Herinvoering doodstraf in Nederland

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:27 schreef Halcon het volgende:

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Tellen blijft lastig en namedropping hebben we niets aan.

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:27 schreef FritsVanEgters het volgende:

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ub40_bboy + inhoudelijk ENTER

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:28 schreef ub40_bboy het volgende:

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Ben je dom ofzo? Zoek zelf maar Halcon is je slaaf niet.

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This is an archive of more than a hundred cases involving in alleged, admitted, and/ or demonstrable forensic fraud. That is, it is an archive of cases where forensic science and law enforcement experts have provided sworn testimony, documents, or reports intended for the court that contain deceptive or misleading information, findings, opinions, or conclusions. Such information, findings, or conclusions have been deliberately offered by the expert in order to secure an unfair or unlawful gain as determined by their employers, by the courts, and in many cases by their own admission. Subsequently, no opinions have been added to the referenced sources.

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:29 schreef Halcon het volgende:
Ik ben dus eten. Op INHOUDELIJKE posts reageer ik later wel weer.

Ajuu!

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:31 schreef Iblis het volgende:
Verder nog een argument tegen doodstraf: Forensic Fraud:
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En dan volgt een hele lijst van experts die geen expert waren maar toch getuigd hebben. Mensen die bewijs gefabriceerd hebben. Ook het aantal mensen dat van death row gehaald wordt is zorgwekkend. Er zitten te veel mitsen en maren aan een goede rechtsgang. Zelfs in Nederland. Tunnelvisie is niet ongebruikelijk.

Dat is een fundamenteel probleem, en dat maakt de doodstraf fundamenteel moeilijk.

Overigens vind ik het wel erg dat Halcon tien namen wil hebben. Zou één persoon die onschuldig zou zijn gedood niet genoeg moeten zijn om geen doodstraf meer uit te voeren?

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:31 schreef Sloggi het volgende:

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Heb je die foto bij dat artikel gezien? Die gast is echt wel schuldig!

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Court Invalidates a Decade of Blood Test Results in Criminal Cases

Published: November 12, 1993

Hundreds of blood tests that West Virginia prosecutors have used to link defendants to crime scenes over a 10-year period are now invalid because a former State Police serologist may have fabricated the results, the West Virginia Supreme Court of Appeals has ruled.

At the court's request, an independent team of serologists spent the last five months combing through the testimony of Fred Zain, the State Police serologist from 1979 until 1989. In the 36 cases it investigated, the team said, it discovered that Mr. Zain had lied about, made up or manipulated evidence to win convictions in every single case.

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:32 schreef ub40_bboy het volgende:

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Mensen die geen blond haar hebben zijn bij voorbaat schuldig.

Halcon for president!!

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:24 schreef scanman01 het volgende:

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Ik vind de stelling dat geen enkel mens het recht heeft om een ander mens van het leven te beroven ook best wel een goede reden eigenlijk. De tijd van oog om oog, tand om tand ligt toch heel ver achter ons dacht ik.

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:21 schreef Halcon het volgende:

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Je roept gewoon wat namen. Daar hebben we niets aan.

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Carlos DeLuna Texas Conviction: 1983, Executed: 1989
A Chicago Tribune investigation released in 2006 revealed groundbreaking evidence that Texas may have executed an innocent man in 1989. The defendant, Carlos DeLuna, was executed for the fatal stabbing of Texas convenience store clerk Wanda Lopez in 1983. New evidence uncovered by reporters Maurice Possley and Steve Mills casts doubt on DeLuna’s guilt and points towards another man, Carlos Hernandez, who had a record of similar crimes and repeatedly confessed to the murder. A news piece aired on ABC’s "World News Tonight” also covered this story.

The new evidence casted strong doubt on DeLuna’s guilt. This is the fourth investigation in the past two years pointing to the execution of a probably innocent man. Similar questions have been raised in the cases of Cameron Todd Willingham and Ruben Cantu in Texas, and Larry Griffin in Missouri.

See the Chicago Tribune's Investigation, "Did This Man Die...for This Man's Crime?"
Watch ABC's "World News Tonight" (June 24, 2006)
Watch "Did Texas Execute Innocent Men?" - Dan Rather Reports reveals new details surrounding two capital murder cases in Texas - leading to the executions of Ruben Cantu and Carlos De Luna that may have occurred as the result of flawed evidence (September 2007).

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Ruben Cantu Texas Convicted: 1985, Executed: 1993
A two-part investigative series by the Houston Chronicle casts serious doubt on the guilt of a Texas man who was executed in 1993. Ruben Cantu had persistently proclaimed his innocence and was only 17 when he was charged with capital murder for the shooting death of a San Antonio man during an attempted robbery. Now, the prosecutor and the jury forewoman have expressed doubts about the case. Moreover, both a key eyewitness in the state's case against Cantu and Cantu's co-defendant have come forward to say that Texas executed an innocent man.

Juan Moreno, who was wounded during the attempted robbery and was a key eyewitness in the case against Cantu, now says that it was not Cantu who shot him and that he only identified Cantu as the shooter because he felt pressured and was afraid of the authorities. Moreno said that he twice told police that Cantu was not his assailant, but that the authorities continued to pressure him to identify Cantu as the shooter after Cantu was involved in an unrelated wounding of a police officer. "The police were sure it was (Cantu) because he had hurt a police officer. They told me they were certain it was him, and that's why I testified. . . . That was bad to blame someone that was not there," Moreno told the Chronicle.

In addition, David Garza, Cantu's co-defendant during his 1985 trial, recently signed a sworn affidavit saying that he allowed Cantu to be accused and executed even though he wasn't with him on the night of the killing. Garza stated, "Part of me died when he died. You've got a 17-year-old who went to his grave for something he did not do. Texas murdered an innocent person."

Sam D. Millsap, Jr., the Bexar County District Attorney who charged Cantu with capital murder, said he never should have sought the death penalty in a case based on testimony from an eyewitness who identified a suspect only after police showed him Cantu's photo three seperate times.

Miriam Ward, forewoman of the jury that convicted Cantu, said the jury's decision was the best they could do based on the information presented during the trial. She noted, "With a little extra work, a little extra effort, maybe we'd have gotten the right information. The bottom line is, an innocent person was put to death for it. We all have our finger in that." (Houston Chronicle, November 20 & 21, 2005 and Associated Press, November 21, 2005).

Read "Did Texas Execute An Innocent Man?" by Lise Olsen, Houston Chronicle (2005)
Watch "Did Texas Execute Innocent Men?" - Dan Rather Reports reveals new details surrounding two capital murder cases in Texas - leading to the executions of Ruben Cantu and Carlos De Luna that may have occurred as the result of flawed evidence (September 2007).

UPDATE: Bexar County District Attorney Susan Reed issued a report in 2007 finding that Ruben Cantu was guilty of the crime for which Texas executed him in 1993. However, critics have noted that Reed was formerly a judge who handled Cantu's appeal and set his execution date, raising a conflict of interest in conducing an investigation of his guilt. For more information see: "Report Fails to Erase Doubt that Texas Executed an Innocent Man."

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Larry Griffin Missouri Conviction: 1981, Executed: 1995
A year-long investigation by the NAACP Legal Defense and Educational Fund has uncovered evidence that Larry Griffin may have been innocent of the crime for which he was executed by the state of Missouri on June 21, 1995. Griffin maintained his innocence until his death, and investigators say his case is the strongest demonstration yet of an execution of an innocent man. The report notes that a man injured in the same drive-by shooting that claimed the life of Quintin Moss says Griffin was not involved in the crime, and the first police officer on the scene has given a new account that undermines the trial testimony of the only witness who identified Griffin as the murderer. Based on its findings, the NAACP has supplied the prosecution with the names of three men it suspects committed the crime, and all three of the suspects are currently in jail for other murders. Prosecutor Jennifer Joyce said she has reopened the investigation and will conduct a comprehensive review of the case over the next few months. "There is no real doubt that we have an innocent person. If we could go to trial on this case, if there was a forum where we could take this to trial, we would win hands down," stated University of Michigan law professor Samuel Gross, who supervised the investigation into Griffin's case. (St. Louis Post-Dispatch, July 11, 2005).

See "NAACP Legal Defense and Educational Fund Report on Larry Griffin"
Listen to "Missouri Execution Case Reopened" from NPR: All Things Considered (July 12, 2005)
Read "Did Missouri Execute An Innocent Man?" by Associated Press (July 12, 2005)

UPDATE: On July 12, 2007 the St. Louis Circuit Attorney concluded that Larry Griffin was guilty after an extensive review.

* Circuit Attorney report: Summary
* Circuit Attorney report: Factual and legal history
* Circuit Attorney report: Appellate process
* Circuit Attorney report: Investigative findings, analysis and conclusions
* Circuit Attorney report: Appendix A through C
* Circuit Attorney report: Appendix D through G

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Joseph O'Dell Virginia Conviction: 1986, Executed: 1997
New DNA blood evidence has thrown considerable doubt on the murder and rape conviction of O'Dell. In reviewing his case in 1991, three Supreme Court Justices, said they had doubts about O'Dell's guilt and whether he should have been allowed to represent himself. Without the blood evidence, there is little linking O'Dell to the crime. In September, 1996, the 4th Circuit of the U.S. Court of Appeals reinstated his death sentence and upheld his conviction. The U.S. Supreme Court refused to review O'Dell's claims of innocence and held that its decision regarding juries being told about the alternative sentence of life-without-parole was not retroactive to his case. O'Dell asked the state to conduct DNA tests on other pieces of evidence to demonstrate his innocence but was refused. He was executed on July 23rd.

Read "Virginia Inmate Executed Despite International Campaign" by CNN (July 23, 1997)
See "Commonwealth v. Joseph O'Dell: Truth and Justice or Confuse the Courts? The DNA Controversy"by Lori Urs, New England School of Law: Journal on Criminal and Civil Confinement (Winter 1999)

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David Spence Texas Conviction: 1984, Executed: 1997
Spence was charged with murdering three teenagers in 1982. He was allegedly hired by a convenience store owner to kill another girl, and killed these victims by mistake. The convenience store owner, Muneer Deeb, was originally convicted and sentenced to death, but then was acquitted at a re-trial. The police lieutenant who supervised the investigation of Spence, Marvin Horton, later concluded: "I do not think David Spence committed this crime." Ramon Salinas, the homicide detective who actually conducted the investigation, said: "My opinion is that David Spence was innocent. Nothing from the investigation ever led us to any evidence that he was involved." No physical evidence connected Spence to the crime. The case against Spence was pursued by a zealous narcotics cop who relied on testimony of prison inmates who were granted favors in return for testimony.

Read "A Closer Look at Five Cases That Resulted in Executions of Texas Inmates" by Raymond Bonner and Sara Rimer, New York Times (May 14, 2000)
See The Muneer Deeb Case

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Leo Jones Florida Convicted: 1981, Executed: 1998
Jones was convicted of murdering a police officer in Jacksonville, Florida. Jones signed a confession after several hours of police interrogation, but he later claimed the confession was coerced. In the mid-1980s, the policeman who arrested Jones and the detective who took his confession were forced out of uniform for ethical violations. The policeman was later identified by a fellow officer as an "enforcer" who had used torture. Many witnesses came forward pointing to another suspect in the case.

Read "Questions of Innocence: Legal Roadblocks Thwart New Evidence on Appeal" by Steve Mills, Chicago Tribune (December 18, 2000)

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Gary Graham Texas Convicted: 1981, Executed: 2000
On June 23, 2000, Gary Graham was executed in Texas, despite claims that he was innocent. Graham was 17 when he was charged with the 1981 robbery and shooting of Bobby Lambert outside a Houston supermarket. He was convicted primarily on the testimony of one witness, Bernadine Skillern, who said she saw the killer's face for a few seconds through her car windshield, from a distance of 30-40 feet away. Two other witnesses, both who worked at the grocery store and said they got a good look at the assailant, said Graham was not the killer but were never interviewed by Graham's court appointed attorney, Ronald Mock, and were not called to testify at trial. Three of the jurors who voted to convict Graham signed affidavits saying they would have voted differently had all of the evidence been available.

See "Guilt of Texas Inmate Gary Graham Debated as Execution Draws Near" by CNN (June 21, 2000)
Read "Death Row Man Executed" by BBC News (June 23, 2000)
See DPIC's Capital Punishment in Context: The Case of Gary Graham

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Cameron Willingham Texas Convicted: 1992, Executed: 2004
After examining evidence from the capital prosecution of Cameron Willingham, four national arson experts have concluded that the original investigation of Willingham's case was flawed and it is possible the fire was accidental. The independent investigation, reported by the Chicago Tribune, found that prosecutors and arson investigators used arson theories that have since been repudiated by scientific advances. Willingham was executed earlier this year in Texas despite his consistent claims of innocence. He was convicted of murdering his three children in a 1991 house fire.

Arson expert Gerald Hurst said, "There's nothing to suggest to any reasonable arson investigator that this was an arson fire. It was just a fire." Former Louisiana State University fire instructor Kendall Ryland added, "[It] made me sick to think this guy was executed based on this investigation.... They executed this guy and they've just got no idea - at least not scientifically - if he set the fire, or if the fire was even intentionally set."

Willingham was convicted of capital murder after arson investigators concluded that 20 indicators of arson led them to believe that an accelerent had been used to set three separate fires inside his home. Among the only other evidence presented by prosecutors during the the trial was testimony from jailhouse snitch Johnny E. Webb, a drug addict on psychiatric medication, who claimed Willingham had confessed to him in the county jail.
Some of the jurors who convicted Willingham were troubled when told of the new case review. Juror Dorinda Brokofsky asked, "Did anybody know about this prior to his execution? Now I will have to live with this for the rest of my life. Maybe this man was innocent." Prior to the execution, Willingham's defense attorneys presented expert testimony regarding the new arson investigation to the state's highest court, as well as to Texas Governor Rick Perry. No relief was granted and Willingham was executed on February 17, 2004. Coincidentally, less than a year after Willingham's execution, arson evidence presented by some of the same experts who had appealed for relief in Willingham's case helped free Ernest Willis from Texas's death row. The experts noted that the evidence in the Willingham case was nearly identical to the evidence used to exonerate Willis. (Chicago Tribune, December 9, 2004).

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:27 schreef Halcon het volgende:

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Tellen blijft lastig en namedropping hebben we niets aan.

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:36 schreef Dr.Daggla het volgende:

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Nergens beweer ik er tien te hebben gevonden, maar 9 is al te veel.
En ik heb bij de meeste het hele verhaal erbij gepost. Dus bek dicht en lezen voor je die debiele bek van je weer eens opentrekt .

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:34 schreef MaGNeT het volgende:

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Je vergeet de blauwe ogen.

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:30 schreef ub40_bboy het volgende:

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Niet flamen.

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:34 schreef Heremeteit het volgende:

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Ik zit er eigenlijk niet mee als een crimineel om het leven wordt gebracht. Waar ik wel mee zit is dat er altijd een kans is dat deze persoon onschuldig is.

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:32 schreef MaGNeT het volgende:

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Hij wil tien namen, en als je die noemt dan vindt hij dat "namedropping".

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:29 schreef Halcon het volgende:
Ik ben dus eten. Op INHOUDELIJKE posts reageer ik later wel weer.

Ajuu!

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:33 schreef Steeven het volgende:
Goed, geen mensen voor de doodstraf op Halcon na, voelt men wat voor lijfstraffen? Een ouderwetsche afranseling op het plein in het dorp? Gezellig met de familie de penis van een pedo eraf schuren opdat hij het nooit meer kan doen?

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:31 schreef Sloggi het volgende:

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Heb je die foto bij dat artikel gezien? Die gast is echt wel schuldig!

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:29 schreef Halcon het volgende:
Ik ben dus eten. Op INHOUDELIJKE posts reageer ik later wel weer.

Ajuu!

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:47 schreef MaGNeT het volgende:

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Death row meal?

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:33 schreef Steeven het volgende:
Goed, geen mensen voor de doodstraf op Halcon na, voelt men wat voor lijfstraffen? Een ouderwetsche afranseling op het plein in het dorp? Gezellig met de familie de penis van een pedo eraf schuren opdat hij het nooit meer kan doen?

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:33 schreef Steeven het volgende:
Goed, geen mensen voor de doodstraf op Halcon na, voelt men wat voor lijfstraffen? Een ouderwetsche afranseling op het plein in het dorp? Gezellig met de familie de penis van een pedo eraf schuren opdat hij het nooit meer kan doen?

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Facts on Post-Conviction DNA Exonerations

There have been 225 post-conviction DNA exonerations in the United States.

The first DNA exoneration took place in 1989. Exonerations have been won in 33 states; since 2000, there have been 160 exonerations.

17 of the 225 people exonerated through DNA served time on death row.

The average length of time served by exonerees is 12 years. The total number of years served is approximately 2,799.

The average age of exonerees at the time of their wrongful convictions was 26.

Races of the 225 exonerees:

138 African Americans
60 Caucasians
19 Latinos
1 Asian American
7 whose race is unknown

The true suspects and/or perpetrators have been identified in 89 of the DNA exoneration cases.

Since 1989, there have been tens of thousands of cases where prime suspects were identified and pursued—until DNA testing (prior to conviction) proved that they were wrongly accused.

In more than 25 percent of cases in a National Institute of Justice study, suspects were excluded once DNA testing was conducted during the criminal investigation (the study, conducted in 1995, included 10,060 cases where testing was performed by FBI labs).

About half of the people exonerated through DNA testing have been financially compensated. 25 states, the federal government, and the District of Columbia have passed laws to compensate people who were wrongfully incarcerated. Awards under these statutes vary from state to state.

33 percent of cases closed by the Innocence Project were closed because of lost or missing evidence.

Leading Causes of Wrongful Convictions
These DNA exoneration cases have provided irrefutable proof that wrongful convictions are not isolated or rare events, but arise from systemic defects that can be precisely identified and addressed. For more than 15 years, the Innocence Project has worked to pinpoint these trends.

Eyewitness misidentification testimony was a factor in 77 percent of post-conviction DNA exoneration cases in the U.S., making it the leading cause of these wrongful convictions. Of that 77 percent, about 40 percent of cases where race is known involved cross-racial eyewitness identification. Studies have shown that people are less able to recognize faces of a different race than their own. These suggested reforms are embraced by leading criminal justice organizations and have been adopted in the states of New Jersey and North Carolina, large cities like Minneapolis and Seattle, and many smaller jurisdictions.

Limited, unreliable or fraudulent forensic science has played a role in 65 percent of wrongful convictions.
In over half of DNA exonerations, the misapplication of forensic disciplines—such as blood type testing, hair analysis, fingerprint analysis, bite mark analysis, and more—has played a role in convicting the innocent. In some cases, forensic scientists and prosecutors presented fraudulent, exaggerated, or otherwise tainted evidence to the judge or jury which led to the wrongful conviction. Three cases have even involved erroneous testimony about DNA test results.

False confessions and incriminating statements lead to wrongful convictions in 25 percent of cases. More than 500 jurisdictions now record interrogations to prevent false confessions.

False confessions are another leading cause of wrongful convictions Twenty-five percent of cases involve a false confession or incriminating statement made by the defendant. In 35 percent of those cases, the defendant was 18 years old or younger and/or developmentally disabled. The Innocence Project encourages police departments to electronically record all custodial interrogations in their entirety in order to prevent coercion and to provide an accurate record of the proceedings. More than 500 jurisdictions have voluntarily adopted policies to record interrogations. State supreme courts have taken action in Alaska, Massachusetts, Minnesota, New Hampshire, New Jersey, and Wisconsin. Illinois, Maine, New Mexico, and the District of Columbia require the taping of interrogations in homicide cases.

Snitches contributed to wrongful convictions in 15 percent of cases.
Another principal factor in wrongful convictions is the use of snitches, or jailhouse informants. Whenever snitch testimony is used, the Innocence Project recommends that the judge instruct the jury that most snitch testimony is unreliable as it may be offered in return for deals, special treatment, or the dropping of charges. Prosecutors should also reveal any incentive the snitch might receive, and all communication between prosecutors and snitches should be recorded. Fifteen percent of wrongful convictions that were later overturned by DNA testing were caused in part by snitch testimony.

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:52 schreef Iblis het volgende:
-knip-

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:48 schreef FritsVanEgters het volgende:

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Ben jij de kloon van Halcon die het topic een nieuwe wending gaat geven?

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Too Late for Luck: A Comparison of Post-Furman Exonerations and Executions of the Innocent

Talia Roitberg Harmon
Criminal Justice Department, Niagara University

William S. Lofquist
Sociology Department, State University of New York at Geneseo

This study is a quantitative analysis designed to compare two groups of factually innocent capital defendants: those who were exonerated and those who were executed. There are a total of 97 cases in the sample, including 81 exonerations and 16 executions. The primary objective of the authors is to identify factors that may predict case outcomes among capital defendants with strong claims of factual innocence. Through the use of a logistic regression model, the following variables were significant predictors of case outcome (exoneration vs. execution): allegations of perjury, multiple types of evidence, prior felony record, type of attorney at trial, and race of the defendant. These results point toward significant problems with the administration of capital punishment deriving primarily from the quality of the case record created at trial.

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:54 schreef Steeven het volgende:

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Niet echt, sarcasme wordt niet goed opgepakt denk ik.

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 23:55 schreef FritsVanEgters het volgende:

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Al net zo min als mijn ironie.

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Op dinsdag 2 december 2008 22:36 schreef Halcon het volgende:
DNA-tests.

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Op woensdag 3 december 2008 00:03 schreef Specularium het volgende:
Genoeg stukjes tekst voor Halcon dacht ik zo.

Je moet toch wat om anderen af te schrikken.

Wie weet er nog meer? ?

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Op woensdag 3 december 2008 00:07 schreef Dr.Daggla het volgende:

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Ik zal al vast wat non-argumenten voor hem posten.

Onbetrouwbare (linkse) bron.

Was al veroordeeld voor wat anders, dus verdiende het om dood te gaan.

Ach, het waren toch maar negers

Je moet toch wat om anderen af te schrikken.

Wie weet er nog meer? ?

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Op woensdag 3 december 2008 00:17 schreef Iblis het volgende:

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Onschuldigen zijn nu bij God, dus die hebben het zo slecht nog niet.

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Op woensdag 3 december 2008 00:37 schreef Argento het volgende:
De doodstraf is een veel te gecompliceerd onderwerp om af te doen met een paar regels en na 1,5 argument te concluderen dat het eigenlijk best een goed idee is, zoals in de OP gebeurt.

Laten we in ieder geval vooropstellen dat de doodstraf als onderdeel van een wetboek van strafrecht betekent dat je te maken hebt met een overheid die wettelijk bevoegd is haar burgers ter dood te brengen. Een overheid die bovendien de potentie heeft om eenzijdig, dwingend op te treden. Dat stelt mij niet echt op mn gemak en dan ben ik nog niet eens van plan om daden te plegen waarop de doodstraf van toepassing zou zijn.

Vervolgens is het de vraag of de overheid wel iets te maken zou moeten hebben met zoiets fundamenteels als het leven. Het moge duidelijk zijn dat de overheid (als publiekrechtelijke entiteit) in ieder geval niet de hand heeft gehad in de verwekking. Alleen daarom al ligt het niet voor de hand om de overheid wel (zij het onder omstandigheden) enige bevoegdheid te geven over de beeindiging van datzelfde leven.

Dat neemt natuurlijk niet weg dat in een samenleving de aanwezigheid van misdaden nu eenmaal een gegeven is en dat een overheid dus in ieder geval bij machte moet zijn om de daders te straffen. Van belang is daarbij dat de straf in ieder geval proportioneel is ten opzichte van de gepleegde daad. In mijn visie is het zo dat een overheid daarbij alleen kan ingrijpen in de rechten van de dader. Het opleggen van een boete grijpt in in zijn vermogensrechten, het opleggen van een gevangenisstraf grijpt in in zijn vrijheidsrechten.

De doodstraf grijpt echter onherroepelijk en definitief in in het leven zelf. Het leven als biologisch gegeven is geen recht maar slechts dat: een biologisch gegeven. Daar heeft de (straffende) overheid zich derhalve verre van te houden. Er bestaat natuurlijk wel zoiets als de lichamelijke integriteit en het ingrijpen in die integriteit komt wel voor en dan nog niet eens als het gaat over straffen. Denk aan de 100%-controles op Schiphol. Maar dan nog is sprake van een zwaar spanningsveld tussen het belang van controles/straffen waarbij de lichamelijke integriteit in het geding komt, en de lichamelijke integriteit op zichzelf. Als er een ander, minder ingrijpend middel voorhanden is om hetzelfde doel te bereiken (de vrijheidsstraf in plaats van de lijfstraf) dan dient voor het minder ingrijpende middel gekozen te worden. In zoverre zouden we naar mijn idee nooit kunnen toekomen aan zoiets als de doodstraf of een lijfstraf.

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Op woensdag 3 december 2008 00:37 schreef Argento het volgende:
De doodstraf grijpt echter onherroepelijk en definitief in in het leven zelf. Het leven als biologisch gegeven is geen recht maar slechts dat: een biologisch gegeven. Daar heeft de (straffende) overheid zich derhalve verre van te houden. Er bestaat natuurlijk wel zoiets als de lichamelijke integriteit en het ingrijpen in die integriteit komt wel voor en dan nog niet eens als het gaat over straffen. Denk aan de 100%-controles op Schiphol. Maar dan nog is sprake van een zwaar spanningsveld tussen het belang van controles/straffen waarbij de lichamelijke integriteit in het geding komt, en de lichamelijke integriteit op zichzelf. Als er een ander, minder ingrijpend middel voorhanden is om hetzelfde doel te bereiken (de vrijheidsstraf in plaats van de lijfstraf) dan dient voor het minder ingrijpende middel gekozen te worden. In zoverre zouden we naar mijn idee nooit kunnen toekomen aan zoiets als de doodstraf of een lijfstraf.

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Op woensdag 3 december 2008 00:54 schreef Iblis het volgende:

-knip-

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Op woensdag 3 december 2008 01:01 schreef Wheelgunner het volgende:
Nee, alhoewel dat niet betekent dat ik niet denk dat bepaalde misdadigers de dood verdienen.

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Op woensdag 3 december 2008 01:05 schreef Dr.Daggla het volgende:

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Maar levenslang zitten is een straf die oneindig maal erger is dan de dood.

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Op woensdag 3 december 2008 01:16 schreef Wheelgunner het volgende:

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Daar ben ik het dan weer niet mee eens, dat ligt helemaal aan de persoon en de omstandigheden.