat zo zijn dan weten we al helemaal niet of Floyd zich daar bewust van was. Met je nuance.
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1) Er zijn hiervoor geen aanwijzingen.
2) Al zou dat zo zijn, op het moment dat hij geboeid op straat ligt te kermen om adem is er geen enkele reden om nog geweld toe te passen.
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Alsjeblieft, hou op. Je maakt jezelf belachelijk.

De covid19-complicaties weerhielden hem er niet van om zich dusdanig heftig tegen zijn arrestatie te verzetten dat zwaar politiegeweld vereist was om hem onder controle te houden, terwijl aan de andere kant het inzetten van slechts een doodnormale routineuze arrestatietechniek ervoor gezorgd heeft dat deze (blijkbaar?) doodzieke man overleden is?

Hoe verzin je het .

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Op vrijdag 5 juni 2020 11:41 schreef probeer het volgende:

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75-jarige man benadert agenten met een politiehelm in de hand, op een locatie waar geen protest/demonstratie meer gaande was. Wordt flink weggeduwd, struikelt, hoofd raakt grond, bloed loopt uit zijn oor. Politieagenten lopen allemaal langs en een agent wordt weerhouden van helpen / checken hoe het met de man gaat. Politie stelt in een statement alleen maar dat de man struikelde. Video komt naar buiten. En volgens twitter is de duwende agent dezelfde die gister bij een eerdere demonstratie 'vreedzaam knielde'. https://twitter.com/chadloder/status/1268760680569532419

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Op vrijdag 5 juni 2020 11:24 schreef Lokale_Notabele het volgende:

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Ik probeer nuance aan te brengen in het beeld wat is ontstaan van meneer Floyd. Op CNN hebben ze de plek waar dit gebeurde uitgeroepen tot "sacred ground" en hebben ze het erover dat deze gebeurtenis gelijk staat aan 9/11. Het enige wat er feitelijk gebeurd is, is dat een ordinaire junkie gangster gestolen heeft uit een winkel, zich verzette tegen zijn arrestatie, in een choke hold genomen is en dit, waarschijnlijk vanwege COVID-19 complicaties, niet overleefd heeft. Dat is niet leuk en verdrietig voor zijn familie, maar geen aanleiding om in Groningen de straat op te gaan.

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Op vrijdag 5 juni 2020 11:03 schreef spectrumanalyser het volgende:

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Dit!

De nekklem is bedoeld om een verdachte rustiger te krijgen, zodat hij naar een politiebureau kan worden afgevoerd. Met een nekklem is in de basis niets mis.

https://www.trouw.nl/nieu(...)uitgevoerd~b8d50f1e/

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Op vrijdag 5 juni 2020 11:49 schreef Scrummie2.1 het volgende:

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Volgens mij gaat niet in 1 onderzoek in op 'black on white crime veel vaker voor dan white on black crime'.

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Op vrijdag 5 juni 2020 11:14 schreef spectrumanalyser het volgende:

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Nou, laten we het eens omdraaien. ga jij je tot de dood verzetten tegen de politie als je betrapt bent op een stafbaar feit?

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Op vrijdag 5 juni 2020 11:14 schreef spectrumanalyser het volgende:

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Nou, laten we het eens omdraaien. ga jij je tot de dood verzetten tegen de politie als je betrapt bent op een stafbaar feit?

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Op vrijdag 5 juni 2020 11:15 schreef spectrumanalyser het volgende:

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George Floyd moet vereerd worden, stoppen met zoeken naar het verleden van George Floyd?
Black Lives matter!
zoiets?

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Op vrijdag 5 juni 2020 11:50 schreef Scrummie2.1 het volgende:

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Nouja, de user die jij quote zegt "Tevens komt black on white crime veel vaker voor dan white on black crime. Iedere kleuter kan deze cijfers opzoeken."

En jij komt vervolgens met 'deze cijfers?' die daar niet op ingaan.

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Op vrijdag 5 juni 2020 11:20 schreef Isdatzo het volgende:

het gaat om het patroon van systematisch excessief politiegeweld tegen de zwarte bevolking in de VS, de systematische achterstelling, de groeiende sociaal-economische verschillen, de afnemende sociale mobiliteit

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Op vrijdag 5 juni 2020 11:41 schreef Lokale_Notabele het volgende:

Dit is dus onzin. Puur onderbuikgevoel ingegeven door de hersenspoeling die dagelijks door de linkse media over ons uitgestort wordt.

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Op vrijdag 5 juni 2020 11:43 schreef Scrummie2.1 het volgende:

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Volkomen logisch gehandeld daar. Overigens ontfermden zich gewoon mensen in legerkleding over die man, en de agent moest doorlopen want linie. Niets mis mee.

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Op vrijdag 5 juni 2020 11:24 schreef Lokale_Notabele het volgende:

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Ik probeer nuance aan te brengen in het beeld wat is ontstaan van meneer Floyd. Op CNN hebben ze de plek waar dit gebeurde uitgeroepen tot "sacred ground" en hebben ze het erover dat deze gebeurtenis gelijk staat aan 9/11. Het enige wat er feitelijk gebeurd is, is dat een ordinaire junkie gangster gestolen heeft uit een winkel, zich verzette tegen zijn arrestatie, in een choke hold genomen is en dit, waarschijnlijk vanwege COVID-19 complicaties, niet overleefd heeft. Dat is niet leuk en verdrietig voor zijn familie, maar geen aanleiding om in Groningen de straat op te gaan.

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Op vrijdag 5 juni 2020 11:48 schreef Lokale_Notabele het volgende:

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Er zijn wel "aanwijzingen" dat hij zich verzet heeft tegen zijn arrestatie. Ik heb zelfs in de vorige pagina van dit topic de time stamp gegeven bij het filmpje waarop dit te zien is.

Wat wil je nou precies met "het is niet bewezen dat hij gestolen heeft omdat het recht niet gesproken heeft?" Heeft het recht zich al uitgesproken over het feit of hij "vermoord" of "gewurgd" is dan?

Maar je bent het toch hopelijk wel met mij eens dat deze junkie niet in het rijtje met Rosa Parks en Martin Luther King thuishoort? En dat deze gebeurtenis niet in een adem met 9/11 genoemd moet worden? Die kant gaat het wel op namelijk. 9/11 had in Nederland zelfs minder impact dan dit plaatselijke incidentje in Mineapolis. Hoe absurd is dat.

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Op vrijdag 5 juni 2020 11:43 schreef Scrummie2.1 het volgende:

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Volkomen logisch gehandeld daar. Overigens ontfermden zich gewoon mensen in legerkleding over die man, en de agent moest doorlopen want linie. Niets mis mee.

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Op vrijdag 5 juni 2020 11:58 schreef Leandra het volgende:

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Wat is dit toch voor vreemde stuiptrekking om de conclusie van de patholoog te verwerpen en er zelf een raar verhaal van te maken en dat als waarschijnlijke oorzaak weer te geven?

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Op vrijdag 5 juni 2020 11:58 schreef Leandra het volgende:

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Wat is dit toch voor vreemde stuiptrekking om de conclusie van de patholoog te verwerpen en er zelf een raar verhaal van te maken en dat als waarschijnlijke oorzaak weer te geven?

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Op vrijdag 5 juni 2020 12:05 schreef Scrummie2.1 het volgende:

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Feitelijk juist.

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Op vrijdag 5 juni 2020 12:05 schreef Scrummie2.1 het volgende:

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Feitelijk juist.

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Op vrijdag 5 juni 2020 12:06 schreef Isdatzo het volgende:

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Feitelijk de realiteit ernstig geweld aandoen. Als ik jou wurg kan ik ook feitelijk concluderen dat jij overleden bent aan een hartstilstand.

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Op vrijdag 5 juni 2020 12:05 schreef Lokale_Notabele het volgende:

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Sowieso zijn er twee autopsierapporten die elkaar tegenspreken dus hoezo "verwerp ik de conclusie van DE patholoog." De rest van mijn "rare verhaal" is volledig op feiten gebaseerd.

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Op vrijdag 5 juni 2020 12:06 schreef Scrummie2.1 het volgende:

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Wurgen? Het gaat over een man die een duw krijgt, daarna struikelt en dus valt.